• Report: #12666

Complaint Review: TOYOTA OF GLENDORA Mike Levine; Mack

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  • Submitted: Mon, January 28, 2002
  • Updated: Sat, November 20, 2004

  • Reported By:Chino Hills CA
TOYOTA OF GLENDORA Mike Levine; Mack
1949 AUTO CENTRE DRIVE GLENDORA, California U.S.A.

TOYOTA OF GLENDORA RIPOFF CALIFORNIA

*Consumer Comment: You still have not answered my question

*Consumer Suggestion: Dear, Dear Dorothy

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: You still don't understand

*Consumer Suggestion: Toyota of Glendora

*Consumer Comment: Left this out

*Consumer Comment: How many cars do you think i NEED

*Consumer Comment: Get A Grip, makes very little difference if you are on line 1 or 2? They are treated the same

*Consumer Suggestion: "We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

*Consumer Suggestion: "We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

*Consumer Comment: Going throught the same thing

*Consumer Suggestion: Richard Romero if you are the GM The First amendment that I posted for you

*Consumer Suggestion: Class Action ida

*Author of original report: Mr. Romero...You Just Incriminated Yourself

*Consumer Suggestion: I'm backing up Celestino

*Author of original report: Mr. Romero..you still miss the point!

*Consumer Comment: If only your fraud was as easy to see through as your clumsy attempt to manipulate the legal system

*Consumer Comment: Guess What...

*Consumer Comment: NICE THREAT RICHARD ..Toyota of Glendora mis lead this customer.

*Consumer Suggestion: Richard Romero You need a wake up call.

*UPDATE Employee: "We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

*Consumer Suggestion: Celestino L. Rivera, Jr My hate is off to you!

*Author of original report: Formal Rebuttal to Attorney's Threat

*Consumer Suggestion: Celestino L. Rivera, Jr please read this ..Car dealers across the country hate this web site because it exposes their deceptive ways!

*Consumer Suggestion: Don't Back Down !!!

*Author of original report: Toyota of Glendora Threatening to Sue Me

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THE GLENDORAS BOX

Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc October 26, 2001
Mail Drop H200
19001 S. Western Avenue
Torrance, CA 90509

RE: Celestino L. Rivera, Jr
Account Number 0206116596

This letter is to express our complete disgust and disappointment with the way the people at Toyota of Glendora have handled our purchase of a brand new 2002 Toyota Corolla, which was purchased on September 20, 2001. They intentionally deceived me with the deal which I consider a fraud.

I co-signed the purchase for my sister, Elma R. Ombao, and led to believe that that was the case. Having a Tier 1 rating of close to 800 points, we were told by Mike Levine and a certain Mack (Sales Manger), that my sister cannot get a loan with myself not co-signing the loan. I agreed to co-sign based on the statement Mack made that I will only be the co-signer. In fact, my sister and brotherin-law can testify to that. Upon receiving the first payment stub, it indicated that I am the primary account holder. I immediately called Toyota Financial Services to clarify the mistake but I was told that since I signed the first signature of the loan papers I am therefore the primary account holder for the loan. I HAVE BEEN FRAUDULENTLY LED TO BELIEVE OTHERWISE. We agreed to pay a higher price and a higher rate of 8% with the assumption that the loan was going to be under my sister's name and I would just be a co-signer. OTHERWISE, I WOULD HAVE NOT MADE A DEAL OR MADE A BETTER DEAL SINCE I HAVE A CLOSE TO 800 POINT RATING. I WAS EVEN TOLD THAT I COULD GET THE LOWER RATE OF 0.9% FROM TOYOTA AT THAT TIME IF IT WAS UNDER MY NAME. I know car salespeople are known to be vicious and liars BUT I TRUSTED THESE PEOPLE. I also called the Finance Department that processed the papers but was told he cannot help me with this problem and that he does not know what deal was made prior to financing. THIS IS A TOTAL DISAPPOINMENT FOR ME SINCE I HAVE DEALT WITH TOYOTA ON OTHER PURCHASES IN THE PAST.

I asked that you look into this matter before I take any other course of action with the Department of Motor Vehicle and Better Business Bureau in California. You can contact me at (909) 943-9119 Ext. 238 (daytime) & (909) 628-1441 (nightime)

Dissatisfied Customer,


Celestino L. Rivera, Jr
Chino Hills, CA 91709

CC: Toyota of Glendora

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 01/28/2002 12:00 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/TOYOTA-OF-GLENDORA-Mike-Levine-Mack/GLENDORA-California-91740/TOYOTA-OF-GLENDORA-RIPOFF-CALIFORNIA-12666. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

You still have not answered my question

AUTHOR: Dorothy - (U.S.A.)

