• Report: #145303

Complaint Review: Liberty League International

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  • Submitted: Tue, June 07, 2005
  • Updated: Tue, April 19, 2011

  • Reported By:Gilbertsville Pennsylvania
Liberty League International
14300 N. Northsight Blvd, Suite 210 Scottsdale, Arizona United States of America

Liberty League International Scam | Review Complaint INVESTIGATION: Wendy Stevens commitment to total customer satisfaction. RESIGNED FROM LIBERTY LEAGUE, BETTER OPPORTUNITY FOR ASSOCIATES. Wendy Stevens past and current approach to business is focused on providing the highest quality career consulting services to their clients.
*UPDATE: Wendy Stevens pledges her commitment to Rip-off Report Corporate Advocacy, Business Remediation & Customer Satisfaction Program. A program that benefits the consumer, assures them of complete satisfaction and confidence when doing business with a member business. Wendy Stevens is Rip-off Report Verified Safe.

*UPDATE Employee: Attention: Who Else Wants To Finally Get A Candid Opinion??

*Consumer Comment: Complete Garbage, and Many Thanks to Armando in AZ for the url- http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf

*Consumer Suggestion: Caveat Emptor (Let the Buyer Beware)

*UPDATE Employee: Take Some Personal Responsibility

*Consumer Comment: Teresa you talk big, but you're just another LLI statistical failure who never made a dime in LLI.

*UPDATE Employee: WHY BLAME LIBERTY LEAGUE??

*Consumer Comment: LLI Why it is sinking?

*Consumer Comment: Gut feeling from God

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: The income stats for 2006 are worse than 2005.

*UPDATE Employee: Don't do it

*Consumer Comment: Let's be critical thinkers here

*Consumer Comment: Let's be critical thinkers here

*Consumer Comment: Let's be critical thinkers here

*Consumer Comment: Let's be critical thinkers here

*Consumer Suggestion: LLI's real income statistics just don't add up to all the hype. It's hard to argue with the facts.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: LLI rip off scam

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: LLI rip off scam

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: LLI rip off scam

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: LLI rip off scam

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

*Consumer Comment: Great Report! I'm glad I investigated this company!

*Consumer Comment: Great Report! I'm glad I investigated this company!

*Consumer Comment: The same few idiots....

*Consumer Comment: 100 Times: Thank You

*Consumer Comment: John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

*Consumer Comment: John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

*Consumer Comment: John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

*Consumer Comment: John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

*UPDATE Employee: All of the Facts

*UPDATE Employee: All of the Facts

*UPDATE Employee: All of the Facts

*Consumer Comment: Attorney General's Office Terry Goddard Settles with Personal Development Marketing Company

*Consumer Comment: scam

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: Hey LLI, I heard Burger King is Hiring

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

*Consumer Suggestion: Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

*Consumer Suggestion: Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

*Consumer Suggestion: Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

*Consumer Suggestion: Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Time To Move On...

*Consumer Suggestion: I have found Mecca

*Consumer Suggestion: Yeah, Well ...

*Consumer Comment: Cult,Scheme, Scam, Pyramid????

*Consumer Suggestion: Use a credit card...I got my Money back!!!

*Consumer Comment: Seen people like these before...

*Consumer Comment: Seen people like these before...

*Consumer Comment: Seen people like these before...

*Consumer Suggestion: lin - what other companies???

*Consumer Suggestion: Simply amazing

*Consumer Comment: What are these others businesses you all have found?

*Consumer Comment: I'm Lucky, I only lost the Beyound Freedom level.

*Consumer Comment: Liberty League is now a grey area for me

*Consumer Comment: Email from Ex- Liberty leaguer

*Consumer Comment: Product information is well-hidden, but it's there.

*Consumer Comment: No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

*Consumer Comment: No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

*Consumer Comment: No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

*Consumer Comment: Do you guys have eyes?

*Consumer Comment: Liberty League's mystery business

*Consumer Comment: What they sell is clearly presented....

*Consumer Suggestion: I STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT HEY SELL !!!

*Consumer Comment: Comments from an Outsider

*Consumer Comment: Classic MLM Scam

*Consumer Comment: Classic MLM Scam

*Consumer Comment: Classic MLM Scam

*Consumer Comment: Liberty League More Than You Think

*Consumer Comment: You Say You Tried?

*UPDATE Employee: Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

*UPDATE Employee: Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

*UPDATE Employee: Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

*UPDATE Employee: Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

*Consumer Comment: First in Miami doesn't know what a pyramid is...

*Consumer Comment: Matt & Gabriel the entire thing is a pyramid scam

*UPDATE Employee: Oh Matt, Matt I can see tension in your last posting

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Liberty League Follow-Up

*UPDATE Employee: Lets clean this up

*UPDATE Employee: Lets clean this up

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Liberty League Follow-Up Rebuttal

*UPDATE Employee: Liberty League International. The Perspective You should have

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SPECIAL UPDATE: April 19 2011: Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International remains committed to increased customer satisfaction and has improved their business practices over the years to better serve their customers. Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International is truly dedicated to making sure their customers are satisfied and that any complaints which do arise are addressed promptly and fairly.

To date, Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International has made good faith efforts to resolve all complaints reported on Rip-off Report. Based on our experience, the member business has proven to be among the top members of the Rip-off Report Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation and Customer Satisfaction Program as a Verified Safe Business.

Over time and since becoming a member, Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International has remained actively engaged and improving the way they address customer service complaints. As an active and current member of the Rip-off Report Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation and Customer Satisfaction Program we are happy to report that now more than ever Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International remains committed to improving customer satisfaction.

Remember, no company or individual can ever satisfy 100% of the people 100% of the time. There are no products or services that will always be perfect for everyone and even the best companies will receive complaints from time to time. However, by participating in the Corporate Advocacy Program, the member business has made a commitment to working with its customers to resolve complaints quickly and fairly whenever possible.

Please keep in mind that as a consumer you have some responsibilities as well. Success has many definitions that based on your past experiences, current situation and your perceived expectations. Success with any product or service is always based on the proper application and understanding. The fastest car will not run if you never turn the engine on. Look at how you used the product or service that was provided in relation with the instructions that you received. The Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation and Customer Satisfaction Program will help you get your voice heard but please be prepared with documentation and fair representation of your concern, also have an idea of how the company can fix your concern. Can they offer additional services, extend warranties, offer a fair refund or just get you talking with someone that can help. ..let them know and let us know!

*Any consumer not receiving satisfaction from a member of the Corporate Advocacy Program should email us at editor@ripoffreport.com
 Wendy Stevens - Liberty League International is Rip-off Report Verified

Rip-off Report Investigation:

Editors UPDATE: Positive Rating and Recognition has been given to Wendy Stevens for its Commitment to Excellence in customer service.

Rip-off Reports investigation of Wendy Stevens uncovers an ongoing commitment to total client satisfaction. This means that clients can expect that Wendy will always work towards finding a mutually satisfactory resolution to any complaints or concerns. Wendy listens carefully to client concerns and sees them as an opportunity to learn from past mistakes and become more efficient as a company in the services she offers and the support for those services.

One top executives in the internet marketing industry stated to Rip-off Report, that Wendy Stevens personal philosophy is that her clients are a precious resource. We must listen to our clients and respond properly. This is the best way to ensure I will maintain a successful enterprise both now and in many years to come.

Another top executive of the company stated to Rip-off Report, that Wendy Stevens personal business philosophy is based on the premise that Wendy Stevens strives to add value in its services as they understand that a successful business model is based on value-added services, and client care. Wendy Stevens mission statement says it all; "Our goal is to provide our clients the best quality, value and professional excellence in the industry." Some of the other things Rip Off Report learned in the course of its investigation: Wendy Stevens business was established in 2004 to provide professionals and entrepreneurs elite marketing training. Wendy has trained thousands of individuals in that time with a handful of personal coaching clients and is recognized as a leading expert and premier trainer in the internet marketing world.

Rip-off Report has confirmed that Wendy Stevens takes quality control very seriously. Wendy has recently put a lot of effort into ramping up her support team and client relation processes including full time availability to clients to assist with any issues that develop. Rip-off Report was pleased to learn that Wendys past and current approach to business is focused on its pledge to total commitment towards client satisfaction.

WENDY STEVENS RESIGNED FROM LIBERTY LEAGUE, BETTER OPPORTUNITY, MORE BENEFICIAL TO CLIENTS, AND FOR HER ASSOCIATES WENDY HAD NO CONTROL OVER THE WAY BUSINESS WAS RUN, MAKING IT BAD FOR EVERYONE For over six years individuals have enjoyed Wendy Stevens engaging training style and have been attracted to her genuine caring for each individual she works with one on one. Wendy''s unique philosophy of giving back to others through sharing her success in internet marketing earned her a stellar reputation in the industry at large. Rip-off Report received complaints from individuals claiming to be her Liberty League associates prior to Jan 2009. In several cases the individuals did not even appear on Wendy Stevens'' official sales register nor did their IP addresses match the reports submitted--in other words, their stories were made up. Rip-off Report has investigated each Wendy''s reports and also found that some complaints were related to customer service issues which Wendy did not directly control.

Wendy Stevens began her career as internet entrepreneur with Liberty League, but the company made a series of fateful decisions that resulted in it going out of business in mid-2009. Rip-Off Report discovered that Wendy Stevens had no ownership in Liberty League. Although Wendy trained for that company she did not control staffing decisions, product quality, customer service policies, refund policies, nor any other control mechanism to ensure customer service for her associates. It was a very frustrating situation for her personally.

When the leaders of Liberty League launched a new business venture in late 2009, Wendy had grave doubts about its viability but did everything she could to help it succeed out loyalty both to the owners and her associates. When it became clear to Wendy that this new venture would not in fact succeed, and that her associates had been left without a way to make a living, Wendy Stevens resigned from the business to find another, better opportunity, for her associates. In doing so, Wendy Stevens walked away from the majority of her income. How many entrepreneurs have that kind of integrity and dedication to their team? Wendy did succeed in finding a great new opportunity for her team with LifePath, where she is helping people set records again in internet marketing. She hired a full customer service and customer resolutions team to ensure that her associates were being treated as VIPs.

Wendy Stevens recognizes that complaints posted on Rip-off Report (true or not) are issues that need to be addressed and if handled correctly can be valuable learning opportunities. With the feedback generated by Rip-off Reports Investigation Wendy Stevens has made organizational changes allowing her clients a more streamlined approach to problem resolution and a total overall commitment to her client experience.

In summary, after our investigation, which included discussions with Wendy Stevens and many of her past and current associates, Rip-off Report is convinced that Wendy Stevens has been and is committed to quality delivery of services resulting in total client satisfaction.

Read more about Wendy Stevens Commitment to Excellence and Total Consumer Satisfaction and why consumers should feel safe, confident and secure when doing business with a member of Rip-off Report''s Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation & Customer Satisfaction Program. ..yes, a long name for a program that does a lot for both consumers and businesses alike.

Read about Rip-off Report Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation & Customer Satisfaction Program,..A program that benefits the consumer, assures them of complete satisfaction and confidence when doing business with a member business. this program works.

===================== NOW TO THE ORIGINAL REPORT THAT WAS FILED

=====================

Liberty League International More focused on recruiting than an actual product Scottsdale Arizona

 

I am amused at all the Liberty Leaguers who have chimed in to endorse their "opportunity". I poured my heart and soul into this business for over 6 months FULL time every day, 7 days a week with ZERO results. My only real result is that I am now in debt over $12,000 and the company refuses to refund even a portion of the money I lost back to me. I chuckle to myself when I read all the posts about "lack of commitment", or "expecting a free ride", or lazy work ethics. Baloney! I spoke with over 100 people every week, week after week for 6 months and only had 3 people semi-interested!! (I guess I wasn't exhibiting good posture!) It was literally like trying to sell the Brooklyn Bridge when pitching their "Beyond Freedom" course for $1520! The sad part is, many of these folks (prospects)are struggling just to put food on the table, yet alone buy into this! And yes, they GREATLY pressure you to buy into the next higher levels (Liberty and Summit) in order to "position" yourself to make better money. The Liberty is $7995, and the Summit is over $12,000!


They neglect to tell you that in order to run this business, you need to spend $39.95 a month on the LLI personal website, $19.95 a month for an 800 number, $99 quarterly to have access to their PROLINK conference system, and ATLEAST $200 a month on leads from their self-owned lead company, Extreme Leads. Generating your own leads thru web advertising can even be costlier!!

Lastly, the main thing I found running rampant within the organization was the "fake it til you make it" mentality. I was encouraged to tell people of my mulitple six-figure income I was generating, when I hadn't made a single red cent! Where is the integrity and honesty in that? I never spoke with a Liberty Leaguer (and I've talked to many) who wasn't earning $20-40K every month......sounded a bit too good to be true, and unfortunately I've learned why the HARD way. A class-action lawsuit is in the works against LLI-.

Matt Gilbertsville, Pennsylvania
U.S.A.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 06/07/2005 06:34 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Liberty-League-International/Scottsdale-Arizona-85260/Liberty-League-International-Scam-Review-Complaint-INVESTIGATION-Wendy-Stevens-commitme-145303. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 81Consumer 1Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 UPDATE Employee

Attention: Who Else Wants To Finally Get A Candid Opinion??

AUTHOR: Nick - (U.S.A.)

I will try to be quick here because I already recognized that it is not worth it for me spending much time in this forum. (sorry for any typos. I am typing fast :)

Before I start, a little on my background. I have three university degrees and was recognized several times for my accomplishments in studies of business, journalism, and outside of school. I later spent time as a Manager of Marketing in Corporate America. I have my own share of experience in MLM as well, etc.

Recently, about 4 months ago, I joined LLI. The first thing that I did before I joined was thorough research for 2 months. No hype or internet opinions, just good research the way I know how to do it and do it well. at the end of that research I decided in a very relaxed and worry free way to Join LLI.

Best decision! Here is why:

I was able to quit my job in the first month in the business. When I started creating my own rules, and didn't focus on the income producing activities, but instead on "learning about the internet" etc. I didn't do well. When I started to follow the directions from the training, I did very well. Simple as that.

LLI is stronger than ever by the way. It doesn't take someone who has been here for 5 yrs to notice this.

I also realized that in my experience over 95% of the people who have something critical to write on LLI are former LLI who either were kicked out of the company for integrity issues or were too busy "trying to work", but not actually working and following directions. Folks this is a business. In a business you invest time, money, effort, energy, anything to achieve success.

That is what separates an entrepreneur from an employee. If so many people are achieving great results in LLI, then why didn't it work someone else? Simple question?

Is it because a select group of good-looking people only have the secret to success in LLI and the rest are left behind? LOL

It is pretty logical, isn't it?

If one is looking for a job, jobs are free. No shame in having a job. But if one is looking for a business, then that takes a Totally different Mindset. One can not succeed in business with the mindset of an employee.

Every company has a certain way that they pay their independent business owners, just like a regular company has millions of ways how they make money and how they pay their employees. We check out the compensation plan, and we either like it and join and get the training to become successful, or we don't join and move into something else. Simple

There is no selling here or convincing about purchasing anything here. If someone was a little pushy, that is that one person, not everyone here.

It either makes business sense to purchase the products or not. That's it. No one took me by the hand to the bank and made to to pay for any products. It made sense to me, got in the car, went to the bank and paid my adviser. The same way I got paid as an adviser, and the same way the people are brought into the team are getting paid as well.

Some folks here have the least idea of what it takes to become a business owner. They are just buying hope and just put their toes in the water to see if this works. It is like a guy going to the gym, saying "hey I will eat some chips here, see what you guys are doing, and when I get in shape, I will start working out."

Folks, over 90% of traditional business fail within 3 years. In Direct Sales the chances for success are much much much higher, but that doesn't mean that LLI or the adviser will guarantee your success. I am also a certified personal trainer but I couldn't guarantee success to my clients. Just like I can't lift weights for someone to get in shape, so advisers can not do the job for someone else. They can only TRAIN you.

Look at how many complaints are against Microsoft, Wal-Mart, McDonalds, etc. THOUSANDS! There are complaints against any company. It is the right of the consumer to file complaints. That doesn't make the business wrong. Hey, if I go to Target and buy a pair of gum and then get a stomach ache, I could file a complaint. but that doesn't mean that it was Target's fault. maybe the gum wasn't the reason for the stomach ache! I hope you get my point here.

Out of Thousands of professional and honest distributors that LLI has, if only few are critical, then we are doing extremely well and it speaks for the quality of the products, the training and the integrity that all the business owners here are committed to.

I urge everyone to take personal responsibility and stop pointing fingers. How about we all start pointing fingers to the person in the mirror.

The world needs leaders, doesn't need whiners.

I sincerely wish the best to all of you, no matter if you join LLI or not.
Make an educated decision!

God Bless!
Nick S.
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#2 Consumer Comment

Complete Garbage, and Many Thanks to Armando in AZ for the url- http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf

AUTHOR: Rhonda - (U.S.A.)

Thank you too Matt for the heads up on this pathetic, poor excuse of a "company". Too bad you had to lose all that money. I wanted to find out more information about them, and the info on this site is all I needed to see.


