Bandit Motor Sports - Jim Johnson President warranty promises not honored-multiple deffects on chinese scootor Eugene Oregon

I just received a rebuttal called "Right Back at You" from Jim Johnson, (herein referred to as JJ).  at Bandit Motorsports, regarding a complaint I filed 31 months ago on the "Ripoff Report" web site, (hardly a timely 'right back at you' is it?).  

 Before reading my rebuttal, which includes Jim Johnsons e-mail promises never fulfilled,  I would like to make some corrections regarding statements made by JJ in his rebuttal of June 25, 2010;

 First, JJ says in the 6-25-10 rebuttal; "I told him that we didn't have a Belly Panel in stock in Red but would get one to him as soon as we did.

 I respond; I never asked for a red belly body panel.  I have a SILVER motor scooter. 

 Next JJ says in his rebuttal; "he did report that the seat latch had come open and the seat had shifted to one side bending the pivot bolt, that the fuel door didn't align properly because of it, and that the belly panel was also damaged.  I DID TELL HIM THAT ALL DAMAGES WOULD BE FIXED...I immediately sent him the items for the (You'll notice he didn't even mention this fact)." 

 I respond;  In my complaint to the Oregon  Better Business Bureau, I did not mention specifically the two items sent to me by JJ to correct the bent crooked seat /or the bent flap covering gas cap problem (one bolt and one sheet metal spring.)  I just mentioned the things he promised but never delivered.  FYI, these are the last 2 thing he ever sent. 

In Jim Johnsons rebuttal, he describes a 1" scratch as minor damage, but as youll see from the attached picture, it is not a small scratch, but is a gouge / scrape with a indentation below the scrape.  This scrape was caused by a metal shipping strap. 

Jim J also says in his 6-25-10 rebuttal;

  "yes, we covered the 1" scratch in the belly panel"

Really?  Amazingly, JJ implies he fixed the belly damage problem. 

JJ goes on to say;

"I love how he skips the details entirely"  

What skipped detail?  Jim Johnson NEVER fixed the belly panel damage or sent a replacement.   JJ continues in insincerity;

 "He eventually sent me the photos - Belly Panel damages was a 1" scratch on the rear of the panel on a face that points to the ground.  THIS WAS A PAINT SCRATCH. (NOTE; see photo to dispute JJs claim).   Of course, when I told him to just touch it up, his reaction was that I was insuating [sic] that he was a paint and body man (mountain out of flat plane).  Answer me this then - which do YOU BELIEVE would be easier to repair if you are not a paint and body man?  Paint touch up or remove and replace a body panel?  Yeah - I know..." 

I respond saying: 5 photos of the damaged scooter were e-mailed the day the scooter was delivered.  JIM JOHNSON contacted me the next day by e-mail, but he NEVER told me to touch up the body panel with paint.  Here is what Jim Johnson actually said in his e-mail to me on August 9, 2006;

----- Original Message -------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Jim Johnson

To: Terrence Baker

Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2006 5:11 PM

Subject: Re: shipping related damage

Hi Terrence,

"Sorry it got a little bang up on the way to you.  It looks like you need a new 'belly' panel in silver... or you could take your bike to a auto paint shop and they would fix it up for ya.  We can get you a new seat lift, and the belly panel if you choose... and I need you to check and see if the seat hinge bolt is still straight and perpendicular to the center line of the scooter.......

 "Let me know if you want a belly panel or if you prefer to take it to a auto paint shop.  A shipping claim will pay for everything so don't worry about that.  And I can get you the info to get started on that as well..."

 Let us know if you have other questions...
Thanks, Jim J...

As you have just read,  it was JJ who determined that the belly panel needed to be replaced or repainted by an auto shop.  He also promises me a shipping claim will pay for everything, so I shouldnt worry!  JJ will even get the information together  to get my claim started as well...Compare this e-mail to his rebuttal above, (the false claim of telling me to touch up the scratch).   From e-mails JJ sent me, you'll see his pattern of lies and denials throughout this rebuttal. 

Regarding the incorrect speedometer readings, JJ now admits in his rebuttal that the Speedo didn't register correctly and was off by 10-15 mph, depending on speed.  Reader, please see complaint number 4 in the Better Business Bureau complaint below.

