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  • Report: #308728

Complaint Review: First Convenience Bank (Division Of First National Bank Texas)

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  • Submitted: Wed, February 13, 2008
  • Updated: Sun, November 08, 2009

  • Reported By:Midlothian Texas
First Convenience Bank (Division Of First National Bank Texas)
P.O. Box 937 Killeen, Texas U.S.A.
  • Phone: 800-903-7490
  • Web:
  • Category: Banks

First Convenience Bank (Texas)First Convenience Bank First Convenience Bank (Division Of First National Bank Texas) Non Disclosure of $400 Overdraft on Minor Student Checking Account Killeen Texas

*Consumer Comment: Appreciation to Ex Employee, Understanding Comment to Gary (OP)

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: response

*Consumer Comment: For Exemployee

*UPDATE Employee: Disclosure

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: hmm

*Consumer Comment: Two Words: Mouse Print

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: will you listen!

*Consumer Comment: Gary, you balance...

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: sorry to hear

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: sorry to hear

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: sorry to hear

*Author of original report: First Convenience Bank

*Author of original report: First Convenience Bank

*Consumer Comment: No the issue is...

*Consumer Comment: No the issue is...

*Consumer Comment: No the issue is...

*Consumer Comment: Wait A Minute

*Author of original report: First Convenience Bank (Texas)

*Consumer Comment: Too bad...

*Consumer Suggestion: why would you give a 17 year old a checking account?

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My 17 year old son recently opened a student checking account with direct deposit at the First Convenience Bank branch in Midlothian, Texas. He works part time and I encouraged him to open an account at the bank for convenience and to help him begin becoming financially responsible. I went with him to open the account to make sure that I understood the type of account, fees, etc. He was issued an ATM card and signed up for a MasterCard debit card which he received and used. Both he and I religiously checked his account balance prior to his using either card and he knew that I put money in to keep him solvent.

He withdrew $200 after calling the 800 number and doing the ATM inquiry, both of which confirmed a balance of $240.00. The next day he was overdrawn by $200 which ballooned to over $400 with the addition of 5 overdraft charges at $33 each and the following day another $99.00 in fees. I immediately called the branch and made two personal trips to the bank to find out how this could occur. I was advised that because he signed up for direct deposit that he was automatically given $400 in overdraft protection

First of all, had there been any disclosure of an overdraft protection at the time the account was opened, I would have point blank declined it. Many
adults have difficulty with overdraft, so a 17 year old with his first checking account and a $400 overdraft is not only ridiculous but asking for trouble.
I don't think most 17 year olds have much experience in the difference between "Available Blance" and "Ledger Balance," not to mention the pitfalls and ramifications of using overdraft protection. After 5 days and much discussion we were able to get a few of the charges removed but that is not the issue.

My son now has a liability based upon the complete non-disclosure of the overdraft protection on a direct deposit account. In fact there is no mention of the overdraft on the bank's website anywhere including the Direct Deposit link.

I have over 25 years of experience in the Texas savings and loan industry and I certainly know when something is either improperly disclosed or not disclosed at all. In this case there was no disclosure and this is a minor.

I am not sure what the legal ramifications are on this matter but I certainly thing the Texas state banking regulatory agencies should be apprised of this gross misconduct as I am most concerned that this is a widespread banking scam.


Gary
Midlothian, Texas
U.S.A.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 02/13/2008 05:03 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/First-Convenience-Bank-Division-Of-First-National-Bank-Texas/Killeen-Texas-76540-0937/First-Convenience-Bank-TexasFirst-Convenience-Bank-First-Convenience-Bank-Division-Of-F-308728. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 20Consumer 0Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

Appreciation to Ex Employee, Understanding Comment to Gary (OP)

AUTHOR: InShock66 - (USA)

Ex Employee:  I want to say that you have written some very valuable information.  Had I known some of the things regarding the way First Convenience Bank makes their money, etc... prior to have opened an account there, the account never would have been opened and I would not be in the situation I'm currently in.  I've already filed a report of my own, so I won't write a repeat of it here, I'll only mention the two points you referenced which now (unfortunately, after the fact) have at least caused me to make some sense out of why they did what they did to me.  NOT that it makes it any more right....


