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Report: #101112

Complaint Review: Keyes Toyota - Van Nuys California

  • Submitted:
  • Updated:
  • Reported By: Malibu California
  • Keyes Toyota 5855 Van Nuys Blvd., Van Nuys, California U.S.A.

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Here's the short version: my roommate very kindly offered to go with me one weekend to look for a car. Having either purchased or helped purchase eight cars to date, she felt pretty comfortable on a car lot. Her experience balanced my lack thereof.

I decided to go to Keyes Toyota in Van Nuys based on a TV ad they were running and, as a result of the ad, a telephone conversation with their used car manager in which I was very frank about my dismal credit rating: no down payment, no co-signer, a $350 monthly payment ability and only my nearly inoperable Ford Explorer as a trade-in. He told me to come on downhe'd be able to help me.

After several hours of being there, being pushed from one department to another, the humiliating experience of filling out an application for a new car at the insistence of a sales person when I knew I was going to be turned down, filling out another application in the used car area (only to be told again the I didn't qualify), and told that they just didn't think they could get it to work without a co-signer, we decided to leave. My roommate suggested that we go and check out the Jeep Dealership since she had a current loan with them at 1.9% financing.

As we thanked the sales manager for his time, he suggested to my roommate that she might qualify as a co-signer. Hindsight is always 20/20, I know, but I'll say it anywaylooking back it's so clear how they manipulated the situation, making it almost impossible for my roommate to decline.

My roommate stated quite clearly that she did not need another car and did not want to be the primary on a loan. They assured us that she would only be the co-signer and that after I made six months of payments and established a good payment history with them then we would be able to remove her as the co-signer and I could bring the car in and trade up for the car I wanted. I had stated many times during the hours we were there that I had no down payment, needed to keep my payments to $350 a month and would use my Ford as a trade in. Also that I needed the payments to be on a schedule after the 15th of each month to coincide with my employment pay cycle. We were told all of this was fineno problemand that my first payment wouldn't even be due until about 55 days after the purchase.

We were eventually shown into the office of the loan processor. As he pulled out paper after paper, he kept indicating that my roommate should sign on the top line and/or where it read primary and that I was to sign below her name and/or where it read co-signer. Each time we signed a document, both I and my roommate independently voiced our confusion at signing in such manner. We kept reminding him that I was the primary and she was the co-signer. That she did not want to be the primary. His response was that it was just an internal thing, that when the information was sent out (I assumed to the lenders) that I would be on the contract as the primary. After approximately 8 hours of searching for a car, the rollercoaster ride of applying and being denied and reapplying and being denied for a purchase, we were exhausted and took his word for it.

It wasn't until the next day when I was reviewing all the information that I discovered the loan processor had not put down due dates for payments on the 15th of each month, but rather the 11th of each monthfour days before I received my paycheck. There was no way I was ever going to be able to make payments on timeI'd always be late. Looking further I saw that the first payment was due approximately 35 days after the contract, not the 55 days as originally promised.

I made several attempts to speak to the loan officer that day but no one could help me. I left messages and continued calling but to no avail. Little did I know that this was only the beginning.

Last month my roommate applied to buy a condo. During the normal credit check she was informed by the loan officer that her credit report indicated she was the primary on not one, but two car loans. When my roommate called to discuss this with Keyes she was told that she was put on as the primary because I would not have qualified for the loan.

She was livid. She told them she had agreed to be the co-signer, not the primaryin fact, she had emphatically stated that she would not be the primaryand they had fraudulently represented one thing and done another. She wanted her name removed, immediately, as the primary. The representative said they could not do that without rewriting the contract and that they would be in touch with her. Suddenly a six month commitment with her in a co-signing position turned into a 5 year (or it may be 6!) year commitment with her as the primary. That was the last we heard from Keyes. They will not return our calls nor have they contacted us by mail.

There is no question that they deliberately deceived and misled us. Where's the logic?:

My roommate already has a car loan on a jeepwhy would she want to buy another car?

And no way would she enter a contract with a 14.9% finance charge when she was currently paying a 1.9% finance charge on her Jeep!

If she were going to buy a car, she certainly wouldn't need a co-signer. Her credit is good enough to qualify to buy a condo it's good enough to buy a car. And besides, she's bought over the years, on her own with no co-signer, several cars, and is in fact the co-signer on her sister's car, and

She's a smart girlif she needed a co-signer she sure as heck wouldn't use me, and

Why would a dealership use me to guarantee a car loan when my credit is so bad that I can't get a loan even with a co-signer?

