- Report: #106983
Complaint Review: Four Paws Shih Tzu
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| Four Paws Shih Tzu P O Box 475
LaPine, Oregon U.S.A. |
|
Four Paws Shih Tzu Puppies Debbie Rondeau of Four Paws unprofessional and did not provide quality shih tzu. LaPine Oregon
*Consumer Suggestion: American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
*Consumer Suggestion: American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
*Consumer Suggestion: American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
*Consumer Suggestion: American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
*Consumer Comment: NOT A SHIH TZU
*Consumer Comment: NOT A SHIH TZU
*Consumer Comment: NOT A SHIH TZU
*Consumer Comment: Michelle, how OLD are you?
*Consumer Comment: Puppy SO perfect? Put your money where your mouth is.
*Consumer Comment: Ask AKC to do a DNA test
*Consumer Comment: MY PUPPY IS ABSOLUTELY AWESOME AND PERFECT!
*Consumer Comment: "Not sure what breed it is" -Dog show exhibitor response
*Consumer Suggestion: Damage is done...now lets learn from it
*Consumer Comment: SHUT UP ALREADY!
*Consumer Comment: SHUT UP ALREADY!
*Consumer Comment: SHUT UP ALREADY!
*Consumer Comment: SHUT UP ALREADY!
*Consumer Suggestion: If You Must Purchase A Canine Companion From A Breeder
*Consumer Comment: Beware "Marginal" dog registries
*Consumer Suggestion: This dog is obviously a mix
*Consumer Comment: Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
*Consumer Comment: Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
*Consumer Comment: Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
*Consumer Comment: to debbie, lucille you are supposed to be a reputible breeder yet you sell inferior examples of your breed
*Consumer Comment: Show breeders vs. backyard breeders
*Consumer Comment: I am one of those "prissy" show people
*Consumer Comment: How you can get a hold of Debbie Rondeau
*REBUTTAL Individual responds: COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
*REBUTTAL Individual responds: COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
*REBUTTAL Individual responds: COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
*REBUTTAL Individual responds: COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
*Consumer Comment: confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
*Consumer Comment: confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
*Consumer Comment: confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
*Consumer Suggestion: Well, throw her a bone!
*Consumer Suggestion: Don't support backyard breeders!
*Consumer Comment: I am thankful.
*Consumer Comment: Asking around
*Consumer Suggestion: Look before you leep!!!!!!!
*Author of original report: Rebuttal Comments - True Facts. I am not a breeder and never knew anything about recessive which Debbie should have been up front about.
*Consumer Suggestion: refund warranted
*Consumer Comment: Great Dog but agree with communication issue
*Consumer Suggestion: Breeders
*Consumer Suggestion: Definitely not a shih tzu........
*Consumer Comment: breeders
*Consumer Comment: breeders
*Consumer Comment: breeders
*Consumer Comment: Oh My Fussing over a Poor Dog
*Consumer Comment: Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
*Consumer Comment: Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
*Consumer Comment: Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
*Consumer Comment: Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
*Consumer Comment: The Best Shih tzu I Have Ever Owned
*Consumer Suggestion: boycott backyard breeders!
*Consumer Suggestion: boycott backyard breeders!
*Consumer Suggestion: boycott backyard breeders!
*Consumer Suggestion: boycott backyard breeders!
*Consumer Suggestion: All of you morons should be shot for trying to pass off these animals as DOGS.
*Consumer Comment: Your pup looks more like a chihuahua mix
*REBUTTAL Owner of company: What more could I do?
*Consumer Comment: Deb Rondeau, has done the best she could to appease this woman
*Author of original report: AKC COMMENT RE: FOUR PAWS - NIKKO
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I purchased a shih tzu for $700 from Debbie Rondeau of Four Paws and got ripped off, because my puppy, Nikko does not look like a shih tzu.
First of all, Debbie was not very accommodating regarding the ship date. She asks you when you would like the puppy shipped, but she doesn't pay any attention to what you want. She ships at her convenience only. She didn't even email me to find out if I received him safely. As a courtesy, I did emial her that I received him on 12/5/03. I found my dealings with her very unsatisfactory. I think she is a very unprofessional person and probably is running a puppy mill of sorts. Just look at her website and see all the puppies she always has.
She professes on her web site that she raises quality puppies with great coats. Only that is not true. When I received my puppy, Nikko, he was very mangy looking. His hair was very thin and coarse, his skin was all flaky and he scratched himself incessantly. In fact, the vet did a scraping to test him for the mange. He put Nikko on vitamins and a healthy food diet.
Also, the vet was concerned that he had an open fontenal (soft spot) that had not healed completely which could lead to neurological problems later on if not closed. When I emailed Debbie this info, her response was, "if he had any health issues my vet would never have given him a health certificate to fly." She was not the least bit concerned whether there was a problem with him or not, nor did she ever further inquire about his health. After only on month with me, he gained about three pounds. He only weighed 4.13 on 12/5/03 when I received him, and by Jan. 2nd after proper care and nourishment, he weighed in at 7.5 pounds.
Nikko does not even look like a shih tzu. First of all, his snout is longer and more pointy than the normal pushed in look of a shih tzu. Secondly, his eyes are almond shaped with short eyelashes rather than the shih tzu's normal big round eyes with long curly eyelashes. Third, his hair is short and smooth rather than the long busy look of a shih tzu. I will try to attach a picture of two puppies. The lone on the left is a shih tzu and looks very much like one. The one on the right is my Nikko that Debbie sold me as a shih tzu. It's very obvious how different looking he is.
When I mailed Debbie a picture, her response was, and I quote, "the coat is much like we get sometimes when it is a recessive which is what coc is. It may change once he gets his first short hair cut." Well his hair has never grown long enough to get it cut. Anyways, what little there is, I would be afraid to cut. Furthermore, she states that I bouth a pet, not a shih tzu and that's why he came with a limited registration. My papers state I bought a shih tzue not a pet. First of all, I never discussed breeding rights with her. I never knew about limited registrations. Secondly, she didn't send me his papers until a few days before she shipped him and not until after I had paid her in full.
I had to ask numerous times for pictures of the parents. She actually sent me a picture of his sister. It took me many months and many requests to receive the right pictures. Quite honetly, I don't even know if the pictures I have are correct. Also, I would email her several questions and she would only answer one and ignore the rest. Sometimes her answer wasn't even relevant. Debbie Rondeau obviously has a communication problem.
Under the circumstances, I have asked her for a partial refund. I feel a fifty percent refund is warranted as Nikko is not the quality shih tzu she claims to raise. She refuses to give any refund whatsoever. She has offered to exchange him or to help me sell him. Who would pay $700 for a shih tzu that doesn't look like one, let alone the $1000 plus that I have invested in him due to neuturing and shots. Once a puppy comes into my home, he is here for his duration. Just because I'm disappointed that he does not look like a shih tzu, doesn't mean I would send him back as you would bring a dress back to a store because it wasn't exactly what you wanted. Furthermore, I wouln't think of sending any dog back to her.
DO NOT buy any puppies from Debbie Rondeau of Four Paws. DO NOT trust Debbie Rondeau. I know several other people that have had problems with her. Also, there are several breeders that know of her and don't think very highly of her. Unfortunately, I am not at liberty to use ther names. Unfortunately, it is people like Debbie Rondeau that give reputable breeders a bad name.
Lucille
Lancaster, New York
U.S.A.
First of all, Debbie was not very accommodating regarding the ship date. She asks you when you would like the puppy shipped, but she doesn't pay any attention to what you want. She ships at her convenience only. She didn't even email me to find out if I received him safely. As a courtesy, I did emial her that I received him on 12/5/03. I found my dealings with her very unsatisfactory. I think she is a very unprofessional person and probably is running a puppy mill of sorts. Just look at her website and see all the puppies she always has.
She professes on her web site that she raises quality puppies with great coats. Only that is not true. When I received my puppy, Nikko, he was very mangy looking. His hair was very thin and coarse, his skin was all flaky and he scratched himself incessantly. In fact, the vet did a scraping to test him for the mange. He put Nikko on vitamins and a healthy food diet.
Also, the vet was concerned that he had an open fontenal (soft spot) that had not healed completely which could lead to neurological problems later on if not closed. When I emailed Debbie this info, her response was, "if he had any health issues my vet would never have given him a health certificate to fly." She was not the least bit concerned whether there was a problem with him or not, nor did she ever further inquire about his health. After only on month with me, he gained about three pounds. He only weighed 4.13 on 12/5/03 when I received him, and by Jan. 2nd after proper care and nourishment, he weighed in at 7.5 pounds.
Nikko does not even look like a shih tzu. First of all, his snout is longer and more pointy than the normal pushed in look of a shih tzu. Secondly, his eyes are almond shaped with short eyelashes rather than the shih tzu's normal big round eyes with long curly eyelashes. Third, his hair is short and smooth rather than the long busy look of a shih tzu. I will try to attach a picture of two puppies. The lone on the left is a shih tzu and looks very much like one. The one on the right is my Nikko that Debbie sold me as a shih tzu. It's very obvious how different looking he is.
When I mailed Debbie a picture, her response was, and I quote, "the coat is much like we get sometimes when it is a recessive which is what coc is. It may change once he gets his first short hair cut." Well his hair has never grown long enough to get it cut. Anyways, what little there is, I would be afraid to cut. Furthermore, she states that I bouth a pet, not a shih tzu and that's why he came with a limited registration. My papers state I bought a shih tzue not a pet. First of all, I never discussed breeding rights with her. I never knew about limited registrations. Secondly, she didn't send me his papers until a few days before she shipped him and not until after I had paid her in full.
I had to ask numerous times for pictures of the parents. She actually sent me a picture of his sister. It took me many months and many requests to receive the right pictures. Quite honetly, I don't even know if the pictures I have are correct. Also, I would email her several questions and she would only answer one and ignore the rest. Sometimes her answer wasn't even relevant. Debbie Rondeau obviously has a communication problem.
Under the circumstances, I have asked her for a partial refund. I feel a fifty percent refund is warranted as Nikko is not the quality shih tzu she claims to raise. She refuses to give any refund whatsoever. She has offered to exchange him or to help me sell him. Who would pay $700 for a shih tzu that doesn't look like one, let alone the $1000 plus that I have invested in him due to neuturing and shots. Once a puppy comes into my home, he is here for his duration. Just because I'm disappointed that he does not look like a shih tzu, doesn't mean I would send him back as you would bring a dress back to a store because it wasn't exactly what you wanted. Furthermore, I wouln't think of sending any dog back to her.
DO NOT buy any puppies from Debbie Rondeau of Four Paws. DO NOT trust Debbie Rondeau. I know several other people that have had problems with her. Also, there are several breeders that know of her and don't think very highly of her. Unfortunately, I am not at liberty to use ther names. Unfortunately, it is people like Debbie Rondeau that give reputable breeders a bad name.
Lucille
Lancaster, New York
U.S.A.
This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 09/04/2004 12:48 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Four-Paws-Shih-Tzu/LaPine-Oregon-97739/Four-Paws-Shih-Tzu-Puppies-Debbie-Rondeau-of-Four-Paws-unprofessional-and-did-not-provide-106983. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.
