Liberty League International Scam | Review Complaint INVESTIGATION: Wendy Stevens commitment to total customer satisfaction. RESIGNED FROM LIBERTY LEAGUE, BETTER OPPORTUNITY FOR ASSOCIATES. Wendy Stevens past and current approach to business is focused on providing the highest quality career consulting services to their clients.

---

*UPDATE: Wendy Stevens pledges her commitment to Rip-off Report Corporate Advocacy, Business Remediation & Customer Satisfaction Program. A program that benefits the consumer, assures them of complete satisfaction and confidence when doing business with a member business. Wendy Stevens is Rip-off Report Verified Safe.

The scumbag Tim Darnell of Advantage Conferences (do a search and find the expose on quantloos) helped found Liberty League with Brent and Shane after Global Prosperity IGP went down in flames. Look on the Advantage Conferences website, and see if it insnt just a bunch of hype by a corrupt ex-or still Mormon spouting Christ centered programs. Find the expose and the write up in the Houston paper and hi disillustrious past of his specialty of compensation plans. I suppose they had a falling out because he left and founded his Advantage Conferences.

Not to leave out Joe Nied. He supposedly brought Liberty League out of insolvency and as their CEO and then got canned as well. Just look him up too and his disillustrious past.

Wake up everyone, only a few people on the DVD portion of the best selling Beyond Freedom are left. Others got their sense back and are gone.

News Flash in a last ditch effort to get newbie's to recruit there is an Extreme Team conference in Las Vegas Jan 20, 2007. What's wrong Mr. and Mrs. Lavenia, John McDermott, Wendy Stevens, Dagmar Campbell Behrend-Larry Harmon team? Nobody wants Liberty League anymore or wants to purchase Leads from you to line your pockets with blood money? One of these types of conferences hasn't happened since the early days. Rah-Rah, pump em up to suck blood money to line your pockets.

MICHAEL HAMBURGER AND WIKIPEDIA:

Recently, Michael Hamburger, an advisor in LLI since March 2003, caused the moderators at Wikipedia to delete the LLI article because he got into an editing war with someone to the point that the moderators got sick of it and just deleted the LLI article altogether. Michael kept editing out true facts about LLI that people doing research on the company should be aware about, the founders past, and about the Arizona Attorney General's $115,000 fine that he did not want people to see or know about. Why? Because this LLI wiki article appears in the top 6 spots in, Yahoo, the number 3 spot in Google, and in the top 10 spots in Ask's search engine when you type in "Liberty League International". It drives people who were about to join LLI away and impacts their business. Anyone doing due diligence on LLI will find it with ease. It's appears so high up it's impossible to miss. He wanted an all positive article instead of the fair and balanced article it was that had both the positive and the negative about the company, and with valid proof for both.

A fair and balanced article with both the good and bad of the company, so that at the end of the day, people can make up their own minds with all the facts. But Michael apparently only wanted the positive to be seen, even thought real government web links were provided to validate and prove the negative with legal documents and such. Take the $115,000 Arizona Attorney General fine. Instead he would edit out all the negative and it's proof, and instead add his own marketing website to gain free high ranking advertisement for his own gain. Tony Rush and several other LLI peeps did the same thing. Delete all the negative along with it's proof that you don't want new prospects to see when doing research on LLI, and replace it with links to their own personal LLI lead generation websites and blogs instead.

Hopefully Michael is reading, because I am going to post what he and others kept hiding about LLI that people need to know about right here where it can't be delete or modified once posted. I will also back up what I post with real website links to pertinent information pages so all of you can see for yourselves and other proof. I'm not about BS or hiding facts or putting out biased nonsense. I just want all potential prospects to know all the facts both good and bad about LLI so that they can make up their own minds.

