• Report: #1056109

Complaint Review: Debbie Smith Mark Smith

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  • Submitted: Mon, June 03, 2013
  • Updated: Mon, June 03, 2013

  • Reported By: mommaof52013 — Kansas
Debbie Smith Mark Smith
rd Texarkana, Texas USA

Debbie Smith Mark Smith Do NOT buy a Giant Schnauzer Puppy From Debbie Smith and Mark Smith in Texarkana, TX Texarkana Texas

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Summary of Complaint

*Consumer Comment: I Kristina With Jordan Family Kennels Was Ripped Off And Now they are trying to make me look bad!

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Adding to rebuttal answer about Mark Smith & Debbie's Giant Schnauzers

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: QUALITY Giant Schnauzers from Mark Smith, Debbie Smith

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D not buy a Giant Schnauzer puppy from Debbie Smith or Mark Smith in Texarakana Texas. I have received 3 pups from these people. The first pup was not the one they said it was in pics. They said it was a puppy in the ad that was a solid black thick american coat female and I got a medium coat female with browns mixed in and white on the chest. We got her for breeding and this was not nice quality for that so we just found her a nice pet home. I did not throw a fit or get upset and demand a replacement pup because I had no problem just rehoming her and so was not out any money. The second pup we got was what they said which was a medium to american coat with a tiny white spot on her chest, and she was also healthy so no problem there.

The third pup we also bought for breeding to replace the first that we had to rehome, they increased their price on breeding dogs so we paid extra for a female with full AKC that we could use for breeding. This 3rd pup had a heart murmur and 1/4 of the ear missing and they would not exchange or give anything back on this pup!. Paypal does not give buyer protection for live animals so even though they were in the wrong I could not get a refund. These people buy dogs that have champ ped to breed them and make a dollar on someone elses hard work and they do not know breeding quality or what they are breeding,. They will not give you a refund if anything at all is wrong with your puppy. and Paypal is not a safe way to pay for a pup from them since Paypal automatically goes with the seller on animals since they do not give buyer protection on animals!!!

With these people I never saw a guarantee until after I complained and never agreed or signed any guarantee,. I definitely would never have agreed to buy a female and pay extra for full AKC on a puppy with a heart murmur and part of one of her ears missing. These people say a grade 1 heart murmur is often seen in large breed dogs and I say to that, BS, and if you have a pup with a heart murmur you do not sell it as a breeding female. You can not breed a dog with any heart murmur at all,. Then they said I knew the ear was damaged because it was standing up, That is sooo ***!!! Sometimes pups have ears that stand up and in no way does that mean the ear is damaged!!!

This puppy I received had 1/4 of the ear missing and so is going to have to have an extremely short ear cropping... These people are out to get your money and that is it and they do not care about their reputation. They just want your money and then you will not get anything from them if anything at all is wrong with the puppy. They say they never have issues with their pups but I have had 3 people who have received their pups call me saying they had issues with their pup to such as eye issues and genetic issues and they always say the same thing, never had that issue and no refunds or replacement pups given. They have two emails at this time so watch out and dont buy from: molecularman42@hotmail.com and maidinheaven67@hotmail.com


This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 06/03/2013 06:19 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Debbie-Smith-Mark-Smith/Texarkana-Texas/Debbie-Smith-Mark-Smith-Do-NOT-buy-a-Giant-Schnauzer-Puppy-From-Debbie-Smith-and-Mark-Sm-1056109. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 1Consumer 3Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Summary of Complaint

AUTHOR: Kriatina - ()

I hope everyone reads this last message. I am Kristina Jordan and I bought pups I paid extra for to use in my breeding program from Debbie and Mark Smith that live in Texarkana Texas. The orginal complaint was from me stating I received a pup with half her ear missing and a heart murmur and the breeders would not replace her or give my money back on her. So I filed a rip off report against them. I was the person that was ripped off and then Debbie and Mark made a ripp off complaint against my company to trash my name online even though they never bought anything from me. They have never been to my home or even asked me about my breeding program. They just want to trash my reputation online because I filed a report against them. I have never had any complaints filed from any of my puppy buyers. If you know me you know we are not a commercial breeder at all but a group of family and friends that each own a handful of dogs that are our family pets, so there is no kennel that is mentioned in this report. It may sound confusing because it is one breeder's review on another breeder. But just remember one thing, that I Kristina Jordan Jordan am the person who was ripped off and who submitted the first complaint against this other breeder mark and debbie smith. Here is my report I filed against them:
pissedconsumer.com/reviews-by-company/debbie-smith-mark-smith-giant-schnauzers.html

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#2 Consumer Comment

I Kristina With Jordan Family Kennels Was Ripped Off And Now they are trying to make me look bad!

