• Report: #220288

Complaint Review: EBAY - Paypal - EJNRN

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  • Submitted: Mon, November 13, 2006
  • Updated: Fri, November 17, 2006

  • Reported By:Hatfield Arkansas
EBAY - Paypal - EJNRN
Baltimore, Maryland U.S.A.

EBAY Seller "EJNRN", PayPal, And EBAY scamming people for shipping insurance fraud ripoff Baltimore Maryland

*General Comment: CynUSA not the same person

*General Comment: FRAUD: Rita and CynUSA are the same person.

*General Comment: Thank you, Robert!

*Author of original report: Oh, Robert.... my hero, you FOUND me!!! *gag!*

*Author of original report: Glad you are so responsible

*Author of original report: Thanx, Rita!

*Consumer Comment: I agree with Robert

*Author of original report: Oh, Robert.... my hero, you FOUND me!!! *gag!*

*Consumer Comment: You're right

*Consumer Comment: Cin...

*Author of original report: Thanx for your input!

*Consumer Comment: Thoughts from a discount junky

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Ebay seller, "EJNRN" (and LOTS of other unscrupulous sellers) sell you their items, takes your shipping insurance money but doesn't put the insurance on (they claim they forgot [how convenient!]). When the items are received damaged and unusable (like mine was), the seller refuses to make good the damages, and instead refunds the shipping insurance, which is NOT an acceptable resolution. Meanwhile, the buyer (me), is stuck with damaged goods.

Although I've won my PayPal dispute (they found in my favor), they tell me I need to return the items "in original condition" in order to receive a refund from the seller. This is the part where it gets tricky, because the seller can then claim not to have to refund on the grounds that the items are not received "in original condition" (naturally, duh!), so the seller therefore doesn't have to refund on a technicality.

This also is unacceptable on a couple different levels: Besides the seller claiming the items are not in original condition, there is no enforceable guarantee in place that they will or can be made to refund at all. Neither PayPal nor ebay enforce claims under $25 (which mine happens to be). Secondly, the buyer has to pay for insurance! Now to me, this is adding insult to injury not only is it NOT the buyers fault, but now in addition to initially having paying for shipping AND INSURANCE on the item which was subsequently received damaged and unusable, buyer now also has to pay to ship it back again, pay for tracking (don't want the seller to claim it wasn't delivered!), and pay for shipping insurance (again!) on said items which will probably never get refunded anyway. It's screw you time at ebay and PayPal. Step up to the plate boys and girls, and wait your turn on the how much money can we bilk you out of Sellers Game!

I have refused to return the items. Instead, I have offered a fair and good faith compromise to the seller and gave them a couple different options: since I paid for two items and one was damaged, the seller can refund to me what it would have cost had I only bought the one item. OR, they can, at their expense, send me a new item. Fair, you say? Yes. Reasonable, you say? Absolutely.

Does the seller acknowledge the fact I'm trying to resolve the issue in an amicable and equitable manner? Hell no! They accuse ME of trying to cheat THEM! Do you believe the gall and audacity of some delusional morons??? First, they demanded pictures; I don't have a digital camera, so I have to drive 20+ miles away to borrow one, then I send the seller the pictures showing the bent and twisted container.

Bear in mind now, that since the damage consisted of one of the two bottles of lotion oozing all over my kitchen counter when I opened the outside package, I had attempted to clean part of the goopy mess up so it didn't smear and dribble the mess all over. I did not anticipate having any problems claiming the damage through the post office (thinking of course that it was insured) as it was all over the packaging and obviously not in like new condition, plus there was about 75% of the liquid gone. Imagine my surprise then when I inspected the outside packaging and the label, and noticed there was NO insurance on it. Of course I immediately contacted the seller:

****The package did arrive. It was ripped open, and a good portion of the contents of one bottle apparently oozed out (I say apparently because it was only three-quarters full). I do not see any indication that you had insurance put on the package, although I did pay extra for it. As you might imagine, I'm not very happy right now... unless you can provide me proof that you had insurance on the package, I expect you to replace the damaged bottle at your expense. If you had it insured, I will go through USPS for reimbursement if you provide me proof so I can provide them proof. Thank you for your immediate attention to this problem.****

I spend almost two days trying to get a response from her (I'd had to send several emails because she didn't respond until I threatened a ebay/PayPal dispute). When I finally did receive something back, this was her reply:

**** I am sorry for the trouble please provide me a picture of the damaged bottle
thanks ****

My response:

**** Thank you for responding. I do not have a digital camera, however, I will take the time and go through the expense to drive over to a friends house and obtain one, to send you a picture of the bottle as you requested, AFTER you RESPOND to my ORIGINAL request of sending me PROOF that you INSURED the package so I can file a claim with the post office. PLEASE PROVIDE THIS =NOW=. I am trying in good faith to resolve this, and at this point I feel you are trying to be evasive and not respond to my request for proof of insurance... of which I clearly paid for and also requested in an email PRIOR to my bidding on the item, to which you responded that you assured me you would put on the insurance. What do you propose to do to resolve this issue? ****


Her reply:


**** Hi
I am sorry u feel i do not respond fast enough to your message...
I am a wife,mother,work full time,& ebay. I respond to all my messages same day or the next which I think is very responsable and respectful.
Saying all that....
I checked your shiping info and I am truely sorry to say that I honestly forgot to put insurance on. Check your paypal account I refunded your insurance fee.
I asked for a picture so I can see what happened, I have sold hundreds of these bottles with out a problem. I use bubble wrap and a plastic bubble enevelope.
Once I get the picture I will see what I can do.
Thanks ****

Oh, bahhh-waaahhh! Cry a little louder! So she's now trying the ploy of poor me, I'm an overworked Mom, blah-blah-blah. She seems to think that since she honestly forgot to put on the insurance, that refunding my insurance fee is good enough? It doesn't seem to sink in to her thick skull that it is NOT good enough, and she needs to make restitution. She at this juncture thinks she is off the hook because she's refunded my insurance fee. I continue to request she reimburse me for my loss:

