• Report: #560786

Complaint Review: National City Bank - PNC Bank

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  • Submitted: Wed, January 27, 2010
  • Updated: Fri, September 17, 2010

  • Reported By: riannicole81 — Fishers Indiana United States of America
National City Bank - PNC Bank
Internet United States of America

National City Bank - PNC Bank Unfair Charges and Won't Refund Them, Internet

*UPDATE Employee: Dispute this charge! And the fees!

*Consumer Comment: I already know the answer to this

*UPDATE Employee: Why this charged was approved

*Author of original report: Clear Up

*Consumer Comment: Why?

*Consumer Comment: It's clear

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National City Bank is ripping people off even when its not the customers fault. This all started the other day when I called to cancel a subscritption with Best Buy for $42.79. I got the autherzation number from the guy on the phone as well as an email stating they canceled it.

I knew I didn't have the money in my account which is why I canceled the service with Best Buy to begin with and what happens the next day my account is overdrawn. I then sent them an email telling them that the charge should not go through I canceled it with Best Buy.

The response from them.... We can't do anything until the charge posts. So how do you charge two overdraft fees at $36 before a charge post yet you can't take care of the charge before it post. This doesn't make sense to me. Second I don't understand how National City would let this go through on my account when I didn't have enough to cover it. If I go use my card somewhere it would have declined me. So why not decline the $42.79 from Best Buy. Problem Solved.

Nope not even close.

The following day I get another overdraft fee. My paycheck gets direct deposited every Friday. This all started on Wednesday. So now I have 3 overdraft fees at $36 on my account.... all of which is not my fault.

I emailed National City again about this problem. They said they would look into and get back to me.

Come Friday my check post to my account and I have a positive balance again. And the charge for $42.79 is no longer pending but is not posted either. I thought well they must have solved that problem but what about the overdraft fees.

Wrong again. Come Monday the charge for $42.79 was posted to my account. Again I canceled this service and I notified my bank while it was pending. I emailed them again. The response I get back is to contact Best Buy and they need to give me a letter stating that it was Best Buy's error before they will refund any fees to me.

Keep in mind I have an authorization number that I canceled this service and I told my bank about this. I'm not asking the bank to refund the $42.79 I'm asking them to refund the 3 overdraft fees at $36 each... totaling almost $100. I understand that Best Buy is responisble for the $42.79 but its not their problem or fault that the bank 1. let the charge go through to cause the overdraft fees and 2. they can't refund the fees to me. 3. I have an authorization number which I gave to National City as well. They can take the time to call Best Buy and find out if it was canceled or not.

Because of National City doing this I could not buy groceries or put gas in my car this week.

And all the person at National City could tell me is they are sorry but they only refund fees that are in the bank error. I call this a bank error. It wasnt my error.

I did get the address to Coporate Office which I am going to be sending a letter to as well. If there is anyone else I can send a letter to please let me know. This problem needs to be brought to attention to someone. I have no choice but to live pay check to pay check and I count on every dime I make. If this was my fault I would take responsibility for it. But I didn't send the charge through on my account when I didn't have the money. I took all the steps I could take to prevent the overdraft fees.

Yet still nothing from National City. I also don't understand, which I have noticed a few times with my bank, is right before some charges post to my account they dissapear the day before. So if I check my account on the phone it looks like I have more in my account than I actually do. Its like they are doing that on purpose so you will overdraw your accout to get money from you.

Someone needs to stop these Banks from doing this. Please let me know who else I can contact about this problem.



This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 01/27/2010 01:22 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/National-City-Bank-PNC-Bank/internet/National-City-Bank-PNC-Bank-Unfair-Charges-and-Wont-Refund-Them-Internet-560786. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
1Author 5Consumer 0Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 UPDATE Employee

Dispute this charge! And the fees!

AUTHOR: Kayo - (United States of America)

What I don't understand is why you don't file a dispute for the charge from Best Buy and the fees assessed?  As much as the error was not on your end, it was also not on the banks end; with that PNC is not responsible to reverse the fees.  The fault is at Best Buy's end.  Either they can refund you the charge and the fees or you dispute it with the bank as canceled/revoke authorization.  I'm surprise you were not given this option.

Also, as soon as a transaction is pending on your account, it is affecting you available balance to pay items that are posting that day.  For example, you begin the today (9/17) with $200 in your account, excluding any pending credits or debits (called your ledger balance).  The total amount of transactions pending on your account is $50; (transaction that are authorize, but not posting for this today business) .  The total amount  available to pay posting transactions this same business day is $150.  Posting transactions on 9/17  include 1 transaction for $100, 7 transaction for $10.  The total amount posting that day is now $170.  You account is -$20.