AUTHOR: Upset Buyer - ()

This is Kristina with Jordan Family Treasures. First off I do not own a large kennel. I only have two adult dogs that live with me. We are a group of friends and family that breed for different breeds so the adults can live as family pets in a family home. I agree with your statement. I received a pup with a heart murmur and a ear that was partially missing. A pick of litter female I paid extra for so I could use her for breeding and show her in the ring. Then after just having her a few days I notified you of the issues and after paying $300 to have her shipped to me, yes I wanted you to do your part in sending me a puppy that was not what I paid for by doing the right thing and helping pay shipping back to you. You should have done that just for the fact the puppy had 1/4 to 1/3 of her ear missing and you missed that! I actually wanted my money back but had said would take pick of the litter in the next litter which was what I paid for in this puppy and did not get. Yes, I hope everyone does their research before buying a puppy from you or anyone else. Hope people also only look for breeders that health test the parents, just as I do. Also do not believe breeders that say PayPal has buyer protection... PayPal does not give buyer protection for animals. I learned that from this experience. Kristina with Jordan Family Treasures

PAYPAL Does not give buyer protection on animals!!! Something I learned when I made a claim with PayPal because the puppy I received was not what I paid for. Then The breeder said "Sure Let PayPal Decide" knowing that PayPal would Deny the claim because it is a animal and they do not give buyer protection for animals! I talked to the Paypal claim Dept for weeks and sent them my vet reports and finally they told me that someone should have told me as soon as I made my claim that it would be automatically denied because it is a animal. So YES I am going to warn people that some breeders falsely lure you into using PAYPAL saying they have buyer protection. But In Fact They Do Not. I use PayPal everyday and yes it is a nice tool to send and receive money but there is NO buyer protection when it comes to your puppies when paying by PayPal. I would tell People to use their credit card through PayPal, at least then they can make a claim on their card when their puppy is not what they paid for. And let me add that making a complaint against me for making a complaint against your company is childish. Nothing I stated was False. You are just trying to put my company name in a pissed consumer complaint to tarnish my reputation online. If you were really wanting to explain your side you would have just explained yourself by a comment on the complaint I made instead of making one against me. You are not a consumer and I am going to have this post deleted. I am a reputable breeder and am not affiliated in any way to the Giant Schnauzer Breeder in TX that the original complaint is against. I, Kristina, at Jordan Family Treasures was the one that was ripped off. I am a licensed breeder even though I do not have to be since I only own 2 females  and 1 male adult dogs. The Texarkana breeder is not licensed and does not test their adults. I should have done better research before buying from them.

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#3 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Adding to rebuttal answer about Mark Smith & Debbie's Giant Schnauzers

AUTHOR: mark - ()

 

Forgot to mention, don't have a clue as to what this lady is referring to concerning eye issues with our Giants that other buyers supposedly came to her and discussed with her. We have never had anyone that even came to us with a health issue that didn't get addressed, much less eye issues. Also, we never had anyone come to us wanting refunds for any reasons, health related to our pups. Please take note even in this situation , she came back to us saying "she was going to send the pup back for pick of the next litter." We were the sellers of this puppy, and it was our decision how this was to be handled not someone elses. It was us who suggested that we refund her money and she ship the puppy back, with her paying the shipping cost for return. We felt that that was fair since she didn't have a real reason to request another pup or even really get a refund. After she refused our refund offer, we decided to just cut off all communication with this individual. 

All of our puupies are very well taken care of, vaccinated, kept in a clean environment, and pampered with close attention. They are also in a climate controlled environment. They are vet. checked, wormed very 2 weeks from birth. So our respose to health issues..it seems that if anyone would want a refund or have complaints about eyes or whatever they would have came to us. We have NEVER had any refund requests or issues of health that warrented a return of a pup. So guess this was just another case of confusion as to who she was referring to in the complaint filed by this individual. This is just an out right untruth about us.

Now concerning money , might we say that yes we sell our puppies, and yes we accept paypal as also does this individual that placed this complaint. You can go to their website and it is clearly stated in their payment section that the 1st form of payment that they receive is also paypal. So it seems that she is contradicting when saying that paypal is a way not to do busuness. It appears to me that just because someone didn't get their way that they were going to do or say whatever to try and damage someone else's character or image possibly seeing us as a threat to their "business". Well we aren't and we could care less what they sell or do as breeders, and in no way are we going to falsly attack anyone , but we will defend and speak truth as to our position as as small specialized family breeders of a few quality Giant Schnauzers. 

Now if you want to check out thier site and buy puppies from them it is your perrogitive and choice. we encourage you to check out thier nice website.We could care less if someone wants to buy a puppy from someone other than us. They are located in Harrisonville, Mo.- Jordon Family Kennels. In an earlier rebuttal we mentioned them as being in Kansas that was a mis-statement. We shipped her pups to Kansas City, but they are located in Missori. We are located in Texarkana Texas- Mark & Debbie Smith- Quality Giant Schnauzer puppies.

Thanks for carefully checking us out or anyone else before you choose to buy a puppy.