Special thanks again to Armando in AZ for posting that link (http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf) for the world to see how full of ____ this "business" really is.


...and for the dense, brainwashed idiots who keep defending the LL-osers, who most likely kicked out the money for the crap they offer, the court case outcome at http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf speaks for itself. Keep up the bad work, and have fun making back the thousands you've already lost.


LOLOL!
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#3 Consumer Suggestion

Caveat Emptor (Let the Buyer Beware)

AUTHOR: Jan - (U.S.A.)

Today, April 5, 2007, I too was preyed upon by an Advisor from North Carolina. She found me from my response to slick packaged web-site that advertises legit "Work From Home Opportunities".

I was told that the company was comprised of professionals who would be helping clients with their personal development strategies. A tele conference was set up for me to participate where I would be listening in on a guest presentation. I found it interesting that it wasn't a toll free number, but it would be at the expense of my own dollar(s).

Anyway, I am grateful for this website and all the honest people out there. Tom - you are priceless in your commentaries. You are also wise in suggesting that us lookie-loo's go to E-bay (The Direct Sales Graveyard) and find LLI's first, albeit cheapest product hawked to the highest bidder. Sure enough, "The Beyond Freedom Course" is being offered for $34.00 and there are 6 bidders!!!

Legit opportunties don't use the devil's tools of speed, greed and confusion. All elements you see with this company.

Lastly, if you want a good read try "A Purpose Driven Life" for there you will find what life is suppose to be like and what we all were made for.

Success is really preparation meeting opportunity and this is no opportunity people!

For all the entrepreneau's out there, by a Entreprenau Magazine to ferret out legit opportunities; trade shows; and cost vs bogus pipe dreams that are designed to fleece the masses.

Remember the adage - Pigs get fat, but hogs get
butchered!

Go in Peace!
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#4 UPDATE Employee

Take Some Personal Responsibility

AUTHOR: Paul - (U.S.A.)

First of all let's clear the air on what a pyramid scheme is:

pyramid scheme - n. A fraudulent moneymaking scheme in which people are recruited to make payments to others above them in a hierarchy while expecting to receive payments from people recruited below them. Eventually the number of new recruits fails to sustain the payment structure, and the scheme collapses with most people losing the money they paid in.


Liberty League states in the presentation call as well as on the website that no income is earned solely for recruiting people into the program. There are tangible products involved, and you earn money off of product sales.

So that takes care of that fallacy.

Matt - it is a shame you did not make any money with LLI. Let me ask you this though - what kind of person were you being on the phone? Did you do what is taught to do? Were you pitching a product and opportunity you believe in or were you trying to earn a quick buck? Were you sincerely trying to assist people based on what they wanted, or were you booking everybody and anybody to the presentation calls? Did you even open Beyond Freedom? Because if you did, you would not have put quotes around it to imply a negative connotation. And I have not once, heard from anyone, ever, to lie and tell people you are making money when you are not and I hardly ever miss a training call. If you were told this, then you had a poor mentor but it was still your choice to say it or not.

For anyone else - It does not surprise me that you are unwilling to take personal responsibility for the results you experience in your lives. All too often we are quick to pass the buck or place blame on others when all we need to do is take a look in the mirror. You see it everyday, everywhere you look -

In the corporate work environment where everybody is all too quick to point fingers or place blame elsewhere when something goes wrong for fear of losing their jobs.

In our personal lives, where divorce is at an all time high. It is too easy just to blame the other person and walk away.

In our communities, where we are always asking our politicians how they are going to make our lives better.

How about asking what can I do to make my work environment better? Or what can I do to make my marriage work? Or what can I do to make my community a better place to live?

It really is a shame how we are always expecting others to make things right or better.

What Teresa says is absolutely true and it matters not whether she made money or lost money. The opportunity to create wealth with LLI is absolutely available to anyone - the only question is what price are you willing to pay to achieve the desired results. Understand that by price, I am not necessarily referring to the actual dollar amount but rather how much a person is willing to change. To what lengths are you willing to go to achieve the results?

The difference between the people who ARE making money in LLI and the people who ARE NOT making money in LLI has nothing to do pyramid schemes, false advertising, etc. - it simply means that they were willing to take personal responsibility for their results. The opportunity is EXACTLY the same for each person who gets involved.

Sure, there is a group of people at the top who are earning the lion's share of the profits but I would like someone to explain to me how that is different from the corporate world. Take a look at any corporation out there, and the people at the top are earning 95% of the total payroll. The CEOs make the most money, and then as you go further and further down the chain, the less people are earning. With LLI, you come in and have the opportunity to make as much as you want. So you tell me which is the pyramid scheme.

Unfortunately, we are taught to go to college, get good grades, and go work for someone for the rest of your life. Sure you are getting paid for your work, but someone else is in control. You are told what to do, how to do it, when it needs to be done by and then you are paid for it. As a business owner, you are in control of your results - period.

Some of the top earners in LLI started by placing hundreds of flyers on cars in mall parking lots. How many of you are willing to do that?

There are successful people in LLI who spent hours posting ads on the hundreds of free classifieds websites available over and over. How many of you are willing to do that?

And how many of you are willing to take a deep look inside yourselves and admit that there are areas of your life where you need to improve - to be a better husband, a better father, a better business mentor, etc. - and then take action to make those changes? Unfortunately, the answer is not too many. The people who are willing to do these things are the people who are successful not only in LLI, but anywhere and everwhere you look and in business as well as their personal lives.

I feel truly blessed and grateful that I found LLI and the Beyond Freedom product. The community and the products have literally transformed my life. But they have done so because I was willing to allow that transformation to take place. Too many people get involved, don't have microwave results and then cry wolf like they were scammed.

The only scam here people, is the one you are creating for yourselves by pulling the sheets over your heads.

My hope is that someone reads this and realizes that their dreams are absolutely achievable, IF THEY ARE WILLING TO ACHIEVE THEIR DREAMS - regardless of whether it is with LLI or not.
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#5 Consumer Comment

Teresa you talk big, but you're just another LLI statistical failure who never made a dime in LLI.

AUTHOR: Steve - (U.S.A.)

Teresa you sure talk big, but at the end of the day you're just another one of the many LLI statistical failures who made no money there (see 2005-2006 LLI income stats above). In fact, you lost money when all was said and done and you know this.

Why would anyone want to take advice from someone like you Teresa who's a self admitted miserable failure that "didn't make any money either.?" You've proven yourself a lousy business person. If you made no money, everything else you say doesn't matter. Stop trying to appear like you have business sense. Since you said this: "I didn't make any money either." it means not only did you NOT make any money, but since you bought BF and operated the business you actually LOST money. You ended up in the hole. Even more so if you bought a conference ticket (which you never mentioned).

You said this:

"If you really work the BF workbook things will change.. Will it give you marketing ability and advertising sense? NO! YOU HAVE TO LEARN THAT!

Things will change how? Learn that from where? The company training that has produced the above income statistics? Again you yourself made NO money there. You have nothing to stand on as well as the vast majority of associates and/or advisors within LLI. This would be easier to believe had YOU yourself actually made any money or even a profit with what you preach.

The classic LLI pattern of failure is something like this. People get started with high hopes, listen to the company training, and begin to do everything they are told as far as marketing/advertising. The vast majority or people joining LLI are already broke, living paycheck to paycheck, in debt, or have little money to begin with. That's why they responded to the ad in the first place right? After a few weeks or months of throwing money on advertising methods taught in the calls or buying leads that don't but products or join, little or no sales come in. They are spending money and not making any in return, or are spending money at a much higher rate then they are making it. Sooner or later these two paths must cross and a business needs to be making MORE money then they are spending. At this point though, people in LLI simply stop taking their advisor's calls or emails and just dissappear not financially able or willing to go any further. They stop attending the company and team training calls. Then they cancel their 800 numbers ect.

Teresa you also said this:

"The question is WHY THEM AND NOT YOU OR I? The same could be asked of any successful company.. Because, that is what a HOME BUSINESS IS- Your own company!So, I sit here and read these complaints against LLI and I ask myself- HOW can I succeed or HOW are "they" succeeding"

Again, you talk big. It would be easier to believe you had you Teresa actually made "ANY" money at all in LLI. By your results in LLI, or lack there of, it's clear you have not answered your own question. You made no money there. You lost money in fact. Bottom line, you're a failure Patricia.
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#6 UPDATE Employee

WHY BLAME LIBERTY LEAGUE??

AUTHOR: Teresa - (U.S.A.)

~A CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT!!!Are you kidding me????
I see these complaints. To me it is rediculous. LLI states right on the website- the actual cost of everything- all those things you itemized!THEY DO NOT SAY YOU HAVE TO HAVE IT! It is a suggested start up!On the conference calls they tell you that as well. Plus, it could cost more or less- it is all up to you what you spend!You do not even have to purchase the Beyond Freedom Package to participate, nor the additional items.. THAT WAS YOUR CHOICE!!!

It is a business. Did you NOT do your research? Did you not make a business plan?

With this and companies like this it is the attitude, marketing ability and advertising ability that will bring success. I never once was told to LIE!If you did lie.. that too was your choice!

I didn't make any money either. But, I do NOT blame LLI. If you started a franchise, would they give you your money back if YOU failed?
It is YOUR business. LLI just provides the product and the benefits of some marketing materials and sales aides. Your in charge of your own company!WHY BLAME LIBERTY LEAGUE?
If an Advisor told you to lie or gave you misinformation-BLAME THEM-and inform the company!even though I still feel it was up to you to do your own research!!)Blame the individual owners that are "advisors" with LLI-MAYBE!)But, NOT LIBERTY LEAGUE!

Do you think the people who are succeeding are faking it?Do you think the money isn't real?? They have to make SALES just like any one else! The question is WHY THEM AND NOT YOU OR I? The same could be asked of any sucessful company.. Because, that is what a HOME BUSINESS IS- Your own company!So, I sit here and read these complaints against LLI and I ask myself- HOW can I succeed or HOW are "they" succeeding.

I will say this... Brent and Shane aren't JERKS and they started LLI as soemthing good to create something good... NOT only for themselves but, for others.. and they have! THE SUCCESS STORIES are REAL.The changes in peoples lives are real... If you really work the BF workbook things will change.. Will it give you marketing ability and advertising sense? NO! YOU HAVE TO LEARN THAT!

My whole point is.. if your going to report a company make it because of somthing the COMPANY actually did! Did you pay for product and they didn't give it to you? WHY WOULD YOU DESERVE MONEY BACK FOR MONEY YOU LOST??? You lost it!
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#7 Consumer Comment

LLI Why it is sinking?

AUTHOR: Jon - (Canada)

Why are all the top guys leaving this company? These are the people having the most success right? So if the top income earners are leaving what does that leave? The ones who haven;t made it and now have no guidance on how to make it. This company is in the water. It will soon sink. The company people all are going to is the one being honest, and ACTULLY helping people. They have products not getaways. Vacation time. Seems to be an on going trend in LLI. I would go find the other company.
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#8 Consumer Comment

Gut feeling from God

AUTHOR: Nick - (U.S.A.)



Hello,

Growing up as a Roman Catholic, now 27 years old, I consider myself a normal functioning Christian adult in the new millennium. I have a strong love for technology, and unfortunately earned the wrong degree in college, which was a B.A. in Psychology. With my strong Catholic Christian beliefs, i found many conflicting ideologies and theories when i studied psychology, especially when it came to Freud. In the end, the overall subject of Psychology is sound and true, and I give thanks to all the Doctors, Researchers and Counselors who put their life into their profession, and I thank especially all the priests who have laid down their life to serve others.

Without all of the influential people throughout my life, i don't think I would be here right now. There is one thing I remember in my undergrad that helps me, along with the holy spirit, and that is "psychological toughness". I learned that some people just don't have it, and they end up bums, settling for minimum wage jobs, or landing themselves in jail because they don't think twice before about the consequence, etc... These are few examples of either you have it or you don't.

Psychologists have found that over 70% of individuals in the world suffer from a mental illness, ranging from minor illness to severe types such as: Sexual Addiction Disorder to Major/Manic Depressive Disorder. Out of the millions of people who suffer from these disorders, less than 50% of them realize they suffer from a mental disorder, and less than 10% are compliant once undergoing treatment. THIS IS A SCARY STATISTIC. LOOK AT ALL THE STATES THAT ALLOW CONCEALED WEAPONS, AND THINK OF ALL THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE HAND GUNS THAT SHOUDLDN'T! Personally, I am a gun collector and hunter, but I do know for a fact that our laws miss many people and issue them permits to buy firearms when in fact they shouldn't. Moving on...

I graduated December 2005 and landed a great high-tech sales job out of college, at least I thought it would until I had to leave because of lack of growth potential in the region I resided.
So, I still work a part time job as a chauffer but still need to get on my feet and find a job I love paying at least 80K. I know what I love, and that is people and technology, so monster.com was an obvious tool in finding a new career, but when i came across LLI, literally less than 2 hours ago, I thought it sounded different. So I called it and gave them my name and number. This guy called me back less than an hour, and after talking with him, I immediately asked him the name of the company and started doing research. The first place i always look is the better business burrow. Then I looked up LLI's website. The guy on the phone wanted me to do a phone conference, but I just listened and watched the videos on the website, and those gave me a good enough idea about the company. I immediately had thoughts in my head that LLI had some very obvious characteristics of a cult.

I just want to clarify those of you who have worked for LLI that I totally am for your resignation and pray that God serves justice to those who have temporarily ruined your lives. I believe that the only person that can help yourself is God and yourself. You don't need to spend thousands of dollars to become happy, unless you have sever depression, the office visits to your psychologist may add up to thousands over time.

So, for those ignorant people out there, stay away from LLI, for my gut tells me everything, especially after all the research i did on the company. NOT GOOD. STAY AWAY. Lastly, this is the first time I have done anything like this, (Posting a thread online) and I only do, because I think the two CEO's are taking advantage of people and they aren't even Doctors in any medical field!! RIPOFF INDEED!!

Frank
St. Louis
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#9 UPDATE EX-employee responds

The income stats for 2006 are worse than 2005.

AUTHOR: Steve - (U.S.A.)

LLI has just recently published the new LLI income stats for 2006. I don't post any hype of BS I just post the facts.

In 2006, 85% of the entire company only earned $7,131 for the whole year on average.

In 2005 this figure was 80% earning an average of $7,149.

So the very bottom bracket of earners making the least amount of money is up 5%.

Also, in 2005 only the very top 5% of the entire company made anything more that $150,000 for the whole year. That's only about $12,500 a month. This same group accounted for almost half (48%) of the entire sales made company wide in 2005.

In 2006 this figure dropped by almost half. It's now only the top 3% of the entire company making anything over $150,000 for the year, and accounting for only 32% of all sales. Down from 48% the year before. That's a big drop.

Why? Because people are quitting LLI by the bunches, including many top income earners and record holders. These top income earners have also taken their entire teams with them out of LLI and gone elsewhere. So the amount of people quitting and leaving LLI is a lot more than people know.

Just some of the top earners to have recently quit LLI:

Jay Kubassek
Mike Dillard
Lehman Hailey
Aaron Parkinson
Ashton Howell
Alan Nettles
Kristy Davis
Harold Roscoe
Greg Six
Mike Leroux

Remember, these people took their entire teams out of LLI with them.

Oh and by the way, just look at what these former top LLI income earners are using for their new high ranking Google ads for their new company.

"LLI income record holder shares inside knowledge and why he left", "See Where Me and My Team Went and Why You Should Avoid Their 2 up", "find out why most top earners have recently left and where they went", "Discover the Company that Liberty League doesn't want you to know about"

Just go do a Google search on "Liberty League International" and see for yourself.

LLI is a sinking ship. Don't bee fooled by the photos of huge mansion, private jets, or multi-million dollar yachts you see on many of their marketing websites. They don't own any of that stuff.
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#10 UPDATE Employee

Don't do it

AUTHOR: Kurt - (U.S.A.)

LLI is an evil entity. I worked "hard" with the company for 16 months and created close to $30k in debt. I am filing bankruptcy, almost lost my fiance and am basically sick to my stomach thinking about how I was sucked in to their humanistic way of thought...it almost cost me my salvation as far as I'm concerned. It is a very worldly, very "all you", very - listen or leave us, very "we always know best", very slimy to be quite honest. Take my word - there is a select group making money there....Brothers in law of the cofounder, non-feeling ex-car salesmen, and ruthless and uncaring ex-NCAA coaches. After that, the list is even shorter. I was recruited by a punk named Jay Kubassek. He made close to a million dollars with them. They threwe him out...
Please! Do not give them the time of day!
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#11 Consumer Comment

Let's be critical thinkers here

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

Think critically, without the hype from those who have a "funny feeling", and you can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

LLI is going to make money regardless of your efforts. In their video, they talk about how corporate America doesn't care about you, and you're making money for someone else. They say that they *DO* care about you, that you are the one making money, and that this is a business with as much risk as any business. It's a world of caring and sharing that is most likely a proposal of their personal development course.

