• Report: #431009

Complaint Review: MetalWorks Institute Of Sound And Music Production

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  • Submitted: Thursday, March 05, 2009
  • Last Posting: Friday, December 03, 2010
  • Reported By:Mississauga Ontario
MetalWorks Institute Of Sound And Music Production
3611 Mavis Rd. Mississauga Ontario L5C 1T7 Canada
  • Phone: 905-279-4000
  • Web:
  • Category: Music

MetalWorks Institute Of Sound And Music Production False Advertisting Marketing School Abuse Scheduling Poor Administration Mississauga Ontario

*Consumer Suggestion: Original Report = Two Thumbs Up!


1Author 9Consumer 1Employee/Owner

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My issues will be listed in bullet form, as there are many. They are as follows:

1.False advertising

When you're taken on a tour of the "school" you're told things like "you'll be learning from rockstars" and "we can't guarantee you a job coming out of school, but with our references and accreditation, you'll be working in no time". you're told that the school is a professional environment where you can learn and will be respected by teachers and administrators... this couldn't be farther from the truth.

The reality?

The majority of your teachers don't work in the entertainment industry, and haven't for a number of years (in such a rapidly changing business, knowledge becomes obsolete in days, nevermind years). You are taught the old model of business, something that hasn't been practiced since the 80s and early 90s - and this is by the few teachers that aren't telling you that the industry is dead and that we shouldn't bother looking for work. A number of the teachers berate and belittle students because they don't know things that they shouldn't be expected to know, going as far as calling them names like "Retard" and other, cruder words. On a number of occasions, I had seen students cry because of things teachers had called them - and yet the school did nothing to punish said teachers, when they knew full well (and even acknowledged to us) that they knew from personal experience how vulgar and hurtful the teachers could be to students.

In terms of finding work after school? Don't even bother trying. The school makes no effort to help you find work, other than offering you "employment" working in their studio and production house segments for minimum wage (around $10.00/hr). Now, to me, after having been told that I'd be coming out of MWI (MetalWorks Institute) as a skilled industry professional, being offered a job at a facility that I've just paid 17k to attend, working for $10/hr (they know you wont find work anywhere else and take advantage of your desperation) is rather insulting, to say the least. If you try to find employment anywhere else, the school does not reference you, or help you in any way. Individual teachers may help you find employment, on occasion, but even then it's not what was promised by the school (and isn't the responsibility of the instructors to do so).

Moving on...

2. Instructors

The majority of the instructors, because there is no set curriculum, other than having preassigned and predetermined courses, do not communicate with each other. "Why is this a problem?" one might ask. The problem is that the majority of the courses having materially that can potentially overlap - which it does... abundantly. If the school took the time to discuss with teachers what they should be teaching, 70% of the courses could be cut out, giving students a more succinct, less time consuming ( in my 3rd term at MWI I was given 16 courses... These, like university or college courses, required my constant attention and presence at MWI. One course might be a 3 hr class, or 2 1 1/2 hr classes weekly. You can imagine how much time I wasted there...) "education".

As I had mentioned earlier, many of the instructors were once, many years ago, industry professionals, so their view of the music industry is rather dated. We were taught, for example, how to create and manage a record label and roster - meanwhile it's common knowledge that Record labels around the world are rapidly declining in power and are essentially dying. These instructors, however, insisted that this was current knowledge and that it would be useful to us, as we would all be starting independent record labels, etc. etc. (none of my classmates had any inclination to, and were actually rather against, starting up indie labels). Other problems with instructors include being given quizzes, tests, and exams that have NOTHING to do with the course material (and when 95% of the class fails the course, the school makes no effort to remedy the situation, other than to say "well... you can retake the course... but you have to pay us $500.00" - a number that seems like they drew a random sum from a hat). There was one instructor, in particular, that taught my classmates and myself 2 courses, completely mindlessly (no one understood what was going on, and 95% of the class, completely seriously, failed the course) and was let go by the school, yet they still wanted us (even though they had, by firing said instructor, admitted their guilt) to pay the $500.00 retake fee.

Other problems with instructors include them showing us movies every class and not actually teaching, some of which were hollywood depictions of events that, really, had nothing to do with our course material, other than to have some far drawn connection that instructors insisted were pertinent, meanwhile they would go outside and talk on their cell phones to their friends while the movies were playing. There are many more issues, but from these I think you can see that there is something seriously wrong with the faculty body at MWI.

