American Military University AMU Degree mill - setting the bar low Internet

Fortunately, I have had a completely different experience than the poster (who has not actually attended AMU).  My bachelor's degree is from Southern Illinois University - Carbondale, where I also completed the first semesters of Graduate School before being deployed on a series of assignments that prevents me from attending a "traditional" graduate school.

First off, I must say I value this sight as I have used it several times to do research into various educational institutions, but one thing I look for is (at very least) a personal experience. This report does not contain any personal experiences, but rather it is composed, exclusively of hearsay and speculation. If one is really concerned if a particular institution is a diploma mill then they should check with the Better Business Bureau, the US Department of Education, etc. and not base their opinion solely off a baseless tirade. Bottom-line is do your own research, don't be one of the "sheeple."

The following are some inaccurate items in the original report:

1. "... for profit universities have an interest not for quality of education but rather profits..." I ask those considering an online education read the following excerpt, "Most online for-profits, such as American Public Education's (APEI) American Military University, 'do a very good job taking care of students,' says Robert Songer, director of lifelong learning at Camp Lejeune. American Military and its counterpart American Public University recently won a national award for quality in online education" (Golden, NP). A critical aspect to realize about any online education is that what you put into it you get out of it, especially since you are effectively going it alone when doing online courses. So if you need interaction, sit in a classroom.

2. "Basically if you put some minimal time, minimal effort and a ton of money you will eventually get a degree." The preceding statement is based, exclusively on hearsay since the individual filing the report is not a student.

3.

"The curriculum is a joke." If the curriculum is a joke, please provide evidence and a comparison of a similar course which is at a traditional university.

4. "I took a look at his paper and I can only describe it as mediocre with grammar, and style errors." The author of the report makes the preceding statement then follows with the following, "He gets an "A" every time so I know his paper don't get read.  By the way he is a senior in AMU and don't even know how to reference a paper using APA or MLA!" I would like to point out that the author who is so very critical of his friends ability to write makes some very glaring errors as evidenced in the preceding. When I see mistakes such as these I have to ask myself, "What qualifies this person to make such statements?"

5. "As a result none of the people I know who is enrolled in AMU even reads their free book." If this statement is true then those persons that the author knows are very adapt at finding their answers on the internet, etc. while using their "free book" as a coaster. This is amazing since many classes require answers that can often only be found in that particular text book, especially when you look at some of the classes which deal with subjects that are not standard by any means.

6. "They just cut and paste and maybe change a few words and pass it as their own." This is amazing, since most of the courses verify papers through web services that look for plagiarism. The site used by AMU is also the site used by a large number of major universities.

7. "One of my friends was took an economics course, I quizzed him some basic principles and had no idea what I was talking about." Not only is the preceding statement poorly written, but what makes the author an expert who can effectively and properly quiz his "friend" on "basic principles?" One, must realize that some "basic principles" are only basic for the course they are being taught in. Courses very on what the educator and institution deem as what the content should be and are not standard.

8. "They are there for the easy paycheck not the passion to teach." While this could be true, it can also be true for "real universities." Many professors at "real universities" do not teach their own undergraduate classes, they have a graduate students or doctoral candidates teach. Also if teaching were a passion then professors would not worry about being tenured.

9. "One of my friends, submits the same paper for every class every semester.  He is getting by and will get a degree and only had to write one paper." This is also amazing in that there are very real differences between classes. So much so, I would love to see this amazing "one-size fits all" paper. Now as a conscious living being, does this make any sense at all? Why even ask for papers if one will do?

10. I must admit at this point I am a graduate of AMU and according to the author I am not to be trusted since I have a choice to defend, but why should I not address the grievances that the author levels against AMU? The following statement I find quite ludicrous, "The five people I have asked all taking different classes with different instructors told me about the indifference and lack of participation of the instructors." Why you might ask? Well, for one, one of my professors called me while I was stationed overseas so I did not have to spend my own money. That does not show indifference, but consideration. I have been in contact with many of my past professors and to this day they respond with advice and guidance, amazing for a bunch of people who are indifferent.

11. "True some of the instructors are probably experienced people in their fields working full times." By this time, I believe that the author needed to proof read his report, so its veracity would not be so easily to call into question. Professors who are currently working in their field of expertise lends itself to ensuring that the information they give is up to date and not stale. This is not the case, often times, at "real universities" where the professors has been tenured for decades and recalls the days when he was in the field in the '70's.

In closing I wish to reiterate that this report does not contain any personal experiences, but rather it is composed, exclusively of hearsay and speculation. If one is really concerned if a particular institution is a diploma mill then they should check with the Better Business Bureau, the US Department of Education, etc. and not base their opinion solely off a baseless tirade. Bottom-line is do your OWN research, don't be one of the "sheeple."

References

Golden, Daniel. "For Profit Colleges Target the Military," Bloomberg Business Week, accessed 2 March 2010 from  <http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/10_02/b4162036095366.htm?chan=magazine+channel_top+stories>

Additional resources

http://www.osac.state.or.us/oda/unaccredited.aspx

http://www.onlinedegreereviews.org/college/page/best-worst-online-college-awards/

http://www.onlinedegreereviews.org/college/american-military-university-reviews/

First, I am a student at APU, which is the other half of AMU and I have been so for the last year.  I also posses my Juris Doctor (J.D.) degree and have been to several schools in my life, both distance learing and classroom setting.

Yes the school does have 8 week classes and some 16 week courses. Yes, I do right a paper for every course and post as well as respond to discussion board comments. Yes, the tests are open book, however, I would challenge anyone to take any test that I have taken as they are not easy and even harder because of that. Yes, we do have some instructors that participate less than others, as does any college.

I would love to see how a student can write one paper and make it through 2 years let alone 4 years. I would bet my job that it is not possible. Further, his attack on AMU as a for profit University is interesting as University of Phoenix, Capella, Kaplan, National and many more are for profit as well. However, there is no reference in his to those schools, so is your implication that they are all upstanding and have never done anything wrong?  Arguably he is not even a consumer of the school, but someone who is spreading hearsay information.

 With respect to the discussion board topics, I would question how he knows so much about them from just talking to students who have been through some classes. I have been through 13 classes and yes sometimes we do talk about other topics in our discussions and responses, but that is what makes this a great process. I have been to several classroom style classes and I have seen the same events occurring, so what is the difference. As for the cost of book and tuition, clearly he does not have a clue. Yes, I turned in a few of my books (8 to be exact) and I received or will receive a little over $90.00, not a mega return as he makes it sound out to be. As for “excerpts of books” mine have been full books, which I have had to read every one of them to fully understand the topic

As for the cost of tuition, let me say that he did not do his research when he discussed this topic. This program is by far one of the cheaper programs both at the Distance Learning program as well as an in-class program. Yes, I pay $750 for an Undergraduate course, but if I was going to University of Phoenix or Capella I would be paying $1,100 - $1,500 and then paying for books on top of that.

Regarding his focus on the amount of time his friend spends on school work.  I take 2 classes every 8 weeks and work a full time job and, that is all I do! As a result of my job my wife and I live in two separate towns, and see each other about every 2-3 weeks. However, if I had not changed jobs and moved, I would not be doing 2 classes every 8 weeks. I joke with my co-workers that I work, go home cook dinner, clean up from dinner, do homework, watch television for 1-2 hours, go to bed and get up the next day and do it all over again. In addition to that I do homework and other chores on weekends, except those that I see my wife then I do homework all week so I can spend the weekend with her. I could do less homework and not work as hard at my classes, but it would reflect in my GPA, which is about 3.90, but that is not who I am. I believe in doing a job right and only doing it once. My experience for those who take distance learning courses is that it is harder because we have to stay focused and motivated.

I think that I have addressed most of the truths and falsehoods in the “report”, but remember this is only my opinion and not those of my classmates.

Let me get this straight: You don't attend the school.  You've never taken a class.  But you know enough to publicly criticize the program.

Let me guess, AMU is nothing compared to Bucks County Community College.

Dude, how about we meet up at the Copper Kettle and I'll have you work on one of my Master's program assignments. 

I breezed through AP courses in Highschool.  I breezed through BCCC.  I breezed through Millersville.  I have been working my ass off at AMU.  I'm getting good grades, but having to work hard for them.  Open book tests are the way of any serious program no matter what college you go to.  You have to synthesize the information contained in books and on the internet.

