• Report: #830715

Complaint Review: Elite Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College

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  • Submitted: Sun, January 29, 2012
  • Updated: Fri, January 04, 2013

  • Reported By: Steve — New York New York United States of America
Elite Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College
8310 South Valley Highway, Suite 200 Englewood, CO Englewood, Colorado United States of America

Elite Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College AIMS Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College Do real medical sales recruiters push job searchers to their expensive affiliated "Medical Sales College." Englewood, Colorado

*General Comment: Medical Sales College

*Author of original report: MSC Valedictorian Still a Restaurant Server (Only Now $10,000 Poorer)

*Consumer Comment: Medical Sales College - Best Investment Ever Made

*Author of original report: No MSC: An Asian Restaurant Story

*Author of original report: "MSC" on Resume Could Hurt Applicant

*Author of original report: Psychological Projection

*Consumer Comment: Steve, you are questioning MSC when you have posted 46 times over seven months on this site alone? In fact you are the ONLY one that has posted!

*Author of original report: "Bakerj1850" is One of Medical Sales College's Many Online Aliases

*Consumer Comment: That Answers That!!!

*Consumer Comment: Im not buying it 300 nos in one day?

*UPDATE Employee: MSC Update

*Consumer Comment: Interesting

*General Comment: Comments to Steve

*Author of original report: 3-Year Extension of MSC's License to Steal

*Author of original report: Another For-Profit School Victim

*Author of original report: Beware of MSC's Placement Claims. They Continue to Refuse Answering Two Simple Questions.

*Author of original report: Another Scripted Rebuttal. Still Think MSC is Legit?

*General Comment: Thought I'd Give it a Try

*Author of original report: Another MSC Smokescreen Response to "Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get "

*Consumer Comment: Steve is a SICK HUMAN BEING!

*Author of original report: MSC's Smokescreen Response to "Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get "

*Consumer Comment: Experience -vs- Agenda

*Author of original report: Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get

*Consumer Comment: Steve It is official, on your 38th update you continue your psychopathic ways!

*Author of original report: Another Fake Future MSC Student

*Consumer Comment: Steve, four-years selling non-orthopedic devices and you call yourself an expert? You are a joke!

*Author of original report: MSC is an Education Scam, I'm Not a Competitive Recruiter

*Author of original report: MSC Sounds Exactly Like a Modeling School

*Author of original report: Do All Advertised EliteMed Jobs Really Exist?

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: YES! The jobs are real!

*Author of original report: EliteMed-MSC Will Not Answer This One Simple Question

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Who's More Credible? You Decide.

*Author of original report: MSC Certification on Resume Can Hurt Jobseeker

*Author of original report: Medical Sales College is an Educational Scam

*Author of original report: EliteMed-MSC Dodges Questions by Attacking Inquisitor

*UPDATE Employee: One Hour Later...

*UPDATE Employee: Why would someone post 29 times who hasn't attended the college or admittedly been "ripped off"? What does he have to gain through daily posting?

*Author of original report: EliteMed-MSC is Nonselective. Also, They Use Fake Job Ads to Lure Students.

*Author of original report: Not all Scams are Absolute Scams

*Author of original report: Check Out All These Modeling School Testimonials

*Author of original report: If MSC is so selective, then how come the EliteMed recruiter just tried to hard sell you MSC?

*Author of original report: Like All For-Profit Colleges, MSC is Non-Selective and Targets Student Loans

*Author of original report: MSC is Like Bad Contractor Who Occasionally Moves to Different State, Only to Continue Same Bad Tactics

*Consumer Comment: MSC is NOT Respected

*Consumer Comment: MSC is NOT Respected

*Author of original report: EliteMed-MSC is No Hall of Justice

*UPDATE Employee: Director of Social Media

*Author of original report: MSC will argue they are government licensed. Guess what, so was Bernie Madoff.

*Author of original report: EliteMed & MSC Continue to Post Fake Testimonials

*Consumer Comment: 27 More Medical Sales College Placements in the last 21 days!

*Author of original report: Medical Sales College and Their Fake Testimonials

*Consumer Comment: Steve is the FRAUD... Medical Sales College is accurate

*Author of original report: EliteMed-MSC Targeting Taxpayer Dollars Via Student Loans

*Author of original report: That EliteMed Job You Applied For Doesn't Really Exist

*Author of original report: Medical Sales College Grads at a Disadvantage

*Author of original report: MSC Certificate vs. Masters Degree-- a False ROI Argument

*Consumer Comment: SQUIDRACULA POEM.......

*Author of original report: Fresh Fish Shouldn't Smell Fishy

*Consumer Comment: I Agree that it's a Scam

*Author of original report: Certificate Useless Once Granting Institution Changes its Name

*Author of original report: Anatomy of a Fake MSC Testimonial

*Author of original report: Elite's unethical loophole. By definition, no recruiter should ever charge the candidate.

*Author of original report: Medical Sales College Mincing Words (As Usual)

*Author of original report: Elite-MSC Continues to Post Questionable Testimonials

*Consumer Comment: Face it...It works!

*Author of original report: MSC distancing itself from AIMS? In name perhaps, but not in practice.

*Author of original report: Elite-MSC Will Probably Blame Their Victims

*Author of original report: Questions to Ask Elite Recruiting and Medical Sales College

*Author of original report: Elite/Medical Sales College Ethics

*Consumer Comment: Medical Sales College - From a real student

*Author of original report: Other Common Arguments by Medical Sales College

*Author of original report: Some Common Tricks Used by Elite-Medical Sales College

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Best way to learn about the Medical Sales College or Elite Med - Talk to former students and placements

*Author of original report: Some Common Arguments You'll Hear From Elite-MSC

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: When you're the best, somebody is losing business

*Author of original report: Elite-MSC is basically classic Modeling School scam

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Elite Medical Sales Recruiting was once called AIMS. Was this due to the great number of SCAM allegations and complaints AIMS received?  Google "AIMS Medical Sales Recruiting" to read all people have to say. http://elitemed.com/

There is a company out there called Elite Medical Sales Recruiting (formerly AIMS Medical Sales Recruiting) that posts all over Monster.com, CareerBuilder and other jobs boards. Their ads look exactly like traditional recruiter ads, so many sales reps unquestioningly forward them resumes. What happens next is as follows:

1) A "recruiter" from Elite calls the job seeker and tells him or her that their resume looks good and that there are medical sales jobs in the job seeker's area. Elite calls even those not currently in a medical sales position. Most recruiters will not do this, so this is a red flag.

2) The "recruiter" then sends you an email describing their program and affiliation with a "Medical Sales College." This is a giant red flag.

3) This same recruiter then says another Elite recruiter in your area will contact you regarding medical sales opportunities near you. In reality, what this next recruiter does is tell you your resume will not land you a medical sales job unless you take a course from their affiliated Medical Sales College. This, in my opinion, reveals that Elite/AIMS/Medical Sales College work together to extract most of their money from job seekers.

4) Elite currently claims to charge a flat $2,000 off hiring companies, but I suspect they did this due to all the allegations that they are not legitimate recruiters. AIMS used to advertised that hiring companies are NOT charged any fees.

5) Elite/AIMS tell everyone that their company has a solid Better Business Bureau rating. To me, this is misleading, since BBB is an agency that companies pay for. BBB is, in effect, is a marketing/advertising service.

6) Elite/AIMS makes most of its money from job seekers. Traditional recruiters  charge million/billion dollar companies, not job seekers. The $2,000 they charge hiring companies is a small portion of their actual business--which is selling education much like University of Phoenix, Kaplan University, etc.

7) The current fee for the Medical Sales College course is approximately $5,000. Since consumers are not guaranteed a medical sales position, and since the course is not an MBA, then essentially the degree is worthless unless one lands a medical sales job with it.***

Four questions:
1) Is Elite Medical Sales Recruiting a SCAM?
2) Why did AIMS change its name to Elite?
3) Are there any current lawsuits against these people?
4) Is there any value to a Medical Sales College course?

In my opinion, AIMS/Elite Medical Sales Recruiting and their affiliated Medical Sales College is one big SCAM. And no, I am not a recruiter, but someone these people tried to rip off. 



This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 01/29/2012 01:22 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Elite-Medical-Sales-Recruiting-Medical-Sales-College/Englewood-Colorado-80112/Elite-Medical-Sales-Recruiting-Medical-Sales-College-AIMS-Medical-Sales-Recruiting-Medic-830715. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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48Author 24Consumer 4Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 General Comment

Medical Sales College

AUTHOR: Todd - ()

I am the CEO of a medical device company.  Look me up.  I have recently begun looking at the Medical Sales College to help us place new representatives in territories where they are needed.  I have not hired a graduate yet, however we plan to hire between 5 and 10 in the next few months.  Admittedly, this is an experiment.  We will assess the actual results over the coming months.

However, prior to engaging MSC, I did some research.  I visited the school.  The settings are excellent.  They teach students all that they need to break into this field and literally hit the ground running.  Most importantly, they teach surgeon targeting and how to approach surgeons.  This particular area of establishing surgeon relationships and selling to surgeons seemed to be the finest I have ever seen.  It is highly researched, strategic, and applies only to this extremely specialized sales area.  This is among the most lucrative sales positions, and it is also very challenging.  It is a very tough field.  Surgeons are often millionaires with countless people trying to sell to them constantly.  The simple, unavoidable truth is that some MSC graduates will not succeed even after they make excellent grades at the school.  Academic success is very different from real world success.  I have also spoken with other executives that work in my industry who have hired MSC graduates.  Some work out well, some do not.  Some from MSC become their company’s top performing sales reps.

The school is clearly legit.  But, that doesn’t mean everyone will be able to make it in the real medical device sales world.  I would say that if you want an opportunity to make many hundreds of thousands of dollars annually, have great interpersonal skills strong enough to credibly interact with surgeons, and an intense, driven work ethic then checking into this may aid you in achieving your goals.  We’re going to hire some targeted graduates, and many in our industry have done so as well.

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#2 Author of original report

MSC Valedictorian Still a Restaurant Server (Only Now $10,000 Poorer)

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at the post by "Becker Sams" directly above and notice that it contains the same old MSC rhetoric of prior entries. Becker obviously works for EliteMed- Medical Sales College.

What he fails to mention, of course, is that the Thai restaurant server who wrote the mentioned Linkedin profile is a Medical Sales College Valedictorian.

If their top graduate can't find a medical sales position, how effective could their program be? Again, only a sucker will fall for their program.
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#3 Consumer Comment

Medical Sales College - Best Investment Ever Made

AUTHOR: Becker Sams - (United States of America)


I feel inclined to respond as this agenda-driven person known as Steve continues to post on this site. It is still unknown what his real name or profession might be! However, he has posted here and on other sites looking to mislead people on the good work and the countless number of jobs that the Medical Sales College has assisted.

In his most recent attempt, you will notice how he portrays an individual as a victim based on the fact that he or she attended the Medical Sales College and currently (assuming the LinkedIn account has been updated) has not been placed in a job in the industry of medical sales. He goes on to say that the college should have never accepted this person because of the lack of his or her selling experience. He concurrently posts the identical message on several other blog sites expressing his opinion and making one last statement how putting MSC on a resume is like putting sucker on a resume.
Please keep in mind that he started this thread on this site and several others over the course of the last 12 months at a minimum!

I have a different point of view than this individual because I actually ATTENDED the educational program. I have been very vocal in my continued support of the program. I was a recent college graduate with limited experience and this program was exactly what delivered me not only into the profession of medical sales, but as a prepared representative. Like many
people, I submitted hundreds of resumes without even a single call back from a recruiter. Once I finished the program, I had several opportunities with device positions. I have recommended this program to several friends who have completed and ALL are employed!

Think about it, this guy makes mention that he has never attended the college and have been the lone negative responder on this and several other sites. As the Author of this thread, he has posted an amazing 49 times in just less than one year! Reallyno agenda? Why would someone with nothing to gain nor lost spend so much effort?

Like the story in his last post he looks to find an angle to defame the college. What he doesnt tell you is the truth! Sure, it is
unbelievably difficult to get into this profession even if you had tremendous selling experience. With NO experience or as in the example he used as a server, it would be for most people impossible! This is yet another example of how powerful and demanded the graduates are from the Medical Sales College. If you spend a few minutes on LinkedIn, I suggest you try this advanced search. Use the Medical Sales College as the school and server as the keyword. You will see 11 results, in which all 11 attended the Medical Sales College all with backgrounds  as a food-server. 10 of the 11 have graduated from the program while 1 is still attending. 7 of the 10 who have graduated have positions as medical sales representatives. In fact, 5
of the 7 work for the top device companies including Depuy, Biomet and Arthrex. Would have these individuals been able to get those jobs without MSC? No way! 4 out of the 10 have server as their last position before attending the college.
3 of the 4 have jobs now in medical sales! The only one that does not to date, is this individual. That is a 70% placement rate of the group and 75% of the focus group!

I guess Steve forgot to mention thatlol

For those of you who really want to know about the Medical Sales College, please feel free to reach out to me. I have several other colleagues that I can have you call as well!

Best of luck in your job search!

Becker Sams
Jackson, Mississippi
bbsams@gmail.com
601-594-1010
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#4 Author of original report

No MSC: An Asian Restaurant Story

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

***All I have written in this Ripoff Report and elsewhere are just my opinion. I do not present anything as fact, but I provide the information in order to get readers to think critically about modern day snake oil salesmen. Again, I am not a competitor of EliteMed-MSC, but an actual person who they tried to rip off.***

Below is a current Linkedin profile of a Medical Sales College graduate who completed the program way back in July 2012... approximately 6 months ago. The information was uploaded by the person for the public to see, so here is my opinion of it. The person's name was removed since the goal here is not to add insult to injury to the victim, but to expose EliteMed-MSC and perhaps get them to actually take action assisting this particular victim find a job. If a rebuttal states the victim actually obtained a medical sales job through EliteMed-MSC, then fantastic.

This person should never have been "accepted" by MSC since he or she will have a difficult time breaking into medical sales because of the following reasons:

1) Lack of outside sales experience, i.e., copier sales, window sales, medical sales, etc.

2) Lack of general sales experience beyond up-selling food specials and painting services.

3) Graduated from college after 5 years, while many college athletes are doing so in 4. (May not pass the Gallup, Wonderlic, etc. administered by many device companies.)

4) Job hopped, except while at Outback Steakhouse for 4 years, 4 months during college.

Of course, that's not how this for-profit college works. EliteMed probably told this person:

1) A BS in Kinesiology makes one competitive even if one does not possess true sales experience. (Talk about BS.)

2) Many MSC students obtain job interviews while still in the program or shortly afterwards. 

3) A vast majority of MSC graduates find work in medical sales. (They claim 81%, 86%... no one ever thinks they will be part of the smaller percentage who never find medical sales work.)

4) No college guarantees jobs.... MSC's favorite disclaimer. (Of course, 100% of all medical school graduates actually find work as MDs... but this is an inconvenient truth. The reason for this is selectivity: US medical schools accept only a small percentage of the best applicants, and hence all of their graduates find work in the field. MSC, on the other hand, accepts anyone who can pay. Keep in mind EliteMed sells MSC.)

So what happens to MSC grads who don't find work in medical sales within 6 months?

1) The further from graduation, the more irrelevant the MSC certificate. MDs train for 8 years, not 8 weeks, so how much knowledge could MSC grads possibly retain from a 2 month program, 6 months after graduation?

2) An MSC certificate is not an MBA since it can really only be used for a medical sales position. Therefore, if one doesn't obtain a medical sales job with a Medical Sales College certificate, then what actual value does the graduate get? NONE!

So what happened to the advertised job for which the victim forwarded EliteMed his or her resume?

1) Again, the position probably
never existed. It was just bait to lure one into submitting a resume. (When EliteMed called to pitch me, they refused to tell me about the advertised position in my area. The "recruiter" kept saying that a "local recruiter" would call me about it. Of course, EliteMed planted the MSC seed during our conversation.)

2) EliteMed probably told the victim that a Medical Sales College certificate enhances one's candidacy in the eyes of medical device hiring managers. Unfortunately here, the victim still works in the same Thai restaurant months after graduation... only now $10,000 poorer! (Imagine if MSC is able to offer non-dischargeable student loans. Disaster.)

3) "MSC" on a resume, in my opinion, is like putting "SUCKER" on a resume.

Actual Linkedin profile:

Current
Server at Basil Thai Cuisine


Past
Student at Medical Sales College

Cocktail Server at Vida Mexican Kitchen y Cantina
Server at Outback Steakhouse

Education
Medical Sales College
James Madison University

Connections
90 connections

Actively seeking a medical device sales position within an organization that provides challenging assignments, opportunity for career growth in a professional and dynamic environment. 

Willing to relocate for the right opportunity. 

Energetic, hardworking, and goal oriented outside sales professional with solid qualifications in customer relations and sales strategy execution. Proven ability to reach target market, develop new business, and increase sales with new and established clientele. Persuasive communicator with strong deal closing abilities; well organized; and excellent time management skills.

Server
Basil Thai Cuisine
June 2011 Present (1 year 7 months) Charlotte, North Carolina

Part of an intimate team ,hand selected by the owner to uphold the set standards of service and to build and maintain relationships with the patrons
Student

Medical Sales College
Privately Held; 11-50 employees; Medical Devices industry
May 2012 July 2012 (3 months) Charlotte, North Carolina Area


Excelled in a completive environment being awarded Valedictorian for demonstrating exceptional dedication and hard work 
Developed a strong foundation of knowledge related to anatomy, physiology, pathology, biomechanics, and medical terminology to effectively communicate with surgeon customers.
Reviewed Operating Room protocol and the sterile field to effectively navigate the hospital environment.
Acquired a comprehensive understanding of the products and procedures involved in orthopedic medicine including: total joint reconstruction, fracture management, internal and external fixation devices, surgical releases, sports medicine products, and orthobiologic products.
Participated in 30+ hours of role-playing to develop competency in building rapport and converting sales.
Identified the target market for orthopedic surgeons in the Charlotte, NC area; Prepared more than 25 surgeonprofiles and developed an actionable business plan for territory development

Cocktail Server
Vida Mexican Kitchen y Cantina
September 2009 May 2010 (9 months) Charlotte, North Carolina Area

Worked in multiple facets of restaurant, upholding service standards, customer satisfaction and restaurant promotion while continually producing record sales
Selected as part of the training and employee development team for future employees and new store openings 
Chosen to assist in the development of a training program for new employees and new store openings 
Actively involved in the organizing and execution of promotional events with the Checkers; onsite advertising, pregame/post game parties hosted at the store, and fundraising events
Server
Outback Steakhouse
Public Company; 10,001+ employees; Restaurants industry
February 2006 May 2010 (4 years 4 months)

Personally chosen by the General Manager/Store Partner to travel to help train and open a brand new Outback Steakhouse 
Continued to develop sales skills, winning a majority of in-store and regional personal sale's goal competitions 
Selected to represent Outback Steakhouse with onsite catering for promotional and charitable events 
Key member involved in the transition of store owners and new system structure by effectively adapting to the new management team and styles, eagerly learning the new computer systems and leading by example to motivate others to embrace the opportunity
Branch Manager
College Works Painting
Privately Held; 1001-5000 employees; Construction industry
August 2005 August 2006 (1 year 1 month) Frederick, MD

Actively sought out business in target areas and gaining experience in the art of successful cold calling, identifying potential customer's needs, conducting estimates, building relationships with potential client and closing the sales
Capitalizing on valuable sales skills in combination with strong work ethics and communication abilities to successfully sell and produce over 100K in revenue while maintaining excellent GPA as a fulltime student 
Hands on experience with customer relations, employee relations, advanced problem solving, and effective communication practices

Medical Sales College
Academy Program, Orthopedic Sales
2012 2012

James Madison University
Bachelor of Science (B.S.), Kinesiology
2005 2010
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#5 Author of original report

"MSC" on Resume Could Hurt Applicant

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

As more and more medical device companies, recruiters and hiring managers become aware of the deceitful manner in which Medical Sales College (MSC) recruits students through fake EliteMed job advertisements, more and more are realizing that MSC graduates are simply victims of an education scam. Therefore, "MSC" on one's resume actually says one is a non-savvy business person.

