symbolic
  • Report: #135630

Complaint Review: C.R.C.

Thank You

Read how Ripoff Report saves consumers millions.

  • Submitted: Sat, March 19, 2005
  • Updated: Fri, July 21, 2006

  • Reported By:Reading Pennsylvania
C.R.C.
1383 South Missouri Ave. Clearwater, Florida U.S.A.

C.R.C. ripoff Clearwater Florida

*Consumer Comment: Walking the legality line

*Consumer Comment: Walking the legality line

*Consumer Comment: Walking the legality line

*Consumer Comment: Walking the legality line

*Consumer Comment: Thankx!!

*Consumer Comment: Thankx!!

*Consumer Comment: Thankx!!

*Consumer Comment: I must agree that this is a scheme...

*Consumer Comment: STILL AT IT?

*Consumer Comment: STILL AT IT?

*Consumer Comment: STILL AT IT?

*Consumer Comment: STILL AT IT?

*Consumer Comment: they admitted it was for entry into a sweepstake

*Consumer Comment: SCREW THESE F@#KERS - where is the damn Florida Attorney General Too busy taking money from these crooks letting them all stay in business.

*Consumer Comment: Got the card in the mail today...thank god for Rip Off Reports!

*Consumer Comment: peggy and kevin - hope you guys figure out a way to market the magazines and ditch the phony 'sweepstakes ' idea.

*UPDATE Employee: JustAnEmployee

*Consumer Comment: The FTC has you guys figured out

*UPDATE Employee: Ok good points here.

*UPDATE Employee: Ok good points here.

*UPDATE Employee: Ok good points here.

*UPDATE Employee: Ok good points here.

*Consumer Comment: Why not just do this?

*Consumer Comment: Let's try this again, Kevin

*UPDATE Employee: Thanx for reading the facts.

*Consumer Comment: telemarketing and the bait and switch

*Consumer Comment: My experiences...

*UPDATE Employee: Was there any merit to what you just said Frank?

*Consumer Comment: Response to CRC shill Kevin

*UPDATE Employee: Not quite how you explained it . . .

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Yesterday I recieved a small yellow postcard in the mail claiming that "we're going nuts looking for you!" with the name Debbi Peti at the bottom. So I called this 800 number and I was connected to a represenitive and they asked me for a control number. Then the person was so friendly. I was told I was entered in a sweepstakes and they asked me about a credit card so I thought maybe it is for verification. Boy was I wrong! I just gave my card number to the most ruthless scam company I have ever heard of.

I was then told I just purchased 16 months of about a bajillion magazines for over a year at almost 60 dollars a month. Boy was I upset. I then proceeded to tell the person I did not want to do this or recieve the free gift I was "awarded;" but it was no good. I was told that I have to call customer service and try to cancel but the represenitive told me "I dont think it's possible.

My fiancee has been calling the 800 number for me all day and doing research on this scam. He's only gotten busy signals and a whole lot of reports on how the company scams innocent people! Please help bring down this fruadulent organization!

Jessica
Reading, Pennsylvania
U.S.A.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 03/19/2005 10:41 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/CRC/Clearwater-Florida-33756/CRC-ripoff-Clearwater-Florida-135630. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

Walking the legality line

AUTHOR: Lisa - (U.S.A.)

Companies such as this have a way of walking right on that fine line between legal and not. And, they often slip off of that line, but unfortunately most consumers because of embarrassment or thinking it is a waste of time, will not pursue legal means to stop these companies from further inflicting harm on other consumers. This company in particular operates under several names which consumers should be aware. Some of their AKA's or DBA's are C.R.C., C.R.C.O.C., Clearwater Newspapers and Magazines, Clearwater News Dealers and Newsstands, among others I am sure, and their "auto presorted first-class US postage paid" permit #130 out of Fort Myers, FL was paid by USA Publications. This last bit of information came from the Fort Myers Post Office Business Division and can be verified by anyone because it is public information.

As a consumer who is fed-up with companies such as this one, I will be submitting all information I have found over to the Attorney General's office in my state. I urge every consumer who has received this yellow post card to do the same. The AG offices receive enough complaints, investigations will follow. Most state AG offices have an electronic form on their websites for complaints.
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#2 Consumer Comment

Walking the legality line

AUTHOR: Lisa - (U.S.A.)

Companies such as this have a way of walking right on that fine line between legal and not. And, they often slip off of that line, but unfortunately most consumers because of embarrassment or thinking it is a waste of time, will not pursue legal means to stop these companies from further inflicting harm on other consumers. This company in particular operates under several names which consumers should be aware. Some of their AKA's or DBA's are C.R.C., C.R.C.O.C., Clearwater Newspapers and Magazines, Clearwater News Dealers and Newsstands, among others I am sure, and their "auto presorted first-class US postage paid" permit #130 out of Fort Myers, FL was paid by USA Publications. This last bit of information came from the Fort Myers Post Office Business Division and can be verified by anyone because it is public information.

As a consumer who is fed-up with companies such as this one, I will be submitting all information I have found over to the Attorney General's office in my state. I urge every consumer who has received this yellow post card to do the same. The AG offices receive enough complaints, investigations will follow. Most state AG offices have an electronic form on their websites for complaints.
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#3 Consumer Comment

Walking the legality line

AUTHOR: Lisa - (U.S.A.)

Companies such as this have a way of walking right on that fine line between legal and not. And, they often slip off of that line, but unfortunately most consumers because of embarrassment or thinking it is a waste of time, will not pursue legal means to stop these companies from further inflicting harm on other consumers. This company in particular operates under several names which consumers should be aware. Some of their AKA's or DBA's are C.R.C., C.R.C.O.C., Clearwater Newspapers and Magazines, Clearwater News Dealers and Newsstands, among others I am sure, and their "auto presorted first-class US postage paid" permit #130 out of Fort Myers, FL was paid by USA Publications. This last bit of information came from the Fort Myers Post Office Business Division and can be verified by anyone because it is public information.

As a consumer who is fed-up with companies such as this one, I will be submitting all information I have found over to the Attorney General's office in my state. I urge every consumer who has received this yellow post card to do the same. The AG offices receive enough complaints, investigations will follow. Most state AG offices have an electronic form on their websites for complaints.
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#4 Consumer Comment

Walking the legality line

AUTHOR: Lisa - (U.S.A.)

Companies such as this have a way of walking right on that fine line between legal and not. And, they often slip off of that line, but unfortunately most consumers because of embarrassment or thinking it is a waste of time, will not pursue legal means to stop these companies from further inflicting harm on other consumers. This company in particular operates under several names which consumers should be aware. Some of their AKA's or DBA's are C.R.C., C.R.C.O.C., Clearwater Newspapers and Magazines, Clearwater News Dealers and Newsstands, among others I am sure, and their "auto presorted first-class US postage paid" permit #130 out of Fort Myers, FL was paid by USA Publications. This last bit of information came from the Fort Myers Post Office Business Division and can be verified by anyone because it is public information.

As a consumer who is fed-up with companies such as this one, I will be submitting all information I have found over to the Attorney General's office in my state. I urge every consumer who has received this yellow post card to do the same. The AG offices receive enough complaints, investigations will follow. Most state AG offices have an electronic form on their websites for complaints.
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#5 Consumer Comment

Thankx!!

AUTHOR: David - (U.S.A.)

I received my little yellow card this evening. Thanks for the information on this site regarding this particular card. It prevented me from having to waste the little free time I have calling the number and being harrassed by a salesperson.

As I write this, the little yellow card is ripped in half and in the trash can.
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#6 Consumer Comment

Thankx!!

AUTHOR: David - (U.S.A.)

I received my little yellow card this evening. Thanks for the information on this site regarding this particular card. It prevented me from having to waste the little free time I have calling the number and being harrassed by a salesperson.

As I write this, the little yellow card is ripped in half and in the trash can.
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#7 Consumer Comment

Thankx!!

AUTHOR: David - (U.S.A.)

I received my little yellow card this evening. Thanks for the information on this site regarding this particular card. It prevented me from having to waste the little free time I have calling the number and being harrassed by a salesperson.

As I write this, the little yellow card is ripped in half and in the trash can.
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#8 Consumer Comment

I must agree that this is a scheme...

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Received the same yellow post card, and I must comment. No offense, CRC, but you guys are just trying to trick people into buying stuff. It's a played out scheme... I mean, how good of news is it that I will be entered into a sweepstakes. I could go to a well known million dollar prize awarding site and be entered just as easily. So, here's my opinion. It is now illegal in many states for telemarketers to call people, so you guys figured out a way to get around that by having the people call you. I also seriously doubt it costs you $3.50 for each of these little cards to send out. I could personally mail these out with the required postage much cheaper than that. Either way, leave people alone. You wouldn't be on this site if you hadn't done someone wrong. (I mean the card says "It is real important that you call toll free..." How important is it really that I will be entered into a sweepstakes and have the opportunity to buy magazing subscriptions from you???)
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#9 Consumer Comment

STILL AT IT?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)


FELLAHS:

THIS IS TOM AGAIN REGARDING THE YELLOW CARD BAIT AND SWITCH. I AM NOW A LICENCED MORTGAGE BROKER . TO DRUM UP BUSINESS WE SEND OUT FLIERS STUFFED IN BUSINESS ENVELOPES TO LOOK LIKE LEGIT MAIL.