 

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#4 REBUTTAL Owner of company

QUALITY Giant Schnauzers from Mark Smith, Debbie Smith

AUTHOR: mark - ()

The woman of which who owns a large Kennel in Kansas - Jordan Family Kennels, has been untruthful in her statements on this ripp-off report site. First of all, every puppy that every buyer purchased from us in every instance has been the puppy that each buyer choose from our pictures or on site. We also take great care in describing each puppy and helping each buyer pick the puppy out of thier choice, weather they pick by pictures or in person. We have never been deceptive to anyone. We can offer anyone who contacts us about our puppies an extensive reference list that they can freely contact many other buyers across the US that have purchased our Quality Giant Schnauzer Puppies. They will get nothing but good reports on us & our Giants.

We have only 1 male and 3 females now of which we breed. Our Male is an amazingly handsome sire with a great AAA American coat. 2 of our 3 females have almost all champions in their bloodline AKC pedigrees. Our 3rd female is a huge 120 friendly girl. This is the only animals that we breed and sell. This is a hobby of which we specialize in breeding only quality Giant Schnauzer which only suppliments our primary income. We are in no way a "puppy mill", with multiple upon multiple breeds on our grounds. This being said we can add that we take great care of our adults and each puppy at our home. So there is no confusion which pup is which. We collar & label each puppy from the time we picture and send out pictures to our buyers who have reserved pups. The collars remain on each pup, and remain marked with permament ink, until they go out to their new homes.

Now if a person picks a paricular puppy even if they are a breeder or not; it is always the puppy they get! You can't just pick & choose if you are a breeder and you want the first pick of the litter and you are down at the bottom of the list as to the order of deposit made. We do not give anyone special preference over anyone else. It's a first come basis as to which puppy anyone gets to pick, which is in order of deposits taken. Really now, none of our pups are of bad quality. She is a breeder and if she didn't want what she got then she could have sold any of the 3 pups that she received.

This particular breeder was being inflamatory in her remarks towards us and offensive on several occations. we actually had decided after she bought the second one that we weren't going to sell another to her and she came back pratically begging. But against our better judgement we went ahead and sold her another. We also decided that if we were to continue selling to breeders then we would charge extra for the hastle and the competition of spreading our champion pups around to puppy mills. we felt that the extra charge would deter some breeders. Actually we would prefer that our pus go to good homes as pets.

Secondly, the complainer stated to us that she never received our "health guarantee, or deposit contract". That is certainly a suprise to us and definately not true. From the very beginning up front; we send all this to each potential buyer who wants to or is even interested in making a deposit. It seems kind of odd that a breeder wouldn't want this especially after making 3 seperate purchases of puppies, and "never got or guarantees or deposit contract". We repeatedly sent her information that she said she never got and re-sent items via email more than once on several occations.

We even discussed over the phone diferent details about shipping of the pup with texts that she claims she never got or understood. We even told her that shipping confirmation wouldn't be given to her until the pup is checked in on the day of shipping, cause that is AACargo's policy. She would email and say the night before the shipping " where is my shipping info my puppy is suppose to ship tomorrow and I need my shipping info now". Mind you this was after we had emailed her & discussed with her 3 -4 days prior the process of shipping. Possibly she has too much on her plate to remember, or other issues.

Thirdly, We shipped out the last pup that was chose by this individual. It was the pup she picked in the order she placed the deposit. She was aware that one of the ears was tending to stand a bit already and we discussed that issue which was seen in the pictures in advance. She got the solid black AAA American coat that she wanted in this pup on this 3rd puppy she was purchasing. She even text us and said that the pup was gorgeous when she received her off the plane. After taking the pup to the vet and looking at the ear, and "her vet saying that the ear was missing about a quarter of ther ear and that they would have to crop the ears short", she also added that their was a grade 1 heart murmur in the pup and that she was sending her back , so she could have 1st pick of the next litter.

She told us this which doesn't even line up with our health guarantee. Basically she was demanding.Well it appered to us , and our vet and any other vets opinion that many large breed pups have a grade 1 heart murmer untill they get 3 -4 months old and that that is nothing to be alarmed about and certainly won't affect breeding of the dog as an adult once the murmur subsides as the pup ages. This is called an "innocent murmer" - search on the VCA animal hospital studies website for yourself for FACTS about this condition.She said the pup couldn't be bred, and that the ear was "nicked".

OH well, we didn't agree that the pup met any genetic disorder that requiered that it be shipped back that being said we didn't want to have to deal with this breeder again with our next litter having "1st choice" . We feel that she just wanted 1st pick and to be in total control, therefore we disagreed with her. We even offered to refund her as a kind jester but that she pay the shipping cost of sending the pup back. She refused our offer, so we called the deal done, and let her keep that 3rd pup and we alter after several months discovered this nice "rip-off" report.

So this is our answer to a false report about us..please be objective and check out our references, and this rebuttal before taking  one "persons" opinion. Thanks, & God Bless- Happy Schnauzer hunting!  Mark & Debbie in Texarkana Texas

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