*I had a few great teachers however... though it really doesn't, to me, balance out the bad ones. It doesn't even come close. I had maybe 5 good teachers out of the 30 some-odd teachers I "learned" from while at MWI.

3. Administration

Where to begin... I'll start with the bigger issues and go from there.

Our class once had a group project in which we would create a record label, each class member taking on a specific role (marketing, promotion, A&R, financial, etc.). We would find a real band to promote and record (in the neighbouring MetalWorks Studios). One of the students in our class, a rather unpopular individual, took it upon herself to recommend a band that she was working with (personally managing) and only told the rest of the class that she knew them in passing. When we happened to pick this band as our project models, she proceeded to tell us that she was working with them, and that we would be doing all this work for her and that she wouldnt have to pay us for it, as it was part of our class project. When the administration was involved (as this didn't seem wholely pleasing, or legal, to the rest of the class) they briefly questioned her and said that they couldn't prove she was working with the band and did nothing about it. We were forced to complete the project, giving her all of our material (including a professionally recorded track, marketing materials, promotional materials, etc. Things that we had worked on for weeks - all for free). This particular student is now employed at MetalWorks Productions, a segment of the MetalWorks family of companies.

The only time administration would take your request seriously was when it involved them getting money, in some way (ie a test retake form) If you had a genuine problem, it wouldn't be addressed, or even acknowledged, by the admin. I, after having not been at MWI for some time now, recently received an email, informing me that I owed the school money for some past unpaid balance - and when I replied saying that I did not owe them any money and had paid off all my balances, they told me "oh, our mistake... but are you sure you don't owe us anything?" as if they were trying to get whatever they could from me, trying to trick me into giving them money for some made up, completely random fee.

There are many other problems I had while at MWI, but I hope this will at least prompt some sort of investigation, or at least create more awareness about the true nature of the business - as it's just that, a business, not a place of learning, not a school, not an institution of any sort.

A number of other students, fellow classmates, and other prior graduates or drop-outs (and by drop-outs I mean those that passed all their courses save 1 or 2, and out of principle refused to pay the $500.00 retake fee, because it was not their fault that they failed, as mentioned earlier, it was the instructor's for teaching us very little and giving us an exam full of untaught materials - exams that were worth 60-70% of our mark - and when 60% is a passing grade, it's rather difficult to pass if you fail your exam) have had problems with MWI as well - any one that's gone there will attest to my statements being completely true, in fact, even those that have had "good experiences" at MWI.

Thinking of going to MetalWorks Institute? Think about this before you go - $17,000.00 (per year!) isn't easy to come by nowadays, and it's money that I, or you, will never get back. I am currently unemployed and am having trouble finding work in this rather poor economy. My accreditation and Metalworks references are useless. Thank you for taking the time to read my testimonial, I hope, with this information, you'll save yourself some money, time, and dignity.

Trent
Mississauga, Ontario
Canada

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 3/5/2009 7:46:19 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/music/metalworks-institute/metalworks-institute-of-sound-aeae5.htm. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

Unfounded, and Grossly misleading report.

AUTHOR: Justin - (USA)

"1.False advertising When you're taken on a tour of the "school" you're told things like "you'll be learning from rockstars" and "we can't guarantee you a job coming out of school, but with our references and accreditation, you'll be working in no time". you're told that the school is a professional environment where you can learn and will be respected by teachers and administrators... this couldn't be farther from the truth."


Having attended several tours of the school I can assure you no one has ever promised "you will be learning from rockstars" first off Metalworks is an audio production / business school, you don't learn to be a musician or "rockstar" by attending this school nor is it promised. It would also entirely lack relevance to be taught business, or engineering by anyone other than an engineer or business professional.


"The reality? The majority of your teachers don't work in the entertainment industry, and haven't for a number of years (in such a rapidly changing business, knowledge becomes obsolete in days, nevermind years). You are taught the old model of business, something that hasn't been practiced since the 80s and early 90s - and this is by the few teachers that aren't telling you that the industry is dead and that we shouldn't bother looking for work. A number of the teachers berate and belittle students because they don't know things that they shouldn't be expected to know, going as far as calling them names like "Retard" and other, cruder words. On a number of occasions, I had seen students cry because of things teachers had called them - and yet the school did nothing to punish said teachers, when they knew full well (and even acknowledged to us) that they knew from personal experience how vulgar and hurtful the teachers could be to students."