1).  I blamed myself for not having seen a Red Flag when the man who opened my account was so very eager to do so, as well as not having insisted on thoroughly reading what I signed, instead of allowing him to rush me through the process.  I still do, as it is my right to know and understand what I'm signing.  However, after having read what you wrote in regard to the fact that employees are pressured to open as many accounts as possible, I still don't condone his behaviour, but at least I somewhat understand it.


2)  I was completely mystified as to why they abruptly closed my week old account the day after I had deposited $100.00 cash, citing "item twenty-seven of the deposit agreement" (which you are probably familiar with) that basically says that they have the right to close any account for any reason at any time and they are not libable for any damages to the customer that arise from the account closure.  I could not imagine a single thing I had done wrong to even make them want to close it.


After having read in your comment that they count on account Fees, NSF and OD in order to make their money, I now think that the fact that within a couple of days of opening the account, I had already satisfied a requirement for not having fees charged to me Power Checking Account by having deposited $100.00.  It still all seems awfully flimsy... but at least, as wrong as it was what they did, I can somewhat see their misguided motive.


Unfortunately, I think the majority of people who read these Ripoff Reports are people who have already been Ripped off or wronged somehow by the company... therefore end up in this Ripoff Report part of the Internet...  Your comment was made in 2008, I don't know if you will ever see this that I'm writing now in Nov. 2009, but I hope you do, as it is of appreciation.  Also, if it makes any difference to you now... a year later, they are still doing the same thing.. not a good sign.  If you happen to know of which reguolatory agancy.. or other agancy that might make a difference, I sure would be interested to know whom else to contact about this.  You could read my full report right here under:  First Convenience Bank A division of First National Bank Texas, if you so choose.


I wish you all the best in your new job with the raise!


To Gary: I fully understand the pressure you were under as you were most likely rushed through the process of opening the account for your son, and if it went anything like mine, any question you may have asked was probably met with something like, 'Oh, that's nothing, that's just standard, not a problem, that's nothing to worry about....." all said with a convincing smile.

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#2 UPDATE EX-employee responds

response

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

First I worked for this company a long time. I do not have a grudge with the company, I was offered a raise I could not turn down at another financial institution. Secondly while working at this bank I know first hand the demand for accounts to be opened at this location. It is a matter of quantity over quality. The company opens tons and I mean tons of accounts during a month which means more opportunities for NSF, OD fees. Working at a savings and loans is not the same as working at a bank nowadays. In the past savings and loans for a long time did not deal with checking accounts. So for him to have a background in that area does not mean a lot of experience with float holds and soft postings. I did not mean to get all in your face about your experience and say you did not know what you were talking about. I just know that this financial institution makes most of their money through NSF and OD fees which has a lot to do with the quantity opened not with the quality. Thats why they do not run their new accounts through checksystem. Yes it gives people who do not have a great banking history the opportunity to have a debit card and a checking account, but it also sets them up to overdraw their account. Sure the customer should have used a register, but come on the account was for his child. If I was an employee of the bank I would have made sure to at least discuss how to balance a checkbook with the parent and the child and what would happen if they overdrew their account. I can tell you when opening an account at this institution it is a very busy time and most of the time the teller/PB opens the account in less than 5 minutes which does not give the customer enough time to fully understand banking practices. So when I respond I respond trying to help out customers who may have been wronged in this situation. That is all. I understand how the bank works and by know means think that the bank is wrong here I just want to make sure the customer is taken care of.
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#3 Consumer Comment

For Exemployee

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

No, the point is that gary wanted to teach his son financial responsibility. Part of that responsibilty is for the customer to keep track of all transactions done in their check register. The OP mentioned the son calling and getting a balance of $240 and withdrawing $200, which caused an overdraft of $200. This means that there was a transactions, probably a check or automatic debit, for $200 that was not reflected in the available but would, SHOULD have been known to the customer in their register.
Additionally, with Gary's experience in savings & loans did he think to specifically ask if the account could go into an overdraft status? Certainally a question that should have been addressed at account opening.
As for your comments about having a bank background before answering posts here. First of all this is a public forum that anyone can respond to, no experience necessary. Secondly, I do work at a bank in customer service, so I do have a banking background to speak on these things. Thirdly, with your attitude, I think the banking industry is best with you as an exemployee, because I certainly would not have wanted to talk to you with the chip you seem to have on your shoulder. Or are you one of the people that think the only responses came come from people telling the OP 'yes you're right you are a victim. You did nothing wrong. It's all the fault of the big, evil company'? If so, then welcome to reality.
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#4 UPDATE Employee

Disclosure

AUTHOR: Michelle - (U.S.A.)