And last, but not least, currently Keyes has put her as the primary but used my credit to establish the interest rate. So instead of a 1.9% rate she's locked into a 14.9% rate!

This whole experience has been a nightmare. My roommate is currently talking to her attorney to formulate a strategy to hold Keyes Toyota accountable for their fraudulent practices.

What they have done is wrong, morally and ethically. My roommate and I have agreed to do what we can to make sure the fraudulent practices of Keyes Toyota in Van Nuys are common knowledge and that innocent buyers are warned.

K.
Los Angeles, California
U.S.A.

Click here to read other Rip Off Reports on Toyota Dealers and Products

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 07/29/2004 01:11 AM and is a permanent record located here: https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/keyes-toyota/van-nuys-california-90265/keyes-toyota-contractural-fraud-misleading-deceptive-signing-practice-van-nuys-californi-101112. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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#9 Consumer Comment

This dealership's intentions are to rip-off consumers

AUTHOR: Albert - ()

POSTED: Thursday, January 29, 2015

I've exhanged email with one of their salesmen, Basil De La Cruz, and I asked him each time (4 times) to send me a quote for a car that they had advertised on the LA Times. He gave me the run around each time without even sending me the quote. I even advised him that I will be contacting his manager if he failed to send me a quote for the last time and he seemed to absolutely not care.

 

I proceeded to email Basil's manager and Luis Ponce called and emailed me and told me that their ad is the quote. The ad does not say the Net Price of the car nor does it list the MSRP nor the specs of the vehicle. All it stated was $5000 off MSRP.

 

It does not surprise me that Basil acted like a complete moron because his direct manager is exactly the same. I'm sure that if I keep going above the chain, I will find the same moronic people.

 

Stay away from this dealership at all cost!

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#8 Consumer Comment

*Anyone can 'Google' this- AUTO DEALER LOUIS F HARRELSON TO PLEAD GUILTY, and read where the FBI....

AUTHOR: Karl - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Wednesday, December 23, 2009
was involved, correct?

And anyone can 'Google' this- CAR SALES: TRICKS OF THE TRADE- CONSUMER ALERT, and watch how Tori was SCAMMED when she went to buy a Ford Mustang. (The bank was also SCAMMED by the dealer because Tori's income on her credit application was altered by the Finance Manager, right?)

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>HEALTH SAVINGS ACCOUNT ALERT<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

*Make sure to go to the CANOPY page of this site and read how people are losing their HSA's (Health Savings Accounts).

WELCOME TO AMERICA- IN FRAUD WE TRUST
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#7 General Comment

I completely disagree

AUTHOR: Southern California Car Guy - (USA)

POSTED: Wednesday, December 23, 2009
"...As we thanked the sales manager for his time, he suggested to my roommate that she might qualify as a co-signer. Hindsight is always 20/20, I know, but I'll say it anywaylooking back it's so clear how they manipulated the situation..."

The sales manager offering that suggestion (and that's all it was a suggestion) is his job. He did not physically force you to sit down and sign anything. As nice as the deal might have sounded, if it wasn't feasible for you, you shouldn't have done anything but walked out and went to the Jeep store as you planned.

I'm sorry but if a car salesman told me something I wouldn't listen at all. I would read the contact and clearly understand what I'm signing before I blindly sign my life away on some guys suggestion. I don't see how you could fault anyone in this situation but yourself. You can't blame Keyes. I don't know what was said - besides your speculation - but the fact is your signed something with very clear terms.

I hate to drop this cliche bomb on you but if I told you to jump off a bridge, would you?
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#6 Consumer Comment

IF YOU DONT READ WHAT YOUR SIGNING, YOU GET WHAT YOU GOT

AUTHOR: Cathy - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Wednesday, July 30, 2008
Yes, I agree car dealers have done some shady things .. but we as consumers allow them. If you saw that your friend was signing on the line that said "primary" and your line to sign on said "co-signer" .... why, oh why would you continue to sign a "legal" document just because someone said "it ok to, it doesnt mean anything"?

Let's see .. I walk into a court of law with a binding contract in hand and say "but your honor, they said it meant something else ...".
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#5 Consumer Comment

Claremont Toyota *RIP OFF*

AUTHOR: Mary - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Wednesday, September 20, 2006
The very same thing happened to my husband, me, and my mother in law. We went to Claremont Toyota instead though. My husband was supposed to be the co-signer and his mom the primary. They told us there is no difference between the two.

