• Report: #10294

Complaint Review: The Kirby Company

  • Submitted: Mon, December 31, 2001
  • Updated: Wed, February 29, 2012

  • Reported By:
The Kirby Company
Nationwide U.S.A.

The Kirby Company, deplorable Sales Tactics MA major vacuum ripoff

*UPDATE Employee: your facts are wrong.

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: the real truth

*Consumer Comment: Again, with the Kirby myth.

*UPDATE Employee: It's called business

*Consumer Suggestion: Calling the company

*Consumer Comment: Kirby - still the culture

*Consumer Comment: Kirby credit ripoff

*UPDATE Employee: Re-Word of mouth

*UPDATE Employee: @ the soon to be ex-employee

*Consumer Suggestion: Kirby - the culture

*UPDATE Employee: No matter what you say...it is a scam.

* : Let's set the story straight about Kirby

*Consumer Comment: Kirby in Alington Heights VA.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Ah, Here We Go.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: The rest of the story.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: The rest of the story.

*UPDATE Employee: Clearing the air

*Consumer Comment: I am the Owner of a Kirby - Two of them!!!

*UPDATE Employee: I've Read everything to here

*Consumer Comment: Feeling tricked.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: What a silly argument...

*UPDATE Employee: What a crazy game we all play in life.

*UPDATE Employee: Tom stop pouting, if your job is so d**n great, find something to keep you busy and shut up!

*UPDATE Employee: I'm thinking about quitting selling Kirby's and would like to know more about Mikes idea.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: The Company you think you know

*Consumer Comment: I have seen it all

*Consumer Suggestion: If you must have a Kirby, buy USED!!!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: I showed up to clean carpets for $350.00 a week as...

*Consumer Comment: Obnoxious Accusations

*Consumer Comment: Obnoxious Accusations

*Consumer Comment: Obnoxious Accusations

*Consumer Comment: Obnoxious Accusations

*UPDATE Employee: You guys are crazy

*UPDATE Employee: Dear Tom, what i love about Kirby most... it allows uneducated, stupid, dumb people like us to make money

*UPDATE Employee: Swamp land in Florida

*UPDATE Employee: GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

*UPDATE Employee: GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

*UPDATE Employee: GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

*UPDATE Employee: GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

*Consumer Comment: RE: Tom and Aaron

*UPDATE Employee: Tom.. Didnt you say you were a top seller..?

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Dumb, Dumber and Dumbest!

*UPDATE Employee: Once again you dazzle us...

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Aaron, just when I though you were coming around... again shown your lack of intelligence.

*UPDATE Employee: Tom and Tanya ..going to keep on selling them..

*Consumer Comment: I have never bought and will never buy a kirby.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: PS

*UPDATE Employee: To Mr. Rathernot, embarked on a similar adventure of Lone Star selling

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: long hours cold calling and door hanging for leads, your commissions getting taken with the flimsiest excuses given

*Consumer Comment: To Tom, Aaron and everyone else reading.

*UPDATE Employee: salesmen make alot more than $200.00 per sale

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

*UPDATE Employee: your grasp of written english is impressive

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers.

*UPDATE Employee: Way to go Tom!!!! ..all that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a gueranteed payday.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Marie, Are you a distributor

*UPDATE Employee: Little Bitter there, huh,TOM??? maybe you just didn't have what it takes to be a Distributor

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Re: Ex-Kirby Reps.

*UPDATE Employee: Ex Kirby Reps all have the same response!!!!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Aaron of Everett Washington, A master at what?

*UPDATE Employee: I could see through the scam the first day of training

*UPDATE Employee: I could see through the scam the first day of training

*UPDATE Employee: I could see through the scam the first day of training

*UPDATE Employee: Kirby Will Shine.. there are more who like us than don't.

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: IT'S SHOCKING!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: You can't blame the company for everything

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: not a really good place to work

*Consumer Comment: Not all Kirby people are bad & trying to scam you just like people in the world

*UPDATE Employee: I too was suckered into answering an ad in the newspaper as jobs are non-existent

*UPDATE Employee: Give 'em a break ..I am a 20 year old man with a wife and two kids

*UPDATE Employee: To the Lady who forged her husband's signature

*Consumer Comment: Kirby-bad news

*Consumer Comment: Dont worry, some people get even with Kirby!!!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Darryl, Do you sell Kirbys?

*Consumer Suggestion: response to bad credit guy

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Again worth mentioning that the kirby is an outstanding vaccuum cleaner, but the sales tactics used are deplorable. We agreed to one of theose free carpet cleanings and had a salesman come to the house. After the impressive demonstration we agreed to purchase a G6.

After findingout that out credit was not quite good enough for the G6 the salesman said he could offer us a factory reconditioned model from the previous year at a savings of $500 compared to the G6. We agreed on the stipulation that it be 2 things, clean and warrentied. I was shocked when what arrived was a vaccuum that looked like it came right from someone elses house. It was filthy.

Oh yeah and since I did not have the state of mind to verify such things, he put it in under the original contract with the G6 crossed out but for the same price. Kirbys are warrentied by name, so you dont need it in writing, but come on people. I paid the same price as new for 2 year old used vaccuum that I had to scrub clean myself before the wife even saw it.

Yeah they suck pretty good, but not as much as the salemen.
Buyer beware.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 12/31/2001 12:00 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/The-Kirby-Company/nationwide/The-Kirby-Company-deplorable-Sales-Tactics-MA-major-vacuum-ripoff-10294. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 78Consumer 1Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 UPDATE Employee

your facts are wrong.

AUTHOR: yourwrong - ()

there is not a single piece of the Kirby that is made of plastic. It is made of the same material bulletproof windshields, airplane windshields, and nascar windshields are made of. the rest is die cast alluminum(im an ex machinist this is not cheap stuff). This product is the best availible. Comparing a 200 dollar vacuum to a Kirby is like comparing a Ferarri to a Prius except atleast the Prius still works. I have cleaned after "proffesional" cleaning services, and the Kirby still pulled dirt out. ALOT of dirt. do not listen to these naysayers Kirby s the real deal.

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#2 REBUTTAL Owner of company

the real truth

AUTHOR: salesmaster - ()

I spent 3 yrs as a sales person, sales manager, and office owner , for the Kirby Company.  I had nothing when I started , and when I left  was earning an exceptional living. I sold what is without a doubt the best home cleaning system in the world , sometimes to people who had no business buying one . However it is not my place to tell someone what they can or cannot afford . I never took advantage of anyone , incapable of making an informed decision, nor was I ever deceptive. The Kirby Co has turned the lives of many people around , who were dedicated , to working hard , long hours in a difficult job. ...That being said the marketing system is VERY harsh , and very Machiavellian . A recruiter hires a "crop " of 10 -15 POTENTIAL sales reps in a mass hiring , usually conducted offsite .These CANDIDATES are told UPFRONT that they will be independent contractors , but will initially be paid a stipend , while they learn, of a set amount of money , if they attend training and go on a certain number of appointments .If they don't go on appointments , they don't get paid . After training , they candidates are sent to try out their pitch on family and friends . After this is done they are sent on appointments set by the telemarketing dept to show the Kirby. If they sell they make money, if not they do not .  You make money if you sell Kirbys , which is YOUR JOB !!!!! About 1 out of 30 succeeds , the rest usually wsh out in a week . It is not a job for the timid , or the shy . Those that fail , fail soon , those that succeed , do extremely well. It is a hard sell , you are selling a $2000 system to people accostomed to paying $300 for a vaccuum .You do it by showing people how vile and filthy their homes are [ and they are ].Sometimes people don't like the truth . It hurts . It is emabarassing .  The key is that no other vaccuum works , even 50% as well . I have never gone into a home , and not been able to blow away the clients equipment When I left Kirby ,I was in the top 5% of the sales reps in the world , had personally dined with the President of the company ,had won 12 trips , a Rolex , TVs , Stereos , a bike , and had made hundreds of thousands of dollars ..I left Kirby because I was tired of working 7 days a week , 15 hours a day . I am now working for  a luxury car dealership , where I have a customer satisfaction index [ based on my client reviews ]in the top 10% of the US, and still make a 6 figure income. Much of this I owe to Kirby  ; where I learned and honed my sales skills .  Never in my entire sales career have i had to lie , cheat , or scam someone to make a dollar ..Is  Kirby a scam? ...NO ......is it hard , and not for the meek or unmotivated ?...YES......Is the machine expensive? .....YES......should everyone own one ?....NO , not everyone can afford the best ... Kirby is capitalism at it's worst and it's best . 

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#3 Consumer Comment

Again, with the Kirby myth.

AUTHOR: GulfCoastVacuums - (USA)

   Kirby is NOT the best vacuum or cleaning system designed.  It is NOT of higher quality than other vacuums.  Anybody who has purchased a Kirby vacuum in the last 15 years knows this beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

   Common sense tells [the person with common sense] anybody that any 'mult level marketing', especially door-to-door product must have a HUGH margin built in.  Does anybody know what it cost to manufacture a Kirby these days?  

 

   The demonstration of the product in the home is simply a pressure tactic to get in the door.  If Kirby really had a "reputation of excellence", people would order them off Amazon.  Problem is, nobody is dumb enough to pay that much for a vacuuum, or once they do are too embarassed to complain.  I've talked to countless elderly folks in the gulf coast region, all with different but very similar experiences with different salespeople form Kirby.  ALL of them talked about the tactics used to get in the door [ex:  You've won a free carpet cleaning!] then eventually go into the payment plan which gives you this amazing home cleaning system that will last you 35 years.



   Any car will last you 35 years, if you repair it.  Kirby's will last you 35 years, if you repair them.  Kirbys are big plastic, shiny sucking machines with combersome attachments [especially for the elderly] that break belts, burn up motors, and need parts.  Of course, if you paid 1800-2400 for a vacuum and/or haven't paid the darn thing off...you'll fix it when it breaks, even if it costs you a few hundred.  The 'carpet cleaning system' junk that adds Hundreds and Hundreds of dollars is plastic and liquid garbage that can be found for $7 in a bottle & brush at Walmart.  Also, this is one of the BIG MARGIN add-ons Kirby dupes the suckers with.



   If you're a car salesman selling Chevrolet, I bet you can find many reasons why it's the best truck on the market.  Ditto for Dodge, Ford, etc.  Bottom line, if you are a Kirby salesperson or business owner you'll go to your grave justifying your product.  Fact is, it is less about the product but the tactics.



   FACT:  Kirby would be out of business if it wasn't for door-to-dooor high pressure sales.  Kirby is selling the same quality vacuum, with the same crappy warantee you can get for 200-400 anywhere.  They are operating on a 'mythical' reputation from the old "Kirby iron giant" days that is maintained by high pressure sales and tactics.  In the old days, you bought a Kirby to show off to the neighbors.  Kirby rode the "carpet wave" of the 60's, which was a sign of success.



    After getting my elderly Mom out from under the Kirby payment plan, I found tons of the same model on Craigslist for $300 [or best offer].  I called on one and the guy said 3 Kirby salesmen had called, and one even told him he couldn't resell it without authorization, but the other came and purchased it.



     I bought my Mom a nice, lite replacement vacuum that didn't have/need a "transmission"  [lol] and was easy to use.  It works fine, and at $250 has been working well for almost 3 years.



     Don't fall for the Kirby myth.  Make sure your edlerly parents, friends, family ALL know to be careful of Kirby sales tactics.



      Charles

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#4 UPDATE Employee

It's called business

AUTHOR: TrueDWils86 - (United States of America)

THERE IS SOMETHING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT KIRBY.  SOME OF THE SALESMEN. 

I do apologize on the behalf of ANY salesman who has left a customer with a bad experience, lied, got angry, or left a customer with buyers regret.

I, myself, am a salesman for one of the top distributors in the world of Kirby.  I have met many people who have strong negative opinions of Kirby, but what it ALWAYS comes down to is a BAD SALESMAN.   It is not the company, it is not the product, it is the SALESMAN.  If a salesman sells you a product and he was dishonest or operated without integrity, the result is a complaint such as the Original Report. 

Kirby is a very simple company and has functioned the same way for almost 100 years. Door to door direct sales of the highest quality vacuum (home care system) ever designed.  Kirby provides a FREE SERVICE which is a carpet shampoo, stain guard, carpet fluff, and the only residential use of circular dry foam which allows it to dry in 20 min for one entire room. 
This is all free just to SHOW you the Kirby.  What other company does that?

Anyone who says Kirby company is bad has done little to no research because the product is 100% USA built. Designed, engineered, and manufactured IN AMERICA.  We all need to work on not buying crap from CHINA while simultaneously complaining about the economy.

A successful business is made by making a product for cheap and selling it at RETAIL price. EXAMPLE a 3 dollar cup of coffee from STARBUCKS.  

Another successful type of business offers a SERVICE which costs close to nothing to provide. 

Kirby is not sold in stores because you have to SEE IT to BELIEVE IT. Every other vacuum company is SCREWING us everyday, costing us THOUSANDS in disposable vacuums, shampooers, and professional services. 

Anyone who says Kirby is not the highest quality product in it's industry has either never seen it or does not know how to use it.  I lways laugh to myself, but then feel bad for them immediately after when someone is proud of their Dyson because 85% of the revenue goes back into MARKETING a "COOL FACTOR" when the design of the Dyson (and any every other store bough vacuum) was never designed to WORK. 

If you do not believe me, take a closer look at what the vacuums are picking up!  IT IS RIPPING APART OUR CARPETS.  Looks like DRYER LINT doesn't it?  What is dryer lint?  Material from our clothes.  What is dryer looking lint in our vacuums?  Destroyed carpet.  Ahh, NOW you understand why our carpets are completely matted down and wear out in 5 years or so....

As far as complaints from "ex-employees.."  It is an ATTITUDE business. 

Of course you are not going to make any money if you suck at your new sales job, it is COMMISSION ONLY.  You can teacher a worker to SELL, but you cannot teach a salesman to WORK. 

If instead you focused the same amount of time you spend complaining on handling objections you would have the ALL
EXPENSE PAID VIP TRIP I went on to SOUTH LAKE TAHOE.  They PAID FOR MY AIRFARE, LUXURY HOTEL, FOOD, DRINKS, AND s****.> and KIRBY CHANGED MY LIFE. 

I have been in the business for only SEVEN MONTHS. ALL MY HARD WORK IS PAYING OFF becuse NOW I have the OPPORTUNITY to open MY OWN OFFICE in the next 90 days!  I am grateful to have a job where I can work so many hours while so many people are struggling to find even a part-time job...

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#5 Consumer Suggestion

Calling the company

AUTHOR: Marie - (United States of America)

I too called Kirby and I got vague details about the job. If it sounds too vague. That is usually a red flag for me. 

I started messing with the receptionist and asking about base pay and what would I really get paid. She got mad and hung up! 
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#6 Consumer Comment

Kirby - still the culture

AUTHOR: GulfCoastVacuums - (United States of America)

  Again, it is about the culture that a company enforces.  When you try to complain about a tactic or quality and 9 out of 10 people you talk to run defense, then you know it is part of the culture.  Kirby does NOT hold itself accountable for their associates' practices or give an avenue of recourse.  As long as the sales are coming in, there is a blind eye.

  Always there is honorable people.  I don't deny the likely validity of the honorable guy running the honorable Kirby dealership.  Also, I have bet honest car salesmen.  In general, the "culture" of used [and new] car sales is fraught with tricks, tactics, and financing smoke &mirrors.  Bottom line, it requires you to be CAREFUL.  Kirby [in general] falls under the same cloud.  The use tactics, tricks, and financing tomfoolery...and this is done & reported at a much higher frequency than other businesses.  Kirby is known to prey on the elderly...IN GENERAL:  Probably due to the high percentage of elderly at home during the day.

  MYTH:  Kirby's are incredible vacuums that last 35 years.  I own a 30 year old Kirby, and the new ones are NOTHING like those.  This is a plastic vacuum manufactured as well as ANY $200-$400 vacuum cleaner on the market.  ANY vacuum will last 35 years if you take care of it and replace parts.  These newer Kirby's definitely break.  The difference is people have spent $1800-$2400 so they are MORE inclined to buy the expensive repair, rather than simply replace.  Most will also brag about quality due to the simple fact they paid such an incredible price!  Human nature.  If you pay $60k for a car, you are inclined to convince people of all the reasons it is well worth it.

  Everybody knows door-to-door sales are based on TACTICAL process & high-pressure [wear down] methodology.  Kirby knows this.  The world knows this.  It will get worse.  The last generation of elderly to fall for these tactics are dying off.  The Internet has become like the phone, and even the NEW elderly are much harder to dupe at the door.  Of course, "loneliness" will never go away, so Kirby will always have a market.

  I respect the Marine with the high integrity Kirby operation.  If you can sell something that has a 90% markup [like all multi-level marketing] and give many people the opportunity to own their own business with integrity, without tactics, without any pressure, and with full disclosure...then that is just wonderful.  You are the 5% representation of the Kirby company.  Still, you are by no means selling a "35 year vacuum" - I assure you.  Anybody with any sense can tell you that.  Garantee it for 35 years, then you can claim a victory.  :)
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#7 Consumer Comment

Kirby credit ripoff

AUTHOR: caveman - (USA)

I have been in the same situation with different Kirby distribitors. I have owned three Kirbys in my lifetime. They are a great vacuum, but thats it only the vacuum part s great. I can spend a fourth of the money or less sometimes to get the same cleaning power. The tactics and how they draw in there sales force of young people promising them money and then telling them they do not get paid until they get so many demo appointments. The company needs to step up and stop these SCAMS. Their company name is being drug through the dirt by these SCAM artist that promise these young people thousands of dollars, but are never straight forward to them. There is one operating in the Rancho Cucamonga, Ontario area In California.
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#8 UPDATE Employee

Re-Word of mouth

AUTHOR: Absolute67 - (United States of America)

I know there are some unethical Kirby office owners out there unfortunately. They never last and Kirby will shut them down. Outside of that, Kirby is a unbelievable opportunity for those that take hold of it. You do get your own office but all they provide is up to 12 free Kirbys and the license to use their name. NO franchise fees. Kirby wants happy, satisfied customers, not what I am reading here. I discovered as a trainer that 99% of the people that stated the things that you listed never actually sold a Kirby. Generally they didnt like it or couldnt do it so rather than admit that, they told a story about how horrible Kirby is. I had quite a few of those, get them in a house and they would not do a proper presentation and wonder why they were not selling. They go out for a whole week and put no efffort and then want a check. I have sold cars, furniture, flooring and perfume/cologne on the street, Kirby is the most ethical comapny I have ever dealt with. I am a former Marine and Army Green Beret raising four children by myself, I have no college. Had Kirby been unethical or dishonest there would have been some hospital stays for a few people. As a manager I once had a crew member that turned down three house for three different reasons. I took all three and sold all three. I made $1600 plus 10% as a manager. He learned that you can not pre-judge a sale. If you get in a good office with a good owner that provides proper sales training, the sky is the limit.
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#9 UPDATE Employee

@ the soon to be ex-employee

AUTHOR: Absolute67 - (United States of America)

  I started in Kirby sales after sixteen years in the Marine Corps. I was a single father of four with no college, the best laid plans sometimes do not happen. I worked in a office that had high ethics,which is strictly enforced by the Kirby corporation. I then became a manager and soon thereafter the sales/training manager. The "interview" that you talk of is designed to get people in the door and give us a chance to do a quick evaluation, if they "seem" ok we ask them back for the orientation. Kirby wants the chance to present the opportunity in full before anyone makes a decision. You lose some at that point/ Kirby does not need to "sell" themselves. Berkshire Hathway purchased Kirby( that would be Bii Gates and Warren Buffet). Every week we do 100 + interviews to get the 1-2 quality, driven reps that Kirby is looking for.
It is frustrating because many of them just want the "easy" buck, when the opportunity is amazing, to have your own office ina s little as three years! Where can you do that and make that kind of money? I nor my office owner tolerated ANY dishonesty or lack of ethics. I left a few people to find their own ride home after such incidents. The morning meetings do vary A LOT, I know what you are talking about, I do not care for that type. They obviously thought it was motivating for some. The meetings are meant to be tarining and motivation to set and reach your goals. Kirby operates they way they do to give individuals the chance to make their own future without a degree or silver spoon. I helped many people, ones with breathing problems who called to thank me because they or their children could sleep at night without couging or having trouble breathing.
Door to door is a very honorable field and not many are cut out for it, I told them I would never knock on a door. ooops.

I was on the trips that you speak of and they are excellent, the first time I sold 15 Kirbys in a month I qualified for the next trip. I have seen the dishonest Kirby reps and office owners and they soon go the way of the Dodo. I met some wonderful people while going door to door. Yes they ARE worth the asking price. Average Kirby lasts 35 years, so for the next 35 yrs if you did not have to buy another vacuum, or pay someone to shampoo your carpet, furniture, or car. How much would a person save? This is not even discussing how much solid dirt it removes. I put the Kirby up against EVERY vacuum in every house and did a "by the book" presentation. EVERY customer wanted it. I just had to fit it in their budget. Thats all, dont worry about the sale, have a good time and be honest.

