• Report: #649060
Complaint Review:

Don Tigert

  • Submitted: Fri, October 08, 2010
  • Updated: Sat, September 06, 2014

  • Reported By: One — Colorado United States of America
Don Tigert
1809 W loop 281, ste 100-133 Longview, Texas United States of America

Don Tigert Baccarat Personal Training Seminar Promised to teach a winning method, delivered a loser Longview, Texas

*Author of original report: Just refund my money already

*Author of original report: Civilization

*Consumer Comment: Don Tigert Baccarat

*Author of original report: Just refund my money

*Consumer Comment: Don Tigert Baccarat

*Author of original report: That's not me

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: Don Tigert's Baccarat Method

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: Don Tigert's Baccarat Method

*Consumer Comment: NOT MUCH BACCARAT IN EAST TEXAS

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Don Tigert is a snake oil salesman. He has at least two sites. Baccarat Wealth and The Baccarat Personal Training Seminar. He charges $2,500 to learn how to beat Baccarat.

This is from an email he sends out:

I show the person(s) how to make the 2500.00 fee back in 2 shoes or less. I have been staying very busy with members and new contacts that want to take there play to a new level and become rich playing baccarat, traveling full time like my self.

What he teaches is a double up (Martingale) system guaranteed to fail in the long run. In the short run, if you are lucky, you might get away with it. If you want to make your tuition back in two shoes, be willing to risk at least $20,000.

This is a discussion of his system in a baccarat forum:

http://baccaratforums.com/t2131/

I wish I had seen the forum before I wasted a week and $4,000 traveling to Vegas.

What he should do is offer a full refund for anyone who is dissatisfied with his program, but then he would be refunding most students.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 10/08/2010 10:28 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/don-tigert/longview-texas-75604/don-tigert-baccarat-personal-training-seminar-promised-to-teach-a-winning-method-delivere-649060. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
4Author 3Consumer 2Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Author of original report

Just refund my money already

AUTHOR: Jeff Hansen - ()

Since Don Tigert is a multimillionaire, I'm sure he can afford to refund my money, especially since I am not asking for interest. That's a $1,000 savings.

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#2 Author of original report

Civilization

AUTHOR: Jeff Hansen - ()

Now that we are communicating like grownups, please ask him to refund my $2,500. I cannot afford to lose another penny.

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#3 Consumer Comment

Don Tigert Baccarat

AUTHOR: Joseph - ()

Ok.. Most of your answers check out as being a student of his...

The only thing is I am making money with his method and his customer service is absolutely outstanding. So you must have been doing something wrong. Please don't take it personal. I screwed up too in the beginning.

Plus, if his method really didn't work, he wouldn't have the customer base he currently has.

He's not a greedy SOB. He loves what he does and he teaches it.

Also, I would consider that your level of actual play is not nearly what I have played, and certainy not what Don himself has played. Have you practiced enough before playing to make it muscle memory?

I'm wondering how many shoes you actually played with his method and then critiqued yourself on your own play to see if you could figure out what went wrong. 

I messed up 3 times playing his method in the beginning. But that's because I was a total beginner and had to play a few more practice runs before going to the table.

I critiqued myself and found what I did wrong. I also sent Don a text to tell him what happened and he got back to me in less than a half hour.

Not sure what happened to end your business relationship, but I am making money with it and so are many of his other students and we all love his customer service. Many of us make it a lifestyle and a source of income.

In fact, I actually helped him update his play sheets to make it easier to play and win sooner.

I'll be at the tables again in the next few weeks to play some more. 

I'm sorry you had a bad experience, but all of the current students loves his method. Not trying to make you a believer again, but you're missing out big time. You may want to consider (you probably never will but) getting a hold of Don and see if you can mend your relationship with him. 

The stuff he's researched in the last few years is amazing!

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#4 Author of original report

Just refund my money

AUTHOR: Jeff Hansen - ()

You:

My name is Joseph. This is a rebuttal to the negative comment about Don's method. Even though I may seem nasty at times, I really don't mean harm. I am just stating what is true and factual based on the very words you are using here to attempt to "discredit" Don's method. So I apologize in advance if I comes off as being nasty.

First off, gintruth is NOT an accurate source to go by. That website was made up by a group of people that were upset about a membership club being torn apart by greedy people.

So there's a lot of inaccurate info and hard feelings on that site with very few, if any credible opinions. How do I know this? I am part of that club.

And wizardofvegas you can't trust either... These are forums people. Find me ONE person in REAL life, not from some stupid post online that is unhappy with Don's Method. Show me or rather, show Don a real live person who is unhappy.

