• Report: #611472

Complaint Review: PAYPAL

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  • Submitted: Tue, June 08, 2010
  • Updated: Fri, June 11, 2010

  • Reported By: Charles — FRANKLIN PARK Illinois U.S.A.
PAYPAL
2211 North First Street SAN JOSE, California United States of America

PAYPAL PayPal Inc. (PAYPAL2-DOM) PAYPAL CAN'T MAKE CHANGES TO THERE SYSTEM WHICH IS COSTING ME OVERDRAFT AND COLLECTION FEE! SAN JOSE, California

*Consumer Comment: No, it doesn't really matter...

*Consumer Comment: Not that it really matters

*Consumer Comment: opps..

*Consumer Comment: Thanks for the corrections robert...

*Consumer Comment: Don't worry..

*Consumer Comment: or...

*Consumer Comment: No, my calculations are dead on balls accurate

*Author of original report: I'm a great listener and when people go way off track what they talk about....well need I say more.

*Author of original report: Paypal Setting

*Consumer Comment: Paypal complaints...

*Consumer Comment: Starting at the beginning...

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I open up a new bank account at a different bank and make sure all is good a few days later.


I goto PAYPAL and changes all of my continued accounts and wait a few day and follow-up with PAYPAL that all is good and they do or say they do.


So I close out my TCF NATIONAL BANK account because they keep charging me fees shown in documentation they provide me. They say they shouldn't being doing this to begin with. Per TCF NATIONAL BANK any additional electronic payments will be payed then send to the collection agency for overdraft fees and collection fees. I just left with the completed paperwork at that point.


I find out later that PAYPAL is still trying to get payments not from the new bank account that was set up but the closed out bank account eventhough PAYPAL says "Oh sure all the future payments will taken out of the new bank." But like I said they aren't. PAYPAL emailed me a worthless letter to send to TCF BANK to waive overdraft fees etc. TCF stated they don't care.


Don't just take my word for it. Goto GOOGLE and type in PAYPAL COMPLAINTS. WOW!
Here is just a few links with many complaints about PAYPAL
(((ROR redacted)))


Need I say more?!


 

CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 06/08/2010 08:02 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/PAYPAL/SAN-JOSE-California-95131/PAYPAL-PayPal-Inc-PAYPAL2-DOM-PAYPAL-CANT-MAKE-CHANGES-TO-THERE-SYSTEM-WHICH-IS-COSTIN-611472. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
2Author 9Consumer 0Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

No, it doesn't really matter...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

Jezh, thank you for posting exactly what I did. But I guess when you posted it you didn't know I had already posted the exact same thing you stated.

It was essentially nothing more then a typo, as I explained you divide the numerator into the denominator as per 5th grade math. What I did was rebut Robert without realizing I had previously posted the formula wrong..which I simply reversed the numerator and denominator. But if my final solution was correct, obviously I initially did the MATH correctly, and in my rebut to Robert, it is clear that if I can figure out that 1/2 = .5...which x100 would equal 50%, that I can substitute what is the solution of x/y regardless of the numerical values.

However, we do not want to discredit this consumers report by diverting the topic to my typo. We need to look at the facts. The consumer claims a PayPal error on their part caused bank fees, and that if we google "PayPal complaints", that it is a "wow" and "need I say more".

I still stand that the chances are most likely even based on the preponderance of the evidence, that the poster was in err, and that PayPal statistically has near zero percent complaints. If anyone can copy and paste a SINGLE report where it is CONCLUSIVE that PayPal conducted any shenanigans with intent to compound fees for their personal profit (as the BANKS have CLEARLY been doing for several years now), I will lead the pack to find recourse for the victims.

Now regardless of my dyslexic typing, the numbers PROVE that statistically, PayPal has ZERO complaints percentage wise rounded to the nearest hundredth..but it is YET to be proven if PayPal was in err in this case,  and caused this poster to incur bank fees and failed to make good.

I stand, that PayPal will only bill to the account the customer tells them to, and that the system is fully electronic, and that there is no one at PayPal trying with intent to cause any bank fees to their loyal customers by billing closed out accounts.

I strongly believe the customer made an error and did not actually close out the account properly with PayPal, and PayPal emailed a letter to confirm this was simply an honest human error, and the bank CHOSE with INTENT, to fee this customer regardless, and tell this customer in so many words to shove the PayPal email up their arse.