**** Thanks for your response. I, too, am very busy each and every day, but I manage to answer my customers emails promptly - I don't try to excuse tardiness in answering emails due to my being too busy. I work TWO jobs (which equal more than full time), am a SINGLE mother, and I also work ebay PLUS maintain websites, but I manage to check & answer my emails frequently throughout the day. To me, answering emails is a very important priority when you are dealing with customers! So is ensuring the ebay order is placed correctly and proper shipping methods are applied, and yes, that includes adding insurance if the buyer has paid. This keeps happy customers and repeat business. And no, I do not think answering emails every day or two is responsible, and is certainly not respectable unless you are new to ebay and don't know any better - which you don't seem to have fallen into that category as you've apparently been in business over three years - at least under this seller name of ejnrn. It is important to make sure your customers know you are serious about being a good ebay Seller, and answering emails *promptly* is one way to show your good intentions. Otherwise, buyers wonder if they are being ignored, put off, or have been scammed.

Under the circumstances, I hope you can put yourself in my position... I don't know if you've ever bought on ebay, but there's a lot of scammers out there and I've had the misfortune of meeting quite a few in my many ebay dealings; as such, I've become very savvy about different tricks they pull imagine if you will that a lot of Sellers do several thousand transactions per day, collect insurance on each one, then don't put insurance on? It happens every day, all day long. I believed you might have been one of these sellers, and I am only trying to protect myself. Granted, it was only a little over a dollar, but many dollars add up - besides, it's THE POINT. To me, every penny counts, and when someone tries to take away a bunch of my hard-earned pennies, I get defensive.

Just because you were negligent in not putting on insurance, now I have had to take the time and go to the expense of driving 22 miles away to borrow a digital camera so I can take a picture of the item that was damaged and send it to you for proof that it was damaged? Do you feel that is fair and just? I do not. Besides, although the picture will provide proof the package was ripped and torn, it's difficult to take a picture down inside the bottle to see how much soap is left, but, since you insist, I will do so. While I appreciate your refunding the insurance fee and acknowledge your apology, I am still left with a less-than-full and not *new* bottle of soap. What do you think you would do in my position?

You said you've shipped many bottles before and have never had a problem. Good for you, but it was only a matter of time and there is ALWAYS a first time. This time, apparently for you, is yours. I would suggest next time you ship bottles of liquid that you first take a piece of tape, preferably electrical tape, and tape the caps to the bottle. Electrical tape is easily removed by the customer but difficult to come off during shipment. My advice on this is free - you'd be well served in taking it.

Meanwhile, I'm sending the pictures you requested; although I don't feel I should HAVE to, I'm doing so to end this in a amiable manner and show good faith. Now that you have the pictures, please refund the difference as I've requested, or send a new bottle (your choice), promptly. And please inform me which of the two options you are electing to do? I will hold off further disputing/chargeback pending your response.
Thank you****

So, as I said, I borrowed a camera and sent her the pictures she required. Then, I got this response:

**** Hi
After I e mailed u I went to my post office and asked the manager of the branch what they do when a broken bottle of any liquid is sent and is damaged, & leakage occurred what they do. His reply was they deliver it in a plastic bag which is noted for damaged. I looked at all the pictures and it shows a few dents, no soap anywhere on the bag or the bottle, which u said occurred. The bottled is sealed which I am sure u saw, I am still trying to see where the damage is besides a dent. The can looked in tact and clean no damage. ****

What this seller seems to lose sight of is the fact that the item WAS RECEIVED DAMAGED, and SHE was negligent in not ensuring the shipping insurance that I paid extra for was put on. This was her fault, not mine, and she needs to make it good regardless of the type or extent of damage that was done. It doesn't matter what the manager of HER post office has to say, it was delivered to me by MY post office DAMAGED! Hello??? Can you say delusional??? There is no can, it was a plastic bottle. The bottle was not sealed, there was lotion all over. Yes, the bottle was dented, because apparently something heavy had squished it and the liquid oozed out into the inner packaging. And had she put on insurance, I would have trotted down to MY post office and filed a claim. DUH, that's what shipping insurance is for! Here was my reply:

**** I don't care what YOUR post office said they would do, apparently OURS doesn't do the same... or they did not see the leak - it is entirely possible (I am told) that they did not observe any "leaks" and that the damage may have occurred in transit; the bottle was NOT sealed when it arrived, as a good portion of the liquid apparently oozed out. You may not have seen the total mess in the picture as I did clean up some of it - since you took so long answering me and I did not have a camera handy, I surely wasn't going to leave it laying around my home in a mess... perhaps you would leave it, but I wouldn't. And you admit that you did see the dents in the bottle, but because you can't see the wetness you don't think there was any damage??? Get real, lady! There WAS soap on the bag, on the inside of the bubblewrap which had oozed out. Just because you don't see a neat "puddle" in the pictures is no excuse to ignore what has happened. It is also possible that it wasn't a "new" bottle as you claim it was but was used... that would explain there being no seal on that bottle. Irregardless, for WHATEVER the reason, I do not have a NEW, FULL, UNOPENED bottle. Additionally, I don't know what "can" you are referring to that you say looked intact and clean, as there was no "can" in the package.

Besides which, all this is NOT the point - the point is, YOU were negligent in not having insurance placed on the package, and I am NOT going to "eat" it. I paid IN GOOD FAITH FOR TWO BOTTLES! I held up my end, you DID NOT.

Since you do not wish to either refund the difference for the damaged bottle nor ship me a new one as I proposed, I shall proceed with the dispute. Simply refunding the insurance after the fact is not right, and you are obviously trying to rip me off and not willing to take the blame for something that is wholly and totally YOUR FAULT! I will also naturally leave negative feedback in the listing as you didn't perform your end of the bargain. *****

I decide to stop trying to haggle with her and go directly to ebay. But wait! Ebay says you can't file a claim until AFTER 10 days goes by (I'm not sure of the reasoning behind this, most respectable businesses have you file a claim immediately). So, instead I send an email to their customer support. Of course, nobody responds for almost two weeks, but that's ebay for you. Johnny-on-the-spot to TAKE your money, but heaven forbid they ever have to see about a REFUND of your money for a fraudulent transaction. So much for buyer protection. What a joke. And PayPal is just as bad (one actually owns the other, by the way, did you know that?).

