Signtronix took a $1207.00 Deposit Straight to the bank And cashed it. Will not give me a refund Torrence California

kenneth, your tone is pitiful! i wonder if you were treated the same way how would you feel? maybe if someone you cared about was treated the way you mention would you still feel the same? the points that you make are valid but your attitude is lousy. i have a friend who has worked for signtronix for years and prides himself on integrity. we have stopped in on some of his accounts and he has developed a good relationship with his clients due to the way he treats them. the signs that he sells are very nice and i do think they stand out! i think that sales reps with an attitude like yours give a bad name to any company maybe you should take a hard look at yourself.

Regardless of what the "Employee" above says, the "deposit" is the dealers commission. It does not go to Signtronix. I know from fact because I have the same problem with Signtronix and the dealer Brad Whistler, as explained in my report here on this site #398611

Not only did my salesman admit the deposit was his commission numerous times, Signtronix themselves backed up that fact, in writing, during my dealings with them through the BBB (which I will be posting the BBB documents as an 'update' on my own report very soon, just to show how much the BBB is no help when it comes to a company such as Signtronix, and to show how Signtronix lies. Not that we don't know that already)

In my case, the check was NOT a personal check. It was a business account check, so what do you have to say about that? I would bet that most of the people that have problems with Signtronix here have used business accounts with the sales people.

Why do the sales people not go to their own bank to cash these checks? Are they afraid of paper-trails that would show which bank they use?

Why do they track down the customers own bank as soon as they possibly can to cash the check for cash?

Why do they not get the money order at the bank they cash the check? Are you saying the dealer cashes a check and then drives to another bank to get a money order? That makes absolutely NO sense.

Why is the check that is given to the sales person not sent directly to the factory as you say the money order would be? Is it in fear that the check will be fake or something? (again paper-trail fear maybe?) If it is a lease situation, the future payments will be taken from the same account and it sure won't be done by money order. It will be EFT. So if the check would be no good guess what, the EFTs would not work either

These are all moot points that would only be answered by a Signtronix "employee" with more excuses/lies. They are merely to show that what is said by Signtronix "employees" is nothing but trying to get themselves out of the holes they dig

I know 100%, from the tellers at my bank that there was NO money order of any kind bought when my check was cashed! It was in, grabbed the cash, and back out the door.

Here are some things from the official Signtronix career site that show that the deposit money goes straight into the dealers pocket and does not go to the factory at all, as the "employee" stated:

There is some other good reading here but look in paragraph three on this page. It's even underlined: "your commission is paid immediately after you make the sale"
http://signtronixcareers.com/job-sales-rep.asp

Here is another, and this one sheds some light as to why the sales person will do or say anything to get your signature, knowing the money is for the keeping. 4th bullet: "Get paid quickly... soon after you make the sale, with no charge-backs"
http://signtronixcareers.com/opportunity.asp

Here is one of the success stories from a Signtronix salesman. Although one of his "mentors" is the salesman in my report, the guy writing this story is not connected to any of this, but what he writes says a lot. Look at the last paragraph where he states, "It will be easy to put a $700 paycheck in your pocket at eleven in the morning and want to go home and take it easy but just keep working for more"
http://signtronixcareers.com/success-mark-gowen.asp

There is no talk of 'it takes so much time and effort to process the order and design the sign', like the "employee" above claims.

Notice how this salesman states it is "easy" and in a few hours he makes $700.00! Say he starts at 8:00 am (but seeing they work with small business, it is probably more like 9am, maybe even 10am, but I will let it at 8am). So that is three hours of work and he makes $700.00. That would be $233.33 an hour!! No paper-filing employee or graphic designer at this level, would ever make that much. Most lawyers and doctors would even be drooling over this pay rate

And about the claim that graphic designers are not cheap. In some cases it is true and the person would make good money, but anybody that owns or has seen a Signtronix sign, or has witnessed the sales person 'designing' the sign, will probably tell you that it is a cookie-cutter graphics/font layout. The sales person uses a program on a laptop with pre-designed clip-art and font styles. It is like using an every-day art program. It doesn't take much skill to learn your way around a program like that. I have seen 12 year olds design layouts that would blow this stuff out of the water.