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Search Tips#1 Consumer Suggestion
American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
AUTHOR: Allison - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, December 14, 2005
For all of those who desire strong, healthy, typey Shih Tzu, either as pets or show pups, your best point of reference is the American Shih Tzu Club which is sanctioned by the AKC. The website is www.shihtzu.org. It is a membership only organization with codes of ethics and bylaws created to promote the betterment of the breed. On our website you can find a reference to the Breed Committee. Anyone on this committee should be able to provide you contact details for a reputable breeder. Reputable breeders will guarantee the puppies health for a period of time and that guarantee includes return for refund if you are not satisfied. They are usually covered because they do extensive research and certification testing as well as DNA research.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #2 Consumer Suggestion
American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
AUTHOR: Allison - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, December 14, 2005
For all of those who desire strong, healthy, typey Shih Tzu, either as pets or show pups, your best point of reference is the American Shih Tzu Club which is sanctioned by the AKC. The website is www.shihtzu.org. It is a membership only organization with codes of ethics and bylaws created to promote the betterment of the breed. On our website you can find a reference to the Breed Committee. Anyone on this committee should be able to provide you contact details for a reputable breeder. Reputable breeders will guarantee the puppies health for a period of time and that guarantee includes return for refund if you are not satisfied. They are usually covered because they do extensive research and certification testing as well as DNA research.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #3 Consumer Suggestion
American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
AUTHOR: Allison - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, December 14, 2005
For all of those who desire strong, healthy, typey Shih Tzu, either as pets or show pups, your best point of reference is the American Shih Tzu Club which is sanctioned by the AKC. The website is www.shihtzu.org. It is a membership only organization with codes of ethics and bylaws created to promote the betterment of the breed. On our website you can find a reference to the Breed Committee. Anyone on this committee should be able to provide you contact details for a reputable breeder. Reputable breeders will guarantee the puppies health for a period of time and that guarantee includes return for refund if you are not satisfied. They are usually covered because they do extensive research and certification testing as well as DNA research.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #4 Consumer Suggestion
American Shih Tzu Club Member chimes in
AUTHOR: Allison - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, December 14, 2005
For all of those who desire strong, healthy, typey Shih Tzu, either as pets or show pups, your best point of reference is the American Shih Tzu Club which is sanctioned by the AKC. The website is www.shihtzu.org. It is a membership only organization with codes of ethics and bylaws created to promote the betterment of the breed. On our website you can find a reference to the Breed Committee. Anyone on this committee should be able to provide you contact details for a reputable breeder. Reputable breeders will guarantee the puppies health for a period of time and that guarantee includes return for refund if you are not satisfied. They are usually covered because they do extensive research and certification testing as well as DNA research.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
We also support many shih tzu rescue organizations and whole-heartedly agree that a rescued pet is usually just as good or better than a new puppy. So think about it.
The AKC should be a good research channel as well.
Respond to this report!
What's this?
THIS IS FOR Robin - Borger, Texas
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
Respond to this report!
What's this?
THIS IS FOR Robin - Borger, Texas
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
Respond to this report!
What's this?
THIS IS FOR Robin - Borger, Texas
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
You suggest that Lucille forgive and forget? THAT'S BULL. This is not how one should conduct business. This dog is obviously not a shih tzu and Debbie should remedy the situation. She advertised this dog as a shih tzu and this dog is not a shih tzu. Debbie needs her head and eyes examined. Returning the dog is out of the question, the dog and owner have bonded. Returning a family member is ridiculous and a true dog lover would not even dream to suggest such a thing. The honorable thing to do is give a partial refund; if I were Debbie I would give a 70% refund to save face because she is clearly at fault. I know I would not pay $700 for this mutt, I wouldn't even pay $350. If she wanted a mutt, she could have visited the local shelter.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #8 Consumer Comment
Michelle, how OLD are you?
AUTHOR: Robin - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, August 31, 2005
Geez, you REALLY need to get a life! Is all you have to do in life is tear people up for their mistakes? You know Michelle, what goes around comes around and SOMEDAY I PROMISE YOU, something like this will happen to you! Someone, somewhere will attack you like this and NOT LET UP! They will be a bulldog and never forgive you and never forget what you have done to them!
As far as showing my dog, that was a figure of speech and if you had the maturity of a NORMAL FUNCTIONING adult, you would have been able to see that and ignore the post at all! Get a life Michelle and for God's sake GROW UP!
As far as showing my dog, that was a figure of speech and if you had the maturity of a NORMAL FUNCTIONING adult, you would have been able to see that and ignore the post at all! Get a life Michelle and for God's sake GROW UP!
Respond to this report!
What's this? #9 Consumer Comment
Puppy SO perfect? Put your money where your mouth is.
AUTHOR: Michelle - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, August 30, 2005
To:Robin from Borgin, TX. If your dog is as perfect as claimed, and you wish to back up your defense of Debbie with facts, here is the information for the Shih Tzu National Specialty for 2006:
http://www.shihtzu.org/Shows/upcoming_display.asp?SHOW_ID=40&menu=Shows
34th ASTC National Specialty & Sweepstakes
April 17, 2006
Hosted by, American Shih Tzu Club.
In addition, there are 14 shows in Texas in November and December. Shih Tzu entries in Texas are historically always low (at a large all breed show there are usually 10-15 entries, males and females combined), so your chances of winning should be very high, as your dog would only have to be judged against a very few dogs. If you wanted to enter some of the smaller shows, your dog may be the only one there - you would just have to show up to win!
Even the local Specialty shows have small entries, so you can practice winning there for the big National show.
Dallas holds a Shih Tzu specialty that draws anywhere from 15-30 dogs total -if your puppy is Nationals quality, it should clean up in wins locally.
As for the beautiful red color in your dog..I wish people would realize color means nothing in this breed.
What if Lucille's little mix were as solid red and beautiful as your dog? It could be the most beautiful red ever, and STILL would NOT look like a Shih Tzu! It would be the most beautiful red mixed breed ever!
No reason to let this subject drop. People looking to buy dogs on the internet need to see what they will get.
Debbie got caught with her proverbial pants down, in a public place. She never expected this poorly bred whatever it is to be exposed, and certainly never expected a photo of it to be put out where all future buyers can see what you get from her for $700.
This needs to be available for all to see, all the time, whenever Debbie's name comes up. She may have sent you a pretty dog, but the next buyer may get one just like
We will all be waiting for show results come December, when your pup is old enough to show (for those not familiar with dog shows, first place in your class when you are the only dog is nothing, but going on to win Winner's Bitch (against competion) will be something this red puppy should easily be able to do.
http://www.shihtzu.org/Shows/upcoming_display.asp?SHOW_ID=40&menu=Shows
34th ASTC National Specialty & Sweepstakes
April 17, 2006
Hosted by, American Shih Tzu Club.
In addition, there are 14 shows in Texas in November and December. Shih Tzu entries in Texas are historically always low (at a large all breed show there are usually 10-15 entries, males and females combined), so your chances of winning should be very high, as your dog would only have to be judged against a very few dogs. If you wanted to enter some of the smaller shows, your dog may be the only one there - you would just have to show up to win!
Even the local Specialty shows have small entries, so you can practice winning there for the big National show.
Dallas holds a Shih Tzu specialty that draws anywhere from 15-30 dogs total -if your puppy is Nationals quality, it should clean up in wins locally.
As for the beautiful red color in your dog..I wish people would realize color means nothing in this breed.
What if Lucille's little mix were as solid red and beautiful as your dog? It could be the most beautiful red ever, and STILL would NOT look like a Shih Tzu! It would be the most beautiful red mixed breed ever!
No reason to let this subject drop. People looking to buy dogs on the internet need to see what they will get.
Debbie got caught with her proverbial pants down, in a public place. She never expected this poorly bred whatever it is to be exposed, and certainly never expected a photo of it to be put out where all future buyers can see what you get from her for $700.
This needs to be available for all to see, all the time, whenever Debbie's name comes up. She may have sent you a pretty dog, but the next buyer may get one just like
We will all be waiting for show results come December, when your pup is old enough to show (for those not familiar with dog shows, first place in your class when you are the only dog is nothing, but going on to win Winner's Bitch (against competion) will be something this red puppy should easily be able to do.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #10 Consumer Comment
Ask AKC to do a DNA test
AUTHOR: Herb - (Canada)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, August 27, 2005
If you are so concerned about your pet, write the AKC and ask for a DNA kit. You can get your pup sampled and send this back to the AKC.
They will compare the DNA with that of the registered dam and sire of your pup.
DNA does not lie. You will find out for sure whether your pup is pure or not.
The breeder is required by AKC standards to submit DNA of dams and sires after so many litters have been produced. AKC probably has the DNA of the parents already.
Just ask. Tell them of your uncertainty.
What can it hurt?
They will compare the DNA with that of the registered dam and sire of your pup.
DNA does not lie. You will find out for sure whether your pup is pure or not.
The breeder is required by AKC standards to submit DNA of dams and sires after so many litters have been produced. AKC probably has the DNA of the parents already.
Just ask. Tell them of your uncertainty.
What can it hurt?
Respond to this report!
What's this? #11 Consumer Comment
MY PUPPY IS ABSOLUTELY AWESOME AND PERFECT!
AUTHOR: Robin - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, August 27, 2005
I bought a solid red Shih Tzu female puppy from Debbie at Wagin Tails this last month. She is perfect from head to toe! She is a dark, dark red with a black mask. I had no problems dealing with Debbie and she sent the puppy to me free of any parasites or disease. This puppy is absolutely so perfect I could show her in NATIONALS! I wish everyone would get off Debbie's back about her past mistakes! Gee, I guess NO ONE WHO HAS REPLIED TO THIS FORUM HAS EVER MADE A MISTAKE! She did her best to make things right when things went wrong, so just let this forum DIE! ENOUGH ALREADY! If you would like to see a picture of my perfect puppy I got from Debbie, please feel to email me and I'll be glad to send it to you! She's not only perfect, she's a 'head turner'! I've NEVER seen a solid red Shih Tzu puppy this beautiful before! As they say, don't let one bad apple spoil the whole bunch!
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What's this? #12 Consumer Comment
"Not sure what breed it is" -Dog show exhibitor response
AUTHOR: Michelle - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, August 26, 2005
Took this photo,showing only the dog in question, to a local dog show...not one exhibitor, in any breed, identified it as a Shih Tzu.
All I asked is what breed anyone thought it might be. Not even anyone in the toy group could figure it out...closest they came was "Chihuahua mix".
Not one person could believe it when I said it was deemed by the AKC to be a purebred *anything*, much less a purebred Shih Tzu.
Shameful, from the AKC right down the breeder, and the buyer also, for not taking the time to learn more and for giving someone breeding such poor quality dogs their money.
It takes an entire chain of marginal behavior for an event like this to happen. If you are looking to buy a dog, DO NOT make yourself a target - learn what health issue a breed has, what breeders are testing for, and what the breeder is doing to better the breed.
Don't fall for words and pretty pictures and websites. avehard proof in hand the breeder does what they say (proof of testing, proof their dogs are kept in clean, decent conditions, etc.).
If you must buy a dog online, have someone you know that lives in the area visit. It must be someone who knows dogs and will not overlook filth and poor conditions for a cute face.
