Report: #663296

Complaint Review: Paypal Inc.

  • Submitted: Wed, November 17, 2010
  • Updated: Mon, November 22, 2010
  • Reported By: Troy — Minneapolis Minnesota U.S.A.
  • Paypal Inc.
    2211 North First Street
    San Jose, California
    United States of America

Show customers why they should trust your business over your competitors...

I sold a $1000 item on ebay.  My paypal account shows that the seller paid however my accounts says that my money is being held.  Ok.  So I ship the guitar.  A week later it is received. Two days later I check my account and still I do not have the money. 

Paypal treats me like I'm a criminal or something.  Last I checked I'm innocent until proven guilty yet you have NO evidence of any kind that I'm doing anything wrong.  Talk about a major crooked company.  I shipped my item out and now I don't have any money to show for it!  If that isn't bad enough they charge me $30 to steal my money!  I think they owe me interest on my money seeing they're illegally/ethically withholding it.

To make this complaint I went on paypal's website to find their company's address and I couldn't find it. That probably deters people from making complaints.  So I googled for paypal's address and found a site called  Wow, a whole website dedicated to show people how to get around Paypal's habitual criminal actions. 

I want my money!  No excuses. And I want interest on top of that - $30/day for treating me like a criminal without any evidence. Today is 10 days = $300 and counting.
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This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 11/17/2010 07:33 PM and is a permanent record located here: The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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#1 Consumer Comment

I am just a small time buyer and seller...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

So why is it I can buy and sell on eBay using PayPal and not have a single problem/
sure I would prefer if the fees were less..but when I think about what it would take to open a business these days..and what it would take to advertise and promote my sales nation and worldwide...PayPal and eBay seem like a pretty good deal to me...and millions and millions of others.

I agree the customer service sucks..but it sucks almost with anyone these days...all outsourced. But I was never forced to use eBay or PayPal. I CHOOSE with my own God given free use them over the other choices. I take the good with the bad, and find at least for me..the good far outweighs the bad.

I have earned trust and am a top rated power seller now. I sell an item, and in MINUTES..the funds are in my account and I can use them. How is this a bad thing for the economy? Because they charge a fee? Oh god forbid they should make any profit dealing with all the cry babies who expect eBay and PayPal to cover their risky and stupid buying decisions..or to appease sellers that can't abide by the rules?

Sorry. ain't buying it.
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#2 Author of original report

Let's get this straightened out once and for all

AUTHOR: Troy - (U.S.A.)

I believe a lot of you completely missed the whole point of my reporting Paypal as a ripoff.  Don't act so surprised that there's a complaint on this site.

Fact #1.  Paypal overcharges customers.  $30 to adjust a number in your account.  That's like charging $4000 for a Number 2 pencil.  Ridiculous, right? Of course! 

Fact #2. Paypal treats honest customers as criminals and denies access to their own money causing the customer to waste time trying to gain access to money.

Those of you who are Paypal cronies paid to bat for Paypal and unethical business practices and express broken crystal ball perceptions and sickly psychologically abusive opinions are not helping here.  If you can't understand what a ripoff is please look it up.

Financial services on the internet is necessary for business to flow.  Unethical business practices = ripoff plain and simple!   I support any class action lawsuit against Paypal and any legislative law to regular the exploitation of customers by Paypal.  I also recommend boycotting Paypal altogether.  Unfortunately, boycotting doesn't work for big companies anymore because even if Paypal lost a few million customers their having charged over 100 times what their services cost more than makes up for any losses. 

Anyone who has ever educated themselves about how big corporations and government do business is that the overcharging (exploitation) of services contributes to poverty in any nation causing the major banking system in that region to own the debt system meaning they own people (financial slavery).  That's called economic terrorism and Paypal is a proud sponsor of economic terrorism by their choices in business practices. 