The "deposit" is the only thing non-cancelable in the Signtronix contract if you change your mind. That is, unless the order got to the factory and you had your sign at your doorstep before you even gave the 'final art approval' or knew it was being shipped (as a lot of reports here state as happening). That is all done just so you don't get the chance to change your mind, whether or not you like the sign you receive

The dealers commission (deposit) is protected under the contract because if that would have to be refunded for any reason, the "dealers" would not be getting paid. If that happened, do you think these "dealers" would continue working for Signtronix? It would be good for the businesses that are getting screwed but it would also cause Signtronix a whole lot of headaches. They would have to start paying the "dealers" out of their own pockets and that just doesn't happen with a commission-only job.

Normally a sub-contractor, which is what these salesmen are, would get paid after the deal was done and went smoothly. This is why sub-contractor laws are drastically changing. Although most of these laws are construction-based, sales organizations need to be included in these laws because it is the same type of things happening to people.

The Signtronix organization set-up is all in the company's favor. The contract and same day pay-days with no charge-backs makes the sales people turn into predators and the more frenzied the sales people become, the more money Signtronix makes in return. It's easy to see if you look close

Reading the contract does NOT explain any of this. I don't care if a person spends a whole day reading it over and over. The information is just not there

The dealers are instructed to take a personal check and cash it so they can convert it into a money order or cashier's check to send it to the factory. The dealer and company both have spent time and effort already working on making your sign (Graphic designers are not free, neither are the people processing the orders). The only advice I can give you is to read any contract before you sign it. The contract the dealers have you sign are very clear that it's a non-cancelable agreement.

The dealers are instructed to take a personal check and cash it so they can convert it into a money order or cashier's check to send it to the factory. The dealer and company both have spent time and effort already working on making your sign (Graphic designers are not free, neither are the people processing the orders). The only advice I can give you is to read any contract before you sign it. The contract the dealers have you sign are very clear that it's a non-cancelable agreement.

The dealers are instructed to take a personal check and cash it so they can convert it into a money order or cashier's check to send it to the factory. The dealer and company both have spent time and effort already working on making your sign (Graphic designers are not free, neither are the people processing the orders). The only advice I can give you is to read any contract before you sign it. The contract the dealers have you sign are very clear that it's a non-cancelable agreement.

Kenneth, when a person asks you why the deposit is not refundable why do you not tell the truth?

As well as in general, why not tell the truth to the person that authored this post?

Instead of your little joke, "it is for people who only pretend to be buying a sign", why not explain to the customer, "Well your 'deposit' is my commision and one of the reasons I work for Signtronix is because once you sign this contract and hand me the deposit money, I am out the door and paid. Signtronix is a such a GREAT company!"

It's odd how a customer CAN cancel the sign itself but the ONLY way any Signtronix sales person can explain the deposit as being non-refundable, is that "it says so on the contract. Did you not read the contract? well maybe you should have read the contract!"

Don't defend it by saying that it is for your time and travel either. Especially when you come into a business unsolicited. The customer is not responsible for your career choice so don't make it sound like you are 'owed' this money for just showing up at the business and spending time attempting to make a sale.

You comparing a trip in an ambulance to a Signtronix contract is amusing. I could imagine if an ambulance operated like a Signtronix sales team member. To make the two comparable, the ambulance trip would go something like this:

You (customer) are sitting at home watching tv, relaxing, or whatever else you would happen to be doing.

There is a knock at the door.

You get up to answer it, open the door, and find a man standing there dressed as an EMT (sales person)

He says, "I am so-and-so. I am here with an Ambulancix ambulance and I am here to offer you a service. Do you happen to feel sick and in need of hospital care?"

You just stand there with a blank look on your face...