I am a retired US Army Aviation Officer who earned a MA from AMU and a BS from Thomas Edison State College in NJ, also a distance learning school. I have several points I wish to cover in my rebuttal. I will base several of them on my first hand experience at AMU and standards that are easily obtained with reasonable effort. Such as is required from most students.

I am disappointed this site allows hearsay. The author clearly stated they are not an AMU student so their "opinion" is not based on personal experience. They start by implying they are unbiased while asserting anyone from the school is. Under AMU academic standards, the author receives a zero for unsubstantiated allegations.

The classes cost about what DVA pays in education benefits, something easily researched. Under AMU academic standards, the author receives a  zero for low quality research.

The University awards credit based on the nationally recognized American Council on Education guide. The same guide Tho. Edison College used to recognize my Army Flight School education. Again, easily researched, so again a zero for low quality research.

Learning from professionals working in their fields provides a good balance between reality and an academic "Ivory Tower" in my opinion. Also given that the people working in the field would be the first to NOT hire people taught at AMU if the school had a reputation as a "Degree Mill", it is my opinion that these instructors have a higher then average desire to see their students complete a valid program.

I purchased all my books at on-line bookstores second hand (I tend to be frugal) rather then at the school. Some of my instructors provided supplemental material. But none of my required texts were given to me. As texts were often listed for sale on the internal bulletin board, I can assure you the school was not purchasing them back at the same cost. With no first hand experience, the author is not creditable.

As the author isn't a student, their opinion on class topics being on or off topic isn't creditable. In my classes, I never once saw the conversation stray "off topic." Probably because most of us were pretty busy with school and life and had other things to do.

The classes vary widely in topic, so using the same paper would be almost impossible simply for that reason. Because many instructors use the Turn-it-in program that checks for plagiarism, re-use of the same paper is factually impossible. I once used a lot of citations in a paper that did aid in making the required document length. It also earned me a warning because Turn-it-in color coded everything and provided an original content score that was at the low end of the range the instructor used as a standard. The author receives a zero again for poor research.

I don't understand the logic of an "A" equals unread. The author's opinion is both unsubstantiated and their logic would not have been accepted in my mandatory cognitive analysis class.

All my papers had to not only be cited per APA or MLA, they also had to meet the MLA writing standard. And either the APA or the MLA manual had to be in the reference listing. The author again receives a zero for poor research.

Wikipedia was banned as citable source back in 2005 or so. Though if a person is willing to use the listed citations it is still usable as a decent first stop. Again zero creditability.

As one example on testing, every statistics course I have ever taken was open book. This is grad school, not a rote memorization proving ground. I memorized emergency procedures because they were needed for immediate action when flying. In grad school the intent isn't to be able to spout facts and figures.

Others have commented on class content variation between schools. What one professor may consider critical may be ignored by another.

The author closes with yet more hearsay, when a real news article is easily citable and the hyperlink easy to provide. The author receives yet another zero for their inability to maintain even the minimal standards expected by AMU or the APA and MLA standards they claim to know how to use.

My suggestion is that anyone considering AMU who finds this opinion valuable probably wouldn't be able to handle the course work anyway and look for another school.

I knew this would be a very sensitive subject with the AMU allumni.  To be honest, I take everything an AMU allumni post with skepticism, your opinions are bias and your agenda is to make your university look good and legit so that your degree is worth something.  Your counter arguments are illogical, you resort to insults, you seek to address everything (punctuation, grammar, sources) except the fact of the matter.

Can anyone of the AMU allumni here seriously compare an 8 weeks of self taught study vs. 16 weeks of study in a traditional school?  There is no way you can learn the material being a part-time student to the same degree a student can in a traditional university. 

How can you argue with me and tell me AMU is the same as a tradional university when you are taking an open book test??  Your degree is worth nothing if you can't answer questions without having your book next to you.

Everyone keeps talking about accreditations and the school being a legit organization, I don't argue that point.  But just because a school is accredited by an organization recognized by the government does not guarantee that the school is the best it could be.  Again, just like I said before if you just want to get a degree with little work/time then go for AMU.  For the one's seeking a real challenging education then AMU is not for you.

I know the point everyone here seems to be attacking is the fact that I'm not a student of AMU.  Just because I'm not a student, it does not mean my observations are invalid.  A reporter in the newspaper reports based on his/her observations, scientists come up with conclusions based on observations.  I came to my own conclusions based on the observation of various students enrolled in AMU.  They have shown me everything I need to know about the school and the way it operates, they have share with me their opinions, experiences.  Isn't that more valuable than your single narrow view?  The fact that I'm an outsider makes me an unbiased observer that can report with honesty.

Some bring up their education background, such as their previous degrees with other universities and how easy was high school to them.  Come on! that is all irrelevant information.   That type of information gives you no credibility.  The fact that you find the school curriculum challenging is not a testament to the quality of the university, but perhaps an indication of your academic limitations.  Maybe that explains why some of you did not attended a real university. 

What I stated on my original report is the truth based on my observations, which I feel other people considering AMU should know about.  I have no agenda here but to inform, everyone else here has an agenda so intelligent readers make your own conclusions.

 

First, I am a little struck by the author's inability to use proper grammar and punctuation; perhaps the author himself might benefit from attending classes at AMU/APU.

I am an online professor with APU/AMU.  I have worked with them for approximately three years but I have worked as an online educator for over ten years.  I have worked for such institutions as the University of California-Berkeley, Penn State University, NYU, and several for-profit institutions. 

I can assure you that I am a very dedicated instructor.  I take my responsibilities very seriously, taking time to read every student posting, assignment, and research paper very carefully.  I give long and detailed feedback for every assignment in my courses and I return the work within 5 days of the assignment's submission date.  I take the responsibility of education extremely seriously and I resent your remarks regarding the quality of education at AMU--particularly because you are relying solely on hearsay and you offer no facts to support your argument.  In fact, if you submitted this 'article' (using this term loosely), you would fail the assignment, without a doubt.  Students in my courses learn to use scholarly articles that are peer-reviewed in support for their papers.  They aren't allowed to surf the web, rely on hearsay, and make flimsy arguments. 

As far as my credentials go, I hold a PhD from one of the most respected research universities in the world.  I have authored two textbooks and have written many articles for scholarly journals. 

I work hard for my students and my students work extremely hard for their grades.  In my experience, everything about your 'report' is false.  Of course, in every institutions there are lazy instructors--no doubt about that.  They get weeded out but I know for a fact how committed AMU/APU is to providing their students with the highest quality education, along with the flexibility for those who are deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan.  This is a perfect school for those in the military and I am proud to work for them. 

Professor, I'm disappointed with your reply. You are no better than the alumni who try to discredit me by nick picking on my grammar, mechanics, punctuations etc... all irrelevant to this report.  Why don't you address the facts and my previous questions?  It is obvious your intentions as an employee of your corporation are to put AMU and APU in a good light to keep enrollments up and secure your job. 

I don't dispute the fact that distant learning via the Internet is the way to go for the nontraditional students.  But why does your school have to set the bar so low in the name of convenience?  Do you expect me to believe that a 8 weeks compress class will teach the material at the same level with a 16 week course?  Do you expect me to believe that you are in par with other universities with open book tests?  I wonder what is the average failure rate with open book quizzes and tests.

What is the value with discussions when you ask a question and expect all your students to answer it? As a student do I benefit to read 10 or more answers to the same question worded 10 different ways? Honestly, all I see in the conferences are a bunch of people agreeing to other peoples answers.

Sure, you could be the exception and be a great teacher. I will not try to discredit you and make assumptions just like you did to my post.  However, I seriously think you are underestimating the amount of teachers in your organization that do not care much about teaching. 

Your credentials are irrelevant to this report, No one here is trying to hire you. Instead why don't you tell us something relevant such as how many classes you have to teach every semester?  How many students per class? How many students per semester?  How many students fail? What is the average grades of your students?  Why don't you comment on the open book tests? The short semester? The fact that some classes don't have full edition textbooks?  Why do active duty military get an automatic 60 credit hours when enrolling?  Why does your organization award life experience credit? How does business decisions of AMU and APU influence the curriculum and classes offered? Can you comment on your schools' reliance on federal financial aid and DOD tuition assistance money to keep the school in business? 

I doubt you will honestly answer those questions and put your organization in a bad light. 