Oh, I can tell you are a salesman....
But you have not answered my question? Why
didn't the salesman or loan officer just
tell me in plain english, lady you have to buy this car for him? He can not an will not be anywhere on the loan of this car, not even
on the title............. A red flag would have come up.. Again i would have left the dealership .
If this boy wasn't on the loan an not on the title,then how could he get insurance on it?
He does have his license back. No fault of his.
DMV'S fault... Mix up... Wrong person.......
I did as you ask an went to several dealers an guess what.... They said i was done wrong.....
They told me up front, we can't get this boy a loan, no way no how..... So see not all dealerships are BAD.......... This dealership an
a loan officer are working with me. The head man at this dealership is upset at the way
the loan officer handled this.... An has told me they will be more than willing to help me....
So at least they are trying an see i was done wrong.I just needed to talk to someone higher up.
They said they were sorry an assured me this was not the way it should have been handled....
For this they have earned my respect... I told them all i wanted was for the boys name to be on the title so he could get ins... I will deal with the car loan being in my name if i have to. I
am now looking to buy a Rumble Bee from them, only not the same loan officer.
I guees all i wanted was an answer an i got it.
The loan officer should have been up front an they admitted he wasn't...2 salesmen from this dealership i know very well... An before this
got out of hand even they said it was wrong for
the loan officer to trick me as he did. That's why this issue is being taken care of...
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#2 Consumer Suggestion

Dear, Dear Dorothy

AUTHOR: Don - (U.S.A.)

Firstly, I am a reputable car sales and leasing rep for a highly regarded high line dealership.
Secondly, I have nothing to do with Toyota.

The GM (whom everyone wants to gang up on) has given a "crystal clear" explanation and has documented his sources about the transaction that I guess Mr. Rivera is complaining about.

Patricia, your case is similar in the sense that you cosigned. But you are a "classic". You have the nerve to blame the dealer, yet you know that the person you co-signed for is a dead beat. He bounced a check; he's late on the payments. And you expect a lender to accept this individual without a co-signor. It was nice that you co-signed for him but you obviously have poor judgement. You apparently are blaming the dealer because he can't get insurance. Duh! Without a friggin license, you cannot get insurance. If he has a bad driving record, then he cannot get insurance either (at least not affordable insurance). By law, someone has to insure him. You stated that YOU had the vehicle insured but because this guy is such a bone head, even your own insurance agent said to take him off the policy. Don't blame this bone head or your poor judgement on the dealer. Listening to you, you new this all along and you were trying to dump him off on a dealer. Wrong! You are the perfect example my friend as to why the BANKS (note; I'm saying BANKS, not the dealer) require the co-signer on line 1 and the buyer on line 2. If the buyer on line 2 makes the payments on time, then everyone is happy. If not, then the BANKS (not the dealer) will come after the car (repo). FYI-
"repo" is about the worst thing you can have on your credit report.

Again, I am a salesman. I completely understand why a consumer feels that they were "tricked" by the way the sales contract is structured, with the co-signor on line 1. If it makes you feel any better, I would recommend that you go walk into a couple of dealers; ask to speak with either the desk manager or the finance manager if he's not busy; and just ask them, on a co-signor deal, who goes on line 1. The dealers do not set this procedure.

All of you angry people out there that are complaining about this procedure. Let me ask you, how many of you would lend $20,000 to a stranger? This is what you are asking a lender to do. Personally, I wouldn't lend my brother $20,000. Some people are financially fortunate and it is a very kind gesture for anyone to co-sign for another person. I personally treat both
the buyer and co-signor with the same respect because they are both buyers. If the deal is handled correctly (and I take exta time to explain this) then I get not (1) but (2) satisfied customers, hopefully giving me referrals. For us profession salesman, we depend on referrals and positive surveys.

My wife and I just bought a brand new vehicle for her a few weeks ago. We shopped a lot of different
"brands" since she didn't know what she wanted. There are a lot of J.O.'s out there. Ya know what I do when I get less than a warm fuzzy feeling from a sales person or a dealership. I pack up and go somewhere else. If I don't like you, I am not going to give you ($31,000 for my wifes vehicle)and let you make a profit on me. No, no, no...you will not get a paycheck from me.
See my RipOff Report, Tustin Ford and Power Automotive Group and you'll see what I did. At any time, you can get up and leave the dealership. If you sign the papers, then you agreed to the deal. Once you purchase the vehicle, you cannot change your mind or dealers would have brand new cars coming back like crazy, as "used" cars.

Recommendation: Shop around. Buy a vehicle from a salesman that you like and a dealership you can trust and know that they will be there when you need something. Personally, I would only buy from a family owned dealership. The Power/Automotive Group dealers I would suggest everyone stay away from.

Patricia: You have very poor judgement. Please, do not go car shopping alone again. Do not co-sign. In fact, my best recommendation to you is this: Get you hands on the car and you sell it for whatever you can get. Make arrangements with your lender and protect your good credit. I forget who this character is that you said your helping. Very bad decision on your part. Sorry!
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#3 REBUTTAL Individual responds

You still don't understand

AUTHOR: Dorothy - (U.S.A.)

I read your report. You still don't understand where i am coming from.How can i or this boy enjoy this car? As i said it has no insurance
on it for him to drive it. But he does make the payment, of course never on time...
Why was the dealership not up front with me?
All they had to say to me was , I needed to
buy this car, an that is not the same as being a co-signer...

Why would i buy a car just to let someone else drive it all the time... See, if
they had told me i needed to buy this car for
him.............

I would have been long gone...
I would have walked away an never looked back.

Also the boy gave them a check for the down
payment, it bounced, so they took me to court
because the downpayment was not paided. They
never went after him an i ask why.