Me:

I didn't say Wizardofvegas. I'll show you one live person who is unhappy. Me.

http://www.gamblersglen.com/cgi-bin/teemz/teemz.cgi?action=opentopic&topic=380&forum=Baccarat_Message_Board

The wizard of odds has summed up betting systems/methods here:

http://wizardofodds.com/gambling/betting-systems/

It's the same old scam. Why would anyone who has a way to get rich need my money? Furthermore, if there was a way to beat the game, the dealers would be the first to know about it and quit their minimum wage jobs.

You:

And baccaratforum(s).com doesn't exist.

Which brings me to my next point. Why are you going to outside sources to prove your point that his "system" doesn't work? Don't you have enough evidence yourself (in real life) to prove Don's teachings don't work?

Me:

Because he said I couldnt find anyone who had complained. Read my post.

You:

Second, I am a student of Don's method which probably should have been stated first. I have been a student of his for little over one year. I can personally attest to Don's method. It works! But you MUST be teachable and you must follow his instructions.

This is key. If you don't follow the instructions on how to play it, then don't play it or buy it. Period. Because going off and doing it half your way and half Don's way isn't really the way to play it, is it? 

Me:

I played it the way he showed me

You:

Third, every time I hear a negative comment on a casino forum about Don's method, all I see is "your system doesn't work". The last time I checked, Don Tigert DOES NOT SELL A SYSTEM.

In fact, you're all correct! Systems don't work! Don sells information in what he calls a "Method" on how to make money (not gamble all your money away) playing Baccarat.

It's a Method, NOT a system... which tells me one of two things. Either one, you never really purchased Don's method because all his students KNOW to use the word Method in lieu of "System".

Me:

Classic bullshit. System, method, strategy. Nothing will beat the casino, no matter what you call it.

You:

Or two, you are an angry, disgruntled system seller that now has to compete with something that REALLY works. Or you're both of these.

Me:

You wish I was a system seller

You:

Next, to legitimize (if that's a word) you stating that you actually went through Don's training, then when, where and how did it take place? Was it in person as your post suggests? Was it online?

Also, how did you pay Don for the training? Cash, Check, etc?

Me:

2010. I met him at his high rise apartment in Vegas. We played at the Gold Coast. I have a copies of two cashiers checks totalling $2,500.

You:

Also, please give very specific details describing his method, not just, "Oh, it's a martingale step progression system". Describe it. In detail. With brevity.

Me:

He attempts to "randomize" the bets. It's like flipping a coin to decide how to bet.

You:

Also, explain, how you lost your money (describe your actions of play intricately), how much EXACTLY you lost (was it 50K exactly?), and where did it happen (what casino, specifically). Believe me, if you lost money you'll know to the penny how much you lost and where, and you'll remember it till your last day on earth.

Me:

Oh, I remember. Give my money back and I'll write a goddam novel for you.

You:

In addition, give me some things that Don tells you NOT to do when in the casino during play. In fact, tell me the one thing Don suggests you never order for a drink when at the baccarat table.

Me:

Booze

You:

All of these details will tell me and Don if you really did go through his training and if your complaint is really legit or not. 

Lastly, how can someone give you your money back if he doesnt even know who to send it to? He has to send the refund somewhere, right? To someone specific? A name, an address... this is how refunds do take place in the world today, correct? (And by the way, Don actually says to all his students before buying his method, that the fee is NON-REFUNDABLE. So you should've already known you couldn't ask for your money back, shouldn't you?)

Me:

I can ask for anything. I'll give you my name, number, address, shoe size and mothers maiden name if you agree to refund my $2,500. And I'll delete my complaint.

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#5 Consumer Comment

Don Tigert Baccarat

AUTHOR: Joseph - ()

My name is Joseph. This is a rebuttal to the negative comment about Don's method. Even though I may seem nasty at times, I really don't mean harm. I am just stating what is true and factual based on the very words you are using here to attempt to "discredit" Don's method. So I apologize in advance if I comes off as being nasty.

First off, gintruth is NOT an accurate source to go by. That website was made up by a group of people that were upset about a membership club being torn apart by greedy people.

So there's a lot of inaccurate info and hard feelings on that site with very few, if any credible opinions. How do I know this? I am part of that club.

And wizardofvegas you can't trust either... These are forums people. Find me ONE person in REAL life, not from some stupid post online that is unhappy with Don's Method. Show me or rather, show Don a real live person who is unhappy.

And baccaratforum(s).com doesn't exist.

Which brings me to my next point. Why are you going to outside sources to prove your point that his "system" doesn't work? Don't you have enough evidence yourself (in real life) to prove Don's teachings don't work? 

Second, I am a student of Don's method which probably should have been stated first. I have been a student of his for little over one year. I can personally attest to Don's method. It works! But you MUST be teachable and you must follow his instructions.

