• Report: #113183

Complaint Review: AAMCO Transmission -Clark's AAMCO Transmissions Z.F. - RO Clark - Carl J. Lawrence

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  • Submitted: Fri, October 15, 2004
  • Updated: Tue, November 02, 2004

  • Reported By:St. Petersburg Florida
AAMCO Transmission -Clark's AAMCO Transmissions Z.F. - RO Clark - Carl J. Lawrence
3353 5th Avenue South Saint Petersburg, Florida U.S.A.

AAMCO Transmission - Clark's AAMCO Transmissions - Z.F. RO Clark - Carl J. Lawrence - Tom ripoff, coersion, deceptive sales practices, high pressure scare tactics, sexist, agist scam artists, crooks, thieves,liars, swindlers car held hostage Saint Petersburg Florida

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Feel? go back to school

*Consumer Comment: What everybody wants to know~~~

*Consumer Suggestion: Most of his advice is very good, but the fact that he uses an alias degrades his credibility

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Difference?

*Consumer Comment: THe "sensor" debate

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: No shift sensor

*Author of original report: ..I got me car back! BEST WISHES! First Time Customer, Last Time Customer!

*Consumer Comment: Shift sensor#2

*Consumer Suggestion: I am on the "up and up"

*Consumer Suggestion: I am on the "up and up"

*Consumer Suggestion: I am on the "up and up"

*Consumer Suggestion: I am on the "up and up"

*Consumer Comment: 1-2 shift woes - ATTORNEY GENERAL needs to see a pattern before he can act on your behalf.

*Consumer Suggestion: April, here's the real deal - Big companies have money to pay for advertising and lawyers.

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I took my car in for a "free" diagnostic inspection on 10/11/2004 but we only went for a road test due to the fact two hours had passed and they still hadn't put my car on the lift. Tom the Cust. Svc. Mgr.,was very nice and laid back, very interested in my occupation, which is a college student, so he knew from our conversation that I don't have tons of money to give out like it grew on trees and that this is my only car, which I take extremely great care of it, which he complemented me on!

He catered to those facts and stated that the owner of the shop Carl J. Lawrence was a graduate of a very well known local private college in our city and that he was real big on giving discounts to students and "helping them get back on the road in a safe dependable car". So with all that charm I felt a wee bit more trusting, but not fully, my mom and I even went on the road test with him.

I don't like just anybody under her hood! So we drove back to the shop and he informed me that just from driving it he knew that it was an "internal problem" and that the only way that they would know what was wrong with it is that they would have to take the trans out and tear it apart for an internal inspection. Okay I am a young female college kid who knows nothing about transmissions and here is this "professional specialist" telling me that I need this work done because it would be much better than going out buying a used car that could have major engine work needed or some other problems and that I knew I have kept my car up in good condition so why spend all that money and that I really couldn't afford another car.

It took so long for them to get my in on a lift I left and told Tom the Cust. Svc. Mgr., that I would come back Wednesday, Oct. 13, 2004. Wednesday came and I took it back up there. It wasn't as busy as it was that Monday and they got it on the lift.I only gave them permission to do the free diagnostic: road test and computer scan, which I am still not sure that the computer scan was performed, and then he led me out to the bay and told me to smell my trans fluid, which I did.

That's when he started telling me that my trans fluid was varnished and that something internally was wrong with the trans it was getting too hot and something wasn't working properly it could be just a spring he didn't know the only way to find out was to take it out and take it apart.

So I gave them the okay to do the disassembly and reassembly of my trans at a cost of $286.00 plus FL State Tax total $306.02. He told me top leave it with them and he proceeded to finding me a rental car and did so he even went as far as to drive my mom and I over to the company, we thought what a nice little dude, we couldn't have been more incorrect, more like the devil in disguise, a real wolf ya know! HE promised me that my car would be ready by Friday, Oct. 15, 2004 and we went over this like two to three times because I told him I didn't have any money to rent a car beyond three days, he said not a problem.