Apparently, the crooked handlebars are now somehow controlled by a "Key."  This is the first time I have ever heard something about a KEY.  JJ never sent me a Chinese KEY, nor do I have one in my personal toolbox.  And to get to the welded handlebars, one would have to remove the vanity plates, windshield, all of the front scooter skins, and front headlight, to view the fork in the front of the motor scooter.   But reader, ask yourself this question: If the Chinese manufacture can't get the handle-bars aligned properly during manufacturing, then what makes you think any  consumer can?  And why didn't BMS correct this situation before sending the scooter, since they state on their web site

 "Before we ship any scooter, we start, run and test your scooter thoroughly including checking all switch and light functions as well as body condition.  Otherwise, we ship another unit. We don't believe any other seller provides this service since most are drop shippers.  In any event, we will work with you to resolve the situation to your satisfaction to include any needed repairs." 

 Here is another e-mail response from JJ  (after my 3rd request), regarding fix requests and parts not sent, that have not been completed as of August 31, 2006;

----- Original Message ----- -------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Jim Johnson

To: Terrence Baker

Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2006 8:10 PM

Subject: Re: fuse

Hey Terry,

We're not ignorin ya... [SIC] we're updating our computers and phone system to better serve our customers in the future.  But I wanted to let you know that I have you on the Parts Request form for the damaged parts and then I will get with Ed about your handle bar alignment...

(NOTE; ED, his mechanic, is now taking care of the crooked handlebar problem, (not me) and it looks like I'm finally getting all of my parts problems fixed), anyway, JJ thanks me for being patient.  But this was nothing but a stall tactic.

As you read this rebuttal and view these photographs, ask yourself this;  if for example, you bought a Chinese car, would the same flaws be acceptable to you?  How about a misaligned / crooked steering wheel, or incorrect reading on a speedometer and inaccurate odometer readings, or not knowing how much fuel you had left in your gas tank or  how about damage to the body, (and the dealership told you they would replace or have a paint shop correct the damage but never did), would you return the vehicle under the 'lemon' law? What if the dealer promised to fix the flaws, all covered under warranty, but never did.   Would all of this be acceptable to you? And when you did publicly complain, what if the dealership  labeled you as a person making a mountain out of a flat plain or THIS GUY didn't have any real warranty issues.  If these aren't warranty issues, then what is?  In my case, JJ is the final say on what is warranted, and not the evidence.  If JJ had just honored his word to me and corrected all of the defects below, rather than stringing me along for 8-9 months, then you would not be reading this complaint.  But apparently this astute businessman would rather continue along in negative publicity, heals dug in, refusing to do anything, (he did send a bolt and spring for the seat damaged in shipping), hoping you'll buy into his smoke screen explanations in his rebuttal.  But the smoke screen will be blown away by JJ's own e-mail promises to me, "to get everything resolve for me real soon"  Thankfully, you have not gone through what I have gone through.

Finally, JJ seems to suggest I requested a refund a year after I purchased the scooter, (purchased in July of  2006).  But again, this is NOT TRUE. On December 5, 2006, 5 months after my purchase, I REQUESTED, via my last e-mail to JJ, expressing my frustration with delays and problems with no possible fixes and I politely request a refund of my money.  I continued then, and thru my attorney, to request a refund to this very day.

 Here is my  last e-mail  and JJ responsse  (12-5-06) to Jim @ Bandit Motor Sports;

Hey Jim,

I have to tell you Jim, this is getting to be way more trouble than it is worth.  I had no problem in making reasonable 'fixes,' but of late, there are way too many problems with gas gauges, speedometers and mileage recorded incorrectly.  And you still have not addressed the belly panel inquiry.

 Now the latest problem is the gas cap.  It refuses to 'lock' into position, (see attachment).  What is the fix on this problem?

 As a suggestion, If these problems are getting as tiresome for you as they are for me, then you may want to take the scooter back and refund my money.  With the gas gauge reading incorrectly, and the speedometer indicating incorrect speed and mileage recorded incorrectly, this will probably be more than I can handle mechanically.  I really do need relief from these on-going problems.

 Anyway, I need a new gas cap or a 'fix' for this one, or else I cannot even ride the scooter.

 Terrence Baker 

Bandit Motor Sports responded

----- Original Message ----- -----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Jim Johnson

To: Terrence Baker

Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 11:27 AM

Subject: RE: remaining stuff

Hi Terry,

"Understand your concerns and we will work to get everything resolved for you soon.  I need more info from the supplier before I can make an assessment.  Plus, I got your photo of the fuel cap but I cant make out any details.  Could you send a little clearer photo?"