Think about it, what ever happened to the advertised job for which you forwarded EliteMed your resume? 

The truth is, it never existed. It was simply bait to lure you into paying MSC. 

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#6 Author of original report

Psychological Projection

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Psychological projection or projection bias is a psychological defense mechanism where a person subconsciously denies his or her own attributes, thoughts, and emotions, which are then ascribed to the outside world, usually to other people. Thus, projection involves imagining or projecting the belief that others originate those feelings.

One can readily see MSC's projection in the following:
1) They claim that all the entries against them on this blog and elsewhere are from just one person. The truth is, all the "different people" defending MSC are in fact just MSC. 

2) They claim that I hit all the "Yeses" after my posts and all the "Nos" after theirs. The truth is, only MSC has the capability of clicking the buttons thousands of times, since they have many employees with many computers. 

3) They allege that I am not someone they tried to scam, but in fact a recruiter losing money to their "recruiting arm" EliteMed. The reality is, they are the ones pretending to be something they are not, since EliteMed is not a recruiter for companies at all. Instead, its sole function is to recruit victims for MSC. Also, the only party losing money is MSC due to the attempts of many to expose their fraud. 




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#7 Consumer Comment

Steve, you are questioning MSC when you have posted 46 times over seven months on this site alone? In fact you are the ONLY one that has posted!

AUTHOR: Bakerj1850 - (United States of America)

Enough said for any intelligent person!

See Author Steve
New York on every single posting 



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#8 Author of original report

"Bakerj1850" is One of Medical Sales College's Many Online Aliases

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Any smart person can see that Medical Sales College wrote the two posts directly above this one. In fact, the author's diction is consistent with Shannon Marshall's.

Also, I've always wondered who hit all the "Yeses" for my entries and all the "Nos" for EliteMed Recruiting-Medical Sales College's, until it dawned on me--they themselves did...in an effort to distract you from their con. 

Their strategy to discredit my report is almost as well thought out as their for-profit college scam. Seriously, what non-MSC person would take the time to compose such rebuttals? None. 
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#9 Consumer Comment

That Answers That!!!

AUTHOR: Bakerj1850 - (United States of America)

See my previous post on October 7th. 

It is confirmed that this whole thread is one person that has something to gain by blogging the college. As you can see from my last post, I noted that in a matter of hours some person checked "NO" 311 times in the same day. The original post from Mrs. Marshall was on September 24th! See my post on October 7th. Again, since that day (10 days) not a SINGLE person has checked "yes" or "no". Furthermore, not a SINGLE person has responded on my post as well! 

I am sure when the predator returns, he/she will once again use the same method.

Since my last post, I have spoken with four former graduates of MSC all with jobs all very happy with the choice they made. I am confident that I too made the right decision to take this pathway.

My suggestion to anyone interested in the college is to call the school as they will give you a list of local graduates in your area that you can speak with about their experience. 

This blog site is obviously nothing more than someone posting looking for some kind of gain. I guess you or I should have figured that out when the same Author is the only one that ever posted on this and other sites.

I will be sure to follow this with an update once I have completed the course! 
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#10 Consumer Comment

Im not buying it 300 nos in one day?

AUTHOR: Bakerj1850 - (United States of America)

I have been following this college for the last couple weeks. I wasnt necessarily surprised to see the college on a blog. I would have assumed that with the hundreds of people that have attended and have been placed, they still have a small group that did not get a job. In that case, I expected to see a couple unhappy people.

This is where the story gets funny! I can see it is obviously one person and never more so than today! I was about to make a post on Friday but was tied up with work. I noticed through reading this site on Friday that it was the same joker posting, and most likely the college in its rebuttal. Mrs. Marshall had made a very good point in an earlier comment about the number of people that have responded yes or no after each posting from Steve. I agreed with Mrs. Marshall, as it would be highly unlikely that in a matter of minutes hundreds of people would be reading the article/post and then would respond! Well, that was quickly proven over this weekend

On Friday afternoon while reading, I noticed that unlike all the other posts the last three for September had ZERO negative responses. The funny thing was the postings had been on the site between two and three weeks! I pull up the site today and in a matter of hours 311 people clicked no? So let me get this straight, for a couple weeks not a single person clicks the box and in hours 311 people do?

Caught ya!!!!
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#11 UPDATE Employee

MSC Update

AUTHOR: Shannon Marshall - (United States of America)

Having not posted to this site since March 26th, I thought it was about time for an update. Scott, we appreciate you sharing your experience (and that of your wife) since so many of the people who are reading these blogs are just like you guys trying to make sense and sift through all of the garbage for nuggets of truth.

I find it interesting that Steve has not made any negative comments to this site since his last post on Friday, June 1st. Even more interesting is that after months of consistent, even daily, posts on CafePharma there has been virtually no activity there in that same corresponding time frame. Seems that Steve has had other things to do the last 3 months 

The reason, of course, is that the Medical Sales College is and has always been a legit school. Our placement rates are at an all-time high. (Placement rates are up to 85.09% as of this morning for 2011 graduates and at 80.95% for all graduates of 8-week programs who graduated more than 90 days ago.)

Our placement services provider, EliteMed Recruiting has over 500 positions they are seeking to fill nationwide and the vast majority of those positions are with employers who have expressed specific interest in our MSC graduates. EliteMed has had success because hiring managers know what to expect from an EliteMed candidate (very often, but not always, an MSC graduate).
 
If you are among those people (like Scott and his wife) who are trying to make a decision, please contact me and I will be happy to provide references (we have dozens of former students who are happy to take calls or respond to emails on their free time to share their experience with you) or answer your questions as directly as possible.

To see placement activity on our Facebook page, please visit: www.facebook.com/medicalsalescollege
 
To see over 200 of our recently placed Medical Sales College graduates, please visit our website at: http://medicalsalescollege.com/recently-hired-msc-grads/

Also visit our YouTube channel, where we have over 50 videos from employers, graduates, and surgeons who talk about their experience with MSC:
http://www.youtube.com/user/medicalsalescollege?feature=results_main

Regards,
Shannon Marshall
(303) 407-3393
Director of Marketing, Medical Sales College
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#12 Consumer Comment

Interesting

AUTHOR: newb - (United States of America)

So, im thinking of trying to get into orthopedic sales, and have done a little searching for what it would take to delve into this field.  I was interested in taking a sales training program that would give me an understanding of what a sales position would entail.

After reading through many articles, press releases, critiques and this thread I have the following comments:

Steve, I applaud you in taking on this crusade against MSC and AIMS, I think you have brought up many important points that lead to many questions being asked about these two entities.  I do hope that your intentions are pure and are intended to notify potential customers as to the questionable business practices of these companies/people, and do NOT have ulterior motives.  I most definitely think that your focus on this thread has been borderline obsessive, however, that does not mean that your points are not valid.

There is definitely something that smells fishy about this organization and recruiting techniques.  I guess really the only way to find out is to ask an orthopedic sales recruiter directly, if MSC assists in candidates acquiring positions.

To the owners and/or employees of this organization.  I am NOT Steve who has written above, just an interested by-standard who WOULD very much hope that this program or any other like it exists and is beneficial to those trying to better themselves and take the next step in their careers.  That being said, I am still on the hunt for any type of program or trainee education that could help in getting a foot in the door in this field.  If anyone can provide details or information to such a program that would be great!  Thanks.
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#13 General Comment

Comments to Steve

AUTHOR: scottw46750 - (United States of America)

I wanted to get on here and reply to Steve.  My wife is interested in getting into medical sales so one day she came to me with an idea to attend the Medical Sales College.  I was worried at first because she had a good paying job and we just got married 3 months ago.  I started looking on the internet to research this school to see if it was legit.  My wife is now in her 2nd week at the school.  I miss her dearly but I am thinking it is going to be worth it.  She said it is a very legit school when I asked her about it.  She said she is learning so much and it is very difficult. 

I guess what I am trying to get at is that if this is something she wants to do there is NO way a prospective employer would look down upon what she is learning here as a negative.  It can do nothing but help her in the process of getting into this career that she is interested in.  If it pans out the cost of sending her to this will be well worth it in the long run.

I don't know this Steve guy but I do know that I am a real person that has a real person in the program and I'm glad we decided on her going.

We will see if this program helps my wife get a job but I guarantee you it isn't going to hurt her chances.

My name:  Scott Winter
                 Huntington, IN 46750
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#14 Author of original report

3-Year Extension of MSC's License to Steal

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) recently released to Yahoo Finance a cleverly disguised advertisement about the extension of their Colorado license for a further 3 years.

What MSC conveniently fails to mention is that Allison Sherry, of the Denver Post, wrote that [for-profit] colleges have found fertile ground to operate in Colorado because the state has not required much to open a campus or a storefront school. 

This link to the Denver Post article shows it was published around when MSC first opened, suggesting that MSCs license indeed did not require much to obtain. http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14209838   .
     
Of course, what is even more interesting is that MSCs press release boasts that 72% of their graduates in 2011 found jobs in medical sales. This raises the following questions:

1) If their claim of an 81% placement rate in 2010 and a 72% rate in 2011 were true, then how can MSC also claim to have placed 500 graduates since they opened, when their press release clearly says MSC has now trained in excess of 1,000 students through its medical sales educational platform? Doesnt this necessarily mean that less than 50% of their students found jobs in the field?

2) Also, who placed these graduates, MSC, EliteMed Recruiting or both? For all we know, graduates placed themselves, thereby nullifying the implied purpose of EliteMed as recruiting for companies, not just for MSC.

3) Finally, where is the proof for their 72% placement claim? For whatever reason, MSC refuses to provide the information. 

Instead, MSC directs readers to research their placement data directly from the state, or through links that ultimately fail to answer how they calculated the 72% figure. We will never know for sure if the 72% is based on all of their 2011 students, just their graduates or, perhaps, on only those at the top of their classes.

MSC continues to lure potential students through unsubstantiated press releases, fake EliteMed job advertisements, and aggressive recruitment tactics. They think that repeating claims often enough will make them facts. 

Im not buying it, and neither should you. Again, all I have written are just my opinions. Caveat emptor, let the buyer beware.

Link to MSCs cleverly disguised advertisement (a.k.a., their press release): http://finance.yahoo.com/news/medical-sales-college-announces-3-174900307.html   .
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#15 Author of original report

Another For-Profit School Victim

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Whether it's Medical Sales College, Barbizon School of Modeling or California Culinary Academy, despite some success stories, for-profit educational programs often cannot deliver on their promises.

Read what happened to Nick Keith at a for-profit school he graduated from almost ten years ago. Today, Nick is not employed in the field he studied, while his non-dischargeable student loans have ballooned to approximately $142,000.

From today's Yahoo Finance article:
"He fell for their sales pitch, hook line and sinker

"I should have seen all the signs. [The campus tour guide] had a used car salesman answer for everything," Keith recalls.

The magic number was always 99 percentwhether Keith asked how many enrolled students graduated or how many graduates scored jobs afterward.  

Feeling confident, Keith took out $46,000 in private loans."

Link to full article:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/this-bright-eyed-young-man-was-utterly-demolished-by-student-loans.html
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#16 Author of original report

Beware of MSC's Placement Claims. They Continue to Refuse Answering Two Simple Questions.

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Like scam modeling schools, Medical Sales College (MSC) is quick to capitalize on success stories. They blindside potential victims with long placement lists of verifiable and unverifiable graduates named Michelle K., Kristine E., Scott C., Caroline R., etc.

If their advertised 71% to 81% placement rates are indeed accurate, then why does MSC continue avoiding these two questions:

1) What percentage of every single MSC student , since MSC's opening, found medical sales jobs through EliteMed-MSC?

2) How does EliteMed-MSC determine its percentage placement rate
? (For instance, is it based on all students or just their valedictorians?)

Chances are, they will not answer these questions here. Instead, readers will be directed to links that ultimately fails to answer these questions.

My guess is, at least half of all MSC graduates never find work in medical sales. Instead, many are left with significant student debt and a worthless medical sales certificate.

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#17 Author of original report

Another Scripted Rebuttal. Still Think MSC is Legit?

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at the entry directly above from "HelloSteve" and notice that it follows the same exact arguments as Scott Binder and medsalesjason from EliteMed-Medical Sales College (MSC).

The post coincidentally:

1) Blindly praises MSC.

2) Uses Scott Binder's misguided "credentials" attack. Ripoff Report author never claims to be an expert at anything. He instead only ever claims to be someone who MSC tried to rip off, and he expresses his 1st Amendment protected opinions on why he believes MSC is an education scam.

3) Echoes MSC's investment argument that an education doesn't guarantee a job. This is a faulty argument since almost all medical school graduates in the US find work as physicians. The rest often become researchers. On the other hand, many MSC grads never break into medical sales. They are simply stuck with a specific certification that is essentially useless in other fields.

4) Name drops a large device company the same way Scott Binder does.

5) Makes the claim that its author is considering attending MSC.

An intelligent person can immediately see that "HelloSteve" is really either an owner or employee of MSC. No unaffiliated person makes the same exact arguments, or takes the time to write a scripted rebuttal on MSC's behalf. Still think MSC is legit?
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#18 General Comment

Thought I'd Give it a Try

AUTHOR: HelloSteve - (United States of America)

Since I've spent the last 45 minutes reading through this lengthy chain of comments I figured I would go ahead and respond. I'm considering attending the Medical Sales College and was trying to see if it was a legitimate thing. Steve, you have posted some interesting comments that I will certainly look into before enrolling. Likewise, whoever it was the responded most recently also had some good points.

I am currently in the interview process for Zimmer and have no previous sales experience. During my interview I asked my interviewer if Medical Sales College would be beneficial. This man, who has been in the industry for 15 years now, said it would be beneficial but would not guarantee me a job. Therefore I have my doubts that attending would hurt my resume. But I also understand that it is a bit of a gamble but then again so was attending 4 years of college and spending far more than $10,000. 

I am afraid that I must slightly question your credentials, Steve, as you claim to be an expert on everything but seem to struggle for getting the job you want. I don't intend for this to be an attack on you, but you seem very agains MSC, which is fine. There are other medical sales colleges out there. For others interested, I believe there is one in Boston area called PrepMD. I am still in the process of kind of comparing colleges I guess before I make a decision, provided I do not get the job beforehand. 
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#19 Author of original report

Another MSC Smokescreen Response to "Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get "

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Read medsalesjason's entry directly above and ask yourself if it sounds like it was written by a future MSC student. Its writing style is different from the other medsalesjason posts, but its content is identical since it:

1) angrily attacks the author of this Ripoff Report.
2) praises MSC.
3) avoids the valid questions raised in this blog.
4) uses the same EliteMed-MSC arguments.

The entry even says "in [G]oggling information about licensing and regulation of schools in Colorado, I pulled up this article a few weeks ago."

Is it possible that a few weeks before this Ripoff Report mentioned Colorado's easy for-profit school licensing requirements, that this "future MSC student" somehow researched the same topic? Unlikely.

What's more credible is that MSC uses "medsalesjason" to anonymously attack anyone trying to exposed their program as being an education scam. What legitimate college behaves this way? None!

Their latest entry is simply another diversionary response to the following earlier post: 

EliteMed attempts to convince potential MSC students that their school is state licensed and highly regulated, so therefore cannot be a scam. It turns out, consistent with their deceitful recruitment tactics, their state license is also questionable since it did not require much to obtain.

Allison Sherry of The Denver Post in her article entitled "STATE, FEDS DIFFER ON SCHOOL REGULATION," says that colleges have found fertile ground to operate in Colorado because the state has not required much to open a campus or a storefront school.

That is evident in the numbers: 466 schools are authorized by state officials to operate [in Colorado], yet the federal government allows only 112 of those schools to give out loan dollars and Pell grants.

RECRUITERS PAID TO AGGRESSIVELY ENROLL 
Critics say problems often begin the moment potential students reach out to the for-profit college. Colleges are allowed to compensate admissions representatives based, in part, on the number of students they sign up. Critics say that makes the process less of a counseling session and more of a sales job. "Whenever you pay someone such as a recruiter based on numbers they bring in, you're just opening the door for abuse," said Rich Williams, a higher education associate with the Public Interest Research Group in Washington.

Link to full article: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14209838
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#20 Consumer Comment

Steve is a SICK HUMAN BEING!

AUTHOR: medsalesjason - (United States of America)

This is just another fine example of the inept knowledge and agenda driven campaign from the same guy that has updated 39 times just on this report alone.

Seeming how MSC continues to perform at an unsullied level, this agenda driven buffoon continues his record-setting pace of posting. His latest ramblings revolve around two specific things. Avoiding the debate of actual graduate experiences or testimonials and now licensing and the process involved. Neither would I say his aforementioned background holds any credence to representation on the subject.

To think for a second that the State of Colorado or any other agency has no jurisdiction or authority to regulate and punish any school in violation of practices, is just plain idiotic in nature. Watching his pathological processes in hope to sway possible public opinion about the school is an obvious agenda item for this sick human being. Now making that statement,
this is exactly how a blog site such as this or CafePharma makes its money. Its all about publishing garbage to drive conversations or competitive agendas.

Because I have made a commitment to the completion of my medical sales certification, I will defend. I actually have spoken with both: employers and now former students of this great organization. I have only heard positive things in every single conversation.

In goggling information about licensing and regulation of schools in Colorado, I pulled up this article a few weeks ago. The article is talking about another college in Colorado that has been disciplined through local agencies. Obviously the state agencies are watching closely to college practices.


March 14, 2012

Westwood College Settles With Colorado Over Claims That Students Were Deceived

By Goldie Blumenstyk

Westwood College reached a settlement Tuesday with Colorado's attorney general, who had accused the company of deceiving prospective students about costs, transferability of credits, and the jobs and salaries of its graduates. The for-profit college, which has 17 campuses in six states as well as an online division, will now be required to make clear
disclosures about a variety of recruiting claims.

Westwood, owned by the privately held Alta Colleges Inc., also agreed to pay the state $2-million in penalties, restitution, and legal fees, and to pay an additional $2.5-million in restitution to students who borrowed from a college-run loan program to cover some of their tuition.

As part of the settlement, Westwood agreed that its admissions interviews will be subject to monitoring by the attorney general for three years, and that it will submit yearly audits of the data it uses to prepare reports on the employment of its graduates. In its complaint, the attorney general's office said its investigation found that Westwood misrepresented
and falsified its job-placement statistics by counting students as employed in their field even if those jobs had little to do with their field of study.

Point being in this article, it quickly shows how the state
will intervene and prosecute in the event of any inaccuracies of a school.

Furthermore, in an example of comparing a flawless ran
operation such as MSC versus this college, just compare obtainable information
like the Better Business Bureau.

Westwood College had 72 complaints over the last 3 years! (http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/schools-business-and-vocational/westwood-college-in-denver-co-4694)

Medical Sales College has yet to have a single complaint. (http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/schools-academic-colleges-and-universities/medical-sales-college-in-englewood-co-90126557)

What I find interesting is that Westwood has several reports
on this site. 107 reports with hundreds of updates. In looking at the
individual reports, you will notice that in almost every case you will only see
only 1 person that will find the report useful. I highly doubt that a college
in litigation from former students and local agencies, that the Medical Sales
College is receiving 7,000 times the interest in a matter of hours post Steve
updating. It is clearly obvious that he sits in from of his computer pressing yes
or no in some cases more then 300 times! This man is SICK!

This guy has zero knowledge in the world of orthopedic sales
or education



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#21 Author of original report

MSC's Smokescreen Response to "Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get "

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

The post directly above was obviously written by EliteMed President, Scott Binder, pretending to be future Medical Sales College (MSC) student "medsalesjason." The immediate question is, what legitimate school has a recruiting arm officer who behaves this way? None! 