Often, rescues local to whatever area can give you insight on a breeder, or will visit the breeder for a decent donation to that rescue.
They can give you an honest assessment of the situation.
All I asked is what breed anyone thought it might be. Not even anyone in the toy group could figure it out...closest they came was "Chihuahua mix".
Not one person could believe it when I said it was deemed by the AKC to be a purebred *anything*, much less a purebred Shih Tzu.
Shameful, from the AKC right down the breeder, and the buyer also, for not taking the time to learn more and for giving someone breeding such poor quality dogs their money.
It takes an entire chain of marginal behavior for an event like this to happen. If you are looking to buy a dog, DO NOT make yourself a target - learn what health issue a breed has, what breeders are testing for, and what the breeder is doing to better the breed.
Don't fall for words and pretty pictures and websites. avehard proof in hand the breeder does what they say (proof of testing, proof their dogs are kept in clean, decent conditions, etc.).
If you must buy a dog online, have someone you know that lives in the area visit. It must be someone who knows dogs and will not overlook filth and poor conditions for a cute face.
Often, rescues local to whatever area can give you insight on a breeder, or will visit the breeder for a decent donation to that rescue.
They can give you an honest assessment of the situation.
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What's this? #13 Consumer Suggestion
Damage is done...now lets learn from it
AUTHOR: Nicole - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, August 23, 2005
I do not know Debbie or her business practices, but what has been said about her has already been said. People have their own opinions and perceptions about what has happened to Lucille or to themselves.
Knowledgable people are writing to inform others how to avoid these situations. Michelle from Seattle basically said everything people should listen to when purchasing from a "breeder". There is no reason anyone should quit posting regarding this case until everyone knows how to look for a reputable breeder. Yes, poor Debbie is at the center of this, but she is certainly not the only person to breed poor quality dogs and sell them for quality dog prices.
Everyone should read Michelle's comments and learn from them. Showing, legitimately registering, health testing, guarantees, references and no internet advertising are a huge part of finding a good breeder, but certainly not everything. If people don't like reading about this, no one is making you...but hopefully some people will learn from this and learn how to make better decisions than Lucille made.
Knowledgable people are writing to inform others how to avoid these situations. Michelle from Seattle basically said everything people should listen to when purchasing from a "breeder". There is no reason anyone should quit posting regarding this case until everyone knows how to look for a reputable breeder. Yes, poor Debbie is at the center of this, but she is certainly not the only person to breed poor quality dogs and sell them for quality dog prices.
Everyone should read Michelle's comments and learn from them. Showing, legitimately registering, health testing, guarantees, references and no internet advertising are a huge part of finding a good breeder, but certainly not everything. If people don't like reading about this, no one is making you...but hopefully some people will learn from this and learn how to make better decisions than Lucille made.
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What's this?
To all those who wrote against Debbie Rondeau - I have one thing to say to all of you!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
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What's this?
To all those who wrote against Debbie Rondeau - I have one thing to say to all of you!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
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What's this?
To all those who wrote against Debbie Rondeau - I have one thing to say to all of you!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
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What's this?
To all those who wrote against Debbie Rondeau - I have one thing to say to all of you!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
May ALL your past mistakes be thrown up in YOUR faces and may ALL of them be SMEARED ALL OVER THE INTERNET FOR EVERYONE TO SEE!
Geez, ENOUGH already! The woman has done everything in her power to correct all these situations and YOU PEOPLE JUST KEEP ON KICKING A WOUNDED DOG!
You're all a bunch of low lifes' who don't have anything better to do than to smear other people so you will look good! Get a friggin life will ya!!!
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What's this? #18 Consumer Suggestion
If You Must Purchase A Canine Companion From A Breeder
AUTHOR: S.n. - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, August 21, 2005
I've said this before, but I will say it again. Do NOT purchase your canine companion over the Internet. You need to see the puppy, both parents and the living conditions at the breeder's place of business. Do your homework before you pick a particular breed. Then you know which questions to ask and you'll know the answers you should be getting. While every canine companion is different, there are certain traits that come along with each breed. There are thousands of Canine Rescue Groups out there and some are breed specific. Contact them and ask about the traits of the breed you are interested in and find out about medical conditions that may affect that breed and how to be a responsible pet owner. I have seen one post on this thread from a Good Breeder. He worries about where his puppies will end up and takes the time to go the extra mile. If you absolutely have to but from a breeder, this is the type of breeder you want to be dealing with, not over the Internet, sight unseen.
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What's this? #19 Consumer Comment
Beware "Marginal" dog registries
AUTHOR: Michelle - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, August 21, 2005
I see several replies to this situation, some of which note that people are looking to buy a dog over the internet. PLEASE use caution, and you won't end up like the person who bought her mixed breed Shih Tzu.
The registry a breeder uses tells you a great deal about a breeder.
In the U.S., puppies should be registered with AKC (American Kennel Club), UKC (United Kennel Club), the ARBA(American Rare Breed Association) or the foreign registries - the CKC (Canadian Kennel Club) or FCI (Federation Cynologique Internationally).
These registries do not guarantee a good breeder or a well-bred dog, but unlike many other registries, they represent stricter standards (the case in point shows that).
Many registries were started after the AKC instituted the Frequently Used Sires (FUS) requirement which requires DNA certification of a male dog used to sire more than 7 litters in his lifetime.
Some litters have been turned down by the AKC because of violation of this requirement and many other breeders are boycotting AKC as they cannot, or will not, meet AKC's more stringent requirements for breeders.
Some examples of alternative registries that should set off alarms that you are not dealing with a responsible breeder include:
ACA (American Canine Association)
APR (American Purebred Registry)
APRI (America's Pet Registry Inc.)
ARU (Animal Registry Unlimited)
CKC (Continental Kennel Club)
FIC (Federation of International Canines)
USKC (United States Kennel Club)
WKC (World Kennel Club)
WWKC (World Wide Kennel Club)
Please note that some of the registries have similar or the same initials as the older and well established registries. This can cause confusion for consumers. Don't be fooled.
Breeders that charge additional money for AKC papers are suspect also, as are people that charge different "pet/breeding" prices. The dog is either a pet, or is something that should be bred because it conforms to the breed standard and has passed health tests for common health concerns in the breed.
The price should not be higher because you can squeeze puppies out of it later on down the road...That is the breeder reaching into the future to get a "cut" of any money you *might* make with a litter someday. Of course, the breeder who wants extra cash for a breedable female will have no interest in offering to help pay vet bills should something go wrong with your little girl when she tries to have her litter.
Last but not least, BIG RED FLAG, beware of breeders that always have puppies available.
They seem to have beautiful websites, with music and pretty pictures, and they always brag their pups are home raised, and the parents are the best house dogs...How do you think someone can "home raise with love" 25, 30, or 100 puppies at a time!.
Obviously, the are not going to put pictures on their site of how their dogs really live.
They may only show 3-10 pups for sale at a time on their site, but look at the birthdates of the pups, or the colors and sizes, and you can see how many litters they currently have. When people email, often the dog on the webpage is not availale, but they will have others, and send you photos. Often they have a "sale grabbing" story of how this unlisted pup was "pick of the litter", and the sale fell though, and they had not had time to relist...who would NOT want to think they got in on that deal!
Vet checks are USELESS - many vets do a lot of business with these yucky breeders, and will sign off anything, not charging much, due to the ongoing business relationship they have with the breeder.
All the vet has to guarantee is the dog is not too sick to fly. That is it. The dog can have a hernia the size of your fist, be blind & deaf, etc. and it can still be signed off to FLY on a plane.
There is SO much information on the internet.
If puppy buyers would spend 1/10th of the time learning how to buy a puppy from a repulable breeder as they do looking at pictures of puppies to buy, so many of these horror stories would not happen.
The registry a breeder uses tells you a great deal about a breeder.
In the U.S., puppies should be registered with AKC (American Kennel Club), UKC (United Kennel Club), the ARBA(American Rare Breed Association) or the foreign registries - the CKC (Canadian Kennel Club) or FCI (Federation Cynologique Internationally).
These registries do not guarantee a good breeder or a well-bred dog, but unlike many other registries, they represent stricter standards (the case in point shows that).
Many registries were started after the AKC instituted the Frequently Used Sires (FUS) requirement which requires DNA certification of a male dog used to sire more than 7 litters in his lifetime.
Some litters have been turned down by the AKC because of violation of this requirement and many other breeders are boycotting AKC as they cannot, or will not, meet AKC's more stringent requirements for breeders.
Some examples of alternative registries that should set off alarms that you are not dealing with a responsible breeder include:
ACA (American Canine Association)
APR (American Purebred Registry)
APRI (America's Pet Registry Inc.)
ARU (Animal Registry Unlimited)
CKC (Continental Kennel Club)
FIC (Federation of International Canines)
USKC (United States Kennel Club)
WKC (World Kennel Club)
WWKC (World Wide Kennel Club)
Please note that some of the registries have similar or the same initials as the older and well established registries. This can cause confusion for consumers. Don't be fooled.
Breeders that charge additional money for AKC papers are suspect also, as are people that charge different "pet/breeding" prices. The dog is either a pet, or is something that should be bred because it conforms to the breed standard and has passed health tests for common health concerns in the breed.
The price should not be higher because you can squeeze puppies out of it later on down the road...That is the breeder reaching into the future to get a "cut" of any money you *might* make with a litter someday. Of course, the breeder who wants extra cash for a breedable female will have no interest in offering to help pay vet bills should something go wrong with your little girl when she tries to have her litter.
Last but not least, BIG RED FLAG, beware of breeders that always have puppies available.
They seem to have beautiful websites, with music and pretty pictures, and they always brag their pups are home raised, and the parents are the best house dogs...How do you think someone can "home raise with love" 25, 30, or 100 puppies at a time!.
Obviously, the are not going to put pictures on their site of how their dogs really live.
They may only show 3-10 pups for sale at a time on their site, but look at the birthdates of the pups, or the colors and sizes, and you can see how many litters they currently have. When people email, often the dog on the webpage is not availale, but they will have others, and send you photos. Often they have a "sale grabbing" story of how this unlisted pup was "pick of the litter", and the sale fell though, and they had not had time to relist...who would NOT want to think they got in on that deal!
Vet checks are USELESS - many vets do a lot of business with these yucky breeders, and will sign off anything, not charging much, due to the ongoing business relationship they have with the breeder.
All the vet has to guarantee is the dog is not too sick to fly. That is it. The dog can have a hernia the size of your fist, be blind & deaf, etc. and it can still be signed off to FLY on a plane.
There is SO much information on the internet.
If puppy buyers would spend 1/10th of the time learning how to buy a puppy from a repulable breeder as they do looking at pictures of puppies to buy, so many of these horror stories would not happen.
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What's this? #20 Consumer Suggestion
This dog is obviously a mix
AUTHOR: Michelle - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, August 20, 2005
This dog is obviously a mix. As an exhibitor in several AKC venues, I am appalled that they tried to pass this off as purebred.
Not sure if it has to do with money, as the AKC would lose money if Debbie Rondeau were not able to register litters, but it does not look good for the AKC to give a "pass" to this obviously mixed breed dog.
I would suggest any who are as disgusted as I am by the write the AKC.