I'm sick and tired of seeing people like Tony Rush and Michael Hamburger edit, delete, and hide pertinent and factual information that is backed up with proof about LLI they don't want seen. The truth is people need to know both the good and the bad about a company they consider joining. I'm not involved with any company, so I don't care either way. I just want people to get all the information without the smoke and mirrors, as some LLI members have already been lying to new people they bring into the business by saying that LLI has not had any problems with the Attorney General or anyone else, when people have asked about it.

TOP INCOME EARNERS, RECORD HOLDERS, AND ASSOCIATES QUITTING LLI BY THE BUNCHES:

LLI has recently seen a large departure of many of it's top income earners. Several of these individuals now run new top ranking Google advertisements promoting another company with a different compensation plan and products. I'm not going to name the company because I'm not about putting out biased BS. Do a search and you'll find it. Anyway, right now they are currently running Google ads with headers that read; "LLI income record holder shares inside knowledge and why he left", "See Where Me and My Team Went and Why You Should Avoid Their 2 up", "find out why most top earners have recently left and where they went", "Discover the Company that Liberty League doesn't want you to know about" and more. All former LLI top dogs.

PROOF:
Don't believe me? Think this is just some nonsense I'm making up? Go to Google and type "Liberty League International" and see for yourself. Almost all those people with Google Ad headers at the top and right are mostly former LLI top earners who recently quit and have brought along their teams with them out of LLI. Contact some of those individuals if you so desire, or just read their websites, specially Jay's. He makes some really good revelations. People like Michael do not want you or any new customers thinking of joining to know or see this. He kept editing it out in Wikipedia so you could not find it. He personally knew almost all those people too, right Michael?

MORE PROOF:
Also, Google Alan's "no limits team" and enter their team's new training website. It does not require a password to enter. Listen in on some of their training and team calls for that new company. Virtually all ex LLI'ers. On one of these calls, the team has a brief discussion about how they and Alan all began to struggle in LLI just before they recently switched companies. Then other team members begin to talk about how glad and happy they are with this new company etc. I personally heard the fact that everyone in LLI began to struggle come directly from Alan's mouth. You can too. Just go listen to some of those calls. And remember, Alan held LLI's long standing single month income record. Then he quits and takes his team with him elsewhere. Need I say more?

Other top income earners like Jay Kubassek left LLI because of the increasingly bad publicity the company has seen which quickly begins to diminish it's reputation. Just read what he says in his website about a compensation plan like LLI's where you need to pass up training sales, their type of training, etc and you'll see what I mean. Remember, Jay made more sales than most everyone in LLI, and was the winner of two consecutive prize raffles including a new Jeep Liberty. So why does his Google ad header read ?find out why most top income earners have recently left and where they went?? when you Google Liberty League International?

FORMER TOP LLI INCOME EARNERS WHO HAVE RECENTLY QUIT:

These folks have also brought their teams along with them out of LLI. So the actual figure of departures is much higher that you know.

Jay Kubassek
Mike Dillard
Lehman Hailey
Aaron Parkinson
Ashton Howell
Alan Nettles
Kristy Davis
Harold Roscoe
Greg Six
Mike Leroux

THE CO-FOUNDERS:

In the 90's Brent Payne was a rap metal drummer for a group called "Stuck Mojo" out of Atlanta. This band put out sinister songs and lyrics about death and violence.

Some of Brent's former band song titles are:

"2 Minutes Of Death",
"Who's The Devil",
"Assassination Of A Pop Star",
"Pipebomb"
"Enemy Territory"
"Hate Must Be A Gift"
"Drawing Blood"
"Hatebreed"
"Give War a Chance"
"Shout at the Devil"
"Raise the Deadman"
and more.

Brent eventually exited the rap metal band, took up personal development, became involved with multi-level marketing, and Global Prosperity in the late 90's. It would eventually lead to the launch of LLI in 2001. Brent Payne became a self made millionaire by the age of 31.