Now if ANYONE can prove conclusively otherwise, I will gladly submit a redaction and tell this site I was a fool..otherwise, my observations of this report stand as stated.




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#2 Consumer Comment

Not that it really matters

AUTHOR: Jezh - (U.S.A.)

Not that it really matters Ronny but Robert has the correct formula.  Your explanation about x/y being x divided by y is correct but in this case the number of complaints should be x and the number of customers should be y as Robert indicated.  Your formula up above had number of customers as x and number of complaints as y giving a total of 53,915.  Just like you divide the 1 by 2 in your example you should divide 1558/84,000,000.

If paypal acknowledges that they are responsible for the mistake, they are the ones that are responsible for correcting it.


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#3 Consumer Comment

opps..

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

Although I did the math correctly,I did type the formula wrong in the report..I stand corrected with egg on my face.

However, the percentage of complaints vs. account holders is correct, somehow I had dyslexia when I typed it in the replies. But the point was to show statistically they don't have that many complaints, and the math proves it.

But to settle is the complaint against PayPal in this case is valid, it would be of help if we could see a copy of the letter PayPal gave the customer to submit to the bank, I think it would clear this up. I wonder if the letter is actually an admission that PayPal screwed up, or simply explaining that the customer did not remove the closed account in time.

If PayPal has admitted they messed up and caused the fees, I agree they are responsible.
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#4 Consumer Comment

Thanks for the corrections robert...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

but...your "corrections" are WRONG.

Lets start with your provoking me first to debunk that, then we will get to the math.


"Don't worry about the resident Paypal "defender".  You could have someone from Paypal come to your house, back up a moving van to your door, and remove all of your furniture.  They will still tell you that Paypal is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel."


Paypal has been fine for me, no problems here but if you actually READ the first reply I left, I advised the customer to file a Federal dispute form with the bank if PayPal made an error, or conducted and fraud and will not make good.

"Companies make mistakes and if a company makes a mistake the company should make it right.  Of course by the "defenders" logic it is totally acceptable for Ebay to make it right by writing you a letter to show your bank.  Intentional or not Ebay knows they made a mistake, after all they sent the OP a letter.  It is the mark of a true "defender" to say that is good enough."

This statement "assumes" the company made a mistake. Perhaps the customer made a mistake? And if so...PayPal did nothing wrong. So why not the bank help it's customer? What is PayPal supposed to do, pay the bank fees? It is the BANK that is charging these fees, not PayPal.


"Just a note on the "calcuation".  The result was correct but the formula is wrong.  If you run the numbers based on the formula they wrote you actually get 5,391,527%.  The formula should have been

(Number of Complaints/Number of Accounts) * 100 = Percentage of Complaints"


Wrong. When you write out the formula (which is a fraction) for example x/y, it is the same as saying x divided by y, NOT y divided by x, hence that is why if you did the math the way you explained it...you get 5,931,527%, not the way it is actually performed.


Want proof? Okay lets use simple numbers you may understand for example 1/2...okay, do the math..comes out to .5 my way, which is the same as 1/2..agree there Einstein? Try not to argue math with an electronics teacher. Or, do the math your way, and 1/2 would = 2. If you were my accountant I'd be in big trouble.



"But then again it doesn't really matter if the number of complaints is zero.  Ebay appears to have made a mistake in this case, and that mistake has cost the OP money."


"IF" this is the case, then my suggestion was the best. Dispute it with the BANK and they will reverse the charges if PayPal is found to have charged this in error. If this truly was PayPals mistake and they won't make good, then I do not defend them, I request a Federal dispute form E...solution.


Do I tend to defend PayPal?..yes. But only because I find almost every complaint against them to be false or exaggerated..and I have yet to read a report where PayPal has charged any fees using deception or non disclosure. I have not seen PayPal re-sequence transactions to cause additional fees, or auto enroll anyone into overdraft protection services to cause fees, such as our friend the bank has done.


As far as the billing issue here..guess it is possible PayPal can err. But it's not like some representative from PayPal was sitting by a computer and intentionally choosing to bill this customer using a closed account. What would be the point? It is ALL done electronically and the bill is charged to the account the CUSTOMER tells PayPal to use..it would be almost IMPOSSIBLE for them to bill an account if the customer removes it before the billing cycle..explain that one oh Robert who knows all.