I really cannot wait until the American Council on education starts reviewing online programs for the DOD next year.  Then we will see how good AMU/APU does when compared to the new DOD standard.  I honestly believe that taxpayer’s money should give us the best value for our money, and that all the soldiers who get their education paid with federal money get a QUALITY education. 

LTmax has not conducted sufficient research to validate his claim that American Military University is providing substandard education. American Military University is part of the American Public University System. (APUS) holds both regional and national accreditation. APUS “American Public University System is accredited by the Higher Learning Commission, North Central Association, (((Redacted))), 30 North LaSalle Street, Suite 2400, Chicago, IL 60602, 800-621-7440 and by the Accrediting Commission of the Distance Education and Training Council, (((Redacted))), 1601 18th St., NW, Washington, DC 20009, 202-234-5100”  ( “Accreditation & Licensure”, American Public University System, accessed 04 March 2010 from,(((Redacted)))

 LTmax states: “All my friends taking classes with this university laugh at how easy it is to get a degree. Basically if you put some minimal time, minimal effort and a ton of money you will eventually get a degree. Classes are about 8 weeks long, with very few being 16 weeks long. My friend takes 3 classes per 8 week period with no effort at all. At this rate anyone can have a 4 year degree in a little over 2 years. But my friend will be done way before that since he got a ton of questionable credits for being in the military.”

LTmax does not provide the reader with evidence that all of his friends he is referring to have received their degree from AMU. It is true that AMU does have 8 week and 16 week courses. The accelerated courses require just as much work and effort as the 16 week courses and one has less time to complete the work. Since LT does not provide the reader with his friend’s course information or grade information the reader only has LT’s word this is valid information. I think LTmax needs to be more specific and define “questionable credits for being in the military.”

LTmax’s allegation that “for profit universities have an interest not for quality of education but rather profits” is biased and unfounded. While it may be true that some for profit universities may not be quality driven this is not the case for all for profit educational institutions. In Dr. Richard S. Ruch’s book, “Higher Ed, Inc: The Rise of the For-Profit University”, Dr. Ruch points out that some for profit universities often not only meet accreditation standards, they exceed them. Dr. Ruch also points out that as publicly held entities, for profit educational institutions come under more regulatory scrutiny. “In fact, as publicly held companies, they have oversight and regulatory requirements that go beyond those faced by non-profit institutions, such as quarterly reports to the Securities and Exchange Commission. (Ruch, Richard S., Institutional Growth and Academic Respectability, Higher Ed, Inc: The Rise of the For-Profit University, USDLA Journal, Vol.16: No 2, February 2002, accessed 04 March 2010, from(((Redacted)))

LTmax claims, “My sources come from many military students currently attending this university.” Anyone can make an unfounded claim such as his. LTmax does not provide verifiable sources such as complaints to an official academic oversight entity to substantiate his claim; and we know nothing about LTmax’s background. LTmax has not provided the public with any evidence that indicates he has any expertise or authority in accreditation to make a determination that “AMU is a rip off when it comes to quality education.”

Since LTmax has not even attended AMU he cannot viably substantiate his claim from a consumer/student perspective. LTmax informs the reader he has asked five people about the curriculum, but five people can hardly be considered “many military students currently attending this university.”

 LTmax states “The curriculum is a joke.“

Personally I did not find courses such as Competitive Intelligence, Information Warfare, Management Information Systems, Industrial Espionage, Homeland Defense, Computer Crime, Intelligence and Homeland Security, Forecasting Terrorism, Interagency Disaster Management, Consequence Management and Terrorism Preparation & Response, or Research Methods in Intelligence Studies to be a joke. As a matter of fact I considered those courses to be dead serious.

LTmax states: “The main part of the curriculum is based on on-line discussion between a bunch of students who try to answer one or two selected questions posted by the instructor.”

Again, LTmax is speaking with no firsthand knowledge and is WRONG! It is true AMU classes do have on-line discussions between students and instructors but this is not the main part of the curriculum. The on-line discussions give the distance learner a classroom environment where issues can be debated and discussed. Instructors may ask questions but students ask questions as well. Sometimes discussions digress but this is really no different than a typical brick and mortar classroom environment.

LTmax states “The questions are extremely easy but most of the time the conversation turns to an off-topic conversation.”

Again LTmax is speaking with no firsthand knowledge. In regards to LT’s statement: “The instructors hardly instruct. The five people I have asked all taking different classes with different instructors told me about the indifference and lack of participation of the instructors. They are there just to post and grade assignments.” Assuming LT’s five people are real, I doubt they are serious students. ALL members of AMU faculty, I have worked with have been extremely supportive. Not once through my whole graduate program did I EVER encounter an instructor who was indifferent or failed to participate in the course they were responsible for instructing, including the instructors who are frequently deployed on military assignments.

LTmax also states, “True some of the instructors are probably experienced people in their fields working full times. They don't have the time to be full time teachers like real universities. They are there for the easy paycheck not the passion to teach.”

As an alumni of AMU I know firsthand, ALL of the instructors are experienced professionals in their very specialized fields. The instructors, at least the instructors I have learned from are quite passionate about their field of study. They are educators in the truest sense. These instructors have a passion for educating, inspiring students to push beyond the norm, supporting a student’s right to freedom of speech, and they encourage students to actually think rather than regurgitate mindless drivel.

LTmax states: “The books are free but most of the time they are not complete versions just excerpts. At the end of the semester you turn around and sell the book back to them, so in essence the price of the book is included in the HIGH tuition.”

In the Undergraduate studies, the price of books is included in tuition. As a graduate one must pay for their text books. I would love to know which text books LTmax is referring to are incomplete versions or just excerpts. I have not seen these. As far as High tuition, AMU is less expensive than some other on-line universities such as Villanova or University of Phoenix.

According to LTmax, “Some classes usually require a paper to write. Since instructors are not really there to teach, they leave it up to the students to pick a subject. One of my friends, submits the same paper for every class every semester. He is getting by and will get a degree and only had to write one paper. I took a look at his paper and I can only describe it as mediocre with grammar, and style errors. He gets an "A" every time so I know his paper don't get read. By the way he is a senior in AMU and don't even know how to reference a paper using APA or MLA!”

 Every course I have taken at AMU required the students to write multiple papers. Students were permitted to pick a subject but the topic of the paper had to be approved by the instructor. I doubt that LT’s friend could have submitted “the same paper for every class every semester” and received a quality grade. Faculty usually runs papers through a program that detects plagiarism and a paper that had been submitted numerous times would have been flagged. AMU has a strict policy on Academic Dishonesty & Plagiarism. “Submitting the same work for credit without approval (e.g., submitting the same assignment twice for different courses)” is verboten. (Academic Dishonesty & Plagiarism, AMU Student Handbook, accessed 04 March 2010 from (((Redacted)))

APA, MLA, and Turabian Reference Styles are permitted at AMU.

LTmax claims: “Their quizzes and tests are all open book. There are not proctored tests. So why even bother with a test? if you have to look all the answers. They are not testing your knowledge gained but rather how fast can you look up information in a book. As a result none of the people I know who is enrolled in AMU even reads their free book.”

Most of the quizzes and tests are open book but LTmax failed to point out these quizzes and tests are timed. Some exams are proctored. For most exams, students are allowed access to text books and open source materials. Most of the exams I took were composed of essay type questions and required extensive familiarity with the textbooks and other materials used throughout the course.

Regarding LTmax’s comment:“Back to the conferences, my friends use Wikipedia and the web to answer their online discussions. They just cut and paste and maybe change a few words and pass it as their own”

I think LTmax’s friends are exceptions to the vast majority of students attending AMU. For the most part I think the student body at AMU is comprised of people that hold themselves to a very high degree of integrity and honor. Obtaining my MA in Homeland Security from AMU was anything but easy, but this was by far the most rewarding educational experience of my life.

Dr. Forness if you are reading this, I apologize for not dissecting every element of LTmax’s post. I offer no excuses but I do have an explanation. I also regret that this format does not lend itself well to providing the reader with proper APA, MLA, or Turabian citation format. As a consumer, a student, a person dedicated to lifelong learning, a member of Golden Key International Honour Society, a member of Phi Theta Kappa International Honor Society, and alumni of American Military University, I highly recommend American Military University and I hope AMU offers PhD. Programs in the near future.

CLICK here to see why Rip-off Report, as a matter of policy, deleted either a phone number, link or e-mail address from this Report.

LTmax:

 

I applaud your passion for quality education and I am truly disturbed by the experiences that you have detailed.