Now before he did any of that disassembly he was supposed to call me and give me the results of the computer reading, never got that call I had to call him the very next morning Thursday, Oct. 14, 2004 at 8 am SHARP! I was then informed that he had already taken the trans out and it was "on the bench and he was preparing a bench report" I now know in retrospect, from another transmission repair person as a point of reference, that he could have told from the fluid check whether or not taking the trans apart would have been a good idea, but he was banking on the fact that he used his scare tactics on a young female customer who couldn't help but to get the problem fixed through them. Taking the trans out and exposing it to air and getting rid of the old fluid has now put my trans at a greater risk to total damage!

He knew that this would occur but failed to disclose this to me, if he had I would have said NO WAY! Why ruin a good thing? You know how I mentioned earlier that my car was suposed to be ready in three days, well when I went in to get the diagnosis and he had printed out an estimate for the REPAIR, it was $1809.94 repair job, I said "oh no, that's way more money than I want to put into my little car because it just wouldn't be worth it to me. Well at that point he just gets UGLY! He starts to say well we can't put that trans back together it's no good!

He then tries to get me to get a loan to get it fixed which I definitely was NOT about to do. My car is paid in full why go get a payment on it and especially with these clowns having any ties to it. I think not! So then he tells me that he can give me a student discount and a $100.00 off coupon discount which would bring it down to $1528.10, my answer is still no, just put it back together just how I DROVE it in! He says well I can't guarantee you that the car will run, you can tow it home and we can put your trans in your trunk. That's when I got ticked, I told him I didn't tow it in I want to drive it out just the same way I drove it in, smooth and quiet, with no problems except for the delayed gear shifting of the first and second gears upon acceleration after a stop.

He said okay, then he had the gall to tell me that if I would have gotten the car repaired with them then he would have put me ahead of all the other customers and showed me a $2000.00 invoice for another customers repair work to be done and tells me that since I am not getting it fixed that I was being pushed all the way back to the end of the line "because I'm not going to put you ahead of all my $2k " and that I wouldn't get my car back until another three to four days and proceeded to show us out the door.

I was so ticked I swear I had steam coming out of my ears! I got busy though. I called their corporate office and after a few phone tag sessions I got in touch with a Nicole Ext.313, she was very attentive when we did talk and got on the ball, as I write it is Friday, 10/15/2004 so she called today and spoke with the Owner Carl J. Lawrence and said that he said it would be ready Monday 10/18/2004 and it would be in the same working/running condition that I drove it in, and that she would follow up with me until I pick my car up. We will see because I will go above her if needs be, but so far, I can work with her.

I have filed complaints with every agency that will listen and take a complaint and has some power to do something. These clowns need to be stopped and put in check. I am thinking a class action alwsuit perhaps. When something like this happens it makes you feel so violated! If I can prevent just one person from going through this ordeal I'd feel very relieved! I honestly think that they are in the business of placing mechanics liens on peoples' vehicles and resaling them. They are some very shady characters and they have not seen or heard the last of me. They have chosen to rip the wrong girl, I will go about every legal avenue I know and can and will research to see that they are either closed down or majorly reformed!

Also, watch out for these geniuses, they may try to charge you storage fees while they are holding your auto HOSTAGE!, stick to you guns and don't you dare any pay storage, they're the cause of it not being removed. If all else seems to fail, I am thinking small claims, but looking at this site makes me think class action.

Anybody in Florida who had been victimized, I urge you to get on the on the phone or go online and call the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Affairs they are the state body that regulates Auto repair shops and also get on the phone or online and file a complaint with the State Attorney General Charlie Christ's Office he is awesome in working on behalf of the consumer and he gets things done.

Also contact your local news media! Others deserve to be spared this heartache/headache. You know with the economy as unstable as it is most of us don't have money to throw away like its blades of grass, however we earn our money, we work hard for it and these clowns should be required to do the same, work for their money not scam and destroy other people's property and demand a pay check!