First, understand that even though you are running your own business, you are a satellite office for LLI Central. This is not your product, you are not selling it, and you are not even allowed to explain it. You are a lead generation conduit, which is much like "muscle". Remember muscle? Those hairy guys with the gold chains who would get the money out of the stiff for the mob? These guys were finding people to influence, weak-minded saps. Then they would extort money from them by threatening all sorts of bad things that may or may not happen to them. You, LLI "business owners", are the muscle for this organization.

This is a legitimate business. Don't believe all these people who talk about having an MBA and finding salvation in LLI, however. I am just finishing up a Bachelors in Business Administration and I can see the real fallout here: information management. If you are a legitimate business offering to let people in on a secret that will make you thousands of dollars a month, any professional will ask for market research. Any proposal for a business venture I have ever been approached with has been met (through me) by these questions:

1. Who is your target market?
2. What percent buys your product?
3. Why do they buy your product?
4. What is the basis of this demand?

This is simple supply and demand; you learn about this in your sophomore year of business school.

LLI has a grey market made up of people that are influenced by others promising better than what those people have now. They are vulnerable: maybe they've had a spouse die, are disabled, have been shunned by society or family... somehow, they are open to the idea that there's something better. Who knows how many of these mindless sheep actually buy this crap. And why do they buy it? Because they are vulnerable. The demand for this product, and all personal development plans, is made by insecure, bendable Americans who don't believe there is anything better than what they have. These are the same people who killed for Manson and committed mass suicide for the leaders of Heaven's Gate.

Do you know why the beauty industry is booming? Why they rake in billions a year on stuff that eventually turns your face into glued-on corn flakes? It's because people have a very bad self worth. They need therapy. They need to be fixed. If you fixed every person in the world with therapy, the "personal image" industry would collapse. Personal image, personal development... it's the same thing. You're putting on makeup that you think is going to make you feel better about yourself, when what you really need is to GET OVER YOURSELF.

From someone who will be working hard everyday of his life and knowing why he is doing it, please please PLEASE don't buy into the LLIs of the world. Do your research, go to school, get an education, make a difference and instill in your children that hard work through your own devices will be the greatest reward you can ever ask for.

Good luck in the future.
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#12 Consumer Comment

Let's be critical thinkers here

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

Think critically, without the hype from those who have a "funny feeling", and you can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

LLI is going to make money regardless of your efforts. In their video, they talk about how corporate America doesn't care about you, and you're making money for someone else. They say that they *DO* care about you, that you are the one making money, and that this is a business with as much risk as any business. It's a world of caring and sharing that is most likely a proposal of their personal development course.

First, understand that even though you are running your own business, you are a satellite office for LLI Central. This is not your product, you are not selling it, and you are not even allowed to explain it. You are a lead generation conduit, which is much like "muscle". Remember muscle? Those hairy guys with the gold chains who would get the money out of the stiff for the mob? These guys were finding people to influence, weak-minded saps. Then they would extort money from them by threatening all sorts of bad things that may or may not happen to them. You, LLI "business owners", are the muscle for this organization.

This is a legitimate business. Don't believe all these people who talk about having an MBA and finding salvation in LLI, however. I am just finishing up a Bachelors in Business Administration and I can see the real fallout here: information management. If you are a legitimate business offering to let people in on a secret that will make you thousands of dollars a month, any professional will ask for market research. Any proposal for a business venture I have ever been approached with has been met (through me) by these questions:

1. Who is your target market?
2. What percent buys your product?
3. Why do they buy your product?
4. What is the basis of this demand?

This is simple supply and demand; you learn about this in your sophomore year of business school.

LLI has a grey market made up of people that are influenced by others promising better than what those people have now. They are vulnerable: maybe they've had a spouse die, are disabled, have been shunned by society or family... somehow, they are open to the idea that there's something better. Who knows how many of these mindless sheep actually buy this crap. And why do they buy it? Because they are vulnerable. The demand for this product, and all personal development plans, is made by insecure, bendable Americans who don't believe there is anything better than what they have. These are the same people who killed for Manson and committed mass suicide for the leaders of Heaven's Gate.

Do you know why the beauty industry is booming? Why they rake in billions a year on stuff that eventually turns your face into glued-on corn flakes? It's because people have a very bad self worth. They need therapy. They need to be fixed. If you fixed every person in the world with therapy, the "personal image" industry would collapse. Personal image, personal development... it's the same thing. You're putting on makeup that you think is going to make you feel better about yourself, when what you really need is to GET OVER YOURSELF.

From someone who will be working hard everyday of his life and knowing why he is doing it, please please PLEASE don't buy into the LLIs of the world. Do your research, go to school, get an education, make a difference and instill in your children that hard work through your own devices will be the greatest reward you can ever ask for.

Good luck in the future.
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#13 Consumer Comment

Let's be critical thinkers here

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

Think critically, without the hype from those who have a "funny feeling", and you can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

LLI is going to make money regardless of your efforts. In their video, they talk about how corporate America doesn't care about you, and you're making money for someone else. They say that they *DO* care about you, that you are the one making money, and that this is a business with as much risk as any business. It's a world of caring and sharing that is most likely a proposal of their personal development course.

First, understand that even though you are running your own business, you are a satellite office for LLI Central. This is not your product, you are not selling it, and you are not even allowed to explain it. You are a lead generation conduit, which is much like "muscle". Remember muscle? Those hairy guys with the gold chains who would get the money out of the stiff for the mob? These guys were finding people to influence, weak-minded saps. Then they would extort money from them by threatening all sorts of bad things that may or may not happen to them. You, LLI "business owners", are the muscle for this organization.

This is a legitimate business. Don't believe all these people who talk about having an MBA and finding salvation in LLI, however. I am just finishing up a Bachelors in Business Administration and I can see the real fallout here: information management. If you are a legitimate business offering to let people in on a secret that will make you thousands of dollars a month, any professional will ask for market research. Any proposal for a business venture I have ever been approached with has been met (through me) by these questions:

1. Who is your target market?
2. What percent buys your product?
3. Why do they buy your product?
4. What is the basis of this demand?

This is simple supply and demand; you learn about this in your sophomore year of business school.

LLI has a grey market made up of people that are influenced by others promising better than what those people have now. They are vulnerable: maybe they've had a spouse die, are disabled, have been shunned by society or family... somehow, they are open to the idea that there's something better. Who knows how many of these mindless sheep actually buy this crap. And why do they buy it? Because they are vulnerable. The demand for this product, and all personal development plans, is made by insecure, bendable Americans who don't believe there is anything better than what they have. These are the same people who killed for Manson and committed mass suicide for the leaders of Heaven's Gate.

Do you know why the beauty industry is booming? Why they rake in billions a year on stuff that eventually turns your face into glued-on corn flakes? It's because people have a very bad self worth. They need therapy. They need to be fixed. If you fixed every person in the world with therapy, the "personal image" industry would collapse. Personal image, personal development... it's the same thing. You're putting on makeup that you think is going to make you feel better about yourself, when what you really need is to GET OVER YOURSELF.

From someone who will be working hard everyday of his life and knowing why he is doing it, please please PLEASE don't buy into the LLIs of the world. Do your research, go to school, get an education, make a difference and instill in your children that hard work through your own devices will be the greatest reward you can ever ask for.

Good luck in the future.
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#14 Consumer Comment

Let's be critical thinkers here

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

Think critically, without the hype from those who have a "funny feeling", and you can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

LLI is going to make money regardless of your efforts. In their video, they talk about how corporate America doesn't care about you, and you're making money for someone else. They say that they *DO* care about you, that you are the one making money, and that this is a business with as much risk as any business. It's a world of caring and sharing that is most likely a proposal of their personal development course.

First, understand that even though you are running your own business, you are a satellite office for LLI Central. This is not your product, you are not selling it, and you are not even allowed to explain it. You are a lead generation conduit, which is much like "muscle". Remember muscle? Those hairy guys with the gold chains who would get the money out of the stiff for the mob? These guys were finding people to influence, weak-minded saps. Then they would extort money from them by threatening all sorts of bad things that may or may not happen to them. You, LLI "business owners", are the muscle for this organization.

This is a legitimate business. Don't believe all these people who talk about having an MBA and finding salvation in LLI, however. I am just finishing up a Bachelors in Business Administration and I can see the real fallout here: information management. If you are a legitimate business offering to let people in on a secret that will make you thousands of dollars a month, any professional will ask for market research. Any proposal for a business venture I have ever been approached with has been met (through me) by these questions:

1. Who is your target market?
2. What percent buys your product?
3. Why do they buy your product?
4. What is the basis of this demand?

This is simple supply and demand; you learn about this in your sophomore year of business school.

LLI has a grey market made up of people that are influenced by others promising better than what those people have now. They are vulnerable: maybe they've had a spouse die, are disabled, have been shunned by society or family... somehow, they are open to the idea that there's something better. Who knows how many of these mindless sheep actually buy this crap. And why do they buy it? Because they are vulnerable. The demand for this product, and all personal development plans, is made by insecure, bendable Americans who don't believe there is anything better than what they have. These are the same people who killed for Manson and committed mass suicide for the leaders of Heaven's Gate.

Do you know why the beauty industry is booming? Why they rake in billions a year on stuff that eventually turns your face into glued-on corn flakes? It's because people have a very bad self worth. They need therapy. They need to be fixed. If you fixed every person in the world with therapy, the "personal image" industry would collapse. Personal image, personal development... it's the same thing. You're putting on makeup that you think is going to make you feel better about yourself, when what you really need is to GET OVER YOURSELF.

From someone who will be working hard everyday of his life and knowing why he is doing it, please please PLEASE don't buy into the LLIs of the world. Do your research, go to school, get an education, make a difference and instill in your children that hard work through your own devices will be the greatest reward you can ever ask for.

Good luck in the future.
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#15 Consumer Suggestion

LLI's real income statistics just don't add up to all the hype. It's hard to argue with the facts.

AUTHOR: Jim - (U.S.A.)

It's hard to argue with the true companywide income statistics published by LLI itself. Liberty League was obligated by the Arizona Attorney General to publish the true companywide income statistics on it's website as an Income Disclaimer.

This came after the Arizona Attorney General ruled against Liberty League in a $115,000 fine court settelement in May of 2006, which was brought up by former LLI associates who ended up in substantial debt doing the business.

www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf

Liberty League's actual income statistics company wide can been seen here. The numbers just don't add up to all the hype. Look at the stats and the numbers and make up your own mind.

www.libertyleague.com/compliance/income_disclosure.php

Why the heck are only the very top 5% of their associates making almost half the entire sales companywide?

Why did 80% of all active associates in the company averaged only about $7,149 last year accoding to their stats, while product prices each are up to $12,995 per person? I can now begin to see where the court settlement document says a lot of people did not even make back the money they spent on the products to begin with. Just factor in the business and advertisement costs, as well as the product purchases, and you see the point.

Why did the same very top 5% of the entire company only average $22K/mo a month? What happened to all those people making $100K/mo or more?

Why did a total of 91% of all the active LLI associates in the entire company not even make more than $75K at the very most for the entire year 2005, again with 80% averaging only about $7,149?
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#16 UPDATE EX-employee responds

LLI rip off scam

AUTHOR: Susan - (U.S.A.)

I would just like to add to to these comments... I, too, got taken by Liberty League. I bought into the program and worked the leads as directed. I have a full time job and as soon as I arrived home in the evening, I would go into my office and make my calls. I also made the calls during my lunch breaks and driving to and from my work place. My results were non-existent. I even went so far as to purchase leads. I spent hundreds on google ads with no concrete results.

My advisor told me that I was not making my 100 calls, I had a poverty consiousness, etc. When I quit at one point I was verbally chastised and insulted. In reading these posts, I see a definite pattern of language and expresssion that these folks use to try to intimidate. The main goal of these folks seems to be exclusive as to wringing upwards of $20,000 out of people who are trying to make a better life for themselves and their families. I have to say that the program did, indeed, open up some ideas to me, but they were nothing I could not get from my local library or the nearby Barnes and Noble bookstore...or for that matter any metaphysical shop or Church.

They have taken a bunch of information that can be obtained for FREE, as suggested above, compiled it into a book with several blank pages for the consumer to "journal" on and charged the exorbitant price of $1495 and refer to it as some type of an awakening. I hope anyone who is thinking of joiniong this rip off organization wakes up and realizes it's a HUGE scam. When I refused to buy into Summit and Libery, I was told by my advisor that I was a person of no integrity. Those are the tactics these people use. It's really a crime and these people should be ashamed of themselves. As the old saying goes..."What you sow , so shall you reap". These guys are in for a heck of a lot of bad reaping.
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#17 UPDATE EX-employee responds

LLI rip off scam

AUTHOR: Susan - (U.S.A.)

I would just like to add to to these comments... I, too, got taken by Liberty League. I bought into the program and worked the leads as directed. I have a full time job and as soon as I arrived home in the evening, I would go into my office and make my calls. I also made the calls during my lunch breaks and driving to and from my work place. My results were non-existent. I even went so far as to purchase leads. I spent hundreds on google ads with no concrete results.

My advisor told me that I was not making my 100 calls, I had a poverty consiousness, etc. When I quit at one point I was verbally chastised and insulted. In reading these posts, I see a definite pattern of language and expresssion that these folks use to try to intimidate. The main goal of these folks seems to be exclusive as to wringing upwards of $20,000 out of people who are trying to make a better life for themselves and their families. I have to say that the program did, indeed, open up some ideas to me, but they were nothing I could not get from my local library or the nearby Barnes and Noble bookstore...or for that matter any metaphysical shop or Church.

They have taken a bunch of information that can be obtained for FREE, as suggested above, compiled it into a book with several blank pages for the consumer to "journal" on and charged the exorbitant price of $1495 and refer to it as some type of an awakening. I hope anyone who is thinking of joiniong this rip off organization wakes up and realizes it's a HUGE scam. When I refused to buy into Summit and Libery, I was told by my advisor that I was a person of no integrity. Those are the tactics these people use. It's really a crime and these people should be ashamed of themselves. As the old saying goes..."What you sow , so shall you reap". These guys are in for a heck of a lot of bad reaping.
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#18 UPDATE EX-employee responds

LLI rip off scam

AUTHOR: Susan - (U.S.A.)

I would just like to add to to these comments... I, too, got taken by Liberty League. I bought into the program and worked the leads as directed. I have a full time job and as soon as I arrived home in the evening, I would go into my office and make my calls. I also made the calls during my lunch breaks and driving to and from my work place. My results were non-existent. I even went so far as to purchase leads. I spent hundreds on google ads with no concrete results.

My advisor told me that I was not making my 100 calls, I had a poverty consiousness, etc. When I quit at one point I was verbally chastised and insulted. In reading these posts, I see a definite pattern of language and expresssion that these folks use to try to intimidate. The main goal of these folks seems to be exclusive as to wringing upwards of $20,000 out of people who are trying to make a better life for themselves and their families. I have to say that the program did, indeed, open up some ideas to me, but they were nothing I could not get from my local library or the nearby Barnes and Noble bookstore...or for that matter any metaphysical shop or Church.

They have taken a bunch of information that can be obtained for FREE, as suggested above, compiled it into a book with several blank pages for the consumer to "journal" on and charged the exorbitant price of $1495 and refer to it as some type of an awakening. I hope anyone who is thinking of joiniong this rip off organization wakes up and realizes it's a HUGE scam. When I refused to buy into Summit and Libery, I was told by my advisor that I was a person of no integrity. Those are the tactics these people use. It's really a crime and these people should be ashamed of themselves. As the old saying goes..."What you sow , so shall you reap". These guys are in for a heck of a lot of bad reaping.
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#19 UPDATE EX-employee responds

LLI rip off scam

AUTHOR: Susan - (U.S.A.)

I would just like to add to to these comments... I, too, got taken by Liberty League. I bought into the program and worked the leads as directed. I have a full time job and as soon as I arrived home in the evening, I would go into my office and make my calls. I also made the calls during my lunch breaks and driving to and from my work place. My results were non-existent. I even went so far as to purchase leads. I spent hundreds on google ads with no concrete results.

My advisor told me that I was not making my 100 calls, I had a poverty consiousness, etc. When I quit at one point I was verbally chastised and insulted. In reading these posts, I see a definite pattern of language and expresssion that these folks use to try to intimidate. The main goal of these folks seems to be exclusive as to wringing upwards of $20,000 out of people who are trying to make a better life for themselves and their families. I have to say that the program did, indeed, open up some ideas to me, but they were nothing I could not get from my local library or the nearby Barnes and Noble bookstore...or for that matter any metaphysical shop or Church.

They have taken a bunch of information that can be obtained for FREE, as suggested above, compiled it into a book with several blank pages for the consumer to "journal" on and charged the exorbitant price of $1495 and refer to it as some type of an awakening. I hope anyone who is thinking of joiniong this rip off organization wakes up and realizes it's a HUGE scam. When I refused to buy into Summit and Libery, I was told by my advisor that I was a person of no integrity. Those are the tactics these people use. It's really a crime and these people should be ashamed of themselves. As the old saying goes..."What you sow , so shall you reap". These guys are in for a heck of a lot of bad reaping.
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#20 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

AUTHOR: Steve - (Canada)

Firstly, thank you to all that run Rip off Reports.