 

For full disclosure, I am a graduate of AMU and I fortunately did not encounter any of the issues that you have detailed in your report.  For me, AMU was an extremely wonderful and challenging experience.

 

LTmax, I believe that you are an intelligent and honest individual that is truly frustrated by what you have witnessed.  It saddens me to hear that students and possibly their professors are abusing an Educational Institution that I owe so much too and personally hold is such high regard.

 

From your report, I assume that you believe that your five friends are undeserving of their degree(s) and that their professor(s) are not providing the minimum level of instruction necessary for their courses to be of any value.

 

What I ask, so that your concerns may be addressed and those responsible, if validated, can be held accountable, is that you provide the names of your five friends and your report to AMU/APUS.  This will enable the University to take action against the five abusive students that you have portrayed and open an investigation into the professors that may be contributing to their substandard education.

 

Rather than pointing fingers, becoming angry, or verbally abusive, I am more solution based and action oriented.  You have posed numerous issues, extremely disturbing issues portraying significant malfeasance and who knows actions that maybe even criminal in nature.  I am asking you to just “go a little farther” and provide the names of those committing these transgressions so we can stop it and take corrective action hoping that it will never occur again.

 

Thank you for bringing these issue to light and I look forward to the discovery of those your have portrayed.

LT:

My offer to you...I will pay your tuition for one course. I have read your diatribe but am unsure as to your educational level, so the course offered to you is either at the undergrad or grad level, depending on your educational accomplishments thus far. Course to be determined at my discretion, based upon your major or educational direction.

You agree to completing the 8 week course and then write another review. Fair enough?

Thomas F. Gibson MPH
APU Class of 2009

thomasgibsondmt@gmail.com
www.thomasfgibsonmph.com

I'm not an AMU student or alumni but I do have a traditional 4-year BS degree. Out of curiosity I checked what it would take to get an MBA from AMU. First of all I would not need to take the GMAT to see if I had the basic academic skills required for graduate level business courses. Interesting. All I would need to do is show I had an undergraduate degree from basically ANY accredited school and pay the tuition.  Why would AMU not want to verify that a student had a good chance at passing the courses? A traditional school admits students that have the best chances of passing, not failing. They require GMAT scores for entry into their MBA programs. Now if AMU knows their MBA courses run a little 'soft' they don't need to press the GMAT issue. Why turn away money? Right? Especially when it's VA money.

The other issue is perception. How will a future employer perceive a degree from a for-profit versus a degree from a traditional school? If a candidate comes in and has a 4.0 average from AMU and someone else has a 3.0 from Ohio State I suspect the AMU candidate won't see an offer. Why? The perceived value of for-profit paper is lower. A student holding a 4.0 at a traditional school would very likely have his tuition covered by full scholarship at both the undergrad and graduate level. No such luck at a for-profit school.

If you have any doubts just talk to an HR manager at the Fortune 500 level. Ask them how they evaluate degrees from the various schools.

LT, and I pray that you are just using the letters for effect and are not really a fellow commissioned officer for I fear for the men and women you are expected to lead and have already failed along the way.  While the rest of us in the military are humping it day in and day out doing our primary job(s) and taking care of all else, it is upsetting to see that you have nothing better to do than to use that freedom we defend to discredit your fellow brothers and sisters in arms who would lay down their lives for you in battle despite your actions.  Tell me LT, when was your last deployment…the last time you fired a weapon…the last time you lost someone…(i.e. real world and not training)?  Rather than stoop to your level and begin to discredit you, a task which will not prove hard to do, I will instead recommend that Ripoff Report and the political powers that be look into the fraud you commit each day by living off the taxpayers’ dollar in the game you consider the military to be (i.e. remember that we serve them and not the other way around).  It is clear to this senior officer and commander that you do not live or represent the values and standards those of us who have been in the mix do.  LT, you owe many an apology for the illegal libel/slander you have thrown out into the public eyes.  I recommend you take corrective action immediately or fear the Article 15 which will surely come your way at a minimum.  "Let he without sin cast the first stone," and I say this to you my colleague in the profession of arms, you try to make yourself higher than others by putting them down, and the tides will turn, for once under the microscope, your life will be an open book and all those skeletons you thought were hidden will surely bite back and bring you down.  Hooah - out!

If the basis for your argument is the length of courses, next thing you know you'll try to discredit the Academies and their summer academic programs.  Let me see you try to take Aero Engr in 3 weeks.  Would have loved to see you fail and walk the walk of shame back home and out of the military which does not suit you.

I recently completed an MA in Homeland Security with AMU; I have recommended it highly to friends who are pursuing an advanced degree. My intent is not to defend AMU but share my experience. I would concur with the experiences of the other AMU students who have posted rebuttals.
Like any education program, traditional or on-line, a student receives the benefit of his efforts. The only person who would know how well his education process was, would have to experience it. Using second hand opinions are not valid to evaluate a program. The curriculum that I went through was challenging and I did my research, due diligence and wrote properly APA footnoted papers. I have friends that paid the entire tuition out of pocket and received a stimulating and challenging education with AMU as well.
The professors did not allow plagiarism, nor mediocre grammar, nor research from questionable sources, such as Wikipedia. They held all students to a high standard on daily postings and discussions. The research papers were graded fairly and accurately. I put several hours per day into each class, so I feel that I had an excellent education and gained a high degree of awareness in the area of homeland security.
Undergraduate education at traditional, government-run universities are in greater question as to quality with cutbacks that are occurring nationwide. Many students are opting for private schools with smaller classes to gain the higher quality education, and avoid the student mill that "non-profit" establishments offer. 

I could not help but complete a rebuttal on this topic as I felt that the author is under quite a bit of misinformation.

Firstly, every college and university whether it be an on-campus or electronic campus, is a FOR PROFIT institution. I challenge you to name even one accredited college or university that does not take money to teach its students. All universities and colleges are FOR PROFIT in one way or another. Universities such as M.I.T charges $37,782 for nine months of undergraduate study. This does not include the $11,360 for student housing and dining and added $2,858 in book and lab fees. Graduate students pay even more. Now, if that is not FOR PROFIT than I obviously do not understand the meaning of the word “profit”.  And, oh yeah, their classes run 10 weeks, just two short weeks extra than the classes at AMU.

But, that is not the reason I wanted to respond. I wanted to talk about the ‘quality of education’, or lack thereof which the LT author noted as AMU is an online community and not a ‘brick and mortar’ school. Perhaps it would be more understandable to LT if I worded my response this way:

I have a Bachelors Degree from Ohio State University (that pesky brick and mortar school) of which I am not proud of at all. I was considered a number at OSU and in fact I usually sat in classrooms with upwards to 200 other students where I couldn’t even SEE the instructor clearly let alone even have a chance to speak with him or her. More often than not my papers were graded by a teaching assistant and never seen by the instructor at all.  And, oh yes, 90 percent of my tests were open book / open note.  Generally, I would have to say that I learned close to nothing at OSU except that my professors rarely attended classes.

That is the reason why, after graduation, I decided to attend a private Lutheran college to get my second Bachelors degree.  And although the classes were much smaller (not more than 25 students per class) and the college was experimenting with night classes (for all us working adults), it was still 10 week courses and I still had open book / open note tests. Although I now had face to face time with my instructors I STILL did not receive the ‘quality’ education that LT says only takes place in an on campus setting. I graduated with my second Bachelors in less than 13 months with a 4.0 GPA.

So when it came time to go for my Masters degree, being a gainfully employed adult working full time, I spent many months researching and doing background investigating of online colleges. AMU was the only online college that I found that was highly rated and not a ‘paper mill’ just out to get a lot of money for doing nothing.  I even checked with the Department of Education, as I am a Department of Defense employee, I wanted to reassurance that a Masters degree from an online school would hold me in good stead. The DoE informed me that APUS/AMU is a LEADER in the field and it comes HIGHLY RECOMMENDED by DoD recruiters.