So my husband took the guys word for it. He signed the top line and his mom the bottom. They also told us that in a couple of months, his mom could switch it over into her name. This is not what is happening. We still have the car under his name. We keep getting the bills and they keep calling us regarding non-payment.

They lied to us up and down. My husbands mom tried getting it under her name, but the dealer talked her into calling her son to co-sign for it. My husband credit is less than perfect. Now we have two car loans on his credit.

We tried to get a new car under both of our names and a different dealer, but now we are unable because he already has two under his name. I was wondering what any of you are doing to resolve this issue.
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#4 Consumer Comment

Close Call.... This is my first visit to this website, and all I can say is THANK YOU!

AUTHOR: G - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Thursday, May 11, 2006
This is my first visit to this website, and all I can say is THANK YOU! I live in Southern CA, and on the radio almost every morning, you hear the Keyes Of Van Nuys commercial jingle. I have been saving money to buy a new car and driving to work this morning, I heard it again and was really excited to go to the location in Van Nuys to check out their used car inventory. The commercial stated that they need to clear their old inventory and it's a special sale, only for the weekend.

I was looking up their website online, to get the address and location, and RipOffReport.com came up, obviously I read on.

K, you are a model consumer. Because of your report, I am more informed about car dealer fraud practices. I will NEVER EVER go to a Keyes car dealership. As consumers, we do have choices, and 1 bad experience is enough to dissuade me from purchasing a car with them.

Good luck, I wish you and your roommate success in getting Keyes to resolve the fraud they have caused. Thank you again!
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#3 Author of original report

Keyes Toyota Contract Practices

AUTHOR: Kaliko - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Wednesday, September 15, 2004
Bless both of you who have written comments! I have an update but need time to post it. I didn't want to wait, though, to thank you for the amazing information you have left. I will absolutely make good use of it and update this site as I receive responses.

Thank you, again, for caring!!!
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#2 Consumer Suggestion

Hey "K" I am VERY SURE that your dealer will NOT like your Rip Off Report NOW!

AUTHOR: Stick - Rip-off Report Consumer Advocate. - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Tuesday, September 14, 2004
Car dealers can and will do anything they want to do to you because they know that many of our AG's in this country will do nothing to them.

I hope the below info will help you in some way. I hope that you can use the below info to go after your dealer.

California
Office of the Attorney General
P.O. Box 944255
Sacramento, CA 94244-2550
916-322-3360
Web site: www.caag.state.ca.us

If you want to file a complaint go to
http://www.caag.state.ca.us/consumers/mailform.htm

Fax a good clear copy of your Rip Off Report to all of the below fax numbers. Your car dealer will hate that.

Sacramento, CA 95827
Toll free in CA: 800-952-5210
Web site: www.autorepair.ca.gov

Sacramento, CA 95814
Toll free in CA: 1-800-952-5210
Web site: www.dca.ca.gov

Sacramento, CA 94244-2550
916-322-3360
Toll free in CA: 1-800-952-5225
Web site: www.caag.state.ca.us

Bakersfield, CA 93301
Fax: 661-868-2135

Fairfield, CA 94533
Fax: 707-421-7986

Fresno, CA 93721
Fax: 559-495-1315

Los Angeles, CA 90012-2706
Fax: 213-687-0233
Web site: consumer-affairs.co.la.ca.us

Martinez, CA 94553
Fax: 925-646-4683

Modesto, CA 95353-0442
Fax: 209-525-5545
Web site: www.stanislaus-da.org

Napa, CA 94559
Fax: 707-253-4041

Sacramento, CA 95812-0749
Fax: 916-874-7660

Salinas, CA 93902
Fax: 831-755-5608

San Diego, CA 92101
Fax: 619-531-4481
Web site: www.sandiegoda.com

San Francisco, CA 94103
Fax: 415-551-9504
Web site: www.ci.sf.ca.us/casf/

San Jose, CA 95110
Fax: 408-279-8742
Web site: www.santaclara-da.org

San Luis Obispo, CA 93408
Fax: 805-781-1173
Web site: www.sloda.com

San Rafael, CA 94903
Fax: 415-499-3673

San Rafael, CA 94903
Fax: 415-499-3719
E-mail: consumer@co.marin.ca.us
Web site: co.marin.ca.us/depts/DA/main/index.cfm

