• Report: #269981

Complaint Review: Liberty League International, LLI

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  • Submitted: Fri, August 24, 2007
  • Updated: Mon, September 28, 2009

  • Reported By:Burns Lake British Columbia
Liberty League International, LLI
14300 N. Northsight Blvd. #210 Scottsdale, Arizona U.S.A.

Liberty League International, LLI - United Kingdom - Beware LLI scam-cancelled $8K conference without refund-found guilty of fraudulent misrepresentation by Arizona Attorney General-its a con Scottsdale Arizona

*Author of original report: Class Action has been filed

*Consumer Comment: Liberty league international

*Consumer Comment: Liberty league international

*Consumer Suggestion: Fixed link.

*Author of original report: Liberty League Arizona - LLI scam - join a class action and sue for fraud

*Consumer Comment: Good luck with your lawsuit/refund.

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I asked Liberty League if they would like to comment on my previous report about Wire Fraud and their scam (con) tactics and explain their behaviour. As they haven't responded I have reported this pyramid business opportunity to BBC Watchdog. If you have bought into this business opportunity in the last few days, you should seriously consider asking for a refund.

If you don't get a refund contact your Trading Standards Office, also file a report to BBC Watchdog.

Some Facts
1.Our LLI advisor urged us to attend the Super Saturday training weekend. This was, in fact, a high pressure sales weekend where we learned that we had to buy the conferences in order to earn commissions on their sales, otherwise that commission would go upline to our advisor. Having already spent considerable sums on advertising and communication systems as advised, we decided we had no choice.

2.We were due to attend a conference (cost $8000) in Oct 2005. LLI cancelled the conference due to expected hurricane. They advised that all major airlines would be refunding flights and LLI would advise of rescheduling early 2006.

3.It was rescheduled to March 2006 we were unable leave our newly developed farm after Feb 2006 so emailed requesting a refund.

4.LLI replied Liberty League does not refund conferences. (What? No insurance?) I replied, asking for an explanation. No reply. I telephoned the Events Dept and was told I could just register for another one.

5.Email and telephone support were appalling. We decided, therefore, to address this matter at the Whistler conference (cost $13000) scheduled for Dec 2005, but were unable to speak with anyone about the refund.

6.At Whistler (Canada) we learned that a delegate we had recruited had cancelled (without refund) and were told that this often happens. How can anyone afford to pay $13000 and not collect.

7.This conference was supposed to teach us how to protect and manage our huge LLI earnings. It was not of merchantable quality. A Canadian asked the first speaker how his information related to Canadians and he replied that he didn't know (this speaker was selling his book at the conference for $30, which contained far more useful information on financial management than we received in total at Whistler). The speakers were interesting and entertaining. However, Canadians were excluded from the specifics. I asked one speaker about our property situation in Canada and he told me I would need to consult a Canadian lawyer.

8.We could have employed our lawyer and accountant on a one-to-one basis for considerably less and learned more. We have since downloaded an ebook for $7 from which we learned significantly more about financial management than through LLI.

9.At the end of the conference the talk amongst many Canadians was that we should consider the moral and legal obligations of continuing to market these conferences. Some said don't let's rock the boat, but have since decided not to continue.

10.We complained to our advisor and LLI, hoping that they would address this issue, especially as LLI was intending to start marketing to the UK, where we have an extensive mailing list and were intending to promote this business opportunity.

After many attempts we eventually received an unsatisfactory response. It was after this that we learned about Wire Fraud and unfortunately too late to join, the class action by the Arizona Attorney General against LLI, ordering refunds to associates for conferences.

11.I have recently asked LLI to refund both conferences. Their reply informs me that their refund policy is for three days after purchase only. This is actually a statutory cooling off period. They tell me now that one deferment is allowed and that they determined the deferment of the $8000 conference by rescheduling it. However, they have offered to allow me a further deferment.

12.Our lawyer is currently filing an action through the courts to ensure we obtain a judgment which is enforceable in Arizona.

This company will offer you an attractive opportunity, woo you with talk about their family and support, about their superior marketing skills, their personal development products. If you start questioning them, you will be accused of various character and personality defects. Remember the storyThe Emperors New Clothes? Liberty League International wants your money, without questions, after which you will be abandoned.

Don't fall for it!

Lynne
Burns Lake, British Columbia
Canada

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 08/24/2007 10:53 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Liberty-League-International-LLI/Scottsdale-Arizona-85260/Liberty-League-International-LLI-United-Kingdom-Beware-LLI-scam-cancelled-8K-confere-269981. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
1Author 5Consumer 0Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Author of original report

Class Action has been filed

AUTHOR: Lynne - (Canada)

The details of the suit filed by the Class Action lawyer I retained can be seen below:


http://www.courthousenews.com/2009/06/16/Liberty_League_Called_a_$5_Million_Scam.htm


http://www.courthousenews.com/2008/07/31/Liberty%20League.pdf


Many thanks to everyone who has contacted me

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#2 Consumer Comment

Liberty league international

AUTHOR: Dave - (U.S.A.)

What i find annoying is the fact that a disgruntled distributor is allowed to write negatives on a site like this, which destroys all the hard work of the distributors in Liberty League who are doing the right thing.

This person had a bad experience with a distributor, does this mean that LLI distributors are all bad, or misleading?

If you get a dodgy real estate agent, does this mean all real estate agents are bad?

