Isn’t it intriguing, that Brenda J chooses to rebut my “Consumer Comment,” within just four (4) days after it was posted, but never even attempts to address “G’s” original complaint, posted on November 16, 2009? The nine (9) complaints with the Better Business Bureau, were never responded to at all, so I guess we should all be pleased that any response from Desert Management Group is a sign of something. At least that someone is still working there, since Erik is gone, and now Cameron is leaving, the phones are no longer operable, and one of two web sites have been expunged. It’s also intriguing, that the speed of Brenda J’s rebuttal exceeds the speed of responses to all of the complaints by others, including me, about the fact that Desert Management’s communication with its clients, is and continues to be at the very “root” of everyone’s complaints. Is this the only way that investor-client’s can communicate with Desert Management Group? I guess we have Brenda J to thank for any response at all, even if it is false, misleading, misguided and blatantly manipulated and misrepresented!
So, Brenda J, what about “G’s” $18,000.00? Is this just another “complainer,” like Monte McConnaughy and his $18,000.00? What about Wilhelmina, from Custer, Washington and her $15,000.00 and shmyers21 and their $15,000.00? We’re already over $80,000.00, when you add in my $15,000.00! How about Roy Ong in British Columbia, and his $17,000.00 reported to the Utah FBI, along with Monte and my complaints? The list is growing rapidly, and the dollars just in these complaints totals $98,000.00, not including the debt servicing costs (interest on our credit cards)!
And perhaps, Brenda J, you can address the fact that Mark and his wife have been the target of several lawsuits for fraud in the recent past, including a conviction for failing to deliver an automobile title upon the sale of the vehicle, and the fact that he, along with Big Bear Holdings, are co-defendants in a Federal Suit for Securities Fraud with total dollars of $343,500.00! When I read that complaint document, it is even more intriguing, since the “modus operandi” is nearly identical to all of our complaints – “must act immediately,” “inflated appraisals,” “failure to communicate in a timely manner,” and “failure to deliver.”
You are correct, Brenda J, regarding me accepting the April 20, 2009 purchase agreement, but then you “selectively” present a completely “false” representation of all of the facts.
All of us entered into these “contractual” agreements with Desert Management, with the “verbal” and “written” understanding, that we would be building and/or improving our equity position and thus improving our net worth. Our initial investment was defined by Mark Thorn, as a “down payment” on the first of numerous properties that would be presented within the first 90 days, and then learn to leverage our holdings, to acquire more properties. Once we had attained $50,000.00 in profit, we would then pay a $15.000.00 fee to Desert Management.
Paragraph four (4) of the “User Agreement,” specifically states, “We guarantee that within 90 days of your loan qualification Desert Management Group will provide you with a real estate investment opportunity. If after 90 days Desert Management Group is not able to provide you with an investment opportunity, upon your request, Desert Management Group will issue a full refund.” Remember this provision, as we’ll refer back to it again, later.
As stated in the “addendum” to our agreements, “As per your conversation with Mark Thorn, Desert Management Group, LLC is prepared to make all mortgage payments on real estate acquired through/with Desert Management Group. This includes the entire mortgage payment or any negative cash flow as well as any HOA or community fees. This agreement will be in effect until Desert Management Group deems it necessary and completes the sale of the property or properties. Once a successful transaction has taken place and you have realized profits in excess of $50,000.00, [investor/client] agree to pay Desert Management Group, LLC a fee of $15,000.00 for services rendered.”
This document goes on to state, “If Desert Management Group is not able to place [investor/client] into investment property (s) that increase your NET worth, Desert Management Group will refund the initial $15,000.00 investment.”
In September 2007, our Limited Liability Company was formally established in Illinois. The Desert Management Group web sites, one of which mysteriously disappeared after receipt of my October 3, 2009 letter of demand for a full refund, asserted that Desert Management Group was established in 1999, yet official records indicate that the corporate name, “Desert Management Group Real Estate, LLC” was reserved in the State of Nevada, on December 4, 2007 at 4:00:57 PM, and the Articles of Organization for “Desert Management Group Real Estate, LLC,” were finally filed with the State of Nevada, on March 14, 2008 at 8:00:00 AM. This means, that although Desert Management Group may have been “loosely organized” in 1999, it was not an official business entity until March 14, 2008, some six (6) months after our entity was established and formally recognized. Further, the initial cover letter we received, claims “Desert Management Group has over 50 years of real estate investing experience,” which would be difficult for Mark to claim personally, unless he began investing at age 2, and most of the employees we’ve dealt with are in their 20s and 30s. Therefore, this claim is questionable at best.
Now for the un-kept promises in the main agreement with Desert Management Group: all of the online claims made by Desert Management Group on its two web sites (one of which has now disappeared – strangely), contended that “New members to Desert Management Group should have 3-5 properties completed within the first 12 months. Our established members will complete 7-15 properties within a 12 month period, consistently.” It hasn’t happened yet – not even the first property!!! How patient must we be?