You can write them directly here:
http://www.akc.org/contact/contact_akc.cfm
Be civil, explain your thoughts, and ask how they could have determined this dog was purebred.
I would address it to either the Customer service desk, or to DNA...
Not sure if it has to do with money, as the AKC would lose money if Debbie Rondeau were not able to register litters, but it does not look good for the AKC to give a "pass" to this obviously mixed breed dog.
I would suggest any who are as disgusted as I am by the write the AKC.
You can write them directly here:
http://www.akc.org/contact/contact_akc.cfm
Be civil, explain your thoughts, and ask how they could have determined this dog was purebred.
I would address it to either the Customer service desk, or to DNA...
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What's this? #21 Consumer Comment
Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
AUTHOR: Sal - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, August 19, 2005
Lucille, I sympathize with you completely. I was appalled at reading the info about Debbie Rondeau, and couldn't believe my eyes when seeing the picture of your "shih tzu".
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
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What's this? #22 Consumer Comment
Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
AUTHOR: Sal - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, August 19, 2005
Lucille, I sympathize with you completely. I was appalled at reading the info about Debbie Rondeau, and couldn't believe my eyes when seeing the picture of your "shih tzu".
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #23 Consumer Comment
Definately Not a pure bred shih tzu!
AUTHOR: Sal - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, August 19, 2005
Lucille, I sympathize with you completely. I was appalled at reading the info about Debbie Rondeau, and couldn't believe my eyes when seeing the picture of your "shih tzu".
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
I'm glad you came forward with this info to share with other potential buyers. It's a good reminder for everyone to do a lot of research on the breeder prior to the purchase, etc...especially when buying things over the internet.
Rest assured your post will have helped/and will continue to help other buyers from buying from this appalling backyard breeder.
Your dog is a cutie, however, you (and everyone else) are correct, it's (obviously) not a purebred shih tzu.
Does your vet have any idea what kind of dog it really is? (I mean, what it could have been mixed with? It looks to me to have some chihuahua in it).
Maybe Debbie needs some glasses or simply does not have a conscience, she had no right doing what she did. That's the problem with buying things over the internet unfortunately, there's a lot of con artists out there!
Have you filed any sort of legal complaint? You can send her info/your complaint to the FTC and the Attorney General and many other places so her info is kept on file with the police/fbi for future use if needed.
Respond to this report!
What's this? #24 Consumer Comment
to debbie, lucille you are supposed to be a reputible breeder yet you sell inferior examples of your breed
AUTHOR: Harold - (Canada)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, August 17, 2005
debbie,
you are supposed to be a reputible breeder yet you sell inferior examples of your breed for top price it seems,and when this is pointed out you go all legal with paperwork to defend your actions.ie:papers say it is certified as a shih tsu.
too bad dogs weren't like cars(you would be hard pressed to sell a porche for $80 000 if the body is from a volkswagon).
the fact that you even offered to replace the animal with another proves that they are no more than a commodity to you.
of course the breeder who defends you has no problems, you both decide who stays and who goes.
lucille,
looks like you got left with the runt.
mrs breeder had the chance to unload an inferior product and you were the lucky winner.
you said yourself that you aren't a breeder and didn't know about the recessive gene.
the money doesn't matter,all that matters is the fact that you now have a companion that will love you no matter what.
you have papers!!!(frame em and display em)adds to the character and uniqueness of the little bugger lol.
i think the dog lovers all see how mrs rondeau operates now.your story says it all.(good heads-up)
howie,
(not even a dog lover)
new brunswick,canada
you are supposed to be a reputible breeder yet you sell inferior examples of your breed for top price it seems,and when this is pointed out you go all legal with paperwork to defend your actions.ie:papers say it is certified as a shih tsu.
too bad dogs weren't like cars(you would be hard pressed to sell a porche for $80 000 if the body is from a volkswagon).
the fact that you even offered to replace the animal with another proves that they are no more than a commodity to you.
of course the breeder who defends you has no problems, you both decide who stays and who goes.
lucille,
looks like you got left with the runt.
mrs breeder had the chance to unload an inferior product and you were the lucky winner.
you said yourself that you aren't a breeder and didn't know about the recessive gene.
the money doesn't matter,all that matters is the fact that you now have a companion that will love you no matter what.
you have papers!!!(frame em and display em)adds to the character and uniqueness of the little bugger lol.
i think the dog lovers all see how mrs rondeau operates now.your story says it all.(good heads-up)
howie,
(not even a dog lover)
new brunswick,canada
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What's this? #25 Consumer Comment
Show breeders vs. backyard breeders
AUTHOR: Riley - (Canada)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, August 17, 2005
This response is very late, but I just have to respond to the comments regarding how a breeder that does not breed for show is irresponsible. Excuse me, but there is a BIG world outside show dogs. Perhaps some show breeders test their dogs, but there are a lot of others that don't, that continue to put up champions for stud or breed them knowing they are carriers to certain genetic diseases--if you deny that, you're denying history. Isn't it the show world that ruined a lot of dog breeds? Don't tell me breeding Yorkshire Terriers or Chihuahuas that need C-sections is 'responsible' breeding. Don't tell me that continually producing Bulldogs that can't even function sexually without human help or even RUN is responsible breeding. What does a 'show' require, apart from having a dog look a certain way, and act docile around judges? Just being 'docile' isn't a judge for temperament--I can take any dog off the street and teach it to accept strangers fondling their heads and private parts.
If the show world is so responsible, why are there no stricter policies prohibiting people with diseased-laden animals from breeding or showing? And what does a dog's stop, or his gait, or the colour of his ears have to do with health? Show people do nothing but condemn 'backyard breeders', when most problems with the dog world stems from them in general. They blame backyard breeders that breed dogs without testing them, when those abnormalities come because the dogs were chosen to look that way--FOR THE SHOW WORLD. How much influence does a single backyard breeder have in the long run?
"Show" is not anonymous with quality. I know for a fact that show breeders do charge almost twice the amount of money a backyard breeder would for a pet. And temperament is an issue. "Show" is not a valid test for a dog's temperament, ability, or nerves. Is anyone familiar with the term "working"? Are they not as, if not more, responsible than show breeders? Obedience trials, regarded as something you *teach* a dog, rather than a dog is born with, would be a better test than show.
A dog is beautiful no matter what way he carries his ears or his tail, if he does what I want him to do. I would urge people to look at a breeder, "backyard" or not, the way it is--the way he treats his litter, you, and his dogs in general. I got a Dachshund from a backyard breeder and I have never been more pleased. You can be a breeder and have a higher criteria than show breeders with their papered champions. When you start judging dogs a different way, you'll know this to be true.
If the show world is so responsible, why are there no stricter policies prohibiting people with diseased-laden animals from breeding or showing? And what does a dog's stop, or his gait, or the colour of his ears have to do with health? Show people do nothing but condemn 'backyard breeders', when most problems with the dog world stems from them in general. They blame backyard breeders that breed dogs without testing them, when those abnormalities come because the dogs were chosen to look that way--FOR THE SHOW WORLD. How much influence does a single backyard breeder have in the long run?
"Show" is not anonymous with quality. I know for a fact that show breeders do charge almost twice the amount of money a backyard breeder would for a pet. And temperament is an issue. "Show" is not a valid test for a dog's temperament, ability, or nerves. Is anyone familiar with the term "working"? Are they not as, if not more, responsible than show breeders? Obedience trials, regarded as something you *teach* a dog, rather than a dog is born with, would be a better test than show.
A dog is beautiful no matter what way he carries his ears or his tail, if he does what I want him to do. I would urge people to look at a breeder, "backyard" or not, the way it is--the way he treats his litter, you, and his dogs in general. I got a Dachshund from a backyard breeder and I have never been more pleased. You can be a breeder and have a higher criteria than show breeders with their papered champions. When you start judging dogs a different way, you'll know this to be true.
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What's this? #26 Consumer Comment
I am one of those "prissy" show people
AUTHOR: Shannon - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, November 24, 2004
I am NOT prissy, my retired show dog does NOT eat off of any kind of spoon (silver or otherwise). Just because you take your dog to the vet for shots doesn't mean it is a healthy dog. There are many underlying diseases that you can't diagnose unless you TEST FOR THEM. How is a vet going to look at a Boxer and say their heart is ok? They can't say that just by listening to it. Just because a vet looks at my irish setter's eyes and says they look ok doesn't mean squat to me. Irish setters are prone to PRA and the only way to diagnose that is to take them to a canine eye specialist and have a CERF certified vet do a test then you get a certificate saying the dog is, as far as the CERF vet knows, free of PRA symptoms. CERF has to be done every year and in my area the cost is about $75. OR you can pay to run a blood test and have the dog certified DNA clear (which my dog is certified DNA PRA clear from DNA certified clear parents). How many backyard breeders are willing to spend $1200 or more on cardiac, thyroid, hip OFA's, VwD, DNA testing, plus all the expenses incurred in showing their breeding stock to judges in a dog show? NONE because they want to make a QUICK BUCK on their puppies and you can't make any money when you're spending it on health testing and dog shows! My dog is a retired neutered show prospect and I just spent $500 getting a thyroid panel and his hips done in August for his breeder because she cares about where her breeding program is going and wants to know if she is producing HEALTHY dogs. Not dogs who just look healthy but dogs who are physically and mentally healthy. I have yet to find a "show breeder" who charges 3 times what a backyard breeder charges just because they claim they have "show" dogs. But atleast people who show their dogs are making an effort to better their breed and that's more than I can say for people who just pump out litter after litter and take money then tell you "too bad so sad" when something goes wrong.
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What's this? #27 Consumer Comment
How you can get a hold of Debbie Rondeau
AUTHOR: Donna - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, November 23, 2004
Please view my complaint I put on this site, on 11-14-04 by searching under than name Debbie Rondeau, or fourpaws shih tzu. I am an investigator and Debbie took my money and sold my pup to someone else and told me it died. See my complaint to see more info about what she did to me. I FINALLY got a money order out of her last week for most of what she owes me. Here is her new e-mail address: kira@winning.com or wagintails.com Also her new website is www.wagintails.com She is getting a bad reputation on her old Four Paws site, so she decided to change names and try it again. Under her new site and address are not listed. I heard she went into business with someone else. I hope they know what they are getting themselves into.
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What's this? #28 REBUTTAL Individual responds
COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
AUTHOR: COURTNEY - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, November 23, 2004
My 16 1/2 year old shih tzu died over approximately 20 months ago. After several heart-breaking months where I didn't think I wanted another one, I started looking for shih-tzus. My mom and sister each have one also and we are all partial to the breed. After doing a lot of research and even checking with the better business bureau and some other breeders, I contacted Debbie about a dog on her site. She told me the dog was available. I mailed a deposit. She then called and said that her husband had alread sold the dog. She did not return my deposit as she said she would hold it until another dog became available. I specifically wanted a solid female. From time to time over the last 16 or 18 months, I have emailed Debbie. Each time she has been vague and never seems to have an available dog. Needless to say, I have never received a puppy, have not received emails from her in MONTHS, her email address no longer works and her phone number is no longer on her website. I had long since written this money off as a bad decision. I am glad to see others have had the same problems.