I then instead file a PayPal dispute. Several days go by, and they finally contact me back:

**** The seller has submitted an explanation describing the disagreement with this claim. We will evaluate all available information including the original listing, and both seller and buyer statements. A final decision
will be made on this claim per our User Agreement. ****


Know also that a copy of my claim input was sent to the Seller and viewable on the dispute record, but the Seller's explanation was not copied to me nor is it viewable on the dispute record (how fair is that??). Then, a couple more days go by, and here is what they say (attention on the * text *, added by me for emphasis):

**** We have determined that you *may* be eligible for a refund on this PayPal transaction. *To qualify for a refund, just return the item in its original
condition to the seller.* (You are responsible for shipping and handling costs for the returned merchandise.) The amount you will be eligible to
receive is determined by the terms of our buyer protection policies and *we may be unable to make a full recovery of your payment from the seller.*
Please review the buyer protection policies in our User Agreement before shipping the item back to the seller.

baltimore, MD 21209
United States

Please log in and provide tracking information for the item you are returning within 10 calendar days. The seller will also receive the tracking information for this item. When the shipment is verified by PayPal, the refund will be issued to you. If you do not provide this
information to PayPal, the investigation will end and the claim will be cancelled.

You may also choose to cancel this claim if you wish to work directly with the seller to resolve this issue.

Thank you for your cooperation. *****

The buyer protection that they speak of does NOT cover purchases or transactions under $25.00. My transaction was $20.05. So, I respond back to PayPal:

**** I am in receipt of your notice to me regarding the above dispute stating the dispute was found in my favor. Unfortunately, you do not make any warranty as to my refund as you state in the notice: "The amount you will be eligible to receive is determined by the terms of our buyer protection policies and we may be unable to make a full recovery of your payment from the seller." I don't understand WHY you cannot? What good is buyer protection then? Buyers have no recourse from people who scam them? Why do I need to return the item if I have no reason to believe I'll get my money back, PLUS, I will have spent EXTRA money in shipping as well? This is why innocent people like me continue to get RIPPED OFF not only by ebay, but by PayPal as well. I am not satisfied with this end result - either way I am on the losing end and this is NOT acceptable. This is 100% the SELLERS fault, NOT mine; I shouldn't have to be the one who suffers the loss or has to pay. Please respond. ****

I should not waste my time or effort in going through these motions, as basically all I got is a canned response at first. More blah-blah-blah. I exchange a few more emails with them if for no other reason than to continue to show not only my displeasure with their services and protection policies, but in expectation that if I squeak loud and long enough (which I intend to do), that they will ultimately recognize that I refuse to go away quickly or quietly.

At this point I decide that this seller, EJNRN, is not going to do the right thing and neither refund any monies to me nor send me a new bottle of soap, and in effect is just a liar, cheat, and scammer a general all-around bad guy. So, I go ahead and give her negative feedback what else does she expect? And, of course, as I anticipated, this moron thinks I am trying to cheat HER, at least this is the ploy she uses in her negative feedback on me. What a ditz! Not that I care necessarily about this feedback crap because it is soooo bogus! but I guess I'm still appalled at how delusional some people (more and more every day, actually) truly are. They have absolutely NO CONCEPT of reality, and appear to live instead in their own little cocoon. Geesh. Boggles the mind.

By this time now, the 10 days has elapsed and I can now file my ebay dispute, which I do. Here, for your viewing pleasure, is the back-and-forth between myself and the seller. Note: Ebay does not get involved at this time, nor will they until at least 30 days has elapsed from the time you received the item. Then, you need to let EBAY mull over your dispute claim and investigate it. BEWARE OF THIS TACTIC! It is also important to note at this same time, that most credit card/banking institutions refuse to perform chargebacks and/or credit reversals for transactions that are over 60 days (and quite a few refuse any action over 30 days). My input is in green italics; seller's response is in red (note she does not address the facts, points, or issue):

**** Item Significantly Not As Described: 2- 16oz. Yardley English Lavender Moisturizing Soap (#270040764798) Payment Method: Credit Card Payment Date: Oct-23-2006
Additional Details: Slr 'forgot' to put on shpg ins that I pd extra for; item rec'd damaged (or else Slr shpd item 'used' & almost empty). Product wasn't sealed, leaked out. Seller demanded pics; at more expense, I sent pix. I offered compromise to Seller: refund the diff for what was received vs. what was paid for I req'd a $9.15 credit, Seller gave $1.45 (amt of ins). This is NOT acceptable; Seller now req me to return item AT MY ADD'L EXPENSE; I expect not to be out any MORE money! Slr scammed me & wont mk gd. ****

**** why have u not responded to paypal dispute ****

(she apparently can't read as I had already addressed this earlier through PayPal, so I figure she's purposely evading the issue)

**** I HAVE responded to the PayPal dispute. Why haven't u admitted it's ur fault & make it right by refunding a fair amount ($7.70 more) of the damages as I asked for? It was a reasonable & good faith effort towards a fair settlement, but you're totally unwilling. I've gone out of my way & through additional effort & expense to resolve this - you've done nothing but demand this & that, & now expect me to spend even more to return the items? BE FAIR: Upay 4 shpg & refund all my $$, I'll return items.
Why don't you be fair? You keep trying to skirt the issue: this is your fault and you're trying to
make it MY problem. You're not being fair OR honest. I won't go to the expense of returning the items until/unless you pay for shipping - the alternative, as I mentioned before, is fair: you pay me the diff in what it would have cost had I only bought ONE soap; you refunded $1.45 already, the balance due is $7.70... refund that & we can both be 'winners' & I'd agree to mutually remove neg feedback. ****

Hers:

**** I did not do anything wrong i think u r a liar and r cheating me of a new bottle. I check every bottle and there was a seal on the bottle. Why would I send a sealed one and one not what do I gain by it.
Do u think I like going through this. U r being unreasonable. The only thing i did wrong was the
insurance which i made right by the refund. I am human and i made a mistake. I think u dishonest and hard to deal with just like the other feedback u got. ****

