• Report: #285089

Complaint Review: Keystone RV

Thank You

Read how Ripoff Report saves consumers millions.

  • Submitted: Thu, November 15, 2007
  • Updated: Sun, November 18, 2012

  • Reported By:Peoria Arizona
Keystone RV
2642 Hackberry Drive, Goshen, IN 46526 Goshen, Indiana U.S.A.

Keystone RV -- Raptor 3712TS Keystone RV Axles Issues -Very long / insightful -- Also Beaudry RV in Chandler AZ Goshen Indiana

*General Comment: RV Tires

*Consumer Comment: 2007 Keystone Raptor 3612DS

*Consumer Comment: 2007 Raptor 3612DS with tire blow-out issues

*Consumer Comment: Raptor Issues

*Consumer Comment: Keystone RV Worst product I have ever had!

What's this?
What's this?
What's this?
Is this
Ripoff Report
About you?
Ripoff Report
A business' first
line of defense
on the Internet.
If your business is
willing to make a
commitment to
customer satisfaction
Click here now..

Does your business have a bad reputation?
Fix it the right way.
Corporate Advocacy Program™

SEO Reputation Management at its best!

I am going to cross post this on a couple different sites and please do share this information with anyone that you know who owns a keystone product. Also there would be some value to consider whom you are going to purchase from if you are in the process of buying a RV / Toyhauler.

In a nutshell I purchased a Keystone Raptor 3712TS in October of 2006 from Beaudry RV. After our first trip to the Beaudry RV park in Tucson we had gone through 4 tires. I was first accused on hitting curbs, locking up trailer brakes, etc. But finally they replace the tires. This was after they had my trailer held captive for 7 weeks with little to no work being completed. Now lets fast forward to September 2007. I now had 5 tires that were showing significant wear with less than 1500 miles on these tires so I scheduled my RV to go back to Beaudry RV for "Warranty" work. On the day before my appointment I went to the storage facility and picked up my trailer. On the way home my trailer brakes locked up when the turn signal was turned on. Upon further investigation I found that the charge line from the truck into the trailer wiring harness had shorted out and had melted the wiring harness. The short occurred near the batteries on the toyhauler. So this was another items that was added to the fix it list for the warranty idiots at Beaudry. So I take my trailer in on September 4 and I leave a list of repairs. I then proceeded to contact Beaudry on a weekly basis to check the status of my trailer as we had plans on going to dunes for Halloween. So now lets fast forward from 9/4/2007 to 10/10/2007. I am called and told that my trailer is ready for pick up. I go down to the dealership and am told that nothing is wrong with the axles and that they only measured the mounting tabs and all was square. I asked about the wiring repair and was told it was done as well. So backed my truck up to pull away and well no trailer lights. The idiots, I mean technicians, didn't even touch my trailer. In fact in the 7 weeks they had my trailer they did nothing. I picked my trailer up and went straight to spec track for alignment. Bill there is great and very thorough. My axles were grossly misaligned. So now onto the information below. Please share it with anyone you know that owns a keystone product. It sounds like no attention is paid to the axles / wheels as the product leaves their factory.

A couple questions. First has anyone else had a similar experience? Second, Are there any attorneys that deal with product liability / defect issues on RV's?



Mr. Cole Davis, President and CEO Keystone RV,

It is unfortunate that I have to share the letters below with you but I feel that you as the leader of your organization need to know and understand some of the frustrations that buyers of your products are having. I find it particularly disturbing that after paying nearly $70k for my RV that I now find out that when it left the factory that the tires aren't balanced or aligned.
Please see the comments from Ms. Denise Roach in the letters below. How can a manufacturer of a product not assure that the product will perform appropriately
before letting it leave the factory? This baffles me and I am curious how many other owners have been given the same information that I have recently been given.

Customer service and superior products are what keep people coming back in the future. I would hope that you would look at my information below and share it
with others in your organization as a lesson of what QA / QC on a product is not. When the RV leaves your factory it shouldn't "almost" be ready for the
road.

Should you like to discuss further please feel free to contact me at
.