So I entered into my Masters course at AMU and I have to honestly say that it was one of the TOUGHEST two years of education that I have ever experienced.  I can say with assurance that I never had to study as hard as I did at AMU at either of my ‘brick and mortar’ colleges. I fought weekly just to keep my GPA at 3.6! This is a person who graduated from lauded brick and mortar universities with 4.0’s and National Honor Society memberships!  AMU is about quality educations not about making a quick buck. I would put any of my AMU professors up against any of my OSU or Capital University professors and KNOW that my AMU professors would win hands down.  It is not an easy task by far to graduate from AMU. I had the choice of doing a seniors thesis or a Comprehensive Exam to get my Masters and I chose the Comprehensive thinking it would be much easier than the huge thesis – how wrong I was. Let me just say, if you did not pay attention throughout your entire time at AMU then you will FAIL to graduate. I had questions on my Comprehensive exam that were from my first year at the college. And every single question was ESSAY and needed to be in APA format. Oh, and the test was timed and proctored. I had 4 hours to complete an essay test that ended up being thirteen pages long.  And to make it even harder, you could only fail ONE essay question. Anything more than one and you failed the comprehensive and had to pay to take the test over again – so NO, AMU is NOT an easy school that is just a ‘paper mill’.

Now I am in my PhD program at a ‘brick and mortar’ school that also does online classes. I had to be admitted by committee. The committee had to vote for or against admitting me into the school (oh, and just so LT understands this is not a ‘fly by night’ school – it’s Yale University). I had to submit an admissions packet to the committee where they reviewed my prior education, they also made it mandatory that they spoke with three of my professors from AMU as well as received letters of recommendation. Funny enough, the Yale committee found that the AMU instructors were some of the brightest minds and said that I was given admittance to the college because of the recommendations from my AMU professors. – (To those professors reading this post, you know who you are, and who I am – THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart, without you it would not have been possible).

I would recommend that LT take up the professors' offer and attend just one class at AMU of the professors' choosing and THEN if he still feels the same come back and tell us consumers why.

I  resent the fact that you have even suggested American Military University/American Public University as being a for profit college which does not demonstrate concerns for their students. I don't know of any four year college that is a not a for profit institutions; they all are even when they say they are not. 

 

If institutions such as these were not for profit; how do you suppose they would cover the expenses for professor salaries and supplies such as the expense for textbooks and such?  

 

It appears you have based your insights about this college merely on here-say. Have you considered this scenario? Perhaps you colleagues speak of how easy it is to earn a degree from this college because the institution itself caters to the needs of those people in the military who desire to have an education. Therefore, providing that they are working adults and serving their country between the boundaries of the earth; they make the curriculum easy and flexible given the circumstances of those in the military.

 

That is why it is called "American Military University”. The classes are 8 weeks to 16 weeks long because classes start every month. This allows students to earn the 24 credits within the year time as required. You can also stretch out the classes over several months such as 1-2 classes per month which is flexible for both military and working adults.

 

If your friend is taking 3 classes within the 8 weeks period; consider this fact; although these classes are 8 weeks in length, they are academically challenging.

As an example, a history course will require within the 8 weeks; several extensive discussion post, a 10 to 12 page research paper, maybe 2 shorts papers of 800 to a 1000 words, not to mention a mid-term, final exam, and other requirements. The courses are 8 weeks, but my point is it is very extensive. So, if your friend does minimal work, his/her grades are probably minimal as well. This type of learning environment requires commitment. All papers must be done according to the Turabian Manual style or the Chicago Manual Style.

 

In every syllabus it is stated, students are not allowed nor are they permitted to submit work from Wikipedia or on line Encyclopedias.

 

American Military University/American Public University curriculum is no joke!

 

What you consider in the discussion post to be off topic discussion; are actually in-depth information or additional historical facts that more than likely relate to the topic in some way. The professors at the college love in -depth discussions and responses to the discussion post based upon historical research rather than just accepting the basic principals of a topic. It appears you do not understand the entire concept of an online college for working adults. In addition to this, one does not have to earn a degree in the traditional style setting; and if one chooses not to earn a degree by sitting in a classroom with a biased instructor attempting to make things complicated and difficult, it is not wrong. 

 

 Yes, the textbooks are free, but you must maintain an acceptable passing grade point average in order to get the textbooks for free. 

 

What article did read that mentioned employers do not hire people from for profit colleges? "They all are for profit". The very same people who made that comment more than likely graduated from a  profit school and is not aware of it. You need to check the government website of accredited colleges. You will find American Military University/American Public University listed.

 

Your friends are cheating themselves; the college is not cheating them. 

 

Wow. This is a stellar report. It answers most of my questions about the college. Thank you for writing this. It really opened up my eyes.

As a result of this report, I am more encouraged than ever to consider attending this school. I am not interested in the initial post. It was clearly written by someone trying to look important and knowledgable with half-baked opinions. No, my interest was in the rebuttals. They were all well-written and well-formed. More importantly, the responses were consistant with each other.

I tend to throw my weight towards those that have a firm grasp of the English language. It shows they are able to pay attention to detail. So when I read things like "He gets an 'A' every time so I know his paper don't get read," I tend to discredit the source a few points for every ghetto-speak reference. (Psst. By the way, it's "doesn't" rather than "don't") I deduct all the remaining points when you open your 'report' with your very own discreditor: "I'm not a student of AMU."

The author quotes, "The sad part about this, is that my friends honestly believe they are getting a good education." Could this possibly be because they are getting an education? One the author seems to be lacking?

Look, I am as skeptical of online schools as the next. If I were not, I would not be reading this report looking to see if it is worth its salt or worth my time and money. The author did not quote anything of value. The author does not give any first-hand information.

As of the responses to this author, I have little doubt about the level and quality of education about this school now. So the author has my copious amounts of thanks! Without his post, I would never have seen this excellent content.

I only have one question for APU alumni: Did this degree help you in getting a better paying job, or the career change you hoped for? I have no problems putting in the time and effort to get a degree, but was the end result what you thought it would be?

I read this comment and I laughed hysterically. First, the person should learn to write english...I know mine isn't perfect either but I am not criticizing an university I have never attended...the writing in the article I am responding to is definitely not written by anyone that has obtained a Master's degree or a Bachelor's degree and if it is-question the institution they claim to have attended.

Let's clear some confusion about the comments made here.

First, AMU is not a rip off. The tuition is competitive for civilians across the board. Do your research....In addition, this is one of few military friendly schools offering to collaborate with the U.S. military and many students to assure that the tuition is mostly if not all covered by TA/G.I. Bill. It is also Title 4 recognized.   

This is an awesome way by which to get your education while deployed, because it offers online rather than a traditional brick and mortar that you must attend in order to obtain your degree. You can literally be in the sandbox standing post and working simultaneously on your degree. 

Yes I am a student, so yes I will defend it because you have no clue what you are talking about-you are definitely NOT reporting facts. I would hate to see potential students listen to the rants you have described here without factual basis.

You refer to friends you have who do this and that...I doubt it because one can't get away with what you claim they do.

First, the degree program is quite difficult. Some people have to be spoon fed from a brick and mortar university where they party by night and slink (if they even attend school at all) into class by day. Well, if you attend here, it is your responsibility as an adult supporting yourself and most likely a family, to dedicate the appropriate time, conduct your research, submit assignments on time, understand the applications and assignments with minimal instruction and make sure you meet time deadlines or you will fail.

The main part of the curriculum is not a joke. It is a weekly online discussion where you have a few questions posed by the instructor, you write an essay that is fairly lengthy and interact with at least 2-3 students with substantive comments. A research paper is ALWAYS required of at least 20 25 pages at the end of your class. The instructor uses a syllabus to specify his instructional style...either packets or other. The reading material you cover weekly is between 150 pages to 200 pages mandatory for you to "get" the topic of conversation. And there may be an exam in some of your classes and YES they are proctored.

The instructors are highly educated (mostly Phd, Master's level or equivalent) and come with occupational experience that is more than impressive. They carry credentials that I have never before seen.  

Books are not free unless you are military and then of course they are covered. For civilians they are not free but they are reasonable. You don't have to sell them but if you choose to, you can sell them via Ebay, Half.com, privately or back to the bookstore if you choose and they accept them as a buyback. 

And by the way...you can NEVER submit a paper twice. Once you do the paper, you submit to TURNITIN which has been required every time I have submitted a research paper. This creates an actual record of your paper. IF you are ever caught submitting twice you would be failed. At any rate, TURNITIN would prevent you from turning it in more than once because your instructor sees the result of your submitted paper and each submittal stays on permanent record. He/she would see if it has already been submitted.

Whether some have actually had "quizzes that are open book" well I doubt that but if they are it is equally as important to know where to look the answers up as opposed to memory. Memory fades but knowing where your resources are and how to access them is both realistic and practical in the occupational world.  