Lastly, my first manager was a very sweet 51 yr old woman and she was very ethical in her sales. She averaged no less than $1800 a week before she went on to her own office. ANYONE can make it in Kirby if they really want it. Very sorry you had a bad experience.  

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#10 Consumer Suggestion

Kirby - the culture

AUTHOR: GulfCoastVacuums - (United States of America)

My 73 year old mother bought a Kirby in late 2009, and we didn't find it until 2010 in her closet.  She has mild dementia and a Kirby salesman talked his way into the house.  She was embarassed and said, "I knew I didn't need one, but couldn't get him to leave.  He said he had to sell a vacuum or lose everything".  She never figured out how to use it.

The vacuum was $1740 + $460 [financing fee] and they like to draft from bank accounts.  I finally found the credit company [one of many I assume] Kirby uses and paid it off for her.  She'd never figured out how to use it.

I did TALK to many Kirby franchise/sales folks before calling the credit company.  The highest I got was a district manager.  Even at that level, once you get them talking long enough...there is a 'smarmyness' that appears.  Kirby is like a TAXI company in that 'driver/salesman' turnover is very, very high and they don't hold themselves in any way accountable for what the salesmen do.

They will all tell you their product is GREAT and this someone releases them from responsibility for sales tactics.  The one manage after saying he's "never" heard my story, later slipped and said he "knows" elderly are taken advantage of, but says corporate Kirby has a "rule" against selling to elderly over 70 [or 68?].  Anyway, he says the salesmen are not actually notified of this policy and doesn't know any franchise that would...since this would be age discrimination.  LOL

I know there are some good Kirby sales groups out there, but I got the impression Kirby's 'general culture' is that of high-pressure sales and a structure that removes all accountability.  Once your parent/family member is hooked up with the credit company financing the vacuum - Kirby is out of the picture.

Has this ever happend to an elderly parent of yours?

Thanks,
  (((Redacted)))



CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.
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#11 UPDATE Employee

No matter what you say...it is a scam.

AUTHOR: Stephanie S. - (United States of America)

I have read a lot of the posts on here, and I'm not discrediting any one particular statement.  This is merely my own experience and it is a little biased considering the research I've done.  With that said, I will explain. 

I received a call about a job that I had applied for, the description was very limited but it peaked my interest as it was listed under Customer Service, and with having done a lot of phone sales and customer service I didn't question it.  I'm aware of a lot of the scams that have exploded all over job sites.  However, I was fooled. Anyway, I wanted to at least interview because I wasn't really given that much information over the phone.  When I got there I spoke with a woman who confirmed that it was a "customer service position making $400-$800 per week selling power tools."  That is a direct quote, no joke.  I really wanted to give it a try.  The job market has been tough.  I also haven't had much education in addition to my HS Diploma.  When I walked in for training it was really a wordy pitch about Kirby Vacuums.  Selling the job and the product which I've seen before, but he was very convincing.  I was STILL interested even after being mislead by the initial interview.  Once I was told to start with my own connections and demonstrate for them I knew that something was up.  Essentially it is a pyramid scheme, or at least at first.  During a break, everyone seemed blown away by the interview and not skeptical at all.  That is probably because most of them were under 20 years old, some having no HS education or coming from somewhere like Wendy's.  He was talking about huge houses, and vacations, and cash bonuses.  I'm only 26, but I could see through the BS.  The vacuum is great...don't get me wrong.  I was amazed by it, and it could really sell itself. When I did the research I found some horror stories. 

No one has to convince me that it is a scam.  In fact the people that are FOR the company are actually the ones that confirm it.  You don't know how many message boards I've read where someone uses the expression "bad apple" and the trainer actually used that expression too.  You guys are following a script whether you know it or not.  Everything that I was told by the trainer has been recited on message boards alike, and that is too much of a coincidence.  Even if there are a few goods ones out there, the majority of you are cons, and that is evident by ...well the evidence really.  There are tons of reputable companies that would not have the enormous amounts of negative feedback that Kirby does.  You guys talk about "Bad Apples" so much, well when you have so many bad apples..."come on guys! you know this..."  the bunch gets spoiled.  I still have to continue training tomorrow, but I will not be returning.  Thanks, but I'd like to keep my integrity and dignity.  I just feel sorry for the people there who are naive, and don't even see this coming.  Hopefully they will wise up too.

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#12

Let's set the story straight about Kirby

AUTHOR: Daniel - (USA)

To all who may be reading:


I am writing this rebuttal as insight and advice about the Kirby Company. Many of you are skeptical about working for Kirby. Like all independent contractors, you will come across some very bad apples. Now some of you may think, " Well just because you work for Kirby, you sure gonna defend it." Thats simply not true. I am a medically retired US Army Military Policeman, who has several different colleges degrees. I just recently started working at Kirby as an independent contractor simply for the fact that I truly believe in the product and that I truly believe in financial success. I know most people hate door-to-door salesmen. I am truly the same way but at the same time I still give the salesman courtesy and respect and let them pitch me as they are trying to make a livng just like everyone. Kirby is selling a product that very few can measure up to. Now some people get tired of the pressure selling which if you sells Kirbys please be aware that if you do that you can lose more clients/customers by pressure selling and by lying to your customers. As also being a former salesman and also being a part-time recruiter for the Army, you catch more flies with honey, meaning sell honestly and ease your customer into the Kirby world. I know, I know, you don't want to waste 3 hours on a demo if they are not going to buy it. But if you pressure sell or lie to your customers a few things will happen. 


1. You will lose your customer's respect for you and for the Kirby product


2. You will never get a sale


 3. You will never get repeat customers


 4. You won't get any referrals 


Some of you may have been customers that the salesperson took advantage of you or ex-employees who are tick off that their distributor took advantage of them. You must realize you can't just judge Kirby, its products, and its disbributors and employees because someone wronged you in the past. Because if that was the case with every product in this world no one would make a profit and our Country would be looking more like Africa or some of these other countries that haven't advance in this world with technology and economics. For some of those ex-emloyees who say Kirby is a scam because they go into a job interview  from a listing on Craigslist and realize its not what they intended to do, you have no real room to gripe as you should have discuss with your employer and used common sense before even setting foot into the Kirby Office and not be so ignorant of how to get an employer to discuss the job before making the interview. Now I know some of you think that the Kirby price is so high but think about it this way, Kirby has to make a profit, Kirby has to pay the laboerers who built the Kirby machine, Shipping the Kirby to the distributor, your disbributor has to make a profit, advertising cost money, as well as the person making th appointment. If the cost was a little over MSRP (Manufactuer Sale Retail Price ) everyone with the Kirby industry would be out of business. Walmart, Target, K-mart, and many other stores charge higher for most of their products after they are manufactuered. As well as most car dealerships  will get $24,000 car for about $8,000 and try to charge you sticker price. So if any of you want to put down Kirby, so be itm you are entitled to your opinion but you should always consider the facts before you judge. Kirby is one of the number one cleaning systems out there. Many celebrities have either sold Kirby or bought a Kirby ie KC Chiefs football player Tony Gonzalez, Dog the Bounty Hunter, and Oprah. So if they like it and have even stated that how they started their fame was through Kirby it can't all be bad. Please also forgive my grammar typos as I am up late and very tire.

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#13 Consumer Comment

Kirby in Alington Heights VA.

AUTHOR: Kirbykicker - (U.S.A.)

Many residents don't appreciate interruptions of their daily life by a knock at the door by a peddler or a solicitor. But some residents have their hearts go out to a sales story about a chance to go to college or other opportunity that is made possible by money gained from the successful sale for a door to door sales person. However, with door to door solicitation there may be much more than what meets the eye.

With certain conditions, peddlers and solicitors are permitted during certain hours in Arlington Heights.

A peddler is any person who goes from place to place and promotes and offers for sale at retail to deliver, barter or exchange any goods, wares, merchandise, wood, oil, fish, fruits, vegetables, country produce or any other article or thing whatsoever or any service from a vehicle or otherwise. A peddler does not include a serviceman who, responding to a prior call comes and sells replacement merchandise.

A solicitor is any person who goes from place to place, without prior appointment or pre-arrangement with a residential or business customer offers merchandise, articles or things, and takes orders for future delivery at retail of any merchandise or other article or thing. A solicitor also promotes, sells and takes orders for any service or charitable purpose.

Permits are required by any person acting as a peddler or a solicitor in Arlington Heights. It is unlawful for individuals to act as a peddler or a solicitor without a permit.

What hours are permitted for solicitors and peddlers to go door to door?
No soliciting or peddling shall be permitted before the hours of 9:00 A.M. or after the hour of 9:00 P.M. within the Village, and no peddling or soliciting shall be conducted on Sundays.

Can people with a criminal history work as a peddler or solicitor?
It is unlawful for any organization to utilize as a solicitor any person who has been convicted of a forcible felony within a period of five years prior to the date of solicitation or who, having been convicted of a forcible felony, has been released from a penal institution for a period of less than three years prior to the date of proposed solicitation. For the purposes of the Village of Arlington Heights ordinance, a forcible felony means treason, murder, voluntary manslaughter, aggravated criminal sexual assault, criminal assault, robbery, burglary, arson, kidnapping, aggravated battery, and any other felony which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any individual.

Unfortunately many individuals act as peddlers and solicitors without obtaining permits, and some of these individuals are not peddlers or solicitors. They are often criminals with a scam. Often two people will prey on elderly people with one person engaging a conversation with the elderly person while another sneaks in a door to ransack the residence and make off with possessions in the home.

The identity issue
Whenever someone comes to your door, even with an identification card or a solicitor permit displayed, you can't be sure who they are. Even faced with a solicitor with a legal permit, a homeowner cannot be sure that the solicitor or peddler does not have criminal intentions. While standing at your front door there is ample opportunity to assess valuables in a home or judge the wealth that may exist inside. The apparent legitimate reason for a peddler or solicitor to be in a neighborhood also gives ample opportunity for strangers to make observations about neighbors' activities, such as whether someone is on vacation or what time they leave for work, etc. Some police departments have even recognized an increase in theft reports when door to door sales crews have passed through a neighborhood. Regular old solo burglars often use the line to police that they are solicitors when they are casing a neighborhood.

Some solicitors are involved with Traveling Sales Crews (many from out of state) that involve abuse of the sales team individuals, theft, DUI and illegal drug use, and even felony criminal behavior.

Aggressive, spam-like behavior
Many citizens have had enough with telemarketers' interruptions on the telephone, and perceive their homes and property as a last refuge for peace and order. It is possible that residents are experiencing an increase in interruptions from door sales crews because more telemarketing firms are limited by DO NOT CALL lists. Unfortunately, many door to door solicitors and peddlers are aggressive. There are reports of many solicitors not displaying permits. Sometimes they ask odd questions or make strange statements. In one report, a solicitor was asked where he was from, since he didn't display a solicitor permit. He answered that he was from his mother. Another solicitor once mentioned that he was in a program to help him be more outgoing and was told to go out and meet the neighbors.

The opportunity for violent crime
Answering your door for a complete stranger is risky behavior. Village of Arlington Heights ordinance permits peddlers and solicitors to come to your door up to the 9:00 p.m. hour. During most months of the year in Arlington Heights, this time period is total darkness. Opening your door to a stranger could result in armed home invasion, assault or worse. Across the United States, criminal cases have involved individuals or groups posing as door to door sales teams that actually commit crimes such as burglary, theft, harassment and assault. Alarming violent crimes, such as rape and murder have also been attributed to people posing as door-to-door sales people, peddlers or solicitors.

Door to Door Sales Tactics
Solicitors often sell products, subscriptions, and services that are over-priced, poor quality or non existent.

Solicitors are most successful with vulnerable individuals. They sell the items through aggressive tactics, peer pressure, and deceptive practices. Solicitors are trained to aggressively push the products and services. Solicitors often make a contest out of how many customers say no' at first and through aggressive tactics later end up purchasing the product.

Here is list of common tactics solicitors use
Solicitor introduces himself then quickly begins the sales pitch
Solicitor does not take no' as an answer
Solicitor tells the customer they will never get this opportunity again
Solicitor gets upset at the customer if they indicate they want to end the conversation
Solicitor argues with the customer
Some solicitors will actually barge in at a door, even trying to help unlatch the door
Some solicitors will ask for a drink of water
Some solicitors ask to come in the home to use the phone
Some solicitors ask to come in the home to use the bathroom
Once inside solicitors continue the sales pitch and are difficult to get out of the residence
Many solicitors demand that customers make a purchase because the customer has wasted their time
When a customer says no', some solicitors get more aggressive
Many solicitors lie to the police, if they are called by the homeowner, and will even falsely accuse homeowners of being aggressive with the solicitors

Solicitors also use deceptive practices and peer pressure. Many will show customers a sign up sheet with names of neighbors and/or others in the area that have just purchased a product from them. Solicitors use this method to build trust and put peer pressure on the customer.

The following is a list of common deceptive practices of solicitors:
? No sales tax collected when required
? Charging higher percent sales tax
? No village permits when required (many solicitors will claim they didn't know they needed a permit)
? Not registered as a professional charity
? False claims about the product
? False claims about donating to a charity
? If a subscription is not purchased, solicitors tell customer they can donate to
the solicitors educational fund instead
? Solicitor does not issue a receipt to the customer with the company's actual name and correct information
? Forged documents
Solicitors produce fake lists of endorsements of neighbors (the neighbors never wrote the endorsements)

How does a door to door sales team operation work?
Many solicitors are from out of state, and some do have criminal records. The sales teams often stay in middle to lower priced hotel rooms with at least two solicitors to a room and sometimes four to a room.

Door to door sales teams often change localities every week. Car handlers take the sales team to a locality and stay nearby while solicitors hit the streets and start ringing doorbells. Some car handlers have been known to provide support for solicitors that includes finding illegal drugs for their use. Solicitors are sometimes left on the street for 16 hours. All money that is earned is kept by a bookkeeper or manager with a minimal allowance given for food and designed to prevent crew solicitors from having enough money to get back home. In some areas drug use by solicitor crews is very high. In fact drug use and availability of certain types of drugs may be a recruiting tool for some door to door sales crews.

Many solicitor crew individuals will confide in police officers that they want to get out of their situation, but are often afraid of being beaten by managers or are afraid of some other type of retaliation by managers.

Working as a solicitor is a lousy job
Working as a solicitor or a peddler involves a hard lifestyle with long hours and work that can be dangerous. Crew bosses promise many benefits on fliers and utility pole signs near college campuses. The crew bosses often promises a party lifestyle, with travel, prizes, extra money and even scholarships, but once sales people are involved in the job they find they are working a miserable job, scorned and rejected, six days a week with long hours, no benefits and low pay.

Many of the crew bosses operate illegally and assure the sales people that they will take care of matters that involve the police. Most police departments are wary that it is the crew bosses that are often the key to the problem. Some sales staff even end up with criminal records because of the work they performed as a solicitor. Their bosses never backed them up and sometimes even force offenders to miss court dates.

Some communities have set up no knock ordinances in response to unlawful activities of solicitor and peddler crews.

For more information and assistance
magcrew.com
edumacation.com/MagazineSalesScams

travelingsalescrews.info
travelingsalescrews.info: WANTED

SOURCES:
VILLAGE OF ARLINGTON HEIGHTS MUNICIPAL CODE: Chapter 12 Merchants [PDF]
See Article X

Louisville Metro Police Department Patrol Officers Reference Guide to Door to Door Solicitors

* Regarding observance of NO SOLICITORS OR PEDDLERS notice. Article X Section 12-1011 Duty of Solicitors or Peddlers. It shall be the duty of every solicitor or peddler, upon going onto any premises in the Village upon which a residence is located, to look for the notice provided for in this Article, if any is attached, to obey the statement contained on the notice. If the notice contains words such as NO SOLICITORS OR PEDDLERS, then the solicitor or peddler, whether registered or not, shall immediately and peacefully depart from the premises. Any solicitor or peddler who has gained entrance to any residence, whether invited or not, shall immediately and peacefully depart from the premises when requested to do so by the occupant.

A few days after this photograph was taken, The Cardinal caught up with the black male that was photographed in this report. The man said that he worked for Fast Track Marketing of Lombard, Illinois. He said he wasn't selling anything, but that he was out presenting home remodeling product for Sears. Click here Fast Track Complaints- Marketing Scam Beware for a posting from a job applicant who did not like his experience with Fast Track. Fast Track's job classifieds don't specify that they are a door-to-door sales outfit.

ARLINGTON HEIGHTS BREAKING NEWS --The Cardinal -- Arlingtoncardinal.com is a breaking news blog with Arlington Heights & Chicagoland emphasis. For in depth coverage, try the following links for network television, cable news networks and Chicago local media coverage ...

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#14 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Ah, Here We Go.

AUTHOR: Sean - (U.S.A.)

Yepp, well I've read threw this long list of complaints and praises and here's my story.

Firstly lets get these two things straight

1. I'm young, and did do the whole "add in the paper" thing

2. I found out about many of the problems the first day and stuck around to kind of see what would happen.

When I walked in the building for an interview I was kind of taken back by the interior. It was gross to say the least. I remember staring at the carpet and laughing because this was "Kirby" a vaccum place, and the carpet was disqusting. I had my interview, well I suppose you can call it an interview it lasted about 5 mins. I was hired on the spot, they didn't check my resume for anything. So I kind of thought "Okay, that was strange I'll just roll with it."

Then came the first day of training. Before I went into work that day I looked up the company "VIII" ( a syndicate of Kirby) and read some reports on here. Still the promise of a 1200 check was pulling me in. I remember sitting around all the other people. Some were poor, others were single mothers, other were just fresh IN college and poor. I listened to the whole speel about how much money we could make and etc etc etc. The first wasn't bad, and I'm fine admitting that. But then came the rest of the training.

I had my warning signals up and ready to go at anything and I noticed all the smaller things. How much our trainer talked about how many "Cars he had" and what a nice "house he had" and how he came from nothing and now he was "on top of the world". I thought 'Wow, so they're selling the idea on us. How fun"

And then as training went on, and the pressuring from us was becoming complete we had little competitions 'Dirt Master" about how fast we could put toeghter the vaccum. I had learned from working at a few country clubs that attempting to make employee's compete always was trying to "inspire desire when it already should be there" .

Then came the last day, we were told were going to have too practice on our friends and family. I thought this was fine because it would be a good time to see them, and I get the experience for this job. BUT, and I do say BUT because they started telling us we should sell it to them. I'm sorry for all you Kirby employee's who sold your fixed income grandma a d**n vaccum she didn't even need. I couldn't do that, I have a soul.

And the came the splendid "contracts & papers" we had to sign. And here were the things I took offense too.

1. You have to file your own taxes, showing a lack of accounting ability in the company (not good when it comes to a place that handles your paycheck)

2. It stated in the employment contract "that Kirby/VIII didn't have to gurantee any wages upon signing". RIGHT, Hey! I have an idea everyone, lets work for a place that has no legal oblegation to pay you! Ya!

3. Your an "independant seller". Which doesn't cover you for "workers comp" or social security. Also because your "independant" you arn't protected against sexual harrasment or abuse in the company its self. Basically if someone molested you, you had no legal ground in the company.

4. At no time before training or during training was I told this wasn't paid. I assumed because NY had a "paid training" law that we would be paid for it. No one mentioned that I wasn't going to get paid for it. And they wanted me to sign to it contesting that I knew this before even applying. Mmmmm, I think not. I refused to sign the d**n thing.

Now the kirby vaccum is awesome, I cleaned my own apartment with it from head to toe and it looks wonderful. But these "syndicate" offices are pathetic. They lure people in with the hope and dreams of money and no more worrying and then rip them apart. If I hadn't wasted an entire week of my life there I might have found another job, one that pays and I actually feel secure about.

Thank you
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#15 UPDATE EX-employee responds

The rest of the story.

AUTHOR: Daniel - (U.S.A.)

First off, I feel that the Kirby vac is not a bad vacuum. It does a fairly decent job. As for price and salesmen, thats a COMPLETLY different story.

I worked for the company and saw many shocking things. Having been in sales most of my life I was told to stop by a "Interview" for the company. Never hearing a thing about them and only knowing my grandmother had a VERY old model that still worked amazingly well,(still have it and love it)I decided to give it a go. I came in for the "Interview" and saw at least 17 people in the room filling out applications.

Not stepping in the door but for a few seconds, the man who asked me to stop in sees me and tells me "Hey there! You dont need to stay in here with these guys. Come into my office and lets get to the point." In stepping into his office which looked more like a showcase of "Look how much money I have to buy all this crap!" We sat down and he did get straight to the point with me. "We are in the bussiness to make money. And with me YOU can make lots of money just like me.

Ya see that car out there?(Belive it was a porsche, defenetly red and VERY shiny) You too could own one, or more!" I had to speak up at that point. I said "Lets not try and sell me the job, show me what it is that im selling and we will go from there or I'll just go." He smiled and led me into another room with a stage and the Kirby vac sittin right in the middle. He told me of its past, present, and future. He showed me all these sales pitches or should I say "Magic Tricks" with the kirby, like how a side filter attachment that had a clear plastic opening to show when you vacuumed the suckers, sorry, customers floor, they could see all the dirt that there vacuums was not cleaning up. Even showed me how it when turned upside down, with a piece of carpet on the vac head, it sucks baby powder completly through the carpet.