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What's this? #29 REBUTTAL Individual responds
COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
AUTHOR: COURTNEY - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, November 23, 2004
My 16 1/2 year old shih tzu died over approximately 20 months ago. After several heart-breaking months where I didn't think I wanted another one, I started looking for shih-tzus. My mom and sister each have one also and we are all partial to the breed. After doing a lot of research and even checking with the better business bureau and some other breeders, I contacted Debbie about a dog on her site. She told me the dog was available. I mailed a deposit. She then called and said that her husband had alread sold the dog. She did not return my deposit as she said she would hold it until another dog became available. I specifically wanted a solid female. From time to time over the last 16 or 18 months, I have emailed Debbie. Each time she has been vague and never seems to have an available dog. Needless to say, I have never received a puppy, have not received emails from her in MONTHS, her email address no longer works and her phone number is no longer on her website. I had long since written this money off as a bad decision. I am glad to see others have had the same problems.
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What's this? #30 REBUTTAL Individual responds
COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
AUTHOR: COURTNEY - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, November 23, 2004
My 16 1/2 year old shih tzu died over approximately 20 months ago. After several heart-breaking months where I didn't think I wanted another one, I started looking for shih-tzus. My mom and sister each have one also and we are all partial to the breed. After doing a lot of research and even checking with the better business bureau and some other breeders, I contacted Debbie about a dog on her site. She told me the dog was available. I mailed a deposit. She then called and said that her husband had alread sold the dog. She did not return my deposit as she said she would hold it until another dog became available. I specifically wanted a solid female. From time to time over the last 16 or 18 months, I have emailed Debbie. Each time she has been vague and never seems to have an available dog. Needless to say, I have never received a puppy, have not received emails from her in MONTHS, her email address no longer works and her phone number is no longer on her website. I had long since written this money off as a bad decision. I am glad to see others have had the same problems.
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What's this? #31 REBUTTAL Individual responds
COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS
AUTHOR: COURTNEY - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, November 23, 2004
My 16 1/2 year old shih tzu died over approximately 20 months ago. After several heart-breaking months where I didn't think I wanted another one, I started looking for shih-tzus. My mom and sister each have one also and we are all partial to the breed. After doing a lot of research and even checking with the better business bureau and some other breeders, I contacted Debbie about a dog on her site. She told me the dog was available. I mailed a deposit. She then called and said that her husband had alread sold the dog. She did not return my deposit as she said she would hold it until another dog became available. I specifically wanted a solid female. From time to time over the last 16 or 18 months, I have emailed Debbie. Each time she has been vague and never seems to have an available dog. Needless to say, I have never received a puppy, have not received emails from her in MONTHS, her email address no longer works and her phone number is no longer on her website. I had long since written this money off as a bad decision. I am glad to see others have had the same problems.
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What's this? #32 Consumer Comment
confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, November 14, 2004
I must have misrepresented myself; I am not a breeder. I am merely someone who is confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters around the country. Rather than take issue with the entire concept of breeding dogs, I have learned that the best way to fight pet overpopulation is to encourage people who want a PET to get that PET at a shelter. Leave the breeding to the show community.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
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What's this? #33 Consumer Comment
confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, November 14, 2004
I must have misrepresented myself; I am not a breeder. I am merely someone who is confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters around the country. Rather than take issue with the entire concept of breeding dogs, I have learned that the best way to fight pet overpopulation is to encourage people who want a PET to get that PET at a shelter. Leave the breeding to the show community.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
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What's this? #34 Consumer Comment
confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, November 14, 2004
I must have misrepresented myself; I am not a breeder. I am merely someone who is confounded with people who insist on buying pets when there are millions of loving pets waiting for them in shelters around the country. Rather than take issue with the entire concept of breeding dogs, I have learned that the best way to fight pet overpopulation is to encourage people who want a PET to get that PET at a shelter. Leave the breeding to the show community.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
To C.L.:
C.L., didn't your mother tell you what happens when you assume things?
I am not a dog breeder. My house contains many cats and one dog - all were found abandoned. One was taped in a cardboard box and left outside of our vet's office. I am a young person who hasn't even attempted to have children yet, but I have a lifetime of experience dealing with other people's irresponsibility towards animals.
Many health problems caused by poor breeding show up later in the animals life. A vet isn't a psychic and can't tell you for certain if in five years a hereditary condition is going to spring up and require expensive surgery. That's why it is important to deal with responsible breeders - they have their dogs screened for joint conditions before they allow them to breed. Through much research I have learned that this is just one of the many steps that responsible breeders take. I used to think that every breeder was irresponsible because they ALL do contribute to the deaths of shelter pets. But, you have to compromise in this world. So I've learned to only disparage the truly irresponsible breeders that add to problems for their dogs, their owners and the community at large.
Don't accuse me of being prissy - I'm not the one who is choosing a companion to love based on its age or looks. Let's be honest about who the real snobs are here.
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What's this? #35 Consumer Suggestion
Well, throw her a bone!
AUTHOR: C. L. - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, November 13, 2004
This response is for Alicia.
What makes you think that all we buy a Shih Tzu for is to show. Most of we normal people get Shih Tzu's for pets and companionship. They are very loving dogs.
What is the matter with buying from a local breeder when you can see the conditions in which they were born and raised instead of buying from Las Vegas or maybe Houston and get ripped off?
In case you haven't read the rip off reports, the internet is a breeding ground for cyber criminals,
and everyone that shops here gets what they deserve!
You call them "show dogs" so you can charge double or triple for them, then say your prayers as to whether you even get anything at all for your money.
As for animal rescues, well she wanted a pup, and I can't blame her.
We all know you are one of those prissy breaders that paint their nails and feed them off a spoon, sorry you couldn't have children of your own, but grow up! A Shih Tzu is an animal and a pet.
And, how do we know we are getting a healthy pet? In case you haven't heard, there are people to take your pets to get them checked. They are called Vets. They are listed in your local yellow pages.
Most pet owners take their animals there to be checked and to get their shots.
What makes you think that all we buy a Shih Tzu for is to show. Most of we normal people get Shih Tzu's for pets and companionship. They are very loving dogs.
What is the matter with buying from a local breeder when you can see the conditions in which they were born and raised instead of buying from Las Vegas or maybe Houston and get ripped off?
In case you haven't read the rip off reports, the internet is a breeding ground for cyber criminals,
and everyone that shops here gets what they deserve!
You call them "show dogs" so you can charge double or triple for them, then say your prayers as to whether you even get anything at all for your money.
As for animal rescues, well she wanted a pup, and I can't blame her.
We all know you are one of those prissy breaders that paint their nails and feed them off a spoon, sorry you couldn't have children of your own, but grow up! A Shih Tzu is an animal and a pet.
And, how do we know we are getting a healthy pet? In case you haven't heard, there are people to take your pets to get them checked. They are called Vets. They are listed in your local yellow pages.
Most pet owners take their animals there to be checked and to get their shots.
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What's this? #36 Consumer Suggestion
Don't support backyard breeders!
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, November 13, 2004
You people that buy puppies from newspaper ads are not helping the situation. Some of you say that you've gotten perfectly healthy dogs for half the price of this 'four paws' place. How do you know they are perfectly healthy? Even if you are happy with your dog's appearance, you may end up with hereditary problems that show up years later. Or your dog may suffer from conditions that you'll never know about - remember, dogs can't tell you what's wrong.
Just because you are satisfied doesn't mean that you bought a 'good' dog.
People who don't show their dogs are bad breeders. The only reason people should breed their dogs is to better the breed. In order to better the breed you have to be judged on your work by professionals. People can't objectively judge their own dogs because of personal bias. People who breed that don't show are just breeding for money. And when you support them you support a horrible practice.
You kill a shelter pet every time you buy from a backyard breeder. It's just that simple. THERE ARE A LOT OF SHI TZU RESCUES! Choose a rescue dog next time; otherwise you are no better than Debbie.
Just because you are satisfied doesn't mean that you bought a 'good' dog.
People who don't show their dogs are bad breeders. The only reason people should breed their dogs is to better the breed. In order to better the breed you have to be judged on your work by professionals. People can't objectively judge their own dogs because of personal bias. People who breed that don't show are just breeding for money. And when you support them you support a horrible practice.
You kill a shelter pet every time you buy from a backyard breeder. It's just that simple. THERE ARE A LOT OF SHI TZU RESCUES! Choose a rescue dog next time; otherwise you are no better than Debbie.
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What's this?
I am so happy there is this Rip Off Report that consumers can have access to. I have been wanting a shih tzu puppy for several months. I would watch the puppies for sale by Four Paws to see one I would like since I live in Oregon and would be easy to pick up. When I would e mail her asking a question about a pup as I wanted one that would be on the small side because of arthritis in my hands she would e mail back with very short words. I gave her all my information which would let someone know this would be a dog that would be part of a family of 2 retired people who had a shih tzu for 14 years.
I expected Debbie to say she would contact me when she had one that would be appropriate for me as she knew I was interested in getting another shih tzu. She would either not answer or have a short quip like "not now".
After reading this report I went out locally and found the perfect puppy for 1/2 what Debbie charges. I thought getting one from Debbie would assure me a good one but after seeing the picture of the puppy that was suppose to be a shih tzu and looked nothing like one I decided I was just as well off getting one listed in the paper.
I am not disappointed as mine does look and act like a purebred shih tzu. It is obvious the puppy in the picture is not!!!
Thanks to this website I did not make a mistake.
I expected Debbie to say she would contact me when she had one that would be appropriate for me as she knew I was interested in getting another shih tzu. She would either not answer or have a short quip like "not now".
After reading this report I went out locally and found the perfect puppy for 1/2 what Debbie charges. I thought getting one from Debbie would assure me a good one but after seeing the picture of the puppy that was suppose to be a shih tzu and looked nothing like one I decided I was just as well off getting one listed in the paper.
I am not disappointed as mine does look and act like a purebred shih tzu. It is obvious the puppy in the picture is not!!!
Thanks to this website I did not make a mistake.
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What's this? #38 Consumer Comment
Asking around
AUTHOR: Travis - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, November 10, 2004
Lucille,
You are correct she would have given you numbers of people that "love" her and her dogs. Here is the But and it is something to think of, but would take time. Ask other breeders, If she shows her dogs ( and that is an IF ) other breeders may tell you what they think of her dogs.
I still think she should stand behind her pups, and in doing that do her best to make you happy. I hope that others read this and see just how unwilling she is in helping her babies out.
She is a Bad Breeder. She also needs to step up to the plate this is her puppy.
Good Luck
You are correct she would have given you numbers of people that "love" her and her dogs. Here is the But and it is something to think of, but would take time. Ask other breeders, If she shows her dogs ( and that is an IF ) other breeders may tell you what they think of her dogs.
I still think she should stand behind her pups, and in doing that do her best to make you happy. I hope that others read this and see just how unwilling she is in helping her babies out.
She is a Bad Breeder. She also needs to step up to the plate this is her puppy.
Good Luck
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What's this? #39 Consumer Suggestion
Look before you leep!!!!!!!
AUTHOR: C. L. - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, November 07, 2004
Why would you ever buy an over priced Shih Tzu off the internet?
I live in a very small town and in our small town paper we have AKC registered Shih Tzu's for sale all of the time.