APA and MLA is required...don't have any idea who you think you are fooling..without it, a paper wouldn't be accepted here. It simply wouldn't meet the standard.

By the way...if you use Wikipedia you would fail....you have to cite your references and this is not considered a viable/factual source, nor would cutting and pasting...that would be plagiarism. If you were to be caught doing this, you would be expelled from the university not to mention be held accountable by the military once the university revealed the integrity issue.

I hope this educates all the potential students...because it is opening doors for me now and will in my future endeavor...don't believe what someone says when they cannot even report factually from first hand experience.

TRUST this...There is simply none better than AMU if you pursue your degree online.

Hey everyone...I cannot tell you how very proud I am to be here amongst the  instructors, current students and past students who strongly believe the very same I do about AMU/APUS. Someone asked whether this school can make a difference when you graduate. Yes, it can! Further, AMU also has some online assistance for networking/potential job placement when you graduate. This university is fully accredited and title 4 recognized...this is very important because if you aren't in the military then you would probably need funding and a Federal Student loan (depending upon your circumstances Subsidized or Unsubsidized) would be available. The universities that are not Title 4 recognized cannot get Federal Student Aid....they would have to be privately funded...ie a bank or credit union of your choosing if you qualify. Federal Student Aid does not conduct a credit history. However, they do require that you have paid any/all student loans and not have any outstanding. The books? Well this is an easy one...obviously if you are in the military it is covered under your TA but if you aren't you can get the book's ISBN number from the class you are going to be attending and buy them off Half.com or Ebay for a fraction of what any bookstore would cost you. You may be able to sell them back to the university but if you purchased them from Half.com or Ebay, more than likely the university won't buy them back. They only purchase books back from you that you purchased from them.

I am now on my 10th class from AMU-I have 5 more classes for my Master's. Then I plan on getting my Air Warfare grad certificate. Awesome school-for sure no diploma mill!

 

*****True this********* It strongly appears that "Lt" may have an ax to grind with this university to continue this type of counterproductive banter that  he/she started. One really needs to ask themself, why would an admitted non-student have this much hostility and vinegar toward a university unless of course a negative event has occured to launch their vindictive attack? IF indeed this is really a "Lt", why would s/he spend so much time repeatedly attacking the university, the students who have attended or are currently attending and the instructors-what makes it so personal for him/her?

Further, the comments this "Lt" continue to post don't sound respectful enough to be Military nor Law Enforcement therefore, I doubt s/he has any "friends" that attended here rather it is probably their own failed experience. I strongly had to wonder..did this person attempt to gain student or instructor status and was screened out or denied admission? Did the person actually become a student and was unsuccessful in their attempt to obtain a degree or certificate? I say this because people usually don't go to this extent unless they have a very personal vendetta to pursue-you've all heard the saying disgruntled former employee or student? Sour grapes? Hmmmm   

     In today's American fast moving society and wanting everything now and getting it easily is what most want.  This is not just a rebuttal but my opinion through research and physical analysis of online universities versus traditional universities.  It looks like the original author of this article has only done partical research.  I on the other hand have done full research and analysis comparing online universities (non-traditional) to regular universities (traditional).  Through my research I have found that a lot of the online universities are good.  What the original author has failed to mention is that most professors don't teach, they lecture.  Big difference. They also give their students a course sylabus that outlines what to read in the textbooks, when test and quizes are, and what points are to be made during the course of the course.  Sometimes the professors very from the sylabus, which the professors will let the students know.  This is done in most of your traditional universities.  They don't have the time to teach.  They have way too many students with little time for each class. Plus the time the professor has spent grading, answering questions, and listening/reading students points.  This goes for both traditional and non-traditional schools and online and regular universities.  Most are expected to know the basics from high school and college is picking up where high school left off.  If a student has a point, question, or argument they usually can express it to the professor after class or through email.  That is at a traditional 16 week university cousre.  Online classes the student can email or post it on the school's question board (to the professor).  Online schools are much like the regular traditional university.  What makes it different is...there are no face to face conversations. 

     Another example of the original author only doing partical research is he/she only referrences talking to only five students.  He/she never mentions if he/she has talked with different professors from online schools and traditional universities, like I have.  You (as a whole/everyone) also needs to research the what ever school's reputation.  Newsweek put out a 6 page article for the best online univeristy on the market.  American Military University was and still is #2.  That means a lot.  Plus it makes AMU's reputation creditable.  One thing a person needs look at is...is this a good school for the degree I am seeking.  Meaning does the field I want to get into know and reconize this school in this field. 

     Also, the original author failed to state that although the onlines schools are 8 weeks long, the schools are still cramming 16 weeks of work into an 8 week course.  Also, he/she failed to mention if the little effort put in by the students gave them an A or C or lower.  Five students is not enough to give a true and solid opinion on any school.  I will say there are schools better than others.  But not all of us can gain exceptance in an Ivy league school such as Harvard, Yale or Prencton.  He/she has also failed to mention that a lot of the tradtional universities have added an online school system such as Penn State, Georgia Southern (whose got one of the best sports medicine schools), Liberty Univeristy, etc.  These schools see that the online wave is enormous and that they are losing students to these online schools. 

    Also, the discussion boards are part of the classes and if the posts are off topic it is the professors' responsiblity to gear them to the topic at hand at make them post another.

     SO, to the original author and to those looking to get into school, you must do your research and do the research to its fullest on different schools of both nature.  It does not matter how long it takes to get your degree.  What matters is what you the student put into your studies.  It also matters on how good of reputation the school has and the reputation with the field you want your degree in.  All this is coming from a Minisiter, former police officer, former CNN News/Turner Broadcasting employee, and someone whose father is a retired police captain (25 years) from Atlanta with both Bachularett and Master's degree from Georgia State Univerisity and whose father is also a retired university professor (20 years) who started two criminal justice programs at two major universities in Georgia.  Mister or Miss, you should have done more research before you put this on the web because it does show you have not the slightes idea of what you are talking about.  Also, the books are not really free.  The schools that give out books are give GRANTS from Congress for each student, which is just enough for each course.  Those who want to pay the hundreds of dollars out of pocket don't realize that money can be spent for other important things like a bill or savings.  They also can still sell back the books given to them through the school grant.  Free money. 

     In all, research was not fully done for this article and anyone readying this should it take with a grain of salt.  Sounds to me that this person is trying but does not know how to do the true research need to give a bad opinion about a school, degree or reputation of a school.  This person needs more.  Also, the professors at AMU all have a Master's dregee or better.  That is a must in University standards.  I will give the author credit that he/she has made valid points but your research false short of the whole picture.  Also, did you know that there are two CEO's of major companies that received there Bachualarett from online schools.  One is from AMU. If you would like to know who email me at jason.clack@hotmail.com and I will email you the article.

I see that this original post about AMU already has several rebuttals posted. Please consider mine simply the most recent update. I am currently enrolled in AMU's graduate program with three classes left until graduation.

I would first like to point out the irony with the original poster's concern over quality education being articulated in broken, unnecessary, or missing grammar. There are no spelling mistakes, however, which is the result of an individual with poor writing skills using spell check. This is all the more amusing considering the poster laments about grammar and "style errors" in a paper by an AMU student.

The post quickly turns into a cacophony of unorganized, second-hand criticism of the school's curriculum, lack of difficulty, non-participating instructors, price of tuition, etc, etc. Some criticism is valid, some is petty, but most is massively misinformed. The poster cautions to be "critical with endorsements of current or previous students ..." This advice is fine so long as one does not turn the hypocrite and uncritically accept any criticism that can be slapped together. This is called confirmation bias and is typically frowned upon in higher education.

The poster then offers up contradictory accounts of his friends' experience at AMU. At first, he has them all "laugh[ing] at how easy it is to get a degree" and one particular friend breezes through three simultaneous classes "with no effort at all." However, later in the post these "friends honestly believe they are getting a good education." Well, poster, which is it? Are they laughing and giggling about how easy and effortless the school is, or do they think they're getting a good education? That's the problem with made up, second-hand informants. It's hard to keep their stories straight.

Next, the poster complains twice about how expensive AMU is, that the tuition is "HIGH" and costs "a ton of money." This is demonstrably false. I am paying $900 for an 8 week class of 3 graduate credits. This is significantly cheaper than brick and mortar schools and when comparing apples to apples, Norwich University, another online university charges $657 per credit ($1971 for 3), which is over twice as much as AMU. To set the record straight on various other petty, yet still incorrect complaints from this poster, AMU requires the purchase of textbooks for some courses, and free eBooks for other courses. You can buy the textbooks from AMU directly or get them used from Amazon (like I do). The eBooks are full versions of the original book and I have not yet seen any that contain only excerpts as the poster suggests.