Anyone not in Florida, you can do the same but I only know how effective Florida agencies can be, but it can't hurt I'm sure. We all need to band together and let these crooks know that they can't handle us this way, we consumers have the power. Oh yeah and remember folks, have a good Paper trail/documentation and write down any names, days, times , and numbers of whom you have spoken with.

Anybody who can help me with this, you're the golden!

April
St. Petersburg, Florida
U.S.A.

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This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 10/15/2004 09:13 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/AAMCO-Transmission-Clarks-AAMCO-Transmissions-ZF-RO-Clark-Carl-J-Lawrence/Saint-Petersburg-Florida-33712/AAMCO-Transmission-Clarks-AAMCO-Transmissions-ZF-RO-Clark-Carl-J-Lawrence-Tom-113183. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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#1 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Feel? go back to school

AUTHOR: Greg - (U.S.A.)

Heck man me don't feel nothing.I understand these new systems, Thats why I went back to school in 92. Now I work on a team that designs these little do-dads that you put on. When you add on a belt driven turbo or wet NoX systems. They do things such as change the curve of advance fuel and of coarse the shift pattern of the transmission. If you meet any of the older guy's that worked with me back in the 80s they would tell you I was saying then the the next shift kit would be resisters and transistors. I was right but I also was lucky enough to listen to my self and go back to school.
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#2 Consumer Comment

What everybody wants to know~~~

AUTHOR: Tranzmn - (U.S.A.)

Greg~~To answer your question~as you refered to a speed sensor ~~as i said before it is magnetic/ it creates pulse that is read by a computer~~The switch that you refered to on the 350 is a normaly open switch to ground to activate the "smog" system on pre computer vehicles~~This is a on/off system~~This is a way for parts to work together on systems designed by different manufacturers. The systems now are designed to work tighter with each other to create the power/mileage/emissions on todays vehicles. Rob~~~Sorry that you feel the way you do about everything~~But~~~The only reason i provide information to the uninformed is to help "if i can" without any compensation only to know that i've helped someone.~~~Sorry that you feel that this is a venue for debate/arguement on technical know-how~~~~~~or identity~~~it doesn't matter~~~ONLY TO YOU~~~~~THE TRANZMN
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#3 Consumer Suggestion

Most of his advice is very good, but the fact that he uses an alias degrades his credibility

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

There is no difference other than terminology Greg. An engine is powered by "fuel". A motor is powered by electricity. The engine in a car is routinely referred to as a motor all the time. This debate over switches and sensors was just so someone who uses an alias could try and impress himself. Most of his advice is very good, but the fact that he uses an alias degrades his credibility. Even Benjamin Siegel hated the nickname "Bugsy" because of it's detracting his reputation. Hopefully, April will be more careful in the future.
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#4 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Difference?

AUTHOR: Greg - (U.S.A.)

A magnetic when it is tripped sends a signal if it is a speed sensor the computer see's a on off on off and it counts it a pressure sensor is either normally open (no signal) or closed(sending a signal) when these are tripped by pressure the computer gets a signal. Whats the difference?
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#5 Consumer Comment

THe "sensor" debate

AUTHOR: Tranzmn - (U.S.A.)

Greg~~~~~Heres my arguement on this subject~~~~A "sensor" is a magnetic signal pickup,It has no moving parts or contacts,polarity is not nessesary as long as has more than one connection an power is Not at either connection~~~Otherwise if it has points or contacts,only goes to ground or power to "complete" a electrical system~~This is a switch~~and yes the "switch on the 350 is a ground switch and not a sensor~~~~~THe Tranzmn
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#6 UPDATE EX-employee responds

No shift sensor

AUTHOR: Greg - (U.S.A.)

Tranzman how long did you say you have been in the business? Since the first year om GM cars on the old 350 that little sensor on the side of the case by the accumulator that was a shift sensor for lean burn, what about the 200r4s, 700r4s, the early 449t4s, Ford's AXODs they all had a shift sensor in some of the different cars and trucks. In those models how did the computer get the signal to know when it was in high gear on some of those models not only did they a up shift sensor but also one to let the computer know when the tranny down shifted.
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#7 Author of original report

..I got me car back! BEST WISHES! First Time Customer, Last Time Customer!