David
> Subject: Re: 800622 -- Please See attached documentation
> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 18:45:15 -0500
> From: "David J"
> To: roacd@keystonerv.com
> cc:
>
> This is very reassuring to know that Keystone does not care if the axles are properly set up on trailers as they leave the manufacture. I am going to take the information you have shared with me and share it with my peers as it relates to the quality of construction with my keystone product. I am also going to do further research on product liability as it relates to RV's. Knowingly selling a product that can have a defect, ie axles not properly aligned, is malicious and negligent. With the premature wear I was getting on my tires on my coach how would a response below sound in court should an accident have happened. I truly find this statement hard to believe. "When the units leave Keystone they are not aligned or tires balanced.". To me this type of
disclaimer should be provided to the buyer.

> The measurements that were taken on my coach have nothing to do with the camber / toe of the axles. They purely mounted the axles that were defective.
>
thank you for your time and I am going to be in touch with keystone further in
regards to this matter
>
> David
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my wireless blackberry device
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Denise Roach
> To:
> Sent: Mon Nov 12 15:45:16 2007
> Subject: FW: 800622 -- Please See attached documentation
>
> Mr.
> As you can see in the previous email, which was the wrong email address, Keystone does not warranty/reimburse for wheel alignments or tire balance. I got with the warranty manager and supervisor and they agreed, as stated in the Keystone Owner's Manual, wheel alignments and tire balance are not warranty and not covered by Keystone RV.
> Thank you,
> Denise
> Customer Relations Specialist
> Keystone RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Denise Roach
> Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 9:01 AM
> To:
> Subject: FW: 800622 -- Please See attached documentation
> Importance: High
>
> Dear Mr.
> Since receiving your email I have had time to review your file and discuss your input with the warranty team. Keystone's warranty team was in contact with your dealership, Beaudry RV, and they sent in the measurement sheets that are required when an "axle issue" is presented to them. The service advisor and Robert from Beaudry reviewed the measurements and all the measurements were within specs per the axle manufacturer. Being that the axle is fine the next issue would be a wheel alignment. Per the Keystone Owner's Manual, wheel alignments or tire balance are not covered under warranty. It is the responsibility of the owner to have the wheels aligned or balanced. When the units leave Keystone they are not aligned or tires balanced. Your documentation, input as well as this response has been added to your permanent file.
> Sincerely,
> Denise
> Customer Relations Specialist
> Keystone RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 11:54 AM
> To: Denise Roach
> Cc:
> Subject: FW: 800622 -- Please See attached documentation
> Importance: High
>
> Denise,
>
> Please see the attached documentation of axle repairs / alignment that were completed recently on my Raptor 3712TS. Axles were the primary reason that I took my toyhauler into Beaudry RV for warranty work in December of 2006 and then again in September of 2007. During the recent repairs I was assured by my service advisor that the coach would be taken to spectrac for axle evaluation. Spectrac is a service center that specializes in trailer axles and they are the best equipped facility in Phoenix area to handle this type of evaluation. The end result was that my trailer never left Beaudry RV and all that was done was axle hangers were measured. This clearly did not get to the root of the problem for premature tire wear. I think you will see in reading the attached documents that my axles were clearly not aligned properly and the axle where the most significant tire wear occurred was grossly aligned (axle #3). I am curious why this would not be considered a warranty repair on my trailer? It is very disappointing that after spending nearly $70K on a coach that I cannot have any confidence in the construction and operation. I have been concerned with the tire wear on this coach since it has gone through 8 tires in less than 1 year. It is my opinion that Keystone Raptor has an obligation to provide me reimbursement for my out of pocket expenses as it relates to my axle repairs ($622.58). I have provided adequate documentation that clearly shows a problem and I would like to hear from you and your company how you are going to proceed in reimbursing me for this expense. If this is not a "warranty" type issue I would like some documentation that provides accepted tolerances on axle alignment. Specifically what are the QA / QC specs for camber and toe on each of the axles prior to the coach leaving your factory. I have also attached a copy of the receipt for balancing of tires that were replaced by Carlisle. The tires were mounted by Beaudry, or one of their suppliers, however they did not balance the tires. The cost for this was $60.08

Total reimbursement that I am requesting is $682.66.