I SEND OUT 3000 A WEEK. I GET 7 PHONE CALLS PER BATCH. THAT IS ABOUT WHAT? 1/5 OF ONE PERCENT?

OUT OF THE 7 CALLS I GET 5 WHO ARE USELESS. 3 WANT TO JUST GRILL ME FOR INFO AND HAVE NO INTEREST IN REFINANCING - 2 HAVE SCORES SO LOW OR NO EQUITY I CANT FUND THEM.

THE OTHER 2 TURN INTO LOANS -WHICH I THEN PUT IN A LOT OF EFFORT DRIVING TO THEIR HOMES AND FINDING THEM THE BEST DEAL TO SUIT THEIR NEEDS.

I NET ABOUT 2000 OFF EACH DEAL ON AVERAGE WHICH I SPLIT WITH THE BROKERAGE FIRM -SO I GET 2K A WEEK TOTAL.

THE MAILERS COST ABOUT 480 BUCKS PER BATCH AND WITH ALL THE OVERHEAD AND SALARIES TO MANAGMENT AND SECRETARY -THERE IS 11 OF US SO I THINK THEY NET ABOUT 300 OUT OF THEIR 1000 PER DEAL. SO THE COMPANY MAKES ABOUT 600 PER WEEK OFF ME TIMES 11 BROKERS SO ABOUT 6600 A WEEK PROFIT. SO THE BROKERAGE NETS ABOUT 26K PER MONTH PROFIT FOR THE OWNERS.

SO WHY NOT JUST SEND OUT FLIERS ADVERTISING THE MAGAZINES? THE PEOPLE WHO RESPOND WILL WANT THE MAGAZINES. U WILL MAKE PLENTY OFF IT IF U GET THE POSTAGE FOR CHEAP ENOUGH.

STOP THE BAIT AND SWITCH.
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#10 Consumer Comment

STILL AT IT?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)


FELLAHS:

THIS IS TOM AGAIN REGARDING THE YELLOW CARD BAIT AND SWITCH. I AM NOW A LICENCED MORTGAGE BROKER . TO DRUM UP BUSINESS WE SEND OUT FLIERS STUFFED IN BUSINESS ENVELOPES TO LOOK LIKE LEGIT MAIL.

I SEND OUT 3000 A WEEK. I GET 7 PHONE CALLS PER BATCH. THAT IS ABOUT WHAT? 1/5 OF ONE PERCENT?

OUT OF THE 7 CALLS I GET 5 WHO ARE USELESS. 3 WANT TO JUST GRILL ME FOR INFO AND HAVE NO INTEREST IN REFINANCING - 2 HAVE SCORES SO LOW OR NO EQUITY I CANT FUND THEM.

THE OTHER 2 TURN INTO LOANS -WHICH I THEN PUT IN A LOT OF EFFORT DRIVING TO THEIR HOMES AND FINDING THEM THE BEST DEAL TO SUIT THEIR NEEDS.

I NET ABOUT 2000 OFF EACH DEAL ON AVERAGE WHICH I SPLIT WITH THE BROKERAGE FIRM -SO I GET 2K A WEEK TOTAL.

THE MAILERS COST ABOUT 480 BUCKS PER BATCH AND WITH ALL THE OVERHEAD AND SALARIES TO MANAGMENT AND SECRETARY -THERE IS 11 OF US SO I THINK THEY NET ABOUT 300 OUT OF THEIR 1000 PER DEAL. SO THE COMPANY MAKES ABOUT 600 PER WEEK OFF ME TIMES 11 BROKERS SO ABOUT 6600 A WEEK PROFIT. SO THE BROKERAGE NETS ABOUT 26K PER MONTH PROFIT FOR THE OWNERS.

SO WHY NOT JUST SEND OUT FLIERS ADVERTISING THE MAGAZINES? THE PEOPLE WHO RESPOND WILL WANT THE MAGAZINES. U WILL MAKE PLENTY OFF IT IF U GET THE POSTAGE FOR CHEAP ENOUGH.

STOP THE BAIT AND SWITCH.
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#11 Consumer Comment

STILL AT IT?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)


FELLAHS:

THIS IS TOM AGAIN REGARDING THE YELLOW CARD BAIT AND SWITCH. I AM NOW A LICENCED MORTGAGE BROKER . TO DRUM UP BUSINESS WE SEND OUT FLIERS STUFFED IN BUSINESS ENVELOPES TO LOOK LIKE LEGIT MAIL.

I SEND OUT 3000 A WEEK. I GET 7 PHONE CALLS PER BATCH. THAT IS ABOUT WHAT? 1/5 OF ONE PERCENT?

OUT OF THE 7 CALLS I GET 5 WHO ARE USELESS. 3 WANT TO JUST GRILL ME FOR INFO AND HAVE NO INTEREST IN REFINANCING - 2 HAVE SCORES SO LOW OR NO EQUITY I CANT FUND THEM.

THE OTHER 2 TURN INTO LOANS -WHICH I THEN PUT IN A LOT OF EFFORT DRIVING TO THEIR HOMES AND FINDING THEM THE BEST DEAL TO SUIT THEIR NEEDS.

I NET ABOUT 2000 OFF EACH DEAL ON AVERAGE WHICH I SPLIT WITH THE BROKERAGE FIRM -SO I GET 2K A WEEK TOTAL.

THE MAILERS COST ABOUT 480 BUCKS PER BATCH AND WITH ALL THE OVERHEAD AND SALARIES TO MANAGMENT AND SECRETARY -THERE IS 11 OF US SO I THINK THEY NET ABOUT 300 OUT OF THEIR 1000 PER DEAL. SO THE COMPANY MAKES ABOUT 600 PER WEEK OFF ME TIMES 11 BROKERS SO ABOUT 6600 A WEEK PROFIT. SO THE BROKERAGE NETS ABOUT 26K PER MONTH PROFIT FOR THE OWNERS.

SO WHY NOT JUST SEND OUT FLIERS ADVERTISING THE MAGAZINES? THE PEOPLE WHO RESPOND WILL WANT THE MAGAZINES. U WILL MAKE PLENTY OFF IT IF U GET THE POSTAGE FOR CHEAP ENOUGH.

STOP THE BAIT AND SWITCH.
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#12 Consumer Comment

STILL AT IT?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)


FELLAHS:

THIS IS TOM AGAIN REGARDING THE YELLOW CARD BAIT AND SWITCH. I AM NOW A LICENCED MORTGAGE BROKER . TO DRUM UP BUSINESS WE SEND OUT FLIERS STUFFED IN BUSINESS ENVELOPES TO LOOK LIKE LEGIT MAIL.

I SEND OUT 3000 A WEEK. I GET 7 PHONE CALLS PER BATCH. THAT IS ABOUT WHAT? 1/5 OF ONE PERCENT?

OUT OF THE 7 CALLS I GET 5 WHO ARE USELESS. 3 WANT TO JUST GRILL ME FOR INFO AND HAVE NO INTEREST IN REFINANCING - 2 HAVE SCORES SO LOW OR NO EQUITY I CANT FUND THEM.

THE OTHER 2 TURN INTO LOANS -WHICH I THEN PUT IN A LOT OF EFFORT DRIVING TO THEIR HOMES AND FINDING THEM THE BEST DEAL TO SUIT THEIR NEEDS.

I NET ABOUT 2000 OFF EACH DEAL ON AVERAGE WHICH I SPLIT WITH THE BROKERAGE FIRM -SO I GET 2K A WEEK TOTAL.

THE MAILERS COST ABOUT 480 BUCKS PER BATCH AND WITH ALL THE OVERHEAD AND SALARIES TO MANAGMENT AND SECRETARY -THERE IS 11 OF US SO I THINK THEY NET ABOUT 300 OUT OF THEIR 1000 PER DEAL. SO THE COMPANY MAKES ABOUT 600 PER WEEK OFF ME TIMES 11 BROKERS SO ABOUT 6600 A WEEK PROFIT. SO THE BROKERAGE NETS ABOUT 26K PER MONTH PROFIT FOR THE OWNERS.

SO WHY NOT JUST SEND OUT FLIERS ADVERTISING THE MAGAZINES? THE PEOPLE WHO RESPOND WILL WANT THE MAGAZINES. U WILL MAKE PLENTY OFF IT IF U GET THE POSTAGE FOR CHEAP ENOUGH.

STOP THE BAIT AND SWITCH.
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#13 Consumer Comment

they admitted it was for entry into a sweepstake

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

I am very sceptical about C.R.C. and their operation having received a "yellow card" from them today.

I called the toll free number and the lady started by asking me for my special I.D. number which I of course did not give her. I asked her what exactly this was all about and what was I supposed to contact them about.

She admitted it was for entry into a sweepstake so I said I was not interested so she didn't argue. To be honest she come across as someone who had a bad day with rejections.