PROOF:
See the wikipedia article on "Suck Mojo" below. Read the section entitled "former band members" and you will find Brent Payne as drummer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuck_Mojo

Also, look up the band's Cd's at an online music shop like cdunverse and view the album's credits. You will see Brent Payne credited as drummer in a couple of their albums in 1995 and 2001.

While we are on the topic of music, John Lavenia was in a death metal band called "Torture Krypt" in the 90' with more sinister songs and lyrics.

PROOF:
Image Google the words "Torture Krypt". You will see a photo in the results title ?Torture Krypt members? with four people standing together. That short guy standing with his arms crossed with black hair and wearing all black clothes is John Lavenia. He is beside another guy with a huge Marijuana plant on his shirt. Find John Lavenia on some of the current LLI websites as a testimonial and see the obvious resemblance.

Also checkout the Torture Krypt Myspace page. The creator of the page says this; ?For anyone wanting a copy of Rotted Remnants: John Lavenia is going to send me some original Torture Krypt Cd's and merch.?. He goes on to mention that John Lavenia is now a successful business owner. Bingo.

THE CO-FOUNDERS AND GLOBAL PROSPERITY:

Global Prosperity Group aka Investors International (IGP)

Michael probably does not want you to know or see this because he himself was in the infamously fraudulent Global Prosperity under Brent Payne who recruited him. A company with such a bad reputation, that other network marketers will often add a disclaimer to the bottom of their own spams and advertisements which says "Not Global Prosperity". Now that's pretty bad.

When Global collapsed, it eventually saw many of it's principals including co-founder Daniel Andersen, convicted of tax evasion. Several ended up facing up to 20 years in prison sentences and fines in the seven figures. Like true criminals, several temporarily fled the US to avoid sentencing before being held accountable in a court of law. Global Prosperity sold financial wealth building seminars in exotic hotel resorts that taught illegal offshore banking techniques to avoid having to pay tax. In other words, they taught people how to move assets overseas with offshore banking and sometimes into bogus trusts in order to hide them from the IRS and not have to pay tax. The idea was the more you don't have to pay in tax, the more you keep for yourself so the more you made. Global Prosperity also pushed and sold questionable financial investments and trusts to it's customers and all on a true Pyramid Scheme model. This got Global into serious problems with the U.S. Government and the IRS which lead to it's certain demise. Co-founder Mr. Daniel Andersen pleaded guilty to hiding over $50 million dollars from the IRS in bogus trusts and offshore accounts.

PROOF:

Proof of tax fraud by Global Prosperity:

http://www.usdoj.gov/tax/txdv04486.htm
http://justice.gov/tax/txdv05184.htm
http://www.justice.gov/tax/txdv06017.htm
http://0225.0145.01.040/tax/txdv05674.htm
http://www.quatloos.com/groups/gpg.htm

And guess who was Michael Hamburger's personal "advisor" or "sponsor" in Global Prosperity? Brent Payne himself recruited Michael. And Michael knows this. The are both from Atlanta. I still am not 100% sure if Michael is married to one of Brent's sisters.

Michael was a miserable failure. After Global collapsed, Brent went on and founded LLI in 2001 along with Shane. Michael remained with a bitter taste in his mouth from that experience and went back to the corporate rat race. Finally in March 2003 he listened to Brent again and joined LLI despite the previous disaster. He's been there ever since and Brent is Michael's LLI advisor.

But here is what a lot of people don't know you see. There was a third guy who helped found LLI that they don't tell anyone about when talking about the company and how it came about. Mr. Tim Darnell. Tim Darnell left very shortly afterwards because he had his own doubts and felt uneasy and unsure about LLI. So he left and founded Advantage Conferences in 2003. A similar company with a similar compensation plan. At the time Advantage Conferences was also based in Arizona. Today it's in Texas.

BRENT PAYNE CRITICISED BY FORMER LLI ADVISORS:

Brent Payne has received criticism from people who have quit LLI. Why? Because he spent at least $20 million dollars just to build himself a personal music studio in his Arizona home. He previously bought the entire home for a small fraction of that amount before gutting it and adding the $20 million dollar music studio. This has made people wonder and doubt the financial decision being made at the corporate levels.