It was his diversionary response to the following earlier post: 

EliteMed attempts to convince potential MSC students that their school is state licensed and highly regulated, so therefore cannot be a scam. It turns out, consistent with their deceitful
recruitment tactics, their state license is also questionable since it did not require much to obtain.

Allison Sherry of The Denver Post in her article entitled "STATE, FEDS DIFFER ON SCHOOL REGULATION," says that colleges have found fertile ground to operate in Colorado because the state has not required much to open a campus or a storefront school.

That is evident in the numbers: 466 schools are authorized by state officials to operate [in Colorado], yet the federal government allows only 112 of those schools to give out loan dollars and Pell grants.

RECRUITERS PAID TO AGGRESSIVELY ENROLL 
Critics say problems often begin the moment potential students reach out to the for-profit college. Colleges are allowed to compensate admissions representatives based, in part, on the number of students they sign up. Critics say that makes the process less of a counseling session and more of a sales job. "Whenever you pay someone such as a recruiter based on numbers they bring in, you're just opening the door for abuse," said Rich Williams, a higher education associate with the Public Interest Research Group in Washington.

Link to full article: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14209838
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#22 Consumer Comment

Experience -vs- Agenda

AUTHOR: medsalesjason - (United States of America)

Steve,

How would you define your specific skill set and expertise?

With four years general selling experience
  
A) I have an unbelievable amount of knowledge in the licensing, application and procedures of higher education and approval process.

B) I havent actually sold devices but I am a guru at executive and managerial know how and expertise within the device industry

C) I havent attended the MSC however; I should have designed the curriculum in lieu of the five surgeons on their medical advisory staff

What you forget about the above article to mention was that it was published over two years ago and said:  

In 2008, though, state laws were strengthened and state regulators gained a little more muscle to monitor the quality of for-profit schools. Before, state officials simply looked at the business plan, but now they investigate an applying institution's quality, faculty qualification and admissions practices.

So should we assume that since 2008 that regulations have become more stringent? (Not sure if you are away analyzing space walk strategies for NASA)
 
Lets face it Steve, you are the only one on here after four months of professional blogging. No students! Not a single one! You have zero idea, expertise or knowledge on any of this. Just some random guy who didnt like what the recruiter had to say.

Do you really believe that your advice holds more value than those that actually have had experience with the college? 

I will trust

Students that have graduated and now are selling in medical devices
  
Surgeons that have experienced sales representatives and
discuss the value of MSC
 
Employers that have hired graduates and are now out-performing traditional hiring methods

This is real-you are not!

http://www.youtube.com/user/medicalsalescollege?feature=results_main 


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#23 Author of original report

Turns Out MSC's Colorado State License was Easy to Get

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

EliteMed attempts to convince potential Medical Sales College (MSC) students that their school is state licensed and highly regulated, so therefore cannot be a scam. It turns out, consistent with their questionable recruitment tactics, their state license did not require much to obtain.

Allison Sherry of The Denver Post in her article entitled "STATE, FEDS DIFFER ON SCHOOL REGULATION," says that colleges have found fertile ground to operate in Colorado because the state has not required much to open a campus or a storefront school.

That is evident in the numbers: 466 schools are authorized by state officials to operate here, yet the federal government allows only 112 of those schools to give out loan dollars and Pell grants.

RECRUITERS PAID TO AGGRESSIVELY ENROLL
Critics say problems often begin the moment potential students reach out to the for-profit college. Colleges are allowed to compensate admissions representatives based, in part, on the number of students they sign up. Critics say that makes the process less of a counseling session and more of a sales job. "Whenever you pay someone such as a recruiter based on numbers they bring in, you're just opening the door for abuse," said Rich Williams, a higher education associate with the Public Interest Research Group in Washington.

Link to full article: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_14209838




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#24 Consumer Comment

Steve It is official, on your 38th update you continue your psychopathic ways!

AUTHOR: medsalesjason - (United States of America)

Good to see that I got under your skin a little. Although Scott or any other MSC employee may not respond, Ill be your huckleberry!

Out of 52 posts, I have only seen MSC/Elite post three times over the course of four months. They must not care that much about you!

Lets get right to the point
 
1) Why would someone obviously unqualified for the job applied, unaffiliated with MSC spend so much effort informing others? Are you telling me that anyone should believe your obsessive personality and constant hourly posting is not a sign of a disturbed sociopath? You didnt even attend MSC yet speak as if youre knowledgeable about it.  Why is that?

2) You started this report in January as a non-customer yetover the last four months not a single customer of MSC or Elite Med has responded? Why would that be?

3) You mention in your 38th update that I and allother positive comments must be affiliated with the school. 

A non-affiliated person would never get this mad or
post. 

You didnt attend MSC, nor utilize any service from Elite,
yet you have posted 38 times here and probably 1000s on CafePharma! Why would
that be?

4) In your last point (8),

Both allege that only one person is writing against EliteMed-MSC, despite evidence of many CafePharma and BBB entries attacking their program.

Please share what other evidence (names) in which you see anyone other than you are commenting about MSC or Elite including the BBB! It is obvious that only one person is writing about them thats you!

5) Your 38th update was posted according to the site at 7:13 AM; in the first five minutes 107 people marked yes they found this post useful. Are you telling me in five minutes 107 people happened to be researching MSC, found the Ripoff Report and scrolled down to the bottom and only checked Yes on your last update? Why would the same people not check yes or no on any other update? I noticed that last night that my rebuttal and your previous update had not changed a single one!

6) I noticed that since I checked No 5 times a few minutes ago you checked yes 20 times. Should we see who can check first to 1,000?

7) Explain this In researching another college, I picked the most controversial school I could think of, the University of Phoenix. They have the largest enrollment I believe in online education. On the Ripoff Report, they have 636 reports containing 1,000s of updates/rebuttals. In looking at 2011 for compare and contrast, I noticed that they have 425 updates with a total of only 130 clicks on yes or no combined. Only in one instance did I see an update with more than 15 people who found the information useful.  That was 21 dating back since 2005! In contrast, on the 1 and only report onMSC/Elite, I see 52 updates and 7,214 clicks on yes or no combined!!! In fact, you clicked yes more times in five minutes than all of the 425 updates in the last five months for University of Phoenix. Please help us understand!

Steve, I know you do nothing but monitor this and other sites as the official watchdog of medical sales education. I only have the weekend to play and then back to reality for me.  My guess is that you MIGHT have some free time during the week.



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#25 Author of original report

Another Fake Future MSC Student

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

The post directly above is allegedly by a future Medical Sales College (MSC) student named "medsalesjason" from Birmingham. A forensic linguistics review of the document, however, reveals its author as none other than EliteMed Recruiting President, Scott Binder. The deduction goes as follows:

1) Caucasian male
Medsalesjason writes "probably being passed up for job opportunities because of some discriminatory reasons beyond control." This is not something normally written by a racial minority or a female since discrimination is often a reality for them. Shannon Marshall is therefore ruled out. From their websites, we can establish that both Mr. Binder and Jim Rogers are White men.

2) Birmingham
Mr. Binder worked in Alabama, so the "Birmingham" mentioned by medsalesjason is most likely in Alabama. This rules out Mr. Rogers.

3) Angry
To Mr. Binder, this Ripoff Report is an attack on his livelihood. Therefore, as with the earlier posts signed by Mr. Binder, medsalesjason counterattacks Ripoff Report author by calling him "a joke," "crazy mind[ed]," someone who "gets off on attention through obsession and lying," and so on. A nonaffiliated person would never get this angry, so this rules out everyone else.

4) Layman Psychiatric Diagnosis
Mr. Binder characterizes Ripoff Report author as being a "mentally unstable individual." Medsalesjason 
does the same by calling him a "crazy mind[ed]" person who "gets off on attention through obsession." 

5) Syntax
Both Mr. Binder and medsalesjason use identical sentence structures. They also both use ALL CAPITAL LETTERS to accentuate certain points, both use the expression "you decide," or "let the readers decide," and they both break down their mark's paragraphs to rebut points individually.

6) The Count
Both accurately cite the number of posts submitted on this Ripoff Report and on CafePharma. Nonaffiliated readers would never take the time to count each post.

7) Credibility
Both mention the word "credibility" when attacking this Ripoff Report. They do this in order to dodge the many valid questions it raises about EliteMed-MSC.

8) Unablogger 
Both allege that only one person is writing against EliteMed-MSC, despite evidence of many CafePharma and BBB entries attacking their program.

The list goes on and on, implicating EliteMeds President as someone who pretends to be a future MSC student. This is unethical and unprofessional behavior, especially for a company president. Still think MSC is legit?
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#26 Consumer Comment

Steve, four-years selling non-orthopedic devices and you call yourself an expert? You are a joke!

AUTHOR: medsalesjason - (United States of America)

As an interested party investigating MSC for more than five weeks, I believe you just made the case much stronger for the company and in turn ruined any creditability in my eyes as well as anyone reading this post.

In your previous posting (36th to be exact), you finally shed light on your experience with MSC. Please let me elaborate on what
I can extract from your last posting.

You claim that you submitted a resume for a job (ONE) advertised from EliteMed. Your background is in medical sales which you have a total of 4 years experience. Post your conversation a recruiter called you to sell you on MSC. Therefore, you feel that this was a con to get you to attend. Yet, you have never attended MSC.

Now let me tell you about my background. I have been in medical sales for more than 10 years. During that time I have sold for two companies.  The first company was Lincare. We sold oxygen, respiratory and infusion products. After Lincare, I sold for a diabetic testing company (that recently was purchased). Currently, I am trying to break into medical device sales. 

Although I have finished in the top 5% at both previous companies, after more than 200 resume submissions to both recruiters and hiring corporations (for device), I have received one call from a recruiter. I was told that even with my DME experience, I wasnt qualified. I am intelligent enough to realize that even though I call DME medical sales, device recruiters and hiring managers do not see that as the same equivalent as device sales. A few weeks ago I attended a wedding. At the wedding I was
talking with a sales manager for Depuy (J&J company). I was asking his opinion on medical device sales and how to break into the industry. He suggested MSC and that was the start of my research.

I like many others looked through Google to find information on the college. This is how I found this report. At that point I think you only had submitted 15 or 20 updates to the report you started. I also found your posts on another site called CafePharma. I was surprised that you spent so much time daily posting based on the information I could find about your background. In fact, I believed you must have been a recruiter because the hourly efforts made no sense.

Although the following is just my opinion, I will let readers decide for themselves.

1. My guess is that you must have similar medical sales experience as my background (non-device). Unless EliteMed hires completely incompetent sales recruiters, I highly doubt they would sell you a service of training for spine if you already had spine experience (as an example). I have searched the blogs looking for any additional information in which a former device rep was sold MSC as a service to enter the industry. Needless to say, I have found no other indication or accusation then from you.

2. I also noticed in the last update, you now are suggesting avoiding all recruiters and apply directly to the companies. This was followed with the statement from you: I once dealt with recruiters, but have come to the conclusion that networking and applying directly is much more effective.  My conclusion is that after four months of searching, you still havent been successful breaking into medical sales or finding a new job. In addition to the Elite recruiters, it appears from that statement that other recruiters found you equally undesirable from your qualifications. Lastly, if you indeed have suburb qualifications in medical
sales, networking would have been the only needed solution to new employment. I guarantee you that if I wanted a job selling DME; I would just make a call to another hiring manager.

3. With your limited to no experience selling orthopedic devices, how can you make any creditable statement as to the need or outcome of a Medical Sales College graduate or program? You make statements such as:

#44 Update By Author MSC Certification on Resume Can Hurt Jobseeker

AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, May 10, 2012

Displaying a Medical Sales College (MSC) certification on a resume can actually hurt the jobseeker.

As more and more hiring managers become aware that MSC recruits students through fake EliteMed job advertisements, solicited testimonials, unverifiable placement claims and high pressure sales tactics, MSC grads are progressively being perceived as non-savvy business people unsuitable for medical sales.

Therefore, if you have Medical Sales College or MSC on your curriculum vitae or resume, you might consider deleting it so that youre not potentially automatically disqualified by resume screening programs.

You are a non-experienced device sales rep not a hiring manger or executive in device sales!!

4. It is obvious that this posting/updates go far beyond an act of informing the general public about your opinion. You have no
experience with the Medical Sales College, most likely never sold an orthopedic implant, have zero idea of what other hiring managers opinions of the college would be and have some crazy mind that gets off on attention through obsession and lying. Nobody in your position of being simply an unqualified/experienced applicant would seriously exert this kind of effort.

36 postings/updates about device sales from someone that has 4 years of sales experience outside of devices?


Funny thing was at the beginning I had a fraction of doubt of MSC based on the information provided. You would have been better off stopping after your first one or two postings in your smear campaign. I caught on in the last week after I thoroughly read postings both here and on CafePharma. I realized that almost every single one of them was YOU! Then today once I learned about you, it all makes sense now. You are just some sick dude that blames your inabilities or opportunities on the society. Probably being passed up for job opportunities because of some discriminatory reasons beyond control. So what do you do? Look for self-satisfying attention through manipulation of others.

In the end two very important things happened today. First you disclosed yourself ruining any creditability. Next, you finalized my decision to attend the Medical Sales College.
 
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#27 Author of original report

MSC is an Education Scam, I'm Not a Competitive Recruiter

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) attempts to invalidate this Ripoff Report by alleging its author is one of their competitors. Well, let us abrogate their false claim with the following:

                Jobseekers should avoid all recruiters and apply directly to companies.

The truth is, I once forwarded my private information to AIMS/EliteMed by answering one of their many credible looking job advertisements on national career boards. I once dealt with recruiters, but have come to the conclusion that networking and applying directly is much more effective.

Anyway, when an AIMS/EliteMed recruiter called, he praised my 4 years of medical sales experience and stated someone in my local area would be contacting me within a couple of days. He evaded all questions about their advertised position near my home.

A few minutes later, he followed up with an email to plant a seed about MSC. Since MSC's website claims they could make one seem as if they have 1 to 2 years of medical sales experience, and I already have 4 from a publicly traded company, I responded politely to express my disinterest in MSC.

Their recruiter then replied, "as per our conversation [I] do not have the experience to get into medical sales." He never said that during our phone conversation, especially since he was too busy praising my accomplishments and stroking my ego--a classic sales technique of sugarcoating the pill. He seemed defensive and frustrated that he could not sell me MSC.

Again, I am not a recruiter, but simply the wrong person to try to con. True, I have never attended MSC, but one does not need to step into a pitfall to warn others about it.
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#28 Author of original report

MSC Sounds Exactly Like a Modeling School

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

The information below was copied directly from a modeling school's website. Notice that Medical Sales College (MSC) uses the same exact arguments to defend itself against scam allegations.

"Claim: 
Is Barbizon a scam?Fact: 
Weve heard the claims. We decided to address them, head on. After all, you dont stay in business for over 70 years if you are running a scam. Weve gotten to the bottom of the questions and some of the complaints and felt you should hear the facts. 
1. I paid money to Barbizon and I didnt get a job

The truth is we cant predict the future and we cant guarantee our students will secure employment in the modeling and acting industry. Just as if you went to NYU and studied Journalism they cant guarantee you a job in the journalism industry. We can tell you that Barbizon has an extensive network of casting directors, agents, managers, producers and other industry professionals that we work with to provide our graduates opportunities in the industry. And while not everyone will find success in modeling or acting, our graduates have gone on to find success in other areas. You can view our some of our alumni stories below. 

2. Barbizon accepts everyone.

We dont accept everyone, we have class size restrictions and cant always accept everyone who auditions. However, we do offer more than just modeling and acting training, we offer personal development and self esteem development. So we may accept some young people into our schools that come for reasons beyond wanting to just be a model or actor. We accept young people we feel would benefit from our programs and have a real interest in what Barbizon courses can offer. 

3. You shouldnt pay for an agency.

Youre right. You shouldnt pay for an agency. But Barbizon is not an agency. We are a training center or a school. We do have a tuition fee for our training programs that is comparable to many extra curricular activities. Agencies make money by taking a cut of the money the models and actors make on jobs. Barbizon doesnt take a cut when our graduates are placed into jobs."
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#29 Author of original report

Do All Advertised EliteMed Jobs Really Exist?

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Scott Binder, President of EliteMed Recruiting, claims that all of the jobs his company posts on national career boards are for current open positions.

If this is the case, then why do EliteMed recruiters almost always tell jobseekers that the positions they forwarded their resumes for were already filled" by more qualified candidates or Medical Sales College (MSC) graduates?

Naturally, EliteMed also tells jobseekers that they too can enhance their candidacy for future medical sales positions if they pay to attend MSC. 

EliteMed and MSC operate together much like the classic modeling agency-modeling school scam:

1) Talent recruiter lures potential victims using a mix of legitimate and nonexistent modeling jobs.
2) Potential victims are then told that advertised jobs were already filled by graduates of their affiliated modeling school.
3) Of course, potential victims are directed toward said school to enhance their chances of obtaining future gigs.
4) After paying, if victims complain due to lack of modeling work, they are told that promised training was already provided and that it is not the responsibility of the school to place graduates into jobs. Victims are blamed for their lack of success. Agency and school keep victims' money.
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#30 REBUTTAL Owner of company

YES! The jobs are real!

AUTHOR: Scott Binder - (United States of America)

Hi "Steve".  In response to your question about jobs, let me state it very clearly.  Every single job that we post on our website and the many job boards we use are 100% true jobs.  I have 10 senior regional recruiters across the United States.  As I like to say, their job is to find jobs.  Let me tell you our process:

First, every single job that we receive is recorded on an EliteMed Job Sheet.  Each job sheet has it's own number based on region.  On the job sheet is the description of the job, the location, the name of the company, the manager's name or HR rep who gave us the job, and their complete contact information.  Every single job is documented in this fashion and is stored on our server.   This is a fact.  And if we are ever audited by a third party I can EASILY produce these job sheets. 

Second, we have MORE jobs than we can post on job boards.  I have contracts with many of the major orthopedic device manufacturers.  I also have contracts with many smaller distributors.  Why?  You don't have to be Einstein to figure out that my model is a GREAT DEAL for orthopedic device companies.  They can hire a graduate of MSC who has been trained in Orthopedic sales for $0!  If you have a rep opening or run a small ortho company, doesn't it make perfect sense for you to give EliteMed and MSC a try FIRST to see if you can find a rep?  Of course it does.  That's why we have hundreds of jobs.

Better yet, if for some reason a company needs an experienced rep, we can do that too, at a major discount versus traditional recruiters.

But then again you know this don't you "Steve"?  We are killing your business and you are doing everything possible to discredit us.  
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#31 Author of original report

EliteMed-MSC Will Not Answer This One Simple Question

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Immediately above this post, the CEO of Medical Sales College (MSC), Scott Binder, continues his strategy of attacking the inquisitor instead of answering the many valid questions raised in this blog about how EliteMed and MSC conduct business.

Mr. Binder calls the content of this blog defamatory, yet although not a psychiatrist, he diagnoses its author as exhibiting "mentally unstable obsessive behavior." This, by definition, is defamatory since a layman cannot give a factual medical diagnosis, especially one that is injurious to its target.

Mr. Binder then further misdirects readers by inferring that since MSC employs "respected orthopedic surgeons," that somehow his company is absolved from all illicit activities. Of course, this blog has never once stated or alluded that their orthopedic surgeons are involved in EliteMed-MSCs deception.

Like the classic modeling school scam, MSC relies on solicited student testimonials and unverifiable percentages to imply that if one "invests" money on their program, one would get a specific job. Jobseekers do not pay approximately $10,000 for a chance to obtain a job. They pay because they were sold on the idea they will get a job.

Because Mr. Binder continues to avoid answering the many questions raised in this blog, perhaps he can answer this one simple question with a yes or no:  

 Are all the jobs advertised by EliteMed on national career boards for actual open positions?

He will fabricate a reason to not answer this question since he knows that the advertised jobs do not all exist. EliteMed posts fake job ads to lure people into MSC.