Also having read the rebuttals from I think it was Kevin, these contacts come from credit card holders, well that is B.S. My wife and I do not hold a credit card which is our personal choice. However a little spelling mistake in the address showed me where the contact originated from. These are obviously "bought" mailing lists.
Now I have one final query. Perhaps someone with the correct knowledge can check out.

C.R.C. act so very similarly to Pat Haines/NME it makes me think are they all part of the same group from Clearwater,Florida, the SCAM capital of the WORLD.

Lets check this out. It would be an interesting expose!!!
Keep up the good work Ripoffreport.com
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#14 Consumer Comment

SCREW THESE F@#KERS - where is the damn Florida Attorney General Too busy taking money from these crooks letting them all stay in business.

AUTHOR: Justin - (Virgin Islands (U.S.))

These people called me and just to be a nice guy i said i'd pay the $1 dollar they were asking of me to try their program FREE for seven days. FREEEEE Every time they mentioned the monthy payment I asked it's free for 7 DAYS right??, and all i'm paying is ONE DOLLAR for now and they kept saying yes, yes, yes. They said i was going to get a free two day three night vaction even if i canceled before the seven days were up, so i thought no problem. Next thing i know i'm being asked these questions and my answers are being recorded and i'm like wtf is this, this is kinda sketchy. I then went to the gym, and when i got back i decided to check my debit account online, OOO and what do i find a $42 DOLLAR deduction in my account from those FU@kers. This caused me to go negative (i only had like 20 bucks in it, lol), so i costed me another $25.

Luckly i don't use my card often and i canceled it and called those fu@king bas*ards the next day and told them to FU*K off. which i plan to do more often just to piss them off

- OVER AND OVER AGAIN, over and over and over, I ASKED IF I WAS GOING TO BE BILLED MORE THAN ONE DOLLAR$$$

- EVERY TIME THEY SAID NOOOOoooo

- ONE HOUR LATER A $42 charge, FUC@ THEM
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#15 Consumer Comment

Got the card in the mail today...thank god for Rip Off Reports!

AUTHOR: Jeff - (U.S.A.)

the yellow card....

Dear Jeff

We are trying to reach you with Good News! It is real important that you Call! 1-800-.........

Thanks
Debbie Peti

.....

What is the good news?

That C.R.C. does not have the best prices on Magazines? Where did the contest go?

I know not to call....Thanks RIPOFF REPORT!
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#16 Consumer Comment

peggy and kevin - hope you guys figure out a way to market the magazines and ditch the phony 'sweepstakes ' idea.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Just to say my final 2 words:

Lets be honest here frank. These 2 fully admit it aint the most honest way to attract potential customers. They fully admit it which is very refreshing . Most if not all scam companies would never stand up in an open forum and admit as such.

Therefore. not only is their company not a scam -but i sure would like to find 2 employees this candid and honest.

I hope you guys figure out a way to market the magazines and ditch the phony 'sweepstakes ' idea. Its a very good deal for folks who like reading magazines.

God bless
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#17 UPDATE Employee

JustAnEmployee

AUTHOR: Peggy - (U.S.A.)

This is not a scam. If it were I would not work at this company. I was raised better than that.
Before I was hired I had asked if there was really a sweepstakes. The answer was: Yes, people do win. Then he asked if I would like to see the people who won. I did, checked it out and they did actually win.
But back to the company. We do tell the people who call about the sweepstakes, and yes we do go on to tell them about the mags. Alot of people ask in the beginning if I am selling anything. I give them a honest answer, Yes, magazines. But if you give me the opportunity I will explain everything to you and if you like it, great!

I am a magazine reader, I love magazines, but I cannot afford to spend $5.00 for one mag.

I was standing in the checkout line at my local supermarket and I noticed a new mag about organizing. I picked it up and looked at all the articals. Nice magazine. I was going to get it, turned it over to look at the price. OH MY GOD! They wanted $9.49. All I thought was -Are these pages flecked with gold? Then I placed it back on the rack picked my stand by Womans Day, still one of the cheapests mags out there at $2.49.

Went off the subject, sorry.

Back to the company. We don't rip people off, we just offer a nice magazine package for you, and you have a chance to win some nice prizes. I have never won a thing in my life, but people do win.
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#18 Consumer Comment

The FTC has you guys figured out

AUTHOR: Frank - (U.S.A.)

Well, Kevin, if you won't listen to those of us who post here, maybe you'll listen to the Federal Trade Commission:

http://www1.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/tmarkg/magzn.htm

Excerpt:

Not Just by Phone: Other Questionable Sales Approaches

While many unscrupulous subscription sellers rely on the phone to make their pitch, some do business in other ways. For example:

Postcards in the mail:

The postcards say nothing about magazine subscriptions but direct you to call a telephone number about a contest, prize or sweepstakes entry. If you call, you may get information about prizes, gifts or other awards - but more than likely, you'll get a sales pitch for magazine subscriptions. According to the law, you never have to buy anything or pay to claim a prize, gift or award.

-end of excerpt-

My problem is not with what you're selling (magazines); my complaints are about how you're selling it. Seems that the Federal Trade Commission has similar complaints, too.

Oh, by the way, the Do Not Call list doesn't prevent you from mailing out junk mail; it is strictly for telemarketing calls and such.

You've been BUSTED, Kev!
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#19 UPDATE Employee

Ok good points here.

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Ok, Tom.

I can agree with that. I too would agree, that the best approach is to send information regarding the product. Many people though, once they hear the information from a person, see things better then if they had just read it. Many times even I read things wrong, and had I payed just a little more attention to certain parts, or had someone there to answer my questions, I would have been more inclined to buy that product.

I have had the idea of maybe even setting up a website for the company, in which the very same information would be given, and the customer could even place an order online, or, if better for them, read the information online, and then call in to get more details or ask questions. I dont see why that couldnt work, but once a company has been doing something the same way for so long, it is hard to change.

The company I work for isnt very large. It would be too expensive for us to send out detailed pamphlets completely describing our product and services. The postcard is smaller and cheaper then a nicely drawn out information package, and the callers still get the same details just by calling. You know, if you hear the word magazine come up, and you dont want to hear more, you can hang up the phone. All you did was spend about 2 minutes to find out what it was; a sweepstakes entry and magazine promotion. Not too big of a deal really...

Maybe, we can find a cheap, better way of doing things, but for now, this is what we have done for the last 14 years, and it may not change all too soon. Its just how we present it.
Really there is nothing to lose. The sweepstakes isnt GREAT news, but it is good news, and if you actually are interested even a little bit, and take the time so hear out the promotion, you will see that it too, is a good promotion.

If you dont agree, then when you hear the word magazines, feel free to say no thanks, and we will really be ok with hanging up like that. I have people all day who say no thanks once I mention magazines, and thats not a problem. Its there for you if you want it.

People watch commercials on TV every day. A commercial is kinda the same thing as what we do, except we do it on the phone. If you dont like watching a commercial, you dont have to watch it, or you can change the channel. If you do want to watch it, it will give you details, and you can listen, and then possibly buy the product. Same thing with us. If you want the info, just stay on the line. If not... tell us no thanks, and then you have that option to hang up, ending the marketing.

Frank, as a side note, we do follow the do not call list, and it ALSO applies to mailing. Its more like a do not contact list. We comply with it in accordance with the laws of telemarketing, and mail marketing. If a customer asks to be put on the do not call/contact list, we do put them on it. Our computer allows us to do that as an end of call option. It takes 30 to 45 days for it to go in to effect. Sometimes someone who has just recently asked another company to add them to the do not contact list will get mail from us. Thats not our fault, if the list has not been updated yet. However, we will be happy to end the call on a good note with the caller right then and there, and make sure that their name IS on the list by also adding it ourselves.

Please guys, dont over-react. Its a sweepstakes and a magazine promotion. Its our business, its what we do. Sites like this make business for us worse by giving people bad facts by ranters and ravers...

Granted, sometimes it is a very good thing to inform people about scam companies, but we are not a scam company. We might be slightly annoying, but we are just in business. Thats why I came here and posted to explain what was really going on for people who genuinely are interested, to avoid confusion in the future, and to protect the name of my company, a legitimate business, who is getting hurt pretty badly by sites such as this one. Please understand that.

All we ask is for a few minutes of your own time, when you are free, to make a phone call, and find out what its all about. Youll hear that you were entered in the sweepstakes, and we will verify the address for that in case you are a winner. The odds for a grand prize are a little better then 1 in 12 million, not 1 in 500 million. There are still hundreds of smaller prizes for the people who dont win grand prizes, and you have several chances to win, so the odds on them are alot better. Not sure exactly what the odds on those are though, but since there are hundreds of them, simple math could give an estimate... Lets just say, 1 in 60,000
Thats assuming that there are about 200 smaller prizes, and 12 million entrants.

Then, you will hear about the magazines. If you want to hear more, stay on the line and hear it out, its a good deal. If you dont care at all, then at that point, just hang up. You havent lost anything at all, except about 2 minutes of your time, and 1 and a half of that was us saying Hi, and telling you about the sweepstakes and the prizes, and odds.