(oooooooooooo.......aaaaaaaaaahhhh.) I finally couldnt take anymore and just asked what the cost was. He beat around the bush for a few until I said I was going to go and he finally told me how the "payments" and cost worked. I was shocked. Why in the world was it so much when we could sell it for so much less if we had too but, not to do so cause it was your money that you could be making.

I took the job for a test run as I called it. I sold lots of the vacuums. NEVER over $800. I was mocked and made fun of for my lack of abillity to sell and my small checks compared to others there who sold them for so much more. After about a 2 months I started to have pay check issues. Not the correct amount, didnt make it in the mail, bonus checks not put in, etc. I put up with it for a little while and finally pulled the manager aside. I heard every single excuse in the known world. I finally said either give me what was owed to me, or I was leaving to go to a lawyer. He calmed me down with a offer of a check AND a vacuum to keep for my "Dedicated Work Preformance". Not only that but I got a few days off to relax and spend time with my wife and kids since I had been so busy with my work. What a crock!

I went home and took my family out to dinner and a movie for the kids. The next day I woke to screaming and smoke alarms. My wife had tried to use the Kirby vac and the motor burned up from being locked up. It was a used up peice of junk. I was pissed. I talked with her for a while and realized that I had not cashed the check and started to get worried if he had screwed me on that too. I went to my bank to cash it and found that the check was canceled. I ripped out of the parking lot to get to the office and let the boss know what I thought of him. I no more got in the door and was bombarded with hi's and how are ya enjoing your vacation? I pushed through them and went straight for the bosses office.

I opened the door to find him talking with another sucker to come work for this great company. I told the kid to get out and go find a real job! The kid left and the battle began. He acussed me of stealing from the company by telling the customers that they could get the vacuum for lot lesser amount by acting like they couldnt afford it and barder with the boss to get it cheaper. (truth. Im not goin to screw people for a $300 dollar vac. Most ever charged, was close to $760, never saw that commision, big surprise.) Hew also said that I would lie about going to my appointments with customers and would go home and goof off. (False. I ALWAYS went to my appointments. I needed the money come on!)

Not only that but the vac he gave me was supposedly one that I sold that cost HIM money to replace. (Bull. I never once sold a defective OR dirty vacuum. I cleaned it from top to bottom. It looked brand new each one. I took the price down for people the longer I used it. Fair deal I felt.) I finaly told him those famous words we all have wanted to say at least once in our lives " You Can Take This Job And SHOVE IT!!" (with added words of Were he could shove it also)

So as to all you people out there, DONT fall for there salesmen. The sales pitches get better each year, trust me I know. Now I dont know if all the sales offices of Kirby are this way but since my quiting Ive heard MANY of stories of other employes and customers being riped off. Even had a manager tell me of his many years of lies and stealing with the company.(15 years to be exact)

All I can say is just be ready when they come to your door. My years of dealing with them has lead me with only one working response that has left many a kirby salesman and woman in shock and speachless......"If ya want to sell me a Kirby first come take a look at this." I take them out to my garage and show them my "Gift" vac from that wonderful ex-manager of mine. Its been taken out to my fathers property and shot with a 12gauge shot gun, a old colt45, a number of other handguns my father owns, a few 22 rifle shots just for kicks, and finally tied to the back of my fathers truck and dragged down a couple back roads for about an hour.

I then tell them "This is what I feel about the Kirby vacuums. Imagine what I feel about there salesmen." I then walk into my home and they have never once stopped me from walking in or have been outside when I walk back out to see if I have to tell them to leave. Give this a try, It works for me. And If you have a problem with a salesman that wont leave ya alone, send them to me. I love the look on there faces. :)
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#16 UPDATE EX-employee responds

The rest of the story.

AUTHOR: Daniel - (U.S.A.)

First off, I feel that the Kirby vac is not a bad vacuum. It does a fairly decent job. As for price and salesmen, thats a COMPLETLY different story.

I worked for the company and saw many shocking things. Having been in sales most of my life I was told to stop by a "Interview" for the company. Never hearing a thing about them and only knowing my grandmother had a VERY old model that still worked amazingly well,(still have it and love it)I decided to give it a go. I came in for the "Interview" and saw at least 17 people in the room filling out applications.

Not stepping in the door but for a few seconds, the man who asked me to stop in sees me and tells me "Hey there! You dont need to stay in here with these guys. Come into my office and lets get to the point." In stepping into his office which looked more like a showcase of "Look how much money I have to buy all this crap!"

We sat down and he did get straight to the point with me. "We are in the bussiness to make money. And with me YOU can make lots of money just like me. Ya see that car out there?(Belive it was a porsche, defenetly red and VERY shiny) You too could own one, or more!" I had to speak up at that point. I said "Lets not try and sell me the job, show me what it is that im selling and we will go from there or I'll just go."

He smiled and led me into another room with a stage and the Kirby vac sittin right in the middle. He told me of its past, present, and future. He showed me all these sales pitches or should I say "Magic Tricks" with the kirby, like how a side filter attachment that had a clear plastic opening to show when you vacuumed the suckers, sorry, customers floor, they could see all the dirt that there vacuums was not cleaning up.

Even showed me how it when turned upside down, with a piece of carpet on the vac head, it sucks baby powder completly through the carpet.(oooooooooooo.......aaaaaaaaaahhhh.) I finally couldnt take anymore and just asked what the cost was. He beat around the bush for a few until I said I was going to go and he finally told me how the "payments" and cost worked. I was shocked. Why in the world was it so much when we could sell it for so much less if we had too but, not to do so cause it was your money that you could be making.

I took the job for a test run as I called it. I sold lots of the vacuums. NEVER over $800. I was mocked and made fun of for my lack of abillity to sell and my small checks compared to others there who sold them for so much more. After about a 2 months I started to have pay check issues.

Not the correct amount, didnt make it in the mail, bonus checks not put in, etc. I put up with it for a little while and finally pulled the manager aside. I heard every single excuse in the known world. I finally said either give me what was owed to me, or I was leaving to go to a lawyer. He calmed me down with a offer of a check AND a vacuum to keep for my "Dedicated Work Preformance". Not only that but I got a few days off to relax and spend time with my wife and kids since I had been so busy with my work. What a crock!

I went home and took my family out to dinner and a movie for the kids. The next day I woke to screaming and smoke alarms. My wife had tried to use the Kirby vac and the motor burned up from being locked up. It was a used up peice of junk. I was pissed. I talked with her for a while and realized that I had not cashed the check and started to get worried if he had screwed me on that too.

I went to my bank to cash it and found that the check was canceled. I ripped out of the parking lot to get to the office and let the boss know what I thought of him. I no more got in the door and was bombarded with hi's and how are ya enjoing your vacation? I pushed through them and went straight for the bosses office.

I opened the door to find him talking with another sucker to come work for this great company. I told the kid to get out and go find a real job! The kid left and the battle began. He acussed me of stealing from the company by telling the customers that they could get the vacuum for lot lesser amount by acting like they couldnt afford it and barder with the boss to get it cheaper. (truth. Im not goin to screw people for a $300 dollar vac. Most ever charged, was close to $760, never saw that commision, big surprise.)

Hew also said that I would lie about going to my appointments with customers and would go home and goof off. (False. I ALWAYS went to my appointments. I needed the money come on!) Not only that but the vac he gave me was supposedly one that I sold that cost HIM money to replace. (Bullshit. I never once sold a defective OR dirty vacuum.

I cleaned it from top to bottom. It looked brand new each one. I took the price down for people the longer I used it. Fair deal I felt.) I finaly told him those famous words we all have wanted to say at least once in our lives " You Can Take This Job And SHOVE IT!!" (with added words of Were he could shove it also)

So as to all you people out there, DONT fall for there salesmen. The sales pitches get better each year, trust me I know. Now I dont know if all the sales offices of Kirby are this way but since my quiting Ive heard MANY of stories of other employes and customers being riped off. Even had a manager tell me of his many years of lies and stealing with the company.(15 years to be exact)

All I can say is just be ready when they come to your door. My years of dealing with them has lead me with only one working response that has left many a kirby salesman and woman in shock and speachless......"If ya want to sell me a Kirby first come take a look at this." I take them out to my garage and show them my "Gift" vac from that wonderful ex-manager of mine.

Its been taken out to my fathers property and shot with a 12gauge shot gun, a old colt45, a number of other handguns my father owns, a few 22 rifle shots just for kicks, and finally tied to the back of my fathers truck and dragged down a couple back roads for about an hour. I then tell them "This is what I feel about the Kirby vacuums. Imagine what I feel about there salesmen."

I then walk into my home and they have never once stopped me from walking in or have been outside when I walk back out to see if I have to tell them to leave. Give this a try, It works for me. And If you have a problem with a salesman that wont leave ya alone, send them to me. I love the look on there faces. :)
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#17 UPDATE Employee

Clearing the air

AUTHOR: Ben - (U.S.A.)

First and formost, lets get a few things striaght.

In regard to what the mark up of the Kirby is, last time I checked, we live in America, where the Economy is based on the principle of free market capitalism. I would pay about 900 for a Kirby system that is brand new, if I wanted to buy one to do what I want with, now to you guys that live in Cali and are in awe of my luck, keep this in mind, I also live in Minnesota, where inflation isn't so high. and I figure that the Area dist. that I work for probably pays about 700 or so for an entire system.

I am ok with this, becouse I understand the principles of a free market economy. I also figure that the Fac. Dist. that he buys from probably pays less than that as well, and again, free market dictates that is fair, and it is. Now some of you out there probably think that I sound heartless, really, here are some interesting facts about other companys in America

Ford: I love Fords, and get a lot of crap about it at the office, lol, but they do so messed up things. One, parts for all fords, and even GM's and Mopars, and manufactured outside of the country, mostly in mexico where the wages are lower. they only probably put about 3,000-5,000 dollars into any vehicle they make, and probably sell to the dealer ship for about twice that, plus shiping costs, then the dealer marks that up some more, so that they can make a profit as well. Why dosn't Ford, GM, or MOPAR sell directly, becouse it is cheaper in the long run to do it the way they do, becouse they all know that to sell the cheapest cars, at the highest profit is going to make them the most money.

Microsoft: Now here is a company that should be on this site. Bill Gates has created a vitual monopoly in the computer industry, and people complained about it, but not enough to do something about it, and he did it with an idea that his collage friend created, (OMG Bill Gates didn't write DOS, his buddy did), and he stole, and if haveing a monopoly of the magnitude that he has wasn't enough, he when and had the X-box developed, so that he could go into direct competion with one of his biggest clients, Sony, makers of the Playstation game systems, and of the VIAO personal computer system, which they have to put Windows on to sell them. I don't think that any Kirby employee, high up or not ever did anything like that. We didn't sell Vacuums to a company like service master, then go into the cleaning and janitorial bussenss, (sevicemaster isn't a client, just useing them as an example).

Wal-mart: do i really need to say anything

I could go on and on forever about what other companys do, but I would hope that that point would be made now to anyone that is reasonably inteligent.

Why is the Kirby sooooo exspensive. It could have something to do with the fact that they are hand assembled in the USA. engineered to the highest standerds, and that kirby manufactureing in clevland, OH, use NASA technology to make them the best dang Vacuum that you ever saw. bet the hoovers that people go off about being as good as the Kirby can't claim that, and on that subject.

for the people that say that Hoovers and what not preform as well as the Kirby, this just sound ludicris to me, why do you ask. Well when you get a Customer to go over a spot 200-300+ times with the Vacuum cleaner that they are curently useing, and then I go over it 20 with the kirby and pull out damm near as much dirt as what was there when they started, and that is with any other vacuum mind you, then thoughs statements are going to sound ludicris. Now Question for you guys, WOULD YOU GO OVER ANY SPOT IN YOUR HOUSE 200-300+ TIMES WITH ANY VACUUM CLEANER? I have a couple of theroys on this is simple, these people bought a Kirby, and insted of looking at the book, it came with, or watching the video, they just started useing it, and it didn't preform they way promised, or they got there carpets shampooed for absolutly free, yet there feelings, or sense of pride, what ever it is, got hurt, so now there going to bash the product, becouse they don't like the product. to thoughs, I say this, I really hope that you sleep well at night when you realize that you make the work of hard working good people harder, becouse someone offended you, just know that I didn't do anything to you personaly.

couple other issues at hand.

high up's in Kirby that use mind altering chemicals.

Yes, I wouldn't dough't it, I wasn't born yesterday, however, do you realize that is like saying there are mormans in utah, what I mean by that is that alot of people in the bussness world use chemicals of some kind or another at one point or another, and if you think differently, then you are nieve my friend. do you want to know why, think about the stress of running a big company, most CEO's are also closet alcoholic's, and don't pull that holier than thou, it's leagal crap, it's still a mind altering substance that ruins lives. the rest of that point is another debate that is better done on another stage

Selling to friends and Family
Ok, so I can see the logic somewhat on how haveing newbies sell to family is wrong, but when you concider that most of thoughs deals are sold at under distributer cost, not really. I would say that is kind of a grey area, and it depends on the dist.

yes, there are a-hole dist. in kirby, and a-hole dealers too, but if you guys that are customers sit back and think about it logicly for a moment, there is probably a couple of A-holes where you work too, that is life, and I would suggest geting over it, or your life is going to be long and hard.

to the ex-dealers, sorry you couldn't make it work out, cuz this is a fun job, I don't know how anyone can go out in there first month though, and not sell at least three or more. I sold 5 the first month, and with the exception of this last month, that number has been riseing, but I had alot of car trouble last month, so that had something to do with it. as far as the people that feel that they got suckered into working for Kirby, really, are you going to admit to the things that a statment like that intails, cuz you make it sound like you not that bright, just to let you know, you didn't notice the posters in the training room that said Kirby all over them, and the fact that you were in an office that probably looked like there was hardly anyone there during the day. As far as crooked dist. are concerned, my dist was going off about them the other day to me, but like I said, all companys have bad people in them, and there isn't much you can do about that.

the attachments don't ruin the Kirby, they make it the most versitale Vacuum cleaner that you can buy, plus if you put the hose on where the bag gos, (blower mode), put the wand on, and bend the hose so that when you drop a jaw breaker down the tube, it also makes a fairly powerfull electric air cannon, lol. Atomic fireballs work the best, you can launch one up to 50 feet if you angle the wands right.( I use to live in the country, thats how I know that) I can't think of any other Vacuum that can do that.

to buying used.
seems like a good idea, but heres the thing, used you don't know what your geting, case in point, I was dumb enough to buy a used alternater for my car, to save some money. paid 35 buck for it as aposed to 150 or more for a new one. when i put it in, the car ran like crap, now i had gotin the thing tested before I put it in, so I didn't suspect it, and drove the thing for like three weeks, going crazy wondering why the car kept stalling, (yes ladys and gents, I am a white collar professional that works on my own cars.) this I got frustrated, took it to the mechanlic shop that I do bussness with for them to charge me 70 dollars to tell me that the alt was indeed bad. I took it out, put in a new one, and the car ran perfectly since. cost of trying to save money, 35+70 is 105 plus the money that I spent buying a new one in the end anyway, (150) I spent over 250 on a 150 repair. the reason I say that is simple. when you buy from someone other than a dealer, your geting a used product, used by someone else, and who knows how they treated it. (the kirbys are tought yes, but there are people out there that could mess up a flat basket ball). and if you buy on ebay, well I would definatly say buyer beware there too, cuz for all you know, they could be takeing moters out of older models, and puting them in newer caseings, so you'd be paying 700-900 for a Ultimate G with a G-3 moter in it, meaning your paying 900 for a vac that would sell for like 200-300. also too, there is no factory warenty with a used Kirby, what your buying used is on the good faith of the seller, and who are you going to trust, some kid selling them out of his parents basement on E-bay, or a company that has been in bussness for 92 years, and has a history with the BBB that is unsurpassed, in three years only 79 complaints, and most of thoughs were on the sales tactics.

to the guy that quit when he was getting into 1 out of 4 houses he knocked, and closeing 75% of the time, hmm, lets see, easily you did 3-4 demos a day right, and I am going to use todays standerds to make it easy for everyone, lets say you did three demos, and hell, all lowballed you, that is a 150 day, which yes, would be crap for you, but what it one sold full, and you made 350, secound sold you made like 200, and the last one, you really had to cut it, and made only 100. 350+200+100= $650 in one day, now 40X8= $320, and heres the thing, you probably had more days like that than anything else right, cuz that would be how it would go on a knock/van crew. Now I can't figure out why you would do that, unless you had some serious moral issues, which is what it sounds like to me, and probably that you really didn't like you job, which is more what i would be inclinded to belive for the simple fact that even "Ug" the caveman can figure out that 650 in one day is better than 320.

lastly, if you had a guy come in, and clean your carpets for free, and all you had to do was go though him/her trying to get you to buy it, how is that a rip-off, did they take your spare change on the table when you wasn't looking or something. Here's the thing, if someone is giveing you something for free, even if it is part of geting you to buy something, don't be an A-hole and talk about how you were victmized. there are too many victoms in this country today, you didn't lose any money on the deal, and you didn't lose your health, and you even got a carpet or two cleaned, and all you had to do was spend a little time to get it. Where I am going with this is, I feel like I am geting cheated more when a customer complians about the fact that they felt pressure when all I asked them is if they wanted to buy the da*& thing, and how dare you say that you got cheated when you got something for free, shame on all of you that do that, and you know who you are, and shame on the people that give me, and all the other hard working and good dealers a hard time becouse of how another dealer treated them in the past. shame on the people that bash the product becouse they don't know how to address the real problem. and shame on people that only here the word free, and not use the comon sense that god gave a goose to figure out that there would be a reson for it.
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#18 Consumer Comment

I am the Owner of a Kirby - Two of them!!!

AUTHOR: Tony - (U.S.A.)

I had an exceptional experience with one of my Kirby Sales Reps. He was very new, but he did a great job in his demonstration. His sales Manager came to assist him, and things worked like a dream.

As a Professional Sales Person, I would say there is not anything wrong with the closing techniques I seen. I also gave my suggestions on closing techniques and they told me those are exactally what was taught to them.

The Kirby's I do have, are excellent Machines. They are working better than any other machine in the house, and we proved it. None of our machines are cheap.

As we have a Cleaning business we took the salesman through the wringer, and then some. Spending several hours at my house, these fine Sales professionals sold Five Machines at my Location.

Every one of my nieghbors are happy and very satisfied with their machines as well.

Those of you that have made comments regarding door to door salesman. This is a profession. This is one of the Toughest Professions in the world. You make commissions based on your performance Period. Either you make the sale or you don't.

Like Amway, and other products that have the best names in the industry, have been around longer than anyone in the industry, watching them come and go, yet still surviving through thick and thin, while those faceless, online people who do not wish to shake your hand, do business and sell you a cheap product, only to vanish and not back up their product 20 years from now.

I have sold Cutco Cutlery Door To Door, and still think it is the absolute best knives in the industry bar none. I have sold water door to door, I have sold radio advertising door to door, and I have found that to best serve the client is to have the face to face interaction.

I also had a guy rent an apartment from me who sold Kirby years ago. He was one of the few people who paid his rent on time, all the time.

Good Job Kirby Salesman!

I love my Kirby.
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#19 UPDATE Employee

I've Read everything to here

AUTHOR: Jason - (U.S.A.)

When my trainer told me that it is illeagal to sell or buy Kirny machines online I knew it was BS. I looked on Ebay and found buy it now $612.00. Seller had a perfict rating..

also I have a bit more information for anyone else who wants to know some facts about horrible salesman training camps

I was called one night by a friend of many years telling me about the really good paying job she got. I was interested and also out of work. So I car pooled the next day and found out I would be doing Demo's for Kirby. I sat through the training and enjoyed my free lunches. On the last day of training. The agreement papers were signed for "Free training" "contractor disclaimers" and everything else I'm sure you all are familiar with. When I recieved my Kirby and took it home, I first read the papers I already signed. Turns out the Demo's I did this weekend probably wont qualify because I was never equiped the the "Customer Evaluation Form" or the "customer survey Form" both required for the Demo to quilify according to the contract I signed. This is Fine, I have very little time invested, and my carpets at home are clean :)

What concerns me is my friend and her father have already been sold into the hiring scam. They have already sold 3 Kirby machines to family members in thier practice demo's. I wish them the best of luck and hope they dont get scammed.

As far as the Kirby goes, If you put a filter on any machine they will pick up dirt and get dirty. Clearly the vacuums work because the bags do get full. Kirby just has a decieving marketing stratigy.

Next I would like to cover all the money promises. I am a very skeptical person the the first thing I did on my first break was look at the cars in the parking lot and I figured out what the "Teacher/Top Salesman/Interviewer" Was driving. It was a Neon. This office was runned down, dirty and had no computers. When I questioned about why there was no computers. I was told "We keep costs down to pay you more" okay sure...I didnt want to continue this conversation because he was pretty devensive...

The final thing I was told is how to turn a B loan into an A loan.. This didn't sound leagal at all... We were asked not to share this info because he didnt want everyone doing it, and his office wouldn't be "Number one in sales anymore"

Here is how it works.. If the Machine is to be sold at 1499 we would add 100 to it if the customer would fill out a check for 100 (down payment) from there we would drop the 100 back off the load, write VOID on the BACK of the check and fax this to the finance company to show comitment to the loan. and then give the chack back to the customer. this is a LIE to the finace company...