PROOF:
Do a Google search about LLI and browse through some message boards discussing LLI. You will find several posted messages from former LLI advisors who have said that they recently left LLI. These people have left their contact info inviting people to contact them if they want to learn why they left LLI, and about what is going on behind the curtains. I personally spoke, contacted, and questioned several of these people who did not know each other. I got the same $20 million dollar studio story from them. Contact them and see for yourself. One man told me he was scolded by LLI headquarters after reaching out to other Summit advisors across the company, asking them to share what is working for their business as his business began to really slow down. He received a less than favorable response.

ABOUT JOE NEID:

Joe Neid was never the "CEO" of LLI as the above person stated. That is a false inaccurate statement. Joe Neid was an independent contractor Brent and Shane brought on board to help plan, revamp, organize, and oversee LLI's events and conferences.

Joe Neid basically saved LLI from extinction early on. LLI was at a point were it was just barely getting by and was even bouncing checks. Joe Neid revamped the company and basically saved it from it's demise. With Joe Neid plan, LLI grew to a $20 million dollars plus in annual revenues company. Had it not been for Joe, LLI would probably not be around right now.

Brent and Shane fired Joe via email in late 2005 without notice or consideration for unknown reasons. LLI e-mailed all associates and falsely told them all that Joe had decided to move onto other ventures. Totally false. One day Joe was doing the daily "wake up calls" as he had done for years. Then the next day he's replaced by Shannon Lavenia with no explanation. Joe did not decide to move on to other ventures. This man moved to Scottsdale from Chicago and left everything behind in order to be more involved with LLI. He poured everything into LLI. He was all about LLI. The personality and the voice of LLI, liked by so many. He was fired via an email by the co-founders. I have heard this come straight out of Joe's mouth on one of his "Million Dollar Edge" live wake up calls. He literally woke up one morning, checked his e-mail as usual, and found an email from LLI telling him that his "services were no longer required". He was fired and that was that. He as never seen or heard from again in LLI. Joe is now with Emerald Passport aka EPI conducting their wake up and training calls as he did in LLI.

PROOF:
Since being fired, Joe conducts morning wake up calls that he calls the "Million Dollar Edge" which is open to anybody regardless company affiliation free of charge. He has his own website named after his own name. You can register there free and gain access to his call archive. Listen in to several of his first earlier calls he did back when he just got fired, and you will hear out of his own mouth what I mentioned above.

STATE OF ARIZONA VS LIBERTY LEAGUE INTERNATIONAL

In May 2006, Brent Payne and Shane Krider received a $115,000.00 fine from the Arizona Attorney General.

The Arizona Attorney General obtained a consent judgment against Liberty League International and its principals, Brent Payne and Shane Krider. The judgment against Liberty League was a result of an investigation by the Attorney General that was prompted by numerous consumer complaints. Liberty League International is a multi-level marketing company that sells "personal development" products. The State alleged that the defendants tricked customers into spending substantial amounts of money by promising "sizable commissions" if they recruited new participants into the program who were willing to purchase the products. As with many, if not most, multi-level marketing companies, recruitment became continuously more difficult as more and more individuals joined the program. The vast majority of Liberty League participants earned little or no income from the business.

In addition to the civil penalties, attorney's fees, and restitution, the defendants are also required to:

*Refrain from making unsubstantiated income claims.
*Advise potential customers of the correct percentage of participants who have made a profit through their participation in the Liberty League program.
*Refrain from making any false or deceptive statements in their marketing materials.

The terms of the Consent Judgment require Liberty League to comply with the Arizona Consumer Fraud Act and the Pyramid Promotional Schemes Statute. Defendants are prohibited from marketing unsubstantiated income claims and any false or deceptive statements. Defendants are also required to advise potential customers of the correct percentage of participants who make a profit through the promotion of the program.