I am on my third one now and have not ever been disappointed in my purchase. My male that I have now I paid $325 for him. We also went to the home and were able to see the home in which he was born and both the parents.
You people all have more money than brains and deserve just what you get, so quit your whining and invest your money in maybe a total brain transplant!
I live in a very small town and in our small town paper we have AKC registered Shih Tzu's for sale all of the time.
I am on my third one now and have not ever been disappointed in my purchase. My male that I have now I paid $325 for him. We also went to the home and were able to see the home in which he was born and both the parents.
You people all have more money than brains and deserve just what you get, so quit your whining and invest your money in maybe a total brain transplant!
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What's this? #40 Author of original report
Rebuttal Comments - True Facts. I am not a breeder and never knew anything about recessive which Debbie should have been up front about.
AUTHOR: Lucille - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, November 07, 2004
To Donna - Athens, Maine:
Yes, a picture of Nikko was emailed to me when he was a baby when the hair is flat on puppies. How would I have known that the hair would not grow in. Furthermore, I am not a breeder and never knew anything about recessive which Debbie should have been up front about. I received Nikko in December, and I wrote Debbie Rondeau on February 19, 2004 about his looks. That is only two months after I got him not eight months as you state. Since Nikko is recessive, he is not a top qulity dog and some compensation is warranted.
To Debbie of Four Paws - Lapine, Oregon
The AKC did not entirely back you up. They did not disturb the registration of the litter but they further stated, and I quote: "your dog appears to be a poor representative of the breed". Shipping Nikko back to you is not an option. I just wouldn't think of sending him back to you not to mention the expense. It cost me $100 to ship him to me. Then it would cost another $100 to ship him back. Then it would cost me another $100 for you to ship another puppy. That's $300 in shipping at my expesne, not to mention what quality the next puppy would be like. Does that make sense? You stated that you were open and honest about his appearance before I got him. That is totally untrue. You never mentioned anthing about the fact that he was recessive until after my letter of 2/19/04. You state that you have done everything in your power to settle this. That is not true. The only thing you're willing to do is to exchange him. He is not top quality, and therefore, a partial reimbursement is only fair. Half the time, you didn't even answer my emails.
To Shannon - Mississippi: Thank you
Stephanie - North Carolina: Thank you
Wanda - Alabama: Thank you
Eva - Virginia: Thanks - You're right about the research. I know better now. I wish there were more ways to let other people know about bad breeders.
Travis - New Hampshire: Thanks - You're very conscientious and that's good. By the way, I did call the AKC before purchasing Nikko from Debbie. They said that there were no marks against her. If I had asked her for names of buyers, do you think she would have given me any names of customers that were dissatisfied with her? I don't think so.
To Jillian - Manchester: Thanks - I'm not surprised that she put the dog down without consulting you first. It only shows her lack of care.
To Sally - El Paso: Thanks - My exact thoughts. Please note in my rebuttals that I didn't wait 8 months. It was only 2 months, and I was waiting to see him "blossom".
Yes, a picture of Nikko was emailed to me when he was a baby when the hair is flat on puppies. How would I have known that the hair would not grow in. Furthermore, I am not a breeder and never knew anything about recessive which Debbie should have been up front about. I received Nikko in December, and I wrote Debbie Rondeau on February 19, 2004 about his looks. That is only two months after I got him not eight months as you state. Since Nikko is recessive, he is not a top qulity dog and some compensation is warranted.
To Debbie of Four Paws - Lapine, Oregon
The AKC did not entirely back you up. They did not disturb the registration of the litter but they further stated, and I quote: "your dog appears to be a poor representative of the breed". Shipping Nikko back to you is not an option. I just wouldn't think of sending him back to you not to mention the expense. It cost me $100 to ship him to me. Then it would cost another $100 to ship him back. Then it would cost me another $100 for you to ship another puppy. That's $300 in shipping at my expesne, not to mention what quality the next puppy would be like. Does that make sense? You stated that you were open and honest about his appearance before I got him. That is totally untrue. You never mentioned anthing about the fact that he was recessive until after my letter of 2/19/04. You state that you have done everything in your power to settle this. That is not true. The only thing you're willing to do is to exchange him. He is not top quality, and therefore, a partial reimbursement is only fair. Half the time, you didn't even answer my emails.
To Shannon - Mississippi: Thank you
Stephanie - North Carolina: Thank you
Wanda - Alabama: Thank you
Eva - Virginia: Thanks - You're right about the research. I know better now. I wish there were more ways to let other people know about bad breeders.
Travis - New Hampshire: Thanks - You're very conscientious and that's good. By the way, I did call the AKC before purchasing Nikko from Debbie. They said that there were no marks against her. If I had asked her for names of buyers, do you think she would have given me any names of customers that were dissatisfied with her? I don't think so.
To Jillian - Manchester: Thanks - I'm not surprised that she put the dog down without consulting you first. It only shows her lack of care.
To Sally - El Paso: Thanks - My exact thoughts. Please note in my rebuttals that I didn't wait 8 months. It was only 2 months, and I was waiting to see him "blossom".
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What's this? #41 Consumer Suggestion
refund warranted
AUTHOR: Sally - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, November 06, 2004
Anyone who sees the pic of the puppy can clearly see she's not a Shih Tzu, or she is "defective" as far as the breed goes. The buyer's request for a 50% refund is reasonable under the circumstances. The breeder/seller is being unreasonable by charging full price for a dog that is clearly not what someone purchasing a Shih Tzu expects to receive. That's greed, unfair and, like the site title, a rip-off.
It doesn't matter that the puppy's owner waited 8 months because she obviously already loved the pup and was waiting for her to "blossom."
I would never buy a dog sight-unseen.
I hope the breeder does the right thing based on principal.
It doesn't matter that the puppy's owner waited 8 months because she obviously already loved the pup and was waiting for her to "blossom."
I would never buy a dog sight-unseen.
I hope the breeder does the right thing based on principal.
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What's this? #42 Consumer Comment
Great Dog but agree with communication issue
AUTHOR: Jillian - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, November 05, 2004
Lucille - I got a dog from Debbie about 2.5 years ago. I am not surprised to see a complaint out here about her. I myself considered submitting one. However, what held me back was the dog I received, despite the communication difficulties. My dog is beautiful, healthy and has a great personality - he weighs about 12 pounds and everyone who meets him, instantly falls in love with him. People have asked where I got him and what I tell them, is a breeder in Oregon. I mention the name and say the dog is great but the breeder was a hassle. I let them make the decision of wether to check her out themselves.
I also, had big communication problems with Debbie. Overall she seemed very nice and caring about the dogs. Eventhough, she didn't do any kind of follow up on him, once she put him on the plane. I thought of sending her a picture and report on him, but my impression, given her lack effort, was that she didn't care. Not to mention, I really didn't want to deal with her again.
I too had trouble getting questions answered. My biggest problem was that I was to receive a certain dog that a few weeks before he was to be shipped I was told he was no longer available. It turns out he had a heart murmur and she chose to put him down. I was very upset by this since I felt that I would have like the chance to take him anyway. I didn't have the choice. It took a lot of work and many frustrating phone calls, including my lawyer, to try to get my money back... eventually, because I really wanted a dog, I settled on another dog, who is the one I referenced above. He was worth the hassle, but I don't know that I would go through her again if I choose to get another Shih Tzu.
I feel for you, and agree that if you were not warned you were not getting a shih tzu -wether he is a odd ball shih tzu or not, you didn't get what you wanted and paid for- you should be ticked. As far as the money is concerned, I don't think you should be expected to pay the same amount for a odd shih tzu as you would a normal shih tzu. But, the problem is, we want a dog so bad and are so excited, we tend to not read the fine print or prepare for the worst. the breeders that comment are professionals and know what to look for and ask for when selecting a breeder. Some buyers are not as educated about the entire process and therefor don't know what to look out for. So it is easy to get screwed. As I said, I went through trying to get my money back, and it is all over the site that there are no refunds. I am glad you posted a complaint and if she loses some business because of it, even though you don't get your money back, that should make you feel better.
I hope Debbie can take these comments and work with them to make her a better Business Woman as well as a Breeder. It will only help her in her business and I hope she sees it that way.
I also, had big communication problems with Debbie. Overall she seemed very nice and caring about the dogs. Eventhough, she didn't do any kind of follow up on him, once she put him on the plane. I thought of sending her a picture and report on him, but my impression, given her lack effort, was that she didn't care. Not to mention, I really didn't want to deal with her again.
I too had trouble getting questions answered. My biggest problem was that I was to receive a certain dog that a few weeks before he was to be shipped I was told he was no longer available. It turns out he had a heart murmur and she chose to put him down. I was very upset by this since I felt that I would have like the chance to take him anyway. I didn't have the choice. It took a lot of work and many frustrating phone calls, including my lawyer, to try to get my money back... eventually, because I really wanted a dog, I settled on another dog, who is the one I referenced above. He was worth the hassle, but I don't know that I would go through her again if I choose to get another Shih Tzu.
I feel for you, and agree that if you were not warned you were not getting a shih tzu -wether he is a odd ball shih tzu or not, you didn't get what you wanted and paid for- you should be ticked. As far as the money is concerned, I don't think you should be expected to pay the same amount for a odd shih tzu as you would a normal shih tzu. But, the problem is, we want a dog so bad and are so excited, we tend to not read the fine print or prepare for the worst. the breeders that comment are professionals and know what to look for and ask for when selecting a breeder. Some buyers are not as educated about the entire process and therefor don't know what to look out for. So it is easy to get screwed. As I said, I went through trying to get my money back, and it is all over the site that there are no refunds. I am glad you posted a complaint and if she loses some business because of it, even though you don't get your money back, that should make you feel better.
I hope Debbie can take these comments and work with them to make her a better Business Woman as well as a Breeder. It will only help her in her business and I hope she sees it that way.
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What's this?
I breed Jack Russell's, I have bought 1 dog from a pet store ( my first Jack) this poor thing is not a "true" jack. She has some issue's but that is what I get for buying her from a pet store. She is a great pet and we enjoy having her.
As a "breeder" I have my buyers sign a contract as to the care, where the dog will be going, what happens if they no longer want the dog, ect. I stand behind my dogs 100%. I give them up to 6 months to return the puppy if they are not happy, If they return it for non-health issue I don't refund 100% but I do refund something, but if it is a health issue that comes up in 2 years they get a full refund. I want to know what is going on with my puppies. I made that animal and it is up to me to make sure that animal is taken care of 100%.
I also do not sell my pups as "show quality" unless they are going to someone that is going to show them. In that case I state in my contract that I guarantee that that dog will be accepted for registration by my kennel club ( unlike the AKC my club dose not give a blanket registration for the litter, they do it dog by dog). If that dog is not up to the standards of the my kennel club I will refund 1/2 the money paid. As my show/breed dogs go for twice the price as a pet. If the puppy is sold as a pet my contract states it is sold as a pet and I want the dog altered asap. With that my kennel club will only record that dog. I do that so I know there is no unwanted dogs in shelters because I was to lazy to request they alter the dog. Only breeders knowing what they are doing & accept responsibility should be breeding.
I also would never ever shipped a dog unless I'm on that plane with it to meet the buyer. There are so many ways to get a buyer the dog, Meet them at a show or something. I want to meet the buyers ( this includes the kids and anyone living in there house) in person. I also want to know that they understand what they are buying. I also want the option to do a home visit, and follow up visit if I need to.