Yes We are "Gutter Rat" trying to get quick money. The class was full of lower class people getting of the City busses driving beatup cars and lack of education wich explains my typos and spelling errors, But I know what it is right and what is wrong... What the Kirby office on Federal in westmienster is doing to my friends is wrong... The Father was working manufacturing for 30 years and the plant closed down. My friend was just in between jobs. They also are from lower class neigborhoods and needed money bad. Now thier family is in dept another 6 grand becuase they sold 3 Kirbys in thier practice demos using these shisty sales meathods, and probably wont get paid for what they did, because like myself signed the contract that states "All DEMONstrations must be on demo evaluation sheets." and "The cunsumer reaction report or questionnaire for each demonstration must be turned in to the office with the pay per demo sheets no later than Monday morning before the meeting to be paid on Saterday" This is not fair and Dirty. No one in the class recieved these "sheets" we were all rushed through this paperwork. and did not have time to read it. I learned a lession from this.

I will follow up when I quit.
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#20 Consumer Comment

Feeling tricked.

AUTHOR: Yvette - (U.S.A.)

Yesterday evening I was home when I heard a knock at the door. A nice young girl offered a free carpet cleaning of one room--with no obligation. I should have just politely declined, but I said yes. Right about now I remember the words my father told me when I was very young, "nothing is ever free." Why did I let her in you ask? Well, I am a little over a week away from moving across country. In fact, just before the young girl knocked the manager of my apartment complex was conducting my pre move out inspection. He just happened to mention that the carpets were going to have to be cleaned. So, I guess I was vulnerable. A few minutes later, she arrived with the Kirby system. I had already experienced a mishap with a Kirby sales rep. and was not excited. She then proceeded to unpack the vacuum and assemble it. Shortly after, her supervisor arrived to make sure she would do a good job and not forget to call in for her "points." I had just vacuumed my carpet just a few hours prior and felt it was decently clean. (Or else, I probably wouldn't have let my 9 month old son crawl around on it!) I was extremely disgusted at what she proceded to pull from my carpet (which I had assumed was clean). This was probably the strongest selling point. I generally try to be an educated consumer; I check consumer reviews and reports and do the research. I will buy a more expensive product if it seems to be made with integrity and value. I guess that also comes from my upbringing. I do not buy disposable, I buy for the long term. I guess that's why by the end of the demonstration I had out my check book and pen. As you can probably tell by reading this, I believe that the Kirby vacuum is a good product and seems to be what they say it is. My problem is how it was sold to me. My husband was not home for at least half of the demonstration, when he did get home he watched, but wasn't quite as sold as I was. Also during this time, my son woke up and had to be fed. The supervisor came back a few more times and was nice, but had that slimy sort of sales pitch. After seeing the price list, I knew we couldn't afford this vacuum. My husband and I are already paying a mortgage, he gets out of the military next week and then we will have no income until I start my career. I obtained my BA in December, but I have been a stay at home mom until we move. The next few months could be very tight, financially. I have several good leads on employment, but making large purchases without much prior thought is irresponsible now that I am thinking about it. So, I am sitting here in front of my computer at 12:30 at night with this vacuum which I probably shouldn't have bought. I usually pride myself on making responsible financial choices. Luckily, I wrote a check for it and should be able to stop payment if all else fails? I have already talked to the distributor and he seems willing to take it back. I can't help but to have a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach about this. I would not have buyer's remorse right now, if I had made an informed and responsible decision. After spending the better part of the evening doing a little bit of research I have found that most people who have written about Kirby vacuums are not pleased with the sales tactics. I have to agree. I feel that I was pressured into the decision. I have been waiting to make some smaller purchases for quite sometime because I didn't think that we could afford it at the moment. I know there are probably about a million things out there that if I was acquainted with, that I could probably not live without. Some salespeople are excellent at what they do, I have to admit. In the future I will keep all of this in mind and from now on my door will bear a sign that says "NO SOLICITING!" Thanks Kirby, but I will need to return this unit. Right now, I have to focus on the necessities at this point, and maybe then someday I can ELECTIVELY call up Kirby and get a good vacuum.
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#21 UPDATE EX-employee responds

What a silly argument...

AUTHOR: Lamont - (U.S.A.)

As in all things, there are faults on both sides.

I used to be a Kirby salesman. I sold Kirbys for 7 years in two different cities. I trained some of the best salesmen the company has had.

I can tell you... Customers and salesmen are human beings. We are not perfect. We all make mistakes.

Customers make mistakes with using the Kirby and instead of realizing they didn't pay enough attention to the demonstration or feel victimized for letting them in their homes, they blame the Kirby and the company.

Salesmen can mistakes with the demonstration or aren't properly trained and don't sell and instead of asking for help or learning more about sales, they blame the Kirby and the company.

Grow up. The Kirby is a lifeless vacuum cleaner. The Kirby company is based on business practices perfected over 90 years. Stop blaming them.

Blame yourselves for being human beings with faults. Blame yourselves for blaming others.

All that you will ever get out of anything is whatever you put into it.

Personally, I have worked for a horrible distributor. Thank God he is no longer in business here. I don't blame the Kirby Company for that distributor though. His personality flaws are not the company's fault. I have worked with terrible salemen that couldn't sell ice cream on a hot day. I don't blame the Kirby vacuum for that. Their lack of sales skill isn't the vacuum's fault.

I thank the Kirby Company for teaching me sales. I thank the Kirby Company for the people skills I have gained by selling to thousands of people. I thank the Kirby Company for making one of the few actual quality products available for purchase. I thank the Kirby Company for allowing the average person the chance to make a good living for their family.

Don't blame the company. Blame us all for being the imperfect people that can mess up good things.
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#22 UPDATE Employee

What a crazy game we all play in life.

AUTHOR: Daniel - (U.S.A.)

Well, to be perfectly honest I don't quite know where to begin. I'll start with this:

It's now 4:19am, and I'm tired as hell. However, for some odd reason I feel like responding to some of these rebuttals.

Dear Tom,
I do apologize that your distributor was a p***k. A man of immoral values and obvious lies. A lesson learned in life I suppose. To give you a background on myself...I'm a former United States Marine. Don't get that being a Marine confused with being an idiot. Not all Marines are idiots. I was promoted to Sergeant in 3 years...mostly unheard of in the Marine Corps. Since you decided you'd throw your IQ around, I'll follow up with mine. In the 8th grade it was 142. Now from what I understand, it goes up until the early 20's, I could be wrong, but either way, not too shabby I suppose. EQ is another matter entirely, but I'm sure you know all about that as well. I've graduated college, I actually have a B/S in Business Management emphasis in Sales and Marketing. So as far as the educated route goes, I suppose I've done a little of that.
I'm also an employee at a Factory Distributorship in Northern California. Well, I guess I'm a bit more than an employee...I'm a DPS at the moment. And Tom, to be perfectly honest, I love my job. No, I don't believe I rip people off. Yes, I do believe I provide an opportunity. The same opportunity I've been offered. The same opportunity I am currently investing my time and energy into. No, it's not an opportunity for everyone, especially the feint of heart, but Tom, being the educated man that you are, you should realize that most people on this earth are lazy. Not all, but most. Most people also like to place blame. Again, not all, but most. I love my job Tom. I love being a trainer because I get to offer this to others. Its up to them whether or not they'll follow through. YES, IT IS HARD WORK AND MANY HOURS TO BEGIN. Damnit, what in life good comes to you that you don't have to work hard for? I don't mislead my new hires in any way shape or form. I tell them its Kirby in the interview, step one. I tell them what they'll be doing. I let them know. They're not obligated to sell the machine the first weekend. I pay, out of my own paycheck, for them to SHOW the equipment the first weekend. If they sell, awesome, good on them, it will help boost their confidence level when they go out to the field. If they don't, big deal, there's always tomorrow. I give them the option of selling the Kirby at a low price to their friends and family. If they decide to try and sell it for more, I'll help them however I can.
Maybe the difference between some Kirby people and myself is, that I'm not too concerned about making a shitload of money from my new people. I'm more concerned with them making a lot of money their first week out so they will have the excitement and enthusiasm to move them forward through this long and arduous process.
Tom, how many other companies out there offer someone without a degree the chance to own their own branch office of a multi billion dollar corporation? Well, let me add this, without requiring a huge sum of money to start...and actually allow you to earn inventory? The answer is, not many. There may be others, but it is definately a handful. To be honest Tom, you may make 37.50 an hour, and that is good money, no lie...but how many people have that opportunity? And let me ask you this, I'm sure that many of the skills that you learned in your short tenure in Kirby you have applied to even acquire that job making you 37.50 an hour? Correct me if I'm wrong, but even if you're not ultimately successful in Kirby, and by that I mean becoming a 100+ Factory Distributor, you learn many useful traits in the sales meetings and in dealing with other dealers and customers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can learn something from every person and every situation, be it good or bad.
And just so you know, the Kirby costs $440 now, minus the shampooer...and thats at FD cost. I guess its been a few years since you last checked. Yeah, they sell them a lot higher...but knowing as much about the intricacies of business as you do Tom, you know that there is an overhead that must be maintained; and to maintain that overhead you have to bring in a certain amount of money per deal. And since we're doing all of the advertising ourselves and all of the work, why not make some money for doing it? Which by the way, equates to 40% commission for a new dealer above the cost and 50% for a SR. Dealer (after 12 sales, 13 makes you SR.) At least thats how it works here at our office.
Don't get me wrong, we have a huge attrition rate at my office, but the great thing is, my people know what they're getting into, when they get into it. The ones that stay, which is usually about 4 or 5, stay for a long time and make about 2-5k per month. Yeah, it might not be the best money in the world as a dealer, but the opportunity to own an office more than suffices.
Wow, its now 4:46 and I have to be up to teach a class in a few hours. I guess I should hit the hay. I hope I get some responses, and if I have shitty grammar, its probably because I'm tired as hell. Oh, and by the way, I fought for your right to b***h about a company that will probably continue on long after we're all dust. Oh...I'm also only 24 years old. Thanks. And good night...er, good morning or some s**t.
(By the way Tom, not trying to razz ya any, just stating my opinion against yours.)
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#23 UPDATE Employee

Tom stop pouting, if your job is so d**n great, find something to keep you busy and shut up!

AUTHOR: Melisa - (U.S.A.)

First off, I work for Kirby, and have for two years. Started off with the blind ad, became a dealer, was top in the division my first 2 weeks, qualified for my VIP trip, came back and was top dealer for the following month. I then became a canvasser, became top in the division, and top in the WORLD within the month, began DPSing and was 2 in the WORLD my first month, top in the division.

I now canvass part time, DPS when needed, and help run a van, mind you that has the Division record of selling 103 out of ONE van, so your little 50 a month does NOT impress me. Now, just because your distributor was an apparent dickhead does not mean they all are. You have got to learn to let go and get over it.

You are acting as if you are 2. Great! You earn nealy 40 an hour. Big freaking deal! I do not work from 9 am until 10 pm. As I have children whom need to be picked up from daycare ect. I work generally from 9 until about 5, averaging paychecks from 500-1000.00 a week. Sometimes higher, but mind you NEVER less.

My Fiance' runs the van with me, and has been a golddigger time after time, has the Rolex, ect. He is 28 yrs old and last year's 1099 has an impressive 103,000.00 Year before, 98,000.00. Now correct me if I am wrong but I do believe that is MUCH MORE THAN 40 an hour. I do not see you pulling in that income, now do you? So until you do keep your mouth shut and continue sitting on your a*s hiding behind a computer while the rest of us GET OFF OUR a*s AND MAKE A REAL LIVING!

It is NOT our fault you could not make it. Do not blame us, instead keep your job, have fun at it and enjoy life. I am just happy to say 20 years after I joined Kirby I will not be sitting behind a desk, nor will I still be in the field. Perhaps when my software needs help, I will seek you out just to be sure you will have money to support yourself in the future. Sadly, by then you will probably be laid off, like everyone else, oh! Wait! Except Kirby people as we do not have layoffs.

The reason? Not because the people quit so often, yes people leave on a daily basis, but because business is so well they do not have to lay us off. I come from a Distributor who is now a Regional Supervisor, has the top DPS, top dealer, top new dealer, top canvasser, ect EVERY month and never falls short of 300 + sales, so I don't see ANY of us being broke!!

Now until you have something better to say to Kirby people, I suggest you sit at your lil cozy desk in the corner of some warehouse and type your lil heart out while the rest of us PAY PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO DO OUR s**t WORK!!!
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#24 UPDATE Employee

I'm thinking about quitting selling Kirby's and would like to know more about Mikes idea.

AUTHOR: Peter - (U.S.A.)

I too answered an ad in the paper that promised a monthly salary of $1995.00 setting up "store displays" as I was told over the phone. After 2 days of training I was then told I wouldn't be paid for the training.

I've been reading this thread for the past hour now and am starting to doubt the whole "door-to-door" selling of Kirby's and will probably quit.

I ran across a mother yesterday who didn't want to buy the Kirby but rather said I should buy one myself and go clean people's carpets. Now that I have read that someone else is doing that and it seems to be making good money I'm considering doing that myself.

Mike, I was wondering if you could elaborate a little bit on how exactly you present it to the customer and about what you charge. I'm extremely interested.
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#25 UPDATE EX-employee responds

The Company you think you know

AUTHOR: Mike - (U.S.A.)

To who it may concern, here is a little insight to everyone on both sides of the company...

I worked for kirby for three years I've earned my five diamond three times, I've also had six months as a 60+ Team Leader. I've rubbed elbows with lots of millionairs and been on twelve vacations that i didn't have to spend a dime on.

But, for all of you dedicated Kirby guys here is the real picture.

FACT=There are only two Distributors In all of Kirby who cleared over $1million in 2004 completely from Kirby profit.
This came right from Jeff Bowen having a conversation with Mike Roaldi.

FACT=Jeff Bowen,Nick Kondos&Nick Jr. Brad Dinunzio
Mike Roaldi, Mike Tenhaken, Jhon Cooper and Ron Earl all do an exteme amount of drugs. As a matter of fact if anyone has any of Brad Dinunzio's Recruiting Tapes he has never been on video whithout being stoned.Watch the tapes you won't argue. Not to mention John Feilds the original 12 out of ten Closing average who Mentored the famous Troy Brown. Well John is in prison for raping his wife.

FACT=For all you dumb shits who really arent important enough to ever find out the real price of a kirby its $185.00 and if your distributor is Gold Circle it is $125.00 This is including the larg numbers of free Kirbys they recieve every year if they maintain their quota.

FACT=I forget who claimed thier Dist. Stole 25,000 from them but that is very belivable and here's how it is done remember this if you ever become a DT or AD. If your Distributor Goes through UCFS when you are promoted as AD make sure you get set up in your own name. Some distributors don't even mention this step until you go Factory. Because on every sale you pay 10% into what is called a Reserve it is for credit defaults however after it reaches 10,000.00 the distributor can withdraw the surplus and it is legally thier money even though it came out of your profit. That means you have over $100. added on to your cost on every financed deal. So if you do get that far in the Bis. Remember to Get set up with UCFS in your name IT IS FREE!!

FACT= If kirby is so Profitable and these Distributors are so wealthy why are most of them in another Pyramid Sceme called TEAM NATIONAL.
curious? go to bign.com

I give you all this information because I started my own "opportunity" I quit kirby because there is no amount of money worth giving up your entire life. Like alot of you I've made the big paychecks
I still have the icebreader award on my wall right next to the copy of an $8,563.00 paycheck I got my best week to remind me how lucky I "was" to find kirby.
Why I didnt think of this earyer who knows.
I often wondered if any carpet cleaning companies used kirby's because we all know we can prove a Kirby does a better job than any "PRO-Steam Cleaner" So i tested it out on my day off I took my own Kirby I went door to door telling people I just started a new cleaning company have you heard of it.They responded no, I reply Dont worry Im not a Salesmen and I dont want any donations. She let me in 1st house ever. I told here we do the first room for $20. and if you like it we hope you call us back. Here is the icing on the cake. I still did just a partial Demo but only because I wanted to clean the rest of her floors that day I made $200. in about 45 min. I know that is nothing compared to a full boat cash commision. But she sent me to 2 other peoples houses that first day I made $675.00 and I was home by 5:00PM. I've been doing this for 5 months now I have a Legall Bis. I am on pace to make between 100 and 150 this year and I only work about 20 hours a week.

For all you mad Customers, I still sell the benafits of a Kirby but no credit checks,I do all the work all the time, and no one is mad at me.

And if any of you Kirby guys think I'm a trader you would be suprised how many people who have Kirby's even a Diamond still call me to do the shampooing.

I hope both sides can be happy with my choice.
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#26 Consumer Comment

I have seen it all

AUTHOR: Bobbi - (U.S.A.)

I can't believe they made a thread for this. My husband was in the Kirby business. He was actually a distributor. I have to agree with Tom from N.J regarding alot of his statements. I will set the record straight about the cost (going back on the G5 models) the distributor did pay about $375.00 for the upright & attachments. The shampooer was sold seperately for about $100.00 or so. Now, Kirby like every other product does have the right to mark it up as much as they would like. If you have a problem with that then buy a used one or like the previous letter from the gentleman go on e-bay. I do believe that the 15 demo/week thing is crap! I am willing to say that no distributor/Area Distributor wants to pay out especially when the dealer did not sell a vacuum! I have met alot of Distributors/Area Distributors and "long dollar whores". I have also met alot of wonderful, hardworking people in the Kirby business. One thing that does stand out in my mind was everyone always saying that they had this and that and etc. The fact is most of these people had to scrape their asses just to try and get enough cash to pay for the next shipment of Kirbys! (Tom will know what I am talking about). I have indeed met alot of fake people out there. Alot of these "Strike-It Rich" Distributors really forgot where they came from. I have also seen Distributors/Area Distributors steal sales away from their workers. These workers are the ones that put on the demo and wasted 3-4 hours and not to get the sale when the person calls in 3 days later. I have really seen it all! And the best is when you sell 3 bad deals in a week and the contract gets shopped around..WooHoo your a*s made $90.00 for over 12 hours of work. Now deduct the gas & food & tolls. Big Deal.
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#27 Consumer Suggestion

If you must have a Kirby, buy USED!!!

AUTHOR: Mike - (U.S.A.)

I was recently visited by three Kirby salesmen at home. They were selling the Ultimate Diamond G starting at only $1950. While we were negotiating pricing, I looked on eBay to compare against used models and found one for $450. Still I could only talk the salesmen down to $900 (54% price reduction, what a scam!).

However, after seeing the demonstration, I would agree that Kirby is an excellent vacuum. After the salesmen left, I shopped around and purchased a used G5 for $78 (seventy-eight dollars) on EBay! After all, if they are supposed to last a lifetime, a used Kirby will be fine. Repairing Kirby's is extremely simple. All of the moving parts can be replaced with new ones for roughly $200, if you do it yourself.

In the long run I am glad I was visited by the Kirby conmen. After all, I purchased an excellent vacuum for $78. My advice is to bypass the Kirby Company completely and buy used for a fraction of the cost.
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#28 UPDATE EX-employee responds

I showed up to clean carpets for $350.00 a week as...

AUTHOR: Rhonda - (U.S.A.)

I responed to an ad in our local newspaper that stated "We need 15 men and women to clean carpets" and we will pay $350.00 a week start immediately. When me and my room mate got there we filled out an application. We asked what all work was involved and were told we could do the carpet cleaning or set-up/display or even manager work.... we could move up fast. After 3 days of orientation we were told to sign a piece of paper stating we would not get paid for the 3 days that we spent a total of 10 hours not to mention gas to get there 90 miles there and back.. not directly blaming them, but they did keep saying we would make extremely good money. Then we find out on this day as well, we would be independant contractors ... meaning we would be responsible for any damages etc. We also would have to ride with them door to door trying to get into people's houses to make a demo of the vacuum... We did feel scammed by this as the ad never mentioned this..... needless to say we did not want to be a part of it after the demo they gave explaining that the price was $1995.00 but, they would consider bringing the price down if someone wanted it and it was not in their budget to pay the original price... we were also told elderly people could purchase it for $1000.00 ... in our opinion an elderly person could push it easily.. yes.... but, they could not be able to attach and detach and change out the water/foamy parts on the vacuum.... some maybe.. most no! I am 51 and it was sort of difficult for me to get in the floor to do and undo the parts and carry a little tray of foamy water every 15 minutes or so to get rid of it to be able to shampoo more space.. that was very time consuming and to me would be very hard on an elder... I agree with someone who said that the Kirby manager at orientation was not professional.. ours was a filthy mouthed young girl who was just plain rude and obnoxious.. you could tell she was out for the mighty dollar and that was all that was on her mind... she also said do not clean any furiture even though the Kirby was supposed to do this.. why? Because she said if the colors on a couch etc.. bleed over and ruin the couch.. guess who is responsible..?
Well, we could go on and on... but, we basically believe that the vacuum is only worth probably about $250.00 - $300.00 after seeing it demonstrated, using it there ... and personally viewing what it did or not... yes it did a good job, had lots of things it could do... was light weight to push to vacuum... but all in all.. a fair price is not over $300.00 to anyone .. good or bad credit... Anyone who wants to comment is fine of course but i will say upfront.. i will not respond back as ... when you get done reading this and you place your comment ... just go back and re-read this and others who were at the orientations and first hand practiced with and watched demos of this product.. we were there .. we know! The ad was a scam to start with.. you never know until you go and see what is up.. sorry that we did though...
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#29 Consumer Comment

Obnoxious Accusations

AUTHOR: Michele - (U.S.A.)