They said altho he wrote the check an it was no good,they went after me because this boy has NOTHING to do with this car, so he could write them all the bad checks he wanted, an they still would come after me..

I ask why again, an they said This boy is no where on the loan or the title you bought the car. So my insurance company cancelled the ins on this car when they found out he was driving it all the time.He didn't tell me his license had been taken away months ago..He
was driving without one. All this has fallen on me because the dealership was not up front with me on this car....

When the loan officer said lets pretend you are buying this for your son, i should of realized they were up to no good. I told them he was not my son... So how can he drive
a car, he has gotten his license back now, without insurance on it???????????

He has to be on there somewhere in order to get insurance in his name..
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#4 Consumer Suggestion

Toyota of Glendora

AUTHOR: Don - (U.S.A.)

Wow...I cannot believe all of the pent up anger I'm hearing over this matter. Especially from those of us that were not there.

I am a licensed car sales and leasing rep for a very reputable high line dealership. I have nothing to do with this Toyota dealership or Toyota in any respect. I'm responding simply to try and calm some of you down.

In the car business, this "co-signing" deal is common and is the only way that a co-signor can be utilized. The dealer did not do anything wrong. This is certainly not a straw purchase. You got the car you wanted. I don't understand what you are trying to accomplish.

Here's how it works, the person with the best FICO score goes on line 1 and the other person that has the weak credit (that you are trying to help get established) goes on line 2. Assuming that the person on line 2 makes the payments on time, then "both" parties (line 1 and line 2) get
the credit on their credit report. I generally take a little extra time to explain this to the buyer(s) so that I don't end up with a situation like this. Even if the deal was written the way you seem to want it, e.g. whereby you feel you should be on line 2 since you are the co-signor, it just doesn't work that way (at any dealer). This is a requirement by the lender(s) not the dealer.

You were kind enough to help your friend by co-signing. As long as the payments are made on time, there is no problem. She'll get the credit
(which is a good thing) and so will you (even though it doesn't sound like you need it).

To the person that sent this complaint in, no one has done you wrong. Take a deep breath and relax.
Buying a new car is suppose to be fun but I suspect that you have ruined this "first time buying experience" for the person you helped buy the car. On top of this, you now have dozens of people cheering you on to "go get the car dealer".
Again, I have no interest in your deal. I'm only trying to reassure you that this dealer did the paperwork the same way that "every dealer" has to do it, according to the lender's guideline.

Move on; enjoy your new car; feel good about the good thing that you did by helping this person who obviously needed your help; and forget about all this legal rhetoric.

In closing, to all you angry people out there that want to hate a car salesman..... My wife needed a new car and we bought one a week ago. Being a professional car salesman myself, I didn't tell any of these salespeople I spoke with.
I will say that about 50% of the sales people that I spoke with were scum balls. Read my rip off report on Tustin Ford.

I'll check back to this report site. If you have any questions that you'd like me to answer for you, I'll be happy to do so. If you promise me that you will try to calm down; go ahead and write me; and I'll bet that I (as one of the "good, professional sales reps in the industry that really cares about his customers) can help you with your complaint...in terms of getting both you and the dealer to agree on a
mutually beneficial arrangement.

I will be the first one in line to go after someone that cheats me. Again, check out my rip off report. I think in your case, someone failed to communicate clearly with you and now this situation has gotten pretty hot.

You probably are not going to believe me, so perhaps you should go to one or two other dealers and ask to speak with a desk manager or finance manager and get their opinion about "what line does the co-signor go on"?
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#5 Consumer Comment

Left this out

AUTHOR: Dorothy - (U.S.A.)

I forgot to say THIS BOYS NAME IS NO WHERE ON THE LOAN...... YOU SAID IT DIDN'T MATTER WHAT LINE I WAS ON LINE 1 OR 2 I AM THE ONLY ONE ON ANY LINE.....
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#6 Consumer Comment

How many cars do you think i NEED

AUTHOR: Dorothy - (U.S.A.)

To begin with, if i had wanted to buy a car don't you think i would have bought one i liked??????
Further more if the salesman or loan officer had
told me this boy can't get a loan even if he had
a co-signer , I WOULD HAVE WALKED OUT OF THE DEALERSHIP AN NOT LOOKED BACK......I have 2 cars
an 1 truck..... Do you think i needed a 4th car?
I'm not a CHEVY PERSON, I'M A FORD LADY.....
Why was i not told all this up front, because they wanted to sell a car. Not all dealerships
work this way i know... As i said i have bought
a few in my lifetime an this is the first time
i have had a dealership not be up front with me.
All this dealer had to say was YOU NEED TO BUY THIS CAR FOR HIM BECAUSE HE CAN'T GET A LOAN...
Then i would have left his dealership.. end of it.
An you are right i am worried about having to pay for a car that i don't want or need... Since the car is in my name, so is the insurance.... an
my ins. company does not want this boy driving my car. So he is paying for a car he can't even drive..... It has been in my driveway for 2 mons. now... Ins. company canceled ins when they found out he was driving it..... Would you want to pay for a car you can't DRIVE?????????
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#7 Consumer Comment

Get A Grip, makes very little difference if you are on line 1 or 2? They are treated the same

AUTHOR: Rick - (U.S.A.)