Well, I'm done guys. I have done nothing but give good facts here, and I have given all the facts that I possibly can, as truthful as could be. If you get a postcard, the choice is in your hands.

Thanks for taking the time to come here and read the site, showing interest in what is really going on.

Farewell.
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#20 UPDATE Employee

Ok good points here.

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Ok, Tom.

I can agree with that. I too would agree, that the best approach is to send information regarding the product. Many people though, once they hear the information from a person, see things better then if they had just read it. Many times even I read things wrong, and had I payed just a little more attention to certain parts, or had someone there to answer my questions, I would have been more inclined to buy that product.

I have had the idea of maybe even setting up a website for the company, in which the very same information would be given, and the customer could even place an order online, or, if better for them, read the information online, and then call in to get more details or ask questions. I dont see why that couldnt work, but once a company has been doing something the same way for so long, it is hard to change.

The company I work for isnt very large. It would be too expensive for us to send out detailed pamphlets completely describing our product and services. The postcard is smaller and cheaper then a nicely drawn out information package, and the callers still get the same details just by calling. You know, if you hear the word magazine come up, and you dont want to hear more, you can hang up the phone. All you did was spend about 2 minutes to find out what it was; a sweepstakes entry and magazine promotion. Not too big of a deal really...

Maybe, we can find a cheap, better way of doing things, but for now, this is what we have done for the last 14 years, and it may not change all too soon. Its just how we present it.
Really there is nothing to lose. The sweepstakes isnt GREAT news, but it is good news, and if you actually are interested even a little bit, and take the time so hear out the promotion, you will see that it too, is a good promotion.

If you dont agree, then when you hear the word magazines, feel free to say no thanks, and we will really be ok with hanging up like that. I have people all day who say no thanks once I mention magazines, and thats not a problem. Its there for you if you want it.

People watch commercials on TV every day. A commercial is kinda the same thing as what we do, except we do it on the phone. If you dont like watching a commercial, you dont have to watch it, or you can change the channel. If you do want to watch it, it will give you details, and you can listen, and then possibly buy the product. Same thing with us. If you want the info, just stay on the line. If not... tell us no thanks, and then you have that option to hang up, ending the marketing.

Frank, as a side note, we do follow the do not call list, and it ALSO applies to mailing. Its more like a do not contact list. We comply with it in accordance with the laws of telemarketing, and mail marketing. If a customer asks to be put on the do not call/contact list, we do put them on it. Our computer allows us to do that as an end of call option. It takes 30 to 45 days for it to go in to effect. Sometimes someone who has just recently asked another company to add them to the do not contact list will get mail from us. Thats not our fault, if the list has not been updated yet. However, we will be happy to end the call on a good note with the caller right then and there, and make sure that their name IS on the list by also adding it ourselves.

Please guys, dont over-react. Its a sweepstakes and a magazine promotion. Its our business, its what we do. Sites like this make business for us worse by giving people bad facts by ranters and ravers...

Granted, sometimes it is a very good thing to inform people about scam companies, but we are not a scam company. We might be slightly annoying, but we are just in business. Thats why I came here and posted to explain what was really going on for people who genuinely are interested, to avoid confusion in the future, and to protect the name of my company, a legitimate business, who is getting hurt pretty badly by sites such as this one. Please understand that.

All we ask is for a few minutes of your own time, when you are free, to make a phone call, and find out what its all about. Youll hear that you were entered in the sweepstakes, and we will verify the address for that in case you are a winner. The odds for a grand prize are a little better then 1 in 12 million, not 1 in 500 million. There are still hundreds of smaller prizes for the people who dont win grand prizes, and you have several chances to win, so the odds on them are alot better. Not sure exactly what the odds on those are though, but since there are hundreds of them, simple math could give an estimate... Lets just say, 1 in 60,000
Thats assuming that there are about 200 smaller prizes, and 12 million entrants.

Then, you will hear about the magazines. If you want to hear more, stay on the line and hear it out, its a good deal. If you dont care at all, then at that point, just hang up. You havent lost anything at all, except about 2 minutes of your time, and 1 and a half of that was us saying Hi, and telling you about the sweepstakes and the prizes, and odds.

Well, I'm done guys. I have done nothing but give good facts here, and I have given all the facts that I possibly can, as truthful as could be. If you get a postcard, the choice is in your hands.

Thanks for taking the time to come here and read the site, showing interest in what is really going on.

Farewell.
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#21 UPDATE Employee

Ok good points here.

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Ok, Tom.

I can agree with that. I too would agree, that the best approach is to send information regarding the product. Many people though, once they hear the information from a person, see things better then if they had just read it. Many times even I read things wrong, and had I payed just a little more attention to certain parts, or had someone there to answer my questions, I would have been more inclined to buy that product.

I have had the idea of maybe even setting up a website for the company, in which the very same information would be given, and the customer could even place an order online, or, if better for them, read the information online, and then call in to get more details or ask questions. I dont see why that couldnt work, but once a company has been doing something the same way for so long, it is hard to change.

The company I work for isnt very large. It would be too expensive for us to send out detailed pamphlets completely describing our product and services. The postcard is smaller and cheaper then a nicely drawn out information package, and the callers still get the same details just by calling. You know, if you hear the word magazine come up, and you dont want to hear more, you can hang up the phone. All you did was spend about 2 minutes to find out what it was; a sweepstakes entry and magazine promotion. Not too big of a deal really...

Maybe, we can find a cheap, better way of doing things, but for now, this is what we have done for the last 14 years, and it may not change all too soon. Its just how we present it.
Really there is nothing to lose. The sweepstakes isnt GREAT news, but it is good news, and if you actually are interested even a little bit, and take the time so hear out the promotion, you will see that it too, is a good promotion.

If you dont agree, then when you hear the word magazines, feel free to say no thanks, and we will really be ok with hanging up like that. I have people all day who say no thanks once I mention magazines, and thats not a problem. Its there for you if you want it.

People watch commercials on TV every day. A commercial is kinda the same thing as what we do, except we do it on the phone. If you dont like watching a commercial, you dont have to watch it, or you can change the channel. If you do want to watch it, it will give you details, and you can listen, and then possibly buy the product. Same thing with us. If you want the info, just stay on the line. If not... tell us no thanks, and then you have that option to hang up, ending the marketing.

Frank, as a side note, we do follow the do not call list, and it ALSO applies to mailing. Its more like a do not contact list. We comply with it in accordance with the laws of telemarketing, and mail marketing. If a customer asks to be put on the do not call/contact list, we do put them on it. Our computer allows us to do that as an end of call option. It takes 30 to 45 days for it to go in to effect. Sometimes someone who has just recently asked another company to add them to the do not contact list will get mail from us. Thats not our fault, if the list has not been updated yet. However, we will be happy to end the call on a good note with the caller right then and there, and make sure that their name IS on the list by also adding it ourselves.

Please guys, dont over-react. Its a sweepstakes and a magazine promotion. Its our business, its what we do. Sites like this make business for us worse by giving people bad facts by ranters and ravers...

Granted, sometimes it is a very good thing to inform people about scam companies, but we are not a scam company. We might be slightly annoying, but we are just in business. Thats why I came here and posted to explain what was really going on for people who genuinely are interested, to avoid confusion in the future, and to protect the name of my company, a legitimate business, who is getting hurt pretty badly by sites such as this one. Please understand that.

All we ask is for a few minutes of your own time, when you are free, to make a phone call, and find out what its all about. Youll hear that you were entered in the sweepstakes, and we will verify the address for that in case you are a winner. The odds for a grand prize are a little better then 1 in 12 million, not 1 in 500 million. There are still hundreds of smaller prizes for the people who dont win grand prizes, and you have several chances to win, so the odds on them are alot better. Not sure exactly what the odds on those are though, but since there are hundreds of them, simple math could give an estimate... Lets just say, 1 in 60,000
Thats assuming that there are about 200 smaller prizes, and 12 million entrants.

Then, you will hear about the magazines. If you want to hear more, stay on the line and hear it out, its a good deal. If you dont care at all, then at that point, just hang up. You havent lost anything at all, except about 2 minutes of your time, and 1 and a half of that was us saying Hi, and telling you about the sweepstakes and the prizes, and odds.

Well, I'm done guys. I have done nothing but give good facts here, and I have given all the facts that I possibly can, as truthful as could be. If you get a postcard, the choice is in your hands.

Thanks for taking the time to come here and read the site, showing interest in what is really going on.

Farewell.
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#22 UPDATE Employee

Ok good points here.

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Ok, Tom.

I can agree with that. I too would agree, that the best approach is to send information regarding the product. Many people though, once they hear the information from a person, see things better then if they had just read it. Many times even I read things wrong, and had I payed just a little more attention to certain parts, or had someone there to answer my questions, I would have been more inclined to buy that product.

I have had the idea of maybe even setting up a website for the company, in which the very same information would be given, and the customer could even place an order online, or, if better for them, read the information online, and then call in to get more details or ask questions. I dont see why that couldnt work, but once a company has been doing something the same way for so long, it is hard to change.

