• Report: #267520
Complaint Review:

Wholly-Water, Life Streams International Mfg. Co, James Fairgrieve

  • Submitted: Tue, August 14, 2007
  • Updated: Sun, February 19, 2012

  • Reported By:Arcadia California
Wholly-Water, Life Streams International Mfg. Co, James Fairgrieve
5203 Moore Road Westmoreland, New York U.S.A.

Wholly-Water, Life Streams International Mfg. Co, James Fairgrieve Wholly-Water whole house fluoride & arsenic water purification system does not work. Ripoff Westmoreland New York

*Consumer Comment: The Water Treatment System Worked For Me

*Consumer Comment: California Water is as wet as it's politics

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Here is what happed and what is beeing done.

*Author of original report: Please update original report.

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I am on city water in Temple City, California. My city water already meets EPA standards.

On 3/9/05 I supplied Wholly-Water.com/Life Streams International Mfg. Co. a copy of a water test from ChemServe water testing facility of New Hampshire which showed my home water contained EPA approved levels of arsenic (<.010 PMCL), lead (<.010 mg/L) and fluoride (.457 mg/L). I also supplied a copy of a report of my home's water consumption for the prior year. I asked Wholly-Water in an email if they could remove 99% of these three contaminants.

On 3/16/05 I ordered a $2500 Whole House Wholly Water Arsenic-Fluoride Enhanced Purification System from Wholly-Water.com. $1500 was for the basic 2 tank system and $1000 was for the 3rd arsenic-fluoride tank. Wholly Water told me that I could not buy the arsenic-fluoride 3rd tank without buying the basic 2 tank system to condition the water for the 3rd tank.

I installed the system with the homemade instructions provided and installed an expensive bracing system as we have earthquakes.

In December, 06 I had ChemServe perform another test using the Wholly-Water filtered water. The results were arsenic (<.010 PMCL), lead (<.010 mg/L) and fluoride (.498 mg/L). These results meant the Wholly-Water was not removing any fluoride.

On 1/26/07 I emailed Wholly-Water.com with these test results and said "Please note the fluoride levels contained in the recent test results are very high and near the level of the before installation test. Do you have any suggestions? I question whether the system filters fluoride, the sole reason for my purchasing the system."

Wholly-Water.com emailed back on 1/30/07 "Fluoride is a very difficult substance to remove, and we have never put our full attention on it." Mr. Fairgrieve then offered me a under-the-counter Wholly-Water Appliance at a reduced cost.

I emailed back requesting a whole house solution.

Mr. Fairgrieve emailed back on 2/22/07 offering me a larger 3rd tank at a reduced price.

Please note that Mr. Fairgrieve has since admitted he has no test results on any of his large arsenic-fluoride removal systems!

Mr. Fairgrieve offered multiple times in his emails to conduct a long term test of my water if I bought another system. That was his proposed solution. I do not believe he knows how to make the large arsenic-fluoride removal system work. I did not take Mr. Fairgrieve's offer of a long term test because his only solution was for me to buy more of his products (which didn't work). Please note Mr. Fairgrieve is a smooth salesman, not a water technician or engineer.

On 5/30/07 I sent Wholly-Water.com and Mr. Fairgrieve a certified letter detailing the history of my purchase, installation and notification of failure of my Wholly-Water system with suitable document attachments and asked him to make the system work at his expense or refund my $2500.

I have received no response.

Please note that Mr. Fairgrieve prides himself on never having a return. His website lists a detailed return policy. If Mr. Fairgrieve never communicates with you concerning a return, or accepts a return he probably can make this claim.

Be aware of Wholly-Water products.