The Consent Judgment requires defendants to pay the Attorney General civil penalties in the amount of $100,000.00 as well as costs and fees in the amount of $15,000.00. The civil penalties and costs and fees were placed in the Consumer Revolving Fund. Additionally, defendants will make partial restitution to approximately 60 consumers who had filed complaints before June 17, 2006.

Note:
That last sentence basically means that LLI will refund back the wholesale costs of Beyond Freedom courses as well as Liberty and/or Summit conference tickets to some 60 people who had made a complaint against LLI with the AG or the BBB before June 17th 2006.

PROOF:

http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf

Also see pages 31-34 of the following link for the actual legal documents the State of Arizona has on file regarding the LLI $115,000 fine and what the State of Arizona will do with the money.

http://www.azleg.gov/jlbc/jlbcag061406.pdf

You need Adobe Reader to view these pages. You can download it here free if you do not have it:

www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

LLI BANNED IN THE STATE OF SOUTH DAKOTA:

That's right. LLI and all of it's members are legally banned from being able to place and run newspaper ads or to prospect people from the state of South Dakota.

Why? Because a few years ago an undercover investigator posed as a potential prospect over the phone and caught an LLI associate falsely stating that a product purchase was required in order to participate and market the LLI products and income opportunity. No product purchase is required at any level. When an associate decides to purchase the products, the qualification becomes shorter.

PROOF:
If you are a current member of LLI and have the $39 a month LLI self replicating corporate website, log into your "online business center" or "back office". You will find a statement in the companies "news" buried in the policy or compliance statement telling you to immediately remove any ads you may have in South Dakota newspapers, and that you will be refunded their costs. It goes on to explain the reason I just mentioned above about this ban and the undercover investigator. If you are a former or current member who remembers having read that statement in the LLI corporate website some time before, then you know what I am talking about.

WANT TO KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY PEOPLE IN LLI REALLY MAKE?

You've seen their websites. Some with pictures of lavish mansions, private jets, large yachts, etc. The catch is they don't own any of them.

After being fined $115,000, the Arizona Attorney General also mandated that LLI add an "Income Disclosure" to the bottom of it's corporate website. This was to show all potential new prospects the real income statistics company wide as part of the settlement. In other words, show the people how much money associates and advisors are making selling the LLI products and marketing the opportunity. LLI did not have an Income Disclosure before the court settlement mind you. Now you can find it at the bottom center of their corporate website.

THE STATS FOR 2005

In 2005, over 80% of all ?ACTIVE? associates and advisors in LLI made less than $30,000 for the entire year. That's less than the average American family's annual income of $46,326. And across that same 80% of the company, the average income earned was only $7,149 for 2005. Hardly impressive.
Factor in marketing expenses and product purchases which will total over $22,000 for all 3 products or a ?full boat? entry, and you will find that most of these people ended up with negative cash flow. Specially when most people joining are low on money and worthless leads costs almost $400 per 100. Many quit the business after running out of funds to continue to market and advertise any longer.

People are told to do whatever it may take to come up with the money weather it's selling off our cars, your belongings, maxing out credit cars, refinancing your house, or borrowing the cash from others. ?When you make the decision you'll find a way to come up with the money? they say on training calls. Read the official Arizona Attorney General's court settlement document and the AG says most people did not even end up recouping the cost of LLI products purchased and instead lost substantial amounts of money doing the business.

Interesting is that the top 5% of the company, like the Lavenias, the Glanvilles, etc. made nearly 50% of ALL the sales across the entire company the whole year 2005.

In 2006 the top income earners bracket dropped from 5% to 3%, and their total sales volume dropped from 48% in 2005 to only 32% in 2006. Why? Because a bunch of their top earners have quit, left and taken their entire teams with them elsewhere like Alan Nettles for example.