This is key. If you don't follow the instructions on how to play it, then don't play it or buy it. Period. Because going off and doing it half your way and half Don's way isn't really the way to play it, is it? 

Third, every time I hear a negative comment on a casino forum about Don's method, all I see is "your system doesn't work". The last time I checked, Don Tigert DOES NOT SELL A SYSTEM.

In fact, you're all correct! Systems don't work! Don sells information in what he calls a "Method" on how to make money (not gamble all your money away) playing Baccarat.

It's a Method, NOT a system... which tells me one of two things. Either one, you never really purchased Don's method because all his students KNOW to use the word Method in lieu of "System".

Or two, you are an angry, disgruntled system seller that now has to compete with something that REALLY works. Or you're both of these.

Next, to legitimize (if that's a word) you stating that you actually went through Don's training, then when, where and how did it take place? Was it in person as your post suggests? Was it online?

Also, how did you pay Don for the training? Cash, Check, etc?

Also, please give very specific details describing his method, not just, "Oh, it's a martingale step progression system". Describe it. In detail. With brevity.

Also, explain, how you lost your money (describe your actions of play intricately), how much EXACTLY you lost (was it 50K exactly?), and where did it happen (what casino, specifically). Believe me, if you lost money you'll know to the penny how much you lost and where, and you'll remember it till your last day on earth.

In addition, give me some things that Don tells you NOT to do when in the casino during play. In fact, tell me the one thing Don suggests you never order for a drink when at the baccarat table.

All of these details will tell me and Don if you really did go through his training and if your complaint is really legit or not. 

Lastly, how can someone give you your money back if he doesnt even know who to send it to? He has to send the refund somewhere, right? To someone specific? A name, an address... this is how refunds do take place in the world today, correct? (And by the way, Don actually says to all his students before buying his method, that the fee is NON-REFUNDABLE. So you should've already known you couldn't ask for your money back, shouldn't you?)

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#6 Author of original report

That's not me

AUTHOR: Jeff Hansen - ()

Don:

I was one of your "students". You are confusing me with 

Joe - (U.S.A.)

he wrote in after I filed my original report

I will address your rebuttal point by point:

 

don:

My Name is Don Tigert. I am rebutting the one and only complaint. The person that complained will not

reveal His name and when I read the complaint it sounded even more Fishy/Bogus. It's first Fishy If some

one files a complaint but does not contact me first to allow me to clear up any confusion or points of the

Training that need to be clarified.

jeff:

why do you need my name? 

I called you and told you that I was having trouble and had lost money. You said that i had to be doing it wrong. and that you would get back to me in a month. You lied

don:

And as part of the training I give UNLIMITED  email and phone Support. 

jeff:

You need to, because it will never work

don:

For You the Reader's Information, I Personally Challenged the Top 10 "System Sellers"on the internet, to show "Proof of Winnings". I will show proof of winnings so I contacted the top 5 system sellers to show proof, even just 1 proof of winnings and the result was not one of the top 10 produced any proof of winnings from Any Casino. My Challenge was for every 1 Proof of Win Loss Statement from a Casino I would produce 2 of mine.

jeff:

this means nothing. No system works. anyone playing martingale can show you proof of winnings. dozens of winnings of $25 and one loss of $50,000


don:

My Reputation on the net and in the Gaming community is very good. I have Thousands of Book Customers and Hundreds of Seminar Students, and you will be hard pressed to find only  2 or 3 negative remarks about Me, My Method, or my Support 

Jeff:

Oh really? 
http://gintruth.com/gnt/Blog/Entries/2012/6/19_Betting_on_Baccarat.html

http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/18434-don-tigert-2500-baccarat-seminar/

don:

 I put my money where my mouth is, meaning, I Train One on One, after the training I play what was just taught at the Casino Baccarat Table of chosen by the Student, we play and make money

Jeff:

That's the only reason I gave you my money. Apparantly you make enough money from gullible hicks that it makes up for your gambling losses

don:

 This is to the person that wrote the complaint and gave no name.  I am happy to talk to you my phone # is 817-437 9488 and If you are a Seminar Student you would know you have unlimited support from me. I will meet you anytime by Skype or in person In Las Vegas. I am there almost every month Training and Playing with past and present Students.  My Method Works and the Training and Support is second to none.  Feel Free to call me.  BaccaratTrainer.com

Jeff:

I have lost enough money. If you would agree to giving me a full refund, I will be happy to give you my name.

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#7 REBUTTAL Individual responds

Don Tigert's Baccarat Method

AUTHOR: Don Tigert - ()

My Name is Don Tigert, I place my full when addressing you.  You failed to include your full name

which means you are bogus and have no credibility.  If you were one of my Baccarat Seminar Students

you would know that I have a Home in Dallas/Frisco Texas and a Home in Las Vegas.  I have never

lived in a Trailer home, not that there's anything wrong with a trailer home but I have never

lived or owned one. You are probably one of the "System Sellers" that I challenged to show

proof of winnings and when you can't You try to trash me. Don Tigert does show proof of 

winnings and will challenge you or any one to show Proof of winnings before purchasing anything.