Arcadia, California

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 08/14/2007 05:59 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/wholly-water-life-streams-international-mfg-co-james-fairgrieve/westmoreland-new-york-13490/wholly-water-life-streams-international-mfg-co-james-fairgrieve-wholly-water-whole-hous-267520. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Consumer Comment

The Water Treatment System Worked For Me

AUTHOR: Robert M - (United States of America)

   I am generally a skeptic, but I took a chance on James Fairgrieve's arsenic removal system and it worked for me.  My water was last tested by Truesdail Laboratories, Inc 14201 Franklin Ave., Tustin, CA, www.truesdail.com on 12/20/2005 and on 1/25/2012.  It was retested again for arsenic the problem substance I wanted removed to check that the system was still working as promised.  There were no other problems with the other water parameter tested the first time, when the well was first dug so only the arsenic level was the retested on 1/25/2012.  The report Lab I.D. 999797 results determined that Arsenic EPA 200.8 contained Arsenic at 6.95 ug/L or parts per billion.  The state of California has recently increased the water purity standards for Arsenic required to be less than 10.0 ug/L from 50.0 ug\lL for public water.  My well water is now 100% within State required parameters for public consumption.  I purchased the whole house 3 tank system and connected to 3/4" piping to slow the water going over the media to maximize the media's ability to purify the water.

   It should be noted that the Notes on the report stated under Detection Limit: specified ND:  Below the limits of detection (Not Detected)

   It should also be noted that I have never met Mr. Fairgieve and I have no financial interest in his product or business other than as his customer.        
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#2 Consumer Comment

California Water is as wet as it's politics

AUTHOR: Joe Keating - (U.S.A.)

I am saddened to read that the report stating that the Wholly water system for flouride removal does not work. Mr. Fairgreives is correct in advising his Californian customer that flouride is extremely difficult to remove. In addition, this manufacturer has offered a larger unit that would probably do the job. You see that soluble chemicals like flouride in water have to be removed by reverse osmosis or through longer than usual contact times with an adsorbent media that has an affinity for flouride. I do not know what media was offered in this case, but knowing the products and in fairness Mr. Fairgreives and the Wholly Water organization, the Wholly water product will remove the unwanted chemicals (in this case flouride) in the water as intended. The problem, from a "mechanical filtration" removal is indeed contact time required. I believe that the unit offered was undersized and the person who is complaining should have opted for the larger unit if he was really serious about removing the flouride. The large unit would definitely offer longer contact time with the filtration media and therefore would have no doubt have removed the unwanter flouride. In closeing, an asside abservation, it is even more important to note that if US States like New York and California didn't add the flouride in the first place, thanks to their wonderful politicians, it wouldn't have to be removed - in the first place. The public would be better served if this "customer" were to take it up with the State of California instead of picking on an honest businessman who is concerned with carcinogens that our government puts into our precious resources!
Thanks you for allowing me to rebut this injustice!
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#3 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Here is what happed and what is beeing done.

AUTHOR: Whollywater - (U.S.A.)

Hello Mr. B,

Fluoride is a very difficult substance to remove, and we have never put our full attention on it. Wholly Water technology goes after the whole range of water contaminates. It is tops in the Industry at what it does. With that said we can remove Fluoride very well, as shown in our new tests in India last year. India Institute of Technology spent about 5 months with various tests, primarily for arsenic, but several other substance as well.

Our target was the arsenic, but it did contain 12 oz of fluoride removal media. It dropped fluoride from 7.92 ppm to 0.448 94.4%. In studying the test results I did however learn a great deal. First I should say there was 20 times greater amount of arsenic media in the unit. This also removes fluoride just not as well.

What was most important is contact time with the media bed. Flowing water to fast will greatly reduce performance as the contact time is to short, even though it is enough for removing other contaminants.

I think this is the reason in your case, and I think I have a easy solution for it. This has proven itself in both India and Bangladesh with arsenic which much harder to remove.
I have a second arsenic add on unit that is filled totally with media dedicated for removing arsenic. I can do the same thing for you only just use fluoride media. This will be an under counter unit like the Wholly Water Appliance, but dedicated only for fluoride removal. Your existing whole house system is doing all the work in front of this to make this work. The reason for this small unit is to give a slow flow rate through a comparative large media bed. This unit will not need to be back washed so it will be totally care free. Since you are not getting the results you expected I will provide this at 50% of the cost of the Wholly Water Appliance and give you Free shipping and our new upgraded faucet and our pressure regulator set at 40 psi, a normal $95.00 cost. This faucet has an all metal handle that turns 1/4 to full open, and has a no drip ceramic closure. With it you can slow the flow rate for more contact time. These will all increase the performance for you. Your total cost $350.00

Best Regards,

Hi Jim,

Sorry for not getting back with you sooner.

