• Report: #889073
Complaint Review:

Options on the Open

  • Submitted: Sun, May 27, 2012
  • Updated: Sun, February 03, 2013

  • Reported By: Rich — Rogers Arkansas United States of America
Options on the Open
Internet United States of America

Options on the Open Larry Gaines Implied Profitability False Internet, Internet

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Trading ES futures with your system

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I'm submitting this report so that others may not end up doing what I did and losing out on their hard earned money.

The advertising at Options on the Open is very misleading.

He offers a "system" or "model" for what he calls his "patent-pending", 4-step "Power Cycle Trading Model".  He states that "it is a proven, simple to use, 4-Step day trading ssystem that can be used to trade across all asset classes." Then then goes on to list several markets, including the SP500 ES emini.

His advertising claims that "this 4-Step Cycle Trading System identifies with a high degree of accuracy intra-day price trends and gives an entry trigger that gets you in at the very beginning of a new intra-day price cycle."

This is completely false!

I've been trading the markets for over 20 years, so I'm not new to this. The problem with Larry's 4-step model is that IT DOES NOT get you in the beginning of trades at the very beginning, but rather, it either has you jumping in too early and getting clobbered, or sitting on your hands and missing the trading action.

I have spent 5 days and many hours following his instructions carefully to trade the ES mini market, a market that HE HIMSELF DOES NOT TRADE with his system. In addition to the $560 "non-refundable" I paid, losses also follow.  

When you ask Larry about the problem of his system, he will point to the charts "after-the-fact" to show the signals that would have been profitable. Unfortunately, although this is easy to do in hindsight, it is difficult to do in real-time. When asked to demonstrate his method in the ES mini market, he defends it by saying "I do not trade that market but I have a customer who does and it works for him after he spent 3-months papertrading it."


1. His customer is not the one selling this method for trading the ES emini, Larry is.
2. If this is an "EASY 4-STEP" approach, why did his customer take a full 3 months of paper-trading it to finally make it work for him?

Watching Larry trade his method on the market he likes, such as APPLE stock using options, hours go by listening to him getting frustrated for missing this move or that move. Then sometimes he makes a small profit, and he is also making several small losses. When you watch this live, it looks ridiculous as a way to make a living trading.

What is not easily discernible from his advertising is that he spends all day trying to scalp a couple points here, a couple of points there. It's more about "scalping", something that should be left to those actually on the trading floor rather than from home.

The biggest issue I have with his service is that you purchase based on his website advertising and a write-up in a trading magazine that inaccurately suggested his system provides an edge. Clearly the editor of the magazine did not trade this himself but also was influenced by the hindsight demonstrations from Larry. Those hindsight demos are impressive. Once you try it yourself, you can see how easy it is to make those hindsight calls, but you also realize it is not what it appears to be.

He has a "no-refund" policy.  If his system was so good, why would he have such a policy? It won't protect his method because there is nothing to prevent anyone from sharing it to the public. In fact, his no refund policy is likely to push someone to do so someday. Fortunately for Larry, that is not something I would do. I was dumb enough to actually think this would be useful and so I pay the price. It is not the first time. Goes with the business of trading.

However, I submit this report because Larry does not give refunds and so there are no protections in place for people who find out they have purchased something that Larry himself admits he himself does not trade (the ES emini, specifically), that he has to point that some customer of his got it to work for him after 3-months (tweaking it no doubt).  That brings up one more thing...

On his live trading room I stated that this was not working well trading the SP500 ES emini market. After he tried to show hindsight that it does, the same charts I watched LIVE and know for a fact did not provide correct signals at the right time, and after he refused to demonstrate trading it himself right there in front of us customers, he went on to say that I need to 'tweak it' to fit my own personality. What??? You mean I need to make this "my system" because your system does not work "as is" for the ES emini?

If I "tweak it" to my own liking, does it then become MY system and not his? Therefore, I should be able to sell it.

Without giving details, his system is simply using a couple of stock oscillator indicators and BAND indicators that everyone has in their charting program. He has you change the setting in one of the oscillators, for he claims "he found it works best". Yet, he states it works for EVERY market. Any real trader knows that no single setting works for all markets!  In fact, this setting was no advantage to others I tried. It just makes it 'his'.

BEFORE you plop down nearly $600 on something that looks better in hindsight than in real trading, be sure you ask him to demonstrate it on the market you trade LIVE before you pay for it, because you won't get a refund later.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 05/27/2012 03:02 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/options-on-the-open/internet/options-on-the-open-larry-gaines-implied-profitability-false-internet-internet-889073. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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#1 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Trading ES futures with your system

AUTHOR: Larry - (United States of America)

I have mused a bit of late as to why your system/indicators work for me so much better than those I've tried in the past.

Somewhat off and on, I've been at futures trading for just over two years and have yet to find a methodology that even comes close to yours, for me anyway. I've tried "key numbers". I've tried "auction logic/volume profile" and even candlesticks.

I'm still part of an "auction logic" chat that I had open last week (they did a "Go-To-Meeting" live/voice transmission) and there are some very sophisticated traders in the room. This was simultaneous with your chat. Here they were (last Tues, Wed, Thurs) complaining of the "chop" and inability to get a handle on a
trade. Meanwhile, using the Power Cycle Model with Hugh's custom indicators, I'm scalping one or two (ES) points per trade in the "chop" that seems so indecipherable to them. I mean, if you're are trading 3 - 5 ES contracts and netting 5 to 10 ES points (not ticks) per day.....I mean, how bad is that?

My academic background is in architecture and I've been a builder for nearly 35 years. Maybe, for me anyway, it's the fact that your system is so "visual", that it is not as much numbers based but charts. I dont know, but it sure works for me.

There are many out there "selling" methods. Did I mention "selling"?

You, however, have actually done this for a living. Not selling people things, but TRADING for a living. Not selling people stocks, bonds, etc. as a stock salesman (broker). So many of these jokers....err, sorry, individuals claim to have these methodologies and/or systems but when it comes right down to it, they are salesmen (women) first and foremost that are really better at that, selling,....than at trading. 

Take care Larry and thank you for what you are doing.

John~ Nevada
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