 

You obviously are not a student and you make very little sense with your hillbilly analogy's.

Some one that is credible gives their complete name, phone# and email address. Let me show you.

Don Tigert, (817) 437-9488, dontigert@aol.com , www.BaccaratTrainer.com  That's how a credible

person conducts himself.  Feel free to contact me or meet me in person you will surly learn some

valuable Baccarat information just by talking to me. Will see if you do contact me. I won't hold my

breath.  Don Tigert

 

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#8 REBUTTAL Individual responds

Don Tigert's Baccarat Method

AUTHOR: Don Tigert - ()

My Name is Don Tigert. I am rebutting the one and only complaint. The person that complained will not

reveal His name and when I read the complaint it sounded even more Fishy/Bogus. It's first Fishy If some

one files a complaint but does not contact me first to allow me to clear up any confusion or points of the

Training that need to be clarified. As mentioed  I, Don Tigert am the creator of The Baccarat Seminar Method. 

I am responding/rebutting to the Person that filed the complaint.

#1.  The Person will not give a Name which is suspect and loses credibility from the start.

#2.  This Un-named Person is clearly confused thinking that there must be Casinos in Longview Texas. There are no Casinos in Texas. I have to Drive North to Oklahoma or East to Shreveport. La. to play at the nearest Casinos closest to Dallas, Texas.

I also Have a Home in Las Vegas for which if this person was a "One On One" Baccarat Seminar 

Student they would have known Have a Home in Dallas Texas and a home In Las Vegas and my usual Monthly schedule is first 2 weeks I'm In Dallas and the last 2 weeks I'm At my Las Vegas home Playing and Training.

#3.  Not only do I Train my Students "One on One" , as part of the training, I also go to the Casino of choice and play with the Student. And as part of the training I give UNLIMITED  email and phone Support. 

#4. For You the Reader's Information, I Personally Challenged the Top 10 "System Sellers"on the internet, to show "Proof of Winnings". I will show proof of winnings so I contacted the top 5 system sellers to show proof, even just 1 proof of winnings and the result was not one of the top 10 produced any proof of winnings from Any Casino. My Challenge was for every 1 Proof of Win Loss Statement from a Casino I would produce 2 of mine.

This infuriated  3 of the 10 and we have seen 2 or 3 negative comments trashing me and all were "Anonymous" which speaks volumes to their Credibility. When you make a complaint the first thing is to contact the person your accusing, in this case me, and allow me to cure the problem. but when a person just starts spouting Snake Oil Salesman and other nutty comments about why there's no casinos in Longview, Texas is lame.

This person is not a One on One Seminar Student and has not mentioned any pertinent or factual information that would lead me to believe that he has taken my One on One Seminar Training. 

#5. My Reputation on the net and in the Gaming community is very good. I have Thousands of Book Customers and Hundreds of Seminar Students, and you will be hard pressed to find only  2 or 3 negative remarks about Me, My Method, or my Support and most importantly I put my money where my mouth is, meaning, I Train One on One, after the training I play what was just taught at the Casino Baccarat Table of chosen by the Student, we play and make money, and after the training you have unlimited email and phone access/support which in one word tells my story, "Credibility"

#6. This is to the person that wrote the complaint and gave no name.  I am happy to talk to you my phone # is 817-437 9488 and If you are a Seminar Student you would know you have unlimited support from me. I will meet you anytime by Skype or in person In Las Vegas. I am there almost every month Training and Playing with past and present Students.  My Method Works and the Training and Support is second to none.  Feel Free to call me.  BaccaratTrainer.com

 

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#9 Consumer Comment

NOT MUCH BACCARAT IN EAST TEXAS

AUTHOR: Joe - (U.S.A.)

Back in the day, you could see prominent ads in supermarket tabloids and even in the daily papers for scam schemes like this one.

Then, like now, people wanted a system to beat the odds and to get rich quick in sin city Vegas.

Your first clue should have been his address.

In Longview, Texas, it used to be hard to buy a six pack of beer. And the only gambling taking place was in some remote gambling shack by invitation only and you could get your alcoholic beverages there as well. Cards and Dice and beer and burgers.

 

BACCARAT???????

 

IN EAST TEXAS??????

 

If I was a master of a method to get rich at the casinos, I would be in a luxury yacht in a slip at Monaco or Cannes and not in some house trailer under the Pine Trees!

Look like a good old boy done slicked hisself one of them there city folk.

Something weirf about those Pine Trees...LOL

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