The company I work for isnt very large. It would be too expensive for us to send out detailed pamphlets completely describing our product and services. The postcard is smaller and cheaper then a nicely drawn out information package, and the callers still get the same details just by calling. You know, if you hear the word magazine come up, and you dont want to hear more, you can hang up the phone. All you did was spend about 2 minutes to find out what it was; a sweepstakes entry and magazine promotion. Not too big of a deal really...

Maybe, we can find a cheap, better way of doing things, but for now, this is what we have done for the last 14 years, and it may not change all too soon. Its just how we present it.
Really there is nothing to lose. The sweepstakes isnt GREAT news, but it is good news, and if you actually are interested even a little bit, and take the time so hear out the promotion, you will see that it too, is a good promotion.

If you dont agree, then when you hear the word magazines, feel free to say no thanks, and we will really be ok with hanging up like that. I have people all day who say no thanks once I mention magazines, and thats not a problem. Its there for you if you want it.

People watch commercials on TV every day. A commercial is kinda the same thing as what we do, except we do it on the phone. If you dont like watching a commercial, you dont have to watch it, or you can change the channel. If you do want to watch it, it will give you details, and you can listen, and then possibly buy the product. Same thing with us. If you want the info, just stay on the line. If not... tell us no thanks, and then you have that option to hang up, ending the marketing.

Frank, as a side note, we do follow the do not call list, and it ALSO applies to mailing. Its more like a do not contact list. We comply with it in accordance with the laws of telemarketing, and mail marketing. If a customer asks to be put on the do not call/contact list, we do put them on it. Our computer allows us to do that as an end of call option. It takes 30 to 45 days for it to go in to effect. Sometimes someone who has just recently asked another company to add them to the do not contact list will get mail from us. Thats not our fault, if the list has not been updated yet. However, we will be happy to end the call on a good note with the caller right then and there, and make sure that their name IS on the list by also adding it ourselves.

Please guys, dont over-react. Its a sweepstakes and a magazine promotion. Its our business, its what we do. Sites like this make business for us worse by giving people bad facts by ranters and ravers...

Granted, sometimes it is a very good thing to inform people about scam companies, but we are not a scam company. We might be slightly annoying, but we are just in business. Thats why I came here and posted to explain what was really going on for people who genuinely are interested, to avoid confusion in the future, and to protect the name of my company, a legitimate business, who is getting hurt pretty badly by sites such as this one. Please understand that.

All we ask is for a few minutes of your own time, when you are free, to make a phone call, and find out what its all about. Youll hear that you were entered in the sweepstakes, and we will verify the address for that in case you are a winner. The odds for a grand prize are a little better then 1 in 12 million, not 1 in 500 million. There are still hundreds of smaller prizes for the people who dont win grand prizes, and you have several chances to win, so the odds on them are alot better. Not sure exactly what the odds on those are though, but since there are hundreds of them, simple math could give an estimate... Lets just say, 1 in 60,000
Thats assuming that there are about 200 smaller prizes, and 12 million entrants.

Then, you will hear about the magazines. If you want to hear more, stay on the line and hear it out, its a good deal. If you dont care at all, then at that point, just hang up. You havent lost anything at all, except about 2 minutes of your time, and 1 and a half of that was us saying Hi, and telling you about the sweepstakes and the prizes, and odds.

Well, I'm done guys. I have done nothing but give good facts here, and I have given all the facts that I possibly can, as truthful as could be. If you get a postcard, the choice is in your hands.

Thanks for taking the time to come here and read the site, showing interest in what is really going on.

Farewell.
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#23 Consumer Comment

Why not just do this?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Hi: Tom again

To kevin:

You seem like a decent fellow. Why not just stop with the 'wow your in a contest' when you honestly are not just sending a flyer out stating 'good news' . Cmon , if thats what its really about you would be out of a job.

Again, even if the flyer is about 'good news' -being entered into a 'sweepstakes' -so what? What are the odds anyone will ever actually win any 'sweepstakes'? Sure , the news isnt that the planet is going to self destruct -but it aint 'great news' 'whoopie' .

Every consumer knows they can go apply at all kinds of retail outlets to be entered into a 'draw' -and of course there is always some kind of catch. At the very least they now have your contact info for 'mailing lists' . Whoopie! sounds like good news!! -for companies that is!!!

But then the good news ends. Then all of a sudden you are being sold magazines? Whoopie!!! more 'good news' i suppose.

So you phone up to hear the vague and non stated 'good news' off a yellow card -all to find out the REAL good news is you taking out your credit card.

To the average American , finding out a company has good news -calling up and finding out they were unilaterally entered into some kind of 'sweepstakes' is the good news? WHOOPIE!!! my odds of winning -whatever it is that is won -is about 1 in 500,000,000. Wow that is FANTASTIC NEWS -I SHOULD TAKE THE DAY OFF WORK AND PARTY MY ASS OFF.

Then i can go tell my wife that because of being automatically entered, i can stop wasting my entire day going around entering 'sweepstakes' around town and thru the internet. Whew, what a time saver. Thanks Kevin, your swell!!!

But wait -there is more -i am also going to try to SELL YOU MAGAZINES. Unless the stated average american is DYING to buy magazines , which is dubious that most are on some kind of regular basis, they are going to be now pissed off at the 'BAIT AND SWITCH' .

The thing is - in front of a Judge when dragged to court for misbehaving, the company can claim 'good news' is vague and highly SUBJECTIVE. They shout that it is 'good news' to them, even though using common sense tells the average american the 'good news' is some kind of vague draw that they have no chance of REALISTICALLY winning -as nobody does in any sweepstakes. There is one winner and what? thousands to tens of millions of losers... Some great news.

Being entered into a free 'sweepstakes' or draw happens thousands of times everyday across the country, as a marketing angle, -so being entered into this one is NOT some kind of rare and swell act by any company.

In fact buying their magazines is ever BETTER good news!!! look at the deal!!! woo hoo. Again the term 'good news' is subjective and anyone can claim almost anything is 'good news' whether the average consumer thinks so or not.

The bottom line is that they call up to find out why the company needs to talk to them and what the 'good news is' . They find they are automatically entered into a 'sweepstakes' that they have realistically little chance of winning -like everyone else entered. Then told they can buy their magazines, of course not knowing when they called this had ANYTHING TO DO WITH SELLING A PRODUCT WHATSOEVER.

Gee Kevin -your swell.

To Frank:

I understand why you want to string the guy and his company up by their short hairs. However, the product they are hawking is pretty legit and that is what this site is really about. They dont seem to be satified with just sending out true information to consumers regarding their 'wonderfull deal' and let the product speak for itself. Little do they know that if they did -the only people who would phone are those truely interested in magazines and their sale rate would be near 100%. They could then plan their labour and overhead costs accordingly.

Many many companies - too many to list -have for decades simply put out flyers regarding the magazine product and has done quite well for them.

Getting this thru their thick skulls will not work as they think by pulling this bait and switch they will get more sales. They dont see or care that running 'roughshod' over unaware consumers to hear their 'fantastic deal' pisses more people off than it sells.
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#24 Consumer Comment

Let's try this again, Kevin

AUTHOR: Frank - (U.S.A.)

KEVIN: I mentioned that is more expensive to send the postcard then it would be to dial out, so that would not make sense.

FRANK: You mean, it's more expensive to have a list company print zillions of postcards than to pay a phone pestering service? News to me.

KEVIN: Would you rather be called by a company without any knowledge of who they are, and without regard of whether or not you are busy, or call them on your own time, and have the name, address, and phone number in hand? Simple.

FRANK: What's simple is why you're sending out the postcards. You see, there's a little thing called the Do Not Call list, and you could end up in a lot of trouble with the feds if you violated it and got reported. So this way, if the mark (customer) calls you, you can say that they initiated the contact.

KEVIN: Wrong again Frank. Certain companys when they do business with a credit card holder, send those names to a company, that sells those names to businesses, as people who may be interested in purchasing products, since they have in the past. The Credit card companys do not sell the names.

FRANK: Do you understand what you just wrote? You first tell us that the C.C. companies sell the names to an intermediary, then you say that the C.C. companies don't sell the names. Right.

KEVIN: That statement showed me that you have never called in and listened to what we have to say.

FRANK: Just keep on thinking that, Kev.

KEVIN: Ok Frank, do you have to question EVERYTHING?!

FRANK: Yes, as a matter of fact, I do. You got a problem with that? After all, didn't you say that your job was to answer questions?

KEVIN: I dont give a damn if it takes an hour if the customer will be more informed. We have NO limit to the length of the call.

FRANK: Yeah, right. Any boiler-room operator who spends an hour on the phone with a caller had better get a HUGE order to justify the time spent or his boss will jump on him with both feet and probably fire his ass. In telephone sales your live and die by your sales rate (dollars produced per number of calls). You're going to spend an hour on the phone with one up when you could process a couple dozen calls in the same amount of time? Don't think so.

KEVIN: Never had a lawsuit. Thanks. And the overhead is the mail. Thats all.