Several LLI advisors have falsely claimed to be making more money than they actually do and other unsubstantiated claims. The Arizona AG mandated that no income dollar amounts be made by any LLI advisor in their testimonials on conference calls, training calls, or marketing materials period.

THE STATS FOR 2006 ARE EVEN WORSE:

This year's stats for all ?ACTIVE? distributors are worse. Only the top 3% of the ENTIRE company made anything more than $150,000 for the year. In 2005 it was 5%. That's a drop of almost half. And that's only $12,500 a month. What happened to all those people supposedly making 20,40,60 80, or 100,000 plus each and every month? How many seven figure earners are there really? Any? This is the top 3% folks.

This year 85% of the entire company averaged only $7,131.

In 2005 it was 80% making an average of $7,149.

PROOF:
See the below link, or visit the LLI corporate website and click on the "Income Disclosure? at the very bottom center of the page.

https://www.libertyleague.com/compliance/income_disclosure.php

and

http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf

SO WHAT DOES A FORMER LLI TOP INCOME EARNER HAVE TO SAY ABOUT ALL OF THIS?

This is a recent statement posted by a former LLI top income earner dated Dec. 1, 2006.

""Hi Natalie
I was with LLI for awhile and was a top income earner. The truth is, most people will make no money at all. Of the 50 people I brought in while I was there, only 1 of them made a significant amount of money. Only about 4 of the people I brought in made their training sales. This is basically true throughout the whole company. I am not going to throw a sales pitch at you or a link to a website. What I am going to suggest is that whoever you are working with, make sure they give you some honest answers. A lot of advisors will try to throw sales pitches at you and make it seem easier than it is. If they say more than 10 people on their team are making money, they are lying, and don't trust them. I know most top advisors there, and bottom line is NONE of them have that many people on their team making money. I wish you luck, and proceed with caution. I liked the business a lot, but I have moved on, and I'm glad I did. In fact, most of the people I knew in that business have moved on. There has been a massive exit there the last few months. Take care and keep us posted! Make sure you do your research on any company you look into.
A Former Member"

FORMER ASSOCIATE OF WENDY STEVENS SPEAKS AFTER LOOSING $28,000:

Marketing scheme takes a tricky turn

"Multilevel business transformed lives, mostly from better to worse, former participant says.

Source: The Express-Times Laura Stepanov kept hearing how she was "plugging into the system."

The problem was this: Stepanov could never quite figure out the system. And $28,000 in losses later, the Wilson Borough woman is frustrated by her experiences with an Arizona-based multilevel marketing business and a former Vanderbilt University women's lacrosse coach she trusted.

"I really didn't think I could get rich quick," said Stepanov, who was looking to raise more cash to improve her income and help a friend who was facing a mortgage foreclosure.

Last month, the Arizona Attorney General's Office settled a lawsuit against Liberty League International LLC of Scottsdale, Ariz., and its main operators, Brent Payne and Shane Krider, for $115,000. "

PROOF:

www.npros.com/2006%5C7%5C2%5Cmarketing-scheme-takes-a-tricky-turn/

You're pretty much dead on. Except that Joe Neid was never "CEO" of LLI. He was only an independent contractor they brought on board which they later fired in late 2005 for unknown reasons. He's with EPI now.

Also, you left out the fact that Brent Payne used to be a bartender at a strip club. People in LLI say Michael Hamburger is married to Brent's sister which would make them brothers in law if that's true. Both are originally from Atlanta and both now live in Scottsdale, Arizona. That's home to several other top earners like the Lavenias, Christina Deluca, Bob and Lisa Molina, Eric Wright, Gene Braxton, Shane, Joe Neid, and others. They are all clustered together.

It is very promising to see all these new postings.

Pyramid is about selling over priced products mainly to newly recruited member. Liberty fits right in.