I'm cheating HER??? How can she realistically *assume* that just because it was sent out in (allegedly) pristine condition without insurance that it will automatically arrive in the same (allegedly) pristine condition? What does she think insurance is FOR to put in her pocket??? What do I have to gain by falsely claiming damage? How is it that I am being unreasonable by not rolling over and playing dead, or not keeping quiet and meekly taking the hit??? Not only is she missing the point of responsibility, but she is now starting to act rather belligerent. Hmmm what's wrong with this picture? I'm the one out money and have a useless item, and she is getting pissy? And she's griping about MY feedback? That's a wee bit like the pot calling the kettle black. To continue:

****** THE POINT IS, YOU DID *NOT* PUT THE INSURANCE ON, THE BOTTLE WAS DAMAGED AND YOU REFUSE TO MAKE GOOD *YOUR* MISTAKE! YOU ARE THE DISHONEST ONE! WHY WOULD I CHEAT YOU OUT OF ONE BOTTLE OF SOAP?? IF I
WAS GOING TO DO THAT I WOULD'VE CLAIMED ALL WAS DAMAGED, NOT JUST ONE! THERE WASN'T A SEAL ON THE BOTTLE WHEN IT ARRIVED HERE, & IF YOU'RE NOT SCAMMING ME GIVE ME MY $7.70 BACK! PROVE YOU'RE NOT A CHEAT! YOUR FEEDBACK ISN'T ALL THAT GREAT EITHER SO STOP THINKING YOU'RE SO PERFECT. U R WRONG, WRONG!
How is it you think refunding my insurance money solves this? The damage is already done, you dolt! It's YOUR fault, NOT mine. If YOU would've put insurance on it like YOU were supposed to, we wouldn't have this problem. How and why should it be made MY problem when YOU screwed up? Go back to school, look up the word "responsibility", AND BE RESPONSBILE FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS! STOP BLAMING SOMEONE ELSE! Why don't you ACT human and make good YOUR mistake? An HONEST person would make it right. It appears from reading YOUR feedback that you're not so perfect either, & that others think you lie & cheat also:

(feedback taken from HER ebay profile:)

'BEWARE they lie in their listings. A coupon is NOT a check!!!'

'Didn't show picture of actual item being sold--somewhat decieving. High ship $'

'glasses broken. can't understand the wrapping(two plastic bags, two papers)'
(the seller apparently does NOT pack well for any of her shipments)

'deceptive description: album only holds eight pictures back to back'

So, who's hard to deal with here? At least I offered a compromise; you = nothing. ****

I anticipate having this go back and forth between myself and the seller until the 30-day time frame comes around when I can escalate the ebay claim to get ebay involved instead of trying to communication with this deadbeat seller. Although I don't expect ebay will do anything, I am certainly not going to let them off without making them work for at least an attempt at dispute resolution. They should not get off so easy either if they willingly continue to let scammers like EJNRN continue to utilize their services.

Meanwhile, I have since contacted by credit card company. I did this now for two reasons: 1. I refuse to wait out either ebay or PayPal only to find out I've waited too long to go through my credit card company for results (chargeback/restitution); 2. I honestly do not believe that ebay or PayPal will obtain my refund for me. My credit card company was quite understanding; I had the good fortune of having a customer service person who had personally been ripped off by PayPal AND ebay, so they were more than willing to help. They will do a chargeback under fraud guidelines; the seller was paid extra money in good faith for a service they did not perform whether be by neglect, dereliction of duty, and/or oversight and the items were not received as they had been represented. a.k.a. FRAUD.

I hope I have been able to enlighten some folks by posting this. If I help prevent just one person from being defrauded or scammed, I will feel good. Be very wary of the likes of EBAY and PayPal. In the long run, it is far better to go shopping and get what you need from a store even if it means driving a ways to do so, you will be much better off. Neither company apparently takes seriously their disputes and claims processes, and they unfortunately just don't care; they are too big to care about us little guys. Granted, there's not too much we can do to try and get our money back, so it's best not to give them - or the people that use their services the opportunity to get our money in the first place.

Cin
Hatfield, Arkansas
U.S.A.

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This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 11/13/2006 02:58 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/EBAY-Paypal-EJNRN/Baltimore-Maryland/EBAY-Seller-EJNRN-PayPal-And-EBAY-scamming-people-for-shipping-insurance-fraud-ripoff-220288. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

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#1 General Comment

CynUSA not the same person

AUTHOR: Sue D - ()

Ran across this on my search today for Ebay ripoff reports.  Wow.

First I found it hilarious that someone (schiperno) would post to a report that is over seven years old, hahaha!  And the play on the name -schiperno- is funny too, as it seems they are playing towards their not being a shipper (shipper no), as in they are bad shippers.  ?? 

This -schiperno- also has it wrong where she calls -CynUSA-, as in re-reading the complaints and rebuttals, that person's user name here was actually -Cin- and the parentheses denote the country they are from, which here looks like it's the USA.  -C- and -Cin- are the same person, but that was never denied. 

It was also rather odd to me, that reading the feedback given to the original poster, that looking at it now it seems as the other nay-sayers were indeed the same writers (Lori and Robert).  Neither Lori nor Robert seemed to want to state where they are from, yet Cin did (Hatfield, Arkansas), so that makes Cin appear more credible to me.  And the other writers who were for Cin seemed to have a different writing style, so I don't believe they are the same person - but I can't say the same for ejnrn, Lori, or Robert.  Questionable for sure.

I too have had a few problems with bad Ebay sales/sellers.  It's as if people don't have any respect for others anymore; no pride of business professionalism or ethics.  Their moral compasses are off.  Speaking for myself, I would never have allowed the situation (with the customer being dissatisfied after providing proof of a problem) to get to this point; I would rather maintain good customer relations and would have sent the buyer -Cin- a new item.  As it was, there were hard feelings on both sides, but the buyer wins in my book because he/she tried to resolve it in a mature way initially.  Seems the seller, -ejnrn-, got caught in a mistake and instead of admitting it and making it right, blew the thing out of proportion. 