As far as the curriculum of the class, the poster has some of this right. The primary interaction is a discussion forum where the professor posts a question or two, and by virtue of this being an online school, of course the discussion is entirely online. Whether the questions are easy or not depend largely on the knowledge of the student. For example, the topic of discussion for this week in my class was, "Can the strategic culture of the U.S. be changed or has it changed in the last 40 years? Provide examples to illustrate your point." This question requires the students to fully understand the concept of "strategic culture" as opposed to the other hierarchical strategic levels, if, why, and how it can change, and if this took place in the last 40 years with examples required the whole way through. Is this an easy question? I guess until I hear your response, I can't say for sure, but so far students haven't been breezing through it.

My current class also has weekly written assignments and a 15-20 page research paper. The poster criticizes the school because his friend has managed not to get caught cheating by submitting the same paper again and again, but this begs the question why doing so is necessary if the coursework is so easy.

The only valid criticism this poster brings up is the issue of professors and their participation in the class. Some professors do little more than grade your paper and offer a few comments. They are quite responsive to emailed questions/concerns and may simply figure that unless they get any the class is moving along smoothly. Usually, however, they interact with the discussions, offering constructive criticism to posts that miss the mark or are simply incorrect. Sometimes the comments on my papers were nearly as long as the paper itself. The confusing part of this poster's complaints is that they can be found in almost any brick and mortar school in the country.

I work full-time, have a family, and am paying for school out of my checking account so AMU is the perfect solution. Several students have gone off to work in various government positions at the Pentagon, Secret Service, and other Intelligence Community outfits after graduating at AMU and considering this is the line of work AMU caters to, any concerns that the school is not taken seriously because they turn a profit are so far unfounded.

Greetings!

First of all, let me point out that I have not only attended American Military University, but have also participated in an Information Technology practicum and have graduated with a B.S. in Information Technology Management. 

I have read the post that makes several erroneous claims based on second hand information.  I do not work for or have any ties to AMU or their parent, American Public University System beyond being a student, but I want to correct inaccuracies in a previous post.

"AMU is a rip off when it comes to quality of education." - Depending on who you ask, so is Harvard.  Many ivy league schools have degenerated into social networking institutions rather than grading students according to the standards they used to use in the past.

"First of all I'm not a student of AMU, because for profit universities have an interest not for quality of education but rather profits." - Okay, you don't have any direct affiliation or experience with the institution, but you're claiming they are a rip off.  Also, if you seriously believe that non-profits do not care about money, you are naive.

"All my friends taking classes with this university laugh at how easy it is to get a degree.  Basically if you put some minimal time, minimal effort and a ton of money you will eventually get a degree." - This is true at most contemporary American universities.

"The curriculum is a joke.  The main part of the curriculum is based on on-line discussion between a bunch of students who try to answer one or two selected questions posted by the instructor." - I don't know how much knowledge you have of higher learning, but this is the whole point of the collegiate learning environment.  Student discussion is a major component of learning at the post-secondary level along with reading, writing and research.

"The instructors hardly instruct." - If this were only true!  My political science and literature classes were brutal and taught by people who were very active in the professorial role.

"The five people I have asked all taking different classes with different instructors told me about the indifference and lack of participation of the instructors." - I am wondering if there is something other than second-hand, anecdotal evidence forthcoming.  Apparently not.

"True some of the instructors are probably experienced people in their fields working full times. They don't have the time to be full time teachers like real universities.  They are there for the easy paycheck not the passion to teach." - This is a general statement like "all democrats are anti-Constitutionalist".  You need to develop the ability to distinguish a fact from an opinion.  You obviously have no experience with the professors.

"The books are free but most of the time they are not complete versions just excerpts.  At the end of the semester you turn around and sell the book back to them, so in essence the price of the book is included in the HIGH tuition." - I never received an excerpt.  Additionally, I liked the electronic .PDF versions very much since you can find information very rapidly.  Some online text versions were lacking, however.  The books from Wiley were difficult to use.  I never sold books back to the institution.  I don't even think you can.  They use an external textbook vendor to fulfill orders.  Also, if you think $250/hr is expensive for online universities, you obviously have not done much research!  Many charge far more.

"Since instructors are not really there to teach, they leave it up to the students to pick a subject." - Not true.

"One of my friends, submits the same paper for every class every semester." - I would caution against hanging around with idiots.

"He is getting by and will get a degree and only had to write one paper.  I took a look at his paper and I can only describe it as mediocre with grammar, and style errors." - See previous comment.

"By the way he is a senior in AMU and don't even know how to reference a paper using APA or MLA!" - Ditto.

"As a result none of the people I know who is enrolled in AMU even reads their free book." - This is getting redundant.  Also, for someone critical of other's grammar, you might want to review yours.

"Back to the conferences, my friends use Wikipedia and the web to answer their online discussions.  They just cut and paste and maybe change a few words and pass it as their own." - My professors specifically discounted Wikipedia citations, as should all professors.  They also have the same regard for plagiarism.

"The sad part about this, is that my friends honestly believe they are getting a good education." - You get out of it what you put into it.  Learn it.  Love it.  It applies to everything.  I would purport that there are many dullards that have passed through other institutions as well.  There is a difference between being smart and being educated.

"There was an article in the news not long ago, where job recruiters admitted they don't hire people with for profit university's degrees for mid level management positions." - Where?

As you can see, nearly the entire content of the post was little more than slamming an institution based upon second hand information and absolutely zero direct experience.  Take what you want from the post, and mine as well.  At least I am speaking from an informed vantage.  By the way, I am making very close to six figures with my "for profit university degree." 

All of you are missing an important point.   Most for profit schools are Nationally accredited.  While this sounds important it is not.  National accreditation is the type you hear about that does not transfer credits anywhere.  AMU and APU are Regionally accredited.  That means they have the same accreditation as a State University, Harvard, and Purdue.  These are the kind of credits that are recognized and transferred anywhere.  I am in the education world and I can tell you that Regional accreditation is not easy to achieve and you have to maintain the accreditation all the time - it is not handed out easily.  You are wrong about AMU and APU.  The instructors are outstanding and there is nothing at all easy about it.  I too have been to both types of Universities (physical and online).  The original poster needs to get their facts straight- I am not really sure why they posted at all.  This site is supposed to be about being ripped-off and it does not sound to me as if they were affected in any way by AMU or APU.  If you get the education and degree and pay reasonable prices for an accredited (Regional) university what is the issue???

I'm not going to quote anything you have said LtMaxx but give you my opinions and experiences.  

I choose not to rebuttal the original post as many of you took care of this. I am a recent MBA graduate and for those who are questioning if an MBA from AMU or a for-profit school will better you in the private sector; I can confidently say yes from my experience and my company where advancements were made due to me earning my MBA. Additionally, would an HR manager consider an MBA from AMU or other for-profit schools? Well, my company paid for my MBA at AMU. That should tell you something. My company is a fortune 1000 company and values my efforts and education. An MBA is a tool to get you in the door of a company or advancement. The rest is up to you to apply what you have learned.

 I am also a manager over a department with 24 employees. I am also the hiring manager as well. Guess what, the stigma of online degrees is slowly dissipating. I hire both from online and brick and mortar schools from some schools such as the Ohio State and I can attest to you a not for-profit school does not make an employee more experienced or functional than an employee from a for-profit school in my experience.  

The comments made by the original poster are truly uninformed.  

They should be removed.

 

The beginning words, “I am not a student of AMU” should be a clue.

 

I do hope this person enrolls there, because the moment he uses Wikipedia to answer his questions he’s going to have to cite them, and he’s also going to have to submit his papers to the plagarism evaluation site.  Good luck with that.  Same for submitting the same paper twice.

 

I won’t dwell much more on this, nor does it merit any further response to the original poster on my behalf.

 

Signed,

 

A retired journalist with 25 years experience at NBC and ABC network news and two national Emmy awards. 

This report is nothing but speculation. I can not believe this report is able to stay on this website. It makes rip off report look pretty bad, and I didn't know they allowed reports from people who have not experienced the school itself.

I am not enrolled in  this school, and have been looking for flaws to AMU. I have found nothing yet, except this report. Which I have read and found this to be uninformative and false.