With Liberty League, it is about paying to get abused because they think leaders should hold high posture therefore being arrogant and no time with you (because they are successful and busy while you are not). I was always abused by rude attitude from Wendy Stevens who got tons of my money by doing nothing, not even a patient and nice voice. Just imagine how much value will celebrities like Dan Kennedy offer to you with such money. She already sucked up my blood and won\'t stop by next starting eating my bones--she apparently attempted to steal my customer!

I actually forgived her for sucking my blood, but when I see how she relentlessly started eating bones, I finally told myself: enough is enough!!!

Be careful. Don\'t let their highly exciting sales pitch fool you. Try the biz first before buying any products and don\'t get into the trap that true leaders need to position themselves to the next level by purchasing products.

John McDermott Exonerated

I want to apologize to John McDermott publicly. I was made aware that John McDermott has NO relationship with Larry Harmon and Dagmar Campbell. I was wrong in assuming that he had a relationship with them. He does not. It is wrong to associate outstanding individuals like John with others that have wronged and lied to you. John was truthful to me. I put his name in the original post and I wish I could undo his name out of the original posting. I also wish him the best in his endeavors.

I was having a bad year with my personal life, etc. When I was lied to by people who I thought were in his orginization I took it out on everybody. For that I apologize as well.

I don\'t know why LLI defenders being so retarded and keep saying that those who complained are just blaming others for failure. Part of the reason is because at LLI associates have been brain washed and were taught by leaders and founders that no one should blame others for their failure.

But we are not talking about blaming anyone. We just find out that liberty league is simply a disguised pyramid and that associates unethically lie to draw new customers into the business, use all kinds of methods to convince them to buy expensive products and that by keep going on an unsuccessful model they will make a lot of money and therefore causing a lot of people lose humongous money.

I also don\'t understand why they keep saying their business model is proven when they know for sure it is only working for 5% of the associates. If they are serious on this point and disagree they are not dishonest people, then they should really be having brain functionality issues.

Joe Neid went from ripping off at Liberty League, to Emerald Passport(where he psychotically performed on the morning coffee calls. He soon implemented a ripoff phone system "Prolink" costing every member 45.00 per month(Prior to Joe Neid arriving ,FREE). Beware of the new venture he is starting(4-07), "Life Path Unlimited" Jim Rivas(who is strait forward) has joined this company. Do yourself a favor and avoid ANYTHING "Joe Neid" is scamming together. The ripoffs will be coming soon.

If it didn't work for you because of so-called scrupulous marketers, then you have a right to complain about that person. Don't knock the company because of that person. If you have bad meal at an expensive restaurant and have it topped off with bad service, do you quit going out to eat? It really seems that most of you have a real problem with people bettering themselves.

Even folks who never were in Liberty League are spending way to much time and effort complaining. Get a life. You are like a bunch of crabs in a barrel, when one tries to climb out of the bucket, you do your best to pull him back down inside the bucket. God forbid if someone tries to better themselves. It just shows that the old adage, "Misery Loves Company" is alive and well.

If it doesn't work for you, does it mean it won't for someone else? I mean take a look at the list of companies listed here at this website. Many are well known companies, i.e.-ADT, AOL, Ameritrade, E-Trade, AutoZone, Best Buy, Cellular One, BB&T Bank, CheapTickets.com, Cingular, E-Bay, T-Mobile, Expedia, Experian, Fidelity Investments, GoDaddy.com, Hewlett Packard, Jiffy Lube, JP Morgan, Orbitz, PayPal, Pep Boys, Quicken Loans, U-Haul, & Verizon Wireless to name a few. Are they all bad companies because someone complained about them? I believe not.

Yes, LLI was investigated and we survived and are stronger than ever. Real people in this company are making real money. And it is the most awesome experience to occassionally gather with others with the same mindset. I assume that's the same reason the whiners meet here. Birds of a feather flock together.

Did some top earners leave LLI? The answer to that is obvious. Maybe their personal goals grew very large. So large that LLI no longer fit into their goals. But I do believe that LLI helped them get to the point where they could move on to bigger and better things.