You can submit the payment directly to me at the following address

> David
>
> Peoria,
>
> Also I want to let you know of the total repairs that have been done to my trailer during the recent warranty visit to Beaudry RV. When I dropped the trailer off on September 4, 2007 I left this a list of items that needed repaired. Specifically my fuel station is leaking. This item was not repaired. The pop up countertop (long one in kitchen is warped) This was "fixed" with a backer rod but has been an ongoing issue since the pre delivery inspection. In order to make this repair proper a new countertop needs to be installed. The trailer wiring harness shorted and fried. This repair was not completed in the time it was sitting at the dealership and it wasn't until I went to pick up my coach that they did the repair. I don't know what costs they have submitted to you for warranty work but you need to be aware that they did not complete much of the work. Keystone should not have to pay for any work to Beaudry RV that they claim they did on my trailer. Beaudry RV is one of the worst consumer product dealers that I have ever dealt with in my life. I would never send anyone to this dealership to purchase a trailer. I think they do a poor job in representing your company, Keystone, and I hope at some point they realize that customer service and support is what keeps people coming back.

> If you have any questions or would like to discuss my request further please feel free to contact me at 623-.
>
> Thank you,
> David
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 8:28 AM
> To:
> Subject: Fw: 800622
>
>
> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Denise Roach"
>
> Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 07:36:45
> To:
> Subject: FW: 800622
>
>
> Mr.
> The next closest dealership besides Beaudry is Orangewood in Surprise, #623-974-3000. I know at this time of year the dealerships are very busy with getting units ready for storage or last of the year trips. I know that Beaudry's is busy but they will get the measurement sheets in. Should you change dealership now they will have to start over again with authorizations, measurement sheet etc... I am having the warranty manager getting with them again to get the sheets in. I am sorry it is taking so long. For being in the recreational vehicle business, sometimes its not very recreational. Again I am so very sorry.
Sincerely,
> Denise
> Customer Relations Specialist
> Keystone RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 12:20 PM
> To: Denise Roach
> Subject: Re: 800622
>
> Thank you Denise. Can you tell me are there any other dealers in AZ where I can get warranty service??
> Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Denise Roach"
>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:05:13
> To:<
> Subject: FW: 800622
>
>
> Mr.
> Our records show that our warranty manager on the 9th sent a reminder to the dealership to send the measurement sheets, on the 10th the dealership sent back that they would send to our fax number as soon as possible. That was the last correspondence with the dealership, yesterday.
> Thank you,
> Denise
> Customer Relations Specialist
> Keystone RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 6:35 PM
> To: Jose Mendibles; Denise Roach
> Cc:
> Subject: Fw: 800622
>
> See the email below. I would like to know when the paperwork was submitted. The note says there would be a response within 48 hours. It was my understanding that this was done last week. Is someone not giving me the correct information??
>
> Being told that my trailer would be completed today and leaving after spending better than half a day getting to your location is not acceptible. This has to be resolved immediately.
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: "Denise Roach"
>
> Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 09:30:28
> To:
> Subject: FW: 800622
>
>
> Dear Mr. > Thank you for taking the time to email Keystone RV. Since receiving your email I have reviewed your file and the dealership and Keystone are working on getting all the information regarding your axles and spring hangers to submit to the axle manufacturer to review. Per our warranty advisor once the measurement sheet from the dealership is submitted to Keystone it will be 48 hours or less before we get input from the axle manufacturer. It is not a matter of "pointing fingers", their input is essential for determining if something is out of specs and what the repair would be if so. I would suggest staying in touch with your dealership to get the measurement sheet in and for them to follow up with Keystone regarding input from the axle manufacturer. We realize that time is of the essence and we all need to work together to get the job done. Thank you again for your time, input and patience
> Sincerely,
> Denise
> Customer Relations Specialist
> Keystone RV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Trisha Mascarenas
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 8:18 AM
> To: Denise Roach
> Subject: FW: 800622
>
>
>
> Trish Mascarenas
> Customer Relations
> Administrative Assistant
> Keystone RV Company
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 2:20 PM
> To: CS Service/Parts/Warranty
> Subject: 800622
>
>
> Host: ip72-222-139-222.ph.ph.cox.net
> ------------------------------------------------------
> email:
> realname: David
> Address:
> City: Peoria
> State: AZ
> ZipCode: 8
> PhoneNumber: 62
> division: RP
> SerialNumber: 4ydf371247r800622
> VINNumber: 4ydf371247r800622
> Comments: I am writing this note to you customer service dept out of frustration and disappointment in the manner in which my recent warranty work is being handled by Beaudry RV in Chandler Arizona. I purchased my 2007 Raptor 3712 Last October and have had the trailer in on two other occasions for concerns over the axles / tires. After our first trip (approximately 300 miles) on the toyhauler I went through 4 tires and I took the unit into the dealer for this concern and after endless arguments and ~ 6 weeks of my trailer being at the service department they replaced the 4 damaged / worn tires and said there were no axle issues. This still didn't explain why the tires are wearing so rapidly. So now to the recent trip for the same issue I dropped my trailer off 1 month ago for tire / axle issues among other things that needed to be repaired (trailer wiring harness shorted and burned, warped counter top, fuel station leak, etc) This time they sent my trailer to "spe c track" for axle evaluation and they have found that there are problems with the axles. But the story I am getting from the dealer is that Keystone and the Axle supplier are pointing fingers at each other trying to determine who is responsible for the repairs. Here is my dilemma. I have brought this issue to the attention of the dealer back in December of 2006...and they chose not to look at repairing the axles or even evaluating them for problems. What is it going to take to get this problem resolved? I need my trailer, in running condition, by October 15. I don't think expecting to have my trailer back 6 weeks after dropping it at the dealer should be expecting to much?? Who at Keystone can I speak to in order to get this resolved? Fix my trailer then work out the warranty issues within your company. Please have someone call me ASAP at 623-
>
> Thank you,
> David
> B1: Submit Request
> ------------------------------------------------------
> 09/30/2007, 02:19 PM
> http://keyperformance-raptor.com/?page=service
> Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; Q312461; SV1; .NET
> CLR 1.1.4322; .NET CLR 1.0.3705)