Santa Barbara, CA 93101
Fax: 805-568-2398

Santa Cruz, CA 95060
Fax: 831-454-2920
E-mail: dat155@co.santa-cruz.ca.us
Web site: www.CO.Santa-Cruz.CA/US

Stockton, CA 95202
Fax: 209-468-0314

Ukiah, CA 95482
Fax: 707-463-4687

Ventura, CA 93009
Fax: 805-648-9255
Web site: www.ventura.org/vcda

Visalia, CA 93291
Fax: 559-730-2658

West Santana, CA 92701
Fax: 714-568-1250

Los Angeles, CA 90012
Fax: 213-847-0402
E-mail: dkass@atty.lacity.org

San Diego, CA 92101-4106
www.sannet.gov/city-attorney

Santa Monica, CA 90401
Fax: 310-395-6727

Fax a copy of your Rip Off Report to your State's Banking Commissioner.
California
Commissioner
Department of Financial Institutions
Fax: 415-989-5310

I want you to also read this info below. Try to get your Auto lender to send you or your Friend who thought she was a Co-signer to get a copy of the credit Applicatin that the lender got from the dealer. You might get a FAT SURPRISE called FRAUD!

Read the below.
Car dealers are willing to go to any length to increase their profit. There is a fast growing trend of car dealers lying to banks by padding the buyers income, leading the cosigners to be believe they are in fact the cosigner but they have the cosigners sign first.

Car dealers want the banks to fund deals so bad they are willing to send all kinds of false info to banks. Problems like car dealers deceptive ways can be stopped by the banks questioning the buyer BEFORE funding any deal.I Feel many don't or will not because profit from the car dealers is much more important to them.

To learn more as to what I am talking about go to the below Rip Off Report and Look at this Victim's Credit app. Everything in yellow is FRAUDULENT info that the car dealer wrote on the buyer's credit app behind the buyer's back after she went home.
Also scroll down on her Rip Off Report and you will see a big picture of 4 car buying contracts they had her sign.

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ripoff52158.htm

I also feel that you should make your sure lender gets a copy of your Rip Off Report. You also should post the name, address and phone numbers of the bank that did this car deal. Make sure they make the Rip Off Report aswel.

They need to learn the deceptive ways of car dealers. If they too start making the Rip Off Report and their stock holders and investors start seeing Rip Off Reports maybe they will change their ways as to how they do business with car dealers. Trust me "I FEEL" your Auto lender needs a Rip Off Report.

Next:
I feel that you should send a email to the following people ar Automotive news. Trust me the BIG BOYS at Automotive news Know all about ripoffreport.com I don't think they know that RipOffReport.com is NOW getting about 8,000,000 hits a day.

Hey William C Ford, WAKE UP!

I am sure that they will not like the fact that I posted their numbers and email addresses on your Rip Off Report, BUT SO WHAT. They call their company "Automotive NEWS" so here is some AUTO NEWS.

Keith Crain Editor-in-Chief 313-446-6001 kcrain@crain.com

Peter Brown Editorial Director 313-446-1600 pbrown@crain.com

David Sedgwick Editor 313-446-0376 dsedgwick@crain.com

Edward Lapham Executive Editor 313-446-0339 elapham@crain.com

John K. Teahen Jr. Senior Editor 313-446-0362 jteahen@crain.com

Donna Harris knows all about Ripoffreport.com Make sure she gets to read your Rip Off Report. Spend some beer money on a phone call to Donna and ask what she thinks of your Rip Off Report.

Donna Harris F&I, Retail Reporter,
Washington 1-540-668-7295 donnalharris@juno.com

Charles Child News Editor 313-446-0365 cchild@crain.com

Richard Johnson International Editor 313-446-0371 rjohnson@crain.com

Chaz Osburn Industry Editor 313-446-1677 cosburn@crain.com

David Kushma Retail Editor 313-446-1601 dkushma@crain.com

Victor Galvan Web Editor 313-446-0345 vgalvan@crain.com

Gail Kachadourian Web Reporter 313-446-1638
gkachadourian@crain.com

Mark writes about Toyota Make sure he gets to read your Rip Off Report

Mark Rechtin Mazda, Toyota, Hyundai, Kia and Premier Automotive Group Reporter & Bureau Chief,
Los Angeles 310-739-8009 mrechtin@crain.com

Harry is in D.C. maybe he has some government contacts that would like to read your Rip Off Report

Harry Stoffer Reporter,
Washington 202-662-7212 hstoffer@crain.com

K. If you want more help or more contact info, just post a request for it. It's my labor of love to be a Rip Off Report Consumer Advocate. Good luck on you mission of exposing!