For all those with the negative experience with Liberty League International, take with you the knowledge that you are not alone. Liberty League International is another MLM (Multi-Level Marketing) business "opportunity" or also referred to as "Network Marketing" and now "Direct Marketing". Yes there are always those who will make money in this type of "business", however, the majority of people who get into this type of "business" make nothing more then more debt for themselves. The best advice anyone can give to you regarding such "opportunities" is this...STAY AWAY.

These are companies that prey on your desire (fantasy) to earn better income and promote more time for you and your families, they are in the business of fantasy. I have spent considerable time researching MLM type "opportunities" and I urge you to take alook at the internet, it's full of similar "opportunities". It's too bad so many people get drawn in. The fact of the matter is, that these business "opportunities" are NO GOOD. Along with the fact that ALL MLM businesses satuarate their own market there by imploding in on themselves and once again leaving the people lower in the chain with nothing.

As for being a pyramid scam...No, not by the definition of what the law states as a pyramid scam. The reason they can say it isn't is because they supposedly have a tangible product or service to sell. However, you're not going to be making the "real" money until you "recruit" enough people under you. Even their diagrams are set up as a pyramid. Nope not a pyramid scam by legal terms...It's time the law makers and government officials take a long thourough look at these types of "opportunities". Start bugging your government officials to take action. Hey if it's such a great "business" opportunity why aren't more people doing it? Don't answer, I've heard the rebuttal before.

At any rate, if you want a business of your own, build or buy a business and get the info. and figures in writing. Chances are if you can't afford a business...you can't afford to get into an MLM.

As to the MLM cheering section? Welcome to fantasy land. Nope not a pyramid scam, just another MLM scam, which in my humble opinion can be worst then a pyramid scam.
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#21 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

AUTHOR: Steve - (Canada)

Firstly, thank you to all that run Rip off Reports.

For all those with the negative experience with Liberty League International, take with you the knowledge that you are not alone. Liberty League International is another MLM (Multi-Level Marketing) business "opportunity" or also referred to as "Network Marketing" and now "Direct Marketing". Yes there are always those who will make money in this type of "business", however, the majority of people who get into this type of "business" make nothing more then more debt for themselves. The best advice anyone can give to you regarding such "opportunities" is this...STAY AWAY.

These are companies that prey on your desire (fantasy) to earn better income and promote more time for you and your families, they are in the business of fantasy. I have spent considerable time researching MLM type "opportunities" and I urge you to take alook at the internet, it's full of similar "opportunities". It's too bad so many people get drawn in. The fact of the matter is, that these business "opportunities" are NO GOOD. Along with the fact that ALL MLM businesses satuarate their own market there by imploding in on themselves and once again leaving the people lower in the chain with nothing.

As for being a pyramid scam...No, not by the definition of what the law states as a pyramid scam. The reason they can say it isn't is because they supposedly have a tangible product or service to sell. However, you're not going to be making the "real" money until you "recruit" enough people under you. Even their diagrams are set up as a pyramid. Nope not a pyramid scam by legal terms...It's time the law makers and government officials take a long thourough look at these types of "opportunities". Start bugging your government officials to take action. Hey if it's such a great "business" opportunity why aren't more people doing it? Don't answer, I've heard the rebuttal before.

At any rate, if you want a business of your own, build or buy a business and get the info. and figures in writing. Chances are if you can't afford a business...you can't afford to get into an MLM.

As to the MLM cheering section? Welcome to fantasy land. Nope not a pyramid scam, just another MLM scam, which in my humble opinion can be worst then a pyramid scam.
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#22 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League International Just another MLM scam.

AUTHOR: Steve - (Canada)

Firstly, thank you to all that run Rip off Reports.

For all those with the negative experience with Liberty League International, take with you the knowledge that you are not alone. Liberty League International is another MLM (Multi-Level Marketing) business "opportunity" or also referred to as "Network Marketing" and now "Direct Marketing". Yes there are always those who will make money in this type of "business", however, the majority of people who get into this type of "business" make nothing more then more debt for themselves. The best advice anyone can give to you regarding such "opportunities" is this...STAY AWAY.

These are companies that prey on your desire (fantasy) to earn better income and promote more time for you and your families, they are in the business of fantasy. I have spent considerable time researching MLM type "opportunities" and I urge you to take alook at the internet, it's full of similar "opportunities". It's too bad so many people get drawn in. The fact of the matter is, that these business "opportunities" are NO GOOD. Along with the fact that ALL MLM businesses satuarate their own market there by imploding in on themselves and once again leaving the people lower in the chain with nothing.

As for being a pyramid scam...No, not by the definition of what the law states as a pyramid scam. The reason they can say it isn't is because they supposedly have a tangible product or service to sell. However, you're not going to be making the "real" money until you "recruit" enough people under you. Even their diagrams are set up as a pyramid. Nope not a pyramid scam by legal terms...It's time the law makers and government officials take a long thourough look at these types of "opportunities". Start bugging your government officials to take action. Hey if it's such a great "business" opportunity why aren't more people doing it? Don't answer, I've heard the rebuttal before.

At any rate, if you want a business of your own, build or buy a business and get the info. and figures in writing. Chances are if you can't afford a business...you can't afford to get into an MLM.

As to the MLM cheering section? Welcome to fantasy land. Nope not a pyramid scam, just another MLM scam, which in my humble opinion can be worst then a pyramid scam.
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#23 Consumer Comment

Great Report! I'm glad I investigated this company!

AUTHOR: Jeremy - (U.S.A.)

I got involved with a similiar company called "Travel Dynamics" way back in 1999. That company offerred travel packages and motivational courses for exorbidant prices and I ended up getting into debt BIG TIME trying to sell their courses.

It never ceases to amaze me how the same types of scams are always reincarnated in different forms over the years.
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#24 Consumer Comment

Great Report! I'm glad I investigated this company!

AUTHOR: Jeremy - (U.S.A.)

I got involved with a similiar company called "Travel Dynamics" way back in 1999. That company offerred travel packages and motivational courses for exorbidant prices and I ended up getting into debt BIG TIME trying to sell their courses.

It never ceases to amaze me how the same types of scams are always reincarnated in different forms over the years.
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#25 Consumer Comment

The same few idiots....

AUTHOR: Timothy - (U.S.A.)

A couple of constructive truths that I'm sure will be agreed with by many and ripped apart by a few on criteria such as my spelling, grammar or a particular word or two, in the style of "the definition of the word IS is"

First off, it is scary that Gabriel from Hartford, Connecticut is SO brain washed, that he actually resorted to using the EXECUTIVE CHAIN OF COMMAND MODEL to illustrate how LLI is NOT a pyramid scheme. He is DIRECTLY quoting Jeffrey Combs, another "motivational speaker" who does appearances for LLI and others.

Then Larry from Lapeer, Michigan does two things in one. First he accuses Matt of NOT doing the right thing. As he put it, real business owners don't TRY, they DO. This kills me since he doesn't have the sensibility to realize he is actually supporting Matt's argument. Elsewhere in the threat it suggests that one of LLI's basic faults is hurling disguised insults at people attempting success, but when they fail, they are told they are not VIBRATING correctly or their POSTURE is off or they aren't BELIEVING in themselves enough, etc.

Just more scam lines to buy time so that hopefully those poor souls will shell out more money for yet more expensive leads.

The other thing Larry mentioned was a direct quote from an LLI spinoff website, "Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results." This is a terrific quote and I believe it. But to hurl it at someone as a weapon is way to defensive for me to believe there is much good in Larry or the company.

And why would anyone attack Matt for really trying. I don't care what anyone says, if the guy legitimately dedicated hundreds or even thousands of hours of time to something that - according to the company itself - YOU CANNOT POSSIBLY FAIL AT, then how can you possibly blame Matt for TRYING?!!

Please don't really answer that; I'm sure some LLI supporter will try to. But that would just be further supporting Matt/our arguments, that no matter what we do, say or try, we are somehow wrong, even after spending tons of time, money and effort. It makes no sense as a whole, does it?

One of my favorite things that no one seemed to mention is the credibility of the two founders Brent Payne and Shane Kreider. They are the "authors" of Beyond Freedom, right? But who the hell are they anyway? Two average joes who decided to hire a researcher or someone with an acronym attatched to their name to pen a personal growth and development book: basically a body of work with much white space that could be condensed to a lot less pages.

Incidently LLI also highly recommends other books which are 80 pages + but that contain tons of blank space.

Lastly, to address the heading of my post. There is no doubt that after following LLI for the last 3 years that it is the same half dozen of so names that keep popping up. Just as with Emerald Passport, it is the same few people conducting the overview calls and advertising in the home-biz-leads promotional magazines.

While I believe success is in every individual's hands (and I anticipate the critics will jump on this last point, among others), LLI seems to BLAME people for lack of success after they swear how easy their system is to follow "anyone can follow this simple step-by-step system and have success" Really?!!

Maybe if they lowered their price points a bit? I honestly don't know. You can draw your own conclusions.
I leave it up to you to do
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#26 Consumer Comment

100 Times: Thank You

AUTHOR: Kristi - (U.S.A.)

After reading all of the information presented above, I have made a firm decision regarding LLI. I will NOT be getting involved with this company. I did call someone regarding 'the opportunity', I did listen to their 'live' call (which referenced their next 'exotic' trip RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER - IN JUNE-HELLO, IT'S AUGUST. Oh yeah, at 'live' question time, the phone disconnected, which I anticipated, I would have been shocked if I was able to ask a question. Too much piped in coughing and kids in the background.

If I were on a 'live' call, I would be in a quiet place, that would be logical. There were several red flag questions in my mind listening to this presentation, which led me to believe that they were offering something too good to be true and a product that's results seem too intangible. I don't know this to be a fact, but there's enough evidence for me to stay away. So, after having too many red flags, compounded by the information presented here, I feel I have made an informed decision. Thanks!
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#27 Consumer Comment

John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

AUTHOR: Kayla - (U.S.A.)

John - Evansvill, IN and Lin - Orange Park, FL...What are you guys now doing that is working for you? I, too, was about to join Liberty League International, but now I have decided to keep searching for another opportunity. Since you guys have both experienced LLI and now state that you have found something better and moved forward, I know the majority of all the previous people in this thread would be very interested in a legitimate opportunity that we can all feel good about. I hope you will share with us what you have found. Also, thanks to all the previous Rebuttals because I feel much better knowing that I saved myself a lot of money.

Thanks for your time and hope to hear from you.
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#28 Consumer Comment

John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

AUTHOR: Kayla - (U.S.A.)

John - Evansvill, IN and Lin - Orange Park, FL...What are you guys now doing that is working for you? I, too, was about to join Liberty League International, but now I have decided to keep searching for another opportunity. Since you guys have both experienced LLI and now state that you have found something better and moved forward, I know the majority of all the previous people in this thread would be very interested in a legitimate opportunity that we can all feel good about. I hope you will share with us what you have found. Also, thanks to all the previous Rebuttals because I feel much better knowing that I saved myself a lot of money.

Thanks for your time and hope to hear from you.
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#29 Consumer Comment

John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

AUTHOR: Kayla - (U.S.A.)

John - Evansvill, IN and Lin - Orange Park, FL...What are you guys now doing that is working for you? I, too, was about to join Liberty League International, but now I have decided to keep searching for another opportunity. Since you guys have both experienced LLI and now state that you have found something better and moved forward, I know the majority of all the previous people in this thread would be very interested in a legitimate opportunity that we can all feel good about. I hope you will share with us what you have found. Also, thanks to all the previous Rebuttals because I feel much better knowing that I saved myself a lot of money.

Thanks for your time and hope to hear from you.
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#30 Consumer Comment

John and Lin -- What are you guys doing?

AUTHOR: Kayla - (U.S.A.)

John - Evansvill, IN and Lin - Orange Park, FL...What are you guys now doing that is working for you? I, too, was about to join Liberty League International, but now I have decided to keep searching for another opportunity. Since you guys have both experienced LLI and now state that you have found something better and moved forward, I know the majority of all the previous people in this thread would be very interested in a legitimate opportunity that we can all feel good about. I hope you will share with us what you have found. Also, thanks to all the previous Rebuttals because I feel much better knowing that I saved myself a lot of money.

Thanks for your time and hope to hear from you.
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#31 UPDATE Employee

All of the Facts

AUTHOR: Elizabeth - (U.S.A.)

I found this to be helpful in gaining the facts of the situation concerning the May 2006 issue:

Liberty League Compliance Initiative
News Relating to Liberty League Compliance Initiative Liberty League International - Taking Network Marketing to the Next Level

Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

Scottsdale, AZ (PRWEB) May 24, 2006 - Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

"It's an incredibly exciting time to be a part of this organization," Chief Compliance Officer, Nadine Boisnier stated. "Liberty League is implementing all of the necessary changes to ensure we are compliant with all new FTC proposed rulings on the direct selling industry, in addition to disclosing appropriately to the field the necessary guidelines to ensure a more effective, streamlined and compliant business process."

Co-founders Brent Payne and Shane Krider have been involved first hand in hiring the right people and laying the foundation for further expansion and growth. The co-founders have broad ambitions for the next few years and are proud of the stance they have taken regarding non-compliant activities. Their mission is to help independent distributors understand the importance of running an ethical, compliant business, which is the precursor for bringing any company to the next level of success.

The next level includes being proactive in regards to distributor disclosures. "We feel that if you are running a legitimate company that does have a positive impact on the people involved, extensive disclosure is our best advertising," Krider stated.

"We are extremely proud of the results of our associates and will display with pride and honor the results these individuals are creating." In addition to adding disclosures, the company has also taken a no tolerance policy on unethical business practices and behavior. For example, because of these new policies, top income earners were recently terminated due to non-compliant activities.

"LLI is helping to pave the way for all network marketing companies," Krider added. "And when necessary, willing to adjust our practices to stay within the guidelines of this elusive area called compliance." The co-founders also stand by any type of network marketing standardization that can take away ambiguous subjectivity by various regulators.

As a strong advocate of the industry, co-founder Krider concluded, "Network marketing is one of the worlds leading contributors for getting people working on themselves, personal development, continuing education, learning the internet, learning entrepreneurship, and in some companies, spirituality from a practical result oriented platform."

If we are going to give info, let's give all of the info related to the issue, please. Thank you.
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#32 UPDATE Employee

All of the Facts

AUTHOR: Elizabeth - (U.S.A.)

I found this to be helpful in gaining the facts of the situation concerning the May 2006 issue:

Liberty League Compliance Initiative
News Relating to Liberty League Compliance Initiative Liberty League International - Taking Network Marketing to the Next Level

Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

Scottsdale, AZ (PRWEB) May 24, 2006 - Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

"It's an incredibly exciting time to be a part of this organization," Chief Compliance Officer, Nadine Boisnier stated. "Liberty League is implementing all of the necessary changes to ensure we are compliant with all new FTC proposed rulings on the direct selling industry, in addition to disclosing appropriately to the field the necessary guidelines to ensure a more effective, streamlined and compliant business process."

Co-founders Brent Payne and Shane Krider have been involved first hand in hiring the right people and laying the foundation for further expansion and growth. The co-founders have broad ambitions for the next few years and are proud of the stance they have taken regarding non-compliant activities. Their mission is to help independent distributors understand the importance of running an ethical, compliant business, which is the precursor for bringing any company to the next level of success.

The next level includes being proactive in regards to distributor disclosures. "We feel that if you are running a legitimate company that does have a positive impact on the people involved, extensive disclosure is our best advertising," Krider stated.

"We are extremely proud of the results of our associates and will display with pride and honor the results these individuals are creating." In addition to adding disclosures, the company has also taken a no tolerance policy on unethical business practices and behavior. For example, because of these new policies, top income earners were recently terminated due to non-compliant activities.

"LLI is helping to pave the way for all network marketing companies," Krider added. "And when necessary, willing to adjust our practices to stay within the guidelines of this elusive area called compliance." The co-founders also stand by any type of network marketing standardization that can take away ambiguous subjectivity by various regulators.

As a strong advocate of the industry, co-founder Krider concluded, "Network marketing is one of the worlds leading contributors for getting people working on themselves, personal development, continuing education, learning the internet, learning entrepreneurship, and in some companies, spirituality from a practical result oriented platform."

If we are going to give info, let's give all of the info related to the issue, please. Thank you.
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#33 UPDATE Employee

All of the Facts

AUTHOR: Elizabeth - (U.S.A.)

I found this to be helpful in gaining the facts of the situation concerning the May 2006 issue:

Liberty League Compliance Initiative
News Relating to Liberty League Compliance Initiative Liberty League International - Taking Network Marketing to the Next Level

Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

Scottsdale, AZ (PRWEB) May 24, 2006 - Liberty League International, one of the world's leading personal development companies is taking the necessary steps in order to enhance an atmosphere of compliant business practices to ensure confidence within all independent distributor channels.