David
Peoria, Arizona
U.S.A.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 11/15/2007 04:24 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Keystone-RV/Goshen-Indiana-46526/Keystone-RV-Raptor-3712TS-Keystone-RV-Axles-Issues-Very-long-insightful-Also-Beau-285089. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report.

Click Here to read other Ripoff Reports on Keystone RV

Search for additional reports

If you would like to see more Rip-off Reports on this company/individual, search here:

Search Tips
Report & Rebuttal
Respond to this report!
What's this?
Also a victim?
What's this?
Repair Your Reputation!
What's this?
REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author 5Consumer 0Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 General Comment

RV Tires

AUTHOR: Tom - (Canada)

Just read your comments on RV tires. I know most of your problems were axel alignment, but you might consider this when your axel problems are solved.  I purchased a 2008 Forest River Cardinal with a GVWR of 15.5K. My wife was researching the tires that (according to the brochure), came on the rig, and they were chinese tires with a speed rating of 55mph. imagine how long tires would last on an interstate doing 60-65mph. How do they rate tires? If a tire will hold together for a mininmu of 10 minutes at a certain speed, it's considered safe for that speed and gets that speed rating. Obviously, they test numerous tires. The first thing we did was call the dealer and tell them if those were the tires on my rig, I was not going to buy it. As it turned out, the tires had been upgraded to a higher speed rated tire, but still chinese tires. After 2200 miles, we were sitting at a stop light and the person in the car behind me knocked on my window and told me I had a bulge on the inside of one of my tires. Checked it out and sure enough, a grapefruit sized bulge. changed the tire, and on my way through Georgia, spend $1200 on four 12ply Goodyear tires. Good tires except that when yunning them at the "recommended pressure", the outside edges were wearing prematurly, so I upped the pressure to the max, now the wear pattern is fine. A final note. I've never had a flat or blowout because I'm almost paranoid about tire pressure. Also, I installed a tire pressure monitoring system that monitors both pressure and temperature, and have never had an issue. One final note, a friend of mine also had lots of tire failures and always replaced his tires with the recommended tires. I finally convinced him to increase the number of plys and since then, not one tireproblem   
Respond to this report!
What's this?