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#5 Consumer Comment

Don't worry..

AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

Don't worry about the resident Paypal "defender".  You could have someone from Paypal come to your house, back up a moving van to your door, and remove all of your furniture.  They will still tell you that Paypal is the greatest thing since the invention of the wheel.


Companies make mistakes and if a company makes a mistake the company should make it right.  Of course by the "defenders" logic it is totally acceptable for Ebay to make it right by writing you a letter to show your bank.  Intentional or not Ebay knows they made a mistake, after all they sent the OP a letter.  It is the mark of a true "defender" to say that is good enough.


After all it was the bank that had the nerve to let Paypal to withdraw the funds so the bank needs to be held responsible.  By that logic I guess if someone accidently broke something they borrowed from you.  As long as they wrote you a letter they did what they should, and you need to take it up with the store to get it replaced.


Just a note on the "calcuation".  The result was correct but the formula is wrong.  If you run the numbers based on the formula they wrote you actually get 5,391,527%.  The formula should have been


(Number of Complaints/Number of Accounts) * 100 = Percentage of Complaints


But then again it doesn't really matter if the number of complaints is zero.  Ebay appears to have made a mistake in this case, and that mistake has cost the OP money.

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#6 Consumer Comment

or...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

(84000000/1558) x 100 = 0.00185476190%. is there another way I am missing?
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#7 Consumer Comment

No, my calculations are dead on balls accurate

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

84,000,000 (number of accounts)/1558(number of complaints)= 1.854761904 x 100=0.0018547619%.

If my calculations are "way off", argue it with whomever figured out the formula for determining percentages. I simply entered the numbers and it comes out the same no matter how many times I enter the same numbers.

It is okay to lodge a report here if a company ripped you off, but honestly in this case, I would take it up with your bank. They seem to be the ones not understanding that this may have been an honest mistake. PayPal gave you a letter to try to help you, your bank essentially told you to shove it up your you know what. So what do you expect Paypal to do really?
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#8 Author of original report

I'm a great listener and when people go way off track what they talk about....well need I say more.

AUTHOR: Charles - (U.S.A.)

LOL. Your calculations were way off but in moving forward.

I'm paying for a service that is in writing and accepted by both of us. They chose to take a different route that wasn't agreed upon. Also read my complaint again. I'm paying for someone elses screwup. Service not rendered but paying for the screwup at there end.

I will no longer response to this thread because I get to call paypal again. They claimed in an email to say everything is take care of. I followed through and no nothing has been done as promised by them.

In moving forward.

You have a great day.

Take care.

 

 

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#9 Author of original report

Paypal Setting

AUTHOR: Charles - (U.S.A.)

I'm very familiar with PayPal's settings.

Plus I had there customer service department who confirmed all setting were correct and knew what my goals are.

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#10 Consumer Comment

Paypal complaints...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

With more than 84 million active accounts, and 1558 reports lodged against them here..that brings the grand total of complaints against them to 0.0018547619%..or virtually zero if you round it off to the nearest hundredth. Wherever it was you suggested to link to was redacted by this website..but if you post the number of complaints, I will be glad to determine the percentage value for you.

Now, if PayPal in your case was displaying any INTENT to rip you off..it would not matter if you were the only customer to ever lodge a complaint, I would back you all the way. But I do not see according to your report where PayPal had any opportunity to profit off this situation.

Now I do not know your particular circumstance but I do know that PayPal does not profit off any fees your bank charges. All they do is charge the primary account you tell them to, and if the funds are not available, they then will charge the secondary account.

If PayPal did anything fraudulent or in error with which financially damaged you, request a federal form E from your bank to dispute the charges and the BANK must investigate and reverse any charges.. if fraud or merchant error is concluded.

Best of luck.


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#11 Consumer Comment

Starting at the beginning...

AUTHOR: Edgeman - (U.S.A.)

Let me ask a couple of questions. These are kind of obvious but the answers are required  before figuring out what happened in your case.

When you added the new bank account, did you designate it as the primary account and "save" your selection?

After you added the new account, did you remove the account at TCF bank?
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