"It's an incredibly exciting time to be a part of this organization," Chief Compliance Officer, Nadine Boisnier stated. "Liberty League is implementing all of the necessary changes to ensure we are compliant with all new FTC proposed rulings on the direct selling industry, in addition to disclosing appropriately to the field the necessary guidelines to ensure a more effective, streamlined and compliant business process."

Co-founders Brent Payne and Shane Krider have been involved first hand in hiring the right people and laying the foundation for further expansion and growth. The co-founders have broad ambitions for the next few years and are proud of the stance they have taken regarding non-compliant activities. Their mission is to help independent distributors understand the importance of running an ethical, compliant business, which is the precursor for bringing any company to the next level of success.

The next level includes being proactive in regards to distributor disclosures. "We feel that if you are running a legitimate company that does have a positive impact on the people involved, extensive disclosure is our best advertising," Krider stated.

"We are extremely proud of the results of our associates and will display with pride and honor the results these individuals are creating." In addition to adding disclosures, the company has also taken a no tolerance policy on unethical business practices and behavior. For example, because of these new policies, top income earners were recently terminated due to non-compliant activities.

"LLI is helping to pave the way for all network marketing companies," Krider added. "And when necessary, willing to adjust our practices to stay within the guidelines of this elusive area called compliance." The co-founders also stand by any type of network marketing standardization that can take away ambiguous subjectivity by various regulators.

As a strong advocate of the industry, co-founder Krider concluded, "Network marketing is one of the worlds leading contributors for getting people working on themselves, personal development, continuing education, learning the internet, learning entrepreneurship, and in some companies, spirituality from a practical result oriented platform."

If we are going to give info, let's give all of the info related to the issue, please. Thank you.
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#34 Consumer Comment

Attorney General's Office Terry Goddard Settles with Personal Development Marketing Company

AUTHOR: E - (U.S.A.)

(Phoenix, Ariz. ? May 24, 2006) Attorney General Terry Goddard today announced a settlement with
Liberty League International, LLC, and its principals, Brent Payne and Shane Krider. The consent judgment resolves complaints that the multi-level marketing corporation tricked customers into spending substantial amounts of money by promising ?sizable commissions? if they helped market three ?personal development? products and recruit new participants into the program.

The settlement requires Liberty League International, based in Scottsdale, to pay $115,000 which will be used to pay for consumer education, attorneys' fees and investigation costs, and victim restitution to be determined by the court at a later date.

According to documents filed in Maricopa County Superior Court, Payne and Krider said customers had the potential to earn large sums of money if they used and recruited new participants to use Liberty League's ?personal development? products.

In fact, the majority of participants did not earn enough to cover the amount they paid to buy the products sold to them. The personal development products included a home-study course, a four-day personal development
conference and a five-day personal finance and development conference. Prices ranged from $1,495 to $12,995 per person.

In addition to the civil penalties, attorney's fees and restitution, the defendants are also required to:

*Refrain from making unsubstantiated income claims.

*Advise potential customers of the correct percentage of participants who have made a profit through their participation in the Liberty League program.

*Refrain from making any false or deceptive statements in their marketing materials.

Assistant Attorney General Nancy V. Anger handled this case.

If you believe you have been a victim of fraud, please contact the Attorney General's Office in Phoenix at 602.542.5763; in Tucson at 520.628.6504; or outside the metro areas at 1.800.352.8431.

To file a complaint in person, the Attorney General's Office has 22 satellite offices throughout the state with volunteers available to help. Locations and hours of operation are posted on the Attorney General's Web site at azag.gov. Consumers are also encouraged to sign up on the Web site to receive consumer advisories from the Attorney General.
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#35 Consumer Comment

scam

AUTHOR: David - (U.S.A.)

Matt, Your Right. Thanks a lot. You save me a lot of money and time.

David
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#36 REBUTTAL Individual responds

Hey LLI, I heard Burger King is Hiring

AUTHOR: Daniel - (U.S.A.)

I am so happy with what is happening with LLI. I was accosted by a member a few years back about joining LLI. I was fresh out of college and still getting my taste of the real world.

Well anyway, when I told the guy I didn't have the money to join he went on about how I don't have what it takes to make it in this world and that I should go back home and live with mom and dad because I am destined to be a loser in life.

I didn't say I wasn't interested because I didn't want to do it, or that I requested proof of what they were shoveling...no, I just couldn't afford to spend $2000 to start a job...

Which btw, I couldn't understand at the time that it would cost me money to go to work...I thought that contradicted everything I was taught...even from kindergarten....I thought you go to work to make money, not spend it....but anyway...they guy was really out of line and I just want to let him know that I like my burgers without pickles.

Regards,

Daniel
Memphis, TN
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#37 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

AUTHOR: Corey - (U.S.A.)

Please do your homework - it is true Liberty League is out for your money. And in quite a bit of trouble according to the Arizona Attorney General's office.

I had someone mention this Liberty League program to me, and they stated they were an "advisor" - its not impossible to make money selling someone elses products, but you stand a bigger chance of losing your own money than gaining financial independence. Always research these things.
Remember, always try to sell your own products, buying into a bogus pyramid scheme like Liberty is too risky. Save yourself some money, go to the library, check out some books, they're free!

And lastly, if the system was so great, so amazing, it would not be shared. The only reason the "system" is being marketed to you is because your money becomes their money.
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#38 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

AUTHOR: Corey - (U.S.A.)

Please do your homework - it is true Liberty League is out for your money. And in quite a bit of trouble according to the Arizona Attorney General's office.

I had someone mention this Liberty League program to me, and they stated they were an "advisor" - its not impossible to make money selling someone elses products, but you stand a bigger chance of losing your own money than gaining financial independence. Always research these things.
Remember, always try to sell your own products, buying into a bogus pyramid scheme like Liberty is too risky. Save yourself some money, go to the library, check out some books, they're free!

And lastly, if the system was so great, so amazing, it would not be shared. The only reason the "system" is being marketed to you is because your money becomes their money.
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#39 Consumer Suggestion

Liberty League to Pay 100K for False Claims

AUTHOR: Corey - (U.S.A.)

Please do your homework - it is true Liberty League is out for your money. And in quite a bit of trouble according to the Arizona Attorney General's office.

I had someone mention this Liberty League program to me, and they stated they were an "advisor" - its not impossible to make money selling someone elses products, but you stand a bigger chance of losing your own money than gaining financial independence. Always research these things.
Remember, always try to sell your own products, buying into a bogus pyramid scheme like Liberty is too risky. Save yourself some money, go to the library, check out some books, they're free!

And lastly, if the system was so great, so amazing, it would not be shared. The only reason the "system" is being marketed to you is because your money becomes their money.
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#40 Consumer Suggestion

Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

AUTHOR: Armando - (U.S.A.)

Liberty League Settlement infoz:

http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf
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#41 Consumer Suggestion

Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

AUTHOR: Armando - (U.S.A.)

Liberty League Settlement infoz:

http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf
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#42 Consumer Suggestion

Arizona AG vs. Libertly League

AUTHOR: Armando - (U.S.A.)

Liberty League Settlement infoz:

http://www.azag.gov/press_releases/may/2006/LibertyLeagueSettlement.pdf
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#43 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Time To Move On...

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

To everyone who is looking into Liberty League as a "legitimate" home based business opportunity...you might want to keep looking...

There comes a time in every entrepreneur's career when he or she must decide if their business is going to be able to sustain their financial goals for the future. I have been involved with Liberty League for quite some time, and in that time have had some financial success.

But for various reasons over the last few weeks, I have been forced to ask myself if Liberty League was not only going to help me sustain the financial goals that I have established for my family and I, but more importantly was Liberty League still a company that I could feel good about being a part of...was the level of integrity with the company in fact solid.

The answers to these questions came very definitively over the last several weeks based on several unexpected events, and I have no doubt that my decision to move on to a greater and more prosperous opportunity was the right one.

For those of you who are reading this post, I commend you for doing your homework on Liberty League. If you have any questions regarding the business, the products, or about my decision to transition my business to another opportunity, please feel free to contact me. Whether you are interested in the opportunity or not, I think you would greatly benefit from hearing first hand what has transpired over the last several weeks with regard to my affiliation with Liberty League.

Kindest Regards,
Joe

CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.
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#44 Consumer Suggestion

I have found Mecca

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

What is the the real worth of the LLI 'Beyond Freedom' course? It's somewhere between USD $9.00 and $12.50. How do I know? I did a search on eBay, the ultimate arbiter of junk product worth, and graveyard for failed MLM product.

So today I truly feel doubly blessed. I learned (it's a cognitive thing...) that I can purchase a brand new $1495 LLI product for less than $10, and I learned that same $10 is worth 90 days of therapy.
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#45 Consumer Suggestion

Yeah, Well ...

AUTHOR: Dan - (U.S.A.)

I've watched my oldest brother play the LLI game for the past several months. He's finally gotten an hourly job in his former field again so that he could buy groceries and get his phone service restored.

Me? I'm self-employed for the past two years. My wife & I develop websites & build custom web applications and program database projects for customers locally and in other parts of the country. We don't make enough money to call ourselves rich (i.e., the LLI lure of $150,000+ per year), but we see continual growth in our company revenues and we are able to work from our home. The phone and the lights and the heat are still on, and we have dinner together with our kids as a family almost every night. We're getting by.

The thing is, our revenue is developed entirely from a service that we provide to our customers. We propose projects and set a price, and customers either choose to buy or to NOT buy.

Sure, we appreciate referrals and word-of-mouth advertising. What business doesn't? And we do recognize customers that steer additional business our way. Maybe they get a notebook with our logo on it or a bottle of wine at Christmas.

But ... our clients don't HAVE TO recruit a certain number of additional customers for us.

Before I was self-employed, I was the regional sales manager for a media company. I covered three states and was responsible for a multi-million dollar annual revenue budget. I earned an override from my sales reps' output, but they earned the lion's share of personal income from their business ... not me.

Is LLI's business model honest and ethical?

At the end of the day, that's all I have: honesty, and personal ethics. I know that I've done my level best to help my customers, and I can hear their words of praise on the phone or in person or via e-mail. I know that they appreciate what we have done, and that our service is valuable to them. They tell me so.

Any time I see a business model that requires me to sell a certain number of products or recruit a certain number of "consultants" before I see a dime of revenue, the warning flags go up. LLI is one of those 'warning flag' opportunities.

If you're making that $150,000+ per year with LLI? Congratulations.

And if you can do it while looking yourself squarely in the eye every morning? My hat is off to you.

I may not be knocking down the income I want (yet), but I can look myself in the eye over the bathroom sink, day or night. That's one of the things that matters most to me.
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#46 Consumer Comment

Cult,Scheme, Scam, Pyramid????

AUTHOR: Ashley - (U.S.A.)

I cannot believe I am now participating in this forum and wasn't even aware of this "discussion" until a potential associate brought it to my attention. I am an independent distributor with Liberty League and have been for 1 1/2 years.

I am also am a former banker - 16 yrs in exec. mgt and skeptical by nature. I am completing my masters in psychology specializing in adolescents and children. I tell you this just to let you know I wasn't scammed into working with LLI.

The reference to cult similarities I find offensive. The comments regarding "hard partying" may be true for some but as an alcoholic with 5 years in recovery I have never felt the least bit uncomfortable with other LLI families. Yes, I said families as children are welcome at the events. The comments as to "brain-washing" at the Liberty and Summit events are interesting. Please do your due diligence on speakers such as Andy Andrews who published a best selling book The Traveler's Gift, Michael Lozier and Bill Phillips who wrote Body for Life who have been featured speakers at our most recent events. I don't know if this was brain-washing or not but many of us did participate in a body for life challenge to lose body fat. Bill Phillips pledged to donate $$ for every lb of body fat participants lost and many LLI associates chose to match this with funds going to the make-a-wish foundation. I know this is pretty SCARY stuff.

As for the income opportunity - What were some of you looking for? I have to assume all wasn't fabulous in your world or you wouldn't be looking for a home based business. When one wants to work for oneself - it is assumed that there will be some start-up costs and a learning curve involved in the new venture. As a therapist I can only say that the Beyond Freedom program is a cognitive behavior based self study program that if used for 90 days as recommended is no more expensive than therapy for the same period. I became interested in the income opportunity only after seeing the changes in a friend that was using the program.

I made a choice to be involved in LLI and have not regretted it for one minute. It is amazing that a group of people,like those I've had the pleasure of meeting in LLI, who are trying to make positive changes in their own lives and help others can inspire so much skepticism, criticism, fear, resentment ect. You should have met some of the people I worked with in banking and seen the profit and management structure there....This is a business and yes Virginia, there is a profit motive - that doesn't make it a scam - I'll try to remember from banking: Gross profit - cost of goods sold = net income. Not good or evil - just capitalism. Welcome to America.
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#47 Consumer Suggestion

Use a credit card...I got my Money back!!!

AUTHOR: Enrico - (U.S.A.)

Unfortunately I "was" a victim, but because of the person that enrolled me.... (Mr. Glenn Mosser) was so greedy and wanted to ripp me off so fast, he allowed me to pay thru Paypal , basically with my credit card.

He had promised me a position in his "expensive" coop advertising campaign worth thousands and when he fell short, I was able to file reports through state officials, credit card companies and Liberty league<---(useless), I got my money back!

He held on to my money for two weeks before sending it to LLI which was the first red flag, then never responded to my request for information about the "COOP". This obviously was his way of recruiting people, promising them thousands of $$$ in LEADS!

BUT HE NEVER DELIVERED ON THE PROMISE!

I filed a report on this website. check it out if you want.

BUT the motto of my story is,.....

always use a credit card, believe it or not they do protect you against fraudulant charges. It takes time and patience to get a refund, but eventually you do!

If you can prove that the merchant did not deliver the item or service, like I did, they protect you!

Stay away from comapnies that ask for money orders, that right there tells you they don't want a trace on the money being moved around. Had I paid with a money order, I would have never have gotten a refund.

LLI attorneys sent me an email stating that I was not owed a refund because of the 3 day look period. LLI doesn't care if people are ripping off other individuals to sell packages, they hide behind the attorneys they pay thousans of dollars to push papers.


Look into the company before you buy anything, spend time researching the net.

And go with your gut feeling!
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#48 Consumer Comment

Seen people like these before...

AUTHOR: Todd - (U.S.A.)

How does this list measure with the types of people that run Liberty League?

Cult Check list!

1. The group is focused on a living charismatic leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment.
2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members.
3. The group is preoccupied with making money.
4. Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.
5. Mind-numbing techniques (for example: meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group or its leader(s).
6. The group's leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel.
7. The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity).
8. The group has a polarized, "we-they" mentality that causes conflict with the wider society.
9. The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities (as are, for example, clergy with mainstream denominations).
10. The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means (for example: collecting money for bogus charities) that members would have considered unethical before joining.
11. The group's leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to
control them.
12. Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with
family, friends, and personal pre-group goals and interests.
13. Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group.
14. Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.
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#49 Consumer Comment

Seen people like these before...

AUTHOR: Todd - (U.S.A.)

How does this list measure with the types of people that run Liberty League?

Cult Check list!

1. The group is focused on a living charismatic leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment.
2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members.
3. The group is preoccupied with making money.
4. Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.
5. Mind-numbing techniques (for example: meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group or its leader(s).
6. The group's leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel.
7. The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity).
8. The group has a polarized, "we-they" mentality that causes conflict with the wider society.
9. The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities (as are, for example, clergy with mainstream denominations).
10. The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means (for example: collecting money for bogus charities) that members would have considered unethical before joining.
11. The group's leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to
control them.
12. Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with
family, friends, and personal pre-group goals and interests.
13. Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group.
14. Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.
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#50 Consumer Comment

Seen people like these before...

AUTHOR: Todd - (U.S.A.)

How does this list measure with the types of people that run Liberty League?

Cult Check list!

1. The group is focused on a living charismatic leader to whom members seem to display excessively zealous, unquestioning commitment.
2. The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members.
3. The group is preoccupied with making money.
4. Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.
5. Mind-numbing techniques (for example: meditation, chanting, speaking in tongues, debilitating work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group or its leader(s).
6. The group's leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel.
7. The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered the Messiah or an avatar; the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity).
8. The group has a polarized, "we-they" mentality that causes conflict with the wider society.
9. The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities (as are, for example, clergy with mainstream denominations).
10. The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means (for example: collecting money for bogus charities) that members would have considered unethical before joining.
11. The group's leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to
control them.
12. Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties with
family, friends, and personal pre-group goals and interests.
13. Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group.
14. Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.
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#51 Consumer Suggestion

lin - what other companies???