I guess what I'm saying is go to a breeder that you can trust and will stand behind what they breed. We should breed to better the breed not breed to make tons of money ( as there is not alot of money in it if you are doing the right thing). That dog you bought dose not look like a pure Shih Tzu. It is sad that this breeder will not stand behind what she has brought into this world. In my book that is a bad breeder. She is the type that makes us all look bad.
On the other hand you should have done your homework on her. If she is so great she should have been able to give you names of past buyers that you could have called, she also should have other breeders that can say good or bad. I know in my kennel club if a breeder dose not like you they won't sugar coat the truth. I hope you take this as a lesson and next time do your homework.
I may seem crazy in the way I place a dog, but I know where they all are and I have never had one sitting in a shelter unwanted. From time to time there new owners bring them by just to say Hi. After all I think of it as a big family.
As a "breeder" I have my buyers sign a contract as to the care, where the dog will be going, what happens if they no longer want the dog, ect. I stand behind my dogs 100%. I give them up to 6 months to return the puppy if they are not happy, If they return it for non-health issue I don't refund 100% but I do refund something, but if it is a health issue that comes up in 2 years they get a full refund. I want to know what is going on with my puppies. I made that animal and it is up to me to make sure that animal is taken care of 100%.
I also do not sell my pups as "show quality" unless they are going to someone that is going to show them. In that case I state in my contract that I guarantee that that dog will be accepted for registration by my kennel club ( unlike the AKC my club dose not give a blanket registration for the litter, they do it dog by dog). If that dog is not up to the standards of the my kennel club I will refund 1/2 the money paid. As my show/breed dogs go for twice the price as a pet. If the puppy is sold as a pet my contract states it is sold as a pet and I want the dog altered asap. With that my kennel club will only record that dog. I do that so I know there is no unwanted dogs in shelters because I was to lazy to request they alter the dog. Only breeders knowing what they are doing & accept responsibility should be breeding.
I also would never ever shipped a dog unless I'm on that plane with it to meet the buyer. There are so many ways to get a buyer the dog, Meet them at a show or something. I want to meet the buyers ( this includes the kids and anyone living in there house) in person. I also want to know that they understand what they are buying. I also want the option to do a home visit, and follow up visit if I need to.
I guess what I'm saying is go to a breeder that you can trust and will stand behind what they breed. We should breed to better the breed not breed to make tons of money ( as there is not alot of money in it if you are doing the right thing). That dog you bought dose not look like a pure Shih Tzu. It is sad that this breeder will not stand behind what she has brought into this world. In my book that is a bad breeder. She is the type that makes us all look bad.
On the other hand you should have done your homework on her. If she is so great she should have been able to give you names of past buyers that you could have called, she also should have other breeders that can say good or bad. I know in my kennel club if a breeder dose not like you they won't sugar coat the truth. I hope you take this as a lesson and next time do your homework.
I may seem crazy in the way I place a dog, but I know where they all are and I have never had one sitting in a shelter unwanted. From time to time there new owners bring them by just to say Hi. After all I think of it as a big family.
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What's this? #44 Consumer Suggestion
Definitely not a shih tzu........
AUTHOR: Eva - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, October 26, 2004
I really sympathize with you Lucille, but please let this be a lesson to ANYONE out there looking for a shih tzu puppy to DO YOUR RESEARCH for months before buying, and make sure like a few on this board have suggested that you are buying from a reputable breeder, with a few great dogs, not some mass-"breeder" that profits off the backs of these poor sweet animals, constantly have one litter after the next. You ALWAYS want to see the parents or detailed pics and pedigrees.
Over the months that you research different breeders, you will begin to see BIG differences in quality...(thick coats versus thin, bright expressions, eyes not rimmed with white, healthy fluffy clean puppies, versus sad, dingy looking ones. There are a LOT of BADDDD backyard breeders out there, and we must do everything we can to put them out of business. Your story has certainly caused me to add Debbie of 4 Paws to that list...She is wrong for EVER selling that puppy to you for the price she did, and she knows it.
Thanks for sharing your story, that sweet little guy deserves a loving forever home just as much as any dog, and it sounds like he is lucky to have found YOU.
Over the months that you research different breeders, you will begin to see BIG differences in quality...(thick coats versus thin, bright expressions, eyes not rimmed with white, healthy fluffy clean puppies, versus sad, dingy looking ones. There are a LOT of BADDDD backyard breeders out there, and we must do everything we can to put them out of business. Your story has certainly caused me to add Debbie of 4 Paws to that list...She is wrong for EVER selling that puppy to you for the price she did, and she knows it.
Thanks for sharing your story, that sweet little guy deserves a loving forever home just as much as any dog, and it sounds like he is lucky to have found YOU.
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What's this?
There are plenty of reputable show breeders who WILL ship their puppies. They usually have some kind of puppy questionnaire to get a feel of what you are looking for in a dog and try to contact you by phone and talk to you. They usually find someone who lives close by that can do a home check or, in my case, try to meet the people at a dog show if they are going to be in the area. I bought my dog from a breeder who lives on Colorado and I drove 7 hours to our National Specialty show to meet her, the sire of my pup and lots of his relatives. I couldn't meet mom because she was at home with the pups but I felt comfortable enough with his breeder to buy a dog sight unseen. Would I do it again? Sure, as long as I could do something similar to the first time and as long as I felt comfortable with the breeder. I am a picky buyer and I want to see ALL the health clearances for both parents before I bring home that pup. I want some kind of written contract stating what happens if something genetic pops up or if it turns to have a disqualifying fault and can't be shown to its championship. A good breeder will know what s/he is breeding the parents for and can tell you the reasons WHY s/he bred to that particular dog. They usually have spent hours and hours pouring over pedigrees and pictures, going over dogs they think will compliment their bitch and add something they want to improve on in their own lines. The sad thing to me is we live in a "give it to me now" society and everyone wants that cute puppy in the window nownownow and doesn't want to wait for a well bred pup. The money you spend on a reputable breeder will be worth it in the long run because the chances of genetic and health problems will be fewer since they checked it BEFORE they bred the litter and you can be fairly sure the puppy you are getting will look like the breed that it is.. just my 2 cents...
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What's this?
There are plenty of reputable show breeders who WILL ship their puppies. They usually have some kind of puppy questionnaire to get a feel of what you are looking for in a dog and try to contact you by phone and talk to you. They usually find someone who lives close by that can do a home check or, in my case, try to meet the people at a dog show if they are going to be in the area. I bought my dog from a breeder who lives on Colorado and I drove 7 hours to our National Specialty show to meet her, the sire of my pup and lots of his relatives. I couldn't meet mom because she was at home with the pups but I felt comfortable enough with his breeder to buy a dog sight unseen. Would I do it again? Sure, as long as I could do something similar to the first time and as long as I felt comfortable with the breeder. I am a picky buyer and I want to see ALL the health clearances for both parents before I bring home that pup. I want some kind of written contract stating what happens if something genetic pops up or if it turns to have a disqualifying fault and can't be shown to its championship. A good breeder will know what s/he is breeding the parents for and can tell you the reasons WHY s/he bred to that particular dog. They usually have spent hours and hours pouring over pedigrees and pictures, going over dogs they think will compliment their bitch and add something they want to improve on in their own lines. The sad thing to me is we live in a "give it to me now" society and everyone wants that cute puppy in the window nownownow and doesn't want to wait for a well bred pup. The money you spend on a reputable breeder will be worth it in the long run because the chances of genetic and health problems will be fewer since they checked it BEFORE they bred the litter and you can be fairly sure the puppy you are getting will look like the breed that it is.. just my 2 cents...
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What's this?
There are plenty of reputable show breeders who WILL ship their puppies. They usually have some kind of puppy questionnaire to get a feel of what you are looking for in a dog and try to contact you by phone and talk to you. They usually find someone who lives close by that can do a home check or, in my case, try to meet the people at a dog show if they are going to be in the area. I bought my dog from a breeder who lives on Colorado and I drove 7 hours to our National Specialty show to meet her, the sire of my pup and lots of his relatives. I couldn't meet mom because she was at home with the pups but I felt comfortable enough with his breeder to buy a dog sight unseen. Would I do it again? Sure, as long as I could do something similar to the first time and as long as I felt comfortable with the breeder. I am a picky buyer and I want to see ALL the health clearances for both parents before I bring home that pup. I want some kind of written contract stating what happens if something genetic pops up or if it turns to have a disqualifying fault and can't be shown to its championship. A good breeder will know what s/he is breeding the parents for and can tell you the reasons WHY s/he bred to that particular dog. They usually have spent hours and hours pouring over pedigrees and pictures, going over dogs they think will compliment their bitch and add something they want to improve on in their own lines. The sad thing to me is we live in a "give it to me now" society and everyone wants that cute puppy in the window nownownow and doesn't want to wait for a well bred pup. The money you spend on a reputable breeder will be worth it in the long run because the chances of genetic and health problems will be fewer since they checked it BEFORE they bred the litter and you can be fairly sure the puppy you are getting will look like the breed that it is.. just my 2 cents...
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What's this? #48 Consumer Comment
Oh My Fussing over a Poor Dog
AUTHOR: Wanda - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Thursday, October 21, 2004
Well Lucille I can see your point wanting half of the money back thats only fair, but if you love this dog why would it matter, If you don't want him I'll take him he's precious. I myseaf own Min Pins, I bought what I thought was a healthy pup, it turned out to be the runt that looked more like the taco bell dog with min pin markings but Neo (his name), I wouldn't take anything for him he is part of my family mistakes happen. I did recieve about 20% of my money back but thats ok as long as he is healthy and happy.
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What's this? #49 Consumer Comment
Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
AUTHOR: Stephanie - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Thursday, October 21, 2004
Lucille,
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
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What's this? #50 Consumer Comment
Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
AUTHOR: Stephanie - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Thursday, October 21, 2004
Lucille,
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
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What's this? #51 Consumer Comment
Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
AUTHOR: Stephanie - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Thursday, October 21, 2004
Lucille,
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
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What's this? #52 Consumer Comment
Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman!
AUTHOR: Stephanie - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Thursday, October 21, 2004
Lucille,
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
Thank you for your report!! I was considering a couple of different online breeders to buy 2 shih tzu puppies from. Thanks to your report, I am no longer considering her a potential. Even with the rebuteles, I would not even consider it.. Seeing the picture of Nikko,I am repulsed by this woman! Even though a cute dog, he is not a shih tzu. And if she claims to be a reputable breeder for 30 years, she should of known what a "defective" shih tzu puppy looked like and stated that to you before you bought him!!As far as getting your money back and keeping nikko, I think it is warrented. After all, I could see if the dog was a shih tzu and you didnt like his colors or something, But for god sakes, he isnt even the breed you "thought" you were buying!!! And I would NEVER take the chance of getting a 700.00 "defective" puppy unless thats what i wanted!! Thanks again!!
