• Report: #407209

Complaint Review: Bill Tufts, Orange TKO Industries

  • Submitted: Fri, January 02, 2009
  • Updated: Fri, January 16, 2009

  • Reported By:No Town Louisiana
Bill Tufts, Orange TKO Industries
810 16 Avenue SW, Calgary, AB T2R 0S9, Canada Las Vegas, Nevada U.S.A.

Bill Tufts, Orange TKO Industries fraud, misrepresentation Las Vegas Nevada

*UPDATE Employee: Larry White, list the authority to claim your organic status!

*UPDATE Employee: Larry White Has Given Wrong Information

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Did Jerry Brown the General Manager of Orange TKO International just call his own product TOXIC??

*UPDATE Employee: Rebuttal to No Town, LA

*UPDATE Employee: Rebuttal to No Town, Louisiana

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My New Years resolution for 2009 is to do everything I can to keep Bill Tufts and Orange TKO from ripping off any more unsuspecting people. I am posting and sending emails anonymously to avoid the wrath of a company president that has no idea of the concept of the truth, nor fairness in business. Because I am posting these anonymously, I will make sure that everything stated herein is not only the undeniable truth, but will have supporting documentation to prove my claims. I fully expect Mr. Tufts to respond by stating how wonderful he and the TKO company and product are, and how he can't imagine how anyone would say these kind of things. I am going to start with this letter and cover a few things that you might want to check into if you use or sell Orange TKO.

First, the product itself: Bill Tufts and the Orange TKO company have stated many times that Orange TKO is 100% organic and is made with 97% food grade d'limonene and oxygen as an emulsifier. That is a lie. Orange TKO contains 85% - 90% regular d'limonene, 5% - 6% Poly(oxy-1, 2-ethanediyl), alpha-(nonylphenyl-omega-hydroxy), and 5% - 6% Octoxynol-5. I could find no long term health studies on the effect of the two additional chemicals. However, acute exposure of hamsters to chemicals in the Octoxynol group by bronchopulmonary lavage produced pneumonia, pulmonary edema, and intra-alveolar hemorrhage. Octoxynol-9 at doses over 1 g/kg was toxic in rats and in mice in acute oral toxicity studies. Although exact dosage and effects are a little unclear, the one thing I do find very clearit is more toxic than oxygen.

Second, doing business with Bill Tufts and Orange TKO. If you decide to become a dealer or distributor of Orange TKO, please ask the company for a couple of things first. Get a copy of their business liability insurance. When you get the certificate, call the company that issued it and make sure that it is paid up and in effect. Next, request a list of six current TKO distributors with their phone numbers. Call all of them and ask their opinions on doing business with Orange TKO and Bill Tufts. Third, check out the credit worthiness of Orange TKO and Bill Tufts. You will find that he has to do everything with cash. Bill Tufts has ripped off so many individuals, distributors, and suppliers that none of them will give him credit. His main supplier, Industrial Chemical in Arvada, Colorado that actually makes the TKO blend, requires that a cash transfer be made to their account before they even start an order for him. When you ask for these things, be prepared for him to come up with some reason why you can't have them. To give you an idea of just how bad of a person Bill Tufts is, his sons Graham and Robert, have disowned him. Both used to work in a directorial capacity for Orange TKO until they could no longer deal with their corrupt father and his actions.

Third, Bill's so called Godliness and prestige. This probably the most laughable of all. Bill has no love for anyone but himself. He is an egomaniacal, manipulative; con-man that will do what ever it takes to make himself look good. He will lie, cheat, steal, take credit for you accomplishments, and blame his failures on everyone else. Again, I would not say these things without proof. Ask him for a list of people that endorse his product and their phone numbers. If you actually get it, call them and get their thoughts on Bill Tufts. It will without a doubt prove my point.

I hope that everyone that reads this will post their experiences with Orange TKO and Bill Tufts as I have on www.ripoffreport.com. Maybe if we can get enough people to come forward and tell their stories, others won't be victimized by this pariah.