As a student who has been attending the school for over a year now I can report that this is far from the truth. Classes are taught be industry professionals, and hands-on experience is plentiful, I have NEVER seen a student insulted, berated or made to cry by a member of the faculty. In truth this school is more concerned and accessible in regards to student life and grievances then any other institution I have attended, a result of it's small student body and high teacher to student ratio.


"In terms of finding work after school? Don't even bother trying. The school makes no effort to help you find work, other than offering you "employment" working in their studio and production house segments for minimum wage (around $10.00/hr). Now, to me, after having been told that I'd be coming out of MWI (MetalWorks Institute) as a skilled industry professional, being offered a job at a facility that I've just paid 17k to attend, working for $10/hr (they know you wont find work anywhere else and take advantage of your desperation) is rather insulting, to say the least."

I'm not sure how to respond to this comment, although, it is amusing. No school can guarantee work right out of school, and as is made abundantly clear all the way along by Metalworks, the Music/Entertainment industry is a highly specialized field, it is a small industry, and job advancement is heavily dependant upon experience and seniority, expecting to be managing or producing big name acts right out of school as naive.

"We were taught, for example, how to create and manage a record label and roster - meanwhile it's common knowledge that Record labels around the world are rapidly declining in power and are essentially dying."

What? Go to HMV, pick up a CD look on the back... now find one not published by a RECORD LABEL...



I could go on dissecting this rant, if anyone cares; this "ripoff report" is unfounded and completely misleading the facilities at Metalworks are top notch, and what you do with your education and your attitude in life will determine whether you will succeed. Don't believe every slanderous diatribe you encounter on the Internet, you may miss out out something amazing.

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#2 Consumer Comment

THIS PERSON IS A FAKE!!! Unfounded, and Grossly misleading report. Justin - (USA)

AUTHOR: The truth - Toronto (Canada)

Unfounded, and Grossly misleading report.

Justin - (USA) -- is a fake!!!

This individual is not from the USA and has no idea what they are speaking of. I can guarantee this is someone for the Metalworks Institute Of Sound & Music. Discard everything you read from Justin, it is not accurate.

Everything that Trent stated is the truth. We will get to the bottom of this issue and I will see the day this Institute closes down. I don't see long potential in this operation.

I will have more on this topic soon. In the mean time, if you are planing to get into the music industry for any reason, don't go to Metalworks Institute Of Sound & Music. There are many schools out there that offer better programs for your moneys worth.






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#3 Consumer Comment

Wow

AUTHOR: Ken F. - Branchburg (United States of America)

First off, what are you talking about?

Metal Works Institute is not fake, of faslified. It is a real school in Mississauga Canada, and does not rip you off, in any way or form. Obiviously the first poster must have gotten kicked out for smoking weed or being late to class, or something that is completely HIS fault. MWI is a strict school, if you fail, you will not be able to return. How is it fake when it is accredited, and many companies and artists swear by it, and have an in depth realtionship with the people who work there. They teach the business and production side of touring, and the music industry. You do not learn from the rock stars, and if anything you learn from the people who make the Rockstars sound how they sound. I took a tour in February 2010, and it was unreal. All the artists who redcorded and have performed seminars there, is unbelievable. They have a massive warehouse of FOH, monitor, backline, staging, rigging, and all other kinds of gear. They also have 6 professional high fidelity studios (correct me if I am wrong). THIS IS NOT A FAKE SCHOOL. IT IS ALL 100% REAL. From graduation to get a job, well that is easy, you have to get your ass out there and promote yourself. Tell people what you do, send out resume's, get business cards printed and network. You have to make an effort to get work, it's not the school's problem. No one got by in life, by recieving handouts left and right. I am a real genuine person, and I know how hard it is to get a great job but you have to make an effort. If you still are skeptical, take a tour of the school, and if you felt the same way I did when I saw it, you would feel confidenthow it is run by the real professionals of the industry, and they know what they are doing.