Schiperno states they have had recently or are apparently having now a dispute with -CynUSA-, so I ask if that is true that they post their transaction info here, for all to see.  It would grant credibilty to -schiperno- that as I see it right now there is none.  Schiperno may have something with -CynUSA-, but I doubt it is actually with -Cin- from USA, who was the original poster.  Or better yet, perhaps -Cin- will find this and do a rebuttal. 

So, -schiperno-, show us your proof.  :-)

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#2 General Comment

FRAUD: Rita and CynUSA are the same person.

AUTHOR: schiperno - ()

That is very nice of "Rita" to write as "CynUSA" to congragulate herself on her own false humor. It's sad that people learn that she is crazy only after she files false ebay claims. :(

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#3 General Comment

Thank you, Robert!

AUTHOR: schiperno - ()

I just had an ebay transaction with Cyn and I was not surprised to find this rip off report. I will take the time to file one of my own against her. CynUSA is a rude bully. I also want to point out that a lot of her feedback looks embellished and I reported this to ebay today. 

Like in the case I am currently in with Cyn, in this ripoff report I feel like she is not being reasonable and looking for any excuse to get a full refund over these inexpensive items. She is taking advantage of ebay policies and trying to scam myself and others by the looks of it. :( 

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#4 Author of original report

Oh, Robert.... my hero, you FOUND me!!! *gag!*

AUTHOR: Cin - (U.S.A.)

Oh, Robert, I'm sooo glad you found me! Goody, goody! You are SUCH a smart little detective oh, but wait! You didn't really detect' anything did you, since I included the item number of the transaction in my statement. Duh! And who says I have to be or act in a professional manner? Tsk, tsk. So you think I care about being put on your BBL, you self-righteous twit?? Don't flatter yourself.

Knowing you have the same viewpoint as good ol' EJNRN, I wouldn't want to buy from you anyway. And puh-lease stay OFF my side! I surely do not need the likes of YOU rooting for me - this isn't about my needing or wanting 'cheerleaders'; it's a potential rip-off warning for others. Oh, and you better watch yourself there, bud you sound a wee bit angry yourself! Ha!

Sounds like you think you're Mr. eBay. Well by golly, let's check you out, sugar-dumplin', and see just how flawlessly perfect you are? I dare you to substantiate your self-appointed right to judge. Put your words where your mouth is got the guts to post a transaction ID for one of the items YOU sold on eBay??? If you don't have anything to hide, that is

I have nothing to hide, nor am I ashamed of anything I've written or said here. You betcha I'm angry, and with 100% good reason too. You are apparently one of those types who seems to think that the amount one pays for a service should be proportional to the service one receives? Hmmmm. So, that means, say if you go to an automatic car wash and spend $5.00 getting your car washed, and while going through it one of the armatures falls off on your new car and causes $500.00 damage, do you think the owner is liable to you? If so, for what amount?

According to you, not even the $5.00 you paid. You find out later that the car wash owner didn't have insurance, so you can't get your money back that way, but YOU have automotive insurance but wait! Unfortunately, your insurance agent forgot to add the $1.45 extra you paid the week before to your policy that covers accidents like this. When you complain to the agent when he tells you you're not covered, he says sorry, he forgot to add that special insurance (he is such a busy, busy agent after all!); but, he does promptly refund your $1.45! So, under the circumstances, where do you think you stand?

According to your outlook, getting the $1.45 back should be good enough, right? The point here, Robert, is that it doesn't matter the *amount* of the damage, how it was damaged, or even how reputable your insurance agent OR the car wash owner is; the point is, you paid money to someone to INSURE against damage, and you should rightfully expect that person to take responsibility if/when damage occurs.

Although it isn't anyone's fault per se that the accident/damage happened (i.e., the car wash owner nor the insurance agent caused the damage), damage has nonetheless been done and you rightfully expect compensation. EJNRN didn't actually cause the damage (at least I don't think so, but the seal MAY have not been on in the first place and putting tape on the cap COULD have prevented potential leakage), she just wasn't prudent or diligent about her responsibility to ensure she put on the insurance I paid for.

And as a side note: I'll wager little miss EJNRN will definitely be more careful in the future about making sure that when someone pays extra for insurance, she'll put it on!!! ;-)

Yes, I have had a prior bad experience on eBay with another seller besides EJNRN as you saw, Robert. And who cares about how much EJNRN sells vs. how many times I've bought??? So what if she's got x-amount of feedback? Good for her for being such a busy little selling bee. I only buy on eBay under this ID. AND, unless you know both sides of the story, do not assume you know the facts nor presume to pass judgment until you do; anyone can say anything true or not and there isn't much that can be done about it other than having feedback mutually withdrawn in case of negativity (in fact which you conveniently chose to overlook: she has one, I don't, and if for this not being withdrawn her feedback percentage would be lower than mine!).

You seem to be the type of person to find someone guilty before the whole story is told; you make your mind up and that's that. People have a tendency to think the worst of people anyway, and with the brief space in which to create an explanation on eBay feedback, there's not too much one can do to describe fully the situation.

Everybody makes mistakes (I'll even bet you do too, Robert!). As I mentioned in my statement though, it's what one DOES about them that counts. Do you shrug it off, or do you try to correct it and/or make it right? I tried to work with EJNRN for several days towards a mutually-agreeable resolution. I didn't post negative feedback until just a few days ago two-1/2 weeks AFTER the purchase I'd given her plenty of time and opportunity to prove she was truly sorry and let her make amends. She adamantly believes she did nothing wrong (read her statement!), and feels that returning the shipping insurance of $1.45 is good enough. It's not.

I paid $20.05 for two bottles of new, unopened product. I received only one the other was damaged beyond use. She forgot the insurance, so I asked for some sort of restitution for the damages that was only fair so how is this possibly construed as being unreasonable on my part? And how is it that I'm the one that has to suffer for her mistake? The cost of the item nor the amount of damage is not the point. How can she in good conscience claim I'm the scam-artist?