You will receive 2 overdraft fees for 2 of those $10 transactions (posting occurs largest item to smallest item).  The $50 transactions pending may not post for another 3-5 days, but it effects your account balance the business day the bank receives it.  If a deposit of $20 was made on 9/17, it would have protected the account from fees. But posting in the negative available balance causes overdraft fees. 

The confusing part though is if you look at your online banking the morning of 9/18 it will state your ledger balance is +$30 while your available balance is -$20.  Why is that you say?  Remember, the ledger balance is your beginning balance of the day, excluding pending transactions; the $50 transaction is still pending.  When you look at your account mid-day on 9/18, you will then see the 2 ovd fees bring your balance to $-92 (36x2 +20).  Overdraft and NSF fees are assessed the next business day after your account overdraws, around 3pm EST. 

I know it sounds difficult, but the main thing is just making sure that funds are available for all your transactions. Even if transactions fall off your account, because you know you have deducted it from your available running balance, it doesn't matter when they put it through.  Only way to avoid fees.  And if there is a transaction you don't recognize or did not authorize, let us know.  We can dispute it.

But you must also know that the responsibility of the account is the account holder's.
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#2 Consumer Comment

I already know the answer to this

AUTHOR: I am the law - (USA)

I don't know why I'm even asking, because I already know the answer, but why didn't you bother putting overdraft protection on your account for these types of situations?

 

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#3 UPDATE Employee

Why this charged was approved

AUTHOR: jperry - (United States of America)

When using your Visa Check card for a reoccurring charge such as a subscription, the company receives an authorization code the first time it charges the fee and from then on the same code is reused.  Due to the fact that this is a Visa purchase we can not deny a charge that has an authorization code.  Therefore the bank would have to pay the item. 

Where I do agree with this customer is that the bank should have filed a dispute once the charge posted to the account and this could have resolved both the amount and any fees associated with it.

As to why the charges disappear, the holds only remain on the account for 3 days which is usually sufficient time for the merchant to submit for payment (Now it is 5 days with the changeover to PNC).  After the 3 days the pending hold is removed, but the merchant can still submit the payment at a later date.
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#4 Author of original report

Clear Up

AUTHOR: riannicole81 - (United States of America)

I do keep track of everything I spend. That is not the issue. I knew ahead of time canceled the service before it should have even posted to my account.

National City could have stopped it before it went this far. They could have denied the charge.

I contacted Best Buy. They of course have already put in to refund the $42.79. But they agree with me ... why did National City let the charge go through.

So my complaint is that I should not have gotten 3 overdraft fees. I took steps to try and stop this. I even contacted National City when it was pending and after it posted.

I really got no answers to any of my questions.

So no its not my fault this happened. I did know how much was in my account. I canceled the service. The rest is not my fault.

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#5 Consumer Comment

Why?

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

Why are you not going after Best Buy for the fees that THEY caused.  After all you CANCELLED the debit and have a confirmation and they did it anyways.  If BEST BUY didn't submit the debit you would not have overdrawn(or at least that is what you are inferring).


Yes in the past banks would refund fees in the cases of merchant errors.  However, for every true merchant error there were people who were just gaming the system trying to get fees reversed that were not errors.  So as a result the banks have gone to the stance that unless they caused the error they will not refund any fees.  However, in this case it appears that at some point they may even would have been willing to still refund the fees if you can provide a letter from Best Buy stating they messed up.  The reason they will not accept the e-mail is because there is no way that they can guarantee that the debit that hapened relates to the e-mail.  For all they know you could have had another debit that actually was cancelled and they didn't attempt to debit the other one.  Is this inconvenient yes..and perhaps Best Buy should also compensate you for this inconvenience as well.


Now, just another comment is that you appear to be relying on on-line banking to manage your account.  Because of the nature of how transactions are processed on-line banking was never meant to replace an actual written register.  It is not uncommon for transactions to "disappear" and then "reappear", does that happen all of the time..no, but it can happen.  This is just the nature of holds and how transactions are processed and not some huge conspiracy.  So when you make a transaction you need to write it down as that will be the most accurate way to keep track of your transactions.

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#6 Consumer Comment

It's clear

AUTHOR: Resty - (U.S.A.)

in your own words in this report  you stated " So if I check my account on the phone it looks like I have more in my account than I actually do".........


Now IF you had been using a check register and keeping it uptodate you would already have subtracted what was spent and had an accurate current balance.  You cannot "use" money that is in the account......not keep track of it in hard copy form....and then spend it again because.....as you said " if I check my account on the phone it looks like I have more in my account than I actually do" If you hadnt spent .....or attempted to spend the money at the very beginning when it wasnt there.....there would have been nothing to stop in the first place and the confusion from then on wouldnt have happened so it really isnt the banks fault
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