Thanks, Jim J

Another response from JJ

From: Jim Johnson

TO:  Terrence Baker

Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 3:06 PM

Subject: RE: remaining stuff

Hi Terry,

"Sorry for the delayed response were gearing up for X-mas up here and Im getting in some ATVs and dirt bikes to sell here at the shop.

Also, I wanted to get back some info from the supplier in regards to the speedo sending gear and the front tire size he has not completed his study as of yet but hopes to have a better corresponding unit before he ships my next container before the end of the year"

Let us know if you have other questions

So after being perpetually lied to, I eventually filed a complaint with the Oregon BBB asking them to read the e-mails that I received from JJ at BMS, concerning the complaints listed below, during the warranty period. 

When delivered, the scooter had 7 different problems.  I telephoned and e-mailed the problems and pictures to BMS and JJ, which indicated the defects found in the scooter.  Listed below are the 4 remaining documented complaints;

Excerpts from the Oregon BBB Complaint.

<COMPLAINT Number 1>

Damaged bottom belly panel in shipping, complaint e-mailed to Bandit Motor Sports. 

         Here is 'sincere' J J's 1^st response to me during the warranty period;

It looks like you need a new 'belly' panel in silver... or you could take your bike to a auto paint shop and they would fix it up for ya.

 "Let me know if you want a belly panel or if you prefer to take it to a auto paint shop.  A shipping claim will pay for everything so don't worry about that.  And I can get you the info to get started on that as well..."

 I will have a bunch of new parts (mostly body panels) here shortly in a new container of scooters due next Monday.  I will get the belly panel coming out to you at that time. 

         RESULT:  I never received the belly panel.

The belly panel issue was never resolved and the demand for a refund still is in effect

<COMPLAINT Number 2>

         The scooter handle bars were crooked and needed to be aligned with the front tire.  

         Here is 'sincere' Jim Johnson's 1^st response to me during the warranty period; 

"So I was checking my UC-250 and found that it appears the left handle bar sits much lower than the right side (while seated on the scooter).  I got off the scooter (leaving it on the center stand) and checked the front wheel for center and straight compared it to the head light position looking down and then looked along the concrete floor to make sure it was in line with the rear tire.  After I was sure that the alignment of the front tire was centered, I checked the handle bars for level by looking across the grips perpendicular to the center line.  The grips appeared to be  level so I put a level across the tops of the grips and it was pretty close.  So then I looked from the angle of being seated (without sitting on the scooter) and checked it again and it still looked like the left handle grip was much lower than the right.  At this point, I started taking some measurements from the ground.  I discovered that the body panels dont seem to be aligned perfectly square on the scooter.  In other words, the mounting points for all the body panels in the front end are just welded on to the frame and may not be very consistent.  Or could be consistently off"

         RESULT:  This problem was never corrected due to the fact that the handlebars are welded to the frame, a situation that cannot be corrected, nor could they replace my scooter with one in their inventory,  (i.e all of the scooters handlebars JJ measured were inconsistent too).

This issue was never resolved and the demand for a refund still is in effect

<COMPLAINT Number 3>

       A stuck gasoline float that did not register the correct amount of gasoline in the gas tank.

         Here is 'sincere'  Jim Johnson's 1^st response to me during the warranty period;

"On the gas gauge, I would guess that the float has stuck in the higher position.  Usually if there is signal problem, the gauge will indicate empty or bounce back and forth between empty and whatever level the float is at (represents an intermittent signal).  If you can stick a hook-wire in the fuel tank, (Mr. Baker speaking - every manual I have consulted says this fix is an extremely dangerous procedure (due to sparking) and should only be preformed by a licensed professional) and locate your float, you can move it around in the tank and watch the gauge move.  The float is on the left hand side of the bike (facing forward) and towards the filler neck.  The other way to get at the float is to remove the seat, then the plastic cover over the fuel tank, then there is a bronze colored locking ring on the sending unit / float.  You can remove the float from the tank and hold it in the air and move it up and down to check your signal to the fuel gauge.  Let me know if you have a proper signal to the gauge then we go from there."

         RESULT:  I did not and could not perform either procedure because of the danger involved and the level of expertise needed in performing this highly dangerous maneuver.

