• Report: #7293

Complaint Review: David Chui

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  • Submitted: Tue, October 23, 2001
  • Updated: Sat, March 20, 2004

  • Reported By:
David Chui
Saratoga, California U.S.A.

A Letter to the Would-Be Lindal sunrooms & Cedar Homes owners

*Consumer Suggestion: Lindal does NOT "CERTIFY" dealers or contractors Lindal lies, the dealers lie

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: Sounds like you picked the wrong Installer

*Consumer Comment: As a VERY unhappy lindal customer I have found that Lindal does not stand behind their product

*Consumer Comment: Not all Lindal Dealers are alike!

*Consumer Suggestion: Help for Lindal victims

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Attention: Lindal Cedar Home/Sunroom

Here is my advice to you all out there thinking of building a Lindal Sunroom or a Cedar Home, I won't touch it with a 60 feet pole. I am sure that, sooner or later, you will regret having anything to do with Lindal.

If your Lindal sunroom or Cedar home goes wrong few years down the line, you will get caught in a situation that their dealer will not return your phone calls and Lindal's customer service will tell you to take a long walk over a short cliff (or a hike). They will tell you that Lindal is only a manufacturer of sunrooms and cedar homes while the dealers are independent contractors and they can do anything they want including the option not to help Lindal's customers. At this point, you will think that Lindal really has a sales and marketing problem. Whoever in charge of the sales and marketing dept should be fired. They totally miss the point. How could they sustain their business without the support and commitment of its own dealers? The irony is that these dealers are still on the preferred dealers listed in their web site.
So once you hear this response, you are toasted. The Lindal's customer service will suggest you to go outside and look for independent contractors who can help you with the problems (in my case, it was a leaky roof where rain dipping down into the interior of the house.) Nice folks! In my opinion, they are smoking. Do you think that other contractors will touch the shit that Lindal's dealer left behind?

This was my last experience then and my current experience now. Last time (2 years ago), after a year of phone calls back and forth between the dealer and Lindal's customer service, I ended up having a friend of mine to help me to patch the leak with heat tapes. I was luckly then because it was a minor leak. However, not this time, I believe that I am totally out of luck because I have to redo the whole top of my sunroom.

My conclusion is not to let the looks in the literature deceive you. You need to consider all the dirts hidden under Lindal's products. Their customer service would not offer any help and the dealer not returning your phone calls at the time when you need them. I tried calling one other dealer which is list in the Lindal web site and I got the same treatment.

Be practical or you will pay for it big time in the not so distance future.

I strongly suggest others Lindal customers to come forth and to bring this company down. They don't deserve to be around and keep screwing up customers. As you all know, this is a big headache whenever there is a problem with your home. You will definitely feel totally helplessness.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 10/23/2001 12:00 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/David-Chui/Saratoga-California-95070/A-Letter-to-the-Would-Be-Lindal-sunrooms-Cedar-Homes-owners-7293. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 4Consumer 1Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Suggestion

Lindal does NOT "CERTIFY" dealers or contractors Lindal lies, the dealers lie

AUTHOR: Edwin - (U.S.A.)

A client on the rampage that doesn't know what the hell they are talking about? Unfortunately I have been in contact with all the Lindal customers(Ex) on this site and the one thing they have in common is: Lindal lies, the dealers lie and the customer knows exactly what "they" are talking about!

For your information, Lindal does NOT "CERTIFY" dealers or contractors. Dealers and contractors are independent businesses and are in NO way obligated to perform on any Lindal contract. Failure of a contractor or a Lindal dealer to perform on a contract is NOT The responsibility of Lindal (Read your contract). Although the word "Certified" is used regularly in dealer advertisements the word is highly misleading. Sort of like "Certified Used Cars" It really means nothing! The fact that you suggest that Lindal "Certifies" contractors indicates that you certainly do NOT know what the hell you are talking about!

In all the cases I am aware of Lindal and the dealer have gone to great lengths to stonewall, dodge, avoid, subvert, convolute and delay any and all efforts by the customer to address or recover from a failed Lindal project. In my case, and others, Lindal and the dealer lie about costs and make up bogus charges in an attempt to cover their tracks.

Another customer I have worked with complained that members of the Lindal family were directly involved in the abusive game of keep-away with his money along with the dealer for the purposes of intimidation so (He) the customer, eventuially takes anything Lindal offers to escape from the contract. This process of intimidation is designed to harass the customer into submission and paying both Lindal and the dealer for services NOT rendered. A confidentiality agreement seals the dirty deed for Lindals protection.

As an EX Lindal customer who has defininately done his homework, I can say, YOU sir, represent a deceptive and dishonest company that has ruined the lives of good families through interstate fraud and clearly deceptive and misleading business practices. In ALL cases Lindal has worked directly with the dealer to accomplish this fraud and deception across state lines. Funny that when I hear "CEO" in reference to Lindal I think "Chief Extortion Officer"

I AM a client on the rampage and will continue to help any and all Lindal customers who ask for help! OH, Please stay tuned. There is another unhappy Lindal customer about to tell their story about their failed project, dealer deception, and contractors recomended by the dealer that turned out to be worthless!

I suggest, there is nothing worse than a Lindal dealer that doesn't know what the hell they are talking about! And most of them certainly do NOT!

Again, If you feel you have been given an unfair image in the industry due to these complaints, your concerns should be forwarded to Robert W. Lindal at Lindal Cedar Homes NOT the customers systematically swindled out of their savings!
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#2 REBUTTAL Individual responds

Sounds like you picked the wrong Installer

AUTHOR: Chris - (U.S.A.)