FRANK: Oh, you work for free, eh? You have a strange idea of what the term overhead means.

KEVIN: Carleton Sheets for example sells information. A book if you will. You arent buying a winning chance at making cash with that program, you are buying simply a collection of information about how a person did obtain a large amount of cash using techniques described in that material. Im not too familiar with those promotions workings though, so I cannot really comment more on them.

FRANK: Obviously you aren't familiar with them or you wouldn't have described Carleton Sheets the way you did. Read the ripoff reports: Sheets, Beck, Lapre, and many others are routinely reported for credit card overcharges and selling scam mentoring services. Hey, Reid, want to set Kevin straight?

KEVIN: We dont even have people say that we fraudulently billed them. That would be bad business, right?

FRANK: None that you will admit to, anyhow.

KEVIN: I would just like to add however, that there is no indication at all on the postcard about the sweepstakes. We dont put any reference to it at all on the card. It says "We are trying to reach you, with good news."

FRANK: Why not be up front about what's going on? Why the vagueness?

KEVIN: Well.. they are in the sweepstakes, and could win the prizes. I consider that good news personally, especially since they dont have to do anything to be in the sweepstakes or to win. But, if they didnt call, they wouldnt know about it at all. They wouldnt know they were in it, or what the prizes were, or when it will be drawn next.

FRANK: If they are in it, if they win, why not just notify them that they won and that they should call to claim their prize? Oh, wait, that's the kind of thing that Consumer Award Advisory Service does (see ripoff reports). Hey, it works for them, why not you?
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#25 UPDATE Employee

Thanx for reading the facts.

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Thanks Tom,

for taking the time to read through all the information.

I would just like to add however, that there is no indication at all on the postcard about the sweepstakes. We dont put any reference to it at all on the card. It says "We are trying to reach you, with good news."

Well.. they are in the sweepstakes, and could win the prizes. I consider that good news personally, especially since they dont have to do anything to be in the sweepstakes or to win. But, if they didnt call, they wouldnt know about it at all. They wouldnt know they were in it, or what the prizes were, or when it will be drawn next.

Sure, the sweepstakes is also a way to lighten the mood of the call. Usually when people just call in, they may have had a bad day, or just be highly sceptical, and thats ok. Giving some good news right off the bat, I think, is a good way to get the people talking with you, instead of at you.

I dont really have anything else to add, other then if you get a yellow postcard from us, it wont hurt you at all to call in. You will get good information, and will be treated with respect, and it costs you nothing other then 5 minutes of your time to do so.

Thanks,
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#26 Consumer Comment

telemarketing and the bait and switch

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Dear fellahs:

I agree with the employee of the company who from all accounts really does believe in his products and does not seem to talk about 'disclaimers' or 'fee for cancellation' 'non refundable upfront deposit' or any of the other usual ripoff tactics.

The guy sells magazines. Is he not allowed to sell magazines? There is no mention from consumers that the mags dont ever come -or u have to buy 15 or 20 for 100 years . It seems pretty legit to me.

The marketing tactic actually probably self defeats the company more than it helps . They should ditch the 'sweepstakes' bait and switch and just send out fliers for an opportunity to buy magazines.

The only disagreement i have is with the initial contact. The consumer is RESPONDING to an initial contact by mail from the company under the direct impression that the company wants to talk to them.

So this 'you called us -we did not call you ' is dubious and cannot appeal to the intellect of the average consumer.

It is however better than saying 'we called you and pressured you - but u had the right to hang up on us -but chose not to.

But give the guy a break . Even though this 'sweepstakes' is not why they sent the card -only as a bait and switch to magazines, the company seems to be pretty legit to me. Let em sell his magazines. Some folks really enjoy them.
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#27 Consumer Comment

My experiences...

AUTHOR: Patrick - (U.S.A.)

OK, every time I move, I get a slew of these "postcards" saying that "We've been trying to contact you" or "We can't get ahold of you" to tell me about a prize I've won. Right off the bat, the BS comes out. That postcard was the first time the company tried contacting me. I think they get a list of recent home closings in this area and mass mail the cards out.

The same can be said of CRC. And Kevin, before you try to say it isn't, yes it is. CRC gets consumers to call under the false pretense that they've won a prize, or that they may have won a sweepstakes. It's all just a ploy to drive traffic to your inbound call center.

I suggest everyone do what I do when I get these cards: promptly put them through my shredder.
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#28 UPDATE Employee

Was there any merit to what you just said Frank?

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Kevin: Our company sends the yellow postcard out, as a way of having "YOU call US

FRANK: The REAL reason you do that is twofold: so you don't have to waste time with expensive cold-calling,

(Kevin reply:) I mentioned that is more expensive to send the postcard then it would be to dial out, so that would not make sense.

FRANK: and you can then use the they called us, we didn't call them defense. It's the old take control of the sale away from the customer technique that is so beloved by car salesmen.

(Kevin reply:) Its not a defense, its a better way of doing things. Would you rather be called by a company without any knowledge of who they are, and without regard of whether or not you are busy, or call them on your own time, and have the name, address, and phone number in hand? Simple.

--------------------------------

Kevin: The sweepstakes is legitimate, and it is held each year

FRANK: Of course you do, because it's a lot easier to scam someone in real time than by mail.

(Kevin reply:) No, because it gives the callers a chance to ask questions, and talk to a real person.

---------------------------------

FRANK: You hold the sweepstakes every year just so you can say that you did when someone sues you. The sweepstakes is simply a way of getting people interested enough to call you.

(Kevin reply:) Nice try here Frank, but the postcard doesnt mention the sweepstakes, so your comment shows that you dont even know about our company.

-----------------------------------
Kevin: Your name was received by us through a preferred customer list, which is basically a list of credit card holders names and addresses, of people who have willingly purchased items with those cards in the past.

FRANK: Preferred customer list? Sucker list, is more like it. All you did was buy a list from the credit card companies, which any business can do.

(Kevin reply:) Wrong again Frank. Certain companys when they do business with a credit card holder, send those names to a company, that sells those names to businesses, as people who may be interested in purchasing products, since they have in the past. The Credit card companys do not sell the names.

-----------------------------------
Kevin: There is never a purchase or payment required to be in the sweepstakes, thats automatic.

FRANK: You do that to protect yourselves from being charged under the federal mail fraud statutes. I would be very curious to know if anyone who has ever won your sweepstakes never bought any magazines. Wanna provide names, dates, addresses?

(Kevin reply:) We do that because its illegal to charge in a sweepstakes, and we dont sell the sweepstakes, we sell magazines. We pay to have the callers names entered in the sweepstakes by a company that holds the sweepstakes for companys that wish to have their customers/callers names entered in to it. Although I cannot provide with the names, because they are not even released to us, I would be willing to bet that a large majority of the winners are people who never even called us.
If you even got a postcard, you are in the sweepstakes, because we had you entered.

-----------------------------------
Frank: That's really good: let us scam you because if you don't we can't make our monthly overhead. Like the average working guy and gal really gives a rat's ass about your monthly overhead. Go tell it to Oprah, shill.

FRANK: That's really good: let us scam you because if you don't we can't make our monthly overhead. Like the average working guy and gal really gives a rat's ass about your monthly overhead. Go tell it to Oprah, shill.

(Kevin reply:) I am the average working guy...
This doesnt even makes sence. Again, its not a scam. Its an offer for a product or service. A scam is when a company tells you that you will receive a product or service, and then you do not receive it, or not as it was explained. Every person who we do business with gets exactly what was explained to them.

----------------------------------
Frank: But, just in case the customer can't make up his or her mind, you'll be nice enough to pick for him, right? This is the old book club scam in a different form (if you want this month's selection, do nothing).

FRANK: But, just in case the customer can't make up his or her mind, you'll be nice enough to pick for him, right? This is the old book club scam in a different form (if you want this month's selection, do nothing).

(Kevin reply:) No, we offer a package FIRST, and then ask if they are Ok with the caller, or if they would like to change the magazines. If they like the magazines we pick, great! If not, pick ones you like. If you cant, ok, no problem. Good luck in the sweepstakes and have a great day. Magazines just arent for you.
On a side note, if you want the magazines you have ALOT more to do then if you dont. If you dont want them, just hang up...

-----------------------------------
Kevin: Our reps clearly explain the entire magazine promotion to every customer. We dont make you say that you want them.

FRANK: No, you don't. You simply assume that the caller wants them and act accordingly. This is the kind of thing that F&I clowns at auto dealers do every day. They say, Now, which extended warranty do you want? They don't say, Do you want an extended warranty? Subtle, tricky, and it works more often than not.

(Kevin reply:) First, once again we are NOT an auto dealer. And YES we DO clearly explain it. Its not hidden in any way. Why dont you call Frank and listen, instead of talking without knowledge. That statement showed me that you have never called in and listened to what we have to say.

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Kevin: then and only then would you get transfered to a closer who would let you know about the gifts and then finally the payment options

FRANK: Closer? Like your typical sleazy auto dealership, after you've beaten the customer down, you call in the sales manager. Typical of how boiler-room scams operate.