What you are stating is not a straw purchase. You are just butt hurt that you are on line one of a 2 person contract. Did you know on credit reports it makes very little difference if you are on line 1 or 2? They are treated the same if your are getting credit for yourself. I think you are scared that your new imigrant friend might stiff you with the bill. So much steam for a web site that has REAL examples of fraud being done! Lets go after the slime...Not the ignorant that do not do their homework!

Keep Up The Good Work!

Former Auto Salesman
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#8 Consumer Suggestion

"We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

AUTHOR: Steve - (U.S.A.)

While this is not a uncommon occurrence in the Automotive financing world it is a good bet the California DMV will ask several questions:

1. Who was the the vehicle for?
2. Did the dealership personnel have knowledge of this?
3. How was the original application submitted to the lending institution(s)? **this is the key**
4. Was the co-signer/primary signer in need of a vehicle at the time of sale?
5. Who's name is the insurance in?

Many times the terminology "co-buyers" is use and at times can be confusing to even the seasoned buyer.

Good luck,
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#9 Consumer Suggestion

"We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

AUTHOR: Steve - (U.S.A.)

While this is not a uncommon occurrence in the Automotive financing world it is a good bet the California DMV will ask several questions:

1. Who was the the vehicle for?
2. Did the dealership personnel have knowledge of this?
3. How was the original application submitted to the lending institution(s)? **this is the key**
4. Was the co-signer/primary signer in need of a vehicle at the time of sale?
5. Who's name is the insurance in?

Many times the terminology "co-buyers" is use and at times can be confusing to even the seasoned buyer.

Good luck,
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#10 Consumer Comment

Going throught the same thing

AUTHOR: Dorothy - (U.S.A.)

I feel for this person, because i am going throught the same ordeal. I thought i was

going to be a co-signer, WRONG..... It ended

up i bought the car. Isn't this against the law?

This company is a very large dealership. But

the saleman as well as the loan officer lied

straight out....The loan officer said lets just pretend you are buying this car for your son...

I said he's not my son..... Then he said if you tell anyone i said this to you i will deny

saying it... What a rip off an liars... Can

anyone tell me what i can do. I have to carry ins

in my name for this car, yet someone else drives it. Now my ins. co. wants to cancel ins on this car.... I NEED HELP FAST....
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#11 Consumer Suggestion

Richard Romero if you are the GM The First amendment that I posted for you

AUTHOR: The Great Thorn - Rip-off Report Consumer Advocate - (U.S.A.)

Richard Romero if you are the GM of Toyota of Glendora you need to remind yourself of the following



The First amendment states the exact following word for word.



"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the FREE exercise thereof; or abridging the FREEDOM of SPEACH, or of the press; or the right of people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."



That my fellow American is the FIRST AMENDMENT word for word. This guy has caused your dealer ship no damage of anykind. He is simply stating what has happend to him and his sister.



He also has the right to picket your dealer if he so desires.



Today one of our fellow advocates had a chat with Mr Celestino L. Rivera, Jr. After he had a chat with him me emailed me.



Why don't you have your f&I department recontract him where he is the TRUE cosigner and his sister is the TRUE contracted buyer, Then he would be a happy camper.



Don't say you can't do that because you can only if you want to. If the bank you have him contracted with likes your business, they can work with you to recontract these fine AMERICANS and you know it.



Now nod your head YES!
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#12 Consumer Suggestion

Class Action ida

AUTHOR: Allen - (U.S.A.)

First and formost not all dealerships are bad. Now on to your problem. In this type of dealership you will find that this type of Finance fraud is just part of the dealership culture.



If you could contact all of this dealerships customers you will find many like yourselves. You will also find customers who purchased other finance add on's because they were led to believe they had to just to get financed. You may also find customers who had other add on's packed into their payment that they did not know about.



What protects this type of dealership is that none of you know about the other. Find an attorney who is fimilar with class actions and dealer fraud. He can obtain a list of this dealers customers through California's DMV. He can send them a postcard asking them to call his office if any of the following happened to them. "Were you told or led to believe you were just a co-signer and later found that you were the buyer?, Were you told or led to believe that you could obtain a better intrest rate if you purchased add on's such as Accident & Health, Life or Gap Insurance, Were you told or led to believe that the bank required a service contract".



After it is all said and done this dealer will pay a price that will discourage other bad dealers from finance fraud.
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#13 Author of original report

Mr. Romero...You Just Incriminated Yourself

AUTHOR: Celestino - (U.S.A.)

Mr. Romero, you just incriminated yourself!



In your specific situation, Elma Ombon did not qualify to purchase the 2002 Corolla on her own, since she was new to the country, had not established credit, had no FICO score, and was new on her job. At the time of sale, it was made clear to Ms. Ombon that she would definitely need a co-signer



So, if it was made clear to Elma that she needs a "co-signer" why did your dealership sign me up as the buyer?



You want to file a lawsuit against me? But I thought you said I made "baseless, malicious and false accusations"?



Hmmmm...I THINK I SHOULD FILE THE LAWSUIT!