Want to know what an ebay customer service rep told me once?  Do not pass on ebay seller's fees to the customer because you'll hurt your chances of selling and not being competetive.  In other words, they admit that they charge so much that it's not even wise to pass on the fees that you have to pay.  How much does it cost to list and sell one item on ebay?  More than likely 10 cents.  Charge a dollar or two and make a profit.  They charged me $60.50 just to access the site.  That is exploitation, period.  Not only do they over charge but they have no reliable customer service.  It takes anyone 10 to 30 minutes just to find the link to access customer service and then once you access you need to wait another hour or two to talk to anyone and on top that the reps don't even know their own rules.  It's all a ripoff.

So because I do not support unethical business practices nor economic terrorism I posted a report.  For those of you who don't know what economic terrorism is by all means go to youtube and search for "zeitgeist addendum" and watch the full documentary which is about two hours long.

I'm sure what Paypal is doing is legal.  But, then again, in America, genocide is legal too so as long as you're making billions and giving the government kick backs like the pharmeceutical companies murdering 100,000 people ever year needlessly.  Government approved poisons in the water and food supply causing horrible diseases and suffering.  So I'm not here saying its illegal.  I'm saying its unethical. A society is not sustainable nor civilized if the economic system is not uniformly ethical in its practices. 

So, if you want to be helpful then by all means tell me what is a good ebay and paypal alternative that has good business practices because I'm finding someplace else to take my business.  For those of you who would support paypal or ebay or the 'way it is' (refering to the legal system) you might as well just admit to be a supporter of economic terrorism and exploitation.

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#3 Consumer Comment

Self corrections..

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA) normal everyday life..I can edit and make corrections to a post. On this website..I can not..and I am really sloppy as a typist.

where I stated.." The OP came back stating that research has concluded that sellers are scamming buyers.."

Should read "that buyers are scamming sellers" ( me some proof of that..)..and at some point I typed "except"..when I intended to type "accept". I seem to have some involuntary dyslexia that causes my fingers to type "except" when I mean to type "accept"..but I would hope anyone with half..or even a quarter of a brain would on their on be able to determine what my intentions were.
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#4 Consumer Comment

Why are people responding...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

That have NO idea what PayPal is???

PayPal is NOT a BANK!! I explained in detail in reply #1 why PayPal holds funds.

The OP came back stating that research has concluded that sellers are scamming buyers.

I have been using eBay and PayPal as a side business for a while. I do not buy and sell "here and there", I use them on a regular basis. eBay and PayPal have helped me survive a very rough period..the industry I am in has taken a hit on many levels..and without my home business which is primarily done via eBay and PayPal, I would have possibly been homeless.

Now...the procedure is really simple even I can do it. You list an item...the item is purchased from a buyer who pays via PayPal, you ship the item and get paid. Yes..there is a fee..but many prefer to use PayPal so they do not have to give some unknown seller their bank account/credit card info. And anyone who knows the deal..knows that phishing and identity theft is a major concern when conducting any online transaction.

As I stated previously, no one has to use PayPal to make a purchase, or to except it as payment as a seller. It is an OPTION..and using PayPal or eBay is a privilege..NOT a right.

If you do not like the terms, or understand the way they operate..simply do not use it. I have NEVER been ripped off by PayPal, but I have been...and am currently still to this day, subject to the SAME terms as any other PayPal user.

Now..where there is often regarding PayPal buyer credit, and the PayPal "business debit" card, which I use and absolutely LOVE. In those instances, PayPal is subject to the SAME ,EXACT, IDENTICAL regulations as ANY bank..which is why the terms "credit" and the name "Visa" and "debit", are associated.

If you have any questions..refer to the first reply.
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#5 Consumer Suggestion


AUTHOR: Chicago Medallion Management Corp - (USA)


PLEASE learn how to read, because it is clear you cannot.  Do NOT attribute words to us that are not from our statement.

We stand by what we said. 

Paypal has been sued more times than I can count for similar actions. I've been a part of many of those aforementioned lawsuits.

Please tell me where in my original statement I said, I sell things "here and there".