My husband and I have never even heard of this company until just a few minutes ago. My husband's cellphone rang and it was a woman saying she was with Kirby and that she had some sort of document that was signed by my husband in reference to us wanting her vacuum cleaners. For one, we already have a vacuum cleaner. Two, we don't use it because we have a maid service and they bring their own. And three, she was calling on my husband's cellphone and we don't even know how she got that phone number. My husband proceeded to tell her we were unfamiliar with her company and their was obviously some sort of mistake. The last thing we are in the market for is a vacuum cleaner from some company we've never heard of at that. Then, she unbelievably told my husband over and over that he did sign this document . I could hear her through the phone across the room yelling, "Yes you did.. yes you did!" Unbelieveable! He asked to speak to her supervisor and she said she was the supervisor. Who is she to tell my husband what he's done and who or what kind of company is this? He frustratingly hung up on her and she called back! Still insisting that he wanted a vacuum cleaner. Can anyone believe this?! Never have I witnessed a so-called professional company behaving in this way. He hung up on her again and asked her to please leave us alone. So, out of curiosity I decided to look on the internet for this "Kirby" company and ironically, I see page after page about the deplorable sales tactics and ethical issues. At least now we've gotten to the bottom of this. And in response to some other feedback I've read, if some of you do work for this company and you say you are good people, then please, for your own sake, go work for a company that will treat you and it's customers right. Take this long list of feedback to heart and realize all of these people are not making this up. We weren't even a customer, but now we never will be. We will tell everyone we know about this unexpected and truly unbelievable experience we just encountered as we were minding our own business at home on a Saturday afternoon. Best of luck to all of you who pursue further relations with "Kirby" and to the woman with no name on the other end of our phone line.
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#30 Consumer Comment

Obnoxious Accusations

AUTHOR: Michele - (U.S.A.)

My husband and I have never even heard of this company until just a few minutes ago. My husband's cellphone rang and it was a woman saying she was with Kirby and that she had some sort of document that was signed by my husband in reference to us wanting her vacuum cleaners. For one, we already have a vacuum cleaner. Two, we don't use it because we have a maid service and they bring their own. And three, she was calling on my husband's cellphone and we don't even know how she got that phone number. My husband proceeded to tell her we were unfamiliar with her company and their was obviously some sort of mistake. The last thing we are in the market for is a vacuum cleaner from some company we've never heard of at that. Then, she unbelievably told my husband over and over that he did sign this document . I could hear her through the phone across the room yelling, "Yes you did.. yes you did!" Unbelieveable! He asked to speak to her supervisor and she said she was the supervisor. Who is she to tell my husband what he's done and who or what kind of company is this? He frustratingly hung up on her and she called back! Still insisting that he wanted a vacuum cleaner. Can anyone believe this?! Never have I witnessed a so-called professional company behaving in this way. He hung up on her again and asked her to please leave us alone. So, out of curiosity I decided to look on the internet for this "Kirby" company and ironically, I see page after page about the deplorable sales tactics and ethical issues. At least now we've gotten to the bottom of this. And in response to some other feedback I've read, if some of you do work for this company and you say you are good people, then please, for your own sake, go work for a company that will treat you and it's customers right. Take this long list of feedback to heart and realize all of these people are not making this up. We weren't even a customer, but now we never will be. We will tell everyone we know about this unexpected and truly unbelievable experience we just encountered as we were minding our own business at home on a Saturday afternoon. Best of luck to all of you who pursue further relations with "Kirby" and to the woman with no name on the other end of our phone line.
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#31 Consumer Comment

Obnoxious Accusations

AUTHOR: Michele - (U.S.A.)

My husband and I have never even heard of this company until just a few minutes ago. My husband's cellphone rang and it was a woman saying she was with Kirby and that she had some sort of document that was signed by my husband in reference to us wanting her vacuum cleaners. For one, we already have a vacuum cleaner. Two, we don't use it because we have a maid service and they bring their own. And three, she was calling on my husband's cellphone and we don't even know how she got that phone number. My husband proceeded to tell her we were unfamiliar with her company and their was obviously some sort of mistake. The last thing we are in the market for is a vacuum cleaner from some company we've never heard of at that. Then, she unbelievably told my husband over and over that he did sign this document . I could hear her through the phone across the room yelling, "Yes you did.. yes you did!" Unbelieveable! He asked to speak to her supervisor and she said she was the supervisor. Who is she to tell my husband what he's done and who or what kind of company is this? He frustratingly hung up on her and she called back! Still insisting that he wanted a vacuum cleaner. Can anyone believe this?! Never have I witnessed a so-called professional company behaving in this way. He hung up on her again and asked her to please leave us alone. So, out of curiosity I decided to look on the internet for this "Kirby" company and ironically, I see page after page about the deplorable sales tactics and ethical issues. At least now we've gotten to the bottom of this. And in response to some other feedback I've read, if some of you do work for this company and you say you are good people, then please, for your own sake, go work for a company that will treat you and it's customers right. Take this long list of feedback to heart and realize all of these people are not making this up. We weren't even a customer, but now we never will be. We will tell everyone we know about this unexpected and truly unbelievable experience we just encountered as we were minding our own business at home on a Saturday afternoon. Best of luck to all of you who pursue further relations with "Kirby" and to the woman with no name on the other end of our phone line.
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#32 Consumer Comment

Obnoxious Accusations

AUTHOR: Michele - (U.S.A.)

My husband and I have never even heard of this company until just a few minutes ago. My husband's cellphone rang and it was a woman saying she was with Kirby and that she had some sort of document that was signed by my husband in reference to us wanting her vacuum cleaners. For one, we already have a vacuum cleaner. Two, we don't use it because we have a maid service and they bring their own. And three, she was calling on my husband's cellphone and we don't even know how she got that phone number. My husband proceeded to tell her we were unfamiliar with her company and their was obviously some sort of mistake. The last thing we are in the market for is a vacuum cleaner from some company we've never heard of at that. Then, she unbelievably told my husband over and over that he did sign this document . I could hear her through the phone across the room yelling, "Yes you did.. yes you did!" Unbelieveable! He asked to speak to her supervisor and she said she was the supervisor. Who is she to tell my husband what he's done and who or what kind of company is this? He frustratingly hung up on her and she called back! Still insisting that he wanted a vacuum cleaner. Can anyone believe this?! Never have I witnessed a so-called professional company behaving in this way. He hung up on her again and asked her to please leave us alone. So, out of curiosity I decided to look on the internet for this "Kirby" company and ironically, I see page after page about the deplorable sales tactics and ethical issues. At least now we've gotten to the bottom of this. And in response to some other feedback I've read, if some of you do work for this company and you say you are good people, then please, for your own sake, go work for a company that will treat you and it's customers right. Take this long list of feedback to heart and realize all of these people are not making this up. We weren't even a customer, but now we never will be. We will tell everyone we know about this unexpected and truly unbelievable experience we just encountered as we were minding our own business at home on a Saturday afternoon. Best of luck to all of you who pursue further relations with "Kirby" and to the woman with no name on the other end of our phone line.
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#33 UPDATE Employee

You guys are crazy

AUTHOR: Adam - (U.S.A.)

I am a Kirby Dealer and have been for more than two years. The Kirby is the finest product on the market and as far as my office is concerned we have the most honest and ethical people in the sales profession.

The Kirby costs a lot of money.....So does everything else in this world. yes there is, after negotation about a 300 to 400 percent mark up on the Kirby. There are also the same markups on Dirt Devils and Hoovers.

A Hoover Vacuum is made of plastic with a weak motor, and a cheap design that is able to bring the cost down, but it uses dirty air to clean the fan.

I researched the parts and componants that go in to making a Hoover Vacuum. These machines can be made in the factory for about twenty dollars.
As for the sales tactics used by Kirby dealers..not everyone learns the right way to sell at first. It takes a while in this business to learn how to sell. Until then...new people use high pressure sales and make up stuff because that is all they know.

I've never come across a customer that had a Kirby that was displeased with it, barring the occasional customer I come across that isn't using thier machine correctly and after I show them the correct way to use it they become happy.
It doesn't amaze me at all that ex-dealers are disgruntled about thier time in the Kirby business. I want all of you to understand as you read these notes that a recent study in the United States showed that nearly 100% of all americans lie from time to time. I don't believe the guy who said his Kirby distributor stole $25,000 from him.

It's tough to put on sixty demos a month for the guarantee if your not used to working hard. And I didn't make any money my first month in Kirby. Now I am averaging about 4,000 a month and attempting to promote.

As for the ads in the newspaper. I thank God in Heaven for the fact that they don't list A Kirby Opportunity as "a job selling vacuums." If they did, I would never have answered the ad...and I wouldn't be where I am right now...with the greatest company and the greatest opportunity in the world!
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#34 UPDATE Employee

Dear Tom, what i love about Kirby most... it allows uneducated, stupid, dumb people like us to make money

AUTHOR: Andy - (United Kingdom)

Tom. Let me tell you what i love about Kirby most.

It is a company that allows uneducated, stupid, dumb people like us to make more money than superior individuals like you.

I work smart, i don't call door to door, i qualify my leads and i like to think i'm extremely successful.

I intended to go to university so i began with Kirby just for summer work. I am still there (2 years), have complete job satisfaction and can't imagine not working for kirby.
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#35 UPDATE Employee

Swamp land in Florida

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

And if you believe that, Flossy has some beautiful swamp land in Florida to sell. It's infested with alligators, but if you don't really have a need for alligators, can't afford alligators, or you're too old to run away from alligators you will be discouraged not to buy.

Flossy,
Thanks for the laugh!
I haven't read anything this idiotic since the old Aaron days.
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#36 UPDATE Employee

GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

AUTHOR: Flossy - (Australia)

I've worked with Kirby for 8 years now and have found them to be nothing but above board. Sure, we've had a few idiots come through our distributorship, but they never last too long. If you end up with an idiot in your house you can only blame the idiot, not the whole company, or product, anyway.

We are encouraged in our meetings to only ever be up front and honest with people. Besides people will only buy what they like, not what they're forced into.

I, personally, have been in homes where the people have loved and wanted to buy a kirby, but seeing that they were either too old to get enough real use out of one, or truly not in a financial position to afford one comfortably, I have discouraged the person from purchasing one.

Yes the hours are long, but thats something I'm choosing to do. My fiance and I work in the business together and we have a ball. We probably get to see more of each other working this way than if we held separate 9 to 5 jobs.

So, to anyone who wants to knock the company, whatever the reason, get over it.
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#37 UPDATE Employee

GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

AUTHOR: Flossy - (Australia)

I've worked with Kirby for 8 years now and have found them to be nothing but above board. Sure, we've had a few idiots come through our distributorship, but they never last too long. If you end up with an idiot in your house you can only blame the idiot, not the whole company, or product, anyway.

We are encouraged in our meetings to only ever be up front and honest with people. Besides people will only buy what they like, not what they're forced into.

I, personally, have been in homes where the people have loved and wanted to buy a kirby, but seeing that they were either too old to get enough real use out of one, or truly not in a financial position to afford one comfortably, I have discouraged the person from purchasing one.

Yes the hours are long, but thats something I'm choosing to do. My fiance and I work in the business together and we have a ball. We probably get to see more of each other working this way than if we held separate 9 to 5 jobs.

So, to anyone who wants to knock the company, whatever the reason, get over it.
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#38 UPDATE Employee

GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

AUTHOR: Flossy - (Australia)

I've worked with Kirby for 8 years now and have found them to be nothing but above board. Sure, we've had a few idiots come through our distributorship, but they never last too long. If you end up with an idiot in your house you can only blame the idiot, not the whole company, or product, anyway.

We are encouraged in our meetings to only ever be up front and honest with people. Besides people will only buy what they like, not what they're forced into.

I, personally, have been in homes where the people have loved and wanted to buy a kirby, but seeing that they were either too old to get enough real use out of one, or truly not in a financial position to afford one comfortably, I have discouraged the person from purchasing one.

Yes the hours are long, but thats something I'm choosing to do. My fiance and I work in the business together and we have a ball. We probably get to see more of each other working this way than if we held separate 9 to 5 jobs.

So, to anyone who wants to knock the company, whatever the reason, get over it.
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#39 UPDATE Employee

GIVE US A BREAK GUYS... Sure, we've had a few idiots

AUTHOR: Flossy - (Australia)

I've worked with Kirby for 8 years now and have found them to be nothing but above board. Sure, we've had a few idiots come through our distributorship, but they never last too long. If you end up with an idiot in your house you can only blame the idiot, not the whole company, or product, anyway.

We are encouraged in our meetings to only ever be up front and honest with people. Besides people will only buy what they like, not what they're forced into.

I, personally, have been in homes where the people have loved and wanted to buy a kirby, but seeing that they were either too old to get enough real use out of one, or truly not in a financial position to afford one comfortably, I have discouraged the person from purchasing one.

Yes the hours are long, but thats something I'm choosing to do. My fiance and I work in the business together and we have a ball. We probably get to see more of each other working this way than if we held separate 9 to 5 jobs.

So, to anyone who wants to knock the company, whatever the reason, get over it.
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#40 Consumer Comment

RE: Tom and Aaron

AUTHOR: T - (U.S.A.)

Tom and Aaron, you two really should stop all this fighting. Tom has some really good points about the cost of the vacuum. I do not own a Kirby at this time due to a very pushy sales rep. I had a very nice guy come and offer to do a demo and he did a great job. I was sold on the vacuum until his pushy supervisor or who ever the guy was came into my home to do the paper work. This guy proceeded to tell me that the vacuum was $1,200 I would have to buy the shampooer attachments at extra cost and that I wouldn't get any of the cleaners with the vacuum but I could order them at another additional cost. I did my homework while the 1st sales rep was cleaning the carpet. I asked all the questions about the bottles of cleaner and the shampooer etc... The Supervisor would not honor what the sales rep had told me and he thought he was being a "good salesman" by trying to cut me a deal he told me that he would throw in the case of cleaners that was with the 1st sales rep if I would give him my new Windtunnel vacuum as a trade in. After asking him what he was going to do with my vacuum he said that they donate them to shelters etc. I offered him my old oreck that still worked fine (or as well as it ever did) since the cleaners were already used on a few other demos. He shot back why would I want that one and what do you need the windtunnel for since you are getting this great Kriby. I told him that first of all I could sell my Windtunnel since it was only a month old and figured a vacuum was a vacuum as far as a trade in. He then said ok well give me both of them and I will throw in the shampooer attachements. Once again I told him that I would give him the orek but not the windtunnel. He said that he would be right back he had to talk to his boss in the car. I watched him through the window and he was on his cell phone not talking to anyone in the car. All the while the sales rep that was there doing my carpet just stood there not knowing what to do next. He went out to the car to ask what was going on and the Supervisor or whoever he was told him to get the other bottles out of the trunk. They both came in and told me that they could do the deal with the orek but they would have to charge me $50 for the cleaners and the shampooer parts but they were going to throw in another bottle of cleaner to make ME feel better. We sat down to do the paper work and this guy dug himself in a whole and just kept throwing dirt on himself. He just couldn't shut up about my Windtunnel and how I really didn't need it and how I would never get my money's worth out of it and then he had the nerve to say. Sometimes people can be greedy and not want the poor to have anything nice. That sent me over the top. I told him that first of all he could get out of my house and second of all if he felt so strong about giving nice vacuums to the poor then why didn't he give away Kirby's instead of peoples old trade-ins! I told him he had 2 min. To get his crap and get out of my house. He then when into a tail spin trying to say that he was sorry and he would knock off $100 for the whole set cleaners and all. I told him no and asked him to leave. He then shot me a deal of $300 off the deal and everything that was in my living room even the guys little black case the cleaner bottles were in. I again said no please leave. He got loud and very aggressive and told me that the poor guy that was doing the cleaning would get in trouble for the sale going bad and that he only had today to get all his sales in or he would be fired if this sale didn't go through. Never once taking the blame for the sale going bad. I did feel sorry for the sales rep that did indeed do his job but I also felt that if he could shoot me this great deal now that I said no then he was scamming me from the start and that just plain pissed me off! I once again said NO and told him that I was going to call the police if he didn't not remove himself and his stuff from my home. After another two minuets of him babbling on it took me going to the phone and picking it up for this jerk to get the hint. After this whole thing it has left me sour on Kirby's sales ethics and after reading Aaron and Tom scream it out on this "complaint" about a Kirby sale it only showes me that the people who work for Kirby tend to be a little on the angry and vindictive side. Tom thumbs up for getting out of this kind of work and hope you do well with your new job. Aaron I hope you will read this and find that a job that causes people to fight, lie and scam is not a job worth having. Move on, who knows maybe there is an opening where Tom works.
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#41 UPDATE Employee

Tom.. Didnt you say you were a top seller..?

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Well aleast I get the last word.

BTW Tom, I cant find one Tom E anywhere in the kirby elite magazines from your era.Didnt you say you were a top seller..?

What division were you supposedly in..?
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#42 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Dumb, Dumber and Dumbest!

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

If there was a new movie called Dumb, Dumber, Dumbest, you would be the star!

As far as your last comments;
experiance - not a word
comback - not a word

When making a statement such as the one you made In my experiance people who brag, like "yours truly", are the one's people most consider to be the Moron.

Using the term (your truly) refers back to yourself. So basically you called yourself a moron. I'm glad we're in agreement!

Question; Why did you sit near the guy you claimed was snacking on his own toenails Were you;
A. Hoping to catch and eat the crumbs.
B. Hoping to gain some badly needed negotiation skills.
C. He's your father.
D. All of the above.
Based on your past several comments, I'm going with D.

You started out one of your sentences with the statement I may be a little ignorant.
I totally disagree. You're extremely ignorant and continue to prove it with you inane rambling.

You really should consider at minimum going back to 3rd grade and learning basic language skills before you continue to make a complete a*s out of yourself in public, since you've already done so here.

FYI
You're too stupid to continue to converse with. I have other people with IQ's above 70 to deal with, so I will not be wasting my time on you anymore, although I am sure you will continue to make additional moronic comments further proving your award winning stupidity.

You've now officially achieved your Kirby five diamond award status in the dumb-a*s category. Congratulations!

Good luck surviving in the real world dip s**t!
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#43 UPDATE Employee

Once again you dazzle us...

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Tom..

Once again you dazzle us with your vast know-all God like intellect and how much of a moron I must be to ever question someone like yourself..

In my experiance people who brag, like yours truly, are the one's people most consider to be the Moron.

I may be a little ignorant to what goes on in management level of my Kirby office, and may very well be a complete moron.But Im truly happy to sell Kirby vacuums and enjoy meeting new people from this wonderful county every day.

I saw a guy at the Movie theater this weekend who made me think of you.He was holding everyone up in line at the snack booth attempting to haggle over the 500% markup on popcorn and soda.

He wound up watching the movie snacking on his own toenails...

Tom, I realy cant wait for your comback, I try and check in weekly just to see your brilliance put to print.
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#44 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Aaron, just when I though you were coming around... again shown your lack of intelligence.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

You have once again shown your lack of intelligence.

1. If you think your distributor is paying $500.00 for a Kirby. You're just plain stupid. I happen to know what a distributor pays and it's not even close. As a matter of it's under $300.00

2. You're statement. "This guy Tom is hell bent on poisoning the consumers mind on the cost of the machine.
WRONG. It's called educating the uneducated, such as yourself, on the deceptive, unethical, rip-off tactics of salespeople like you. I believe you or anyone else who sells a product has a right to make a profit, but a 500% markup is criminal and people deserve to know the truth. Even you!

3. Another moronic statement by you. "Yet he's the same guy that goes out and buys a new car at dealer price.."

WRONG AGAIN! You're wrong an awful lot. Too bad you can't make money by being a dumb-a*s, you'd be wealthy by now.

In fact, I am a supreme negotiator. I know what a dealer pays for a car because I have access to dealer invoices online. I also know that there is typically a 4% hold-back by the manufacturer and I know that if the dealer tells you that you are getting an 8.99% loan from a bank, they are probably making 2% or 3% kick-back on that loan. There's also an added fee called the documentary or doc. fee, ranging from typically $35.00 to $600.00, that I refuse to pay after the deal is made.

Did you know that undercoating and rust-proofing are already on the car when it's manufactured? Did you know that paint sealant and fabric sealant are a scam? Extended warranties are pure profit and the alarm systems they charge $1500.00 for only cost the dealer about $100.00? You didn't know that either did you? How could you, when you drive a 1984 rusted-out Ford Escort that your mother gave you when she didn't want it anymore. Were you aware of these facts? I doubt it.