One last thought. Bill Tufts will brag about the millions of dollars that Orange TKO has made over the years. He has never paid one red cent in taxes. He will tell you that Orange TKO is a Canadian company and he is not liable for U.S. taxes. The fact is, he resides and works out of his unlicensed home in Las Vegas, sells to companies and individuals in the U.S., and gets paid in American Dollars, which he deposits in an American bank. With our economy and national debt as it is, it makes me crazy that this person gets away with a free ride. NO MORE!!!

Fedup with orange tko
No Town, Louisiana

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 01/02/2009 11:44 AM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Bill-Tufts-Orange-TKO-Industries/Las-Vegas-Nevada-89101/Bill-Tufts-Orange-TKO-Industries-fraud-misrepresentation-Las-Vegas-Nevada-407209. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 UPDATE Employee

Larry White, list the authority to claim your organic status!

AUTHOR: Jerry Brown - General Manager - (Canada)

Larry White of That Orange Stuff, we will give you an opportunity for the last word. Within 10 days, list the authority under which you claim organic status on your product, or the matter will be taken up with the EPA and the Texas Consumer Affairs Department for protection of the consumer. We are often asked by consumers if That Orange Stuff is really organic, and we would like to have a knowledgeable reply.

Jerry Brown General Manager
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#2 UPDATE Employee

Larry White Has Given Wrong Information

AUTHOR: Jerry Brown - General Manager - (Canada)

Mr. Larry White's fast reply to Orange TKO's rebuttal to the anonymous writer from No Town, LA would certainly appear to confirm that he is, in fact, the writer.

Mr. White's comments on the formulation of Orange TKO are wrong. The toxic chemicals that Larry White refers to are not a part of the formulation of Organic Orange TKO. However, the referenced ingredients are so familiar to Mr. White that we believe his product is toxic. Also, he has not indicated the registrant backing up his claim that his product is organic.

Organic Orange TKO is registered as organic with the Organic Materials Review Institute (OMRI). Also, Organic Orange TKO has full product liability insurance as organic, and has not had an insurance claim in all of the 15 years of the product's existence. An MSDS for Organic Orange TKO can be obtained by calling 1-800-991-2463 or by writing to Organic Orange TKO at 810 16th Ave. NW, Calgary, Alberta, Canada, T2M 0J9.

We challenge Larry White to verify his organic claim for the product that he distributes!

Jerry Brown - General Manager
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#3 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Did Jerry Brown the General Manager of Orange TKO International just call his own product TOXIC??

AUTHOR: That Orange Stuff - (U.S.A.)

I must admit that I am flattered that such a large, prestigious, company as Orange TKO International would mention me, my company, and my product by name in a recent post on this website. However, they forgot my phone number, 1-866-660-6909, and my website, www.thatorangestuff.com. It is an understandable mistake; with all of the business that they are doing they must be very busy.

I have read the post from anonymous in Louisiana and must say that I do agree with most of it, not all of it, most of it. I think that this website is a great forum for people that have been wronged by a company and want to warn other consumers. However, I find it highly unprofessional that a reputable company would take swipe at a competitor and their product in such a public forum.

When conducting business I try to follow a four way test that some of you may recognize:

1: Is it the truth?
2: Is it fair to all concerned?
3: Will it build good will and better friendships?
4: Is it beneficial to all concerned?

In following these rules I find that it would not be professional to respond to anonymous' in Louisiana nor Orange TKO International except in the following two areas:

First Anytime you do business with anyone, whether an individual or company, do your homework. It is important not to listen to just what the company has to say; after all, they are trying to sell you their product. If you were buying a car would you take the word of the first salesman you met? Of course not, you would shop around and do a little independent research before making a purchase. If you accept only the testimony or written documentation of the initial company, you have no basis to determine whether they are telling you the truth or not. If you are entertaining the idea of actually going into business with someone else, realize that their reputation and financial background could greatly affect you. You should always talk with vendors, other customers, financial institutions, and insurance providers in order to get a true picture of the company that you are dealing with.