The information about direct deposit is in the New Account Disclosure packet your son was given when he opened his account. In that same disclosure packet is information about how to request for no overdraft protection. I'm sorry it was not explained to you, but it is not the company's fault that you or your son did not read the disclosures in their entirity.
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#5 UPDATE EX-employee responds

hmm

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

Not going to debate if banking laws are wrong and misconceiving. I will tell you the simple facts about debit cards though. They make banks a ton of money if the consumer uses them on the credit side. When consumers use the credit it does protect the consumer. The simple fact is there is two ways banks make money. One is they reinvest your deposits back into the market to draw bigger dividends. And second they make money off of fee income. NSF and OD fees especially. Smaller banks are mostly fee based which means they make 80 percent of their money off of betting that you are going to overdraw your account. Make sure you utilize a check register and online banking as much as possible. Do not trust ATMs and balance inquiries. Just some helpful tips from a bank manager.
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#6 Consumer Comment

Two Words: Mouse Print

AUTHOR: Thomas - (U.S.A.)

Maybe Gary did receive an account description brochure with all of the terms & conditions...

Maybe he didn't read it....

Maybe it was like the many mail offers I get from DirectTV: One offer was a single page with fine package descriptions on the front *in color*... and some terms had little symbols next to them, like '***', or little daggers, or whatever. All symbols 'were defined on the back'.

The back side of that single page was 2/3 blank, and the bottom 1/3 was crammed with symbols, 'ifs', 'ands', and 'buts' in tiny grey ink mouse print that I could barely read if I wanted a headache. Clearly the entire back side could have been covered by using a more readable font in black ink. But I did not let this shabby trick get me off track.... it was SHREDDER TIME, baby!

Maybe it is time for some new banking account disclosure laws?

And, Gary, loose the debit cards. Those things are like racoons- they look cute & cuddly but if you get careless around one, it will tear you up.
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#7 UPDATE EX-employee responds

will you listen!

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

His problem isn't that he is blaming the bank for overdrawing his account. He is taking responsibility for that. His problem is that he is saying he did not receive any disclosures or notice on the overdraft policy of the bank. This happens all the times with financial institutions. They have such high sales quotas they lack their operational compliance. Gary again I will tell you if they did not give you any information on the bank's policies concerning overdraft go speak to the manager. If he or she refuses to help you unfortunately it is a case of he said she said and you will probably lose that in court. But good luck and you people who instigate arguments on this site ....GO GET A LIFE AND LEARN ABOUT BANKING PROCEDURES BEFORE MAKING COMMENT!
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#8 Consumer Comment

Gary, you balance...

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

your account by keeping a checkbook register and not spending $11 when you only have $10. Kind of sad that you say you were teaching your son financial responsibility and then don't seem to show any yourself.
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#9 UPDATE EX-employee responds

sorry to hear

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

Gary just to let you know upon opening the account they should have given you literature about their overdraft policies. Now most financial institutions have new account packets with these included. Did you not receive any of this? If not please make sure you bring this information to the banking center manager at the branch.

More than likely the center manager does not have the ability to refund the fees altogether but the district manager should. I apologize for this happening. Make sure you understand that banks will pay all items as long as they have not posted to your ledger balance. Your available balance means the bank has not collected the funds from the merchant yet based on the receipt. This is what gets most consumers in trouble from banks. Good luck I hope it works out!
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#10 UPDATE EX-employee responds

sorry to hear

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

Gary just to let you know upon opening the account they should have given you literature about their overdraft policies. Now most financial institutions have new account packets with these included. Did you not receive any of this? If not please make sure you bring this information to the banking center manager at the branch.

More than likely the center manager does not have the ability to refund the fees altogether but the district manager should. I apologize for this happening. Make sure you understand that banks will pay all items as long as they have not posted to your ledger balance. Your available balance means the bank has not collected the funds from the merchant yet based on the receipt. This is what gets most consumers in trouble from banks. Good luck I hope it works out!
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#11 UPDATE EX-employee responds

sorry to hear

AUTHOR: Exemployee18 - (U.S.A.)

Gary just to let you know upon opening the account they should have given you literature about their overdraft policies. Now most financial institutions have new account packets with these included. Did you not receive any of this? If not please make sure you bring this information to the banking center manager at the branch.