AUTHOR: April - (U.S.A.)

Ok guys here's the deal, after much digging and calling around contacting my local news station ABC 28 and corresponding back and forth with Nicole Turner from AAMCO Corp., I got my car back today! I don't know what they said or what they did but whatever it was it worked thank God! I received a call from Tom and I went to pick it up. I asked him if he had my keys and he told me "you need to chill" Ha! the nerve of him! He told me that I didn't have "to go to all the extremes that I did." Heck I just got some people involved who put some fire under their butts to get them to do right by me that's all. If I hadn't I can almost guarantee I wouldn't have my car back today! Then he told me to sign the receipt and because I chose to carfully read what I was signing I was "agitating" him and I was "acting as if we were doing something deceptive." Hey bud you said it! Dupe me once shame on you , dupe me again shame on me!

I thought to myself you've got a lot of nerves but I took the high road and didn't even entertain that, I have way too much class for that, so I paid him $306.02 in cash got my receipt/paperwork , told him to have a good day and got out of there!

Needless to say I am relieved and can rest a little easier now, but from reading many of these other complaints I am watching my car carefully to make sure they didn't try any monkey business under the hood, if you know what I mean.

Well I hope that everyone else gets the justice they deserve and don't stop until you do. I know its tiring and overwhelming but don't take it lying down or at least don't go down without a fight! Best wishes to all! And thanks Rob and Tranzmn for all your comments, but through all this I still never found out what exactly was wrong with my girl. Again, BEST WISHES! First Time Customer, Last Time Customer!
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#8 Consumer Comment

Shift sensor#2

AUTHOR: Tranzmn - (U.S.A.)

Well rob~~1988 on up do have a 3-4 shift solonoid this is different from the 84-87 even the electical connector has 3 blade connection~~instead of the 2 blade connection in the 84-87~~but as you know~~~This design did not become a real electronicly controlled trans till later that controls pressure through an epc and full shift solonoids~~~~by the way 88 on up have a 3-4 shift solonoid and a lock up solonoid~~~but otherwise it is a hydraulic controlled trans.~~Thanks rob i teach the differences of the evolution of transmissions from 40s to present~~~~The Tranzmn
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#9 Consumer Suggestion

I am on the "up and up"

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

My MV Certificate is in my office because I don't have a front lobby for customers. Perhaps that wasn't made clear. I did not design this building, and if I did, it would be alot different. The certificate is at eye level right next to me so if you are in my office signing the work order and looking AT me, you cannot help but see it. And Tranzmn(wonder why you don't use your name if you are on the "up and up") you can call the solenoid/sensor whatever you want. If I call the parts house and tell them I need a shift sensor, guess what they send me. And, the A4LD does have a 3-4 "shist solenoid". Therefore, I am right when I say they have one. try looking at the factory parts manuals. The 3-4 shift SENSOR is what tells the converter to lock up. The converter will not lock up with a bad 3-4 SHIFT SOLENOID. Learn your trade. try using your real name also, I have always found that people who only go by aliases are usually criminal in intent.
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#10 Consumer Suggestion

I am on the "up and up"

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

My MV Certificate is in my office because I don't have a front lobby for customers. Perhaps that wasn't made clear. I did not design this building, and if I did, it would be alot different. The certificate is at eye level right next to me so if you are in my office signing the work order and looking AT me, you cannot help but see it. And Tranzmn(wonder why you don't use your name if you are on the "up and up") you can call the solenoid/sensor whatever you want. If I call the parts house and tell them I need a shift sensor, guess what they send me. And, the A4LD does have a 3-4 "shist solenoid". Therefore, I am right when I say they have one. try looking at the factory parts manuals. The 3-4 shift SENSOR is what tells the converter to lock up. The converter will not lock up with a bad 3-4 SHIFT SOLENOID. Learn your trade. try using your real name also, I have always found that people who only go by aliases are usually criminal in intent.
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#11 Consumer Suggestion