Am I asking you to stop your whining? Hardly not, do what makes you feel good. But for me, I chose to be happy.

Wow, I couldnt have put this together any better myself.

I am an ex-Liberty Leaguer who failed miserably at an attempt to make their so called business work. In fact, I had to take out a second mortgage on my house to pay for that mistake.

Looking at the date of this posting, I am probably too late to do anything about it. If I knew what to do at the time of leaving LLI, I would surely have been involved here.

I will not ramble on about my experience at LLI. All I can say is that the business does work... as long as one has no conscience. If you can take money from people, with nothing to show for it, and sleep at night, you can do well with their business. If you are indeed honest, forget it. That was my problem... my honesty just kept getting in the way.

I did attend a couple of their functions. Although I did meet some interesting people, for the most part, many of the Liberty Leaguers were in my opinion, arrogant. Besides the guest speakers, these functions were for brainstorming with the crowd, the elite if you will, in order to get the juicy details on running a successful business... yeah right. If some of them even looked at you, you could consider yourself lucky. I was actually introduced to one gentleman's butt... wouldn't even turn around to say boo. (it was the way we were situated on a set of steps)

Since my experience with LLI, I have moved on to educate myself on online opportunities and marketing online of the like. In my opinion, these so called opportunities are a bunch of jargon. There is a difference in having a respectable business online as opposed to a Biz Opp. Unfortunately, the successful Leaguers, wouldn't know the difference. Little do they know that having a successful business online, brings greater reward than their so called business.

Anyway, all I can say is that my journey with LLI, was a very expensive online education. I know it will not happen again. I am actually involved in programs where we educate people on these Biz Opps so they don't make the same mistake I made in joining them.

I hope no one gets hurt, especially financially, with these types of businesses. I know they can't be stopped but, bad news does travel quickly... it's just a matter of time.

Sorry Mark to refute what you said above where you mentioned that "John McDermott has NO relationship with Larry Harmon and Dagmar Campbell."

I don't want to give out my name, but I know for an absolute fact that John McDermott is Larry Harmon's advisor, the man who got him into the business. Dagmar is Larry's girlfriend (maybe now wife) who is also involved in the business. In fact, I met Larry, Dagmar and John all at the same time at a LLI event - they were all hanging out together. Whomever told you that they have no relationship is L Y I N G.

Not like it makes a big diffrerence, but I'm just saying so for accurate reporting. If any of these people contact you, run for your lives. They WILL rip you off, and the sad thing is they think what they're doing is honorable. People who haven't left LLI yet, many of them are so deeply brainwashed by their own sales pitches and BS that they can't see the pain and suffering they are causing to most of the people they are getting involved in this organization.

I used to have respect for many of these individuals, but now I see them for what they are - white collar rip-off artists.

I am not a part of the business yet but I plan to join....why because who makes you the authority. So everyone shouldn't join because of what you say? Duh! That is absurd for any person to join or not join based on ANYTHING they read on this post. None of your information is verified.

And soooooo what if someone leaves the business. Are you still on the same job you had when you first got employed. People start their own thing, they move on, they do it all the time in any setting not just Network Marketing. What a retard!! I mean who in their right mind would listen to this and make a decision based on the information you are giving. It's a business. There are risks. Looks like you were looking for guarantees. I have read enough of their material to know that they have disclosure ALL OVER THE PLACE regarding income testimonials, etc. Go back to corporate and leave this for the big boys and girls!

A complaint with the BBB or the Attorney General or whoever. Big deal. Do you realize how many companies have complaints and law suits against them? You say that like you are exposing some hellacious information. Big deal.....

$60 a tank, 4 weeks in a month = $240 to get back and forth to your job, lots of people are complaining about that...is that a scam. Six months or working for the man and putting gas in your car to get to him, there's your Beyond Freedom!! It depends on how ya look at it.... Is your tank half full or half empty? HA!