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#4 Employee

Rock Stars

AUTHOR: jonathan - (United States of America)

I don't think that the person with the first rebuttal (to Trents original post) was saying that MetalWorks Institute is a fake school - but that the glowing review of MetalWorks Institute following Trents rant was in fact - fake.  I would have to agree - looks like carefully executed "damage control" than an honest response.  Being familiar with MetalWorks, I can say that much of what Trent says is true and that smoking weed and being late for class was probably not an issue.  Being a teacher there, I can attest to the fact that I've never seen students under the influence while studying.

Trents first post above represents real observations made by a student there who spoke up about his experience - that simple.  A look from the inside from a unique perspective.  This is what he saw.  To disregard his experience and imply that he's whining and complaining (or smoking weed or whatever)  has no merit in it at all.  It's true that everyone creates their own life motivation and that schools like MetalWorks Institute are just a means to an end.  There are however times when people need to speak up and get the truth out there.  I can tell at this point what's real and what's fake.  I commend Trent for speaking up and encourage others to do the same. 
I think this last comment by Ken F. says it all ...

"You do not learn from the rock stars, and if anything you learn from the people who make the rock stars sound how they sound.  I took a tour in February 2010 and it was unreal".


Embarrassing - even for MetalWorks.

And anyone who finishes their thread saying that they're from the "United States of America"?   is someone i just can't take seriously.

RogerD - Mississauga ON





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#5 Consumer Comment

follow-up

AUTHOR: Justin - Mississauga (Canada)

lol,

I'm not from the USA as it says beside my name, I'm not sure where you change that, i'm from Mississauga, I am a student at Metalworks - I've got dreads past my ass and am always wearing a black or gray bandanna if you're looking for me. Nothing i said was measured or paid for, I'm paying to go to the school, shit loads of money, I'm just sick of people complaining and making false statements...

-- Justin

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#6 Consumer Comment

Is this "employee" even real??

AUTHOR: Ken F. - Branchburg (United States of America)

I searched everywhere on MWI.com and there is no one who works at MWI named Roger D. Is that your real name?? Or is that another falsified comment just like the original review? Justin is real, he has proof, I have proof, look me up online, I want to cross reference " Roger D" to see if he is just a troll. Give your real name so we can get the truth.

-Ken F.

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#7 Consumer Comment

A word about Metalworks Institute

AUTHOR: Dave Mohacsi - Toronto (Canada)

My name is Dave Mohacsi.  I am a producer/engineer.  I work with one of Canada's top producers 7 days a week, 14 hours a day.  I have engineering and production credits on several major label releases with artists such as Metric, Stereos, and Sarah Harmer.  Some of my most recent work was featured in the latest Twilight movie.

None of this would have been even remotely possible had it not been for Metalworks Institute.

The attitude conveyed by the original poster seems congruent with most of the kids that were in my class that either a) couldn't hack it,  b) were too lazy, or c) seemed to have some strange issue with authority.

Metalworks is like any other life experience.  You get out what you put in.  If you don't come to class, don't take your work seriously, and don't take oppurtunities to connect with the vast number of industry pros you will meet along the way, you won't get much out of it.  Yes, it was expensive, but with a lot of hard work and determination I have made my money back several times over by working on music every single day.

I worked my ass off for a year (not nearly as hard as I work now to try to be successful in a small, competitive music industry) and as a result, was able to find great work!

I'm surprised that the OP complains about MWI not helping him find work.  They were amazing in helping me find work after graduation.

As far as the instructors not being industry professionals... Anyone that does their research can find that this could not be further from the truth... But if you're too lazy to search around and just want to go by what this website says... I'll do the research for you.  Here is some of the staff at MWI

Joel Kazmi - Engineer - worked with Sum41, NSYNC, Fefe Dobson, Sloan, The Tea Party

Alf Annabilini - Engineer - worked with Our Lady Peace, DMX, Nelly Furtado, Kardinal Offishall

Brian Allen - Producer - co-wrote Heart's smash hit "What about Love," produced Lee Aaron, managed Socan's International and Concert department, A & R for record labels

Scott Purdy - Post production - Mixed Stargate (the movie with James Spader - HOLLYWOOD), mixed 3 Van Damme movies, won a gemini for a movie that he mixed in his living room - this guy is seriously talented and a great teacher to those that will put in the time to learn.