Thank you for the offer of a smaller unit for the kitchen but I need your help in making the whole house system work.

I need the system to remove fluoride in the kitchen and the bathrooms. What can you provide that will make the third tank in the whole house system work to remove fluoride? Right now the test results show that the fluoride levels are not affected by the filter.


Hi Gary,

In that case I will do a similar offer but with our largest 2 million gallon 3 rd. tank size. (10.5 " x 56") I will fill one will only the fluoride media to the point that it can be topped off with the media that is in your present 3 rd. tank. It will come with the special funnel, for adding your media. This will add about 150% more contact time for fluoride removal.

Cost will be less then 50% of the normal $1,300. price. $600. and Shipping $85.

Best regards,


I have offered you 2 choices of the 2 you will have much more contact time with an under counter fluoride add-on unit than a whole house size.

I want to improve my offer to you and let you have it for $200. shipped.
Send me your test results after using it a while and lets see how it is performing and go from there.


Hi Gary,

What I am saying is, contact time with media is what removes fluoride. If it is not enough the results will be minimal. This leaves two choises, slow the water flow or increase the filter media.

I want to see the results of the add-on small fluoride unit. The water flow will be much slower then in the large system and a large ratio of media. I will add a water flow meter to it. I know your fluoride level, and I will know how much media is in this unit. I know how much it is suppose to remove, so this will tell me what I want to know.

I want to find out for my self exactly how well this is performing on your real water situation.

Many tests are done in labs with synthetic water spiked with,contaminants. There are millions of possible combinations of water chemical conditions in real water.

With your help, I want to zero in on your fluoride problem and fix it. The data from this will enable me to make improvements in sizing the large tanks.

As I said before arsenic was what I have been working on, fluoride was an added benefit of that work.

At the lower levels where your water is, increased contact time is vital as shown in my India test results. When more media was supplied in the arsenic add on unit it dropped from 8.21 to 0.342 over 96% removal

Note: this add on unit had arsenic media in it, not the fluoride media which would have performed better.

Update: Aug. 18,2007
Since this happened , I have set up the same test that I offered, to do with Mr. Gary, ( testing the new fluoride add-on unit by itself, on water in Clearwater Fl.

The test are done by an owner of the same three tank system in my large size.

His 2 + year old system is now passing trace amounts of fluoride but with his single under counter unit after it fluoride is non detectable.

Knowing this, three tank system in my large size and single under counter unit after it is the only way I sell this system now for fluoride removal.
However, I will sell the under counter unit with the new fluoride add-on also.

Just this week I shipped this same small system to India where it will be tested.
As tested by India Institute of Technology on arsenic but this time made for all the normal things but targeting fluoride removal.

The tests are to be carried out simultaneously at Public Health Engineering Departments of Andhra Pradesh, Maharashtra, and Orissa and our National Environmental Engineering Institute at Nagpur.

So Mr. Gary, I am now focusing on removing fluoride, and I expect I will have the best fluoride system people can buy. I am an honest and reliable businessman as this should show any reasonable person. After this system is tested and proven, I will again make you a very good offer, and hope you will accept it.

James Fairgrieve CEO of Life Streams International Mfg. Co. Inventor of Wholly Water The Ultimate Drinking Water Appliance
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#4 Author of original report

Please update original report.

AUTHOR: Funplacetowork - (U.S.A.)

The last line of the original report should read:
"Beaware" instead of "Be aware".

Please add the following line to the end of the original report:
Copies of correspondence and water tests can be provided upon request.
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