That was actually how I'd described her actions in my dispute to eBay and PayPal, and she basically cut & pasted what I said about her to them in her negative feedback about me! She'd also nabbed the statement hard to deal (with) from another seller who'd left negative feedback for me (over a year ago, by the way) after they sent me damaged/used goods (supposed to have been new, it had missing parts that rendered it unusable, and I paid EXTRA for FedEx overnight shipping which they actually sent slow-boat USPS that took almost a week, and BTW I never did get my *promised* refund after I returned the item; then they called me 'rude and hard to deal with' after I returned the item and they never refunded my money so I had my CC do a chargeback). Good grief, she can't even come up with an original, negative-feedback slam! Yeah, I guess I'm hard to deal with especially when you try to rip me off!

So, your perception of my communicating to EJNRN my expectation that she make good on the damaged item was RUDE? *News flash! Reality check!* It's called BEING ASSERTIVE - but you have a right to your perceptions and opinions even if they happen to be wrong. Do you think if I had been nicer she would have made restitution? I don't not for a moment this isn't about being nice or rude. EJNRN was wrong when she forgot to add the insurance. Had she responded promptly in the first place with an offer to make it up to me (as a responsible, trustworthy, and honest person would have), this whole thing could have worked out quite well and would not have escalated to where it is now. I am tired of some people working so hard to take what others have away from them be it their money, self-respect, dignity, sense of worth, etc. I refuse to continue to let others take advantage of me.

You, Robert, may let someone get away with $1.45 today, but perhaps tomorrow it may be $145.00, next year, $145,000.00 it adds up! Where do you draw the line? I've drawn mine, and if you think it's RUDE of me to stand up for my rights and beliefs, then I feel sorry for you.

Robert, if you want be a loser, go ahead; if you want to tuck your tail and slink off, fine with me, but you then do not have the right to judge or condemn others if they take pride in their values enough to speak out. It's the people like YOU who make life miserable for others by being a wimp and not being assertive and protest when people take advantage of you. I think it's because people are so focused on their busy, busy lives that they can't (or won't) take any extra time out of their already stressful, hectic lives to stand up for themselves any longer, and it's like a disease that is spreading and running rampant in this country.

And because they are so busy and stressed out, they become lazy and/or forgetful; they start dropping the ball, things that are important to others are not so important to them, their focus is on themselves, not others. This is just not acceptable in certain situations (like a business you pay to perform a specific service for example), and more and more people especially if they have any sense of conviction - are becoming less and less tolerant of this lazy attitude.

And yes, unfortunately the reprobates, crooks, scam-artists, and degenerates (and those newbies just starting out in this direction some typically found selling on eBay) in this world are just waiting to take your money. But Robert, don't you dare be RUDE to them when they do!

Oh, and Robert I hope you have a mah-velous day yourself, sweetie! ;-)
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#5 Author of original report

Glad you are so responsible

AUTHOR: C - (U.S.A.)

Hello Lori. I'm very happy to hear you are such a responsible seller. I wish more people would go by your example.

Unfortunately, in your pointing out about my giving bad feedback after getting good feedback, you failed to mention one minor detail: the fact that the poster of that feedback has a 95% rating, and that their negative feedback was soooo bad that they have elected to make their feedback "private", which means nobody can see how bad it is. This particular seller had given me good feedback because I was prompt in responding to their email and paying for my purchase.

However, I paid extra for *overnight* shipping on this item, they collected the extra fees, but did not send the item out for over 7 days; and when they did, it was regular mail (not what I paid for). Additionally, they refused to refund my overnight shipping fees. Yet another fine seller on eBay! May even be related to EJNRN...

Actually, there were more than 14 eBay transactions for me, maybe you should count them again: there were a total of 16. Perhaps you need to pay more attention to details before pointing out faults of others.

People take eBay feedback WAY too seriously; you can lie, make incorrect assertions, and state issues/problems that are erroneous; who's to tell the difference? You do not know for a fact what transpired with these purchases in my case, you only see what was left in the feedback, and like most ignorant individuals (Robert included), you presume to make judgments based on what you see and not on what you know.

I give what I get, and expect to get what I give. If you do me wrong, I'm not going to let you get away with it - plain and simple.

Good for you that you've only had the one negative experience! You are among the minority. I don't buy on eBay very often because of these and other bad experiences that not only I have been subject to, but what others have gone through also.

There are a lot of horror stories, and there are more and more each day (just do a search here on eBay!). I do shop at regular stores, but sometimes they don't have what I want, so I've gone to eBay (as well as other e-trading sites) and have taken my chances. That doesn't mean I have to give up my right to speak out when I'm wronged though, as you seem to think.

And you are most welcome! I am glad to know I've done you a favor; perhaps the good eBayers will continue to be "good", and hopefully the bad and irresponsible eBayers will get a clue and straighten up. I'm sure if enough people stand up for themselves and take affirmative action when others wrong them, then perhaps all of us can then begin to expect better treatment. :-)
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#6 Author of original report

Thanx, Rita!

AUTHOR: C - (U.S.A.)

Hey Rita, s'up?? :-)

It just so happens we have one of those trees in our area too. It's a little bit of a jaunt, but hey, I'm ready for a road trip!

And BTW, you already have something you can feel great about your intelligence and sense of humor! I love it.

Thanx again for the info. Shopping, shopping, shopping! ;-)
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#7 Consumer Comment

I agree with Robert

AUTHOR: Lori - (U.S.A.)

I also went in and looked up the information that you gave, and compared both her feedback and yours. I noticed that even when you received good feedback, you added a negative comment about the seller. How nice. Fourteen transactions, and you were unhappy with three of them?

I've been Ebay-ing for several years, both as a buyer and seller, and in all of that time and in all of my transactions, I've only had ONE negative experience. Maybe you should stick to shopping at your local dollar store and stay away from Ebay. At least in this, if you're unhappy with the merchandise, you don't have to buy it in the first place.