AUTHOR: Marshall - (U.S.A.)

lin had said he had found other legit companies he was having success with.. I was looking at liberty league and just about to join before I came across this forum... you said you would talk to anyone about you the company you found and it would sure help me with my decision..
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#52 Consumer Suggestion

Simply amazing

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

I listened in last night to the "live" presentation and am amazed at how deceptive people can be. As a former "Amway" distributor, I guess I saw this LLI as just another con like all the rest have been. God put us on the earth to live and prosper BUT not at the expense of cheating others. All I can see in LLI is another way of taking peoples money for very little return. As one comment here wrote(Tom) "I can go to a book store and buy the equivelant Book for $20.... and buy a vacation for 20-35% less. HMMM... isn't that just amazing! What some people will do to get unsuspecting peoples money. And then when people realize what has happened they have no recourse. Maybe I'm old fashioned but I can make a good living HONESTLY and not cheat a single person. I can take a good vacation with the kids for 20% and probably have more fun than NEEDING to attend the "exotic" lifestyles I listened to on the phone. Your thinking right now,,I won't make half or one fourth of what you make a year or even in a month-- you know, "MONEY IS THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL". If I never make or see more than what I make now, at least I am happy.
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#53 Consumer Comment

What are these others businesses you all have found?

AUTHOR: Shane - (U.S.A.)

What are these other "legitimate" businesses you all have found? I would be interested to research them further.

Thanks!
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#54 Consumer Comment

I'm Lucky, I only lost the Beyound Freedom level.

AUTHOR: John - (U.S.A.)

I was with LLI also and I was wondering if those pictures on Tony's Website are from the Super Saturday in Dallas TX. Tony looks familure to me.
I know that it can be done as I met people their that were very sincere, I had a feeling of finally coming home after knowing that there must be a family to belong to. Like going to a new church for the first time, everybody is glad you came and welcomes you in hoping that you'll stay and become a memeber. That sort of thing.

I had such high hopes, and was about to loose my wife over this decision, as I found out that most the other guys at the Super Saterday Conference (without there wives) were in the same boat. As the night progressed I met my Summit Advisor (SA, this is the main supervisor 2 guys up) and my Liberty Advisor (LA, 1 guy up) for the first time and had a great time talking to them, and was introduced to many of their friends and business associates.
Everything was going fine until my SA turned to a friend of his and said "Guess what, this guy hasn't bought the Liberty Conference (LC) ticket yet, (which is $7000.00 to get the ticket plus the plane fare and other items needed to take a trip out of the country or where ever) want to talk to him about it.
At this point my SA's friend turned his attention on me and started to push me into buying the LC. The berating and badgering went on for some time. I was told to get the money together, beg, borrow or steal, just get it as you don't want to pass people up to your LA or SA as you aren't qualified at those levels.
My argument was, if the system that we are selling won't support itself then how am I supposed to support the system? I was going to sell the Beyond Freedom Courses ((BFC) you make $1000.00 for every BFC sold) until I had the $7000.00 to purchase the LC plus maybe a couple more for the plane fair. I didn't care if I was going to be passing these people up that might have bought their LC or Summit Conference (SC) tickets from me, to my LA or SA, I didn't care, I like my LA and SA, they were helping me right? I just wanted the system to work for me.
At the time I was so far into debt that I really had a hard time buying the BFC at $1495.00 let alone purchase a $7000.00 ticket.
Anyway, this wasn't the answer that this guy wanted to hear and kept on saying you can come up with the money somehow, some way.! I said that the only way I'd be able to come up with the ticket is to sell one of my Kidneys for $10,000.00 (which I said jokingly) he said, do it, you only need one! With that I looked him dead in the eye and saw that he was serious and that was when I started getting a little mad. From then on, (as far as I was conserned) the conversation was over. I stood up and looked him in the eye (as he was already standing) and made a stance as if I wasn't going to be moved on this one and the conversation was over. With that he turned and disappeared into the crowd.
I looked back at my SA and said, "Do you believe that," My SA just looked at me and smiled and started talking to another person.

Like Caryn, (she's can be found in other decisions, talking about LLI) I had a problem with telling people to get a second mortgage, or sell their homes or kidneys, pocket their hard earned money for the first two people that they bring in and tell them to do it again to further their carreer. If you buy the $1495.00 BFC your LA and SA are supposed to help you with the other people to get a total of 5 to be qualified.
Also I know that once you are in so deep with this program (after you've paid $7000.00 for LC or $12000.00 for SC) you just can't throw it all away and say I made a mistake and should've seen the writing on the wall. You have to keep going, you've probably burnt all your bridges and told your friends and family members that they are wrong for not believing in you enough to allow you to pay such money into this program. If you don't make it work by the time you've spent the $19,000.00 on both the programs you're name will be Mudd. It's a numbers game but the numbers are stacked against you. I figure you'd have to talk to over 100,000 to 500,000 people to get lucky enough to find the right person to join Liberty League. This person would have to have the $20500.00 to go BF, LC and SC all at the same time. Would have to be partly gullible, partly a risk taker and someone that wouldn't worry to much about loosing the $20500.00 if it didn't work out. I'm sure some of the LAs and SAs did getlucky and found one of these people within the first week or so. I heard of one lady that was widowed and took the money that her husband left her and bought BFC, LC and SC all at once. Now find me 5 people like that and you can make it at Liberty League, it's that simple.
So I got to thinking about the owners of Liberty League, if they have 15000 people making the phone calls that Caryn talked about in another posting, then it would be possible to maintain the Liberty League interprise with as little as 3 to 5% retention in the phone force. Even with such a small percentage of increase, none the less, it's still an increase. In the mean time you may be one of the honest few that are having a problem with your consience and want to help people instead of hurt them. This is why you have to get use to hanging up on people and moving on to the next. Numbers numbers, numbers, pump the numbers. For those of you that were led in believe in the LLI story but were turned off with the person that you were talking to as they didn't want to answer your specific questions, that's because it is written in the script to do that. If you are new to LLI in the Script you tell the lead that you are calling that there is no selling, explaining or telling, but the lead still may have questions and want to know a few things before getting started. You push them to the 20 min. conference call that is starting soon and the questions can be answered their.
True, if you still have questions, call this person back that talked to you and ask to speak with their Liberty Advisor or Summit Advisor. They will be more than happy to answer your questions. When you first start calling the prospect leads that you've spent so much money and time into getting you still are supposed to just let them go if they ask to many questions. I don't see how you can keep doing business that way unless you are the Owners and only are looking for the select few that I talked about earilier. Enough said...

As far as the BFC, I found that it is a very powerfull personal development course (PDC) and is unlike anything I've ever heard before. I've been listening to other PDCs for many years and felt that LLIs BFC is a combination of everything that I've heard all put into a very slick package. When you first get the package and look at it you are pretty disappointed, I paid $1495.00 for 3 cds, a DVD note book and pin? Still I really felt that it was worth $1495.00 after listening to it for the way in which the info was presented. There is a lot of power talks, life changing info in the package. The Super Saturday was the same, and I'm sure if I had made it to the LC and SC I'd be pumped up even more. I really struggled with the decision to leave as I really felt that LLI could have worked if it weren't for the fact that you need to put so much into it to get it going, but once and if you got it going it would be hard to stop and the people under you would be doing most of the weeding on the phones leaving you to mentor and train the newbies that came into your orginazation.
I was putting out 10000 emails a day, calling every chance I got, the problem is the quality of leads that you have are from people that filled out a survay to get a free toaster or some giveaway item to get them to fill it out. So the lead that you are getting isn't the quality that you are looking for. To get those kind of leads that you'd need would cost easly $500.00 to $1000.00 per lead or more (If you were a SA and you could make $13,000.00 off of a qualified lead, wouldn't you easly pay for it?)

I too have found something like Caryn that allows me to sleep at night, and am glad that my wife is with me on it. I will be eventually making as much with this new program as I would with LLI. I could've made it with LLI if I had the stomach and the callused heart to look people in the eye and tell them that they aren't doing enough if they haven't sold there car, home etc to get the money together to buy the tickets to the seminars.

Anyway I'm sure someone will take me to task over this as I see the bantering back and forth that goes on here. The only thing I can say before the bantering games begin is, it is my story, and this is what happened to me.

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#55 Consumer Comment

Liberty League is now a grey area for me

AUTHOR: Cam - (Canada)

I was about ready to jump on board with Liberty League, but now thanks to this website I will save my money, and yes I am one of those already in debt and Liberty League would have exposed me and put me further in debt.

A company with "morals" I think not. I am wondering if all the positive feedback for Liberty League aren't fictional characters, or just one person posting several postings making all the names and locations up.

Pretty intelligent individual whoever you are, but we are on to you. I remember another corrupt company out of Scottdale, Arizonal, CP Direct, selling longitude, and they were sued and lost heavy !!

I am wondering if this is the same people re-surfacing. Not gonna purchase Beyond Freedom anymore, thanx everyone. Lin I would like to talk to you. Did you actually purchase the program or consider it ?
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#56 Consumer Comment

Email from Ex- Liberty leaguer

AUTHOR: Lin - (U.S.A.)

LLI'ers or LL Liars?

1. I know for fact that the so called live conference calls, are recorded ( if they weren't I'd be there speaking my mind, you can count on that)

2. I know for fact (because they have admitted to us on the phone) that people out there right now advertising that they have made over 100,000 a month with LLI, have not made a dime.

3. I know for fact that the reason the LLI numbers seems to stay stagnant (no growth) is that the rate of failure to success is about 98% failure to 2% success. I also know that most of the people within that elite and apparently conscience free group, sickens me every time I see their names or faces. No, I'm not a sore loser as we are very successful currently with a different and legitimate business. I'm disgusted because I talk to people every day who are bullied into thinking that somehow they are stupid for not getting a second mortgage on their house to come up with the 12,000 summit ticket.

4. I know that the training calls once you get involved "teach" you (you may in fact already believe in these tactics, in which case good for you and bad for those you pray on)to deceive people into thinking you are a millionaire. There is a difference between the idea of "living as if you are successful and therefore you will become successful) This doesn't mean you lie to people or misrepresent a set of realities in order to get them believe an opportunity is better and more of a sure thing than it is.

5. I know that we were "guaranteed" while on our 3-way before joining that if we did everything they told us, WE COULD NOT FAIL. The simple fact they guranteed us anything makes it illegal.

6. I know that a friend of mine wrote to her sponsor in regard to some of her thoughts and concerns and he wrote back and I quote "Other people's success or falure is of no consequence to myself" Nice guy.

7. I know that we prospected over 300 leads while involved with LLI and did not get a single person on board, on the otherhand with our new business we talk to maybe 5 people a day and get 1-2 of them on board. That should tell you something about the difference in opportunities as I can assure you we did not undergo some miraculous transformation that improved our ability to talk to people effectively.

I could continue and believe me I will at a later time but for now I'm going to let the LL Liars, if they dare, waste their time trying to convince you that what I've told you is not true. I'm always very amazed at how much time they spend here trying to squelch the voices of the people who know the truth. The time I spend here is for anyone about to spend their hard earned money on something that will send them into a deeper hole than one they might already be in. In summation, Liberty League and it's Liars disgust me! I would happy to talk to anyone on this topic.
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#57 Consumer Comment

Product information is well-hidden, but it's there.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Call me dense (it wouldn't be the first time!), but I would expect that product information would be under a link called, oh, I don't know, 'Products', or maybe 'What We Sell' or perhaps 'Product Information'. Actually it's under the 'What we do' link, where we find that this business is 'Inspiring', 'Paradigm-changing', and 'Life-changing'.

There are three products. The flagship product is a 90-day multimedia 'Personal Development' program (think CD's and a workbook here) that retails for $1495. Sell one of these and keep $1000; LLI gets the other $495.

Please note that you don't get ANY of the profit until you sell FIVE of these. Your 'Advisor' (the person who signed you up), takes all the profit until YOU have made the fifth sale. There is a catch. If you actually 'buy-in' and purchase the product, then each sale you make will be added to your Advisor's sales until five sales are made. Congratulations! You are now an Advisor and will start raking in the profits with each sale you make.

All three products are based on this premise of buying-in and then making four sales to get Advisor status.

The second and third products are high-ticket items that amount to nothing more than VERY expensive vacations, and are sold in the same fashion as the Beyond Freedom course.

The Liberty Conference is a week-long jaunt to a resort for what appears to be a week of hard partying with the 'beautiful people'(watch the video) and retails for $7995, $5000 of which is your profit. Prior 'conferences' were in Cancun and Oahu.

The Summit Conference is like the 'Liberty' except the location (and the price) is more exotic. This sucker retails for $12995 and if you sell one of these you keep $8000 in profit. The last two Summit Conferences were at Athens, Greece and Fiji.

I can get a book or a CD at a bookstore that is the equivalent of the Beyond Freedom course for about $20.00; I travel extensively for my business and can get the same vacations for 20-30% of these prices.

I can imagine that if LLI was conducting business in the real world, they would rapidly become bankrupt. The products are nowhere near competitive with real-world economy. There is just no market for this stuff at these prices.
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#58 Consumer Comment

No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

AUTHOR: Juliet - (U.S.A.)

I've been very interested in what Liberty League has to offer due to this report so I did look up the Liberty League website. I had no problem finding out they offer a program (for $1500!) and some conferences. I just clicked on the tab that indicated "purchase", filled in the info, and voila! there were the items they offer. Sure, I had to give name, address, etc., but big deal. I don't answer any phone calls where I don't recognize the caller I.D. incoming #; if they send me junk email, I think I can handle deleting it, or blocking it if they send 100s per day. It may be a ripoff, or it may not be, I can't say, but navigating the website was certainly clear and easy.
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#59 Consumer Comment

No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

AUTHOR: Juliet - (U.S.A.)

I've been very interested in what Liberty League has to offer due to this report so I did look up the Liberty League website. I had no problem finding out they offer a program (for $1500!) and some conferences. I just clicked on the tab that indicated "purchase", filled in the info, and voila! there were the items they offer. Sure, I had to give name, address, etc., but big deal. I don't answer any phone calls where I don't recognize the caller I.D. incoming #; if they send me junk email, I think I can handle deleting it, or blocking it if they send 100s per day. It may be a ripoff, or it may not be, I can't say, but navigating the website was certainly clear and easy.
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#60 Consumer Comment

No problem finding out what Liberty League sells

AUTHOR: Juliet - (U.S.A.)

I've been very interested in what Liberty League has to offer due to this report so I did look up the Liberty League website. I had no problem finding out they offer a program (for $1500!) and some conferences. I just clicked on the tab that indicated "purchase", filled in the info, and voila! there were the items they offer. Sure, I had to give name, address, etc., but big deal. I don't answer any phone calls where I don't recognize the caller I.D. incoming #; if they send me junk email, I think I can handle deleting it, or blocking it if they send 100s per day. It may be a ripoff, or it may not be, I can't say, but navigating the website was certainly clear and easy.
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#61 Consumer Comment

Do you guys have eyes?

AUTHOR: Tony - (U.S.A.)

Vic said, "I checked the LLI web site and there is NO INFORMATION about the product(s) it sells there...Why not brag about what they're selling?"

REPLY: Are you guys quite sure you're going to the right website?? Let me help you out.

The corporate site is at http://www.libertyleague.com/start. At the top of the page is a clearly-marked heading that says "WHAT WE DO". Once clicking this, you have four sub-options, THREE OF WHICH are completely devoted to the company's products.

Additionally, there's more than TWO HOURS OF STREAMING VIDEO ON THAT SITE that gives information on the company, the product and the opportunity.

Seriously. Several here have claimed that they can't find any information on product but they're evidently not looking in the right place. The broad strokes are there and, like any serious consumer, anyone interested in a closer look will contact a representative and request more info.

It's not rocket science, guys. :)
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#62 Consumer Comment

Liberty League's mystery business

AUTHOR: Vic - (U.S.A.)

After past experiences with Amway and JewelWay (a failed startup by a group of former Amway-ers that sold counterfeit and misrepresented jewelery-I know, I still have it), I can say the FIRST sign of a business to be wary of is the total lack of information about 'the deal' unless you attend a meeting or make contact with someone in the business.

I checked the LLI web site and there is NO INFORMATION about the product(s) it sells there. I've never heard of them outside of my research this week. People I've spoken to have no idea what LLI sells.

At least with Amway, you know what you're getting. Being sneaky always means they're hiding something.

Why not brag about what they're selling? Implying that you need to have the cojones to succeed in their business is classic, bald-faced bullying, plain and simple.

When LLI 'comes out of the closet', they'll become worthy of the interest of honest people. They can stay in their exclusive club. What a corny, old school sales pitch. Too bad I had to be victimized twice before I could see through that nonsense.
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#63 Consumer Comment

What they sell is clearly presented....

AUTHOR: Tony - (U.S.A.)

If I may, here are some clarifications that will hopefully assist Richard:

Richard said, "I have been trying to get information about this company. . . I cannot say anything that would be a negative or derogatory remark about this company because they never get around to to telling you what they sell."

REPLY: I'm genuinely confused at how someone could review any information about Liberty League and not know what the products are. Nearly the entire website (http://www.libertyleague.com/start) is product driven and the guest presentations explain the business opportunity in a way that's clearly tied to the sale of products to the end consumer.

The products are these: The Beyond Freedom Home Study Course (a 90-day multimedia personal development course), the Liberty Conference (a 4-day all-inclusive event for two) and the Summit Conference (a 5-day all inclusive event for two). Obviously I won't presume to detail each one here but these products are clearly described on the corporate website as well as their guest presentations.