Although Jim Rogers is technically the CEO of EliteMed, Mr. Binder works with Mr. Rogers in this education scam. It's a beautiful day in their neighborhood...except for the many MSC grads who do not find medical sales jobs.
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#32 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Who's More Credible? You Decide.

AUTHOR: Scott Binder - (United States of America)

As the owner of EliteMed Recruiting, I feel compelled to respond directly to these defamatory and slanderous claims against my company by Steve.  He is trying to discredit my company and the Medical Sales College as a scam by making false and unsubstantiated claims against our companies. 

It all comes down to who you believe is more credible to the reader of these posts, Steve or me.  At the end of this post, that will be for the reader to decide.  So let me lay out some facts:

 I am telling you who I am.  But who is Steve?   He has written on this site that he is NOT a
former student and he is NOT a recruiter.  Rather he has identified himself as someone we have tried to scam. He has posted over 30 times in the last 4 months.  Lately, he has become so obsessed with trying to destroy our credibility that he has literally spent hours and hours clicking Yes on his posts to
create the impression that hundreds and hundreds of other people have visited this site, read his comments, and agree with him.  These are clearly the actions of a mentally unstable individual. 

Its so plainly obvious as to what he is doing.  Go and click ANY other company and ANY other
string randomly on Ripoff Report.  NONE have more than 3 or 4 Yes this was helpful or No its not tags.  Yet somehow, hundreds and hundreds of people find Steves reports helpful one hour after he posts?  Again, this is mentally unstable obsessive behavior. 

His motivation for trying to destroy our credibility is very clear to me.  He is obviously one of my
recruiting competitors and he is VERY worried about the fact that my firm is re-writing the rules of the game when it comes to medical device sales recruitment.  I am a major threat to his livelihood.  Just like Sam Walton re-defined discount shopping, (and created many enemies!) we are re-defining medical sales recruitment.  I have a discounted model that ALL my clients love, and my competitors hate!   

But dont take my word for it.  Watch and listen to REAL people who will endorse what MSC is doing.  

Listen to MY clients tell why they like to hire graduates of MSC:

1.    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkGsc9isELU&feature=related

2.    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyrPJCCYK8E&feature=relmfu

Listen to REAL surgeons discuss the value of the training people receive at MSC:

1.    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebGi2xPOq_I&feature=relmfu

2.    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZMNo1Bis0I&feature=relmfu

 (Yeah, Steve these respected orthopedic surgeons are willing to throw away their entire career and participate in our scam) 

And finally, listen to the UNPAID, REAL stories of 20 people who have attended MSC and are now thriving in the medical sales industry:

http://www.medicalsalescollege.com/Advisory-Committee.html

Now the reader, after considering all the facts, has to decide who is more credible:

1. Regional VPs and distributors of major orthopedic companies, respected orthopedic surgeons, and 20 former graduates who willingly shared their experience about MSC and how it prepared them for
success.

OR

2. Anonymous, obsessive, Steve

If you choose Steve, thats fine by me.  We probably couldnt find you a job in this
industry anyway since you probably also believe that:


  We really didnt land on the moon, that whole thing was a hoax.

  JFK was really assassinated by the CIA.

  Elvis is not really dead, hes actually working at a Wal-Mart in Memphis.

Now let me get busy spending hours and hours clicking Yes to this report. :)


Scott Binder, President EliteMed Recruiting

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#33 Author of original report

MSC Certification on Resume Can Hurt Jobseeker

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Displaying a Medical Sales College (MSC) certification on a resume can actually hurt the jobseeker. 

As more and more hiring managers become aware that MSC recruits students through fake EliteMed job advertisements, solicited testimonials, unverifiable placement claims and high pressure sales tactics, MSC grads are progressively being perceived as non-savvy business people unsuitable for medical sales. 

Therefore, if you have Medical Sales College or MSC on your curriculum vitae or resume, you might consider deleting it so that youre not potentially automatically disqualified by resume screening programs.
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#34 Author of original report

Medical Sales College is an Educational Scam

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Despite some benefitting from MSC, I believe it is an educational scam for the following reasons:

1) MSC recruits through EliteMed job advertisements for nonexistent positions.

***If an EliteMed recruiter calls you, ask what the name is of the device company for which you forwarded EliteMed your resume. Their recruiter will most certainly come up with at least one reason to sell you MSC. A common one is the position was already filled by one of their grads.***

2) MSC uses the number of resumes EliteMed receives as "proof" of their program's popularity. 
3) MSC is non-selective, meaning that anyone or almost anyone who can pay tuition is accepted.
4) They will not reveal how their placement rate claim is calculated. This number fluctuates from 70% to 81%.
5) They use the same testimonial strategy as known fraudulent modeling schools.

***Look for unsolicited testimonials from legitimate schools such as Harvard or Yale and notice that there aren't many. Now research the number of testimonials from scam modeling schools, and you'll find plenty. MSC pushes students and grads to make such testimonials.***

6) They changed the names of their entities many times.
7) They move for mysterious reasons. I'm guessing legal ones.
8) One of their former names, AIMS, received many Better Business Bureau complaints.

***They claim to distance themselves from AIMS, yet their leader Jim Rogers, also led AIMS. Here is the link to the BBB complaints--  http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/employment-training/american-institute-of-medical-sales-in-englewood-co-90110812   ***

9) MSC grads may not necessarily pass the various personality tests administered by many device companies.
10) They target student loans, therefore, defaulted loans are ultimately paid by taxpayers.
11) They hide behind a governmentally issued license. Keep in mind, even Ponzi artist Bernard Madoff had a governmental license. Also, it could take years for a governmental agency to revoke a license.***
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#35 Author of original report

EliteMed-MSC Dodges Questions by Attacking Inquisitor

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

EliteMed-MSC goes on the offensive by making the following claims:
1) Only one person is complaining against their program.
2) That person is a competitive recruiter who is losing business to them.
3) None of the complaints are substantiated.

Their smokescreen, of course, is to divert us from questions like the following:
1) Why do they recruit using job ads for nonexistent positions?
2) Why do they pretend to be MSC students and grads on Cafepharma?
3) Why do they refuse to reveal how their 81% placement rate was calculated?
4) Why do they keep changing the names of their entities?



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#36 UPDATE Employee

One Hour Later...

AUTHOR: Shannon Marshall - (United States of America)

Interesting that the number of hits on "Did you find this post useful?" for Steve's last post went from 156 to 363 in less than an hour and in that same time frame there have been 221 "No" responses to my post, as to whether or not it was useful... 

The obvious tactics that Steve continues to use should be transparent to any observers of this thread. We are happy to engage anyone about questions they might have about our programs, but the absurd, unsubstantiated, and repetitive accusations really are out of hand. 

Steve, it's time to come clean... 

Shannon Marshall
Director of Social Media, Medical Sales College
smarshall@medsalescollege.com
(303) 327-7033
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#37 UPDATE Employee

Why would someone post 29 times who hasn't attended the college or admittedly been "ripped off"? What does he have to gain through daily posting?

AUTHOR: Shannon Marshall - (United States of America)

Steve, 

As Director of Social Media, I am responsible for monitoring our online presence which, unfortunately, includes this thread. Our reputation is important to us, and your 29 attempts to defame that reputation really must be addressed.

We are trying to gauge your interest in our college. We have quickly noticed today a pattern in your efforts. About an hour ago, you filed your 29th report (EliteMed-MSC is Nonselective. Also, They Use Fake Job Ads to Lure Students.) and, in a matter of 30 minutes, have clicked Did you find this post useful? button more than 156 times!  

We clicked the other 11 Nos over the last few minutes just to see how it works!  Although we would
love to think that, in a matter of less than one hour, people are using search engines to find the college, find the Ripoff Report, read through your 29 postings, and then have156 people click the Did you find this post useful? button it is rather unlikely!! I guess that would indicate we have an enormous
amount of people interested in our college. That would be on pace for more than 3,700 people a day!

So I have a simple question for you, in your first post you mentioned a few things, one in particular 

In my opinion, AIMS/Elite Medical Sales Recruiting and their affiliated Medical Sales College is one big SCAM. And no, I am not a recruiter, but someone these people tried to rip off.

Since that time you have added another 28 additional posts under several different titles.

Why not explain to the readers, since you are not a student, how exactly did we try to rip you off?
 

Shannon Marshall
Director of Social Media, Medical Sales College
smarshall@medsalescollege.com
(303) 327-7033

Steves 29 Posts:

#1 Update By Author
Elite-MSC is basically classic Modeling School scam
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, February 10, 2012

#2 Update By Author
Some Common Arguments You'll Hear From Elite-MSC
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, February 10, 2012

#3 Update By Author
Some Common Tricks Used by Elite-Medical Sales College
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, February 15, 2012

#4 Update By Author
Other Common Arguments by Medical Sales College
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, February 22, 2012

#5 Update By Author
Elite/Medical Sales College Ethics
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, February 23, 2012

#6 Update By Author
Questions to Ask Elite Recruiting and Medical Sales College
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, February 23, 2012

#7 Update By Author
Elite-MSC Will Probably Blame Their Victims
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, February 24, 2012

#8 Update By Author
MSC distancing itself from AIMS? In name perhaps, but not in practice.
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Saturday, February 25, 2012

#9 Update By Author
Elite-MSC Continues to Post Questionable Testimonials
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Monday, February 27, 2012

#10 Update By Author
Medical Sales College Mincing Words (As Usual)
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Tuesday, February 28, 2012

#11 Update By Author
Elite's unethical loophole. By definition, no recruiter should ever charge the candidate.
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, February 29, 2012

#12 Update By Author
Anatomy of a Fake MSC Testimonial
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, March 02, 2012

#13 Update By Author
Certificate Useless Once Granting Institution Changes its Name
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Saturday, March 03, 2012

#14 Update By Author
Fresh Fish Shouldn't Smell Fishy
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, March 07, 2012

#15 Update By Author
MSC Certificate vs. Masters Degree-- a False ROI Argument
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, March 08, 2012

#16 Update By Author
Medical Sales College Grads at a Disadvantage
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, March 09, 2012

#17 Update By Author
That EliteMed Job You Applied For Doesn't Really Exist
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, March 14, 2012

#18 Update By Author
EliteMed-MSC Targeting Taxpayer Dollars Via Student Loans
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Monday, March 19, 2012

#19 Update By Author
Medical Sales College and Their Fake Testimonials
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Tuesday, March 20, 2012

#20 Update By Author
EliteMed & MSC Continue to Post Fake Testimonials
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Wednesday, March 21, 2012

#21 Update By Author
MSC will argue they are government licensed. Guess what, so was Bernie Madoff.
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, March 22, 2012

#22 Update By Author
EliteMed-MSC is No Hall of Justice
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Monday, March 26, 2012

#23 Update By Author
MSC is Like Bad Contractor Who Occasionally Moves to Different State, Only to Continue Same Bad Tactics
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, March 29, 2012

#24 Update By Author
Like All For-Profit Colleges, MSC is Non-Selective and Targets Student Loans
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, March 30, 2012

#25 Update By Author
If MSC is so selective, then how come the EliteMed recruiter just tried to hard sell you MSC?
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Sunday, April 01, 2012

#26 Update By Author
Check Out All These Modeling School Testimonials
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Tuesday, April 17, 2012

#27 Update By Author
Not all Scams are Absolute Scams
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Thursday, April 19, 2012

#28 Update By Author
EliteMed-MSC is Nonselective. Also, They Use Fake Job Ads to Lure Students.
AUTHOR: Steve - New York (United States of America)

SUBMITTED: Friday, April 20, 2012
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#38 Author of original report

EliteMed-MSC is Nonselective. Also, They Use Fake Job Ads to Lure Students.

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) boasts that thousands of jobseekers forward them resumes, therefore they can be choosy with the quality of people they admit into their program. 

In reality, they get many resumes only because their recruiting arm, EliteMed, advertises "jobs" on national career boards, not an expensive for-profit college. The existence of these advertised jobs, of course, is highly questionable. MSC only pretends to be selective, but they will accept anyone willing and able to pay tuition. 

MSC's main goal, perhaps, is to be able to receive Federal funding and accept Federal student loans. Since most governmental or private student loans are currently nondischargeable in bankruptcy, then MSC grads who ultimately fail to secure medical sales jobs with their very specific medical sales certificate, are essentially stuck with a worthless "diploma" and a lifetime of debt. 

The reason many MSC grads will not find work in medical sales is because the school is nonselective, so will accept even those who cannot pass potential employers personality tests or face-to-face interviews.

From modelingscams.org:
"The basic concept of selection scams is very simply pretending to be selective.

Most people would instantly recognize a scam if they knew everyone who was scouted was selected. Therefore the selection scam artists must make it appear as if they are being selective."
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#39 Author of original report

Not all Scams are Absolute Scams

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) is not an absolute scam, since some students do benefit from their program. Unfortunately, the vast majority of their graduates do not get placed in medical sales jobs. Furthermore, their continued refusal to tell us how they calculated their alleged 81% placement rate only ads to the claim that MSC is running an educational scam.

From modelingscams.org:

"Most modeling scams are not absolute scams. There are success stories. Some people do benefit. Just because a company is not an absolute scam, however, does not prove it is not a scam."

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#40 Author of original report

Check Out All These Modeling School Testimonials

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Below are many testimonials from the websites of two modeling schools. Do these good reviews mean these for-profit colleges are not running scams? The point is, the existence of MSC testimonials does not necessarily mean MSC is legit. Research "John Casablancas" and "Barbizon" to discover if there are any scam allegations about them.

Modeling School Testimonials

"Although previous comments may lead one to believe I am not in support of all modeling schools, it should be known, there are certain schools, which actually do a great job in being honest and discover incredible talent who have gone on to great, huge careers. The team at the Barbizon is one of those schools and has an incredible relationship with not only myself and The Network but with many top agencies around the world. They have great eyes for talent and have discovered some great talent."
- Paul Fisher, CEO The Network, Star of the CWTV show Remodeled
"I would like to say THANK YOU for the opportunity of a lifetime for Tori and myself to be part of Barbizon. What an amazing experience. Who would have thought that me submitting a photo of her to a contest on Face book would have given her all these wonderful opportunities. Barbizon Rocks! "
- Vanessa Addis, Parent
"I would like to thank you for the amazing opportunity you have given me with Barbizon. I truly had a memorable time and gained much knowledge about modeling and acting. I appreciate all of your time and dedication you have put towards all of the students."
- Philicia Peters
"loved my experience here "
- Korinah, Facebook
"I'm Receiving Modeling Jobs Right And Left! Thank You So Much Barbizon ! I'm Extremely Grateful "
- Katherine, Facebook
"It just seem like yesterday i was a 13 year old that had a dream to be a model and actor. after, i was done with Barbizon i started to have the most greatest opportunity of my life i am so bless for everything now i have a competition that's coming up and i am ready to shine show them how Barbizon change my life and i would like to say again thank you so much for everything!!!!?
sincerely,
janet reyes barbizon grad"
- Janet, Facebook
"Savannah was diagnosed at age 5 with Hepatoblastoma which is a rare liver cancer in children. Previously I had just finished radiation treatments for Breast Cancer and she was diagnosed with this liver cancer within 6 weeks of my treatment ending. So our family knows the emotional rollercoaster cancer puts you through. We also know the joy of survivorship as well. She just found out last week at Hershey Medical Center that she is now 3 years cancer free!! (I am 4 years cancer free too!) We have a lot to be thankful for and our life perspective is different than most. We are just happy for the opportunity each day brings honestly. She started her classes with Barbizon after all her cancer treatments were over with. (She spent every 20 days as 10 days inpatient up at Hershey for almost a year) When she lost all her hair you could see the disappointment in her eyes. Children would not play with her at playgrounds and she was not invited to birthday parties. It was really a sad time for Savannah. Perhaps that is why Savannah is so compassionate and a social butterfly wanting to include everyone. We knew we had to do something to make her shine again as we know her. Barbizon has been perfect for that. Thank-you for putting a smile on her face when very little else could anymore. Savannah definitely has more self confidence and has a good time on runway and photo shoots. If that is all that comes out of Barbizon, we as her parents are thrilled with the outcome so far. Although Savannah has already told us she wants to go to Paris to eat a croissant and visit the Eiffel Tower. Lofty goals for an 8 year old I think. Whatever her dream, we support it. Thanks again for the opportunity to be in the Pink Promise Fashion Show."
- Kimona & Shawn Keenen (Parents of Savannah Keenen)
"Oana recently did an interview with ASPIRING HOLLYWOOD where she took the time to thank Barbizon. Oana has done a lot of print work for both Billabong and Bratz. She has also been involved in doing fashion shows for big names such as Hilary Duff and Mary-Kate and Ashley Olson! Oanas advice for aspiring actors and models, Dont give up! Give it your all & hope for the best!"- Oana Gregory

"I tell you, Barbizon has been one of the best things ever for this girl - she has SO much confidence. She has really tapped into what makes her "tick" and is totally going for it and doing great! Her agents love her, and are very encouraging for her future as a commercial actress and model. Keep your eye out for Miss Jayne Hall - she is going places!" "
- Donna Harkness, Barbizon Parent
"I left with a new confidence that Ive never experienced before. I was confident I could put on make up correctly, walk on stage gracefully, and confident I could be a better speaker. Read more from Jena on the BARBIZON OF GEORGIA WEBSITE"
- Jena Sims, Barbizon of Georgia

"Barbizon is amazing to work with. They are professional and have a real knowledge of the industry that they use to prepare their students. I have had great success working with Barbizon."
- Randy Cazzalino, C/H Management
"I am writing you to express my continued confidence in working with Barbizon. I feel that you are one of the agencies that truly know how to develop and train models for the international modeling industry. In my years of working with you, I know that when I see models from your agency I will always be guaranteed a level of professionalism and knowledge about the business so often lacking from your competition."
- Roman Young, Wilhelmina Models
"When we get a model from Barbizon, we know theyre trained and professional."
- William Whitfield, Models International
"Its (Barbizon) is preparing them for a career if thats what they want. It shows them what to expect when they get out there. Its the first step if you really want to be in the entertainment business."
- Joey Hunter, Modelwire
"Elite Chicago and Barbizon Midwest have enjoyed a very successful relationship for many years. We have discovered several beautiful girls that have turned into great models. Barbizon Midwest does a wonderful job at development and has supported Elite Chicago over the years."
- Jan Berendsen, Elite Model Management Chicago
"Barbizon offers not only modeling and acting but gives our young people of America the ability to learn about themselves, leadership, self independence and motivation."
- Daryl Washington, Global Management 101, Dream Believe Know It Foundation
"Barbizon provides connections from agents and managers from all over the world. For someone thats not in Barbizon, its harder for them to get in touch with agents and managers to get represented and into the projects. It gives them a step up compared to non Barbizon contestants."
- Jessica Chung, Envy Model Management, LA
"For us, as a family this has been about supporting Sam and giving her the greatest opportunity to be everything she desires to be. Barbizon has been an extraordinary experience for our entire family. (So much so that Sam's older sister, Rachel is now interested).

We are excited for the journey ahead and know that it is all about effort and hard work. We know that she will hear "no" more than "yes". We are so pleased with the growth in Samantha and want to thank you all again for caring for our daughter, encouraging her, pushing her and helping her to grow as a young lady."
- Bill McAlpine, Barbizon Parent
"(In Regards to a Barbizon Competition)
I wanted to take a moment to Thank your team at Barbizon for a job well done this past weekend in Dallas Texas. When I first signed my daughter Julia up for the competition I thought that this might be a BIG SCAM but I went ahead and paid the fee for the show anyway. Of course like all Moms I want my daughter to do well and I would do anything to help her with her dreams. We made this a family event. My husband, 2 sons and my sister (from Oklahoma) came for the show. I never realized the amount of time and energy that was involved in a show like this until we experienced it first hand. I'm so thankful that I didn't listen to the bad news about Barbizon and we went to the show. We had so much FUN!