Here's another one:

"You have made the accusation that Toyota of Glendora transacted a straw purchase in the purchase of your 2002 Corolla"



Mr. Romero, I read my post 100x but still have not found these comments in my original post. Are you reading the same post?
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#14 Consumer Suggestion

I'm backing up Celestino

AUTHOR: Preston - (U.S.A.)

I too posted a rip off report on a dealer. As result, the dealer threatened to sue me for "slander."



Pretty smart lawyer apparently. Considering, if the statements were actually false would have been "libel."



That was a year ago. I am still waiting for that lawsuit.



If the General Manager wants to talk about messages without merit, he should look at the load of crap he posted.



Here is my personal favorite line:



" We are confident that you will confirm our statements as being valid and true; once you confirm our findings, we will make one more request to have you remove your baseless,

malicious, and false accusations from the websites that you have posted to.



If you do not, you will leave us no choice but to exercise all of the options available to us, including any and all legal means necessary to have these statements removed."



It's hilarious!! Considering he spent the bulk of his rebuttal basically reiterating what the buyer initially said! How can they be false accusations if he's saying them too? Can we find that to be true?



He also claims an accusation of "straw purchase" in the initial post. Maybe it's the late hour I'm reading this, but I didn't find the "straw purchase" reference in the original post. In fact, the first one to bring up the term is the General Manager... hmmmmmm....



Celestino: You're exercising your freedom of speech and have a right to do so. I think you should further exercise it: PICKET!
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#15 Author of original report

Mr. Romero..you still miss the point!

AUTHOR: Celestino - (U.S.A.)

Richard Romero

General Manager

Toyota of Glendora

Glendora, CA



Mr. Romero,

Thank you for your civil response in comparison to the threatening and intimidating letter from your attorney, which in my opinion violated the ethical standard of the State Bar of California. (I will let the Bar decide on this issue.)

Mr. Romero, let me make myself clear.

I WILL NEVER BE INTIMIDATED BY TOYOTA OF GLENDORA.



My thanks to you as well for validating the existence of this consumer website www.rip-offreport.com that contains thousands of rip-off reports from consumers all over this great United States against businesses who do not play it fair but still sleep well at night. Like most businesses reported in this website I am sure you must have felt its impact. I don't know what country you came from, but here in America we call it freedom of speech. We can express what we feel rightly or wrongly! We can complain to anyone who will hear us. That's the American way!



Mr. Romero, your actions has not created any more friends or customers to your dealership. As a matter of fact it created a more negative publicity to your dealership and the automobile industry as evident from unsolicited response from readers and consumers. Have you heard of Business 101? Repeat business? Either that was never taught in your class or you were in the bathroom the whole time! It's unheard-of of a business establishment suing a customer! I hate to break your bubble Mr. Romero, but you are not very popular at this time.



Mr. Romero, your response still completely miss the point of this issue, which is MISLEADING A CUSTOMER! This is the issue. Do you want to deny that?

Just to remind you of your response:



In your specific situation, Elma Ombon did not qualify to purchase the 2002 Corolla on her own, since she was new to the country, had not established credit, had no FICO score, and was new on her job. At the time of sale, it was made clear to Ms. Ombon that she would definitely need a co-signer



Your description of the transaction is exactly what I have been saying! Plain and simple, MISLEADING A CUSTOMER! So, why did I end up the buyer and my sister the co-signer? Explain that Mr. Romero! If this is not straw purchase scam, then what do you call this one! Mr. Romero, I'm waiting to hear from you. Let me hear you dig out of this one! You seem to be very familiar with this phrase. You obviously acknowledge the existence of this scam and many more in your industry.







Regarding the issue of interest rates:



Additionally, you claim that you should have received 0.9% a.p.r. financing on your purchase. This is not possible since Toyota did not offer 0.9% financing on 2002 Corollas at the time of your purchase. There was a $500 factory rebate offered at the time, which you were given, as listed on your contract (line 6-D) and was applied to the down payment of your Corolla.



Mr. Romero, I just received the paperwork I requested from Toyota Financial about my credit rating. I also requested from you all the paperwork that you submitted to Toyota Financial during the transaction but obviously it fell on deaf ears. I have the right to these documents. I still have to hear from you as to why this seems to be a problem.

Mr. Romero, I went to your dealership with no intention of buying another car. I have 4 cars under my name already. I have never denied signing any documents. I have never denied agreeing to co-sign for my sister. BUT one thing is sure I NEVER INTENDED TO BE THE BUYER. If my intent was to be the buyer I could have done it all by myself without any co-signer. My rating according to Toyota Financial is 795 which is more than any person would ever get, including yourself!

I may be mistaken with the 0.9% but for sure I know you had it in your ad for at least 2.9% for 36 months, 3.9% for 48 months and 4.9% APR for 60 months at that time. It ended up as 8.9%. What has $500 rebate got to do with this issue? Was there a provision of either rebate or low APR? We agreed to the 8.9% because you led us to believe that I would just be a co-signer for my sister and that rate was not applicable for this scenario. I wonder what kind of percent rebate you got from Toyota Financial! Did Toyota of Glendora pocket the difference?