If my memory is correct Bell Road Toyota is a Keys dealer. Read this Rip Off Report. I feel it is good reading for all VETS who served this country.

http://ripoffreport.com/reports/ripoff36168.htm

Remember K if you want more help, just post a request.
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#1 UPDATE EX-employee responds

DOES NOT SURPRISE ME

AUTHOR: R - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Tuesday, September 14, 2004
I had worked for this organization for over 10 years (why i dont know) and it would be no surprise that this is happening (actually it is). I heard and seen many many customers complaining about the things that were going wrong and the way they were treated, and i agree. But i had to keep my shut as i needed the income at the time.
When i started (I WAS VERY YOUNG) it was an OK place to work. They had dollar for dollar 401k match (but i was not old enough to participate), Christmas bonuses, Vision care, EXCELLENT Health benefits, profit sharing and more. That was then. They gradually took most of that away from us and the health benefits were cut drasticaly. That was the first sign of things to come. The Vision plan was taken away. Profit sharing was taken away too. No more Christmas bonuses. And the dollar for dollar 401k match was lowered too.

I was a highly valued employee (after i left i was asked to come back to work there several times over the years but turned them all down),i wanted to keep my work ethics, moral and dignity, this is why i left and would not go back. By NO means am i a disgruntled ex employee. Let me put that up front to all the readers.

This ORGANIZATION (Keyes Motors)is a inhumane place, not only to work, but to do business with. Remember, they have stores at this time throughout the west, including Phoenix AZ AKA Bell Road Toyota and others. Las Vegas NV (Names unknown).

CONSUMERS ARE URGED NOT TO SHOP AT THEIR STORES AS YOU DO HAVE CHOICES... Remember, you do have choices.

FACT: They at one time (and may still do)use to send their Department Managers to "meetings" of an un-just kind. These meetings were with lawyers who are very well versed in the California Labor Codes and Laws. They would teach their managers how to skirt the law (Keyes was often sued and would settle out). In short, the employees would be treated like trash. And they still treat them this way as i understand. I have a friend who works there at this moment but will be leaving soon as testament to the BS that goes on there (i tried to fair warn him but he wanted to see for himself). Harrasment is a daily thing at this organization.

Howard Keyes plays very little part in what goes on inside his organization. He is more involved in his bottom line. Howard spends alot of time in his office. Larry Abrhamson, VP, is one of the better people upstairs and is more involved in this organization. There was one skinny girl upstairs, i dont remember her name, but she is/was a royal b***h. john Lewis, the Parts and Service Director needs to find a personality (They should have kept Virgil Atkins, he is an awesome person!) But we all miss good old Bob Kaminsky! Bob was and is the greatest of them all. He is a past VP of this organization. WE MISS YOU BOB!
now...

FACT: Keyes Motors Inc use to do unilatteral business with an Exclusive Auto Body Inc (since sold to M2 Collision centers), an automotive crash facility located around the corner from them. Many of the principals and employees at the former Exclusive A/B had/have nothing good to say about the Keyes organization either. I was told by a high ranking former Exclusive employee, "doesn't any ex employee have anything good about that place to say?" The fact is... NO!

Keyes Motors (Howard Keyes) is a ruthless company that looks after only itself/himself. It/he has no regard for it's/his employees. Most employees are paid non-living wages and many grumble day to day because of the ruthless enviroment they are in. I feel so bad for these people. I tell you, if you are one of these employees... LEAVE! There are better places to work, not to mention that pay living wages.

As for what has happend with the contract, it would not surprise me. CALIFORNIA HAS A NO COOLOING OFF PERIOD FOR CAR SALES. So once you sign, you signed. And Keyes knows this. This is were they and others trap buyers.

I could go on and on about this hellhole, but i think you all can imagine. If not... i am very sorry. I have not one good thing to say about this place. They never did me any favors. It is one of the most political places in the valley (besides Galpin Motors, Bert Bochman)

REMEMBER, CONSUMERS ARE URGED NOT TO SHOP AT ANY OF THEIR STORES. TAKE YOUR BUSINESS ELSEWERE.

THANK YOU.
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