(Kevin reply:) No, closer, as in a person who makes sure that the reps were nice to the callers, goes over exactly what you will receive with the promotion, and makes sure you understand it, and agree that its good for you, before closing the sale. Closing meaning setting up billing for the product/service.

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Kevin: We even ask if you have questions about the sweepstakes or the magazine order, before we would transfer you to a closer.

Frank: Anybody who has gotten that far is pretty well hooked, so you don't have too many victims (customers) who pull out at the last minute. Besides, by that time you have all of their credit card info.

(Kevin reply:) Ok well thats plain not true. We state what we have one time. Without any rebuttels. Then we ask if there are questions. If there are we answer them and go to rebuttels.
So they arent hooked, they JUST heard it all one time, and we ask if they need to hear it again, or desire additional information, or if it is ok as it was just explained. Also, we dont have their credit card info at all. I never have asked for a credit card number or anything like that. So what you said about us having the credit card information was either a blatent lie, or an assumption by you. Both are bad form.

I am there simply to give details, and screen the people interested in the offer from the people who dont want it. Then they are transfered to the closer, who explains it AGAIN, and then FINALLY, if the customer is still interested, gets the credit card information.

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Kevin: We arent willing to spend 6 minutes of our time talking to you, just to send a mis-informed person, who would probably not get the magazines if they didnt understand, over to the closers.

FRANK: Six minutes? Interesting number. How did you arrive at that figure? Because that's how long your bosses give you to bring the fish to gaff, so to speak. Spend any more time talking to a mark and the head scamsters start yelling about your productivity. Notice, too, how the term closer keeps popping up?

(Kevin reply:) Ok Frank, do you have to question EVERYTHING?! Six minutes is about the time it takes to explain the sweepstakes, the magazines, the price, the exchance service and the master list, and the answer questions, and give the company rebuttels. I dont give a damn if it takes an hour if the customer will be more informed. We have NO limit to the length of the call. If the customer has questions, we answer them. If they dont want it, we let them get on with their day. If they dont have questions and they fully understand and want the magazines, then we do not need to spend any longer with that person, and can transfer them, and take the next call.

-------------------------------

Kevin: As you might notice if you get that postcard, we send them first class mail. Thats expensive.

FRANK: We're supposed to give a damn about how much it costs you to mail out your stuff? Your overhead is YOUR problem, and if it's costing you too much, well, there is such a thing as bulk mail. Could it be that you can't get a bulk mailing permit from the Postal Service because they don't want to aid and abet scams? The usual reason for using real stamps to mail scam letters is that, when some people see a real stamp on a letter they're less inclined to figure it's junk mail and toss it.

(Kevin reply:) I dont care if you care what it costs. We are spending time and money to send you the postcard so that you can call us on your own time so we dont bother you, and it doesnt cost you anything to call us back. End of discussion on that.

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Kevin: It is company policy to use 2 rebuttels on a caller if they seem un-interested. 2 isnt really that many.

FRANK: Two rebuttals on a reluctant caller? Even ONE would be high pressure, two is unconscionable. In the auto business, this is called a turnover (turn the customer over to the high-pressure fast closers).

(Kevin reply:) Huh? If I tell you that you will get 2 magazines for $1, and you say that you dont like those magazines that I picked, and I offer you something that you would like, is that high pressure? No, thats good salesmanship.
That also counts as 1 rebuttel. Whew... damn that high pressure. Example..

Me:
Then Ill send you ESPN and Playboy for $2

Joe: Well, I dont like those.

Me: Ok, well what are your favorite hobbies or interests, Im sure I can find something you would like...

Joe: I like cars and computers.

Me: No wonder you didnt like the magazines I picked, they dont fit your interests. I'll send you the PC magazine and Car and Driver instead, Ok?

Oh my god... if that was too high pressure for you, take a Xanax, then call back. Thanks.

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FRANK: Up? That's car sales slang for customer. If there was any doubt about how you guys operate, you just removed it. Speaking of auto dealer slang, there's that word closer again. See the pattern?

(Kevin reply:) No, thats CRC employee slang for the sheet of paper containing the order for the customer that is interested in the product and service. When we take the sheet to the cappers (closers), its called bringing the order UP to the capper, hence "an up". If its a GOOD up, it means that the customer was very interested in the promotion. We try hard to inform the customers fully, before sending them up, making those "Good Ups." Simple again.

---------------------------------
Kevin: How many mags you will get, the mag names, the payments, how long, how many payments... whatever they have set up for you so far as an option for you. THEN we take a recording of each of those items, asking if not only you understand each part, but accept it.

FRANK: No legitimate business that takes credit card orders has to go to those lengths. You're trying to protect yourselves, not the customer.

(Kevin reply:) Well, you are part right on that. The part that we are protecting ourselves. Sure we are. If later on someone trys to report us for billing them against their will, then we have the recording of them saying that they understood each part, they knew what payments they would make, to which card, how many, how many months of service, how many magazines, that they can change them, and that they understand and agree with those terms, and give us permission to do what we said, exactly as we said it.
We are also protecting the customer, because by recording that, if we WERE to charge a person against the terms stated on the tape, we would be in violation of the contract. Having that tape protects them from that happening. We are recorded stating what we will do, and they are recorded stating that they agree. Pretty straightforward I think. I wish more companys WOULD do that.

--------------------------------
Kevin: We have been in business at the same address for over 14 years now, doing the same exact thing.

FRANK: So what? George S. May has been around at their same address a lot longer than that and May is one of the biggest scam companies out there. All that proves is that you run a very well thought out scam and can afford good attorneys (which might explain a lot of your high overhead).

(Kevin reply:) Never had a lawsuit. Thanks. And the overhead is the mail. Thats all.

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Frank: What a load of crap. If that were true, then how can scamsters like Carleton Sheets, John Beck, Don Lapre, and Russ Whitney keep ripping off people with fraudulent credit card billings year after year?

FRANK: What a load of crap. If that were true, then how can scamsters like Carleton Sheets, John Beck, Don Lapre, and Russ Whitney keep ripping off people with fraudulent credit card billings year after year?

(Kevin reply:) Bad examples. Carleton Sheets for example sells information. A book if you will. You arent buying a winning chance at making cash with that program, you are buying simply a collection of information about how a person did obtain a large amount of cash using techniques described in that material. Im not too familiar with those promotions workings though, so I cannot really comment more on them.
We dont even have people say that we fraudulently billed them. That would be bad business, right?

------------------------------------
Kevin: I personally know my boss, the owner of the company, and he loves this company with his whole heart. Not one of us are striking it rich, not even him. We arent willing to risk the company, because we mislead a customer. It just doesnt happen.

FRANK: My heart bleeds for you and your boss, it really does. I've got some beachfront property in Nevada that I'll be glad to sell you, cheap.

(Kevin reply:) Nice to know that you care. Now, on a side note, trying to sell someone beachfront property in Nevada WOULD be scamming.
Nice job on that one.

-------------------------------------
Kevin: In closing, we are NOT fraudulent. We do not SCAM. We simply offer a product to you, explain all the details, and make it available to you.

Frank: Sure. And, like another famous liar said, I did not have sex with that woman! Please note that C.R.C. is located in Florida, the scam capital of the U.S. (Utah is runner-up).

(Kevin reply:) So my closing was to the point, and you couldnt think of anything else bad to write, so you bashed the previous Commander and Chief of the USA, who has nothing to do with my company.

You know Frank, after reading all you had to say, and replying to it, I realize that I was defending my company against someone who has never dealt with us. If you had, you would have known better, then to post this stuff. Well, if you had actually payed attention when you spoke with us, if you did...

Oh, and if you do call, ask whoever answers the phone to let you speak to me. Ill be happy to call you back and speak with you one on one. You already have the number.

Thanks, for replying.
No Thanks, for trying too hard to talk about something you dont know anything about.

PS... People, if you as scared about getting ripped off by us as this guy seems to be, just dont call Ok? Good luck in the sweepstakes, but if you are like him, we would rather not talk with you. But it will not hurt you just to call and listen, ESPECIALLY if you like magazines.
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#29 Consumer Comment

Response to CRC shill Kevin

AUTHOR: Frank - (U.S.A.)

Kevin: Our company sends the yellow postcard out, as a way of having "YOU call US

Frank: The REAL reason you do that is twofold: so you don't have to waste time with expensive cold-calling, and you can then use the they called us, we didn't call them defense. It's the old take control of the sale away from the customer technique that is so beloved by car salesmen.

Kevin: Our reps are required to be polite on the phone, and we actually like having person to person information exchanges with the callers.

Frank: Of course you do, because it's a lot easier to scam someone in real time than by mail.

Kevin: The sweepstakes is legitimate, and it is held each year

Frank: You hold the sweepstakes every year just so you can say that you did when someone sues you. The sweepstakes is simply a way of getting people interested enough to call you.

Kevin: Your name was received by us through a preferred customer list, which is basically a list of credit card holders names and addresses, of people who have willingly purchased items with those cards in the past.

Frank: Preferred customer list? Sucker list, is more like it. All you did was buy a list from the credit card companies, which any business can do.