         NEW response from BMS to BBB, by 'insincere' Jim Johnson saying;

 "My

         My comment on the above response:  J J uses his own Yamaha motorcycle for justifying a defective fuel gauge on my scooter by saying; My Yamaha street motorcycle doesn't have a fuel gauge, let alone one that is inaccurate  Translated the scooter I sold you, even though it does have a fuel gauge, should not work either.  So Mr. Baker, you dont need to have a scooter that records accurate fuel levels, because mine doesnt, even though I know your expectations in purchasing the scooter from us dictates otherwise.  

This issue is still unresolved and the demand for a refund still is in effect

<COMPLAINT Number 4>

       My speedometer recorded a speed of 30 miles per hour, when in fact I was only going 23 miles per hour.  Speed was checked by riding through a stationary police radar display where the mileage and speed are demanded to be recorded accurately, in all 50 states, but is incorrect due the gear sending unit does not match the tire size. 

         Here is 'sincere'  Jim Johnson 1^st response to me during the warranty period; 

"On the speedo inaccuracy, Im not sure of what can be done immediately.  It comes down to the geared sending unit at the front wheel is not matched to the tire size so one of two things has to happen.  The tire needs to get bigger or the geared sending unit has to be made smaller.  I have the supplier working on this at the moment but its hard to convey the needed information so that he can understand what I am asking and needing.  I am working on the problem for the long term though"

         Mr. Baker speaking; Apparently, 'sincere' J J in his response to me, already knew about the speedo / tire size problem by saying;

 I have the supplier working on this at the moment ..  I am working on the problem for the long term though"

         RESULT:  I  d i d  n o t  receive a newly sized tire, nor a speedo sending unit to match my existing tire.

          NEW response from BMS to BBB -   This complaint was responded to by 'insincere' Jim Johnson saying;

"Mainly, the scooter DOES record mileage very accurately in Kilometers traveled.  That's all it has to do.  I have the same scooter, I've verified against mile posts traveled.  And while we've reviewed every part of 49 CFR part 571 (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Stnds) for motorycles, we have yet to find anything about an accurate speedometer or a fuel gauge of any kind being a requirement on motorcycles." 

My comment on the above response:  Here Jim contradicts himself; First he says; his suppliers are working on this at the moment and they will be working on this for the long term  Jim is trying to get this problem fixed and he hopes his next shipment will be better, and says in another e-mail;   in regards to the speedo sending gear and the front tire size he has not completed his study as of yet but hopes to have a better corresponding unit before he ships my next container before the end of the year yet in his response to the BBB, he says there is no problem at all, the speedo sending unit and the tire size are sending miles driven in Kilometers, very accurately.  But that is not true. My odometer does not record accurately in kilometers, nor in miles per hour.  Remember, if the speedometer needle points incorrectly to either MPH or KPH, then neither reading can be accurate.  In addition, Jim has already admitted, that the speedometer

I used to believe and practice fairly that any individual has their own opinions... and as such, can make comments as they see fit against me or my company.  I used to believe that people are fundamentally honest and decent - that general nice-guy conduct is predominently what most human beings are capable of.  I also used to believe that answering these complaints or providing rebuttals wasn't a good thing for my business in that I would seen as arguementative or defensive.  I was wrong...

The more I let these things stand, the more damage they tend to inflict upon my business.  It's not going to kill us by any means, but if I don't start answering to the claims, then many will just assume that they are correct and accurate...

THIS GUY is the perfect example of a person who can create a mountain out of an absolutely flat plane.  Distorting the facts - ommiting facts and out right lying are just part of his tools to make one think that he was a poor innocent victim...

First off, his purchase date and product are accurate.  For damages in shipping, he did report that the seat latch had come open and the seat had shifted to one side bending the pivot bolt, that the fuel door didn't align properl ybecause of it, and that the belly panel was also damaged.  I DID TELL HIM THAT ALL DAMAGES WOULD BE FIXED...

I immediately sent him the items for the (You'll notice he didn't even mention this fact).  I told him that we didn't have a Belly Panel in stock in Red but would get one to him as soon as we did.  I requested photos of the shipping damages so we could verify and document those damages.

He eventually sent me the photos... and the Belly Panel damages was a 1" scratch on the rear of the panel on a face that points to the ground.  THIS WAS A PAINT SCRATCH.  Of course, when I told him to just touch it up, his reaction was that I was insuating that he was a paint and body man (mountain out of flat plane).  Answer me this then - which do YOU BELIEVE would be easier to repair if you are not a paint and body man?  Paint touch up or remove and replace a body panel?  Yeah - I know...