He says, "I offer an ambulance service for people in desperate need. I do not own the ambulance and I do not work for Ambulancix, who does own the vehicle, but I have permission to use it. No need for me to bother explaining those little details though. Time is wasting. You are looking more and more 'under the weather' as each and every second passes. You should really think about it."

You scratch your head and say, "well I don't feel sick"

He then says "well, even though you don't feel sick, there have been studies done stating that you are probably sick and don't even know it. Trust me, I know what I am talking about and these studies are right on the money. I have seen many terrible things happen to people that though they were healthy. I could give you references if you would like for me to prove I can back this up."

He goes on and on with statistics and studies and how this ambulance is the best thing since sliced bread

You ask, "Well which hospital would you be taking me to if I was sick?"

He says, "You are missing the point. There is no need to ask questions like that because I am good at what I do. You don't have the luxury of time for asking needless questions. You can trust me. Even though I am just the ambulance driver, I will say that it is the best hospital! Nothing but the best for a showcase service!"

You start to feel as though you have a fever coming on

He says "also... and this is for you and only you, and because I want people in the area to hear of my driving abilities, I will even cut the price of the ride in half! Just for the fact that nobody in your area has yet to take a ride with me in 'my' ambulance."

You think to yourself, "wow, I really am starting to feel sick. I DO have a fever and what is this pain starting to run down my left arm? Maybe I should do this before it is too late!"

He says, "All you need to do is give me a deposit of cash or a check in MY name, which by the way is not refundable because I say so, and we will be on our way to the hospital. It will be a small price for such a wise decision that will ensure you will prosper in life for many years to come!"

You finally agree to go with it. You make out a check for the deposit, give it to the driver, and jump in the ambulance. Your journey to the hospital begins


After what seems like an eternity, the ambulance finally stops.

The driver opens the doors to let you out, says "we're here", helps you to the pavement, and before you can ask a question or say a single word, the driver is back in the ambulance and speeding away.

You turn and begin to walk towards the building. You see the word 'hospital' but wonder why the building is so small

You think, "Well maybe it is small so they can give better care for a more limited number of patients."

It finally sinks in as to where you were dropped off as you walk through the doors and hear dogs barking, cats meowing, and various other animal noises.

A veterinarian hospital! You have been ripped off!

You call Ambulancix. You state what happened and that you want your money back. You mention the name of the driver that you paid.

You are told you will not get the money back because the driver you speak of is not an employee of Ambulancix and they are not held responsible for what that person has said or done.

You try to call the driver. No answer. You leave a message

You never get a call back

Next you start receiving bills in the mail from Ambulancix for the use of their ambulance during the trip to the hospital

You stop to reflect on what has happened

Your face begins to turn red... and it's not from a fever

The muscles in your hands tighten... and it's not a cramp

Your teeth clench... and it's not due to to tetanus

Welcome to the world of 'outside sales'

You need to HONOR your written signed agreement for the balance of your purchase.

No one has "ripped you off."

You PURCASED a Sign!

You are at least 18 or older, right?

You knew what you were doing, you BOUGHT a sign.

Honor your word, Friend!

You promised "not to" "change your mind!" This is a CONTRACT OBLIGATION.
Changing your mind at such a point makes you appear as unreliable. It also does not make sense. You deposit is not refundable. Its written IN your copy of the contract.
I read that to each of my customers. When they ask why is that there, I answer, "It is for people who only PRETEND to be buying a sign. You aren't pretending to buy a sign, are you?"

They laugh! Its FUNNY!

Let's use something else as an example:
Your Mom needs to take an ambulance to get emergency care. You "change your mind," deciding you don't want to pay for it. Huh? It does not make sense, be it a sign or a ride in an ambulance.

As a busines owner, you NEED the sign.

Make some great money with it! Have NO regrets!

Congradualtions on your new sign purchase from Signtronix. It is simply the best!
A wise busniness decision on your part.

Put your new sign UP. MAKE the money it brings in, when UP.

:>)