Kevin: There is never a purchase or payment required to be in the sweepstakes, thats automatic.

Frank: You do that to protect yourselves from being charged under the federal mail fraud statutes. I would be very curious to know if anyone who has ever won your sweepstakes never bought any magazines. Wanna provide names, dates, addresses?

Kevin: Along with the sweepstakes, in order to pay OUR rents and electric, etc etc. . .

Frank: That's really good: let us scam you because if you don't we can't make our monthly overhead. Like the average working guy and gal really gives a rat's ass about your monthly overhead. Go tell it to Oprah, shill.

Kevin: We wont send you a "bazillion" magazines either. We will let you pick them, in fact we would rather you pick ones that you like.

Frank: But, just in case the customer can't make up his or her mind, you'll be nice enough to pick for him, right? This is the old book club scam in a different form (if you want this month's selection, do nothing).

Kevin: Our reps clearly explain the entire magazine promotion to every customer. We dont make you say that you want them.

Frank: No, you don't. You simply assume that the caller wants them and act accordingly. This is the kind of thing that F&I clowns at auto dealers do every day. They say, Now, which extended warranty do you want? They don't say, Do you want an extended warranty? Subtle, tricky, and it works more often than not.

Kevin: then and only then would you get transfered to a closer who would let you know about the gifts and then finally the payment options.

Frank: Closer? Like your typical sleazy auto dealership, after you've beaten the customer down, you call in the sales manager. Typical of how boiler-room scams operate.

Kevin: We even ask if you have questions about the sweepstakes or the magazine order, before we would transfer you to a closer.

Frank: Anybody who has gotten that far is pretty well hooked, so you don't have too many victims (customers) who pull out at the last minute. Besides, by that time you have all of their credit card info.

Kevin: We arent willing to spend 6 minutes of our time talking to you, just to send a mis-informed person, who would probably not get the magazines if they didnt understand, over to the closers.

Frank: Six minutes? Interesting number. How did you arrive at that figure? Because that's how long your bosses give you to bring the fish to gaff, so to speak. Spend any more time talking to a mark and the head scamsters start yelling about your productivity. Notice, too, how the term closer keeps popping up?

Kevin: As you might notice if you get that postcard, we send them first class mail. Thats expensive.

Frank: We're supposed to give a damn about how much it costs you to mail out your stuff? Your overhead is YOUR problem, and if it's costing you too much, well, there is such a thing as bulk mail. Could it be that you can't get a bulk mailing permit from the Postal Service because they don't want to aid and abet scams? The usual reason for using real stamps to mail scam letters is that, when some people see a real stamp on a letter they're less inclined to figure it's junk mail and toss it.

Kevin: It is company policy to use 2 rebuttels on a caller if they seem un-interested. 2 isnt really that many.

Frank: Two rebuttals on a reluctant caller? Even ONE would be high pressure, two is unconscionable. In the auto business, this is called a turnover (turn the customer over to the high-pressure fast closers).

Kevin: After ALL of that, if you are genuinely interested, or what would be called a "good up", the closers continue to once again explain everything to you.

Frank: Up? That's car sales slang for customer. If there was any doubt about how you guys operate, you just removed it. Speaking of auto dealer slang, there's that word closer again. See the pattern?

Kevin: How many mags you will get, the mag names, the payments, how long, how many payments... whatever they have set up for you so far as an option for you. THEN we take a recording of each of those items, asking if not only you understand each part, but accept it.

Frank: No legitimate business that takes credit card orders has to go to those lengths. You're trying to protect yourselves, not the customer.

Kevin: We have been in business at the same address for over 14 years now, doing the same exact thing.

Frank: So what? George S. May has been around at their same address a lot longer than that and May is one of the biggest scam companies out there. All that proves is that you run a very well thought out scam and can afford good attorneys (which might explain a lot of your high overhead).

Kevin: If we even get 2 out of 100 complaints filed about a credit card being billed without permission, then we lose the right to bull credit cards altogether. Needless to say, that would end the 14 year business.

Frank: What a load of crap. If that were true, then how can scamsters like Carleton Sheets, John Beck, Don Lapre, and Russ Whitney keep ripping off people with fraudulent credit card billings year after year?

Kevin: I personally know my boss, the owner of the company, and he loves this company with his whole heart. Not one of us are striking it rich, not even him. We arent willing to risk the company, because we mislead a customer. It just doesnt happen.

Frank: My heart bleeds for you and your boss, it really does. I've got some beachfront property in Nevada that I'll be glad to sell you, cheap.

Kevin: In closing, we are NOT fraudulent. We do not SCAM. We simply offer a product to you, explain all the details, and make it available to you.

Frank: Sure. And, like another famous liar said, I did not have sex with that woman! Please note that C.R.C. is located in Florida, the scam capital of the U.S. (Utah is runner-up).
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#30 UPDATE Employee

Not quite how you explained it . . .

AUTHOR: Kevin - (U.S.A.)

Hello readers, and concerned callers.

Our company sends the yellow postcard out, as a way of having "YOU call US", if you are interested in what we may have to say, on your own free time, instead of bothering you when you might be busy, with an annoying phone call.

Our reps are required to be polite on the phone, and we actually like having person to person information exchanges with the callers.

The sweepstakes is legitimate, and it is held each year, primarily for the preferred credit card holders, although that is not required. Your name was received by us through a preferred customer list, which is basically a list of credit card holders names and addresses, of people who have willingly purchased items with those cards in the past.

There is never a purchase or payment required to be in the sweepstakes, thats automatic.

Along with the sweepstakes, in order to pay OUR rents and electric, etc etc. . . our company also promotes magazines. Again, there is no purchase required to be in the drawings.

Its actually a very good promotion, and the value of it is that you can change any magazine at any time, free of charge. In the end, you will save 40 to 70 percent off the newstand price of the magazines through it, and never be stuck with any mag you dont like, since you can change them at any time. We wont send you a "bazillion" magazines either. We will let you pick them, in fact we would rather you pick ones that you like. There is a total of either 4, 5, or 6 magazines. Hardly a bazillian.

Our reps clearly explain the entire magazine promotion to every customer. We dont make you say that you want them. We simply show you the great points of the promotion, so you can decide if its something for you. After getting all the details about it, aside from billing, since the initial phone reps have nothing to do with payment plans, and you letting us know that you are interested in the promotion, and want the mags, then and only then would you get transfered to a closer who would let you know about the gifts and then finally the payment options.

We even ask if you have questions about the sweepstakes or the magazine order, before we would transfer you to a closer. That gives you a chance to ask whatever you want, or even to let us know that you just arent interested.

We want all of the callers to be informed, understanding of, AND interested in the promotion. We arent willing to spend 6 minutes of our time talking to you, just to send a mis-informed person, who would probably not get the magazines if they didnt understand, over to the closers. As you might notice if you get that postcard, we send them first class mail. Thats expensive. As a caller who receives that postcard, it costs our company about $3.50 just to send it out to you, and to have you call us back alone. We just want an opportunity to tell you what is going on, and what we have to offer.

It is company policy to use 2 rebuttels on a caller if they seem un-interested. 2 isnt really that many. Usually when people do say they are not interested, its just because the mags that we selected were not for them, or.. they just need more details. Thats why we are there to give those details.

After ALL of that, if you are genuinely interested, or what would be called a "good up", the closers continue to once again explain everything to you. How many mags you will get, the mag names, the payments, how long, how many payments... whatever they have set up for you so far as an option for you. THEN we take a recording of each of those items, asking if not only you understand each part, but accept it. 8 questions later, we ask permission to enter the order exactly as we explained it. At that time you have a chance to once again, state yes or no.

We have been in business at the same address for over 14 years now, doing the same exact thing. The promotion has changed with the times, mostly in the amount of the magazines, and the cost due to inflation. The price of magazines does go up every few years, and by taking advantage of the promotion, your rate, whatever we state it at, is frozen... meaning it cannot go up, no matter what the publishers charge for those magazines.

If we even get 2 out of 100 complaints filed about a credit card being billed without permission, then we lose the right to bull credit cards altogether. Needless to say, that would end the 14 year business. I personally know my boss, the owner of the company, and he loves this company with his whole heart. Not one of us are striking it rich, not even him. We arent willing to risk the company, because we mislead a customer. It just doesnt happen.

We arent the cheapest for magazines, but we also are not the most expensive. Its the points of the services and the frozen price that make it so valuable, and a great offer to the callers.
Give us a chance to explain it. It costs us money to send the card to you, to take your call, and to stay open. All we ask is you listen to what we have available.

In closing, we are NOT fraudulent. We do not SCAM. We simply offer a product to you, explain all the details, and make it available to you.

In regards to customer service, their normal hours of operation are 10:00am - 5:30pm EST, Monday through Friday, and can be reached by calling 1-800-745-5757 during those hours, and just asking to speak to customer service. To be safe, I recommend calling before 5pm EST, since sometimes they go home early, depending on the volume of calls.

Thanks for reading.
A proud employee of the Community Reading Club of Clearwater, FL.
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