I am on the "up and up"

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

My MV Certificate is in my office because I don't have a front lobby for customers. Perhaps that wasn't made clear. I did not design this building, and if I did, it would be alot different. The certificate is at eye level right next to me so if you are in my office signing the work order and looking AT me, you cannot help but see it. And Tranzmn(wonder why you don't use your name if you are on the "up and up") you can call the solenoid/sensor whatever you want. If I call the parts house and tell them I need a shift sensor, guess what they send me. And, the A4LD does have a 3-4 "shist solenoid". Therefore, I am right when I say they have one. try looking at the factory parts manuals. The 3-4 shift SENSOR is what tells the converter to lock up. The converter will not lock up with a bad 3-4 SHIFT SOLENOID. Learn your trade. try using your real name also, I have always found that people who only go by aliases are usually criminal in intent.
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#12 Consumer Suggestion

I am on the "up and up"

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

My MV Certificate is in my office because I don't have a front lobby for customers. Perhaps that wasn't made clear. I did not design this building, and if I did, it would be alot different. The certificate is at eye level right next to me so if you are in my office signing the work order and looking AT me, you cannot help but see it. And Tranzmn(wonder why you don't use your name if you are on the "up and up") you can call the solenoid/sensor whatever you want. If I call the parts house and tell them I need a shift sensor, guess what they send me. And, the A4LD does have a 3-4 "shist solenoid". Therefore, I am right when I say they have one. try looking at the factory parts manuals. The 3-4 shift SENSOR is what tells the converter to lock up. The converter will not lock up with a bad 3-4 SHIFT SOLENOID. Learn your trade. try using your real name also, I have always found that people who only go by aliases are usually criminal in intent.
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#13 Consumer Comment

1-2 shift woes - ATTORNEY GENERAL needs to see a pattern before he can act on your behalf.

AUTHOR: Tranzmn - (U.S.A.)

April ~~To bad you took it there~~~Looking at robs suggestions~~The office is not the best place to put all your consumer requirements~~~If your on the up and up the first things you see are all the contact info~~Thats how it s in Ca.~~I look for them when i patronize an unknown vendor.'~~If the work order is clear on the description of work contracted for At that point its legal.It sounds like the vehicle was not running at peak performance~~Possible restricted exhaust?~~~~~~The computer controled vehicles have many sensors that measure load/speed/etc.~~It sounds like you had another problem not the trans.The AAMCO (ALL AUTOMATICS MUST COME OUT)way is to disable the car before you confirm the root cause of the malfunction.This could of been diagnosed in the car without removal. #1 oil pressure test (verify hydraulic integrity) #2 computer scan to review electrical signals & comands and any present codes.~~AMMCO has a sheet with each job with places to make notes/documentations of conditions found "prior" to removal. This is supposed to stay with the job paperwork.By the way Rob~~~A4LD~~transmissions are hydraulic and DO NOT HAVE 1-2 SHIFT SENSORS only a VSS~~NO Transmissions have 1-2 shift sensors~~1-2 shift solenoids which are controlled by signal from pcm or tcm.names will change by makes.Sensors initiate signal~~~ solonoids act on signal thats the difference of the two~~~~~April it might be in your best interest to ask in writing for these documents or copies of them~~if they refuse to produce them ask in writing by return reciept requested mailing to aamco corporate.So you involve both partners in the loop.I'm sure the ATTORNEY GENERAL needs to see a pattern before he can act on your behalf. THE TRANZMN
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#14 Consumer Suggestion

April, here's the real deal - Big companies have money to pay for advertising and lawyers.

