Hot Business Market Pro And Blazing Words Net Grant Instructor Fraudulent credit card charges from Hot Business Market, and they show no intention on changing their illegal business practices. , Las Vegas Nevada

There are other reports about this company on this site (and other sites), but my situation is slightly different.  Most people are reporting that they signed up for some "work at home" trial and were subsequently hit with several large charges after that.

In my case, I had no history with this company and am, frankly, smart enough to know that "work at home" scams are just that--scams.

I got an email stating that I had a credit card payment due.  That struck me as rather odd, considering that the particular credit card is only used for emergencies and had no activity, save for one local purchase at a restaurant, this year.

When I looked at my statement, I found these four charges:

08/02/2009    08/03/2009    LIST FOR CASH 8665571418 KNA        $81.32
08/02/2009    08/03/2009    SBA TRACK ONLINE 8667161124 KNA        $13.42
08/11/2009      08/11/2009      LIST FOR CASH 8665571418 KNA        $81.32
08/22/2009     08/24/2009     SBA TRACK ONLINE 8667161124 KNA     $13.42

I'll point out here the proximity of these charges to each other and that there is no $1.95 trial charge like others report.  These are the only four charges to show up on this credit card this year, besides one authorized purchase from a local restaurant.

I tried calling the 866-557-1418 number first.  Initially I got a woman who was of no help--in fact I found that all of their employees parrot the same lines.  I was really pissed off at first and just demanded a refund and an explanation of what their business was.  She refused the refund and gave me a business name that I don't even recall at the moment.  She said the only thing that could be done was that I had to file a police report and then send it to a fax number.  She then hung up on me when I demanded that she transfer me to a supervisor.

I thought about it for a few minutes and realized that my best bet was just to have the charges reversed and a new credit card issued.  To assist the bank's fraud investigation, I thought it was best to keep on these guys and collect as much information as I could.

Then something interesting happened--I called the same number back and got a different vibe immediately.  A polite Indian woman and it sounded like a huge call center based on the background noise.  So before I laid into her, I asked her what company she worked for--and it's apparently some legit company (it has "Credit" in the name, but I didn't write it down) that these scammers borrowed their phone number for.  As soon as I started talking, she explained that they get hundreds of similar calls but they have nothing to do with the issue.  She also stated that they had initiated an investigation against the scammers as well.  Now, it's certainly possible that she was full of BS, but she didn't carry the same attitude or parrot the lines that the other reps did.  So I'm not sure why dialing the number sometimes get the scammers and sometimes gets this other company, but I saw other reports that mentioned the same thing.

So I called the other number, 866-716-1124, and got the first rep again (the one who hung up on me).  I went through the same routine and she disconnected me.  She refused to give me her name or any information except for their "fraud fax line" that I needed to send a police report to.

At this point, I'm on a mission.

I call back again and get a guy who claims his name is "Rocko Savinski" (right).  He's another mindless parrot, but had the gall to actually say that none of the charges made by their company are fraudulent.  He said he read all the Internet comments and that the complainers are just sore because they're stupid.  I was truly speechless at this show of chutzpah.  He couldn't explain the disparity in my IP address, phone number or email address, of course, except to say that I must have forgotten I signed up for this >cough< legitimate service.

He ended up hanging up on me after about 15 minutes of me demanding to speak to a supervisor ("we do not have the ability to transfer phone calls" and "our supervisors do not take phone calls"), a physical business address (5348 Vegas Dr. is a dirty shell building that does not house anyone of import from that company) or a business license/registration number.  He kept getting caught up in his own lies, which was a source of entertainment for me between my frustrations.  He hung up on me.  I called him back--he pretended that he didn't know who I was, but by that point, I could recognize my buddy "Rocko" anywhere.  Every time I called back, I got his extension because he would hang up on me as soon as he picked up.

On my last try, I got a guy named "Robert Sampson".  He was much nicer, but still parroting the company lines.  This was also the first time I was able to get an email address from them and the alleged name of their business manager ("Jennifer Johnson").

I have work to do, so I'm finding other creative (and automated) ways of expressing my displeasure.

What I was able to garner from all this:

1. Their call center reps are low-paid, not particularly intelligent people coming out of rehab and can't get jobs anywhere respectable.  They're given a playbook that they do not deviate from.

2. My credit card information, including security code and billing address were supplied to this company somehow.  I haven't figured that one out yet.

3. They claim that I signed up for a trial on some web site, but they couldn't give me a date, a URL or tell me when the trial charge was made (it wasn't).

4. I assume their deliverables are electronic since I didn't receive anything at home.

5. After considering #4, I asked all of these reps what phone number and email address they were given.  Both were bogus.  The phone number supplied was a Verizon Wireless number that's disconnected (I've used AT&T/Cingular since 1998) and the email address isn't valid.

6. The call center reps refuse to process refunds--only cancellations.  They all say that you have to file a police report (which is BS, because this isn't their jurisdiction and my credit card was not physically stolen) and fax in or email the report.  While I will not be doing this, "Robert Sampson" made an interesting admission by telling me that hundreds of people faxed in police reports for fraud.

7. You have to do some social engineering to get them to tell you the IP address used when the fraudulent transaction was made and they won't care that it doesn't resolve to your ISP or anywhere near your geography.

8. Their Better Business Bureau rating is "F":

Reasons for this rating include:
   Length of time business has been operating.
   Number of complaints filed against this business.
   Failure to respond to complaints filed against this business.
   Number of complaints filed against this business that were not resolved.
   Overall complaint history with BBB.
   BBB does not have sufficient background information on this business.

The Bureau processed a total of 928 complaint(s) about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period.

Complaints Concerned:

  5 - Selling Practices
    5 - Sales presentation used dishonest sales practices
  1 - Advertising Issues
    1 - Advertisement misrepresented a service
  1 - Service Issues
    1 - Improper or inferior service
  912 - Billing or Collection Issues
    3 - Failure to correct billing errors
    873 - Unauthorized credit card charges
    34 - Unauthorized bank debits
    1 - Failure to provide itemized billing as requested
    1 - Unknown
  1 - Delivery Issues
    1 - Non-delivery of services
  3 - Refund or Exchange Issues
    3 - General Refund or Exchange Complaint Issues
  1 - Product Issues
    1 - General Product Quality Complaint Issues
  4 - Customer Service Issues
    4 - Inappropriate behavior by customer service personnel

The 928 complaint(s) closed in the last 36 months was/were closed as:

  187 - Resolved
    5 - Company resolved the complaint issues. The consumer acknowledged acceptance to the BBB.
    182 - Company resolved the complaint issues. The consumer failed to acknowledged acceptance to the BBB.
  11 - Unresolved
    11 - Company failed to resolve the complaint issues through the BBB voluntary and self-regulatoryprocess.
  1 - Administratively Closed
    1 - BBB determined the company made good faith and reasonable offer to resolve the issues, but the consumer did not accept the offer.
  729 - No Response
    729 - Company failed to respond to the BBB or to the consumer to resolve the issues.

Here are other web sites that restate/summarize the issues:

http://www.vegasbbb.org/bbb_rated_acc_rpt.asp?bbbid=77161
(((link redacted)))

(((link redacted)))

It's one thing if people are gullible enough to fall for a "too good to be true" marketing promise.  But I entered no such agreement and the company showed no interest in correcting the situation.  They tell you to file a police report (bad info) but then they won't give you legitimate details about the business that you need for the report should you decide to file one.

My bank initiated a fraud investigation and will reverse the charges.  But I'm happy to say that I will be continuing my pursuits against this company and any poor fool ignorant enough to work for them.

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