Of course not.

THE business is built on integrity, selling Personal development products. This business helps people build a great life, and at the same time if you have desire, make a huge income. But it's a business, not a get rich quick scheme. It's approved by Dun and Bradstreet with AAA credit rating.

It's a business with integrity. Sure some idiots join and do the wrong thing, just like idiots buy a Mcdonalds or Wendy's franchise. Does that mean Ray Crock or the Mcdonalds brothers are bad people, of course not.

cheers
Dave.
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#3 Consumer Comment

Liberty league international

AUTHOR: Dave - (U.S.A.)

What i find annoying is the fact that a disgruntled distributor is allowed to write negatives on a site like this, which destroys all the hard work of the distributors in Liberty League who are doing the right thing.

This person had a bad experience with a distributor, does this mean that LLI distributors are all bad, or misleading?

If you get a dodgy real estate agent, does this mean all real estate agents are bad?

Of course not.

THE business is built on integrity, selling Personal development products. This business helps people build a great life, and at the same time if you have desire, make a huge income. But it's a business, not a get rich quick scheme. It's approved by Dun and Bradstreet with AAA credit rating.

It's a business with integrity. Sure some idiots join and do the wrong thing, just like idiots buy a Mcdonalds or Wendy's franchise. Does that mean Ray Crock or the Mcdonalds brothers are bad people, of course not.

cheers
Dave.
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#4 Consumer Suggestion

Fixed link.

AUTHOR: Dan - (U.S.A.)

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#5 Author of original report

Liberty League Arizona - LLI scam - join a class action and sue for fraud

AUTHOR: Lynne - (Canada)

Many people are asking to join my law suit and make it a class action.

I am consulting with my lawyer today. If you have a legitimate claim of loss and are interested in joining a class action leave me a voice mail and I will contact you when I have information from my lawyer

CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.
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#6 Consumer Comment

Good luck with your lawsuit/refund.

AUTHOR: Dan - (U.S.A.)

I never went past the BF level. I was also strongly encouraged into buying the conference tickets right away on the calls and by my advisor. But I never did because I could not even make a BF sale after months in the business. Let alone the $8,000 and $13,000 conference tickets. I ended up selling the BF course on ebay with no reserve price set after I quit, just to see what people out there felt it was worth to them. It sold for a measly $100 even though it was brand new and complete. To the general public, the BF freedom course ain't worth anywhere close to $1,500 to them. The prices and conferences are just an excuse to pass money around.

The majority of people at these conferences went there not because they wanted to go, or because they could afford to go, or even because they think it's worth the price. They went because of what somebody else told them. They wanted to position themselves to be able to sell the same thing to other people and turn a buck. They came for the money, not the conferences. Because just like you, from the time you join, they literally try to shove the conferences tickets down your throat.

I guarantee a ton of people sitting at those conferences had taken out second mortgages, 401K's, sold off belongings, sold houses, sold cars, borrowed from friends, maxed out credit cards, and what have you. Nervously wondering in the back of their minds if they will be able to come out on top. And wondering what on earth will they do if the can't. Most fail. Many leave in debt. This is what prompted the investigation by the Arizona Attorney General in the first place . All you have to do is look that LLI's income disclosures for 2005 and 2006 that they had to publish as a result of the $115,000 fine. You will see that if over 80% of associates only make an average of about $7,000 a year, for at least the last two years, then most actually leave in debt after you factor in marketing expenses and conferences purchases. This completely validates the Arizona Attorney General's statements on the document itself.


www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf


If it was not for the income opportunity luring folks in, people would not be paying this kind of money for these conferences. I bought BF not because I wanted it, but because I wanted to make $1,000 profits. And even that did not work for me. Most coming in are not looking for personal development products to buy, or conferences have to attend overseas. They responded to an ad to make money bottom line. Not to buy personal development products at $1,500, $8,000 and $13,000 plus international airfare to get there. There is a wealth of personal development material out there at a fraction of the cost and you won't have to fly anywhere to get it. People are attracted to the income that they are told they can make in LLI if you do what they tell you to do. That is the only reason most of them are buying the products at those prices.

LLI's own income disclosure shows that for at least the last two years now, over 80% of all active participants of LLI only make about $7,000 for the entire year. And a very very small top percentage of the entire company is even making a six figure income, or $10,000 per month, yet they account for about half the entire sales in the company. So wit this in mind, most people in LLI are statistically doing far worse than the average single American family income of about $43,200. Go figure.

2005 income disclosure:
http://www.discovervancouver.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=96550


2006 income disclosure:
www.libertyleague.com/compliance/income_disclosure.php


There are some people in the company with some dirty little secrets.

Like Wendy Stevens for example.

She was on stage as a speaker at a Super Saturday I once attended. She got on stage and gave her little story about being a former Vanderbilt Women's Lacrosse team coach. There was absolutely nothing new taught at the Super Saturday that was not already said in the overview and training calls. So i did not understand what all they hype on the calls was all about, urging everyone to make it there anyway they could. It was just a complete reiteration of the training calls with nothing new, except on stage motivation.

What people don't know, and what Wendy Stevens did not tell people, is that Wendy Stevens is actually a convicted criminal. She has an extensive history of credit card theft and fraud.

http://www.tsc.state.tn.us/opinions/tcca/PDF/023/stevensw.pdf
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