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Richard said, ""I SUSPECT THIS COMPANY IS BASED UPON A MUTLI-LEVEL-MARKETING MODEL AND THE PEOPLE AT THE TOP OF THE TRIANGLE GET ALL OR MOST OF THE PROFIT."

REPLY: Actually, the opposite is true. In an MLM (as you describe) the profits are shared by people in the "upline". Liberty League is a direct sales company and only ONE person earns money when a sale is made: the Advisor who makes the sale.

In other words, if the person you were speaking to was a qualified Advisor, he/she would be the only one to earn money if you choose to buy the product.

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Richard said, "I would advise anyone whom is considering putting up money to proceed with caution. ONE SHOULD NOT OR OUGHT NOT HAVE TO PUT MONEY UP FRONT AS A PRIVILEGE TO RECEIVE LEADS OR SELL A COMPANY'S PRODUCT. PLAIN AND SIMPLE COMMEN SENSE WILL DEMANDS ATTENTION TO THIS VERY BASIC RULE OF THUMB."

REPLY: Richard, respectfully, this is the mindset of an employee, not a merchant. If Liberty League was a company who was offering a "job" to you, then you'd be correct.

But, this is not a "work at home job". Liberty League is about owning your own business. It's about engaging in free enterprise. And if you know of any business owner who earns a six-figure income and has never had to spend money, I'd be interested in seeing it. (So would Ripley's Believe-It-Or-Not.) All legitimate businesses have overhead and marketing expenses. Why wouild you assume Liberty League would be any different?

I hope that assists you,
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#64 Consumer Suggestion

I STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT HEY SELL !!!

AUTHOR: Richard - (U.S.A.)

I have been trying to get information about this company. I have received phone calls from Matt Thomas in North Carolina. I cannot say anything that would be a negative or derogatory remark about this company because they never get around to to telling you what they sell. They seem to focus on making money and will ask you "how much money do you need per month to live like you want ?" Well I have to tell everyone out there that earning money is a good thing, money isn't everything though. I SUSPECT THIS COMPANY IS BASED UPON A MUTLI-LEVEL-MARKETING MODEL AND THE PEOPLE AT THE TOP OF THE TRIANGLE GET ALL OR MOST OF THE PROFIT.

MATT IN PENNSYLVANIA SEEMS TO HAVE A GRASP OF THE SITUATION, BUT HE IS INVESTED INTO THIS COMPANY AND FROM WHAT HE SAYS HE "GAVE IT HIS ALL." I am a teacher, I have a Master's in Education. I am at a crossroads in my life and was simply looking for another opportunity. I would advise anyone whom is considering putting up money to proceed with caution. ONE SHOULD NOT OR OUGHT NOT HAVE TO PUT MONEY UP FRONT AS A PRIVILEGE TO RECEIVE LEADS OR SELL A COMPANY'S PRODUCT. PLAIN AND SIMPLE COMMEN SENSE WILL DEMANDS ATTENTION TO THIS VERY BASIC RULE OF THUMB.

Sincerely Best Regards to all.
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#65 Consumer Comment

Comments from an Outsider

AUTHOR: Tracy - (U.S.A.)

I listened to Liberty League's Business Presentation a week ago Sunday and while conducting my due diligence I ran across this site and couldn't help but post a couple of comments and ask a couple of questions, especially of Matt in Pennsylvania.

First of all, Matt, no where in your posts do I read that you actually USED the product you were attempting to sell. What's your opinion of the product? And based on the numbers you are throwing around, I have to assume that you purchased a Conference but no where do I see you address your experience at the Conference. I'd be interested in your opinion of both the Beyond Freedom Personal Development course as well as the Conferences.

After I listened to the Business Presentation the advisor called me back and then some other advisor answered my questions. I understand this is common practice as the company touts its no selling, telling or explaining policy. Which, so far, I have found to be pretty much true. The guy I've talked to hasn't strong-armed me or used any aggressive sales tactics. As far as you not being told you would have ongoing business expenses, did you ask and were given misinformation or did you simply not ask before you joined?

After initially reading your posts I did contact the advisor again (I'm considering two other direct sales companies at the moment)and asked about getting my money back should I join. He explained to me that I have the right to return the Beyond Freedom program after I've had 3 days to look it over. Did you ask for a refund and NOT receive it within that three day window? I also asked about refunds on the Conference ticket and was told up-front they are non-refundable. Can you expand on the grounds you're requesting a refund (i.e. was the Conference not up to your expectations or did it not take place?). Did they change the rules after you bought your ticket?

Respectfully, Matt, Liberty League is a direct sales organization. You make a sale. You get paid. But anyone with any kind of business sense knows you have to be able to stand behind your product. I mean, you can get fired at Budweiser for drinking a Coors beer. That's good ole American capitalism ... stand behind what you sell! I am hoping to gather some concrete information on your experience with the products and if the company is in violation of any represented policies or procedures in order to assist me in making a decision here. No offense, Matt, but I'd like to hear exactly how Liberty League ripped you off versus you simply voicing your frustrations in a public forum.
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#66 Consumer Comment

Classic MLM Scam

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

This is a textbook example of a recruitment-based MLM (pyramid). Hop on over to the Liberty League International website and see if you can find information, ANY information as to what the company offers, or what the company does. I'll save you the grief, you won't find anything other than oily-slick testimonial videos that expound the good life, freedom, life-changing moments, and various other dreck; all designed with the sole purpose of luring in the unwary sucker.

Just to 'buy in' to the program requires a significant frontload($$$)and you're going to 'pay to play'. You'll be 'selling' a product that doesn't have a market, and be encouraged to 'buy up' to the next level (and insuring that you'll go broker, quicker!).

I am absolutely, positively sure that the chances of profitable success with this scam is ZERO. It's an unlimited pyramid that is designed for failure.

I would encourage anyone who says they are successful with this to post their tax returns for the last couple of years so we may ALL see your financial accomplishments. My guess is there will be no takers.
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#67 Consumer Comment

Classic MLM Scam

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

This is a textbook example of a recruitment-based MLM (pyramid). Hop on over to the Liberty League International website and see if you can find information, ANY information as to what the company offers, or what the company does. I'll save you the grief, you won't find anything other than oily-slick testimonial videos that expound the good life, freedom, life-changing moments, and various other dreck; all designed with the sole purpose of luring in the unwary sucker.

Just to 'buy in' to the program requires a significant frontload($$$)and you're going to 'pay to play'. You'll be 'selling' a product that doesn't have a market, and be encouraged to 'buy up' to the next level (and insuring that you'll go broker, quicker!).

I am absolutely, positively sure that the chances of profitable success with this scam is ZERO. It's an unlimited pyramid that is designed for failure.

I would encourage anyone who says they are successful with this to post their tax returns for the last couple of years so we may ALL see your financial accomplishments. My guess is there will be no takers.
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#68 Consumer Comment

Classic MLM Scam

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

This is a textbook example of a recruitment-based MLM (pyramid). Hop on over to the Liberty League International website and see if you can find information, ANY information as to what the company offers, or what the company does. I'll save you the grief, you won't find anything other than oily-slick testimonial videos that expound the good life, freedom, life-changing moments, and various other dreck; all designed with the sole purpose of luring in the unwary sucker.

Just to 'buy in' to the program requires a significant frontload($$$)and you're going to 'pay to play'. You'll be 'selling' a product that doesn't have a market, and be encouraged to 'buy up' to the next level (and insuring that you'll go broker, quicker!).

I am absolutely, positively sure that the chances of profitable success with this scam is ZERO. It's an unlimited pyramid that is designed for failure.

I would encourage anyone who says they are successful with this to post their tax returns for the last couple of years so we may ALL see your financial accomplishments. My guess is there will be no takers.
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#69 Consumer Comment

Liberty League More Than You Think

AUTHOR: Rebecca - (U.S.A.)

I am willing to take my chances. After reading all the info on this site, as a LLI associate, I am more committed than ever. As a former CEO, an MBA and MS from an Ivy League school, I was ready to take my fate into my own hands. I have made some money and will make more, of that I have no doubt. I am also a partner in two restaurants, and following the logic that has been expounded on this site, I should have sued my banker for making a loan to get us started because he should have protected me from myself during our difficult years, two of which came after 9/11. We worked especially hard during that time, and had to borrow money to keep going, but never doubted it would eventually turn around. That is the heart of an entrepreneur.

It seems to me that the point of the debate over LLI centers around a concept which I - among others - am ready to forego. I was raised to work hard, for others, at their beck and call. To be a professional, to be educated. I am quite happy that I did as it made me a thinking person. But did it give me the opportunity for self-determination. No. I will neither extol the virtues of Liberty League nor discredit them. I will, however, extol the opportunity to reach beyond my former limits and discover -through Beyond Freedom and the conferences- a new way of approaching life. Is it worth $1495...a whole lot less than therapists and others who will tell us that they have the answer to our dilemnas. It is everyone's personal responsibility to decide for themselves. No one else makes us or breaks us. I have never felt a need to pressure anybody as I am fully aware that this is not for everybody. Will I make millions of dollars. I don't know. But I have the satisfaction of knowing that it is up to me, not - as Matt says - out of hard work. That is not the answer. It is up to me for the ability to do it. There are plenty of skeptics out there, and from the BBB to WAHM, they all want money to discredit others. When I was called by Mike Bromell, who is now marketing for IGI, he didn't want to tell me the benefits of his company, he just wanted to vent. At Liberty League, I have found an unusual breed of people, with a higher purpose in life, only part of which is making money. The people I work with, that I prospect, understand that as it is the base purpose of LLI. Do I understand why people are skeptics, of course. It is what we are conditioned to do. Does LLI make money from selling leads - yes - so what? They are in business. This is my business; I expect to make money and I will run my business holding the highest ideals - I make that clear to everyone I speak with. I believe that the majority of associates do as well. Is the personal mentoring true? Yes, whenever I need assistance, it's there. Is it get rich quick? No. Nor is it the lotto. But it's legit. It raises the standard.

And Matt, you stated that there was a class action suit against Liberty League and never did answer the inquiry regarding the details of that. If you cannot, I propose that you withdraw the statement, as that would be a measure of your integrity. My observation would be that you were in it ONLY for the money rather than any sincere desire for personal growth.
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#70 Consumer Comment

You Say You Tried?

AUTHOR: Larry - (U.S.A.)

Matt, you say you tried. By the very definition, trying has no place in running a business. You will never find an owner of a McDonalds or any other franchise say they spent their money and gave it a try. You get in business to DO! If not, you are waisting your time.

This then is not the companies problem, but your very own. I too have been working LLI for about 6 months, and have only sold one. Now I'm not gonna tell you I have worked 7 days a week, because I have not.

I have another business, and along with life itself, I have had several weeks in this period where I have done very little.

What I have discovered is in going to Cancun, MX and Dallas, Texas with LLI, the people are real, the opportunity is the best I have ever sean (I'm 43 years old) very few have been overnight succeses, but the potential is there to make a boatload in a very short period when you understand some things, and "Truely" plug into the system.

As for what drives this business "Prospects" looking for a home business, I have found most are not seriously looking, but rather hunting for a hoby level commitment that may also bring in some money, or a lottery mentality that they will fall into the right thing and get rich. What has happened in LLI to generate this discussion, is what happens to ALL networking businesses, when momentum hits, you have people who get talked into or get emotionaly caught up, but do not ultimately have the desire to do the work.

LLI is not easy, but it is simple. If you can follow directions, and have the desire to succeed no matter what, (we call this being coachable and trainable), you will have great results here.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. If you do not get the results that successful folks are having, the first thing you should do is counsel with someone who is where you want to be in life, and do what they do, and keep counseling until you get it right.

I wish you well,
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#71 UPDATE Employee

Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Does anyone know what a pyramid is before they make claim to LLI being a pyramid scheme?

Here is a link? http://www.tommcmahon.net/2004/10/corporate_hiera.html
Looks like a pyramid, right ?

How about an Executive Chain of Command model

1 President/CEO - 13 % shareholder stake
2 Sr.VPs - 7 % shareholder stake (split)
3 Executive managers - "" 4.5% (split)
4 Middle Managers - "" 2.3 % (split)
5 Supervisors - "" 1.1 % (split)
6 Frontline workers - "" .03 % stake (split)

Draw this on a piece of paper and, well, well, well. We have a pyramid model. The same model that every employed American is subjected to.

Every Business model wether it be executive, IT, and Sales, follows a pyramid structure. Does that make them bad, Maybe!

Is your stake at company profits and performance a mere .03 to 13%? Probably so.

However. Liberty League International provides a business model for its associates at a mind boggling 66% company stake which equals $1,000.00 commisions per sale. This is obviously a CEO's dream. Well unless your Bill Gates.

Before individuals claim LLI is a pyramid scheme of negative connotation (which we are not). You must reflect at your current situation and job.

Yes, you are in fact employed by some pyramid model.

Yes, you are undercompensated and feel that their is something better.

Yes, you are overworked, underpaid, and lack the flexibility to spend more time with your family

Yes, you despise the fact that your boss makes more than you, for less work, and recieves all the company performance bonuses.

Or you are possibly without a job, because your company executives decided to lay YOU off. To save their asses, to improve stock performance, and make shareholders happy (which inlude themselves).

Which leads me to say:
If your job is so good, there would be no need for LLI.

However LLI understands that there are individuals who are sick and tired of being sick and tired.

I can promise anyone that if LLI was selling it's product at only 9.99 no one would be complaining of it's so called "pyramid nature".
But because individuals are psychologically limited to it's start-up cost, they will.

These individuals will disclaim their incompetence or lack of ambition and responsibility with, "too expensive, must be a pyramid, this is a scam"

Funny how individuals who find this opportunity too expensive, own a 35K car, mortgaged a 350K home (interest only). Possibly own a plasma, or LCD TV. which retails between $2000-$15000, have 2 kids ready for college. Have no retirement plans. Oh, and are in debt to their eyeballs. But LLI, and the opportunity to become financially accountable and empowered is too expensive. Talk about priorities

The problem with America is that we have a "get rich quick for nothing" mindset. There is no such thing. Even with LLI, gumption, ambition, and hard work is required.

Yes, there are many individuals including myself commanding a 120K+ salary. What sets us apart from the pack is that we believe in an "Entrepreneurial Spirit", accountability to ourselves, and an unwithered mindset of "success", and make no excuses for ourselves.
In sum the characteristics of leaders.
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#72 UPDATE Employee

Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Does anyone know what a pyramid is before they make claim to LLI being a pyramid scheme?

Here is a link? http://www.tommcmahon.net/2004/10/corporate_hiera.html
Looks like a pyramid, right ?

How about an Executive Chain of Command model

1 President/CEO - 13 % shareholder stake
2 Sr.VPs - 7 % shareholder stake (split)
3 Executive managers - "" 4.5% (split)
4 Middle Managers - "" 2.3 % (split)
5 Supervisors - "" 1.1 % (split)
6 Frontline workers - "" .03 % stake (split)

Draw this on a piece of paper and, well, well, well. We have a pyramid model. The same model that every employed American is subjected to.

Every Business model wether it be executive, IT, and Sales, follows a pyramid structure. Does that make them bad, Maybe!

Is your stake at company profits and performance a mere .03 to 13%? Probably so.

However. Liberty League International provides a business model for its associates at a mind boggling 66% company stake which equals $1,000.00 commisions per sale. This is obviously a CEO's dream. Well unless your Bill Gates.

Before individuals claim LLI is a pyramid scheme of negative connotation (which we are not). You must reflect at your current situation and job.

Yes, you are in fact employed by some pyramid model.

Yes, you are undercompensated and feel that their is something better.

Yes, you are overworked, underpaid, and lack the flexibility to spend more time with your family

Yes, you despise the fact that your boss makes more than you, for less work, and recieves all the company performance bonuses.

Or you are possibly without a job, because your company executives decided to lay YOU off. To save their asses, to improve stock performance, and make shareholders happy (which inlude themselves).

Which leads me to say:
If your job is so good, there would be no need for LLI.

However LLI understands that there are individuals who are sick and tired of being sick and tired.

I can promise anyone that if LLI was selling it's product at only 9.99 no one would be complaining of it's so called "pyramid nature".
But because individuals are psychologically limited to it's start-up cost, they will.

These individuals will disclaim their incompetence or lack of ambition and responsibility with, "too expensive, must be a pyramid, this is a scam"

Funny how individuals who find this opportunity too expensive, own a 35K car, mortgaged a 350K home (interest only). Possibly own a plasma, or LCD TV. which retails between $2000-$15000, have 2 kids ready for college. Have no retirement plans. Oh, and are in debt to their eyeballs. But LLI, and the opportunity to become financially accountable and empowered is too expensive. Talk about priorities

The problem with America is that we have a "get rich quick for nothing" mindset. There is no such thing. Even with LLI, gumption, ambition, and hard work is required.