More than likely the center manager does not have the ability to refund the fees altogether but the district manager should. I apologize for this happening. Make sure you understand that banks will pay all items as long as they have not posted to your ledger balance. Your available balance means the bank has not collected the funds from the merchant yet based on the receipt. This is what gets most consumers in trouble from banks. Good luck I hope it works out!
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#12 Author of original report

First Convenience Bank

AUTHOR: Gary - (U.S.A.)

Congratulations to all of you who know to the penny 24/7 your exact balance and have never forgotten a transaction. Had there been no overdraft protection there would have been no disbursement. And had he known about the overdraft and associated fees then he would have made his decision accordingly. The bank did not provide him with the appropriate disclosure to make an informed decision.
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#13 Author of original report

First Convenience Bank

AUTHOR: Gary - (U.S.A.)

We intend to pay it...that's not the issue at all. The issue is, that we were never told there was a $400 overdraft loan and that any pending purchase not cleared when the overdraft kicked in was subject to a $33 nsf fee. I have four debit cards with Visa and Chase et. al. and if I try to take out $11 and only have $10, the card is declined. My issue is non disclosure of the overdraft resulting in bank charges. Again, this is not a balancing issue. How can you effective balance account if it's over $1.00 and the ATM pays it, and you incur a $33 nsf fee? I'm not sure how this Rip Off Report works, but if you to the Home page and Search "First Convenience Bank" it will be obvious that I am not the only person with issues regarding this bank. Regards
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#14 Consumer Comment

No the issue is...

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

he called the 800 number and checked the ATM for the balance and then withdrew $200. If he was keeping a register with all of his transactions he would have known that something already spent had not posted and that he didn't have the money to withdraw. Simple as that.
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#15 Consumer Comment

No the issue is...

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

he called the 800 number and checked the ATM for the balance and then withdrew $200. If he was keeping a register with all of his transactions he would have known that something already spent had not posted and that he didn't have the money to withdraw. Simple as that.
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#16 Consumer Comment

No the issue is...

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

he called the 800 number and checked the ATM for the balance and then withdrew $200. If he was keeping a register with all of his transactions he would have known that something already spent had not posted and that he didn't have the money to withdraw. Simple as that.
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#17 Consumer Comment

Wait A Minute

AUTHOR: Cory - (U.S.A.)

You're discussing terms and conditions and disclosures at the time the account was opened. You never address the fact that your son didn't balance his "checkbook" and really had no idea how much money he had in his account. You state you opened the account to "help him to become financially responsible" yet you did nothing towards that end. If anything you did and are doing just the opposite. You didn't and aren't teaching him anything. Now after the fact you're saying "They didn't tell me right" so I shouldn't have to pay. That's a fine lesson to learn.
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#18 Author of original report

First Convenience Bank (Texas)

AUTHOR: Gary - (U.S.A.)

The issue in this matter has nothing to do with having a check/debit/atm register to balance transactions. The issue is that the bank did not disclose there was an automatic $400 overdraft protection for direct deposit student accounts, that the overdraft fees were $33.00 each, nor did it give the option at the time the account was opened to decline that overdraft protection...a fact that was offered by the bank only after the damage had been done.

This is a disclosure issue and from my perspective a predatory banking issue directed at anyone, regardless of age. Any bank that would offer special incentives to minors to open a "free student checking account" and then not disclose the overdraft loan feature and associated costs is negligent and from all appearances fee driven.
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#19 Consumer Comment

Too bad...

AUTHOR: Striderq - (U.S.A.)

you didn't teach him to keep a register of his transactions and to only use the phone and ATM balances to confirm what has posted. if you had done this he wouldn't have overdrawn his account.
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#20 Consumer Suggestion

why would you give a 17 year old a checking account?

AUTHOR: Nancy - (U.S.A.)

Several facts. TEACH HIM TO USE A CHECKBOOK REGISTER. If yhou want him to learn finances that is the correct way.

the phone ballance is hardly ever correct and youa re not told if it is the available balance and you dont know how many transactionsare on hold.

The ATM is not always correct either. The register is the best and second best is to check the account on line and see what items are still on hold and if the balance includes them or not.

Buy the kid a calculator
Take away his debit card. YOu are getting him started on a path alright but not the right path. And he is also learning that if he gets in trouble Daddy will bail him out. Not a good lesson.
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