Regarding your threat of lawsuit:



We are confident that you will confirm our statements as being valid and true; once you confirm our findings, we will make one more request to have you remove your baseless,

malicious, and false accusations from the websites that you have posted to. If you do not, you will leave us no choice but to exercise all of the options available to us, including any and all legal means necessary to have these statements removed



Mr. Romero, please wake up! THIS IS THE ISSUE MISLEADING THE BUYER!

Your bases maybe covered when I signed those documents but one thing is for sureYOUR PEOPLE LIED TO US AND DECEIVED US AND THAT IN MY OPINION IS FRAUD!



MY POST IN THE INTERNET WILL STAY!





Still dissatisfied,

Celestino
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#16 Consumer Comment

If only your fraud was as easy to see through as your clumsy attempt to manipulate the legal system

AUTHOR: Fraud Hammer X - (U.S.A.)

Toyota of Glendora, if only you spent as much time dealing with the public on the up-and-up as you did misleading the public, you would set the Toyota car sales record! As is though, your ham-fisted manner in trying to ram this one sale through is costing you dozens of sales a day! Is it worth it? Can you put a price on the satisfaction you receive by calling your humble customers liars?



YOU'RE MUCKIN' WITH THE G HERE PAL! This hard-working citizen told you the score, AND YOU TRIED TO SHAFT HIM! I BET YOU REGRET THAT NOW, DON'T YOU! Have some FRAUD HAMMERTIME: POWWWW! Ooooh, that's going to leave a mark! Ha ha! FRAUD DOESN'T PAY!



And when the hell is Stick Bogart going to sound off on this?
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#17 Consumer Comment

Guess What...

AUTHOR: Dave - (U.S.A.)

The original poster didn't deny he signed a contract at your dealership Mr. Romero. What is in question is how that contract was presented to him. He has indicated that your dealership misrepresented said contract, with him under the belief that his sister was to be the only one obligated to pay back the loan in question.



Obviously this wasn't the case. Given the nature of 'salespeople' in general, (granted there certainly are exceptions) I find it extremely easy to believe that the buyer was duped into signing something that was totally different from what you represented.



I would NEVER purchase any type of vehicle from your dealership and hope the original buyer kicks your butt!
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#18 Consumer Comment

NICE THREAT RICHARD ..Toyota of Glendora mis lead this customer.

AUTHOR: ERIC - (U.S.A.)

Richard,



What a nice threat, you got Toyota money and Toyota lawyers behind you. I guess she worded it wrong so let me help. In MY PERSONAL OPINION and it only MY OPINION Toyota of Glendora mis lead this customer. Further more in my opinion Toyota of Glendora is a piss poor excuse for a customer service friendly dealer. In my opinion I would never buy a car from Glendora Toyota for its BS type of financial dealings.



Richard how come in financing finance managers can get a reduced interest rate if someone buys all the BS add ons the dealership offers. Why not give the reduced rate up front? Richard does your dealership get any rebates or better known as kickbacks from the banks you use for financing. Does your dealership gain any monetary gain from higher interest loans. I dare you to say "no" here so we can sue you for lying. You can't answer that.



Hey Richard I dare you to sue me for anything I said here. Hey everyone, In my opinion you should never buy a car from Toyota of Glendora, In my personal opinion these guys are a bunch of yahoo's who think we should be scared of big corporate Toyota and the owners of Toyota of Glendora. There are plenty of dealers that sale Toyotas within 50 miles of you and in my personal opinion all customers should visit those dealers instead of Toyota of Glendora. Hey Richard thanks for fueling the fire here in Southern California and causing a very Anti Toyota of Glendora attitude.



Eric Klein ( My real name )

Anaheim Hills

California
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#19 Consumer Suggestion

Richard Romero You need a wake up call.

AUTHOR: The Great Thorn - Consumer Advocate Volunteer - (U.S.A.)

Richard Romero you do not understand the program. Here at www.ripoffreport.com NONE of the reports are EVER removed.



Don't try to scare Celestino L. Rivera, Jr

into removing anything. Trained "Lot Sharks" hate this web site because it reveals what has been going on at dirty car dealers for way too long.



I ask you Richard Romero I bet you hate this web site, don't you? well sleep on this, This Rip Off Report is here for a good reason, as many as 500,000 people a day will able to read it and I love it.



Celestino L. Rivera Never forget my motto,

"Go Deep, It feels better" ..and I will dig deeper.



Now Mr car dealer. I know you can keep your local newspapers mouth shut, but you and others can't and will never keep our mouths shut here at Rip Off Report.



If this goes to court, I will see to it that Celestino L. Rivera, Jr has one of the best expert witnesses on his side. No car dealer wants this guy to talk to a jury. Push on and YOU will see!
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#20 UPDATE Employee

"We welcome the California DMV to decide this issue...

AUTHOR: Richard Romero - (U.S.A.)

Celestino L Rivera Jr.

13846 Silverwood Ln

Chino Hills, CA 91709



Mr. Rivera:



We would like to take this opportunity to address the malicious and false accusations that you have been posting on the web site known as Rip-offReport.com.



You have made the accusation that Toyota of Glendora transacted a straw purchase in the purchase of your 2002 Corolla.