From our experience Barbizon is what you make of it. Nothing in life is free and modeling is hard work and will take time to perfect your skill. I believe that Barbizon is a great 1st step for those that think they might want to get into the business."
- Angela Hoover, Barbizon Parent
"Everyone on Barbizon's staff was so friendly and so willing to help."
- Angela Johnson, Barbizon Parent

"I just had to share my feelings with you concerning the training you provided my son, Layron. He gained knowledge that I never would have been able to afford nor thought would ever be possible. He had many positive experiences and he had fun. His self-confidence is higher and he is pleased that he was able to show others that you can do anything you want. You not only trained my child in your program, you knew my child personally and were never too busy to stop and visit him. As a parent, I would like to thank you for all you did and still do to continue the success in my child's life. I feel I made the best investment a parent could ever make, an investment in my child's future."
- Ethel Livingston, Barbizon Parent
"Our daughter Trina has always set goals for herself. To assist in realizing her goals, we enrolled her in your modeling classes. I am happy to tell you that the training you and your staff have given her exceeded our expectations. Her classmates at school remarked that she always dressed sharply and had a very positive attitude. This positive attitude has spilled over into other parts of her school life. We would like to thank every member of your staff who worked with Trina. All of them seem to take a very personal interest in each student and show a great deal of affection for the modeling."
- Bob Wollard, Barbizon Parent
"To say that Megan has bloomed over the course of your instruction would be an understatement. I have seen her confidence grow after each session. A drive and fire burns within her; goals have been set as a result. Plans for her future have now become a focal point of our conversation. You have given her tools that have allowed her to dream!

"I know that no guarantees exist in this program, nor should there be; however, I feel like she is better prepared to accept the challenges that life will present her in the upcoming teenage years. At this moment her focus is on becoming the best model/actor that she can be. I think that you have given her the chance to accomplish this."
- Jane, Barbizon Parent
"I wanted to thank you for all you are doing with our girls in their training sessions. My 9 year old daughter Logan came home Sunday evening and formally set our dinner table. She was so excited to show us all she has been learning. Great job. Thank you!"
- April Carey, Barbizon Parent
"I can assure everyone and anyone Barbizon is an EXCELLENT place to start! 100% class!"
- Lisa Kane, Barbizon Parent
"Barbizon gave me the confidence to fulfill my dreams of becoming an actress. I was nervous at first, because I didn't know anyone. But, I was soon feeling at ease because the people here and in my group welcomed me and made me feel special. We are like one big family. I will never forget you, or the confidence you have instilled in me. THANKS BARBIZON!"
- Casey McCormick, Barbizon Alumn
"Barbizon enhanced my life by making me feel good about myself on the inside and the way that I appear on the outside. I use the skills that I learned at Barbizon everyday, from how to apply make-up to how to walk. The people there encourage you to set goals and how to accomplish them. Barbizon is a wonderful experience to have."
- Jade Monfils, Barbizon Alumn
"It's been a year since I auditioned for Barbizon. Who would have thought that in one year, I would be featured in over one hundred magazines and billboard ads..."WOW"! One day I'm in London, the next I am in New York City! Now, I am a regular on the soap All My Children and have had nothing but thrilling success. Barbizon taught me the ropes of the modeling industry, and how to survive in this business without getting knocked over. I have nothing but respect for the modeling school Barbizon. What a team, I'm very blessed to be a part of their company."
- Bobby Shue
"It is my great pleasure when someone asks me where I got my start; I can proudly say that it all started at Barbizon! I am so thankful I took advantage of this great opportunity that was presented to me. Barbizon has made me a whole person. Not only has it helped me pursue my modeling and acting career, but it has given me confidence in my everyday life. In fact, just last week a teacher at school asked the class a question, and I knew the answer because I had learned that at Barbizon. It has opened so many doors for me, and I can't wait to see what my future at Barbizon has in store.
"
- Alexis Katsafanas
"Where to beginBarbizon has changed my life in such a wonderful way! The classes have taught me to be proud of whom I am. From the first day, I knew it was a new beginning for me and for everyone else that was there with me! Barbizon should be a requirement for all teenage girls and boys! "
- Katelyn Hartsell, Barbizon Alumn

I can not give John Casablancas Modeling and Career Center of Hartford enough praise for what they have done for my career over the years. I started modeling classes in 2003 at the shy, insecure age of 15. I was nervous about walking the runway in front of peers, memorizing scripts, and doing my own makeup for the first time. Little did I know that in 14 short weeks, I would be a professional model with all the tools and tricks of the trade perfected! My self-confidence boosted, I was eager to walk on a runway in front of other models, and I aced my beauty final exam. What a difference JC made! I have participated in numerous fashion shows, was part of the first ever Full-Figure Fashion Week in New York City, have graced the pages of Manik Magazine, Plus Model Magazine, and numerous newspapers, and am just getting started! I am so proud of my accomplishments over the years, and can not give enough loyalty and thanks to Tina! She is the one who pushed me to pursue my dreams and challenge myself, and I respect and cherish our relationship! John Casablancas is where I started, and I will continue to strive for success and give all credit to them for helping me do so! - Katherine RollI graduated from the Hartford/Rocky Hill Center back in 2001. I started booking local runway and print jobs immediately and I was elated! The center held a casting for NBC's Sports Illustrated Model Search, which I booked and was flown out to L.A for the first time! With Tina's help I've been placed with different agencies nationally and am currently based in New York City with New York Models. I am proud to say that John Casablancas has opened up several doors for me. I've braced pages of magazines, I've been on t.v and radio, I've travelled, and I've met lots of interesting people! Thank-you John Casablancas and Tina!!! - AdaoraI started my training with John Casablancas when I was 15 years old. I was so excited to be part of the JC team. I waited until I graduated to pursue larger markets and now through the connections at JC work in the industry as a professional print/runway model. The training has built my confidence and given me the skills and tools necessary to have an edge in the industry. I love my job as a professional model and I have to thank John Casablancas team for believing in me. - Ami HixsonModeling has been my full time career for the past six years, but my success is based upon my experience with John Casablanca's Modeling and Career Centers in Hartford, Connecticut. My late teen years and early 20's have been filled with a hectic whirlwind of travel to six continents and amazing bookings which include Cosmopolitan, Surface, YM, Glamour, Italian Elle, and many other prestigious magazines. I flip through my new editorials with intense anticipation and excitement because even after all this time, I still can't believe my career. I realize that if I hadn't started the program at the JC Center under the strong guidance of the owner, Tina Kiniry, I wouldn't have such amazing experiences to share. I met Tina when I was a shy and nervous fifteen year-old. I remember listening to Tina intently as she explained the Women's Professional Modeling Program as well as the opportunities that happened afterwards. I wasn't sure what I wanted out of modeling, but I thought I should investigate my options. I began classes shortly after the initial meeting and I was pleasantly surprised each week I went to the Center. It wasn't just about putting on make-up, taking pretty pictures or learning a runway walk. The classes were a wonderful self-discovery each week. Could I memorize lines for a TV ad? Yes! Could I get through a photo shoot? Yes! Could I ace a make-up final? Yes! I began noticing lots of changes in myself, such as raising my hand in school more often and making more of an effort to try new things. I had some excellent teachers at the Center. I still remember Joan, the make-up teacher's lecture on proper skincare, which I still follow to this day. I remember Walter, the photographer's advice on movement for the camera. I remember the staff and fellow models encouraging and supporting me throughout my entire career. My biggest champion, however, has been Tina. I am highly cognizant of how fortunate I am to have such an incredible manager. She always steers me in the right direction, values my opinions and even invites me into her own home whenever I am in Connecticut. Not many models at my level can boast such strong support from their mother agency. My experience through the JC Center has proven to be invaluable. I realize I owe a lot to the program that launched my highly successful career and I feel incredibly fortunate for taking advantage of the opportunities that came my way because of John Casablancas. - LizJohn Casablancas, and MTM have helped me so much to get me prepared for the success that I am experiencing in my career. I just auditioned for Vampire Diaries, a Pearl Vision photo shoot and commercial that films in New York and an independent film. Thank you for all your help. - Santiago
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#41 Author of original report

If MSC is so selective, then how come the EliteMed recruiter just tried to hard sell you MSC?

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

If MSC is so selective, then how come the EliteMed recruiter just tried to hard sell you MSC? This is a simple question your inner voice probably already raised. 

No real recruiter charges jobseekers, and EliteMed does exactly that through MSC. Medical device companies are catching on to how MSC does business.
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#42 Author of original report

Like All For-Profit Colleges, MSC is Non-Selective and Targets Student Loans

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) accepts anyone willing and able to "invest" approximately $10,000 for a medical sales training certificate. It claims selectivity via the following reasoning:

1) MSCs recruting arm, EliteMed, regularly places hundreds of enticing medical sales job ads all over national career boards. Their ads are so convincing that thousands of jobseekers, unaware the positions are mainly fictitious, forward them resumes.

2) Because EliteMed can only call a small percentage of the resumes they receive (under false pretenses, of course), they claim "selectivity."

Keep in mind that unlike traditional recruiters that only recruit for manufacturers, EliteMed mainly recruits students for MSC. 

Also, unlike traditional recruiters which only solicit experienced medical sales reps currently working in the field, EliteMed's only recruitment criteria is that their recruits are willing and able to pay MSC. In reality, EliteMed Recruiting is not a recruiter at all, but a job agency that implicitly promises jobs for cash. (No desperate jobseeker "invests" $10,000 for the promise of an interview.)

Finally, the real money for MSC will come in the form of non-dischargeable student loans. If they are ever able to go public like University of Phoenix, they will have access to millions of dollars in the form of federal or federally guaranteed private student loans. 

MSC grads who do not find medical sales positions are basically stuck with a highly specific medical sales training certificate that is useless for finding work in other fields. Therefore, when they default on their student loans due to lack of income from a well paying medical sales position, who do you think ultimately picks up the tab? Taxpayers.
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#43 Author of original report

MSC is Like Bad Contractor Who Occasionally Moves to Different State, Only to Continue Same Bad Tactics

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

http://www.cafepharma.com/boards/showthread.php?t=484598&page=8

The following is from an anonymous 3/29/12 post on Cafepharma:

"MSC is nothing close to the former AIMS." Was there something wrong with AIMS? Since AIMS "went out of business in 2009" as you put it, doesn't that make an AIMS education worthless now? Putting it on a resume would seem silly. What happens if MSC changes its name again? 

Since it seems that most of the negative publicity may be coming from former students of AIMS, why doesn't Rogers et al just refund the placement guarantee to those who were unplaced with AIMS? Wouldn't this silence those who feel they were wronged? Since there surely could only be a handful (or as the pro MSC folks say only 1 angry student) wouldn't it be cost effective for MSC to step up and reimburse any and all students who were guaranteed placement their tuition? It would seem a small price to pay to potentially re-gain some credibility. 

There are always references to the fact that MSC has no formal complaints, but it's undeniable that AIMS did have complaints. The fact that AIMS closed shop and then MSC opened up with the same leadership is akin to a crooked contractor who after building a bad reputation, moves to another town, changes the name on the side of his truck and continues with the same tactics. 

Arguably, the two most popular threads on this site may very well be related to AIMS and MSC and the reputation of the schools and leaders. Shannon Marshall wants to discount the credibility of this site and claims that they are so incredibly busy enrolling and placing students. Why then offer any rebuttals at all?
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#44 Consumer Comment

MSC is NOT Respected

AUTHOR: Tiffany - (United States of America)

If any school or institution has such a difficult time as MSC arguing that it is respected, it obviously is not. These days, you pay for the name of the institution on your diploma or certificate. It's the reputation of the institute that gets graduates jobs and MSC has the reputation of a shady used car salesman.
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#45 Consumer Comment

MSC is NOT Respected

AUTHOR: Tiffany - (United States of America)

If any school or institution has such a difficult time as MSC arguing that it is respected, it obviously is not. These days, you pay for the name of the institution on your diploma or certificate. It's the reputation of the institute that gets graduates jobs and MSC has the reputation of a shady used car salesman.
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#46 Author of original report

EliteMed-MSC is No Hall of Justice

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Directly above this post is an entry from EliteMed-MSC's very own Bizarro Wonder Woman, Shannon Marshall. As their Director of Social Media, Shannon is adroit at using her bulletproof bracelets to deflect legitimate questions fired at MSC. She is charismatic and very well trained in assuaging fears about their controversial program.

Of course, Shannon's greatest skill is not getting entangled in her own Lasso of Truth, since she avoids giving true answers to the following:

1) Why within a 3 or 4 year period did their recruiting arm change its name from Blue Chip to AIMS to EliteMed, while their school went from being called AIMS to MSC?

2) Why do they keep insisting they have zero BBB complaints, yet the following link clearly shows they had at least 13: http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/employment-training/american-institute-of-medical-sales-in-englewood-co-90110812 ?

3) Why does EliteMed post job ads all over Career Builder and Monster, yet when their recruiters call those who forwarded them resumes, their recruiters avoid discussing posted positions? (Hint: their posted jobs are fictitious, designed to lure potential students.)

4) Why does Shannon claim they do not post fake testimonials, yet entries 7, 12, 25, and 27 on this Ripoff Report are obviously from an EliteMed-MSC affiliate pretending to be an unaffiliated consumer?

5) Why do they refuse to reveal how they calculated their alleged 81% placement rate?

This is not an exhaustive list of what smart consumers should be asking EliteMed-MSC. It is up to prospective students to make EliteMed-MSC's scheme as transparent as Wonder Woman's plane. Regarding lack of professionalism, compare their posts to mine. Which side uses profanities? 


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#47 UPDATE Employee

Director of Social Media

AUTHOR: Shannon Marshall - (United States of America)

I am responding to this forum as the Director of Social Media for the Medical Sales College. I can be contacted at smarshall@medsalescollege.com or by phone at (303) 327-7033. If, as you read through this forum and find you have questions, I would encourage you to contact me so that I can address your
concerns directly.

It is very unfortunate that blogs and venues such as this one exist that allow people to vent in an unprofessional and completely unrestrained manner. There is so much MISINFORMATION being disseminated that you dont know what is fact and what is fiction.

I am responding to this distasteful forum in an attempt to address concerns for those who care to hear it.  

The theme of these posts seems to be related to either: (1)the effectiveness of our programs or (2) to the legitimacy of student (or graduate) testimonials and their success in the field.  

First of all, it is important to note that we are approved and regulated by the Colorado Department of Higher Education, Private Occupational School Board (DPOS), directed by Mr. Jim Parker. Contact information for the DPOS is (303) 866-2723 and Mr. Parkers email address is jim.parker@dhe.state.co.us.
I mention this because, as a regulated college, there are very strict guidelines for our activities. As part of the approval process, we have participated in an extensive application processes, we have presented our
curriculum to the state (which included a needs assessment reviewed by surgeons and companies) and we are bonded (meaning that the tuition paid for by students is protected in the case that we cease operations). Further, the Attorney Generals office protects the interest of consumers from fraudulent or criminal activity so we must be accountable to them, as well. We have been approved and regulated since 2010, during which time there have been no complaints and this can be confirmed by the DPOS or the Attorney Generals office. 

For the Medical Sales College to post fake testimonials, it would mean that our activities went far beyond a scam and that we were actually participating in illegal activities. That is, frankly, ABUSRD. We have NEVER posted fake testimonials and we have NEVER created fake profiles or pages for students. We have not participated or engaged in any activities that would be considered fake, false, or misleading...

We DO make every attempt to recognize and celebrate the successes that our students have. We are very proud when our graduates complete their programs, find sales opportunities, are placed, and fulfill their dreams. There has been a lot of hiring activity in recent weeks and lots of success stories to share. We encourage you to go to www.facebook.com/medicalsalescollege (our primary social media outlet) where we have celebrated the success of over 30 students who have accepted job offers in the past three weeks. You have seen some of our proponents encourage you to go to our students LinkedIn sites to confirm the information that we share. I would also encourage you to do this. There are now over 450 (and we are nearing 500) former students who are now enjoying successful careers in medical sales - the vast majority of which are selling implants and biologic products for some of the largest, most successful, and most reputable companies in the world.

Another thing that I would like to address is the idea that MSC students pay $10,000 to get an interview. Our students do not pay for jobs, nor interviews They pay tuition to develop a skill set that positions them to succeed in a profession a very competitive and rigorous profession, at that. This industry is NOT for everyone. We make every effort to be sure that our students understand exactly how competitive this industry really is. Employers look to hire MSC grads because they have this unique skill set and are more prepared to step into a new territory and make a contribution. Our graduates have successfully differentiated themselves from the competition, which makes them (and us) a target

Once again, if you have been reading this thread and have more questions about the Medical Sales College, I would encourage you to contact me, as I would be happy to address ANY and ALL questions in a direct manner. We also have extensive reference lists of former graduates who are willing to tell you
about their experience at MSC.

Our students have not all shared in the same success. Sometimes that has been attributed to their individual performance and sometimes it has been dumb, bad luck. It is impossible to please all of the people all of the time and I find it very unfortunate that this blog is so very divisive when there are SO
many people whose lives (and livelihoods) have been enhanced by our programs.

To this end, I can be contacted at:

smarshall@medsalescollege.com
(303) 327-7033 

Shannon Marshall
Director of Social Media, Medical Sales College 
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#48 Author of original report

MSC will argue they are government licensed. Guess what, so was Bernie Madoff.

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

It is a common EliteMed-Medical Sales College argument that they are licensed by the government, so cannot be running a scam.

Go call the SEC and ask for Mary L. Schapiro, Elisse B. Walter, Luis A. Aguilar, Troy A. Paredes, and Daniel M.Gallagher and ask them if Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC went through a rigorous process of getting licensed by the SEC. Of course Bernie did. Doesn't mean he wasn't running a scam. 
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#49 Author of original report

EliteMed & MSC Continue to Post Fake Testimonials

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at the post directly above and ask yourself why its author is pretending to be unaffiliated with EliteMed-Medical Sales College (MSC). Do professionals behave this way?

Also, notice that they want you to think I am a competitive recruiter who is losing money to them. Let me rebut by saying that I don't think anyone needs a recruiter. I never used one and I still got into medical sales. EliteMed-MSC can't face the fact that I am simply someone they tried to rip off.
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#50 Consumer Comment

27 More Medical Sales College Placements in the last 21 days!

AUTHOR: salesgurutj - (United States of America)

You are continuing to see this recruiter who has lost his business to the Medical Sales College argue 100% false reports. Why? Simple, as a recruiter he charges $15,000 per placement. The college charges nothing! That is why you see so many Medical Sales College graduates with medical sales jobs. The hiring manager gets an 8-week trained sales representative with no recruitment cost. They have more than 400 graduates with JOBS! You can find almost every one of them through social media (Try Linkedin and FaceBook)

In fact, they have 27 new graduates with jobs in the last three weeks. You can see all of them at the Medical Sales College website and Facebook page...

Here they are:

I have counted 27 people placed as Medical Sales College Graduates just in the last THREE WEEKS!!!!!!

https://www.facebook.com/medicalsalescollege

Medical Sales College

?#4 Last but certainly not least is Brandon S., our Class 110 Valedictorian, who has been placed with Smith & Nephew... 3 weeks since graduating! We know you're going to kill it out there!
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23 hours ago

Dana Angel Swann and 4 others like this.

Medical Sales College

?#3 Will P., a Class 108 grad, gets it done in 8 weeks and
is now selling extremity and biologic products with MedShape, Inc. You've been
cheering the other grads, but now it's our time to cheer YOU!

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23 hours ago

Dana Angel Swann and 2 others like this.

Debbie Cox Way to go Will! Well deserved! Yea! Class 108!

22 hours ago Like

Medical Sales College

?#2 Congratulations to Jose B. who is now working for OrthoPros, Inc., a company selling arthroplasty, distal extremity, sports
medicine, and biologic products. We wish you all the best!

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23 hours ago

Dana Angel Swann and Rebecca Ensley like this.

Medical Sales College

And here's 4 MORE grads to celebrate with...

#1 Congrats to Katie A. who has accepted a position with
Kinex Pharmaceuticals, where she will be selling specialty pharmaceuticals and
biotech products! We hope you kill it out there!