Thanks for your original post, you did a lot of good ebayers a favor, we have a good idea of who we're working with, and who we shouldn't be.
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#8 Author of original report

Oh, Robert.... my hero, you FOUND me!!! *gag!*

AUTHOR: C - (U.S.A.)

Oh, Robert, I'm sooo glad you found me! Goody, goody! You are SUCH a smart little detective? oh, but wait! You didn't really ?detect' anything did you, since I included the item number of the transaction in my statement. Duh! And who says I have to be or act in a professional manner? Tsk, tsk. So you think I care about being put on your ?BBL?, you self-righteous twit?? Don't flatter yourself. Knowing you have the same viewpoint as good ol' EJNRN, I wouldn't want to buy from you anyway. And puh-lease stay OFF my side!

I surely do not need the likes of YOU rooting for me - this isn't about my needing or wanting 'cheerleaders'; it's a potential rip-off warning for others. Oh, and you better watch yourself there, bud? you sound a wee bit ?angry? yourself! Ha! Sounds like you think you're ?Mr. eBay?. Well by golly, let's check you out, sugar-dumplin', and see just how flawlessly perfect you are? I dare you to substantiate your self-appointed right to judge. Put your words where your mouth is? got the guts to post a transaction ID for one of the items YOU sold on eBay??? If you don't have anything to hide, that is?

I have nothing to hide, nor am I ashamed of anything I've written or said here. You betcha I'm angry, and with 100% good reason too. You are apparently one of those types who seems to think that the amount one pays for a service should be proportional to the service one receives? Hmmmm.

So, that means, say if you go to an automatic car wash and spend $5.00 getting your car washed, and while going through it one of the armatures falls off on your new car and causes $500.00 damage, do you think the owner is liable to you? If so, for what amount? According to you, not even the $5.00 you paid. You find out later that the car wash owner didn't have insurance, so you can't get your money back that way, but YOU have automotive insurance? but wait!

Unfortunately, your insurance agent ?forgot? to add the $1.45 extra you paid the week before to your policy that covers accidents like this. When you complain to the agent when he tells you you're not covered, he says sorry, he forgot to add that ?special? insurance (he is such a busy, busy agent after all!); but, he does promptly refund your $1.45! So, under the circumstances, where do you think you stand? According to your outlook, getting the $1.45 back should be ?good enough?, right?

The point here, Robert, is that it doesn't matter the *amount* of the damage, how it was damaged, or even how ?reputable? your insurance agent OR the car wash owner is; the point is, you paid money to someone to INSURE against damage, and you should rightfully expect that person to take responsibility if/when damage occurs.

Although it isn't anyone's ?fault? per se that the accident/damage happened (i.e., the car wash owner nor the insurance agent ?caused? the damage), damage has nonetheless been done and you rightfully expect compensation. EJNRN didn't actually ?cause? the damage (at least I don't think so, but the seal MAY have not been on in the first place and putting tape on the cap COULD have prevented potential leakage), she just wasn't prudent or diligent about her responsibility to ensure she put on the insurance I paid for.

And as a side note: I'll wager little miss EJNRN will definitely be more careful in the future about making sure that when someone pays extra for insurance, she'll put it on!!! ;-)

Yes, I have had a prior bad experience on eBay with another seller besides EJNRN as you saw, Robert. And who cares about how much EJNRN sells vs. how many times I've bought??? So what if she's got x-amount of feedback? Good for her for being such a busy little selling bee. I only buy on eBay under this ID. AND, unless you know both sides of the story, do not assume you know the facts nor presume to pass judgment until you do; anyone can say anything ? true or not ? and there isn't much that can be done about it ? other than having feedback ?mutually withdrawn? in case of negativity (in fact which you conveniently chose to overlook: she has one, I don't, and if for this not being withdrawn her feedback percentage would be lower than mine!).

You seem to be the type of person to find someone guilty before the whole story is told; you make your mind up and that's that. People have a tendency to think the worst of people anyway, and with the brief space in which to create an explanation on eBay feedback, there's not too much one can do to describe fully the situation.

Everybody makes mistakes (I'll even bet you do too, Robert!). As I mentioned in my statement though, it's what one DOES about them that counts. Do you shrug it off, or do you try to correct it and/or make it right? I tried to work with EJNRN for several days towards a mutually-agreeable resolution.

I didn't post negative feedback until just a few days ago ? two-1/2 weeks AFTER the purchase ? I'd given her plenty of time and opportunity to prove she was truly sorry and let her make amends. She adamantly believes she did nothing wrong (read her statement!), and feels that returning the shipping insurance of $1.45 is good enough. It's not. I paid $20.05 for two bottles of new, unopened product. I received only one ? the other was damaged beyond use. She ?forgot? the insurance, so I asked for some sort of restitution for the damages? that was only fair? so how is this possibly construed as being ?unreasonable? on my part? And how is it that I'm the one that has to suffer for her mistake?

The cost of the item nor the amount of damage is not the point. How can she in good conscience claim I'm the scam-artist? That was actually how I'd described her actions in my dispute to eBay and PayPal, and she basically cut & pasted what I said about her to them in her negative feedback about me! She'd also nabbed the statement ?hard to deal (with)? from another seller who'd left negative feedback for me (over a year ago, by the way) after they sent me damaged/used goods (supposed to have been ?new?, it had missing parts that rendered it unusable, and I paid EXTRA for FedEx overnight shipping which they actually sent slow-boat USPS that took almost a week, and BTW I never did get my *promised* refund after I returned the item; then they called me 'rude and hard to deal with' after I returned the item and they never refunded my money so I had my CC do a chargeback).

Good grief, she can't even come up with an original, negative-feedback slam! Yeah, I guess I'm hard to deal with? especially when you try to rip me off!

So, your perception of my communicating to EJNRN my expectation that she make good on the damaged item was RUDE? *News flash! Reality check!* It's called BEING ASSERTIVE - but you have a right to your perceptions and opinions? even if they happen to be wrong. Do you think if I had been ?nicer? she would have made restitution? I don't? not for a moment ? this isn't about being ?nice? or ?rude?. EJNRN was wrong when she ?forgot? to add the insurance.