The following is the definition of a straw purchase as posted by Fitzsimmons Community Federal Credit Union's website, in an article dated Spring 2002:



A straw purchase occurs when a dealer indicates that a co-signer is needed to finalize a deal, but the co-signer ends up with the loan entirely in their name. With only a co-signer's name on the loan, the co-signer legally owns the car. Be sure to thoroughly read the contract and have both signers sign at the same time on the same contract- never sign separate contracts.



An example is posted on the website www.carbuyingtips.com:



the dealer tells you that you can't qualify for the loan so you need to get a co-signer, plus they tell you that it will help you build your credit. No problem, Grandma will do it for you. But Grandma is easily duped by the dealer and 2 weeks later you find out that the dealer did not process a co-sign loan, they made the entire loan in Grandma's name! This does not help your credit. Her name is on the title, and it's illegal for you to buy insurance on a car that is not titled to you



In your specific situation, Elma Ombon did not qualify to purchase the 2002 Corolla on her own, since she was new to the country, had not established credit, had no FICO score, and was new on her job. At the time of sale, it was made clear to Ms. Ombon that she would definitely need a co-signer. At the time of sale, you were both present. You are both on the contract, as is clearly spelled out the top section labeled Buyer (and Co-Buyer). You both signed in numerous places on the contract, as well as the DMV application for registration. Additionally, you both signed the co-signer agreement, in accordance with the Federal Trade Commission's Trade Regulation Rule on Credit Practices.All of these documents were signed by both of you at the same time.



As you verify all of the above information, we are confident that you will come to the inescapable conclusion that you were not subjected to a straw purchase scenario.



Additionally, you claim that you should have received 0.9% a.p.r. financing on your purchase. This is not possible since Toyota did not offer 0.9% financing on 2002 Corollas at the time of your purchase. There was a $500 factory rebate offered at the time, which you were given, as listed on your contract (line 6-D) and was applied to the down payment of your Corolla.

Some time after your purchase, in response to 9/11, a number of different manufacturers made low or zero financing available, but none of this would have been applicable to your purchase, since they specifically excluded prior purchases. These offers became available at about the same time you started writing to us expressing your dissatisfaction with your financing.



We invite you to take your all of your documents to DMV and ask them whether or not you were involved in a straw purchase. They will tell you, as they have already told us, that the paperwork is properly filled out for a co-signed transaction, and that no straw purchase was involved with your contract.



We are confident that you will confirm our statements as being valid and true; once you confirm our findings, we will make one more request to have you remove your baseless,

malicious, and false accusations from the websites that you have posted to.



If you do not, you will leave us no choice but to exercise all of the options available to us, including any and all legal means necessary to have these statements removed.



Sincerely,



General Manager

Toyota of Glendora
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#21 Consumer Suggestion

Celestino L. Rivera, Jr My hate is off to you!

AUTHOR: The Great Thorn - Rip-off Report Consumer Advocate - (U.S.A.)

Celestino L. Rivera, Jr



My hat is off to you my fellow American. Don't let a slime-ball car dealer bluff you. Use the following info below to help expose this car dealer for defrauding you into believing you were going to be the COSIGNER, but in fact making you the buyer.



None of this deception would have ever happened to you if the bank was willing to VERIFY all info sent to them from the car dealer.



If the bank called you Celestino L. Rivera and asked ONE QUESTION: Is all of the info submitted to us by the dealership in fact CORRECT? The car dealer could not have pulled this scam on you.



This is why I feel that banks and car dealers sleep on the same dirty mattress at the same time.



Please make sure that your state's banking

commissioner's office gets a VERY CLEAR copy of your Rip Off Report. Leading a Cosigner to believe they are really Cosigning but having them sign first is DECEPTIVE! and it must be EXPOSED!



State of California

Department of Financial Institutions

111 Pine St., Suite 1100

San Francisco, CA 94111

415-263-8507

Toll free in CA: 1-800-622-0620

Fax: 415-989-5310

E-mail: consumer@dfi.ca.gov

Web site: www.dfi.ca.gov



Next, see if the LA times has guts. Let's see if they are willing to interview you and the dealership.



e-mail Los Angeles Times @ readers.rep@latimes.com

or fax them a copy of your Rip Off Report.

Telephone message line: (877) 554-4000

Fax: (213) 237-3535



Email some of these clowns below, tell them you are sick and tired of car dealer deception. Tell them to get off of their big buts and pass some laws that PROTECT consumer not laws that protect car dealers and their scams.