As for me, I saved several thousands of dollars when I bought my wife's 2003 Nissan Maxima GLE with leather and a kick-a*s stereo that you've heard when someone with a Maxima passes you on the highway, and when I bought my 1999 35th Anniversary, bad-a*s black Ford Mustang with my added Flow Master exhaust system and K&N air filter that you can only dream about driving. Man does that car sound awesome and it's fast as hell too.

I pay under dealer invoice when I buy a car. Do you even know what a dealer invoice is? I doubt that too.

4. You can continue to attempt to have a battle of wits and word with me, but I think you should now focus on Tanya since she is obviously as dumb as you are. You cannot and will not ever beat me. You're not educated enough, you're not smart enough, and you don't even know how to spell the name of the product you sell, "vacume" instead of vacuum. It's obvious you took my advice and used spell-check for your last rebuttal because you were actually able to spell "car". You have come a long way since your first rebuttal.

By the way, my manager said I can still offer you that toxic swamp land infested with alligators and snakes in Florida that's selling for 10 times the appraised value today only for 12 times it's appraised value. But that's today only because I only need one more sale to win a dinner for two at Taco Bell, so I am willing to let it go cheap.

Take my advice and shut the hell up you moron. It is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt. Too bad it's too late for you avoid that possibility.

Life is hard. It's harder when you're stupid. How do you manage?
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#45 UPDATE Employee

Tom and Tanya ..going to keep on selling them..

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Tom-

I think we've been over the argument of cost already.Considering the only person to see a Kirby at or near $500 is a Factory distributer, and he earned that price so lets put that to rest....

Tanya-

First, not all salesmen are the same.I would have pre qualified you within the first 10 minutes and closed within the hour.I know not everyone buys and I dont go to great lengths just to get a sale...(maybe thats why I havnt had a month of 15 sales yet)

Second, do you realy think the very best Hoover they sell touches a Kirby, please take that garbage elswhere.

Show me a Hoover that will pick up sand through carpet padding and then with a few turns of a knob become eather a portable canister or two types of shampooers..

This guy Tom is hell bent on poisoning the consumers mind on the cost of the machine.Yet he's the same guy that goes out and buys a new car at dealer price..

Do you think a $300 Hoover is realy $300 off the assembly line, lol...

How about that peice of crap Orek that all the little ole ladies buy for $500.

My machine is worth every penny you pay.I wish I could sell it for less than I do but then I wouldnt make any money.Im in this business to make money, and I find those right homes with freindly people to sell my Kirby to.

Im not ripping them off, maybe my Boss is, but im certainly not.And as long as I find people who are proud to have a Kirby in their home rather then some overpriced surface cleaner then im going to keep on selling them..

I see it this way, If I can knock into a complete strangers home and sell them a Vacuum for $1700.00 + then I can sell just about anything....
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#46 Consumer Comment

I have never bought and will never buy a kirby.

AUTHOR: Tanya - (U.S.A.)

I have watched this very exspensive vacuum being sold to my father at a very outrageous price.
I watched my neighbors be sold on this at a very outrageous price.

As I have had many demonstrations I noticed one day that my hoover was placed in floor mode and then used to demonstrate that it didn't work as well.

According to consumer report hoover sucks just as well and is much more affordable.

All of the above people mentioned do no longer use there kirbies. they use another brand which is one lighter and two cheaper and three works just as well. I feel sorry they spent the money that they did.

I came to this sight to check out reports and saw nothing but a bunch of arguing from all people, mostly sales people or old sales people or used to bes.

I'm sorry for all of you because of what you have to do to sell the product. I don't care for kirby sales people hones or not because I know that they are here to sell no matter what and realize that they will use whatever tactics needed to make that sale.

my advice for all who are at home or near the house or receive that phone call. get rid of them. they are much like jehovah witnesses, no offense to any, but they too get on the nerves.
home is where your casle is and if you aren't invited, or you're not a friend, you're not invited. i love my big dogs. they work wonders.

i live in the sticks. one day on my way home i passed a car and noticed as i was turning onto my drive that this person was turning around. they followed me home. you guessed it, kirby sales person. unethical, and i let them do their thing and said no after i wasted 3 of their hours. that'll teach them. lol
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#47 UPDATE EX-employee responds

PS

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Kirby - Great Product.

Price - $500 - $550 Complete, Fair!

People - A bunch of scumbag assholes!

Kirby Sales - Urban terrorism...

Everybody - Wake the hell up, go to school, get an education and a real job. Tell your distributor to shove it up his lying, cheating, false promising, looking for any way to screw you out of your money, dirtbag a*s.

Don't say I didn't warn you!

Aaron - I hate to say it, but I told you so. Now do you get the picture?

Just my opinions of course!
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#48 UPDATE Employee

To Mr. Rathernot, embarked on a similar adventure of Lone Star selling

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Ive embarked on a similar adventure of Lone Star selling. My Kirby career as short as it has been (6 months), has been troubling.

I started out with a 20 year veteran salesmen for the first 3 months and made a decent amount of money until a office dispute between him and my Distributer ended my time with him.

After that I was placed on the Van crew, and went out every day with the "Crew" canvasing working class neighborhoods for 10 hours a day after a two hour pep meeting.

This is absolutely (for me) the worst kind of selling I can imagine, both for the dealers and the consumer.

I knock in and demo, then about 30-45 minutes into the Demo my team leader comes by and asks if they want to buy, 99% of the time they are like "Uh, no not at this time".

So he tells me to pull more dirt and He'll be back to check in on me after a bit.

When we do manage sales, they are usualy low balled down to dealer price and we wind up with a $50-$100 overide check for the comission.

I didnt spend 3 months learning relationship selling and selectivity to deal with a $450.00 weekly commision (before taxes ) for 60 hour work week.

Ive been out on my own for a week now, and managed one sale on friday.I made $647.00 selling at full price to a very happy house wife who made me wait until her husband came home to re-demo for him.

I dont feal like I have the same confidence going it alone as I do when Im with someone experienced, but I geusse that will pas with time..

BTW, the day after I quit the Van crew a guy named Mike Embuski (mispelled) from one of Jhon Coopers Van crew's came to work in our office for 3 days.

My Distributer payed him $300.00 a day + $125.00 per sale to supposedly show us all how to sell in larger volume in the Seattle Metro area, lol...

He went 1 for 14 in closing demos, not one time did he get his lazy a*s out of the van to demo or knock a rookie in.

He said he was the master at "Mind f**king" people, and his closing ratio is 1 out of 2 anywhere else.

Im not sure who was a worse team-leader, him or the guy currently holding that title.....
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#49 UPDATE EX-employee responds

long hours cold calling and door hanging for leads, your commissions getting taken with the flimsiest excuses given

AUTHOR: Christopher - (U.S.A.)

I have followed this thread, and I have to say that you are probably the most reasonable person in the door-to-door vacuum market I have ever heard about.

I sold TriStars, Rainbows, and finally Kirbys for give-or-take a year each from 1984 to 1987. I had a decent track record, and did make a few bucks, but I worked my assets off to do it.

Our selling price (for all three) was approx $1299; of that the salesman got roughly $200, with the obligatory "bonuses" for X number of sales in the day/week/month.

It HAS been a while, and I don't exactly recall which brand it was, but I was in the "managers" office one day - He had a call, and left momentarily to get something from another office. On his desk was a manufacturer's invoice, at a price of $325 per unit.

The rest of my story is the same as the other opinions here: long hours cold calling and door hanging for leads, your commissions getting taken with the flimsiest excuses given, etc. etc.

You seem to be the exception that proves the rule, in the vacuum business.
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#50 Consumer Comment

To Tom, Aaron and everyone else reading.

AUTHOR: Rathernot - (U.S.A.)

I'm twenty two years old and I failed K-12th grade. I'm a failure as for education, but i'm not stupid. I like to smile and make others smile, if I can make someone happy it will make me happy. I think of myself as a good person but I also like money, this is where the kirby company comes into play.

I don't knock doors for hours upon hours. I rarely go into neighborhoods where every door has been knocked five hundred different times by kirby dealers with see through sales pitches. I was trained by different people through my years and watched a lot of different dealers do their demonstrations.

I've been in kirby since I was Sixteen. Working out of three different offices all together. The first two were horrible, dishonest and down right insane people. They did brag about ripping people off, they did gloat about money they had in their pocket. They sure never mentioned how they didn't know how to save money or plan for the future. Some made 300 a week, some made 1500 a week. They were always broke and on top of that a joke as for being a human being.

I was raised a different way as we all were, i've had jobs since I was twelve and I know how hard money is to come by, especially when you have nothing and no one to fall back on. I think I am lucky that I was and am being scammed by kirby. The only way they are scamming me is only giving me the possibility to make 674 instead of a 1000 since i'm doing the work.

When I work I work alone and I don't have many tactics besides being very personable. I love myself and I love just being the guy with his own two feet on the ground.

I drive down country roads, every town and city has them, I canvass about three country roads leading someplace that I havent seen yet. I usually work them untill I have spoken to everyone, If they do not let me in one day, they will know me the next time and usually let me in there nice home

I talk to them, I don't salespitch them. Why are you home relaxing while im out here working hard! I don't even say what i'm doing, I just make conversation and usually if they aren't a deadbeat they go along with it. This is not my scam or a scam. I enjoy meeting them, everyone has a different personality and stuff I never seen or heard of.

Everyday I learn something about myself and others. I am becoming educated as a person and not as a robot like they do in schools. Mr Tom, who is a firm believer in liberal education. Just taking a shot at you.

What I do in a home isn't much. I show the product as of how I learned from Brad Denunzio, sid bauman and a few others that are not so known in the kirby world. I add what ever I have to offer into my demonstration too. People enjoy the kirby when I show it, I can demonstrate a cheese grater and make it fun, all you need is a sense of humor and wit.

I do a lot of funny things, not because i'm scamming the people but because *I'M HAVING FUN AND I'M ENJOYING THEIR COMPANY AS THEY ARE MINE*. I remember when I had this guy push the kirby a certain way that is so goofy that I laughed for five minutes. I was good straight man, I was showing him the "proper" way to push the kirby so he won't get tendonitus. This was a joke of course. His wife looks at me as if i'm crazy but also sensing that I might be teasing since this is what I have been doing so she suspected it. She watches her husband push the kirby all around like I showed him and she bust out laughing into hysterics. He stops, looks at her and then looks at me. "I'm just playing along"

At the end of my demonstration I will usually have around 100 pads of dirt in different places. I cover the furniture with them because thats where they came from. I cover the mattress in body size with them, I lay them on the electronic stuff. the floor. I go from the bedroom and to each display. I ask one question, Now that you see what the kirby can do for your home and lives. Can I go ahead and welcome you into the kirby family? Then we shake hands.

It's not always easy, there are people who don't like to let go of money. Some deals aren't so high and some are. My negotiations are soley depended on how much of the kirby they want to buy. I will never sell the kirby at my cost because that is pointless. I'm there to make my own money, not the office money. I strongly urge you guys to work alone, Otherwise you will be used and controlled. Sucked right into the kirby vacuum along with the other kids and brainwashed drones.

I do plan on becoming a distributer but right now I am saving money, what I make in a week doesn't matter to you so it is pointless information to spout off about. I average three sales a week, I work five days out of the week. How many hours a day I put in vary. I do five to six demonstrations a week and just about half buy. Not everyone is going to buy the kirby from you. If they don't see a need for it after my demonstration then I leave.

I have watched my team leader from the first office i worked in drag out an hour grilling old people, young people. Actually arguing over why they need to buy this today, now. Right now!!! or never! This was after an hour or two long demo. That first year took a lot from me, I knew if I quit I had nothing. I couldn't go college because I havent even earned a highschool diploma and kirby was the only thing working for me. Kirby gave from me, but took from me. I was doing what they were doing, anything to get someones money. I was always stressed out.

Since I wasn't afraid to verbalize my opinions to veterans in this business like places we call "The main event", I was actually shown a different way to work for kirby. I will eventually have a team to run but I know I will have to train them so when it comes time for writing up a deal, they wont have to beg or use tactics to get it. All that is needed is a superb demonstration and believe me. eighty percent of the kirby dealers out there put on half assed demonstrations. I use to, and then grill them. I was an idiot, they told me everyone wants to buy one and that its THAT EASY. Just pick up some dirt and make them buy it. All I ever had was bad experiences except the times I go into a home and they already are asking who do I make the check out to? That happened once every five months.

The most I have ever sold was 22, I made less money than I do now when I sell about 13. Anyone can do this, you just need to be shown a better way. I'm not sure if there is a right way. I'm sure if I used all those "tactics" in my demonstrations I could add a thousand dollars onto my monthly ammount but it's not worth it. The only people with tactics are the ones who don't know what they are doing so they make up for it with bullshit. Tactics or knowing what you are doing. Make the decision.

My team will consist of myself and three other guys. To be able to move on from being a dealer I believe you have to have a few months of 35 sales under your name from your team. I think I will have to work a few neighborhoods where some people aren't so happy about kirby but I guess thats how it is. Then I will become a recruiter, and do what I have to do. Then eventually open an office. These are my plans and they always change.

In a way, i'm the boss of the boss in the office when it comes to machines that I sell. He really has no part in it. I feel like a man when I walk in the office and see guys lumped together labled as "the crew". All dressed poorly, talking about insane junk. I do attend a few meetings they have every morning. I don't consider myself better, just free from kirby politics for a while. The distributer has been honest about paying me, as others havent so here in northern california from the redwood division I stay. For a while.

If you're in california and want to do it the right way. I plan on having a team in 2005 and an office in 2007.

Why do I choose to spread my plans out?

I want to be effecient in what I do, I need to be. I have never ran a team before and I don't want a few fluke months and then move on. I want to do that for a year, see others do it for a week or two at times. You cant run an office you don't know how to do these things. I will want to spend a year at recruiting also.
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#51 UPDATE Employee

salesmen make alot more than $200.00 per sale

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

I dont know who you worked for in the past, but my office has been in the same place for 10 years and our salesmen make alot more than $200.00 per sale.Infact, $200.00 is the minimum a salesmen can make.

$1,250.00 is the lowest a Kirby can be sold out of our office. The salesmen then recieve office proffits rather than sales commision..
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#52 UPDATE EX-employee responds

I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

AUTHOR: Christopher - (U.S.A.)

...at one time or another: Kirby, Tri-Star, Rainbow - you name it.

They are ALL scams!

Great vaccuums all, but NOT worth the $1700 - $2000 price tag. $500 maybe... but $2000!!!! Fuggetaboutit!

The "Office Managers" for these companies make $1000+ per unit; the sales puke makes about $200 per unit if they manage not to get cheated out of it by the "office managers".

I love it when one of these salesmen knock on my door. I let them in and tell them that a) I used to sell these vaccuums and don't need the demo (they ARE excellent machines), and b) I'm going to do them the biggest favor of their lives.

I tell them to tell their "office manager" that their "customer" is a former saleman and that he'll take a demo unit if they'll sell it for $500. I tell the salesman that he won't get a commission for that sale, but he will get another sale towards the "weekly bonus". I tell the (usually) young salesperson to call me tomorrow and let me know what his/her "office manager" said.

WITHOUT FAIL, I was told that NO WAY would their manager approve that deal; and, also without fail, I would get a call from the salesperson saying that they couldn't believe it, but their "manager" agreed to my terms!

I then go on to explain how their "office managers" work. They swoop into an area, hire new salespeople, screw their employees and customers alike, and then depart the scene - leaving behind a sizeable group of irate, ripped-off employees and cheated consumers. I tell them that I wouldn't buy their vastly overpriced machinery if it was the last vaccuum on Earth, just because of the shoddy way they do business.

Many have thanked me for this eye-opener and changed careers.
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#53 UPDATE EX-employee responds

I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

AUTHOR: Christopher - (U.S.A.)

...at one time or another: Kirby, Tri-Star, Rainbow - you name it.

They are ALL scams!

Great vaccuums all, but NOT worth the $1700 - $2000 price tag. $500 maybe... but $2000!!!! Fuggetaboutit!

The "Office Managers" for these companies make $1000+ per unit; the sales puke makes about $200 per unit if they manage not to get cheated out of it by the "office managers".

I love it when one of these salesmen knock on my door. I let them in and tell them that a) I used to sell these vaccuums and don't need the demo (they ARE excellent machines), and b) I'm going to do them the biggest favor of their lives.

I tell them to tell their "office manager" that their "customer" is a former saleman and that he'll take a demo unit if they'll sell it for $500. I tell the salesman that he won't get a commission for that sale, but he will get another sale towards the "weekly bonus". I tell the (usually) young salesperson to call me tomorrow and let me know what his/her "office manager" said.

WITHOUT FAIL, I was told that NO WAY would their manager approve that deal; and, also without fail, I would get a call from the salesperson saying that they couldn't believe it, but their "manager" agreed to my terms!

I then go on to explain how their "office managers" work. They swoop into an area, hire new salespeople, screw their employees and customers alike, and then depart the scene - leaving behind a sizeable group of irate, ripped-off employees and cheated consumers. I tell them that I wouldn't buy their vastly overpriced machinery if it was the last vaccuum on Earth, just because of the shoddy way they do business.

Many have thanked me for this eye-opener and changed careers.
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#54 UPDATE EX-employee responds

I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

AUTHOR: Christopher - (U.S.A.)

...at one time or another: Kirby, Tri-Star, Rainbow - you name it.

They are ALL scams!

Great vaccuums all, but NOT worth the $1700 - $2000 price tag. $500 maybe... but $2000!!!! Fuggetaboutit!

The "Office Managers" for these companies make $1000+ per unit; the sales puke makes about $200 per unit if they manage not to get cheated out of it by the "office managers".

I love it when one of these salesmen knock on my door. I let them in and tell them that a) I used to sell these vaccuums and don't need the demo (they ARE excellent machines), and b) I'm going to do them the biggest favor of their lives.

I tell them to tell their "office manager" that their "customer" is a former saleman and that he'll take a demo unit if they'll sell it for $500. I tell the salesman that he won't get a commission for that sale, but he will get another sale towards the "weekly bonus". I tell the (usually) young salesperson to call me tomorrow and let me know what his/her "office manager" said.

WITHOUT FAIL, I was told that NO WAY would their manager approve that deal; and, also without fail, I would get a call from the salesperson saying that they couldn't believe it, but their "manager" agreed to my terms!

I then go on to explain how their "office managers" work. They swoop into an area, hire new salespeople, screw their employees and customers alike, and then depart the scene - leaving behind a sizeable group of irate, ripped-off employees and cheated consumers. I tell them that I wouldn't buy their vastly overpriced machinery if it was the last vaccuum on Earth, just because of the shoddy way they do business.

Many have thanked me for this eye-opener and changed careers.
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#55 UPDATE EX-employee responds

I've sold them all... They are ALL scams!

AUTHOR: Christopher - (U.S.A.)

...at one time or another: Kirby, Tri-Star, Rainbow - you name it.

They are ALL scams!

Great vaccuums all, but NOT worth the $1700 - $2000 price tag. $500 maybe... but $2000!!!! Fuggetaboutit!

The "Office Managers" for these companies make $1000+ per unit; the sales puke makes about $200 per unit if they manage not to get cheated out of it by the "office managers".

I love it when one of these salesmen knock on my door. I let them in and tell them that a) I used to sell these vaccuums and don't need the demo (they ARE excellent machines), and b) I'm going to do them the biggest favor of their lives.

I tell them to tell their "office manager" that their "customer" is a former saleman and that he'll take a demo unit if they'll sell it for $500. I tell the salesman that he won't get a commission for that sale, but he will get another sale towards the "weekly bonus". I tell the (usually) young salesperson to call me tomorrow and let me know what his/her "office manager" said.

WITHOUT FAIL, I was told that NO WAY would their manager approve that deal; and, also without fail, I would get a call from the salesperson saying that they couldn't believe it, but their "manager" agreed to my terms!

I then go on to explain how their "office managers" work. They swoop into an area, hire new salespeople, screw their employees and customers alike, and then depart the scene - leaving behind a sizeable group of irate, ripped-off employees and cheated consumers. I tell them that I wouldn't buy their vastly overpriced machinery if it was the last vaccuum on Earth, just because of the shoddy way they do business.

Many have thanked me for this eye-opener and changed careers.
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#56 UPDATE Employee

your grasp of written english is impressive

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Thank you for spending the time to correct my spelling.

Tom, your grasp of written english is impressive to say the least, as my second language Ill have to double my efforts to master it as you have so clearly done.

However, your grasp of business is a bit shaky.Think of this Tom, does a 2 liter of Pepsi sell for $1.99 right off the Pepsi truck, NO.It goes from Pepsi to a distributer then on to the store where in finnaly sells for $1.99.

Should Kirby follow different rules? Should that fancy car you buy every 2 or 3 years be sold for the price a dealeship pays for the same car?

Its a simple question for someone with an intelect as high as your own..
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#57 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. I don't hold it against you because you sell Kirbys. After all, I did the same for a long time. Way too long! I like the product, it's the best. That's why I have two of them. Hell, I trade in numerous Rainbow and Electrolux vacuums less than a month old because they were crap. I agree with you totally, nothing beats a Kirby. It's the price and the tactics that I can't stand.

Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers. Our distributor doctored credit applications to get deals through illegally. Whether you believe me or not, if you're paying $1200.00 your distributor is ripping you off. I feel bad for you if that's what your price is, because you'll never make any real money.

Since you have been reading the report here for a while, you know I sold Kirbys for a long time and I was d**n good at it, but working 80+ hours a week for an inappreciative b*****d who stole from us every chance he got took it's toll on me. One morning in May of 1989 I unpacked my van for the usual morning Kirby cleanup, to make the unsold demo machines look good again, went to get gas and never came back. My ex-distributor was out of business in a couple of years. He got what he deserved.
I went to work for a food service, selling freezer plans.

Three months later I was the sales manager because I sold my first 15 in a row and when one appointment wasn't home, I knocked on doors until I got in and sold that one too. I was that good and if I wanted to, I could walk back into Kirby today and easily sell 15 to 20 personals a month. The problem is long hours, dishonest distributors, no family life, and in my opinion selling a product worth $600.00 at most, for 3 times that amount.

You may be a nice, honest, decent, family man who cares about people, but I met enough Kirby people to know that most of them are not. Don't judge them by the way they act when you're at your divisional meetings. That's a faade. Almost any one of them would steal a sale from you the minute you turn and look away. I know, it had happened to me more than once. Even by my distributor.

One day, you will may wake up and say to yourself, what the hell am I doing with my life, just like I did. If and when that day comes, do yourself a favor. Do what I did.

1. Get your high school diploma. No offense, but your spelling and grammar are deplorable, and if you graduated from high school, that school should be burned to the ground.

2. Get at least an Associates degree from Chubb, or DeVry, or your local community college. An education will vastly improve your life. You will have options beyond Kirby or car sales or Cutco knives and will have a feeling of pride and accomplishment that comes with an education.

3. Use what you've learned at Kirby to your advantage. Hopefully you've learned positive attitude, persistence and people skills that only door-to-door Kirby sales can teach. I was working for a large telecom in NJ.

The lay-offs came and I was a victim. I went to a tech. fair and heard nothing but whining and complaining throughout the room about how hard it was out there to get a job, and how long people had been out of work. There were supposed to be 21 companies taking resumes. 6 showed up.

Of the 6, 3 were taking resumes for future positions because the currently had none. Of the other 3, 2 were investment companies trying to get people to roll over there investments to their companies. The last wanted people with vastly more education and experience than I had. It did not look good, but because of the persistence and positive attitude I learned at Kirby, and the technical education (A.A.S.) in computer information systems I received at DeVry. I forged ahead and in less than 5 weeks I had a new career at a humongous Pharmaceutical company starting at $30.00 per hour. More than I was making previously. I mostly owe that to the skills I learned at Kirby.

On the Monday I was interviewed, at the beginning of the interview I was told they had other candidates that they already had interviewed, and had more to interview after me. They promised to let me know if I would be hired by Thursday of that week. At the end of the interview I was hired. Having been told I would know by Thursday, I just had to ask, Why me? What made them hire me on the spot? They told me that not only did I have great technical knowledge, I also had the kind of attitude they were looking for. The main deciding question was; this is 50% phone support, do you have any problem with that? I immediately answered with, Bring it on, I love phone support.

My last position was 100% phone support. It was the positive attitude that I learned from Kirby that closed the deal. So you see Aaron, Kirby did do something for me. It made me positive, it made me strong, (that which does not kill you makes you stronger) and it helped mold me into a mental and verbal powerhouse. I'm thankful that I sold for Kirby. It helped make me the superstar that I am at my career today. I would never want to do it again, but I am truly glad I did.

4. Kirby is a great place to start and for some maybe a great place to stay, but if you are as fortunate as I was to learn from it and move on to better things, consider yourself lucky. I do!

I never learned to type so it takes me quite a while to write these letters and I do make some typos. I usually spell check them before I post them, but when I replied to Marie, I was extremely busy and forgot too. I do recommend doing a spell check first, especially on your resume.

---------------------------

I took the liberty of correcting your spelling and grammar mistakes from your last comments. I hope it helps you to write a little better in the future. See below***

I've graded your work
Effort B
Spelling D-
Grammar- D-

With a little time and effort I am sure you can bring these up
----------------------

***Corrected version
Way to go Tom!!!! ..All that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a guaranteed payday. Wow, you're an amazing man Tom, all that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a guaranteed payday.

I mean c'mon, you were getting into 1 in 4 houses you knocked, closing 75% of every Demo and making around 500$ profit from each sale.

Man you should hold seminars to teach us dumb f--ks what being successful is all about.

The fact that you would give up all that money and adventure for a job that only pays $1500.00 a week take home is simply amazing and shows that you have great integrity.

I made half that this week just Bird Dogging 6 sales. I'm sure Peter made closer to 4k considering an average sale was $1899.00 and one low balled down to $1225.00 but he scored a G4 as a trade in.

Not to shabby for a moron with 20 years of service to Kirby.

As for myself, like I said, i'm just a rookie who's to dumb to get burned out by doors slamming in my face.

FYI, not all Kirby offices are ran like yours, we have no van, we don't all go out and canvas neighborhoods like most offices. The office I work out of has 8 10+ year veteran salesmen all AD's who have an understudy ( Bird Dogger ) like myself who they get to knock doors for them.

Last year my Office had 5 months of 100+ sales in an area that isn't very receptive to door to door salesmen ( Washington State ).

Our office also has a code of conduct policy, No High Pressure Sales. We have a great referral program due to our relationship we build with customers i.e., we shampoo the whole house for the customer for the first time.

We may all be a bunch of brainless idiots to you, but a Job is a Job. The last thing I ever want to do is sit behind a desk doing the same ole s**t for the rest of my life.

I meet braggarts like you all the time. They claim to have done this and done that and were the best around.

Back in 1987 things were a bit different, Kirby allows dealers to sell at whatever price they can build enough value for. And yes I know I'm getting my a*s ripped by my factory distributor at $1200.00 a machine, but I haven't earned a better price as of yet. And in all reality that price matters very little considering I'm canvassing for an AD who in turn pays me at the end of the week.

You asked if a dealer could ever hope for $1500.00 a week. I don't think they would stay with Kirby for chump change like that. Look up the name Peter Choong ( my AD ).He's the only dealer ( senior dealer at the time ) to have ever made 23k profit in one month off of 28 sales.

All you proved to me with your bullshit bragging is that your the true idiot.
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#58 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Ok Aaron. I do understand your frustration. I don't hold it against you because you sell Kirbys. After all, I did the same for a long time. Way too long! I like the product, it's the best. That's why I have two of them. Hell, I trade in numerous Rainbow and Electrolux vacuums less than a month old because they were crap. I agree with you totally, nothing beats a Kirby. It's the price and the tactics that I can't stand.

Our distributor lied to us, we lied to the customers. Our distributor doctored credit applications to get deals through illegally. Whether you believe me or not, if you're paying $1200.00 your distributor is ripping you off. I feel bad for you if that's what your price is, because you'll never make any real money.

Since you have been reading the report here for a while, you know I sold Kirbys for a long time and I was d**n good at it, but working 80+ hours a week for an inappreciative b*****d who stole from us every chance he got took it's toll on me. One morning in May of 1989 I unpacked my van for the usual morning Kirby cleanup, to make the unsold demo machines look good again, went to get gas and never came back. My ex-distributor was out of business in a couple of years. He got what he deserved.
I went to work for a food service, selling freezer plans.

Three months later I was the sales manager because I sold my first 15 in a row and when one appointment wasn't home, I knocked on doors until I got in and sold that one too. I was that good and if I wanted to, I could walk back into Kirby today and easily sell 15 to 20 personals a month. The problem is long hours, dishonest distributors, no family life, and in my opinion selling a product worth $600.00 at most, for 3 times that amount.

You may be a nice, honest, decent, family man who cares about people, but I met enough Kirby people to know that most of them are not. Don't judge them by the way they act when you're at your divisional meetings. That's a faade. Almost any one of them would steal a sale from you the minute you turn and look away. I know, it had happened to me more than once. Even by my distributor.

One day, you will may wake up and say to yourself, what the hell am I doing with my life, just like I did. If and when that day comes, do yourself a favor. Do what I did.

1. Get your high school diploma. No offense, but your spelling and grammar are deplorable, and if you graduated from high school, that school should be burned to the ground.

2. Get at least an Associates degree from Chubb, or DeVry, or your local community college. An education will vastly improve your life. You will have options beyond Kirby or car sales or Cutco knives and will have a feeling of pride and accomplishment that comes with an education.

3. Use what you've learned at Kirby to your advantage. Hopefully you've learned positive attitude, persistence and people skills that only door-to-door Kirby sales can teach. I was working for a large telecom in NJ.

The lay-offs came and I was a victim. I went to a tech. fair and heard nothing but whining and complaining throughout the room about how hard it was out there to get a job, and how long people had been out of work. There were supposed to be 21 companies taking resumes. 6 showed up.

Of the 6, 3 were taking resumes for future positions because the currently had none. Of the other 3, 2 were investment companies trying to get people to roll over there investments to their companies. The last wanted people with vastly more education and experience than I had. It did not look good, but because of the persistence and positive attitude I learned at Kirby, and the technical education (A.A.S.) in computer information systems I received at DeVry. I forged ahead and in less than 5 weeks I had a new career at a humongous Pharmaceutical company starting at $30.00 per hour. More than I was making previously. I mostly owe that to the skills I learned at Kirby.

On the Monday I was interviewed, at the beginning of the interview I was told they had other candidates that they already had interviewed, and had more to interview after me. They promised to let me know if I would be hired by Thursday of that week. At the end of the interview I was hired. Having been told I would know by Thursday, I just had to ask, Why me? What made them hire me on the spot? They told me that not only did I have great technical knowledge, I also had the kind of attitude they were looking for. The main deciding question was; this is 50% phone support, do you have any problem with that? I immediately answered with, Bring it on, I love phone support.

My last position was 100% phone support. It was the positive attitude that I learned from Kirby that closed the deal. So you see Aaron, Kirby did do something for me. It made me positive, it made me strong, (that which does not kill you makes you stronger) and it helped mold me into a mental and verbal powerhouse. I'm thankful that I sold for Kirby. It helped make me the superstar that I am at my career today. I would never want to do it again, but I am truly glad I did.

4. Kirby is a great place to start and for some maybe a great place to stay, but if you are as fortunate as I was to learn from it and move on to better things, consider yourself lucky. I do!

I never learned to type so it takes me quite a while to write these letters and I do make some typos. I usually spell check them before I post them, but when I replied to Marie, I was extremely busy and forgot too. I do recommend doing a spell check first, especially on your resume.

---------------------------

I took the liberty of correcting your spelling and grammar mistakes from your last comments. I hope it helps you to write a little better in the future. See below***

I've graded your work
Effort B
Spelling D-
Grammar- D-

With a little time and effort I am sure you can bring these up
----------------------

***Corrected version
Way to go Tom!!!! ..All that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a guaranteed payday. Wow, you're an amazing man Tom, all that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a guaranteed payday.

I mean c'mon, you were getting into 1 in 4 houses you knocked, closing 75% of every Demo and making around 500$ profit from each sale.

Man you should hold seminars to teach us dumb f--ks what being successful is all about.

The fact that you would give up all that money and adventure for a job that only pays $1500.00 a week take home is simply amazing and shows that you have great integrity.

I made half that this week just Bird Dogging 6 sales. I'm sure Peter made closer to 4k considering an average sale was $1899.00 and one low balled down to $1225.00 but he scored a G4 as a trade in.

Not to shabby for a moron with 20 years of service to Kirby.

As for myself, like I said, i'm just a rookie who's to dumb to get burned out by doors slamming in my face.

FYI, not all Kirby offices are ran like yours, we have no van, we don't all go out and canvas neighborhoods like most offices. The office I work out of has 8 10+ year veteran salesmen all AD's who have an understudy ( Bird Dogger ) like myself who they get to knock doors for them.

Last year my Office had 5 months of 100+ sales in an area that isn't very receptive to door to door salesmen ( Washington State ).

Our office also has a code of conduct policy, No High Pressure Sales. We have a great referral program due to our relationship we build with customers i.e., we shampoo the whole house for the customer for the first time.

We may all be a bunch of brainless idiots to you, but a Job is a Job. The last thing I ever want to do is sit behind a desk doing the same ole s**t for the rest of my life.

I meet braggarts like you all the time. They claim to have done this and done that and were the best around.

Back in 1987 things were a bit different, Kirby allows dealers to sell at whatever price they can build enough value for. And yes I know I'm getting my a*s ripped by my factory distributor at $1200.00 a machine, but I haven't earned a better price as of yet. And in all reality that price matters very little considering I'm canvassing for an AD who in turn pays me at the end of the week.

You asked if a dealer could ever hope for $1500.00 a week. I don't think they would stay with Kirby for chump change like that. Look up the name Peter Choong ( my AD ).He's the only dealer ( senior dealer at the time ) to have ever made 23k profit in one month off of 28 sales.

All you proved to me with your bullshit bragging is that your the true idiot.
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#59 UPDATE Employee

Way to go Tom!!!! ..all that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a gueranteed payday.

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Wow, your an amazing man Tom, all that success selling Kirbys and you gave it all up for a gueranteed payday.

I mean cmon, you were getting into 1 in 4 houses you knocked, closing 75% of every Demo and making around 500$ profit from each sale.

Man you should hold seminars to teach us dumb f--ks what being succesful is all about.

The fact that you would give up all that money and adventure for a job that only pays $1500.00 a week take home is simply amazing and shows that you have great integrity.

I made half that this week just Bird Dogging 6 sales.Im sure Peter made closer to 4k considering an average sale was $1899.00 and one low balled down to $1225.00 but he scored a G4 as a trade in.

Not to shabby for a moron with 20 years of service to Kirby.

As for myself, like I said, im just a rookie who's to dumb to get burned out by doors slamming in my face.

FYI, not all Kirby offices are ran like yours, we have no van, we dont all go out and canvas neighborhoods like most offices. The office I work out of has 8 10+ year veteran salesmen all AD's who have an understudy ( Bird Dogger ) like myself who they get to knock doors for them.

Last year my Office had 5 months of 100+ sales in an area that isnt very receptive to door to door salesmen ( Washington State ).

Our office also has a code of conduct policy, No High Pressure Sales.We have a great referal program due to our relationship we build with customers ie, we shampoo the whole house for the customer for the first time.

We may all be a bunch of brainless idiots to you, but a Job is a Job.The last thing I ever want to do is sit behind a desk doing the same ole s**t for the rest of my life.

I meet braggerts like yourself all the time.They claim to have done this and done that and were the best around.

Back in 1987 things were a bit different, Kirby allows dealers to sell at whatever price they can build enough value for.And yes I know im getting my a*s ripped by my factory distributer at $1200.00 a machine.But I havnt earned a better price as of yet.And in all reality that price matters very little considering Im canvasing for a AD who in turn pays me at the end of the week.

You asked if a dealer could ever hope for $1500.00 a week.I dont think they would stay with Kirby for chump change like that.Look up the name Peter Choong ( my AD ).He's the only dealer ( senior dealer at the time ) to have ever made 23k profit in one month off of 28 sales.

All you proved to me with your bullshit bragging is that your the true idiot.
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#60 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Marie, Are you a distributor

AUTHOR: Thomas - (U.S.A.)

I did not start in 1987, I started in November 1982. Left in May 1989. Read on and maybe you'll understand what I am talking about.

During my Kirby days I was a salesperson, a recruiter, AKA DPS, a vanmaster, and was made an inside area dealer in Morrisville, PA. under a guy Named Dennis.

As an inside $50.00 was help from each deal that I and my 5 dealers wrote in order to save enough money for me to open up my own office.

The money was held by my distributor in an account to be used for expenses when I was ready to open my own office.

I accumulated over $25,000.00

The office I worked for averaged over 100 sales every month while I was there, my guys averaged over 50 sales and there were 3 vanmasters.

When we would all go out in our vans to Phila. I was called upon to close deals for the dealers belonging to the other vanmasters because I was the vanmaster with the highest closing average in the office, and the other guys were to say the least, LAME!

When I was finally ready to open my office, the dirt bag, no pun intended, who I worked for decided that the deal was off. He did not want his best guy leaving, so he stole my $25,000.00 and would not let me open up my own office. Since I did not have my $25,000.00 and no way to prove it was mine, I was forced to continue as a vanmaster.

I built value. More value than you could ever hope to build. My average demo from the time I walked through the door until I walked out with the contract 75% of the time was over 4 hours. I was thorough, persistent and left the home in 1 of 2 ways. I either had the contract or I was told get the hell out of my house because I just did not give up!

When we had a prospect who just wouldn't budge, my distributor would drop his pants and insist we go down to $399.00, having us state that this is the free one I won in last months contest and I only need one more sale to win my contest, so I am willing to let it go cheap so I can win my all expense 3 day trip to a fleabag hotel in Jamaica or whatever contest was running that month. Ask Rasner about that, he invented that tactic.

At $399.00 the dealer made a 10% commission, but I still got my $100 as his manager.

I'm not bitter, I'm honest and consider myself a consumer advocate. Door-to-door products just like MLM products are way over priced, period!

Are you a factory direct distributor? How much did your grandmother pay, $1200.00. What a sweet girl.

I did buy both a G5 and a G6 from my ex-wife's new husband for $500.00 each. Believe it or not, it's true and you know that is above the distributors cost. I wanted to own the product because I know there is nothing out there that can even come close to it's quality or performance, but I wasn't about to be screwed and since there are a lot of distributors who will do just about anything for a sale, I knew I could get them for $500.00. I could have paid less, but I felt sorry for my ex-wife's husband since he struggles to feed his kids and figured I'd let him make a little profit on me. I have the money, and then some!

Yes I do sit on my a*s making $37.50 an hour, 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, $1500.00 per week. How many dealers do you know that make that kind of money every week, 52 weeks a year. NONE!

I also own a side business doing tech. support for attorneys. I out in about another 10 hours a week at $75.00 per hour, bring it to $2250.00 per week. How many factory direct distributors are making that? Not too many!

When I applied for my career at a huge multi-billion dollar Pharmaceutical company, nobody placed a blind ad, leaving me wondering what the job was. They didn't have to lie to me to get me to the interview. They didn't fill me full of hype and promise me that I would be a millionaire in 3 years, they explained the responsibilities to me, tested me, and I was hired on the spot because I am awesome at what I do, not because I passed the Kirby test (do you have a pulse? OK, you're hired), now goes screw over your grandmother.

Marie, are you a factory direct distributor? How much do you charge you dealers? Are you screwing them for $1200.00 per unit like Aaron's distributor? By the way, any dealers reading this, if you pay over $600.00 for a Kirby complete, renegotiate or go get a job.

I would never hold it against you for making an HONEST, yes Honest living, but Kirby distributors are far from honest. In my $117,000.00 per year opinion, you're a bunch of thieving, lying cheats that would steal from your own grandmother on her death-bed. I know, that's how my distributor was. Fortunately he's no longer with Kirby. He's got a used vacuum shop in a strip mall making about $35 a year from what I hear. Why is he out of business? Because his 100+ per month average was never seen again when I quit, in fact he never broke 60 after I left. He got what he deserved.

Speaking of 1 fry short of a happy meal, my IQ is 131. What's yours? And I don't eat at McDonalds, I can afford to eat Filet mignon and Lobster whenever I want to.

Although I do see McD's commercials on my 65 inch HD TV.

I am angry, but don't feel bad for me. I'm not angry for the reasons that you assume. I am angry that people like you are still allowed to enter people's homes through lies and deceptive tactics and then rip them off for an item, while a great product, for way, way, way more than it's worth.

I feel bad for the people who are sucked in with the hype, sold the so-called Kirby dream, only to find out that they were used to get easy sympathy sales from friends and relatives over the so-called 1st week practice demonstrations.

And as far as the weekly or monthly guarantee of a certain amount of pay for a certain amount of demos, they know you will never achieve the number of demos required, but if by some strange chance you do, they will find a way to disqualify some of those demos so you don't get the guarantee that you were told you would.

I was extremely dedicated and I was very loyal. I was taken advantage of, just like the people you hire every Monday will be.

If Kirby is such a wonderful opportunity, why do you need to hire every week? Could it be that the job just plain sucks? Could it be that you make your highest dollar sales off of sympathy sales from unsuspecting friends and family of the poor desperate unemployed saps that have no other hope?

I remember the saying that my I used to hear from Kirby over and over again.
Kirby is not a job, it's a way of life. No s**t, you have to work 80 hours a week to survive, so you have no other life. It's not a job, it's more like a cult.

Dealers, don't try to go home early, don't try to take a day off. Even though you are an independent dealer and can't be forced to do anything by your distributor, they will make your life a living hell, or just refuse to let you work for them if you do. Sound familiar? I heard that threat many times, but since I was so incredibly good, I did get preferential treatment.

Instead of peddling vacuums, try an education.
Life is hard. It's harder when you're stupid.
Good luck in your career and try to stay warm out there knocking on doors in Wisconsin!
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#61 UPDATE Employee

Little Bitter there, huh,TOM??? maybe you just didn't have what it takes to be a Distributor

AUTHOR: Marie - (U.S.A.)