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23 hours ago

Dana Angel Swann and 7 others like this.

Medical Sales College

Here's the way to start of the week... Congratulations to
Justin C., a Class 109 grad, who is going to work for Wright Medical
Technology. 8 weeks since graduation and he's ready to roll!

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Monday at 12:55pm

Dana Angel Swann and 4 others like this.

Debbie Cox Way to go Justin! Class 108 knows how hard you
worked!

22 hours ago Like

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Blaine T., another Class 111 Academy
grad, who has signed on with DePuy Mitek! That's another one who got it done in
less than a month... Great job and best of luck, Blaine!

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March 16 at 10:19am

Brooke Johnson likes this.

Medical Sales College

You've ALL made friends with our cameras, so thought you'd
get a kick out of this... One of our current classes (we won't mention names)
decided to make this camera a little more "life-like". Does it help
with role-plays and exit interviews? We'll let you know... :)

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March 15 at 5:51pm

Dana Angel Swann, Matt Palmer and 14 others like this.

Medical Sales College

Here's another one to celebrate... Congrats to Joe R. who accepted a position with Arthrex this week! Joe had to be a little patient with this process, but we know he's going to turn it out! Can't wait to hear about your many successes, Joe...
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March 15 at 10:14am

Dana Angel Swann and 5 others like this.

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Heidi W., a Class 108 graduate, who has
accepted a position with Ameridose. While her new sales role is outside of
traditional device sales, she will be selling into hospitals and calling on
anesthesiologists. We're excited for you and wish you all the best!

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March 15 at 9:58am

4 people like this.

Debbie Cox Good job Heidi!

22 hours ago Like

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Gena K., a Class 106 Academy graduate,
who has accepted a position with a distributor of medical devices and
surgical/capital equipment. She got it done just 7 weeks after graduation!
We're wishing you much success!

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March 14 at 12:39pm

Dana Angel Swann and 3 others like this.

Adam Roberts Nice Work Gena!! That's awesome!!

March 14 at 5:25pm Like

David Feiner Go Gena!!

March 15 at 8:16am Like

Medical Sales College

Another shout out to Brian A., a Class 111 Academy graduate, who just signed on with Biomet! He "sealed the deal" just over three weeks since graduating. Nice job and best of luck to you, Brian!

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March 13 at 9:59am

Dana Angel Swann and 4 others like this.

Todd Dalton that is awesome!

March 13 at 10:05am Like

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Kathy S., who has formed her own independent distributorship in North Carolina (Carolina Pine Medical
Solutions). We know you're going to knock it out of the park!

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March 12 at 10:04am

Dana Angel Swann, Melissa Triano and 6 others like this.

Kathy Stanczak Thank you! Very excited and thankful for this opportunity! I am very happy to be back and supporting the medical needs of my military family! I couldn't have done it without the skills, networking, relationships and confidence I gained through the MSC!

March 12 at 12:13pm Like

Linda Austin Cline Congrats! You will do Great! :)

March 12 at 2:31pm Like

Medical Sales College

Let's not forget Class 111's Valedictorian, Will W., who has accepted a position with DePuy Mitek! Closed it in less than than 3 weeks and starts work next Monday - exactly 24 days since graduating! Great luck to you to at J&J...

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March 5 at 4:06pm

2 people like this.

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Justin Smith, a Class 106 Academy
graduate, who signed on with Biomet this week! We know you're going to rock it
out in Texas!

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March 5 at 4:02pm

Adam Roberts likes this.

Josh Kerrigan We knew you could do it!!!

March 12 at 3:16pm Like

Graham S. Moredock Congratulations Justin!

March 15 at 4:49pm Like

Medical Sales College

Another MSC grad to knock it out is Tracy N., who completed her Extremities program on January 20th and accepted a position last week with Dynasplint! Way to go, Tracy, and best of luck to you!

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March 5 at 3:59pm

2 people like this.
 
Willester Penn Way to go Tracy!!

March 11 at 1:38pm Like

Tracy Nowak Miss you sweet boy!! :)

March 11 at 1:59pm Like
 
 
Medical Sales College

What a week! We have a lot more placements to celebrate, so
let's kick it off with Dani Hull, a Class 111 Academy graduate, who has landed
with 3D Spinal Solutions! Dani graduated just 3 weeks ago and is really to
roll... Congrats!

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March 5 at 3:54pm

Tom Rolen likes this.
 
Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Olenka L., an Academy graduate who just signed on with Biomet! It was Olenka's performance in role-plays and the persistence of her recruiter (Gaia) that made sure she had the opportunity to shine. We look forward to hearing more about your continued success, Olenka!
 
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March 5 at 11:15am

3 people like this.
  
Medical Sales College

Big kudos go out to Carlanna C., who is graduating from our
Orthopaedic Extremities class today but is already set to start her new
position in just a week! Carlanna has officially signed on with CC Surgical
Solutions and will be selling a big bag of sports medicine and spine products.
Great job getting it done BEFORE graduating! All the best to you!
 
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March 2 at 11:47am

4 people like this.
 
Carlanna Cunningham Thank you! I wouldn't have this
opportunity if it wasn't for the education I received at MSC :)

March 2 at 1:57pm Like
 
Kat Vermelis Way to go girl!!!

March 2 at 3:06pm Like   1
 
Jaime Martinez Way to go!!!

March 3 at 11:43pm Like

Medical Sales College

Congratulations to our Most Valuable Participant from Class 108, Renee' S., who accepted a position (about 2 weeks after graduating) with SEC! Renee' was hired by a former graduate who now manages his own distributorship and has a big bag of medical products. We wish you much success!

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March 1 at 4:25pm

Lauren Keegan and 3 others like this.
 
Dusten Pecor Congratulations

March 1 at 10:17pm Like
 
Willester Penn I am so happy for you Renee!

March 11 at 1:39pm Like
 
Medical Sales College

Congratulations to Kirk P., a Class 108 graduate, who has landed with Marathon Medical - a distributor with a big bag of trauma, total joint, arthroscopy, and biologic products (including Tornier, SBi, Incisive Surgical, ACell, Conformis, and more). Better yet, he got it done about 5 weeks since graduating! Best of luck, Kirk!
 
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February 29 at 1:45pm

4 people like this. 

Dusten Pecor That's great congratulations

March 1 at 10:17pm Like
 
Willester Penn Congratulations Kirk!!

March 11 at 1:39pm Like

 
Medical Sales College

Here are the 8 grads mentioned below... Congrats again,
guys!

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February 28 at 10:39am

Melissa Triano and Andy Fitzpatrick like this. 

Medical Sales College

OK... The admin fell off the radar here, but we have a bunch of placements to celebrate! Congratulations to Pierre G., Tom K., Chad D., Christopher T., Lille T., Justin M., Megan S., and Cory H. who have all accepted positions recently. Megan already has a big case booked for this week! We wish each and every one of these graduates continued success!

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February 27 at 12:25pm

Melissa Triano, Dana Angel Swann and 7 others like this.

Jimmy Norton Class 110 is on the board!!!

February 27 at 1:22pm Like 

Medical Sales College I failed to mention that 3 of these guys were Core5 Orthopaedic Biologics graduates, so a job especially well done to them!

February 27 at 2:56pm Like

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#51 Author of original report

Medical Sales College and Their Fake Testimonials

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at the post directly above and notice 3 things:

1) It attacks me, but does not refute what I wrote. This is because everything I stated is accurate.

2) Its tone sounds angry, frustrated and unprofessional. 

3) The writing style looks exactly like other MSC posts, yet its author pretends to be a consumer.

Still think MSC is legit?
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#52 Consumer Comment

Steve is the FRAUD... Medical Sales College is accurate

AUTHOR: salesgurutj - (United States of America)

Author of this report is the real FRAUD

 Little over 30 days ago a person named Steve New York files a report on the Ripoff Report. Interestingly, according to his first report, he never has attended the Medical Sales College rather was scammed by their tactics. Therefore, he has alerted the general public while filing a report.

This was his first report

Elite Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College AIMS Medical Sales Recruiting/ Medical Sales College Do real medical sales recruiters push job searchers to their expensive affiliated "Medical Sales College." Englewood, Colorado

Next

#1

Elite-MSC is basically classic Modeling School scam

Next

#3

Some Common Arguments You'll Hear From Elite-MSC

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#5

Some Common Tricks Used by Elite-Medical Sales College

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#6

Other Common Arguments by Medical Sales College

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#8

Elite/Medical Sales College Ethics

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#9

Questions to Ask Elite Recruiting and Medical Sales College

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#10

Elite-MSC Will Probably Blame Their Victims

Next

#11

MSC distancing itself from AIMS? In name perhaps, but not in practice.

Next

#13

Elite-MSC Continues to Post Questionable Testimonials

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#14

Medical Sales College Mincing Words (As Usual)

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#15

Elite's unethical loophole. By definition, no recruiter should ever charge the candidate.

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#16

Anatomy of a Fake MSC Testimonial

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#17

Certificate Useless Once Granting Institution Changes its Name

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#19

Fresh Fish Shouldn't Smell Fishy

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#21

MSC Certificate vs. Masters Degree-- a False ROI Argument

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#22

Medical Sales College Grads at a Disadvantage

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#23

That EliteMed Job You Applied For Doesn't Really Exist

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#24

EliteMed-MSC Targeting Taxpayer Dollars Via Student Loans

So, this guy, files 19 reports almost daily? Again, never went to the Medical Sales College but quickly becomes the expert and prophet for the people?

I almost fell for his PATHOLOGICAL LIES until I stumbled across a blog where I could tell it was the same person. It was identical to the reports here and actually copy and pasted on several other blog sites. The pattern was so disturbing that I finally did my own research.

As an interested yet skeptical prospective student, the information provided through the sales college was so believable. It looked actually too good to be true.  That is exactly why I was skeptical. Upon researching, I noticed a few
posts that caught my attention. Until I noticed they were the exact post over-and-over again. I quickly determined that this was the same guy posting almost hourly against the college.

In the most recent posts from a current student, he/she posted several testimonials and a link to the colleges facebook site.  Of course this guy here (Steve) was quick to call them fake-testimonials and made several attempts to persuade the
audience, similar to here! I went to the facebook site and within a couple minutes learned that the college is 100% accurate. I took the latest 30 odd placements over the last month and typed the first name/last initial, added Linkedin
and the Medical Sales College in the Google search bar. I wasnt surprised to learn that every person was listed with his or her own LinkedIn page.  In addition, each search I found multiple other graduates all with jobs post the college sales education.

There is no longer any doubt in my mind that the sales college is absolutely the gateway into medical sales and I look forward to my enrollment. 

As for this guy (Steve-New York), once I realized that he has posted 19 times here and literally hundreds elsewhere, I am certain that he was not someone that the sales college probably even talked to. I am sure he has some hidden agenda with his massive campaign effort. Probably a recruiter would be my guess. Just look at the 19 names of the reports above and you can figure out it is an agenda. He is throwing everything against the wall in desperation. Meanwhile, the sales college has posted results while providing hundreds of families in this economic environment with life-changing dreams.

In the endOnly Steve is a FRAUD!!!!!
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#53 Author of original report

EliteMed-MSC Targeting Taxpayer Dollars Via Student Loans

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

If Medical Sales College (MSC) is allowed to accept federal or federally backed private student loans, then taxpayer dollars are wasted in repaying any resulting bad student debts.

This is because MSC grads who ultimately do not find medical sales jobs through EliteMed-MSC, have a high chance of defaulting on non-dischargeable student loans.
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#54 Author of original report

That EliteMed Job You Applied For Doesn't Really Exist

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

EliteMed continues to post hundreds of medical sales jobs on employment boards such as Career Builder and Monster. Of course, many of these positions do not really exist.  It is their clever ruse to obtain students for Medical Sales College (MSC). 

Ask the EliteMed recruiter who called you about the local job you forwarded your resume for. Chances are, he or she will say that the job was taken by a more qualified MSC graduate, but you could improve your future candidacy for an open position if you "invest" in a MSC certificate.

What legitimate college recruits in this manner? None!





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#55 Author of original report

Medical Sales College Grads at a Disadvantage

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) continues to recruit jobseekers who lack medical sales experience. Because MSC enrolls students using high pressure EliteMed recruiters, the quality of graduates they ultimately produce are probably low.

Essentially, MSC applicants accepted are those gullible enough to relinquish approximately $10,000 (tuition, transportation, room, board, etc.) for a for-profit unaccredited college certificate.

In my opinion, hiring managers view MSC grads as victims, putting MSC certificate holders at a disadvantage compared with other applicants.
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#56 Author of original report

MSC Certificate vs. Masters Degree-- a False ROI Argument

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) will probably continue to tell prospective students that the return on investment (ROI) from a MSC certificate exceeds that of most masters degrees.

Questions that immediately come to mind are:

 1) How did they calculate this claim? (They didn't, of course. It's just another unverifiable MSC assertion.)

2) Can I transfer credits from a MSC certificate towards a masters or Ph.d? (No, since MSC is a non-accredited, for-profit school.)

3) Can a MSC certificate be used for other jobs? (MBAs can be used for many other positions including medical and pharmaceutical sales, but a MSC certificate is specific to medical sales.)

4) Why doe EliteMed-MSC keep using unverifiable claims? (You be the judge on this one.)
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#57 Consumer Comment

SQUIDRACULA POEM.......

AUTHOR: Karl - (USA)

is available at this website.

Just type in 513480 at this site and it appears as 'Consumer Comment #7' at Ripoff Report #513480.

Thank You

***ALERT: Anyone can 'Google' this- VETERANS TODAY GOLDMAN SACHS EMAILS: FIRM HAD 'THE BIG SHORT' AS ECONOMY FELL, and go to that site to see a picture of Squidracula.
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#58 Author of original report

Fresh Fish Shouldn't Smell Fishy

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Your inner voice or instincts often tell you when something just doesn't smell right. Therefore, if you are considering attending Medical Sales College (MSC), first ask yourself the following:

1) Why did you get a call from MSC?
The answer, of course, is because you answered a medical sales job advertisement posted by EliteMed. The EliteMed recruiter probably told you that your resume looks promising, and that an EliteMed rep in your local area will soon contact you about opportunities.

2) Why did the EliteMed recruiter send a followup email after your initial call?
To plant a seed about MSC, of course. Every good salesperson plants seeds.

3) Why did the "local" EliteMed recruiter say that your chances of getting a medical sales position would increase by 2250% if you obtain a MSC certificate?
To sell you MSC, obviously. Thats how they get paid! Dont be fooled when the recruiter says they make $2,000/per placement from hiring companies. That only pertains to EXPERIENCED reps who are STILL employed by a medical device company. 

4) What happened to the local "job" you originally forwarded your resume to EliteMed for?
It probably NEVER even EXISTED. The only reason EliteMed posted the "position" is to obtain your information. They needed your resume so they could pitch you MSC.

5) Did you feel pressured by EliteMed into taking the MSC program?
Of course! Their recruiters are really high pressure sales people trying to make money off job seekers. Traditional recruiters NEVER take money from jobseekers, only wealthy companies.

6) Why does MSC list tons of percentages and testimonials, but not the cost of their program?
Because they try to sell MSCs "value" by obscuring the facts. They will tell you how great your life could be as a medical sales rep, and that an investment in yourself is justified. 

7) Do legitimate colleges recruit students in this manner?
Of course not! You'll never get a solicitation from Harvard or a community college.

8) If MSC really works, then why dont EliteMed salespeople (a.k.a. recruiters) simply take the MSC course and become medical sales reps?
Simple--because MSC does NOT WORK for MOST of their graduates. Keep in mind, EliteMed recruiters do not earn as much money as average medical sales reps, so clearly they would make the switch to medical sales if they could.

Their business model sure smells fishy.
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#59 Consumer Comment

I Agree that it's a Scam

AUTHOR: Tiffany - (United States of America)

Elite Medical Sales Recruiting and every derivative of the company is a scam.

Steve, I totally agree with everything you have said.

To the CEO (Jim Rogers) of Medical Sales College, shame on you for taking advantage of desperate, unemployed individuals!

The reason that some of your so-called graduates just so happen to find Medical Sales jobs, if that even has ever happened, is because you don't need a degree to sell medical equipment in the first place. Hence, no legitimate university has a medical sales program. Just like you don't need a degree to sell insurance. Just like you, Jim Rogers, had no medical sales experience or training before going to work for Stryker. Savvy to take advantage of those without the business acumen necessary to figure this out? Perhaps, but definitely unethical.
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#60 Author of original report

Certificate Useless Once Granting Institution Changes its Name

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Harvard changed its name once in 373 years. Originally called "New College" or "the college at New Towne" in 1636, it was renamed "Harvard College" in 1639.

Likewise, the Ivy League of Cozenage Colleges also changed its name only once. Its recruiting arm, however, already changed its name twice. Of course, these metonyms all came about within only 3 or 4 years, and there is no reason to think they will stop.

The name changes, so far, are as follows:

(SCHOOL)  AIMS---> Medical Sales College (a.k.a. MSC)---> ?

(RECRUITING ARM)  Blue Chip---> AIMS---> EliteMed---> ?

So what does a certificate from any of these entities mean once an entity changes names? The answer is simple: NOTHING! 

Before you pay for an expensive certificate, ask yourself how long will the granting institution be around? 




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#61 Author of original report

Anatomy of a Fake MSC Testimonial

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Gross Anatomy breaks down the components of the human body in order to help one better understand how the whole body functions as a system.

Below is the anatomy of a classic fake Medical Sales College (MSC) testimonial. It was designed to make a prospective MSC student lower his or her guard against their sales tactics.

1) DISQUALIFIER- makes one think that all negative posts about MSC are just "mess."

Hopefully my message will be sorted out from all the mess that has accumulated on this thread.

2) QUALIFIER- makes one believe that author is a "real student." 

I just graduated from MSC today as valedictorian of my class. 

3) INTERROGATOR- makes one question the validity of negative posts about MSC.

I'm not sure why there is so much negativity on these boards. I loved my experience at MSC and the education is top notch. I learned more in 8 weeks than at least a year on the field. It is an extremely intense program and competitive between classmates. 

4) BOOSTER- raises hopes that those without medical sales experience can break into the field via a certificate.

It's also a great place for newbies to ask "stupid questions" before they get a job and prevent asking those "stupid questions" in front of doctors or bosses. I came from a completely unrelated field (energy and engineering) and came to the school with drive and passion for this industry.

5) PROMISER- indicates that something favorable will come from MSC.

 I was interviewing with 6 companies while in school and received an offer before I graduated (accepted it yesterday). I can't wait to start my job in a few weeks and thank MSC for all of the helpful guidance and great education.

6) SUPPLEMENTER- adds that there are no downsides to MSC.

I don't have a single negative thing to say about MSC. It was a great investment in education for myself.

7) DIVERTER- lures one elsewhere for ambush. In this case, to "Linkedin," where MSC creates fictitious unchallenged, unverifiable resumes.

For those of you interested in attending, I suggest you field LinkedIn for graduates and ask them about their experiences. That's what I did. I hope that this post is useful for some of you reading this messy thread.

8) SIGNATURE- makes one think the poster has a name, and hence a "real student."

C. C.


You decide if the following is from an actual unaffiliated MSC graduate or from an Elite-MSC owner/employee:

Originally Posted by Anonymous on Cafepharma

Hopefully my message will be sorted out from all the mess that has accumulated on this thread.
I just graduated from MSC today as valedictorian of my class. I'm not sure why there is so much negativity on these boards. I loved my experience at MSC and the education is top notch. I learned more in 8 weeks than at least a year on the field. It is an extremely intense program and competitive between classmates. It's also a great place for newbies to ask "stupid questions" before they get a job and prevent asking those "stupid questions" in front of doctors or bosses. I came from a completely unrelated field (energy and engineering) and came to the school with drive and passion for this industry. I was interviewing with 6 companies while in school and received an offer before I graduated (accepted it yesterday).