It took Desert Management Group from April 12, 2008 until August 13, 2008, and three attempts, just to get the “User Agreement” correct. That’s right 121 days, and we’re guaranteed a property within the first 90 days, during which time, we were to be “working and training with Mark Thorn and other staff and professionals,” wherein WE were required, under the terms of the agreement, “to work on assignments given to us, get paperwork, contracts, etc. done in a timely manner,” but I guess this timeliness only held true for us. WE were to “show up for appointments with Mark or other professionals.” This would be a little difficult, since Mark was in Utah, we are in Illinois, and no appointments or training sessions were ever scheduled, even by phone or internet. WE were to “complete all assignments as outlined (?) to get our ‘entities’ established.” Since we were already a formal LLC before Desert Management, we fail to understand what other “entities” needed to be established, since we never received any “outlines,” or other instructions, which we and our attorneys could have handled expeditiously.
Now let’s look at the presented properties. On Friday, November 14, 2008, at 5:06 PM (Illinois Time), some seven (7) months –210 days into our “Platinum Membership,” we received a standard “Real Estate Purchase Contract” (REPC), setting the seller’s “Time of Acceptance” as 5:00 PM Mountain Time (Utah) on Tuesday, November 18, 2008. No other documents were included (e.g. MLS listing, property description, dimensions, photos, appraisals, comparables, etc.) – NOTHING! We were expected to sign this contract for $142,000.00, without knowing anything about the property except the address, at Desert Dusk, and the name of the seller – Big Bear Holdings, which we now find out that Mark Thorn is/was a principal in this entity. If you read the federal legal complaint where Mark and Big Bear Holdings (remember them?) are co-defendants to Securities Fraud, you’ll see that the “modus operandi” are generally the same – “act now or the deal goes away!” Since we had nothing to go by, we didn’t even know if the price was inflated! We took a chance, and signed the contract, and sent it back by fax, on Monday, November 17, 2008. On Tuesday, November 25, 2008, a week later, we received an email, indicating that Big Bear Holdings (you’ve got to read the federal complaint to understand their “inflated appraisals”), had countered the offer at “a significantly higher amount.” It was suggested, in this electronic communication, that we be moved to a Florida property with information forthcoming. We never heard another word about this Florida property.
On Thursday, December 18, 2008, we were presented with a package of information on a Las Vegas property, the Meridian, about a block off the strip. We knew this area well, and had actually seen the complex, and had a great deal of information about the property. We signed and returned the final and corrected REPC on Sunday, December 28, 2008, at a price of $152,000.00. The same evening, we found a listing for an exactly identical unit, in the same complex, for $89,000.00, more than $60,000.00 below the price we were going to pay. We made a phone call to Desert Management the next day about the “extreme” price difference, and this was the last we ever heard about that property.
Alright Brenda J, now it’s your turn. On Friday, April 17, 2009, now over one (1) year, 365 days since my Credit Card charge of $15,000.00, 12 months of Debt Service costs, and still no property to show for it (remember the 90 day clause in the “User Agreement”?), we finally received a package, including the REPC, regarding a property in Detroit. The package included pictures, descriptions, and a “certified appraisal.” Since we were already looking at some other properties on the “fringe” areas of metro-Detroit, that we could purchase for $30,000.00, and rent immediately, as is, for $600.00 monthly, I was concerned about the $69,000.00 purchase price for an inner-city property. As had been Desert Management’s performance record to date, the REPC had clerical errors, as usual. The corrected REPC, once received, was signed and returned on Monday, April 20, 2009, and we sat and waited, again.
On July 14, 2009, almost 90 days later, after being repeatedly assured that we qualified and were approved for financing, we received a denial from Flagstar Bank, indicating “We Do Not Grant Credit To Any Applicant On The Terms And Conditions You Have Requested.” From my understanding, what this means, is that they don’t grant Fannie Mae, 30-year, fixed rate mortgage loans for investment or rental properties. We knew that, and Desert Management should have known it as well. We are actively investing elsewhere, and through other sources, without Desert Management, and we’re making money. On July 31, 2009, we received a mortgage “note” for $48,300.00, showing Desert Management Group as the lender, a 7% interest rate, when the going rates were at or below 5%, and the “deal breaker” was (Article 6 - Occupancy), wherein, we were required to “occupy, establish, and use the Property as Borrower’s principal residence within 60 days after execution of this Security Instrument and shall continue to occupy the Property as Borrower’s principal residence for at least one year after the date of occupancy.” Although an occupancy exception was possible, such was required in writing from the lender (Desert Management Group). Immediately upon receipt of this document, we began attempting to obtain such an exception in writing, and to communicate directly with Mark with additional questions and concerns. Attempts were made by phone and electronic mail on July 30, August 6, August 7, August 13, August 14, August 18, and August 24, 2009. On September 3, Mark finally made contact, but not directly with me. He was rude and insulting, challenging even our attorneys. He indicated he wanted to talk directly to me, and would call at 6:00 PM CDST, on Friday, September 4, 2009. To date, he has not made this call, and now, given his current circumstances and condition, he may never make this call.