Graham Brewer - Engineer - worked with Jet, Sean Desmond, Sam Roberts

Elliott Sairan - Owner and operator of Vyner Road Studios - worked with Gavin Brown, Dale Penner, Natalie McMaster, Universal Honey

Morgan Pottruff - teaches midi, logic, cubase, melodyne, reason etc - Morgan plays keys for violinist Dr. Draw.  He also produces professional instructional dvds for ASK Video on all the music software listed above.

Craig Titus - director of the school - session pianist, engineer, producer - has done a ton of post production also

Matt Blakely - Live Sound - FOH and tour manager for Billy Talent, Slayer, and countless others - this guy seriously knows his stuff.

Is that enough?  I could go on but you get the picture.  These guys are pros.  A few are extremely seasoned veterans, and all have tons of knowledge to share with you.

The original OP talks about checking out other schools.  Well, I hate to bash, but I go through a lot of interns, and after a few bad experiences, I will pretty much only hire MWI grads.  Students from other schools usually don't seem to have learned enough.  Their knowledge of pro tools is usually non-existent, and have no idea about studio etiquette.  YES, when you start, you will be taking out the garbage, cleaning the bathroom, and doing TONS of mundane pro tools work.  NO, you won't be engineering, writing songs, or producing.  That is life.  It's tough, but if you can't get my lunch order right, would we trust you to mix a record?  Hell no!

This brings me to an important point, and is probably the reason why the OP and some other former students seem disgruntled.  MWI was TOUGH.  It was an intense year and the hardest I had ever worked in my life.  That is, until I actually started working in the industry.  MWI whips you into shape and those that can deal with it will be more than ready to enter the industry and go to work.  Those who couldn't deal with it?  They usually spent more time in class complaining about how much work they had or how unfair the teachers were or that the administration didn't care about how much work they had or how unfair the teachers were!  MWI is HARD, the Canadian music industry is HARDER.  GET READY.

If anyone has any specific questions about MWI, please do not hesitate to contact me.  I don't want to post my email, but I think you can email through this site.

D

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#8 Consumer Comment

A word about Metalworks Institute

AUTHOR: Dave Mohacsi - Toronto (Canada)

My name is Dave Mohacsi.  I am a producer/engineer.  I work with one of Canada's top producers 7 days a week, 14 hours a day.  I have engineering and production credits on several major label releases with artists such as Metric, Stereos, and Sarah Harmer.  Some of my most recent work was featured in the latest Twilight movie.

None of this would have been even remotely possible had it not been for Metalworks Institute.

The attitude conveyed by the original poster seems congruent with most of the kids that were in my class that either a) couldn't hack it,  b) were too lazy, or c) seemed to have some strange issue with authority.

Metalworks is like any other life experience.  You get out what you put in.  If you don't come to class, don't take your work seriously, and don't take oppurtunities to connect with the vast number of industry pros you will meet along the way, you won't get much out of it.  Yes, it was expensive, but with a lot of hard work and determination I have made my money back several times over by working on music every single day.

I worked my ass off for a year (not nearly as hard as I work now to try to be successful in a small, competitive music industry) and as a result, was able to find great work!

I'm surprised that the OP complains about MWI not helping him find work.  They were amazing in helping me find work after graduation.

As far as the instructors not being industry professionals... Anyone that does their research can find that this could not be further from the truth... But if you're too lazy to search around and just want to go by what this website says... I'll do the research for you.  Here is some of the staff at MWI

Joel Kazmi - Engineer - worked with Sum41, NSYNC, Fefe Dobson, Sloan, The Tea Party

Alf Annabilini - Engineer - worked with Our Lady Peace, DMX, Nelly Furtado, Kardinal Offishall

Brian Allen - Producer - co-wrote Heart's smash hit "What about Love," produced Lee Aaron, managed Socan's International and Concert department, A & R for record labels

Scott Purdy - Post production - Mixed Stargate (the movie with James Spader - HOLLYWOOD), mixed 3 Van Damme movies, won a gemini for a movie that he mixed in his living room - this guy is seriously talented and a great teacher to those that will put in the time to learn.