I can't wait to start my job in a few weeks and thank MSC for all of the helpful guidance and great education. I don't have a single negative thing to say about MSC. It was a great investment in education for myself.

For those of you interested in attending, I suggest you field LinkedIn for graduates and ask them about their experiences. That's what I did. I hope that this post is useful for some of you reading this messy thread.

C. C.
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#62 Author of original report

Elite's unethical loophole. By definition, no recruiter should ever charge the candidate.

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Check this out. Sound familiar? Oh right, Elite recruiters do not charge candidates... they conveniently push jobseekers who respond to their "job ads" toward their very expensive Medical Sales College (MSC). See their clever loophole? At the end of the day, those running Elite are charging jobseekers. Again, just my opinion. 

Clues to Spotting Bad Recruiters and Scams
By Rita Ashley, August 4, 2011
Just because you are vulnerable doesnt mean you have to be a victim.

http://jobsearch4execs.com/2011/08/04/clues-to-spotting-bad-recruiters-and-scams/

"If a recruiter asks for a fee, they are not a recruiter. By definition, no recruiter should ever charge the candidate; if they have a search, the company pays.  If they charge, that makes them an employment agency, not a recruiter. Again, run away.

Dont let your desire to find a plethora of resources cloud your vision about recruiters. If you chose the wrong one(s) they can do serious damage to your self confidence and your search.  There are many excellent recruiters hired by companies to source qualified candidates. Learn to tell the difference and you will avoid all the angst and anger the recruitings bad apples spread."
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#63 Author of original report

Medical Sales College Mincing Words (As Usual)

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at post #12 entitled "Face it...It works!" by Mike B. - Roswell, United States of America. Mike is allegedly a real student of MSC. 

Notice he says:  "...the Medical Sales College is entirely different. It has NEVER changed its name..."

When have I ever written that Medical Sales College changed its name? Never! MSC's recruiting arm, on the other hand, changed its name 3 times within 3 or 4 years: going from Blue Chip, to AIMS, to Elite. 

Post #12 is just another example of MSC mincing words in order to fool consumers. When arguing one point, they use "MSC." When arguing another point, they use "Elite," etc.

Also, did you catch when Mike says MSC now has relationships with other recruiters "with 20 years experience in device sales or device recruitment"? My guess is, these recruiters are paid by MSC for sending jobseekers to MSC. Isn't this possible racketeering?

Finally, how does a real student know such business relationships between MSC and outside recruiters? It's a no brainer. Mike works for or owns MSC. Perhaps "Mike B." is really Scott Binder or Jim Rogers.
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#64 Author of original report

Elite-MSC Continues to Post Questionable Testimonials

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Examine the post above from an alleged "real student" of Medical Sales College (MSC), then ask yourself:

1) Does it sound like it's from a student, or from someone affiliated with MSC? 
2) How exactly does a student know the number of recruiters working with MSC? 

Its author might be a "student" since, as an owner or employee of Elite-MSC, he sat through their program.

 
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#65 Consumer Comment

Face it...It works!

AUTHOR: Mike B. - (United States of America)

Just look through these posts carefully. An unidentified certain someone who claims never to have attended the college manages to author nine of the eleven comments while the owner has posted once. He posts on Wednesday, Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Had I posted earlier, he would have made it five days in a row not four. Do you really believe that anyone reading this wouldnt question his motive? An innocent bystander just trying to help the human population on a daily basis? This has personal agenda written all over it! 

Immediately post my comments on Thursday, he rants on about worthless opinions that lack depth, knowledge and most important facts. He questions why a student would support the college? I assume if someone (who didnt attend) the prestigious MIT in Massachusetts would make a ridiculous comment about the college, one of the 1,000 new students would respond in defense. Keep in mind that between the graduates and the sales training provided for medical sales corporations, I am sure that MSC has instructed more than 1,000 people. This would be equivalent to the enrollment annually for MIT. As to why would I defend? This is simple; I have invested my money in a dream opportunity that I support 100%. Myself and other students have our investments to support. 

He questions the poor selectivity, which lends to an even more impressive feat based on the hundreds of placements. 

As to my previous statements regarding the Medical Sales College, this is a licensed college that has participated in a process for approval. It has an impeccable record since its origination in 2010. Contrary to his opinion with constant comparison to its previous predecessor AIMS; the Medical Sales College is entirely different. It has NEVER changed its name as it was incorporated as the same company it is today. According to my original research, AIMS was never a licensed college, was operated with an entirely different group of people and participated in both education and recruitment. According to previous statements made elsewhere, the Medical Sales College was required by state law to move out the recruitment services. Looking through the construction of the recruitment team, all of the major members had ZERO affiliation with AIMS. The President/Owner of Elite Medical Recruiting brought on several new recruiters many with more than 20 years experience in device sales or device recruitment. They now stand as the largest team in medical sales recruiting. 

In his latest of nine comments here, he makes yet the most ridiculous statement yet. He talks about the certification putting a student at a disadvantage versus doing nothing. They college had been recognized in several publications including CBS and the Wall Street Journal. They not only educate individuals like myself looking to break into the industry, the same hiring manufactures are sending in experienced reps for sales training from the Medical Sales College. They have more than 60 executives documented that have inquired or physically toured the college including all of the major manufactures training and some executive members. There is a reason why they have 200 or more openings (see job board) and more than 450 graduates currently in medical sales. It is the best scenario for hiring managers and job seekers alike. Why would a device company be interested in doing a personality test when the college has a real 8-week test?

As I said before, do your research with those that actually attended. Both the Medical Sales College and Elite Medical Recruiting have publicly made available more than 400 people for you to speak with including hiring managers. I did it and suggest the same if you are considering attending.
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#66 Author of original report

MSC distancing itself from AIMS? In name perhaps, but not in practice.

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Medical Sales College (MSC) will probably tell consumers they are distancing themselves from AIMS Recruiting. The truth is, AIMS simply changed its name to Elite. Perhaps some policies were altered during the metamorphosis, but the same key players remain. Actually, "metamorphosis" is too strong a word, since in this case the caterpillar remains serpentine. 

Like AIMS, the primary mission of Elite is still to recruit students for MSC. Elite might now charge hiring companies $2,000 per EXPERIENCED rep, but they probably still make most of their money from hopeful inexperienced jobseekers. 

Remember, AIMS once advertised they charged hiring companies ZERO fees. The new $2,000 fee Elite charges hiring companies is probably so they may now claim they have a financial incentive to place MSC grads. In reality, however, Elite can still survive even if they place zero MSC grads.

If MSCs recruiting arm is so successful, then why would they change its name from Blue Chip, to AIMS, to Elite within a 3 to 4 year period? The distancing more than likely has everything to do with avoiding legal, financial and reputational issues.

Finally, having a Medical Sales College Certificate on ones resume might actually put one at a disadvantage over other applicants since HR departments are now becoming aware that certificate holders were SOLD a controversial for-profit educational product. Again, all points are just my opinion.
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#67 Author of original report

Elite-MSC Will Probably Blame Their Victims

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

We've all seen this on TV:
A defense attorney blames a rape victim by saying she was dressed too provocatively, or she was hanging out at the wrong place at the wrong time, or she is of low character, or she was the one who solicited the defendant, etc. Your classic "blame the victim" strategy.

Elite-MSC uses this same basic strategy by blaming MSC graduates who are not placed within 90 days after graduation. Five common arguments you might hear are, the MSC grad:

1)Exhibits poor face-to-face interviewing skills. 

They love this excuse since students are generally "accepted" via a phone "interview," so Elite-MSC can argue that they performed their due diligence by making sure the applicant interviews well. Of course, Elite-MSC didn't anticipate that the applicant would perform poorly under the pressure of a face-to-face interview.

2) Is unmotivated or lazy. 

3) Cannot pass the interviewing company's personality test.

4) Elite-MSC cannot work miracles, only an 81% placement rate. 

Because they claim 450 grads were placed, then doesn't that mean they've only had a total of 506 students since their door opened? Doubt it.

5) Elite only promised an interview, NOT job placement.

Perhaps this is what their contract says, BUT do levelheaded consumers really invest approximately $10,000 (tuition, travel expenses, room and board, etc.) for an interview? My guess is, Elite recruiters verbally exaggerate the merits of their program.

This is not an exhaustive list. In reality, the initial phone "interview" one receives from Elite is just a cleverly veiled sales call designed to sell MSC. The phone or face-to-face interview one conveniently receives within 90 days after graduation, I suspect, may occasionally be conducted by someone without an open position.

On the question of selectivity:
Picture a herd of gazelles. A predator only takes what is slow enough for it to catch. In that sense, it is "selective" by not taking them all. Again, I believe everything I have written, but they are still just my opinion. 
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#68 Author of original report

Questions to Ask Elite Recruiting and Medical Sales College

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

For those considering MSC, before you pay, ask them to answer IN WRITING the following questions:

1) What is the name of the device company for which Elite was advertising in your area?
***Chances are, the "job" to which you forwarded Elite your resume never existed. Elite just wanted your resume so they could sell you MSC.***

2) How was their 81% placement rate calculated?
***You won't get a straight answer, since this figure is probably based on a very small select group of students.***

3) Who placed these 81%, Elite, MSC, the students themselves, or a combination?
***They'll probably say, who cares how they were placed. It is important to find out since it will reveal how well Elite finds jobs for MSC grads versus just recruiting students for MSC.***

4) How many experienced non-MSC grads have Elite placed?
***The answer probably is NONE or close to none, since Elite tries to sell MSC to everyone.***

5) Will you get a full refund if you are not placed into a medical sales job 90 days after graduation?
***Their answer, of course, will be NO. Theyll probably tell you something like MDs do not receive refunds from medical schools if they are not placed into internships after graduation. 

6) If they say the 90 day guarantee only pertains to an interview, then ask them if the interviewer will be one of the large medical device companies.
***A phone interview from one of their alleged distributor affiliates doesn't count. You will not know for sure if the person youre speaking with even has an open position.***

7) How many DID NOT find medical sales jobs after graduation?
***According to them, theyve placed 450 people. Since they claim 81% placement, then doesn't that mean that only around 106 MSC graduates were not placed? Chances are there are many more people they did not find jobs for.*** 

In my opinion, Elite/MSC should not be able to use "ignorance" of their actions as a defense since they are aware of this blog. They are complicit and liable. 
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#69 Author of original report

Elite/Medical Sales College Ethics

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Look at the rebuttal directly above this post and notice that:

1) Its author claims to be a Medical Sales College (MSC) student. Ask yourself, what "student" would champion his or her school in such a defensive and passionately technical manner? The person responding obviously works for or owns Elite/MSC. 

2) The rebuttal is ladened with profanities-- clearly showing lack of professionalism. 

3) It minces words by saying MSC does not have any BBB complaints. Again, here is a link showing their recruiting arm AIMS (now called Elite, once called Blue Chip) had many complaints:

http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/employment-training/american-institute-of-medical-sales-in-englewood-co-90110812

4) They never reveal in writing how they calculated their claim of "81% placement." Their response, essentially, is to have you look it up from some agency. Is the 81% based on their first 40 students or every student ever admitted? We will never know for sure.

5) They do not tell you that many medical device companies administer a personality exam to applicants, i.e., the Gallup. How can a for-profit college teach one to pass a personality exam (doesnt test for right or wrong answers)?

6) MSC recruits online. Therefore, regardless of looks, a person who can pay tuition can still get in. In reality, regardless of how morally wrong, illegal or politically incorrect it is, physical beauty is very important in medical and pharmaceutical sales. If you're short, unattractive, nonathletic, over 40, etc., you probably will not get hired. The EEOC exists for a reason-- hiring people still discriminate.

Again, all I have written are just my opinion. I started this blog to get consumers thinking and to help them not get ripped off.
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#70 Consumer Comment

Medical Sales College - From a real student

AUTHOR: Mike B. - (United States of America)



So let me get this straight, you have self-proclaimed to be the sole fighter against the Medical Sales College and Elite Medical Sales Recruiting. You have posted numerous posts that are identical and in many cases literally copied from one blog to another. To date, there are negative threads on CafPharma in which you have posted and one on the Ripoff Report which you have posted. The threads are identical in posting and message. You have admitted to the fact that YOU are the one posting as an act of being the consumer advocate for others. You also have posted that you have not attended the school but in your opinion it is a scam. 


I being an actual student am more than willing to pick a school yard fight and ask for simple yes or no answers to solve this debate. I said earlier that you are full of shit and have an agenda to fill. I did my actual research and am happy to share.


You mentioned that the school although licensed and approved through the Higher Education Department in Colorado could not verify that it isnt a scam.


Why would the school Medical Sales College which has been in existence  since 2010, never receive ANY complaints from students in the history of its existence?


In doing MY research I contacted Jim Parker with the State Education Department that verified two very important facts about the college. 1) They indeed since the very beginning have never received a complaint!  2) They are BONDED as a college which the State Of Colorado holds cash (bond) in the event that any student had a reason to be refunded as well as the viability of MSC as a college. In the event that you were correct (which you obviously are not), all students would be refunded tuition!


Question #1 - Are you saying that the Medical Sales College has received a complaint with the Department of Education? The answer is NO
Question #2 Are you disagreeing that the college is bonded? The answer is YES they are bonded protecting the consumer 100%!


MSC employs medical doctors to teach certain courses, therefore it cannot be a scam


Are you seriously trying to compare MSC with a surgeon facility that includes multiple active surgeons from some of the finest education centers such as Stanford, Yale and others as an example of the US Army invading Iraq? What the hell does that have to do in proving your point? It just proves that you are reaching for anything and that you are a complete retard!


81% placement rate in answers supplied earlier were confirmed and audited by the State. In fact, they (MSC) supplied the actual auditors names.


This is the best and easiest way to once again PROVE that you are full of shit! You made a statement that the testimonials are of an unverifiable origin?


Really a person needs nothing more than this to decide what is true and what is fabrication in this debate. MSC has on their website more than 100 pages of testimonials from former students (http://elitemed.com/graduate-testimonials/) with pictures, names and experiences. You can easily cross reference this list of names be using a simple Google search or using a networking site like LinkedIn. I DID and that is exactly how I determined rather this college was real or not. After speaking to several people, I quickly realized the value of MSC. ON the Elite Med site, MSC has a referral list of 300-400 placed students (http://elitemed.com/reference-list/) with their names, locations and ALL are available to speak with interested candidates.


Question#3 How on earth would the college have so many testimonials and referrals if it was a scam? It would be one thing if the college have a couple friends to say nice things, but 400 plus referrals and testimonials? The school has only been open since 2010!


Seeming how I and everyone else is tired of hearing you bullshit theory and because you continue to remain anonymous, I am ONLY interested in you answering the following questions. If you cannot answer the questions, it becomes very apparent of your agenda in this manner.


These are the only questions I nor anyone else would like for you to answer


What complaints can you confirm that the Medical Sales College have received?


Better Business Bureau ? http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/schools-academic-colleges-and-universities/medical-sales-college-in-englewood-co-90126557


I see and A rating with a following date since 2010 with ZERO complaints filled.


I received confirmation from the Jim Parker at the State Of Colorado Higher Education that the Medical Sales College has never received a complaint.


I see not a single lawsuit or any other action from a government agency


Can you deny that the Medical Sales College is a BONDED college?


This would indicate that upon a disagreement a student has recourse to tuition! If so, does a student have anything at risk?




Can you confirm that any of the 100+ pages of student testimonials or the employer testimonials are fake or misrepresented?


I see several of the names, pictures that can be crossed referenced with social media such as Linkedin, Facebook and Google.


Why would the Medical Sales College have a list of references of more than 300 people willing to talk with students if it was a scam?
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#71 Author of original report

Other Common Arguments by Medical Sales College

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Beware of the following arguments by Medical Sales College. 

1) MSC was approved and is regulated by the Colorado Department of Higher Education, Private Occupational School Board, therefore it cannot be a scam.

Of course, Bernard L. Madoff Investment Securities LLC was approved and regulated by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC).  

***Just because a business is approved and regulated by a governmental agency, doesn't mean that business isn't doing wrong to those it allegedly serves.***

2) MSC employs medical doctors to teach certain courses, therefore it cannot be a scam.

Their argument essentially goes like this:
There are honest, patriotic, educated, and highly decorated generals working for the U.S. Army.
Therefore, invading Iraq under the false pretense that Iraq has WMDs could not have been a scam.  

***Just because there are good people working at MSC, doesn't make the business itself legit. No one is saying that their medical doctor employees are in on the scam.***

I still believe MSC lures students through often bogus job advertisements from Elite (--formerly called AIMS-- which was formerly called Blue Chip. Name changed 3 times within 4 years). Their "interview" call is really just a sales call.

They boast an 81% placement rate, but will not put in writing on how they came up with this figure. 

Finally, they offer many testimonials of unverifiable origin, so it is impossible to separate fact from fiction.

Again, everything I have written here and elsewhere are just my opinion. You'll have to decide for yourself whether or not you believe Elite-MSC is a scam.






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#72 Author of original report

Some Common Tricks Used by Elite-Medical Sales College

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

The CEOs of both Elite and Medical Sales College (MSC) have responded to this post. Ask yourself, what busy CEO would even acknowledge scam allegations about their program, let alone write such long rebuttals? 

You won't see the deans of University of Phoenix or Kaplan responding to the many Ripoff Reports about them. This should alert you to the lack of professionalism at Elite-MSC.

I suspect the reason these two CEOs filed rebuttals is because they know what I have written is accurate. Notice that they do not systematically respond to my points, but instead use the following tricks:

1) They inundate an argument with long lists of unverifiable testimonials.

2) They post second person responses to make the reader think that unaffiliated people are defending their program. 

3) They attempt to convince the reader that I am simply a competitive recruiter with an agenda against them.

My only "agenda" is to expose these people. I am not a recruiter, but instead a medical sales representative who once answered one of their "job openings." I suspect the "opening" in my area never even existed since:

1) I have 4+ years experience selling in the operating room to orthopaedic surgeons, yet AIMS/Elite still tried to sell me their MSC program. Meanwhile, MSC's website clearly says 

"Our designed medical sales programs transform a selling professional as if they have been in the medical sales industry for 12-24 months." 

I have over 48 months of medical sales experience, yet they still tried to sell me.

2) Had I taken their 8 week program, then wouldn't the original "job advertisement" I responded to have been filled by the time I graduated from their college?

I very quickly realized that MSC recruits through fictitious job advertisements, and that their main goal is to make most of their money off vulnerable jobseekers, not wealthy hiring companies. 

They try to establish their legitimacy through the number of people who have signed up with them and through their alleged accomplishments. Didnt Bernie Madoff use this same trick?

Again, all I have written are just my opinion. You have to make up your own mind. Caveat emptor - "Let the buyer beware. 


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#73 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Best way to learn about the Medical Sales College or Elite Med - Talk to former students and placements

AUTHOR: Scott Binder - (United States of America)

We received another response from a former student of the Medical Sales College that suggested I share this information and has offered to speak with any interested candidate.

Thank you Jay!

This thread started with someone that has never attended the college or has had any experience with our recruitment company. Reading through his arguments, you quickly learn he obviously has a motive.

The real truth on the effectiveness and process would be better learned through the hundreds of gainfully employed medical sales representatives that have utilized our services. We are interested as the largest recruitment company in delivering experienced, dedicated professionals to our customers. They specifically have requested competitive reps or trained selling professionals. 95% of our more then 250 current positions have requested this experience. We have seen our growth increase from only 40 openings in the summer to more than six times that a few months later! 

The following is a list that Jay has created that has more than 25 references from former students and employers listed on the Medical Sales College website. We have an additional 100+ references willing to speak with anyone. 

Lilly T.

From the moment I called the Medical Sales College I knew that I had found the right place for me to bring together all of my education and experiences into an incredibly exciting field. The curriculum at MSC is very demanding and dynamic; exactly what I expected from my investment. I feel confident in my ability to not only learn the technical aspects of any medical
device area, but more importantly I gained the confidence to succeed in choosing this as a new career direction for me. The staff at MSC demand the best of their students, which fosters their vision to improve medical sales globally with a trained and credentialed sales force. I am proud to have been part of a wonderful opportunity at MSC.