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

On the wall in plain sight you find the blue poster containing the info for the Division of Consumer services. Attached to this poster MUST be the owner's Motor Vehicle Repair Registration Certificate. At the top right of this you will find a number MV*****. You will need this number to get anywhere with the Dept of Ag in Florida. This is how repair shops are identified. It MUST be visible to everyone in a conspicuous place. Mine is hanging on the wall in my office. It's there because I only do business in my office. I do not have a front counter at my shop down here. If you are in my office, it is right at eye level and nobody can miss it. I find it hard to believe the $286 plus tax was for removal, disassembly AND reassembly and install. What it probably was for is what is called RDI. This means remove, disassemble, and inspect. It is legal in Florida to do this and then just place the torn down tranny back in the trunk as he offered. RDI does not include reassembly ot installation. That is how they get you. Florida law requires the vehicle be given back to the customer exactly as it came in if the customer chooses not to have the repairs done. The loophole is RDI. They get you to sign the repair order for RDI so they can stay within the law and not waste time doing work for nothing. If you agree to RDI, they have fulfilled the terms of the order by doing everything EXCEPT putting it back together. That would cost extra, along with all "parts required to place vehicle back...". They can legally charge you for labor, gaskets, fluids, etc. By the time this is done, the only money saved will have been the parts that were actually needed to fix the vehicle. Since there will be no warranty and the vehicle still will not be "fixed", you will not have saved anything, just thrown good money after bad. I do not fully agree with RDI as a rule, but it is legal and does come in handy for some repairs. If an angine has internal noises, the only way to check it is to tear into it. If the customer decides NOT to have it fixed because the repair would cost more than the vehicle is worth, or the customer decides they "can do it myself for less", or find out they don't have the $$ to do it anyway, I can leave it torn apart and they can tow it away. If they want me to put it all back together without fixing the problem, I will and charge them for it. This would be a waste of $$ and time. That is why RDI came into practice down here. I also do transmission work. I know enough about them to tell you up front what the problem "probably" is. All vehicles have their own little quirks and the same repairs show up on all of them. Chrysler products are notorious for A/C evaporators. Mazdas have bad transmissions. If you fix one, you fix them all. In the tranny game, RDI is a scam. They know what they will find before they open it up. They get you to let them do RDI so you will be stuck, and they know it. Most shops advertise make-believe prices like $8 oil changes and $20 tune-ups. Tranny shops do the $30 fluid/filter change. None of these can be done at the advertised price. Nobody ever owns "most cars" and the games begin. Your car is stuck on a lift and you can either pay or stay. Tranny shops are the worst offenders though. They pull the pan down and show you "all this material" from the pan. I can cover an acre of concrete with a quart of fluid. They can turn a teaspoon of debris into a $2000 repair job. Some debris is always normal. It's called "normal wear and tear". If the stuff is piled up and the tranny wasn't working right, that would be different. Since you said your tranny had some issues, it may have needed RDI. I doubt it though. Since you did not state what kind of vehicle you have, it is impossible to offer any reasonable guesses as to the actual problem. I will offer this though. Since your complaint was a shift error from 1-2, I will assume the problem is nothing more than a shift sensor. Most vehicles made from about 1986 and up use electrically controlled automatics. In my professional opinion, you got jacked. Chryslers are bad for shift sensors, so are most imports. Some of the GM front wheel drives are too. That horrid excuse for a transmission(A4LD) that Ford put into the Rangers and Aerostars was the worst. Good luck getting some resolution to your immediate problem. Remeber this though. AAMCO shops are franchises. The Corporate Office can do very little but pay lip service when you call them. All the shop has to do is fax them a copy showing RDI and they're covered. If you'd like, you may fax me a copy of whatever you signed to (904)381-1270 and I will look at it and tell you what you really signed. I tell everyone to use Mom/Pop shops for their repairs, and not just because I own one. Big companies have money to pay for advertising and lawyers. Small shops do not. Most small shops will also take care of younger people better. I have children and would not want them "taken for a ride" either. Good shops stay busy through "word of mouth" advertising and the occasional special of the month. Good luck.
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