Had she responded promptly in the first place with an offer to make it up to me (as a responsible, trustworthy, and honest person would have), this whole thing could have worked out quite well and would not have escalated to where it is now.

I am tired of some people working so hard to take what others have away from them ? be it their money, self-respect, dignity, sense of worth, etc. ? I refuse to continue to let others take advantage of me.

You, Robert, may let someone get away with $1.45 today, but perhaps tomorrow it may be $145.00, next year, $145,000.00 ? it adds up! Where do you draw the line? I've drawn mine, and if you think it's ?RUDE? of me to stand up for my rights and beliefs, then I feel sorry for you.

Robert, if you want be a loser, go ahead; if you want to tuck your tail and slink off, fine with me, but you then do not have the right to judge or condemn others if they take pride in their values enough to speak out. It's the people like YOU who make life miserable for others by being a wimp and not being assertive and protest when people take advantage of you.

I think it's because people are so focused on their busy, busy lives that they can't (or won't) take any extra time out of their already stressful, hectic lives to stand up for themselves any longer, and it's like a disease that is spreading and running rampant in this country. And because they are so busy and stressed out, they become lazy and/or ?forgetful?; they start dropping the ball, things that are important to others are not so important to them, their focus is on themselves, not others.

This is just not acceptable in certain situations (like a business you pay to perform a specific service for example), and more and more people ? especially if they have any sense of conviction - are becoming less and less tolerant of this lazy attitude.

And yes, unfortunately the reprobates, crooks, scam-artists, and degenerates (and those ?newbies? just starting out in this direction? some typically found selling on eBay) in this world are just waiting to take your money. But Robert, don't you dare be RUDE to them when they do!

Oh, and Robert? I hope you have a mah-velous day yourself, sweetie! ;-)
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#9 Consumer Comment

You're right

AUTHOR: Rita - (U.S.A.)

You're right on all counts.

Now, a blatant hint for finding that soap... I have a "Dollar Tree" growing in my back yard. Perhaps you might find a "Dollar Tree" growing in yours too. I bet that you could do a net search to see if a "Dollar Tree" is near you. Grins*

At any rate, my offer still stands. I'd be more than happy to send you some of that soap. In fact, I'd feel great for doing a good deed.

Smiles,
Rita
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#10 Consumer Comment

Cin...

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

After reading your report, Im glad that I found out your Ebay ID.

I was on your side until I saw your orginal response to the seller, her follow responses, and your responses to her. She responded in a professional manner, asking for proof of the damage.

Yes, she made a mistake regarding the shipping. Sometimes it does happen. I do not believe she "scammed" you for the dollar and change for insurance. Your initial request to her, as well as your responses, were unprofessional at best and downright rude.

Your feedback, compaired to hers, says a lot

YOU: Total Feedback: 14, Feedback score: 88.9%, 2 negatives (both for rude behavior), as well as a rude comment to another buyer because he was a "slow shipper."

HERS: Total Feedback: 574, Feedback score: 99.1%, with 1 negative in the last years (guess whos?)

I'm putting you on my BBL. No one should have to deal with an angry person like you.

Have a wonderful day!!

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#11 Author of original report

Thanx for your input!

AUTHOR: C - (U.S.A.)

Hi Rita, thanx for the info. Discount Junky, how cute!

Yes, I'm sure you are correct in that this Seller was just plain careless - on a couple of counts. As you mentioned, the time it would have taken her - two seconds - could have possibly prevented this from happening. Another few moments of her time to apply the shipping insurance would have pretty much guaranteed her a hassle-free transaction also.

However, based on her defensive comebacks and inability to acknowledge responsibility for her actions makes me believe that 1) she doesn't care and/or isn't intelligent enough to concern herself with the end result of her actions, and/or 2) there is a high probability she's trying to collect additional monies by defrauding people who pay extra for shipping insurance and then not applying it; she just pockets the extra money and goes on her merry way in her little fantasy world.

I'll just wager that she only refunded my insurance money because she got caught this time - not that refunding AFTER THE FACT is acceptable or reasonable of course - she's just a delusional person who doesn't think twice about the consequences of her actions.

No, I didn't realize this product could be obtained in bar form! I would love to have a source though, as the liquid form isn't found easily (and I can guarantee I won't be buying from good 'ol ENJRN anymore, nor would I suggest that anyone else do so either!) and the bars would apparently be much easier to obtain.

Thanx for the tip - I'll look around but perhaps instead of sending me one (an offer I appreciate BTW), could you mention the name of the store you find it at maybe the first few letters if you don't want to mention the whole name. :-)

Thanx for taking the time to write it's nice knowing someone else is like-minded, and the info you shared will be put to use.

Happy shopping, Discount Junky! ;-)
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#12 Consumer Comment

Thoughts from a discount junky

AUTHOR: Rita - (U.S.A.)

Dang Buyer, you're relentless but I love it. Now, my thoughts on this item you bought and it might validate you more.

I'm a discount store shopper and junky and what I find, more often than not, is that products like this one have loose fitting caps. This may be perhaps one reason some products are sent to a discount stores in the first place. I have found many products, like this one, oozing right on the shelf because of poor fitting caps. Compound this, with damage or weight on the item and what you get is a mess of trouble.

I'm betting that your seller got this item relatively cheap (slated for discount store or discount selling method of some sort) because it didn't meet with standards for normal sale. (poor/faulty packaging) and seller is selling this item for more (naturally) for profit.

Not only did your seller not insure the item(s), she perhaps could have avoided all of this by simply tightening the caps. And though your idea of taping the item is a good one, I think that if the seller would have took 2 seconds to tighten those caps, there would be no need for this rip-off report.

On the bright side of all of this. That seller must be in a world of disarray to not be will to make good on such a small amount of money so you can bet she has some way bigger problems other than being a crock.

Last but not least, I've never stumbled across this product that you bought in liquid form but did you know that you can buy it in bar form? I buy 120g/4.25oz of this soap for 1 buck a bar at a store near me and they always have it in stock. I love this soap. Heck, I'd be willing to send you some for free.

Rita
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