Amy W.

Words cannot express how thankful I am for Medical Sales College. As a flight attendant with no sales experience, MSC not only taught me invaluable sales experience but it also gave me the confidence to know that I will be successful in this industry. The standard of excellence that is modeled at every level of MSC inspires me to be excellent! I honestly think the
monetary expense and time away from home is a small price to pay for what I learned. Thank you MSC for this life changing experience. I would recommend and have recommended this program to any one who wants to enter into this field.

Brian B.

MSC offers fantastic course work and the guidance necessary to break into the challenging field of Medical Device Sales. I interviewed with three different companies and now have a position in this industry. These opportunities took place because of the Medical Sales College. I highly recommend this program.

James Mckissic

Before I went to AIMS, I had strong B2B sales experience but I lacked the knowledge and experience needed to make my way into the medical device industry. AIMS helped me bridge the gap! Ive been working in the industry for almost two years now. Going to AIMS was the best choice I could have made for my career! Thanks to the whole AIMS team!

J.D. Cashman

There is no question that the medical device industry is one of the toughest to break into. After trying for nearly two years I decided to attend Medical Sales College. I can say with complete honesty that the experience was well worth the investment. The two month education process was challenging but extremely rewarding. Lectures are delivered with passion and the classroom environment is always engaging. Upon graduating from the Spine program I had several interviews with several great companies that I never would have been able to meet with had I not attended Medical Sales College. If you are passionate about working in this industry you should not hesitate to apply. My experience was nothing short of incredible.

Tom Petrowski

I recently graduated from the Medical Sales College. The education I received was top notch. They gave me the confidence and the skill set which will allow me to be successful as I begin my Medical Device Sales Rep position with Stryker!! I thank the Medical Sales College for helping me break into this exciting industry!!

Tom Cregg

I highly recommend attending the Medical Sales College. If you have experienced the difficulties breaking into this industry due to not having the medical background, then this is the place for you. I would not have been able to get the interviews and obtain a position without it.

Joe Mascis

I tried to get a job in medical device sales for close to two years before I found AIMS College. I had plenty of sales experience but no prior medical sales experience. I could not get an interview with anybody. After completing my 10-week program with AIMS, I was interviewing with two medical devise companies and landed a job with Zimmer. I wont lie, the interview process was very tough but had it not been for the AIMS training on my resume, I would have never been in considered. Once I started working I was more knowledgeable and quicker to adapt to the environment then other new hires. I still refer to things I learned at AIMS to this day.

John Bramhall

With out a doubt one of the best decisions I have ever made! This 8 - week program changed my LIFE! Not only did I land a great job, I made some new relationships that will last a lifetime! I'm so thankful for the entire staff at The Medical Sales College!!

David Lavery

I just wanted to update you and the crew that I have moved on to a new position with Synthes Trauma. I am very happy with the move and I wanted to thank everyone at MSC for the advantages you provided to me by attending the program. This was key in that the manager who hired me loved that I was willing to take a risk and invest in myself by attending MSC. My new
position with Synthes included an awesome compensation package and I am very grateful for this opportunity

Timothy Grace

I attended Medical Sales College in February/March of 2011 based on the referral of a previous graduate. This school was definitely above and beyond my highest expectations. The hiring managers I interviewed with couldn't believe the knowledge I attained in just eight weeks. I truly felt the passion each and everyday that came from my instructors. I believe this
institution is making great changes this industry daily. Nonetheless I am extremely happy with my new career and thank MSC for all the wonderful knowledge I gained.

Brett Cleverdon

If you are looking to break into medical sales, and have no prior experience in the industry, Medical Sales College is without a doubt the way to go. There is such a huge learning curve in medical sales, which is why employers are hesitant to hire people without any experience. The training by the staff at MSC and the tools they provide will give you a HUGE competitive
edge over other job seekers. I am proud to say that I was hired on by DePuy, one of the best and largest orthopaedic companies in the world, a week after graduating. Not only that, I was hired into an award-winning distributorship
and given my own territory. After just 18 months in the field on my own, I am close to a producing a million dollar territory that previously did not have any representation. I have even won a few trauma sales contests and earned some very nice bonuses with my short time in the field. I thank MSC for giving me the opportunity to have what I feel is the greatest job in the world.

Amy Wamsley

I am writing to thank Medical Sales College for my success in the medical device field. I work for Smith & Nephew orthopedics and use what I learned from the school everyday. I wouldn't even be half as successful if I hadn't attended. I say if you want to break into the medical device industry you should absolutely start the medical sales college and GO! You will never regret your decision. You will study your ass off, you will be stressed, you will be happy, you will lose sleep but you will graduate with a tremendous sense of accomplishment and hopefully a job. It is the best decision I ever made!

Joel Smith

I am writing this letter to let others know about my experience at Medical Sales College (MSC). I was looking for options getting into Medical Device sales and found MSC as one of my top choices. It was a difficult decision with a huge commitment of time, money, and sacrifice on my part. The potential of getting into the industry held huge promise and a phenomenal up side. MSC and its instructors gave me the foundation needed to be successful in the Medical Device industry. I can say without any reservation that I would not be where I am today without the instruction, guidance, and direction that I received from MSC.

James Hallbeck

AIMS was the best decision that I ever made. The training that I got there gave me a huge competitive advantage coming out of the classroom into the field. I was a rookie rep with the confidence and knowledge of a two year rep. Rob Mitchell was my instructor and really was precise in giving our class enough information to truly be effective as a rep. Since graduating AIMS, I have been working now for Wright Medical for 15 months. During that time I took a territory basically doing $10K per month in business and expanded it to $70K per month selling only foot and ankle products. Currently in my distributorship I am the only rep running over 100% to quota. Thanks again AIMS for giving me a new start to a successful career.

Jordan Workman

AIMS not only prepared me to land a career with one of the top spine companies in the world, but also supplied me with a solid foundation to hit the ground running right away. The Spine program, lead by the infamous Mitch Seigars, helped accelerated my learning curve, and get to my very own territory quicker. It was a great experience and I'd recommend it to anyone looking to break into the industry. Thanks.

Ian McCormick

I have nothing but the best to say about this school. I graduated a few years ago and have been happily working in the medical device field. My thanks and appreciation lie in a few key individuals who helped me get into the school, and eventually into the field. My primary study of focus was not what I ended up actually doing but the school gave me a great fundamental understanding of basic medical information I needed to know as well as a good introduction to life as a rep. The most valuable piece of the puzzle was after my schooling. The connections with device manufacturers and distributors was priceless. I had tried time and again previously to get into the industry but I needed someone on the inside. This school was it. They have
made many changes since I have been involved with the school but I know there are a few individuals still with the company that make this a great opportunity for people like myself

Josh Strom

Medical Sales College is worth every penny and more. Not only did I receive invaluable training and knowledge that has put steps ahead of the competition, but also their dedicated staff of recruiters helped me to land in my dream career. Furthermore, the instruction and tutelage does not stop when you leave the school, I can call Medical Sales College today and
anyone of the instructors would lend their expertise and knowledge to help a former graduate because they want you to succeed that is priceless! My only complaint regarding Medical Sales College is I wish the in-house portion in Denver lasted longer because I was not ready to leave the relationships I had formed with my peers and the Medical Sales College staff; I will always value those relationships.

Scott K

If you are looking to find an opening into medical sales, this is the absolute BEST way to do it. I worked hard and got the most out of my training and it is paying off now that I am in the field.

Nicole Tittle

Medical Sales College provided me more than just a basic understanding of the industry. After completion of the 8 week course, I had product knowledge, selling strategies, and the confidence to communicate effectively with surgeons. This program changed my life by enabling me to succeed in an industry that had previously been difficult to break into. I have
been working for a while now, and the entire staff continues to provide support and encouragement. I would HIGHLY recommend this program to anyone who is serious and dedicated to doing whatever it takes to succeed in the medical device
world.

 
Nikki C.

 
Medical Sales College and the fantastic team at AIMS provided me with the training and support I needed to land my first medical device sales position. Top-notch sales training combined with medical and procedural training to back it up. Be prepared to work just as hard as you will in the field. I highly recommend this program!


Max Krupp

The Academy course was rigorous and filled with lots of hands-on training. Not a day passed by where I did not feel overwhelmed by the intensity and nature of the course. But with the difficulty came the reward. By the end of the course, I felt extremely confident about my abilities, and was able to obtain a sales position with DePuy Orthopaedics in under 3 weeks of graduating. Since then, I have been able to speak with surgeons, representatives, and other healthcare employees about orthopaedic surgery in a way that I would never have before deemed possible. And while there is still a plethora of topics, surgical techniques, and medical instruments to learn about, I have been able to effectively shorten the learning curve of this
difficult career by the time and effort I put into the training I received at MSC.

 http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2009/jan/13/medical-sales-school-greets-students/

It's too early to say if the school will be a lasting success, but it's already attracted interest from companies.

"What this school will produce is what we and other orthopedic companies are looking for," he said.

Bob Purcell, vice president of sales for Gainesville, Fla.-based Exactech.

Also touring the facility were Phil Mercier and Michael Peters, who run the orthopedic sales rep training academy for medical device maker Smith & Nephew.

"We're looking to explore how it could better train someone coming into our program," Peters said.

New center to train medical device sales representatives

By Daniel Connolly

There's a strong need for better-trained medical device sales representatives, said Albert Dacosta, a regional sales manager for Wright who has worked closely with Rogers.

"I hire somebody new, and I will spend the first five months, four months with somebody teaching them all the things they need to know that they would never read in a book," Dacosta said. Rogers' school could shorten the process, he said.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2009/aug/13/tough-sell/

Just ask William Warrender Jr., senior vice president of global sales for Austin-based Ascension Orthopedics, how tough it is to find an orthopedic sales rep -- a position not only responsible for selling artificial knees and hips to surgeons, but also required to accompany them to the operating room as a hands-off aide.

Sales people are learning not only how to sell orthopedic devices, but also how the devices function in classes taught by Ascension Orthopedics. Chip Tubbs (left) of Atlanta and Matt Thompson of Phoenix get hands-on experience with devices.

Orthopedic sales reps are in high demand, and Ascension Orthopedics offers an extensive education in the devices. William F. Warrender Jr., senior vice president of global sales for Ascension, talks with students.

"Oh, heck yes," said Warrender, who has had to fire 50 percent of his sales team.

Too often good sales reps already have jobs and can't be lured away due to noncompete contracts.

Moreover, companies take big risks hiring outside the industry, usually waiting a year before new hires show fruit.

That's why Warrender isn't taking any chances this time.

He plans to hire his next 10 sales reps from this program.
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#74 Author of original report

Some Common Arguments You'll Hear From Elite-MSC

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

Beware of how they word things. They try to confuse you by using "MSC" when arguing one point, then "Elite" or "AIMS" when arguing another. You practically have to be a lawyer to deal with them.

1) They claim that MSC has no BBB complaints and that only one person is responsible for trying to discredit them-- allegedly a competitive recruiter.  Interestingly, the BBB lists AIMS as having an "F" rating. Here is a link proving their recruiting arm "AIMS" had at least 13 different people file BBB complaints:
http://www.bbb.org/denver/business-reviews/employment-training/american-institute-of-medical-sales-in-englewood-co-90110812

2)  They claim that Elite does NOT charge students. True, however, Elite pushes recruits toward MSC which indeed charges them thousands. 

3) They claim that Elite charges hiring companies the least in the industry at $2,000 per recruit. This, allegedly, is the reason why other recruiters are jealous of them. 

The truth is, they made and probably continue to make most of their money from vulnerable students, not hiring companies. Elite could technically charge ZERO, just as AIMS charged zero. 

Quote from AIMS brochure proving they once only charged students: 

"...Zero Fee Recruiting. We make these graduates available to our corporate and distributor customers at no charge to make placement as easy and quick as possible."

(Keep in mind: since AIMS charged zero recruiting fees, then what financial incentive did they have to place MSC grads? NONE.  I'm betting Elite is the same way, since they still make their real money from MSC.)

4) Within a 4 year period, they changed their recruiting arms name from Blue Chip, to AIMS, to Elite, allegedly "to make things less confusing." What could possibly be more confusing? The true reason must be something more illicit. 

5) They claim to have placed varying numbers of MSC grads in top companies. The numbers they quote change from 360, to over 400, to almost 450, to almost 600--without any consistency. Also, who placed these graduates, Elite or MSC? It's all very convoluted and confusing.

It is up to you, the consumer, to interpret the actions of Elite-MSC. All I have written in Rip Off Report and elsewhere are purely my opinion, and my only agenda is to warn you of what I believe is an educational scam. 
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#75 REBUTTAL Owner of company

When you're the best, somebody is losing business

AUTHOR: Scott Binder - (United States of America)

You will notice that the author of the above response is not a client of Elite Med or a former student of the Medical Sales College. It is specific to his/her opinion and is fueled with a certain agenda.

Our company had grown as the largest in the industry without ANY lodged complaints ever from any person that has attended the Medical Sales College or has had any representation through Elite Med or AMSR.

Furthermore, due to the ability to post an anonymous report, this has been the selected format. We have never nor has the Medical Sales College had any negative posts (complaints) to REAL agencies such as the Attorney Generals Office, State Authorities, Better Business Burial or any other recognized authority. 

We do however threaten most if not all recruitment companies because our fees are significantly less (on average - $10,000 less per placement CHARGED TO THE EMPLOYER). We also have more positions (jobs) than any other recruitment firm by far! As you read below you can quickly understand why.

We do however receive in some months more than 30,000 resumes and filter as necessary. In most cases the candidate is not qualified on the basis of the ad requiring experience. The Medical Sales College is offered as one of three responses to those that have applied without reading the requirements.

For those the do attend the Medical Sales College, they are licensed, regulated and BONDED with the State of Colorado Education Commission. If any student EVER felt that the learning was less than described or in any way they were "scammed - as described", they would have full recourse to the tuition and expenses through the State of Colorado. However, nobody that has ever attended the Medical Sales College has asked for such.

This clearly is an effort from this same person to defame this great organization.

If someone is interested in learning about the process of Elite Med, The Medical Sales College or any other questions, we invite them to ask. I can be contacted at sbinder@elitemed.com

We have access to almost 500 placed graduates of the educational platform taught at the Medical Sales College and can provide hundreds of people you can speak with. They have attended the program and are working in Medical Sales.

We have several placements OUTSIDE of Medical Sales Graduates and can provide them as well. We have placed 5 experienced  (without MSC - former medical sales reps) just in the last few days.

I had previously responded to the SAME poster on a different blog with the following response.

What is the process for Elite Med Recruiting?

I am more than willing to clear the air on the constant misconceptions within this industry.

Rarely does a candidate with no previous medical sales experience understand the process involved to both land a job and succeed. This industry as a medical sales representative is NOT easy! It is more difficult today than ever to succeed due to several changes in the industry. Hiring managers find it much more difficult to hire competitive reps due to non-competes. New reps in this business often fail because of their lack of readiness and difficulty with the learning process.

Unfortunately, many candidates have no idea of the competition they face when submitting a resume. The best way to explain is to understand what our customers (employers) are looking for in a candidate. In most instances, an opening is available due to the underperformance of the last representative. Most hiring mangers or distributors are evaluated through performance of their respective area. Due to the underperformance of this specific opening, this is why more than ever they need to hire the right candidate. Furthermore, they need performance NOW! 

Just because you have selling experience does not guarantee your success in this industry. Just because you sold copiers does not necessarily make you a great fit for this opening. Do you know that the average resumes received for a device position is more than 300? How many of them do you think have solid sales track records? Sure, many of the received resumes are not nearly qualified for this position. However, 25-50 has the ABILITY to be successful in the business. Question as a recruitment company is how do you choose? Do you have any idea how many poor hiring decisions are made? Why? Well, this is very easy to explain. If we interview a candidate, are they going to tell us they work hard? Of course they are! Interviewing becomes an educated guess hopeful that your selection is the best one.

Every one of our job postings requires medical sales experience specific to the specialty advertised. Funny thing is that 90% of those that apply do not read the requirements. Is that our fault? We unlike most recruiters are focused on customer service in which we make best efforts to contact all resumes submitted. For those without specific medical sales experience we offer three suggestions to help in which one is the Medical Sales College. The other two include top B2B companies and networking ideas. With more than 28,000 resumes received monthly, we can find the right candidates. We NEVER charge a candidate for our services.

We are not only the largest recruitment company in medical device sales but also only believe in hiring with experience. That experience is either previous medical sales experience related to that specialty (meaning: relationships, ability to cover cases, ability to perform NOW!) or having received training that will result in quick relationships, ability to cover cases and perform NOW!

The training side of the business (Medical Sales College) is a huge asset and allows one more additional benefit to our corporate customers. We get the feedback of what equates to an eight-week interview. This takes the guesswork out of hiring. After eight straight weeks, the instructors know exactly how hard an individual works, ability to learn technical information, ability to sell and the likelihood of success in the field. This gives us an enormous edge over other recruitment firms and ensures a higher rate of hiring success. An employer never questions the dedication or commitment of a candidate that has invested in their business. It is so ridiculous to read the comments about the Medical Sales College. Anyone with a brain can quickly note the reasoning behind the posts. It is comical how one feels that the anonymous post has more validity than the 450 placed graduates, never receiving a complaint about its services with local governing authorities and continued comments about the BBB being an organization for marketing not protection of consumers. FYI, you keep talking about them (MSC) paying BBB, you might look again they havent even registered yet still have an A rating and no complaints. Every large medical manufacturer has done business with them and/or has representation of a Medical Sales College graduate. Anyway

Because we as a company have placed such a high level of importance on experience and immediate productivity for our employers, this is why our demand has exploded. In July we had less than 80 open positions. In the last six months we have seen that number rise on a monthly basis and now have more than 235 positions open right now! These positions are medical sales distributors and hiring managers that too are requiring either level of experience as noted above.

One last thought, knowing that we operate as one of the last recruitment firms on contingency recruiting, why wouldnt a hiring manager give us a shot. The only pay us if they hire from us. Our fee (this is why we are hated probably the reason for posts), experienced competitive reps we charge an employer only $2,000 which is often 10%-20% of what a traditional recruiter charges. How can we do this? Simple, we place more candidates than anyone. We have a team of 10 experienced outside recruiters and 15 more internally. We only work medical sales positions.

I invite anyone with questions to email me and will be willing to respond. I wish everyone success specifically those in this great industry!

Scott Binder
President, EliteMed Recruiting
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#76 Author of original report

Elite-MSC is basically classic Modeling School scam

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

A well recognized Glamorous Career Scam is that of the Modeling Agency-Modeling School. It works this way:

1) Modeling agency recruiter posts advertisements of modeling gigs that may or may not exist. Normally, it is a combination of both.
2) Respondents, regardless of looks, are given hope of becoming a model, provided they get certified as a professional model by a licensed modeling school. Hopefuls are sold head shots, full body shots, runway training, etc. The recruiter conveniently recommends an affiliated "proven" modeling school.
3) Most who obtain said certificate ultimately do not find modeling jobs. The recruiter and school, however, keep the money.

Medical sales and pharmaceutical sales are generally considered glamorous jobs since they pay well, and reps tend to be attractive. Therefore, Elite and Medical Sales College (MSC) are able to work in the following manner:

1) Elite advertises hundreds of medical sales positions on several national career boards. Whether or not all posted jobs actually exist is questionable.
2) Respondents are told by Elite that getting a certificate from a licensed medical sales college would enhance ones candidacy into the profession. Conveniently, Elite recommends MSC.
3) Of course, a certificate does not make one more physically attractive, or help one pass a potential employers psychological pre-employment test, or in any way give one true medical sales experience. Therefore, a medical sales college certificate, in most cases, cannot deliver what it inherently promises--a medical sales career. The recruiter and school, regardless, keep the money.


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