On October 3, 2009, after a full month of waiting, and since no part of our agreement had been accomplished on Desert Management’s part, I demanded, in writing, the “Guaranteed” refund of my $15,000.00 initial investment.
You are correct Brenda J, the deal was to obtain “investment “ properties. I don’t consider a provision requiring me to “reside” in the property for one year, an investment. I already own my own residence, and I’m not about to relocate to Detroit, when I work in Illinois.
Now let’s just see! Brenda J contends that all contractual obligations were met by Desert Management Group, and I “decided to change my mind, my initial investment of $15,000.00 was a FEE, my life has changed and I don’t like the way things are going in my neck of the woods.”
Perhaps Brenda J needs to go back and read the file again, along with the emails, the phone logs, the dates of the financial updates with Heather and the “User Agreement” as many times as it takes to sink in. Perhaps a remedial reading course might be helpful.
Remember, “If after 90 days Desert Management Group is not able to provide you with an investment opportunity, upon your request, Desert Management Group will issue a full refund.”
It took four (4) months – 121 days just to get the “User Agreement” correct, seven (7) months – 210 days for the paper work for the first property (Desert Dusk), received on November 14, 2008, signed and returned on November 17, 2008 – 3 days – withdrawn by Desert Management Group on November 25, 2008 – Florida property – never submitted to us – eight (8) months – 240 days for the paper work for the second property (Meridian), received on December 18, 2008, signed and returned after corrections on December 28, 2008 – 10 days – never culminated by Desert Management Group – twelve (12) months – 365 days for the paperwork for the third property (Detroit), received on April 17, 2009, signed and returned on April 20, 2009 – 3 days – Flagstar mortgage denial received on July 14, 2009 – fifteen (15) months – 455 days – Desert Management Mortgage note received July 31, 2009 – fifteen and one half (15 ½) months – 470 days. I don’t consider that “following through on every part of the agreement,” and I don’t know of anyone else who would, unless they’re living in a “turnip patch!” To any sensible person, that kind of extensive time, to meet the contractual obligations, is a dismal failure by Desert Management Group, if not an outright fraud. On July 30, 2009, I asked specifically for only three things – a phone call directly from Mark, which I had to continually request seven (7) more times over the next month, the appropriate “Occupancy Exception” documentation, and an explanation of an interest rate that was at least 2% above the current rate at that time. It took a month to get the call from Mark – even though it was later than the prescribed time, and I’m still waiting for the call-back and one-on-one conversation demanded by Mark, as well as the “Occupancy Exception,” and the interest rate explanation. Had Mark and Desert Management met its contractual obligations, and in a timely manner, these postings would not be necessary. Since I didn’t change my mind, my life hasn’t changed, except for the failure of Desert Management Group’s to meet its contractual obligations, I am quite pleased with the way things are going in “my neck of the woods,” and all of the above clearly demonstrates that it was, without question, the failure of Desert Management Group, YES, I do demand my “guaranteed” refund, and until I receive it, I do consider it a swindle, since I’m the one who has met EVERY provision of the agreement, in a timely manner, not Desert Management Group, as you have tried to misrepresent.
Now let’s deal with the FEE. Since the fee was only due and payable, for services rendered, if and when we realized “profits” in excess of $50,000.00. Even with the $20,700.00 equity position on the Detroit property, if culminated, that equity/profit still falls $29,300.00 short of the contractual obligation, and is thus not due or payable as a FEE. I followed the agreement to the letter, and Desert Management Group has taken over 1 ½ years to meet the obligation it had in the first 90 days, even if the Detroit property deal is ever culminated. I made my formal written request/demand for a full refund on October 3, 2009, have received no communication or refund from Desert Management Group or communication from Mark Thorn, nor the “Occupancy Exception,” since that time. I’ve had no indication that these funds will ever be returned, and YES, Brenda J, I consider that a fraud and swindle.
Now that we’ve dealt with MY “complaints,” perhaps you should focus your efforts on responding to “G” and Wilhelmina, and Roy Ong, and shmyers21, and all of the rest of the victims of this scam and scam artist, because you certainly can’t manipulate my facts, since I’ve now shared them with everyone who reads these postings. Perhaps you could just pick up the phone and place a call to me, since we can’t call you with your numbers changed or disconnected. You have my numbers in the file, and if you devoted as much time to providing the “Occupancy Exception” document I require, as you have manipulating the facts in all of the other complaints, postings and rebuttals, perhaps we could get the Detroit property resolved, but then we’ll need to deal with the other $29,300.00 shortfall, before Desert Management Group is entitled to a FEE for services rendered.
Sue
Why file a report here? Ripoff Report is a permanent record! Other complaint sites copy our content then remove reports for money.