We have warranties on all of the products that we sell.  Our warranty terms have always been way 'looser' than any of our online competitors.  We don't require any customer to send back a defective part so that we may verify it's condition.  In fact, we rarely ask for any proof other than an occassional photo...

THIS GUY didn't even have any real warranty issues...

The Geared sending unit was a perfect match to the front tire - for the purpsoe of recording miles traveled.  I tested four bikes persoanally and each odometer clicke doff 8 km's in the distance of 5 miles (posts).  The speedo didn't register correctly and was off by about 10-15 mph depending on overall speed.  But what is more important to a DMV when you change Title and Registration?  Do those documents ask you how fast you are riding - or how many miles are on the vehicle?  We're pretty sure that the super accurate Odometer out weighed the inaccurate speedo...

He also claims that the handle bars were crooked and misaligned.  Well, the alignment of the handle bars to the top of the fork tree is controlled by a key and way set up - it can only be in one place.  And I don't know if many of you are really aware but most motorcycle handle bars are crooked.  They generally have four bends in them and to manufacture them to where you have equal positions on both ends when you are done is next to impossible.  This is called MANUFACTURING TOLERANCE.  Of course, THIS GUY has to make a mountain out of a completely flat plane...

And the body damage to the scooter on delivery - yes, we covered the 1" scratch in the Belly Panel facing the ground.  I love how he just skips the details entirely.  Makes for a fantastic fantasy at least...

He reported that his fuel gauge did not qork correctly - and we provided to him two methods for addressing the problem.  As far as we could tell by his descriptions, the fuel float was stuck at the high point in the fuel tank.  We told him that there were two ways to resolve this issue.  The one we use all the time is to 'fish' around for the float with a coat hanger and get it to move on it's own again.  If he couldn't do that, then he could remove the seat, the fuel tank cover, and then the fuel gauge itself so that he could move it up and down with his hand...

He came back to us with 'I'm not a mechanic and won't work with such a dangerous situation' (montain out of flat plane)  He continued his attack of our suggestions and basically, blamed us for his own incompetence.  TO THIS DAY, everyone else has done this fix on their own without any trouble whatsoever - and there wouldn't be any danger of any kind in the second method suggested.  But then again, if he actually had common sense and was able to reason, he'd come to determine that he doesn't even have a complaint...

You will notice in his statements that 'there was absolutely no attempt to correct the above deffects'... does it seem like there was absolutely no attempt??  This means he's lying to try and reinforce his position, and in all likelihood, is lying about everything for the same reason.  I did catch him and am making the point...

And, yes, our BBB rating is way down - but that's mainly due to customers who enjoy filing frivolous complaints (this guy not withstanding).  Yes, I said frivulous.  We actually have a complaint against us for 'Raising our prices'.  This matter was announced way in advance of it happening, but when it did happen, someone had to make a BBB complaint against for it.  And we understood that we live in a free-market society.  We come to understand that no matter if we proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that our customers were lying, we would still get the negative notch from BBB simply for getting a complaint in the first place...

I'm very sorry if I have offended anyone with my response (except him)... and I'm planning to trash his entire complaint on Complaints.com.  THIS GUY is just a series of lies and half-truths... and it's time for these claims to stop...

Thank, Jim J...

PS - We have all records, e-mails, photo's, etc... to prove our claims above if anyone wishes to review...

PPS - Oh, and an important fact that he has naturally forgotten to include in any of his complaints... when he first started out complaining about his scooter and wanted a full refund, it was more than a year after the sale and he had more than 1,000 kms on the scooter.  He didn't actually make any of the claims that you see above to begin with.  His first complaint was that he went to sell the scooter locally but realized that the Odometer reads in KM's and his vehicle title shows Miles...

He reasoned with us that since he couldn't sell the scooter, in good conscience, with the Odometer indicating in KM's... and that he couldn't just entire the number from the Odometer onto his vehicle title for transfer because then it would be inaccurate.  So then he declares 'because of this specifc situation, I demand a full refund and that you arrange and pay for the scooter to pick-up'.  Mind you, this was over a year after we shipped it to him, and with 1,000 KMs on the odometer...

We figured that he actually tried to sell the scooter, but due to the pricing levels at that time for a new one delivered to his door, he couldn't get half the amount he paid for the UC-250 a year earlier.  And he probably figured we should go ahead and pay for that...

He may respond to our rebuttal - just analyze his comments on your own and decide.  Most of his statements are transparent enough anyways...