Second This is the most important and actually quite shocking. Anonymous in Louisiana stated that Orange TKO contained 5% - 6% Poly(oxy-1, 2-ethanediyl), alpha-(nonylphenyl-omega-hydroxy), and 5% - 6% Octoxynol-5. In his rebuttal, Jerry Brown, the General Manager of Orange TKO International flat out denied this, stating He (Larry White) represents this product (That Orange Stuff) on the label as being organic without any authenticity verifying the same, and which we believe is not organic. It probably contains the formulation that he (actually anonymous in Louisiana) represented as being Orange TKO, WHICH WOULD BE A TOXIC CHEMICAL.

OSHA requires that companies make available their complete and accurate MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) to anyone that requests it. I have a copy of Orange TKO's MSDS sheet that clearly states their product DOES IN FACT CONTAIN Poly(oxy-1, 2-ethanediyl), alpha-(nonylphenyl-omega-hydroxy) and Octoxynol-5. BY MR. BROWNS OWN ADMISSION, IN HIS OWN REBUTTAL, THESE CHEMICALS (AND THEREFORE ORANGE TKO) ARE TOXIC.

You may request a copy of this MSDS sheet from Industrial Chemicals Corporation in Arvada, Colorado. You will see it is not the same as the one they have posted on their website www.tkoorange.com. You may also request a copy of my MSDS sheet for That Orange Stuff at the same time, as they, ICC, manufacture both products. You will see that That Orange Stuff is in fact organic.

I am sorry that Orange TKO found it necessary to attack me, my company, and my product. I think that a person's actions and choices make them who they are, not their achievements and accolades. When one company speaks of another in this manner it does nothing but hurt the type of business that they are in. In this case the organic industry. It is important to pay attention to what we put into our environment; we won't get a second chance. The organic industry has enough problems from government regulation and big chemical companies to waste their time sniping at each other. I am embarrassed that grown professionals would sink to this level. I will respond no further to this line of communication.


Larry W. White
Creative Image Marketing
dba, That Orange Stuff
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#4 UPDATE Employee

Rebuttal to No Town, LA

AUTHOR: Jerry Brown - General Manager - (Canada)

A defamatory and untruthful statement was recently published on the Rip Off Report site. This website, I believe, was created to protect innocent parties from unscrupulous rip-offs. It is now apparent that the rip-offs are using the internet for their own personal greed, and using this site for the unintended purpose of defaming legitimate products for their own gain. We believe that the author who published this erroneous statement about Orange TKO and signed it as anonymous from No Town, LA was actually one Larry White of Creative Image Marketing in Grand Prairie, TX, who sells a product called That Orange Stuff. He represents this product on the label as being organic without any authenticity verifying the same, and which we believe is not organic. It probably contains the formulation that he represented as being Orange TKO, which would be a toxic chemical.

At first it was our judgment not to reply to such ludicrous allegations, however after receiving a letter dated December 17, 2008 from a Dorothy Osborne in Georgia, who after being lied to by Larry White, requested that we take some action to protect innocent third parties from what happened to her. Larry White sold product to a health store in Georgia where Dorothy purchased the product. She stated that she had purchased product under the label That Orange Stuff and knew as soon as she opened the bottle that it was not Orange TKO. I called the number on the That Orange Stuff' container and I was told that they had bought out Orange TKO. She then called Orange TKO and found out that this was an outright lie. We believe that Larry White also contacted the State of Texas authorities and reported that Orange TKO was not organic, but was a hazardous product. The results of this exchange will follow later in this submission.

In reply to those who have read the publication by Larry White and his defamation of not only the company, but also the President personally, we wish to state the following facts:

Regarding Bill Tufts:
1) From the Law Society of Saskatchewan: Please be advised William Clyde Tufts was admitted to the Law Society of Saskatchewan June 26, 1961 and has been a retired member of the Law Society since Dec 31, 2003. Cheryl Eberle, Membership Services.