I have sold lindal sunrooms and installed them in ALASKA since 2000.

The reason our company picked Lindal is because they work in severe weather conditions! We have had experiance with Fourseasons and several others that dont work. We pride ourself on quality and dont like call backs, Lindal sunrooms do not leak! If you would have chossen a qualified contractor that has glazing experiance and had he/she been Lindal certified for installation you wouldn't had a problem. There is nothing worse than a client on a rampage that dosen't know what the hell their talking about!

Do your homework before you lay blame!
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#3 Consumer Comment

As a VERY unhappy lindal customer I have found that Lindal does not stand behind their product

AUTHOR: Edwin - (U.S.A.)

There are no doubt, many honorable contractors with pride in their work. They also may stand behind their product or services even when the customer may have a problem. The dishonorable actions of others (suppliers, subcontractors) may tend to reflect poorly on any contractor with honorable intentions.

As a VERY unhappy lindal customer I have found that Lindal does not stand behind their product and most certainly will go to great lengths to avoid dealing with the customer in any way what so ever. Lindal also interceeds on the dealers behalf to convolute the custoimers ability to correct any problem they may have with a lindal or dealer related issue. I have been in contact with the person who filed this complaint and found his treatment by his dealer contractor and Lindal consistant with most customers who have ever had a problem with Lindal or a dealer. If your lindal project has no problem (what construction project has problems ?) then you may have a pleasant Lindal experience. If you have a problem then you will find out just how good your dealer is...

Unfortunately ALL Lindal dealers market Lindal products and services just the way Lindal directs them. ALL Lindal dealers execute Lindal purchase and sale agreements. ALL Lindal dealers sign the deceptively worded contract that misleads the customer in thinking they have placed a deposit on materials when in fact they have pre-paid both Lindal and the dealer for undocumented services and prices. (Why the deception ?) The reality that your dealer "IS NOT A Legal AGENT OF LINDAL" will be a very painfull one when you have a problem and the service driven dealer network is nowhere to be found, as in this fellas case where he was unable to get any dealer to sell him replacement parts.

The sad fact is, reputable or not, ALL Lindal dealers ARE alike because they work under Lindal rules, contracts, deceptive sales and marketing tactics. If you feel your business has been given a black eye in the industry unfairly, you may wish to bring this up at the next corporate meeting and make sure R.W. Lindal understands angry customers DO make noise!

AS in California and many other states Lindal dealers are not required to be licensed. If you are having a problem with Lindal, SUE your dealer! You will eventually get a favorable response from somebody. If you wish to avoid courts, arbitration, apathetic state agencies, callous treatment by dealers and the "corporation" and a seemingly endless volley of letters and excuses then go somewhere else. Lindal has competition, and they stand behind their product and services.
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#4 Consumer Comment

Not all Lindal Dealers are alike!

AUTHOR: Mikal - (U.S.A.)

Are all cars or car dealerships alike? Neither are all Lindal SunRoom Dealers or Contractors. I am truely sorry that you have had an unresolved and bad experience with your sunroom. It is a black mark for the industry but it is not necessarily representational of all members of the industry. I have been a licensed contractor for 25 years and a Lindal SunRoom dealer for the last 5 years. I chose this product because, compared to everything else out there, it was a superior product. Improper installation of any product can defeat the superior design of the product. I have installed many sunrooms in the San Diego area without any problem, ever. We pay attention to details and install the product so that there is little probability of seal failure. Unfortunately, it sounds like your contractor / installer did not. I would suggest that you go after the contractor through the Contractors State License Board because whoever installed your room should have been licensed and if they weren't then they need to be gotten off the streets. You can access them through www.cslb.ca.gov and file a complaint. Please do not hold your bad experience against all of us. Thank you.
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#5 Consumer Suggestion

Help for Lindal victims

AUTHOR: Edwin - ()

David



I am well aware of what you have gone through with Lindal and your dealer. You will be criticized for the way you may have initially handled your problem but remember this; Lindal and their dealers are well known for abandoning their customers once the money has changed hands (or even before).



I have talked with you via e-mail and need to get in touch with you again if possible. You're not the only CA customer with Lindal problems.



You can begin to make a difference by making your problems well known. Don't worry if you feel you're past the warranty period or past the statute of limitations within your state. Others will hear your complaint and we are getting attention.



Some worthwile links:

for FTC complaints https://rn.ftc.gov

/dod/wsolcq$.startup?Z_ORG_CODE=PU01

(that's all part of the same link in case it gets wrapped)



www.consumeraffairs.com They put out a newsletter and your complaint may get e-mailed to many people of interest, not to mantion dumped into a growing list of other hapless victims.



A good place for finding whether your dealer should have been licensed. (many Lindal dealers should be and aren't) Complain to your state.



http://www.constructionweblinks.com/

Industry_Topics/Licensing__Industry_Topics/

licensing__industry_topics.html



HADD.com has another very informative site, there are a number of Lindal complaints growing there. That site is where I found this one. Both seem to get a lot of visibility.



Make sure your local legislators and WA state legislators are aware of your problem. It is unlikely they will take any direct action in your case BUT... they are all begining to hear it from all over the country.

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/

senators_cfm.cfm



Good luck and I hope you find a more reputable manufacturer of sunrooms and a more responsive dealer. You're NOT alone!
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