#2 Consumer Comment

2007 Keystone Raptor 3612DS

AUTHOR: Mike - (United States of America)

Dan I thought I was looking at my RV in your pics, this has happened to me three times, once in 2009 once in 2010 and now 2/18/2011...I am now having to pay out of my pocket to upgrade to 16 inch E rated tires and rims to have peace of mind when towing my rig...and my insurance company is going to have to to pay for the damage to my rig. which will affect me me again! dont know what else to do but I need to feel confident when towing my rig.
Respond to this report!
What's this?

#3 Consumer Comment

2007 Raptor 3612DS with tire blow-out issues

AUTHOR: Dan - (USA)

I purchased a 2007 Keystone Raptor 3612DS in April 2007.  The unit/tires have less then 3K miles on them.  Over this past July 4th, 2010 weekend I had a blow-out on the way to a camping trip that caused serious damage to the right side of the unit.  Upon returning home from the same trip I had a blow out on the left side causing additional extensive damage to that side of the unit.  These tires have less than 3K miles on them, were at recommended tire pressures, and had been driven less than 20 minutes at speeds below 55 MPH at the time of each blowout.  At the time of these blowouts the unit was empty minus minimal camping equipment (ie: clothing and bedding, no Rv's in garage, fuel cell, water & waste tanks empty).

The RV Dealer I am working with has engaged Carlisle Tire Warranty Services who have requested the tires be sent back to them for Engineerring evaluation.  After reviewing all specs on the Keystone website, per Carlisles request, I noticed that newer units have larger tires (235/80R/16 vs 225/75R/15) with a higher load range (E vs D) installed on them  The weight difference between the 2007 I own and the 2010 models are around 1500 lbs.  This leads me to assume that the tires installed on my 2007 unit were probably already at the upper end of the recommended load range, if not maxed out.

I would appreciate anyones input to similar situations (ie: similar failures, contacts for customer satisfaction, or legal proceedings).

Frustrated in MI,

Dan

 

Respond to this report!
What's this?

#4 Consumer Comment

Raptor Issues

AUTHOR: 2010 Raptor - (USA)

I too am having the same issues with my 2010 Raptor. I have owned it since June 2009 and it has been at the dealer close to 13 weeks (still there). Our issues have been :
TV quit working twice, Microwave had to be replaced twice, slideouts failed to close 2nd trip we took, subwoofer was not hooked up. Now after my first trip over 200 miles the tires are wearing down to steel belt. To make it home I had to change spare.

Now dealer has it again and the Axle folks and Keystone folks are telling me to hold on. I can only hope to get it back by 1st of year. I asked the dealer if I needed to do anything to the tires? Was told no, just ensure you check lugnuts and ensure tire pressure is up to par. I have done all of these. Sad to hear that these items should have been done by me after I buy the unit?? I would assume the tires and axles are in line when unit is purcahsed.

Keeping my fingers crossed they (Dealer, Keystone, Lipperd?) will treat me right. Time will tell.
Respond to this report!
What's this?

#5 Consumer Comment

Keystone RV Worst product I have ever had!

AUTHOR: Gary - (U.S.A.)

David

Keystone RV will run you around and around then will do nothing! As of my last 2 posting my RV is still in the shop, been there since Sept 27th 2007 today is Jan 2 2008! Some of the damage is from Sept 2006 and is still not fixed! After 1 year and 3 months I have had this unit for 90 days the rest of the time it has been broken down or in the shop. Anyone interested in a class action suite?

A warrantee is only as good as the people behind it!
Respond to this report!
What's this?
Report & Rebuttal
Respond to this report!
What's this?
Also a victim?
What's this?
Repair Your Reputation!
What's this?

Advertisers above have met our
strict standards for business conduct.



Ripoff Report Legal Directory