2) Mr. Tufts practiced law in the city of Regina, Saskatchewan under the firm name of Morgan and Tufts, and Leo Morgan, the senior partner will confirm that Mr. Tufts' ethics are beyond reproach.

3) The international chartered accounting firm of BDO Dunwoody prepares Mr. Tufts' income tax for filing on an annual basis for both the United States and Canada.

4) Mr. Tufts has been president of such prestigious organizations as the Canadian Water Resources Association, representing Canada on world conferences.

5) Don Larter has been a distributor of Orange TKO since its inception 15 years ago, and will verify as to the honesty of Mr. Tufts, but also the superior performance of Orange TKO.

Regarding Orange TKO:
1) Orange TKO recently received a letter of congratulations from EPA: I am very pleased to inform you that you will be recognized by the EPA as a Partner in the Design for the Environment Program's Safer Detergents Stewardship Initiative (SDSI). Congratulations! This recognition acknowledges your significant accomplishment towards the use of safer surfactants. Congratulations again on your accomplishment and thank you for your environmental stewardship in using safer surfactants. David DiFiore, Design for the Environment, US EPA

2) Orange TKO has been accepted by the California Certified Organic Farmers (CCOF), a world recognized champion and authority on the advancement of organics for over 30 years.

3) Orange TKO has been certified as organic by the Organic Materials Review Institute (OMRI).

4) Orange TKO has been endorsed by Dr. Michael W. Fox, world renowned veterinarian and scientist, who has spent a lifetime working and writing on the safety of wild animals, pets and people and the importance of organics. Dr. Fox writes a syndicated column, which is read by more than 15 million animal lovers twice weekly, and has written 40 books. Of Orange TKO, Dr. Fox says to President Bill, I think ethically, biologically and environmentally your product is tops! Cheers Michael.

5) Quoting Robert Scott Bell, national health radio talk show host, I greatly appreciate the way that Orange TKO handles the toughest clean-ups, formerly the exclusive domain of toxic petrochemical products. It is especially critical if you have children and pets. Orange TKO is simply the best product I have ever used to clean the environment!

6) What is possibly even more important are the hundreds of letters which we have received from users of the product over 15 years, and how Orange TKO has affected their lives for the better.

7) Reply from the State of Texas regarding the previously mentioned claim that Orange TKO was hazardous: Thank you for the submitted documentation regarding case # 1511080553. Upon review of the submitted documentation, it has been determined your product does not require registration as a hazardous consumer product with this department. You will receive a formal Case Closure Letter within the next few weeks via US Postal Service. Thank you for your attention regarding this matter. Joe Contreras, Enforcement Specialist, Division for Regulatory Services, Department of State Health Services.

8) A further warning to readers: We are advised that Alan Koshar represents himself to be the Florida distributor for Orange TKO, which is absolutely untrue. This was reported to us by Angela Palmieri, who stated, I have confidence in TKO because my birds' health depends on it. I purchased a bottle on the internet from a man named Alan Koshar in Miami, Florida, who represented being the Florida distributor of Orange TKO. As soon as I opened the container, I knew it was not Orange TKO. We are also advised that there is a website owned by Joan Elsberry of Chehalis, WA, selling Orange TKO Organic', which is not our product.

9) To receive a free copy of the official Organic Orange TKO newsletter, 'Our Planet Orange', you may call 1-800-991-2463.

Jerry Brown General Manager
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#5 UPDATE Employee

Rebuttal to No Town, Louisiana

AUTHOR: Jerry Brown - General Manager - (Canada)

Your allegations are so ridiculously untrue that we are not even going to dignify them with a response. Orange TKO is an organic formulation - not a chemical formulation as you set out in your submission. The accounting package, including income tax, for both the company and its officers are handled by BDO Dunwoody, one of the largest accounting firms in North America.

Unfortunately, you got your hand caught in a cookie jar, then tried to hide behind a screen name to make vindictive false and unsubstantiated claims, and you're not even from Louisiana. Who's the fraud?

Jerry Brown, General Manager
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