Senator Dianne Feinstein

http://feinstein.senate.gov/email.html



Senator Barbara Boxer

http://boxer.senate.gov/contact/webform.html



Representative Mike Thompson (D - 01) 202-225-3311 202-225-4335 http://www.house.gov/writerep/



Representative Wally Herger (R - 02) 202-225-3076 202-226-0852 http://www.house.gov/writerep/



Representative Douglas Ose (R - 03) 202-225-5716 202-226-1298 http://www.house.gov/ose/zipauth.htm



Representative John T. Doolittle (R - 04) 202-225-2511 202-225-5444

http://www.house.gov/doolittle/email_doolittle1.html



Representative Robert T. Matsui (D - 05) 202-225-7163 202-225-0566 http://www.house.gov/writerep/



Representative Lynn C. Woolsey (D - 06) 202-225-5161 202-225-5163 http://woolsey.house.gov/emailform.asp



Representative George Miller (D - 07) 202-225-2095 202-225-5609 George.Miller@mail.house.gov



Representative Nancy Pelosi (D - 08) 202-225-4965 202-225-8259 sf.nancy@mail.house.gov



Representative Barbara Lee (D - 09) 202-225-2661 202-225-9817 http://www.house.gov/writerep/



Representative Ellen O. Tauscher (D - 10) 202-225-1880 202-225-5914 http://www.house.gov/tauscher/IMA/get_address.htm



Representative Richard W. Pombo (R - 11) 202-225-1947 202-226-0861 rpombo@mail.house.gov



Representative Tom Lantos (D - 12) 202-225-3531 http://www.house.gov/writerep/



Lets see is any of the above politicians have any backbone.



If you get no reply from any of the above politicians you could feel that they like using the same dirty mattress that car dealers sleep on too!



Car dealer deception WILL BE EXPOSED!
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#22 Author of original report

Formal Rebuttal to Attorney's Threat

AUTHOR: Celestino - (U.S.A.)

James C. Caviola May 16, 2003

xxx xxxxxx

xxx xxxxxx

xxx xxxxxx



Re: Caviola Letter Dated May 12, 2003



Dear Mr. Caviola,



I have reviewed my post at the Internet website www.rip-offreport.com and have found no statements that I consider to be false. I stand by those statements, which can also be attested by my sister and brother-in-law who were present in the transaction. Your letter indicated that I have made disparaging remarks and false statements about your client. I suggest that you be more specific about your allegations.



I have consulted an attorney and we clearly find the purpose of your letter (see attached) as an attempt to threaten and intimidate an individual. I am therefore sending a copy of your letter to the office of the Orange County District Attorney for their review, and as a potential state witness for this form of threat and intimidation by your office.



In addition, I will pursue filing a complaint against your office with the State Bar Attorneys Complaint Department of California (800) 843-9053.
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#23 Consumer Suggestion

Celestino L. Rivera, Jr please read this ..Car dealers across the country hate this web site because it exposes their deceptive ways!

AUTHOR: The Great Thorn - Rip-off Report Consumer Advocate - (U.S.A.)

They know they can keep the media's mouth shut about all of their dirty tricks. They also know they can shove a qork in out mouth.



Hey Celestino Go to the following web sites and tell me what you think all of these web sites do for car dealers.



Here is the list, Go to them ALL, OK?



www.probac.com

www.nationalautotraining.com

www.appliedconcepts.net

www.grantcardone.com

www.davidlewis.com

www.jeffsacksandassociates.com

www.stukertraining.com

www.paulcummings.com

www.tewart.com

www.joeverde.com



www.biggross.com



www.nationalautotraining.com

www.fandiprofit.com

www.carsalestraining.co.uk/preview.html

www.autoscreeningtraining.com

www.autosalestraining.com

www.wwcsonline.com



I post insider info here for car buyers hoping to be the most wooden irritator of car dealer scum worldwide.



If you do get an attorney and need a expert witness that can help you, I will hook you up with one of the best in the country. car dealers fear him.



Most of the time if they know him and see his name on any cout documentation they soon try to settle out of court. He can prove it to.
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#24 Consumer Suggestion

Don't Back Down !!!

AUTHOR: John - (U.S.A.)

1) Make sure you contact more media outlets especially TV and newspapers with this story. I'm sure the dealership will appreciate the extra visibility it will garner. Since the dealership may try to exert their advertising $$$ influence with these local media outlets make sure you contact out-of-town media as well. Investigative reporters live for stories like this.



2) Run an ad in the local papers asking former customers/employees of this dealership to come forward and testify at the court hearing. If they're willing to tell their story to the media beforehand so much the better. It shouldn't be real hard to establish a pattern of misconduct for the judge to rule on.



3) Look for an attorney only if papers are served and only if they are not for small claims court. Once your story makes the news don't be surprised to hear from a few attorneys who would like to take your case 'pro bono (free)' or on a contingency basis. You may just be able to claim losses/damages here.



Don't Give Up !!!
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#25 Author of original report

Toyota of Glendora Threatening to Sue Me

AUTHOR: Celestino - (U.S.A.)

5/13/03



I just received a letter from the attorney of Toyota of Glendora threatening to sue me if I don't remove my complaint with Rip-off Report.



It said that I made "disparaging remarks on the internet about my client. If you don't remove these false remarks from the internet I will be filing a lawsuit against you in (7) days. Note well, Toyota of Glendora will proceed to a verdict against you for your false statements"



I spoke to their attorney and told him the information I posted were ALL TRUE and I stand by my statements and that I have two witnesses to the transaction, my sister and brother-in-law. He called back and told me that he spoke to Toyota of Glendora and he was asked to file the lawsuit.



I have contacted KCBS2news in Los Angeles (Drew Driffin) and sent him an email of rip-off website and specifics of my complaint against Toyota of Glendora.I am hoping that these "Straw Purchase Scams" be exposed. I will update this site soon of any developments.
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