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What's this? #53 Consumer Comment
The Best Shih tzu I Have Ever Owned
AUTHOR: Crystal - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Sunday, October 17, 2004
I feel obligated to write a response to the bad things being said about Debbie. I bought a dog from her a little over a year ago and I have never had a more beautiful and wonderful dog. Mine is solid black and has perfect markings, a perfect coat, a correct bite, and best of all a wonderful personality. I take her everywhere with me, carrying her in a little bag, going shopping, etc. I get stopped by people all the time asking me who the breeder is that I got her from. My groomer has asked me from day one why I don't show her or breed her. She is only about 7.5 pounds full grown. Her hair is all the way down to the ground and I keep her very well groomed.
One time I was at Petco and had someone stop me to inquire about her and after talking for a while she told me that she had gotten two dogs from Debbie and that like me, she felt they were the best dogs she had ever owned.
I think that it is sad that you received a dog that didn't look the way you wanted but instead of bad mouthing Debbie, you should realize that sometimes just like a child is born not perfect, so is a dog.
I would reccommend Debbie to anyone that asked and when I am ready for another dog, I would definately buy from her again. Just to reiterate what I have said, my baby is absolutely wonderful and I am so happy that Debbie sold her to me.
One time I was at Petco and had someone stop me to inquire about her and after talking for a while she told me that she had gotten two dogs from Debbie and that like me, she felt they were the best dogs she had ever owned.
I think that it is sad that you received a dog that didn't look the way you wanted but instead of bad mouthing Debbie, you should realize that sometimes just like a child is born not perfect, so is a dog.
I would reccommend Debbie to anyone that asked and when I am ready for another dog, I would definately buy from her again. Just to reiterate what I have said, my baby is absolutely wonderful and I am so happy that Debbie sold her to me.
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What's this? #54 Consumer Suggestion
boycott backyard breeders!
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
Lucille I am not ashamed to say that you deserve the trouble this woman has caused you. I am glad that you are not going to send the dog back to this monster, but you SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER! If you even know the phrase "reputable breeder" you should also know that such a breeder doesn't ship their dogs to people. A good breeder who takes responsibility for the pup's whole lifetime will want to see where that life will be spent. Also, it is your duty to visit the breeder's facilities or home to see the conditions from which your pup will come. You must ensure you aren't supporting a greedy amature like this person.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
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What's this? #55 Consumer Suggestion
boycott backyard breeders!
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
Lucille I am not ashamed to say that you deserve the trouble this woman has caused you. I am glad that you are not going to send the dog back to this monster, but you SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER! If you even know the phrase "reputable breeder" you should also know that such a breeder doesn't ship their dogs to people. A good breeder who takes responsibility for the pup's whole lifetime will want to see where that life will be spent. Also, it is your duty to visit the breeder's facilities or home to see the conditions from which your pup will come. You must ensure you aren't supporting a greedy amature like this person.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
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What's this? #56 Consumer Suggestion
boycott backyard breeders!
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
Lucille I am not ashamed to say that you deserve the trouble this woman has caused you. I am glad that you are not going to send the dog back to this monster, but you SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER! If you even know the phrase "reputable breeder" you should also know that such a breeder doesn't ship their dogs to people. A good breeder who takes responsibility for the pup's whole lifetime will want to see where that life will be spent. Also, it is your duty to visit the breeder's facilities or home to see the conditions from which your pup will come. You must ensure you aren't supporting a greedy amature like this person.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
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What's this? #57 Consumer Suggestion
boycott backyard breeders!
AUTHOR: Alicia - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
Lucille I am not ashamed to say that you deserve the trouble this woman has caused you. I am glad that you are not going to send the dog back to this monster, but you SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER! If you even know the phrase "reputable breeder" you should also know that such a breeder doesn't ship their dogs to people. A good breeder who takes responsibility for the pup's whole lifetime will want to see where that life will be spent. Also, it is your duty to visit the breeder's facilities or home to see the conditions from which your pup will come. You must ensure you aren't supporting a greedy amature like this person.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
AKC registration means nothing, it never does; you have to meet the breeder, meet one of the parents (a breeder who owns both parents should be able to tell you why their dogs are the best two dogs of the breed, otherwise you need to be suspicious of their motives), get references and review the contract and guarantees thoroughly. You could have gone to a shelter and gotten a beautiful dog for much less money, with no surprises and the joy of having saved a life. One quarter of all dogs in shelters are purebred. Also, you can search for breed-specific rescue groups to find your favorite breed. Hopefully next time you'll do that; every time you opt to adopt, you push irresponsible backyard breeders closer to extinction.
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What's this? #58 Consumer Suggestion
All of you morons should be shot for trying to pass off these animals as DOGS.
AUTHOR: Rex - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
Those aren't dogs in those pictures. The only thing I see are two fur-balls that will provide poop on the carpet on a regular basis. Anything that weighs under 40 pounds is not a dog in my book. Y'all have watched "Best of Show" way too many times. Anything that can't chew your arm off is not a dog. God, ya'll are lame! Quit yer whinin'!
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What's this? #59 Consumer Comment
Your pup looks more like a chihuahua mix
AUTHOR: Shannon - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Monday, October 11, 2004
That pup doesn't even look like a poorly bred shit zhu. It looks more like a chihuahua mix. I am sorry you got ripped off but next time maybe you will be wiser.
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What's this? #60 REBUTTAL Owner of company
What more could I do?
AUTHOR: Debbie - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, September 10, 2004
Unfortunately, we are dealing with living beings here, and not something you picked off a shelf at Wal-Mart.
Living things tend to be not so perfect and I have done my level best to see to it that you are pleased and satisfied with your dealings with me.
My terms of sale are clearly stated on my site, and anyone buying from me is expected to honor those terms. You paid for a Shih Tzu, you got one. The AKC has backed me up on this fact.
He is not perfect. But you state clearly in your letter that you love him anyway. I don't really understand what the problem is that you felt you had to resort to defamation of character and mud slinging. I offered to replace him, you refused. You wanted to keep the dog, AND have your money returned? How is that reasonable?
I have done everything in my power to settle this. I was open and honest with you about his appearance before you got him, you choose to take him. Now you want him AND your money.
It is customers like this that make us just want to hold our babies to our hearts and NEVER let them go!! Thankfully there are far more reasonable, and logical people out there that appreciate and love the dogs we have as the treasures and bundles of love they are!
Living things tend to be not so perfect and I have done my level best to see to it that you are pleased and satisfied with your dealings with me.
My terms of sale are clearly stated on my site, and anyone buying from me is expected to honor those terms. You paid for a Shih Tzu, you got one. The AKC has backed me up on this fact.
He is not perfect. But you state clearly in your letter that you love him anyway. I don't really understand what the problem is that you felt you had to resort to defamation of character and mud slinging. I offered to replace him, you refused. You wanted to keep the dog, AND have your money returned? How is that reasonable?
I have done everything in my power to settle this. I was open and honest with you about his appearance before you got him, you choose to take him. Now you want him AND your money.
It is customers like this that make us just want to hold our babies to our hearts and NEVER let them go!! Thankfully there are far more reasonable, and logical people out there that appreciate and love the dogs we have as the treasures and bundles of love they are!
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What's this? #61 Consumer Comment
Deb Rondeau, has done the best she could to appease this woman
AUTHOR: Donna - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Friday, September 10, 2004
To whom it may concern;
It is my strong opnion that this site needs to get the facts from BOTH parties, before such ludricous comments are posted! I would think that before posting such things you would cover your tracks, for fear of a SUIT!
This woman was sent a picture of the pup BEFORE he was sent to her, and was asked if she still wanted him, which she did. I have been a breeder for over 30 yrs, a recessive breeding can cause poor quality coats at times, it happens!
Deb Rondeau offered her another pup, this "Lucille" did not contac Deb Rondeau till 8 MONTHS after the fact!
Regarding her comment as to sending the pup when it was convenient to her, well of COURSE! Do you think we have time to run to the airport every other thing just to accomadate? NOT! We do the best we can to do so, however as it is said, "you can please some of the people some of the time, but not ALL of the people all of the time! I also know this pup was shipped during the winter months. If the temp is too cold or the roads are bad, we do not ship! Does this "lucille" not want what was best for the safety of her puppy?
I know Deb Rondeau well enough to say that she DOES breed quality pups, I have several of hers, and have given us BEAUTIFUL babies!Infact one of the males, is one of my TOP breeders! When you do this as long as we have . occasionally, we get an "odd" ball, happens, get over it!
I feel Deb Rondeau, has done the best she could to appease this woman, but I do know there are some people out there you just cant please, even if you stood on your head and spit wooden nickles!
Getting $$S back isnt an option, says so all over her website, as well as mine, NO CASH REFUNDS! This woman also didnt want to send the pup back, but then of course she waited 8 months before she complained! So doesnt surprise me!
If some of you out there, walked a mile in our shoes, to see what we do EVERY day, you could NOT keep up with us! A lay person has no idea the time and energy we put into this. You may ask yourself why? Because we love the breed, and love what we do. After the many glowing letters we receive from happy owners, something like this is just a "drop in the bucket". People, dont judge a book by its cover! As well as some person doing such a shady thing as posting such awful accusations! Dont you have anything else better to do?
It is my strong opnion that this site needs to get the facts from BOTH parties, before such ludricous comments are posted! I would think that before posting such things you would cover your tracks, for fear of a SUIT!
This woman was sent a picture of the pup BEFORE he was sent to her, and was asked if she still wanted him, which she did. I have been a breeder for over 30 yrs, a recessive breeding can cause poor quality coats at times, it happens!
Deb Rondeau offered her another pup, this "Lucille" did not contac Deb Rondeau till 8 MONTHS after the fact!
Regarding her comment as to sending the pup when it was convenient to her, well of COURSE! Do you think we have time to run to the airport every other thing just to accomadate? NOT! We do the best we can to do so, however as it is said, "you can please some of the people some of the time, but not ALL of the people all of the time! I also know this pup was shipped during the winter months. If the temp is too cold or the roads are bad, we do not ship! Does this "lucille" not want what was best for the safety of her puppy?
I know Deb Rondeau well enough to say that she DOES breed quality pups, I have several of hers, and have given us BEAUTIFUL babies!Infact one of the males, is one of my TOP breeders! When you do this as long as we have . occasionally, we get an "odd" ball, happens, get over it!
I feel Deb Rondeau, has done the best she could to appease this woman, but I do know there are some people out there you just cant please, even if you stood on your head and spit wooden nickles!
Getting $$S back isnt an option, says so all over her website, as well as mine, NO CASH REFUNDS! This woman also didnt want to send the pup back, but then of course she waited 8 months before she complained! So doesnt surprise me!
If some of you out there, walked a mile in our shoes, to see what we do EVERY day, you could NOT keep up with us! A lay person has no idea the time and energy we put into this. You may ask yourself why? Because we love the breed, and love what we do. After the many glowing letters we receive from happy owners, something like this is just a "drop in the bucket". People, dont judge a book by its cover! As well as some person doing such a shady thing as posting such awful accusations! Dont you have anything else better to do?
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What's this? #62 Author of original report
AKC COMMENT RE: FOUR PAWS - NIKKO
AUTHOR: Lucille - (U.S.A.)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, September 07, 2004
After writing to the AKC and sending in Nikko's photo, they had to following to say to me in a letter date 7/22/04: "It was the consensus of the committee that, based on the photographs submitted, your dog appears to be a poor representative of the breed."
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