Maybe you should have asked your Distributor about the "road to success" program and you wouldn't have had to be a "top salesman" for 6 years. Or then again, maybe you just didn't have what it takes to be a Distributor. (obviously)

You bitter people make me laugh - always trying to put someone down. Maybe somebody should have shown you how to "build value" and you wouldn't have had to sell Kirby's a dollar under your cost.
(if your cost really was $400)

By the way, I also started with the Kirby Company in 1987. I am still going strong, have made many, many friends - both customers and people I have recruited,as well as people in the Kirby business.

You bought a G5 and a G6 for the same price???
Hellloooooo....geez are you one fry short of a happy meal???

Do us all a favor - sit on your____ and make your $37.50 an hour until the company you are working for now figures out what a loyal, kind man you really are.

Don't hold it against the rest of us who work hard and make an HONEST, yes, I said HONEST living.
Sorry you couldn't make it in Kirby - it's not for everyone-it takes dedication, loyalty and a huge commitment.

I feel bad for you - you sound so angry.
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#62 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Re: Ex-Kirby Reps.

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Aaron,

1. I was not a 2 week wonder, I sold Kirby's for more than 6 years.

2. I was the #1 salesperson in my office for many years.

3. As a dealer I paid less than $400. back in 1987. My distributor paid about $180. and it retailed then for about $1,399.00 complete.

4. We often sold the complete system for $399. just to get another sale.

5. If you are paying $1200. I have some toxic swamp land infested with alligators and snakes in Florida that's selling for 10 times the appraised value I would be happy to let you have today only for 12 times it's appraised value.

6. Don't have the spine to go door-to-door? I went door-to-door for 5 years, getting in an average of 1 out of every 4 doors that was answered, selling 75% of the people I showed it to by getting 25+ referrals from each sale. Warm Leads, in case you're not familiar with the term. I learned from the best, Rich Rasner. Heard of him?

7. I have 2 Kirby's. A G-5 and a G-6 (one for upstairs and one for downstairs), that I purchased for cash from my ex-wife's husband, who has been in and out of Kirby no less than 5 times.

8. I paid $500. each for both of them complete. Which is a fair deal and definitely worth the money, since they are the best product on the market.

9. Who said you filled dirt meters? You don't have to. No tricks necessary. The machine is superior to any other out there. That's not the question. It's the tactics and the outrageous price charged.

10. Cash or credit card only? You've never seen d**k, oh sorry, Peter sell a financed deal? You are so full of s**t! I know better, I was selling Kirby's while you were still discovering your p***s and eating your own boogers, so don't even try to sell me that crap.

11. Good salesman work smart, not hard. Wrong again. I was a great salesman and not only did I work smart, I also worked hard making me twice as good as you. *see #6.

12. The fact of the matter is Kirby is by far the best d**n vacuum (not Vacume, did somebody say smart?), a home could ever have and is worth every penny of $500 complete and not a dime more.

13. I love my $500 G-6 and so should anybody else who is smart enough not to pay (laugh $1200)

14. Here I am at work, sitting at my nice warm desk, reading the rip-off report, waiting for a service ticket to come in for a software problem as I am making $37.50 per hour. What's your hourly average? I doubt it exceeds $10.00.
***FYI - Home Depot pays $15.00 to stock shelves!

Best of luck in your career!
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#63 UPDATE Employee

Ex Kirby Reps all have the same response!!!!

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

Tom-

In my short time with Kirby Ive seen everyone I started with and about 20 more Two week wonders come and go from just my office alone.

Yes Kirby's straight off the assembly line are cheap compared to what the customer pays by the time it reaches their door.

But lets tell the truth here, as a dealer you certainly didnt pay $400.00 for a machine anytime in the last 10-15 years.

My cost is $1,200.00 for just the machine and shampoo system.Do you think I would spend 8-10 hours a day knocking doors to sell it at cost..?

Your factory distributer pays something close to that, but not a dealer.

You said selling Kirbys is 2 levels below car sales..hehe, man if you could make 2k a month selling cars as a 90 day wonder then your doing good.

Sales isnt for everyone, and cold sales is about as hard a job as it comes.

Just because you didnt have the spine to go door to door doesnt meen Kirby's are a piece of crap and all sales reps are scam artists.

Have you ever had the pleasure to meet a real Kirby employee, I doubt it.

In your experiance with Kirby you met independent sales reps, not one of those people worked for Kirby.

Theres bad apples everywhere, but that doesnt meen we go into homes and Kill vacumes with tricks, or fill dirt meters when the customer isnt looking.

Ive never seen Peter sell to someone who couldnt afford it, infact ive never even seen a sale that wasnt cash or credit card.

Why..? Because good salesmen work smart not hard.

The fact of the matter is, Kirby is the by far the best d**n Vacume a home could ever hope to have!!!!!
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#64 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Aaron of Everett Washington, A master at what?

AUTHOR: Tom - (U.S.A.)

Watch a master at work! A master at what? Screwing his fellow man! Kirby Distributors pay under $400 for the entire package and sell it for around $2000.00 They send you home for so-called practice demos to your family and friends because they know they will get sympathy sales. You get to ripp-off your grandmother. How noble! Kirby is a sleaze-ball company. Always was, always will be. Aaron, you are two levels below a car salesman. door-to-door uneducated loosers sell Kirbys. I know, I used to be one, but then I was so ashamed of myself, because I have a conscience I went to College and got educated and got a job where I don't have too screw my family and other people to feed my kids. I am ashamed to have been a part of that dirt-bag company. In my humble opinion Rich Rasner, your CEO took advantage of his salespeople as much as possible when he was a distributor in Pleasantville, NJ. Have you seen his wife, Bow-Wow! He even told me once, next time he's marrying for looks, now that he's got as lot of money. What agreat guy!!!!!
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#65 UPDATE Employee

I could see through the scam the first day of training

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

I could see through the scam the first day of training when asked to show the machine to 8-10 of my family and freinds.

Beings that I was collecting unemployment at the time i figured Id give it a shot, but let them know that at no point would I hussle my family to purchase a Kirby.

I got lucky and hooked up with a 20 year Kirby rep that thought I had what it takes to sell Kirbys.

All in all ive averaged a little over 3k a month at helping him make sales, ie. knocking him in and taking care of appointments he cant make it to.

I consider this a kind of apprenticeship of sorts.Although im only making 100$-200$ per sale, I feal like ive been handed a job of a lifetime.

Eventualy Ill be out on my own gaining my own recognition, but for now im happy just to sit and watch a master at work..
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#66 UPDATE Employee

I could see through the scam the first day of training

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

I could see through the scam the first day of training when asked to show the machine to 8-10 of my family and freinds.

Beings that I was collecting unemployment at the time i figured Id give it a shot, but let them know that at no point would I hussle my family to purchase a Kirby.

I got lucky and hooked up with a 20 year Kirby rep that thought I had what it takes to sell Kirbys.

All in all ive averaged a little over 3k a month at helping him make sales, ie. knocking him in and taking care of appointments he cant make it to.

I consider this a kind of apprenticeship of sorts.Although im only making 100$-200$ per sale, I feal like ive been handed a job of a lifetime.

Eventualy Ill be out on my own gaining my own recognition, but for now im happy just to sit and watch a master at work..
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#67 UPDATE Employee

I could see through the scam the first day of training

AUTHOR: Aaron - (U.S.A.)

I could see through the scam the first day of training when asked to show the machine to 8-10 of my family and freinds.

Beings that I was collecting unemployment at the time i figured Id give it a shot, but let them know that at no point would I hussle my family to purchase a Kirby.

I got lucky and hooked up with a 20 year Kirby rep that thought I had what it takes to sell Kirbys.

All in all ive averaged a little over 3k a month at helping him make sales, ie. knocking him in and taking care of appointments he cant make it to.

I consider this a kind of apprenticeship of sorts.Although im only making 100$-200$ per sale, I feal like ive been handed a job of a lifetime.

Eventualy Ill be out on my own gaining my own recognition, but for now im happy just to sit and watch a master at work..
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#68 UPDATE Employee

Kirby Will Shine.. there are more who like us than don't.

AUTHOR: Troy - (U.S.A.)

There are people who like our company and there are people who don't, there are more who like us than don't. From your grandma's to you mom's, they've probably had one....and having it for over 20 years is well worth the price...Good things aren't cheap and cheap things aren't good... you pay for what you get...dont hate us because our price... dont hate us because we've been in business for 90 years now... don't hate the vacuum....everything in life is Negotiable just like cars... everybody doesn't work for free....everyone wants a good deal...everybody doesnt pay the same price for the same exact car....KIRBY will SHINE..
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#69 UPDATE EX-employee responds

IT'S SHOCKING!

AUTHOR: Jason - (United Kingdom)

Before I begin may I just say that this machine is ace, it is the only vacuum cleaner that I could run over the pipes with in my car and it not break, its the only vacuum cleaner that can give me a massage, its the only vacuum cleaner that can be a sander, its the only vacuum cleaner that has so much blowing abilty it could pump a tire on my nissan mirca. FANTASTIC!

When I first saw this machine in action (about 3 days after being there) i thought WOW this is amazing all I have to do is 60 demos a month and get paid 1000. GREAT i thought.

What I was not intially told though is that the first 10 demos would actully be on my own friends and family then in turn they would have to provide me with new sales leads. Its shocking that these sales men actully try and abuse there own friends and family in order to make money.

I was there a week then found this out, so after travelling 60 miles a day for 5 days I left without making a penny.

Although this machine is all well and good people buy a vacuum cleaner to get the crumbs off the carpet and to be fair the kirby makes the best job of them all (considering that its 2 thousand pounds i should hope so!)

But lets be honest nobody really cares that this machine can give you massage. I have a massage in order to realx, i can't relax if the vacuum cleaner making a stupid loud noise.

This is a great machine that has been ruined by needless attachments. If they simply used it as a upright and a dirt devil then sold it for 200 quid then everbody would have one.
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#70 UPDATE EX-employee responds

You can't blame the company for everything

AUTHOR: Michael - (U.S.A.)

As I read the responses in this report, I've found that most of the complaints have come from those that would like to feel sorry for themselves. So, in order for them to feel better they feel the need to curse the product.

Listen, I to did a six week term at the Kirby Company, and also only sold 2 machines. One was a bad credit deal, and the other I made $300.00. I drove all over eastern to western Iowa, $300.00 dollars wasn't even enough to cover my expenses, but that's when I decided to walk away from it. I figured out that I wasn't a Kirby Salesman at heart.

OK, so they don't tell you what the job is over the phone. You're definately going to figure it out once you walk in the door for the interview, and there is a thing called free-will, it's beautiful. If you don't want to sell vacuums, you say, "I'm sorry, I just don't think this is the job for me, thank you." Then you just walk out the door, it's amazing!

No matter how bad the economy, there are jobs available, you just have to be willing to look. When you realize selling Kirby's isn't your thing, then walk away. The people you talked to didn't con you, because there are success stories in the Kirby Company, there are people who have made it.

You're conning yourself when you try balme it all on someone else!
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#71 UPDATE EX-employee responds

not a really good place to work

AUTHOR: Paul - (U.S.A.)

I too was suckered into working for the kirby dealership in my area. The newspaper ad said nothing about kirby or even selling. By the way my mom bought a kirby g4 years before I worked for them so I knew a little about the vacuum, but knew nothing about selling the vacuum until now.

I had no idea what I was in for until about the fourth day of "training", when they brought out the kirby.

Sufice to say that I only sold one vacuum (it was to my uncle who wanted to help me out) and quit after 3 weeks. I was honest and didn't pressure people, that was probably why they thought of me as a bad dealer.

I did my homework after and although generally speaking kirby is an ok vacuum, it is way overpriced and blows out carbon "dust" from the motor out the exhaust, that is not filtered. There are vacuums out there for a lot cheaper that filters better and has comparable suction. I am trying to unload my kirby g4 right now as I type this up.
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#72 Consumer Comment

Not all Kirby people are bad & trying to scam you just like people in the world

AUTHOR: Mary - (U.S.A.)

My daughter sold Kirby's for about a year about 5 years ago & she is now back with them but with a different person over her. Not all Kirby people are bad & trying to scam you just like people in the world.....there are good & bad wherever you go. I could say the same about the 2 local hospitals I have worked for the past 18 years (management & employees alike) or any other organization!! It is unfortunate that the few can ruin it for so many good people.

The product is excellent. We have had ours for about 25 years (long before my daughter was old enough to think about working) & it is still in excellent condition!! My daughter has had her Kirby for 5 years and she is just as happy with it today as when she purchased it. We have never had a problem with either vacuum!! It is very difficult to believe that you would throw one out after 2 years or that it ruined floors from leaving water if they were used correctly! I agree that you should watch the video or contact Kirby for assistance if you are having problems with your product!
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#73 UPDATE Employee

I too was suckered into answering an ad in the newspaper as jobs are non-existent

AUTHOR: Linda - (U.S.A.)

I too was suckered into answering an ad in the newspaper as jobs are non-existent right now due to the economy. The girl that conducted the orientation phase kept stressing having fun and contests and trips and trips and fun.

In the morning there are sales meetings with BLARING RAP music up loud enough (no exageration) to blow out your hearing coupled with 2 strobe lights in a darkened room. Needless to say I would put my fingers in my ears and close my eyes to avoid this junk.

The sales meetings were full of hype and quite explicit on little salesmanship tricks to get suckers, err I mean customers, to buy the Kirby. Don't get me wrong, the Kirby is a great vacuum cleaner that I really like, but I abhor the way they are sold. One seasoned sales person there spoke so fast he made my head spin just to keep up with him.

Talk about slick...that was not the word. I am not a high pressure person, but an easy going laid back type in her 50's. The rest of the sales people were either 19, 21 or 26. The sales distributor was 36 having been a construction worker when he was 18 and went into selling Kirbys at that age. Now he can brag (and make me want to puke) about all the cute expensive toys he now owns. Frankly, who cares a rat's behind WHAT HE owns...

I've never met MORE unprofessional people in my entire life who love to brag about what they own. In my working life when I would have an office job the boss would not bore me with stories of what he owned....but this clown just loves to bore everyone....and party party party. Slot machines and bingo and naturally, no one wins....huh I wonder why? What a con this guy is...he would make a very funny situation comedy if it were not so pathetic the con he is pulling on the sales people.

What was NOT explained to me as a newbie...was the fact that even if I sold a Kirby...I could end up making literally NOTHING due to a "sub deal". Sub deal you ask? Yes, that's where the customer has crummy credit and the finance company will only back the product and not the sales commission...so supposedly no one makes any profit.... all I have to say about this ruse is HA! HA! HA!

In their dreams... the only person who makes nothing is the idiot (me) who spent their gas money getting there, their time and labor to explain and demonstrate the machine to the customer...and my time to write up the contract and deliver the machine to the customer.

Yes...and drive endless miles and not get paid endless hours and get home at 10:30PM or 11:30PM only to get up at 6AM and start all over again the next day just trying to get by in this rotten economy.

My warning to anyone who answers an ad for a job and end up getting suckered into selling Kirbys....you will be definitely conned...no doubt about it. The ones who actually DO sell the Kirbys and make the money are the real con guys and girls.

Someone who is sincere and kind hearted don't seem to make it in this business....wonder why? I have been "burned at the door" by people who agree to an appointment and then are not home or cancel at the door. They don't realize what they are doing to an honest person. I am not talking about the cons...either.

Also I think that Kirby has a good vacuum...but it is very overpriced. The overpriced part comes from having to pay all the salesmen and the commission pyramid structure involved. If they would just have for real stores that would sell the vacuums and literally cut out all these "middle men" making their $50-$500 cut on YOUR hard earned money...the danged machines would cost a heck of a lot LESS and everyone could afford to have a decent vacuum in their home. I have cleaned many a carpet for FREE (and some people are absolute pigs, believe me...and their homes are so filthy it's unbelieveable)and I resent being in the Free Carpet Cleaning Business...you bet I'm mad...you would be too having been deceived by the lure of "big money" only to find out it is a SCAM!!!!

No, I am not a disgrunteled employee...I am soon to be an ex-disgunteled employee. Too bad they are still back in the horse and buggy days of door to door selling. They should get with the program and kock off the door to door stuff. It's a scam. Let a person buy a vacuum cleaner after they have done their own comparison of cleaners at their pace..and not be pressured into buying something overpriced just because the salesman talked fast and snowed them. Nuf said.
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#74 UPDATE Employee

Give 'em a break ..I am a 20 year old man with a wife and two kids

AUTHOR: Tay - (U.S.A.)

I want to let you people know that i challenge any of you to do the job that we do. I am a 20 year old man with a wife and two kids, I sell kirby's to support my family and believe very strongly in the product and it is worth every penny. Before you guys go saying everyone in the company is bad I want you to go out and meet every kirby dealer in in the world. See what nice people alot of them are then make your decision. of course you will have some bad apples. that does not account for everyone. Of course we make a profit on what we sell but are mad at walmart for making a profit, are you mad at jcpenny's, are you mad at the guy you bought your car from. probably not so don't be mad at us for just being a guy going out and working to support his wife and kids. Don't we deserve a profit too.
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#75 UPDATE Employee

To the Lady who forged her husband's signature

AUTHOR: Marie - (U.S.A.)

I am amazed. You talk about how Kirby sales people are a rip-off and then you have the gall to be PROUD of the fact that you signed your husband's name and basically got the Kirby for next to nothing.

Who's zoomin who????

By the way, if the shampooer soaked your carpet, you were using it wrong. I suggest you plug in the free tape you got with your Kirby and watch it so you can learn how to use it. Duh.

There are THOUSANDS of honest, ethical Kirby people. There are also some who aren't so honest.
There is profit in everything. Kirby people make a lot of money because, as you can tell from so many of these complaints, we do the things that most people are too lazy to do. Believe me, by the time a person makes it to Factory Distributor in Kirby, they have earned their right to make 6 figures. ( and then some )

Most Kirby people are happy people who sell a great product and make a lot of $$$. What's so bad about that??
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#76 Consumer Comment

Kirby-bad news

AUTHOR: Lauri - ()

I have heard much about this company from friends who have worked for Kirby or know someone who has, and what was said was by no standards positive. When one person complains, then maybe it's a personal issue they have, but when people come to me at random, all of them giving a very detailed account about how Kirby scammed them, I take heed.

One of my friends found an ad in the newspaper that sounded very promising, but gave no indication of what kind of work was being offered. She called the number, but the receptionist refused to give her details- only promised a great opportunity. Only when she got to the place did they tell it was vaccum cleaners sales. She connected it to horror stories she had heard of the place and left. Apparently, they start scamming you before you're even hired.

Other complaints were:
They don't pay you correctly for hours worked
They take out too much for benefits or benefits you don't even request They promise a check, but don't pay even after weeks of work They teach you how to con people (all the while, conning you)
They play employees off one another, you compete and Kirby gets all the money you bring in
You never seem to sell as much as you should (by thier ever-increasing standards)
They treat you as if you're "on call"

As I said, this is word of mouth stuff, I personally haven't worked for Kirby. However, coming from many people, with no connection to each other, but thier abhorence for Kirby- I'm sold.

HEY TOM, you kick arse. Don't let anyone tell you different.
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#77 Consumer Comment

Dont worry, some people get even with Kirby!!!

AUTHOR: Mel - ()

Kirby sells man knocked at the wrong door! Oh he gave me the pitch and the whole nine yards of cleaning my house and then here comes the pressure! Were doing a contest in the office and today is the last day, so I have to sell as many vaccums as I can. My response, it is a good vaccum but my husband has the credit and hes working. Sales man: Oh we can do it without him here, well just say hes doing it and you sign for everything! My response: Okay!

After all is said and done, kirby is not what its cracked up to be. The water from the carpet cleaner goes down underneath the carpet and settles to the point we had to redo our floors. PLUS we received the cleaner he was using all day to clean other homes, NOT a new model!!!! So guess what, we quit paying for it!

I told them they lied and I wanted to return the cleaner! They said we had a contract and we had to keep paying it or it would go on our credit record! I said oh you think so?!?!?! To their amazement they found out my husband didnt sign for it and we could sue!

So in the end I received a Kirby that we only paid a few months on instead of a $2,000 piece of junk! Wheres the kirby, you ask??? I kept it as a vacuum only and the carpet cleaner parts went in the garbage. The kirby lasted maybe 2 years and that to got thrown out! My advise: Its a ripoff and so are the people that stand behind it!! When you see a salesman at your door, laugh in their face and tell them to get a real job!
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#78 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Darryl, Do you sell Kirbys?

AUTHOR: Tom - ()

You must. Only a Kirby sales jerk would have said that. I used to sell for Kirby for almost 7 years. Every morning the Kirby people have their sales meeting where they stand up and brag about how badly the ripped of their customers the day before. They live for it and they love it. Don't blame the victim. You're probably one of those guys that thinks it was our fault that the dirty arabs crashed into the World Trade center. you Jerkoff
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#79 Consumer Suggestion

response to bad credit guy

AUTHOR: Darrell - ()

Maybe you should have paid your bills on time and had good credit and that would have never happened. Its not his fault you have bad credit.
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