Graham Brewer - Engineer - worked with Jet, Sean Desmond, Sam Roberts

Elliott Sairan - Owner and operator of Vyner Road Studios - worked with Gavin Brown, Dale Penner, Natalie McMaster, Universal Honey

Morgan Pottruff - teaches midi, logic, cubase, melodyne, reason etc - Morgan plays keys for violinist Dr. Draw.  He also produces professional instructional dvds for ASK Video on all the music software listed above.

Craig Titus - director of the school - session pianist, engineer, producer - has done a ton of post production also

Matt Blakely - Live Sound - FOH and tour manager for Billy Talent, Slayer, and countless others - this guy seriously knows his stuff.

Is that enough?  I could go on but you get the picture.  These guys are pros.  A few are extremely seasoned veterans, and all have tons of knowledge to share with you.

The original OP talks about checking out other schools.  Well, I hate to bash, but I go through a lot of interns, and after a few bad experiences, I will pretty much only hire MWI grads.  Students from other schools usually don't seem to have learned enough.  Their knowledge of pro tools is usually non-existent, and have no idea about studio etiquette.  YES, when you start, you will be taking out the garbage, cleaning the bathroom, and doing TONS of mundane pro tools work.  NO, you won't be engineering, writing songs, or producing.  That is life.  It's tough, but if you can't get my lunch order right, would we trust you to mix a record?  Hell no!

This brings me to an important point, and is probably the reason why the OP and some other former students seem disgruntled.  MWI was TOUGH.  It was an intense year and the hardest I had ever worked in my life.  That is, until I actually started working in the industry.  MWI whips you into shape and those that can deal with it will be more than ready to enter the industry and go to work.  Those who couldn't deal with it?  They usually spent more time in class complaining about how much work they had or how unfair the teachers were or that the administration didn't care about how much work they had or how unfair the teachers were!  MWI is HARD, the Canadian music industry is HARDER.  GET READY.

If anyone has any specific questions about MWI, please do not hesitate to contact me.  I don't want to post my email, but I think you can email through this site.

D

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#9 Consumer Comment

Thanks Dave

AUTHOR: Ken F. - Branchburg (United States of America)

Dave, I plan on enrolling next September. I went to an open house last year, and I loved it. I respect that you have knowledge and real expierience with the school.


I plan on taking the 2 year Pro-Audio course, for live entertainment. I am just wondering why these people would talk so badly of a college or institute.


I wonder what made them so mad, you are probably right, they could not take the pressure, and the constant work that they were getting. Some people just can not handle hard working enviorments, and do not have the dedication needed for production.


I loved every second I was in Metalworks, the tours were fantastic, and I know there is a ton of knowledge in that building. I am sure the people who speak poorly of Metalworks could not handle it. They were most likely hoping it was like a regular college and there is more partyingand hanging out than there is work. On the other hand, this place is meant to sculpt you into a professional. It turns you into someone who can both lead, and take orders, and work with others. I know for a fact if you have attittude problems, and you cant work with others you will definately have problems only here, but in the work enviorment too. No-one wants to work with people who have attitutdes, it makes the work just less enjoyable. As for the posters who have nothing good to say, its unfortunate for them.


When I start next year, I know there will be people who just cant do it, its that simple. I will succeed, and thats all I care about, I do not give up, and will not go to a different facility just because someone posts negative comments, because they had a bad expierience there. All I know is when I met all the instructors, no one could be nicer, and more enjoyable to talk to.



Thanks for your honesty.


Ken


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#10 Consumer Suggestion

Original Report = Two Thumbs Up!

AUTHOR: Naz - (Canada)

Hello,

If you want to go for Live Audio then Metalworks is good, but if you want to go for in-the-studio works, Post Production and other related things, Metalworks is the last thing you ant to think about.

 I agree with this report and it is true, Metalworks is filled with fake promises. If only Metalworks can have better management and less lies it would be over the top.

Where does it happen in an Audio school when a student wants to book a studio, lots of money has to be paid? that is epic BS.

I have been to SAE and graduated from there before Metalworks, I was able to book the studios there free of charge and as long as I want. as long as its 24 hours notice and the studio is available, which was available for students too (NOT only famous artists: Hint)

Not to mention having some racist moments against my self from one of the Instructors who seriously has some issues; One of the many reasons I dropped out of this Institute.

Peace!

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