Also where did I say I had to search for their address and did not find it after being part of the class action suit?  I had their address long before then.  I've never had a "real" problem with Paypal because I never kept money in the account.  I got paid and left a balance of usually under a buck in there.  They can't go to your bank account without permission. 

So, PLEASE learn how to read, Bobby, because you look like a true horse's a*s when you take snippets from every single comment from every user and try to pass it off as one person's comments so you can look like you're important in front of mom and dad.


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#6 Consumer Comment


AUTHOR: Robert - (U.S.A.)

Why do people feel that they have to exaggerate to try and prove what ever they are trying to prove.

Paypal has been sued more times than I can count for similar actions. I've been a part of many of those aforementioned lawsuits.

- Not believable.  Because from your own words you just sell things "here and there".  So if you were a part of many of those actions why would you keep going back to PayPal, especially when you are only selling "here and there".  Also, you stated for "this" complaint you went to search for their address.  Well if you had been part of the other suits, one would think that you would already know the address.

Now, personally I think many people are with you.  But when you start to make claims like that it does nothing to help you.  Also, I agree that if Paypal had all of the same regulations as a "Regular" Bank in respect to the money that they hold and goes through their system, they wouldn't get away with a majority of the stuff that they do. 

But that is the problem, they are not a "regular" bank.  However, just like a bank they have terms that you agree to when you sign up.  It is up to you to decide to do business with them or not.  If you are using PayPal then you agree to those terms.

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#7 Consumer Suggestion


AUTHOR: Chicago Medallion Management Corp - (USA)

For what it is worth, there is another site, called, which basically states that ebay (paypal, since they're all owned by the same company) is not a bank, and does not need to operate as such.

Paypal has been sued more times than I can count for similar actions.  I've been a part of many of those aforementioned lawsuits.

Paypal is there for Paypal only.  They deliberately hide their information in an attempt to discourage you from calling them.  For the ones who manage to discover their phone, they will keep you on eternal hold.  Most people won't sue because it's not worth it financially.  The site above has plenty of fascinating stories about people who were ripped off by Paypal.  Paypal claims to be secure and more secure than anything else, but yet paypal is hacked into on nearly a daily basis and has more spam than any other major website.  Does ebay care? Nope, it's not important to them to stop spammers.  As long as they can fool people into believing they are secure, and make it a requirement to sell on ebay, then they have no need to spend time or money on making ebay a safe place to shop.  It's not in their best interests.

What can YOU do?  Get a merchant account for yourself.  Or just stop selling on ebay and insist on paper payments only.
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#8 Consumer Comment

Call Paypal !

AUTHOR: Zk4au - (U.S.A.)

I have had the same incident happen within the last month, all you have to do is call the paypal i believe 1-800 number and ask them to release the funds they may ask for tracking number of item to verify its delivery. They did mine and released the funds within minutes. Hope this helps.
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#9 Author of original report


AUTHOR: Troy - (U.S.A.)

A couple of facts.

I have 100% positive feedback.

I do not have an ebay business. I just sell things here and there on there and have had an account for years with them and paypal with no problems of any kind.  That's why this surprises me.

Ebay Buyer Protection sounds like insurance to me vs. withholding.  I would think ebay could offer that considering how much they rip every one just using a site.  It certainly did not cost them $60 to host my listing. And it does not cost $30 to transfer funds from one paypal account to the next. 

After a little bit of research I find that the problem was sellers scamming buyers.  So now that this policy in effect the ability scam went from the seller scamming the buyer to the buyer scamming the seller.  It accomplishes nothing.  I have to have positive feedback to get my money?  How many buyers do not leave feedback and just forget about it and/or lie and leave negative feedback just to create a dispute about the item that untrue so they can scam the seller and get their money back and I'm out the money and the product! 

I thought that if a seller scams a buyer you take them to court and sue them.  There is so many flaws in Paypal's policy that it's just worthless so I will not be doing business with them.  If you like being ripped off by their ungodly fees and like paypal gambling your money on the virtue of a buyer and you have the money to cover those losses then good for me. For me, I spent my grocery money shipping the item (not cheap) and now I'm going to be begging people for food when I have a thousand dollars in my account because paypal THINKS I'm a scammer.
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#10 Consumer Comment

I can sympathize...