Yes, there are many individuals including myself commanding a 120K+ salary. What sets us apart from the pack is that we believe in an "Entrepreneurial Spirit", accountability to ourselves, and an unwithered mindset of "success", and make no excuses for ourselves.
In sum the characteristics of leaders.
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#73 UPDATE Employee

Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Does anyone know what a pyramid is before they make claim to LLI being a pyramid scheme?

Here is a link? http://www.tommcmahon.net/2004/10/corporate_hiera.html
Looks like a pyramid, right ?

How about an Executive Chain of Command model

1 President/CEO - 13 % shareholder stake
2 Sr.VPs - 7 % shareholder stake (split)
3 Executive managers - "" 4.5% (split)
4 Middle Managers - "" 2.3 % (split)
5 Supervisors - "" 1.1 % (split)
6 Frontline workers - "" .03 % stake (split)

Draw this on a piece of paper and, well, well, well. We have a pyramid model. The same model that every employed American is subjected to.

Every Business model wether it be executive, IT, and Sales, follows a pyramid structure. Does that make them bad, Maybe!

Is your stake at company profits and performance a mere .03 to 13%? Probably so.

However. Liberty League International provides a business model for its associates at a mind boggling 66% company stake which equals $1,000.00 commisions per sale. This is obviously a CEO's dream. Well unless your Bill Gates.

Before individuals claim LLI is a pyramid scheme of negative connotation (which we are not). You must reflect at your current situation and job.

Yes, you are in fact employed by some pyramid model.

Yes, you are undercompensated and feel that their is something better.

Yes, you are overworked, underpaid, and lack the flexibility to spend more time with your family

Yes, you despise the fact that your boss makes more than you, for less work, and recieves all the company performance bonuses.

Or you are possibly without a job, because your company executives decided to lay YOU off. To save their asses, to improve stock performance, and make shareholders happy (which inlude themselves).

Which leads me to say:
If your job is so good, there would be no need for LLI.

However LLI understands that there are individuals who are sick and tired of being sick and tired.

I can promise anyone that if LLI was selling it's product at only 9.99 no one would be complaining of it's so called "pyramid nature".
But because individuals are psychologically limited to it's start-up cost, they will.

These individuals will disclaim their incompetence or lack of ambition and responsibility with, "too expensive, must be a pyramid, this is a scam"

Funny how individuals who find this opportunity too expensive, own a 35K car, mortgaged a 350K home (interest only). Possibly own a plasma, or LCD TV. which retails between $2000-$15000, have 2 kids ready for college. Have no retirement plans. Oh, and are in debt to their eyeballs. But LLI, and the opportunity to become financially accountable and empowered is too expensive. Talk about priorities

The problem with America is that we have a "get rich quick for nothing" mindset. There is no such thing. Even with LLI, gumption, ambition, and hard work is required.

Yes, there are many individuals including myself commanding a 120K+ salary. What sets us apart from the pack is that we believe in an "Entrepreneurial Spirit", accountability to ourselves, and an unwithered mindset of "success", and make no excuses for ourselves.
In sum the characteristics of leaders.
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#74 UPDATE Employee

Do you guys really know a pyramid ?

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Does anyone know what a pyramid is before they make claim to LLI being a pyramid scheme?

Here is a link? http://www.tommcmahon.net/2004/10/corporate_hiera.html
Looks like a pyramid, right ?

How about an Executive Chain of Command model

1 President/CEO - 13 % shareholder stake
2 Sr.VPs - 7 % shareholder stake (split)
3 Executive managers - "" 4.5% (split)
4 Middle Managers - "" 2.3 % (split)
5 Supervisors - "" 1.1 % (split)
6 Frontline workers - "" .03 % stake (split)

Draw this on a piece of paper and, well, well, well. We have a pyramid model. The same model that every employed American is subjected to.

Every Business model wether it be executive, IT, and Sales, follows a pyramid structure. Does that make them bad, Maybe!

Is your stake at company profits and performance a mere .03 to 13%? Probably so.

However. Liberty League International provides a business model for its associates at a mind boggling 66% company stake which equals $1,000.00 commisions per sale. This is obviously a CEO's dream. Well unless your Bill Gates.

Before individuals claim LLI is a pyramid scheme of negative connotation (which we are not). You must reflect at your current situation and job.

Yes, you are in fact employed by some pyramid model.

Yes, you are undercompensated and feel that their is something better.

Yes, you are overworked, underpaid, and lack the flexibility to spend more time with your family

Yes, you despise the fact that your boss makes more than you, for less work, and recieves all the company performance bonuses.

Or you are possibly without a job, because your company executives decided to lay YOU off. To save their asses, to improve stock performance, and make shareholders happy (which inlude themselves).

Which leads me to say:
If your job is so good, there would be no need for LLI.

However LLI understands that there are individuals who are sick and tired of being sick and tired.

I can promise anyone that if LLI was selling it's product at only 9.99 no one would be complaining of it's so called "pyramid nature".
But because individuals are psychologically limited to it's start-up cost, they will.

These individuals will disclaim their incompetence or lack of ambition and responsibility with, "too expensive, must be a pyramid, this is a scam"

Funny how individuals who find this opportunity too expensive, own a 35K car, mortgaged a 350K home (interest only). Possibly own a plasma, or LCD TV. which retails between $2000-$15000, have 2 kids ready for college. Have no retirement plans. Oh, and are in debt to their eyeballs. But LLI, and the opportunity to become financially accountable and empowered is too expensive. Talk about priorities

The problem with America is that we have a "get rich quick for nothing" mindset. There is no such thing. Even with LLI, gumption, ambition, and hard work is required.

Yes, there are many individuals including myself commanding a 120K+ salary. What sets us apart from the pack is that we believe in an "Entrepreneurial Spirit", accountability to ourselves, and an unwithered mindset of "success", and make no excuses for ourselves.
In sum the characteristics of leaders.
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#75 Consumer Comment

First in Miami doesn't know what a pyramid is...

AUTHOR: Tony - (U.S.A.)

If someone is going to make an accusation, it's important that facts be stated accurately.

A "pyramid" or "pyramid scam" is a business where people are getting paid for something other than the sale of legitimate goods/services to the end consumer. For instance, if Liberty League associates were getting paid for enrolling, then, yes, that would be a violation of pyramid laws.

But, if you really attended a teleconference without preconceived ideas, then you would know that no one in Liberty League International earns money unless a sale is made.

The total signup cost for someone to become a distributor with LLI is $50. That's all. No one makes a dime on that enrollment and there are no other required purchases. Only if someone chooses to purchase a product does the enrolling sponsor get paid.

Perhaps it would be helpful if someone understood this basic defintion of legitimacy before they start claiming that a company is a "pyramid".

Also, as has already been mentioned, the other expenses are entirely at the discretion of the distributor. Most of them are expenses that any home-business entrepreneur should already have. For instance, most of us already have a good long distance plan and a 24-hour voicemail service. Whatever expenses an associate chooses to incur in the course of business are just that: his/her CHOICES.

Also -- and I hate to do this -- it should be noted that Gabriel is NOT an employee of Liberty League Internationa. I'm not sure why he labeled his response that way but I'm sure it wasn't intentional. He is an independent distributor of the company and neither his comments or opinions should be assessed as an "official" statement from the company. The only people authorized to speak for the company are its principals or their appointed representatives.

I hope that is of assistance,
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#76 Consumer Comment

Matt & Gabriel the entire thing is a pyramid scam

AUTHOR: First - (U.S.A.)

Matt,

Today I listend-in on their teleconference and quickly learned that the entire thing is a pyramid scam. By Gabriel's answers and his passion for trying to get his point accross and by his insistance on learning about your law suit, it is clear to me that he works for LLI or has some interest in the company other than in participating in a role similar to the one you made.

You are right. I read the thread of messages and did not see anywhere in the messages a single suggestion by you to recommend another scheme. Gabrie: You are so uptight about a potential competitor to your scheme that you see things where they are not.

I am a skeptic by nature and while I was attending the teleconference, I decided to research LLI prior to spending any more time listening to the multiple attempts to convince the listeners that they not only need to buy into the products and commit to the monthly expenses, but also to commit to spending money to go to "exotic" places in order to attend more "brain washing sessions".

Matt: I wish you luck in recovering your $, and Gabriel: Aren't there more honest ways to make a living now a days???

Concerned.
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#77 UPDATE Employee

Oh Matt, Matt I can see tension in your last posting

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

First off I can see tension in your last posting. Listen If you got a class action lawsuit please state your lawyer, jurisdiction, those involved and reason for suit. If you are going to sue someone for YOUR Failure, then I pitty your involvement here in Liberty League International as you deserve to fail.

By the way did you sue your College/University, because you couldn't find a job after you spent thousands on an education. I don't think so. Do you blame the bank for encouraging you to take out an interest only loan, and 5 years later find out you are going to default because the principal payment is beyond your means? Matt, they will spit at you.

In sum, an advisor presented an opportunity to you, never put a gun to your head or forced you to do anything. It was your decision to join. From the day you signed you commited Yourself, not to Liberty League but to Yourself. So I guess you should be suing Yourself.

Matt, understand you are pointing fingers. Leave that to office politics. It wasn't the company that failed, You Failed yourself. Also, you seem like a smart man who reads caption. You know "Results vary, you too can make more or less". Every Organization makes this claim including American Express Financial Advisers, to avoid liability and finger pointers like yourself.

You failed because, Your ambition I must assume was lackluster, Your inclination non-existent, and work-ethic sub-par.

Matt, I know exactly what happened. You treated this opportunity like a 49.99 infomercial. Get rich quick........for nothing. Matt if you sincerely worked 100 leads per week you should have made 12K a month as our hystorical conversion rate suggests 3% to 4% per 100 individuals will sign up.

Matt for every failure like yourself. We have about 10 winners.

Another thing where's the class action suit. Shouldn't your buddies in the suit be supporting you ? At least here on the Rip-Off Report just to shut me up. LOL they don't exist, its all bogus.

What Liberty League International stands for is empowerment, gumption, and a will to succeed. Matt, I have succeeded, yes it took 14 hours a day but guess what I made it work, I am not a finger pointer. I am fully accountable for my own decisions, ambitions and success. This is what Liberty League International teaches.

Matt time to stand up and take accountability for yourself. Think about it if you took out a business loan for your business and failed. Who do you take to court ? The Bank, your business or yourself? either way you still have a loan to pay-off

Matt, YOU need to stand trial. You need to face the judge yourself, and give a sincere testimony. Almost certainly the jury will find you guilty, on several counts of ignorance, negligence, and most importantly defamation of character.

Have a good one Matt. oh and good luck on life, you have so much to learn!
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#78 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Liberty League Follow-Up

AUTHOR: Matt - (U.S.A.)

Dear Gabriel,
Your latest post was very entertaining- thank you for a good chuckle. I am in awe of your claim that I am "promoting another opportunity". Show me where I said THAT and I will respect YOU! Never once have I mentioned another opportunity- only sharing the truth about my own experience with LLI - PERIOD! Is there a law against that? I think not.

It is obvious that we will go round and round on here endlessly, since you have an answer for everything (kinda like my 6 year old). I am glad you are so right and sorry I must be so ignorant. You keep it up and you will soon be headed for the Executive Marketing Council at LLI, you are so knowledgeable!

I'm sure Mr. Payne would be proud of you for asking me "why the heck I would buy leads from Extreme Leads"- LLI's lead company. If they are so bad, why does LLI endorse them so heavily? You mean they aren't being 100% honest when endorsing them?

Shocking! As for the class action law suit, are you a part of it? Then WHY would you know about it?? Don't flatter yourself Gabriel. I will not constantly justify myself or my experience to you any further on this forum. Good luck!
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#79 UPDATE Employee

Lets clean this up

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Matt,
by all means and respect to you, you are full of it. There is no way you can work 100 leads a weak for 6 months and not close their is a historical sales conversion rate of 2to 3% per 100 that means your should have made 8k to 12k a month just like myself. You know I have visited every forum out there and guess what your posting is so cliche, that you would really make some money getting the dialogue syndicated and copyrighted. Why are so many saying the exact same things almost as if they were copied and pasted.

Secondly Matt I would like to know why the heck would you by leads from the company. Every real LLI'er knows not to do it, and you DON'T HAVE to BUY AN 800#. This posses a credibility issue on your behalf. Secondly the BBB has only one blemish on it's report JUST ONE! not countless. Where are your facts comming from MATT other forums ?

MATT also as an LLI'er you should know what this blemish on the report is, im bringing you to the plate. If you get this right I leave you alone, if you don't well then it would further conrete my conclusion that you are a propogandist trying to shake up a company and brand in order to promote another opportunity. Matt Stop talking what you don't know, and finally what class action lawsuit are you talking about? there is none in the WORKS.
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#80 UPDATE Employee

Lets clean this up

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Matt,
by all means and respect to you, you are full of it. There is no way you can work 100 leads a weak for 6 months and not close their is a historical sales conversion rate of 2to 3% per 100 that means your should have made 8k to 12k a month just like myself. You know I have visited every forum out there and guess what your posting is so cliche, that you would really make some money getting the dialogue syndicated and copyrighted. Why are so many saying the exact same things almost as if they were copied and pasted.

Secondly Matt I would like to know why the heck would you by leads from the company. Every real LLI'er knows not to do it, and you DON'T HAVE to BUY AN 800#. This posses a credibility issue on your behalf. Secondly the BBB has only one blemish on it's report JUST ONE! not countless. Where are your facts comming from MATT other forums ?

MATT also as an LLI'er you should know what this blemish on the report is, im bringing you to the plate. If you get this right I leave you alone, if you don't well then it would further conrete my conclusion that you are a propogandist trying to shake up a company and brand in order to promote another opportunity. Matt Stop talking what you don't know, and finally what class action lawsuit are you talking about? there is none in the WORKS.
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#81 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Liberty League Follow-Up Rebuttal

AUTHOR: Matt - (U.S.A.)

I guess my original post was not entirely read by Gabriel- he repeats some of the same criticisms I already raised as if they are new i.e. the old "I didn't try" justification. Seven days a week for six months solid is not trying? Perhaps the business is not as "easy to follow" as it is presented. And realize also it is no coincidence that very many otherwise successful, intelligent business people are failing miserably at LLI. But the most common defense will always be that we just weren't committed enough, and that we didn't try hard enough. Even the Better Business Bureau lists LLI as a pyramid scheme, with a long pattern of complaints against them.
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#82 UPDATE Employee

Liberty League International. The Perspective You should have

AUTHOR: Gabriel - (U.S.A.)

Well I am not going to start my rebuttal with the cliche "Liberty League International is a great company".

What I really want to do is shed some light on the product, a consumer suggested that the "Beyond Freedom" product is overpriced. They suggested the cost to manufacture the product is a mere $20. What I also see is an accountability issue of pointing fingers and laying blame to product, team, and organization. They say I failed, they say the company failed me, They say I lost money and in debt. Well why ? Because you didn't try. I have countless affiliates who have made 15K a month I also have affiliates who never answer my calls when I call them. Will they eventually clamor and complain when they didnt make a red cent. Th truth is many have the 49.99 automated mentality, and the sad part is they carry that same mentality to a $1,500 product, no its not fully automated and it won't sell itself. Point in sum is if you put a sincere effort you will make money. Thats period.

Well here is my case as a graduate from an Ivy League College with an MBA and the top 25 in the class. I was sure headed down the road to success, great JOB, nice home, nice car, etc. Right ? Wrong, I paid in excess of 160K dollars for an education that limited class instruction to power point slides, and tons of BS projects. Worth the price tag? NO WAY, you see I am one to value an education, but what good is an education if it cannot empower you. I learned very fast that my education was meant to empower someone else. First being my professors whom financially benefited from my attendance, secondly I empowered my employer by providing my talents and services and providing millions of dollars in production. This is not even to mention that I demeaned myself through the act of the so called "INTERVIEW". You know, the part where you act not like yourself and over compensate your character for the sake of landing that dream job. Most flattering to the employer. They know you want the job, they know you possibly may need the job, and they boast at how there were 1,000 candidates whom applied and you my freind are lucky enough to be in their presence.

This my freind is the institutionalized America. Designed to create empowerless individuals. designed to set us up with inopportunity, lack luster employers, insufficient retirement funds. In contrast it is designed to benefit the Corporate institutions, Why? Well it's these companies that fuel a GLOBAL ECONOMY, Keep America in CONTENTION as a rich and wealthy super-power. But how many of us are rich? say about 6%.

In sum if anyone likes to join the game of pointing fingers, and blaming others, stick to office politics. We have no room for you here at Liberty League International. Go back to work and talk about how screwed your boss is, not giving you a raise, vacation, time and an awful AMOUNT OF WORK. Amazes me what people would do for $12 an hour. Yet, it amazes me more what people won't do to take their financial futures in their own hands.

We want individuals who will take responsibility for themselves, Who know the scandalous infrastructure of today's America, designed to keep some rich some poor but most middle-class of which our countries financial statements depend on mostly.

So if Liberty League is a scam, than America is the chairman of "CONS R' US"

Empower yourself not anyone else. God bless !
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