AUTHOR: Ronny g - (USA)

..however, and this will probably do no good..feebly attempt to explain why this is done.

Believe it or not..although this policy is geared more towards protecting PayPal..and the actually helps sellers in the long run. Allow me..

When I first moved to LA, I was not really making an income, but living off the money I had made selling cars in a previous state. When I realized I was literally going broke..and it was really hard to find work here, I figured since I have an eBay/PayPal account, I should sell off some valuables.

My first sale on ebay other then a car (which is really eBAy Motors I had been using) was a really expensive Fender guitar. It sold fast, and required around 100 dollars for me to ship it..hard shell case, oversize, insurance, confirmation etc..

So after it sold..I figured (and oh so wrongly), that once the funds were in my account, I would ship the valuable guitar..and all would be well.

But no..PayPal explained to me that the funds would NOT be released to me...until a length of time AFTER I provide proof I shipped the guitar..AND, that the buyer leaves a positive feedback.

This really put me in a if I had a hundred bucks laying around to ship the guitar in the first place, I CERTAINLY would not be selling off my valuables/collectibles that I love and cherish. yourself..I was livid. But I also understood what it must be like to be a business such as PayPal, that is really there only to make online transactions safer.

For far as they know..I never sold an expensive guitar before on eBay (what is your feedback rating as a seller?).., and they have to protect the buyer..right?

Now I could have easily either not sent anything, or sent a fake guitar not as described. Why should PayPal trust me from a hole in the wall until I establish trust over TIME as an ethical seller of rare guitars?. Do you really think there is any shortage of scammers out there that would JUMP at ANY loophole to scam PayPal and buyers?

So, if I sent a fake guitar..and presented proof of shipment..and they release the funds to me right away...what does the buyer do 2-3 weeks later when the guitar is received and they discover I painted a Fender or Gibson logo onto an Epiphone? The buyer lodges a dispute with PayPal..right?

What does PayPal do?...well if they were not holding the funds...there is nothing they could do if I close up the account and vanish off into the virtual woodwork of online scamming. So do you think PayPal is going to offer buyer protection..and then risk paying out of pocket because they trusted YOU? Who the heck are YOU to them? Just an account..they did not give you a drug test..a polygraph..or call any you understand??

This is the way it works for EVERY SINGLE SELLER EVER that chooses upon their own God given free will, to use PayPal. Don't except as a form of payment if of you do not agree to how they protect themselves and buyers considering online scams are rampant beyond imagination..NO ONE can be trusted..nor should be until they are WELL established as per their terms. may does this help you as a seller? them using the hold as a safeguard to offer the buyers protection..the buyers are more confident..and actually buy more from an well as established seller. I have established myself with them so now EVERY transaction is INSTANT payment..and I love it. It took the time as they state in their terms of use to get to this point..but it really worked out very well for me in the long run. I now sell a lot using PayPal.

If you think eBay or PayPal are like Craigslist..or try to use them as such (like an online yard sale) ain't gonna happen. But if you actually want the opportunity to sell worldwide very inexpensively compared to other means of advertising and promotion, most a hell of a lot more riskier, and run a legit home business that can actually make you money (as 99.99% of "home business" opportunity are SCAMS)..and have access to instant have to like EVERYONE ELSE who uses eBay and/or PayPal..go through the process. It is NOT a ripoff..and you WILL get your money. You are just unhappy that it is not to your terms, but theirs. And it is their terms because they are the ones offering buyer protection. Does Western Union offer that?

So..if you are really that disgruntled with PayPal..can you possibly suggest a BETTER way to protect online transactions that would not require a hold? Please do share if you have one. If you do not like that they are simply trying to prevent being scammed..don't use them anymore. Millions and millions of consumers and sellers will continue to use them per day regardless if you choose to or not. And the vast majority will have no problems.
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