I do take online courses through a CC in my state, and all my past instructors have conducted their classes differently. I have had instructors who have been attentive, and instructors who just give out lesson plans. I have even  had instructors who assigned nothing!!! I was able to get a wonderful education, and have been able to retain most of the information I found valuable. 8 weeks is fast!!! If it's anything like I have gone through, I'm sure it's nothing but easy! $750 is extreme, but it's the least expensive school I have found.  It seems there are no gimmicks, calls every hour just to have you as a student. I think the report I read was a bunch of baloney. I hope nobody takes their word for it.

This is a slight tangent to the stream of discourse, but I wanted to ask you a few questions about teh credibility of AMU, as a Professor at AMU. I plan on getting my Masters of Arts in History at AMU, as my husband will be stationed in South Korea.  When I'm finished with the degree I want to go on to a doctoral program at a brick and mortar school such as UCSD, University of Texas or UCLA.  As an experienced educator, how do you think receiving an online masters degree will reflect on my applications to doctoral programs? Also, do you know of any history students that have gone onto doctoral programs or who have become college teachers after attending AMU?  My last question is, are there any tools available to the student online to assist with writing/tutoring etc through AMU?

Thanks for your time, and sorry for the tangent.

Having attended a few universities, I have a few comments which I believe help develop understanding of online education.

1) Programs and courses from universities ranging from Penn State to UMASS are available online (see their respective websites). In fact, Harvard (see Harvard's website) even has online courses (with open-book tests/assignments). The teachers at some of these universities range from full-time professionals to full-time teachers.

2) As with ANY education, you get out of it what you put into it. Just look at all of these scholar-athlete scandals from "reputable" universities. Some scholar-athletes don't even bother going to class, yet receive a degree just as those that do attend their courses.

3) If AMU is as questionable as you say, then why are they accredited by an accrediting institution? Why can anyone take courses from AMU and transfer them to a private or public university (depending on transfer credit policies of the university).

4) You bash "for-profit" universities and claim the education they provide is questionable because they are worried about cash. Do you think public universities aren't worried about their budgets? A simple google search of "public university budget concerns" returns over 8 million results. Speaking of concerns, ever hear of grade inflation at public universities? Public universities are sometimes more worried about graduation rates than quality of education (google "grade inflation").

5) I see you made a lot of claims with no proof of your assertions. If you had received a "quality" education, then you would have at least attempted to provide sources for claims like "There was an article in the news not long ago." Also, you state you quizzed ONE person on economics. Even if that were true, does allow you to evaluate the whole university? I guess you never took a statistics course or heard of a confidence level. What's the confidence interval on quizzing ONE person anyway? I assure you that you can find at least one student in an economics course at Harvard that does not understand economics in the least. This does not speak to the whole university though. 

Well, in response to the original post, that is the exact opposite of everything I have heard from people I know who have went to APU/AMU. They have all seemed to love it and everything about it. I think the big thing is the Regional Accreditation and the reasonable prices. One of my best friends told me about APU and I'm looking into attending. I do have concerns even though it is accredited regionally that a degree may not be taken as seriously but based on some of these posts I feel a lot better about it now.

And I'm guessing even though most posts were made about AMU the same positive responses would apply to APU because they are one in the same correct? This site has provided me with the best feedback on APU yet. (Thanks)

I was wondering though if I could get some further responses from those of you that have attended?
I'm thinking of going for a four year degree. I have some college credits already (not many) and I hope to have some military training evaluated and transferred over as well. If I'm lucky some of my Law Enforcement training too.

How long, on average, should it take me to obtain a 4 year degree? I work full time, so there is no way I can do a full load, part time load for sure and hopefully I will get some credits transferred over.

And bottom line, do all of you feel your degrees are taken seriously regardless of the field you work in out in the real world?

Any info is greatly appreciated!

I don't have any experience with the undergraduate side of the university, but I did earn a Masters degree from APU.  In addition to it, I have an undergrad degree and a separate Masters from traditional brick and mortar universities (two "big name" ACC schools). 

My experience was generally positive.  I found the classes to be challenging and, for the most part, the faculty and fellow students to be engaging - just like the brick and mortars I went to, some people cared more than others.  My experience was that online learning presented a different set of challenges than traditional classroom learning did.  For example, personal time management was more important in the online environment than in a classroom one.

I would encourage anyone that feels they can pay money and be handed a degree to stay away from the institution - you're just cheating yourself and will be ill prepared to handle professional responsibilities upon graduation.  In my case, I do feel that APU prepared me well for a mid-life career change and I'm appreciative of the school and the professors that assisted me in my journey.

Best of luck to everyone who is seeking to expand their educational horizons!

Author was never a student, yet has an incredible arsenal of opinions. I don't know where to begin. First of all, many traditional schools have 8-week accelerated distance-learning programs. University of Maryland for example. Regis University for example. Many others. The list grows every year. Are these schools ripoffs too? Given your non-attendance at APU/AMU and subsequent elaborate dissertation, this should not affect your opinion on these either. We eagerly await your thoughtful uninformed lectures on why UoM is a ripoff..

I have been taking two classes every sixteen weeks, and let me say, they're no joke. Mine is a research heavy degree (History), and my professors have been solid, critical, quick to respond, helpful, you name it. Indeed, before applying (yes, it's hard not to be accepted, true, but that's where the easiness ended for me), I researched the professors I'd likely be taking classes from. Finding out that they are all respectable, and many of them more than qualified, I went for it. I haven't been disappointed.

I can't speak for the undergraduate program, the eight week courses, or even for any other graduate program but mine, so let me rebut LT_Max directly. In each class, I am required to read approximately 150 pages per week, and I write, on average, 15 pages per week. My discussion posts must be referenced when I claim to be stating a fact, and I have to adhere strictly to the Chicago/Turabian standard. I am responsible for turning in an article-worthy paper at the end of each semester, and, if I fail to do so, I am made aware of it. I am maintaining a 'B+' average despite work that trumps friends' works that are getting 'A's in brick and mortar (B&M) institutions.

I must also cite your language, which is nebulous at best. "Some classes usually require a paper to write." So, because you use two variable qualifiers, your sentence can only be strictly interpreted as "anywhere between 1% and 99% of classes will require a paper." You need to back that up with, "of the blank classes one friend has taken, blank have had papers." Otherwise, we can only logically conclude that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Also, "since instructors are not really there to teach, they leave it up to the students to pick a subject" is again a false positive, as it were, on your part. Because an instructor may (I say 'may' because, as stated above, I cannot speak for every degree path) expect a student to take an active role in his or her education, and think critically about what he or she wants to research, you jump to the conclusion that the professor doesn't care. The American public education system is universally criticized for its doling out of cookie-cutter expectations and subjects. I actually say 'bravo' to this private institution that is not as restricted.

You also talk about the expense of attendance. I know that an eight week course costs the same as a sixteen week course. It is the same for every B&M institution I have ever looked into! Currently, my graduate courses are $900 apiece. This, friend, is cheap. My local B&M, with, in my opinion, a lower quality education, costs 50% more per course. Also, you criticize the very existence of eight week courses. Have you ever heard of summer-school?

I will end by touching on your criticism of discussions again. Discourse is an important part of any curriculum, really. It often takes a student to draw another student's concerns to the surface. This allows the professor to address misunderstandings that a student may not even know he or she has.

I returned to university 30 years after my BS from Texas A&M... a career and raising 4 children alone (one disabled) took precedence. 

I am just finishing my MA in History (Ancient and Classical). I am writing my thesis, intending to finish in July 2011. I have a 3.9something GPA, after getting an A- in Ancient Warfare.

I have 33 credits, so far and I have posted most of the papers I've written on a document sharing site--54 at current count--creating a portfolio to support my entrance into a PhD program.

I append the link to my papers here, if any want to see how difficult the program can be.

http://www.scribd.com/davidterrell80/documents

My employer, BAE Systems, is one of the largest defense contractors in the world... and thinks enough of APUS to partner with them... and, gratefully, pay for the entirety of my program:

http://www.apus.edu/news-events/news/2011/03-09-11-APU-Partners-with-BAE-Systems-Intelligence-and-Security-Sector-and-Sun-Maid-to-Offer-Enhanced-Online-Education-Opportunities-to-Employees

The school was declared a "preferred school" by the LAPD

http://www.apus.edu/news-events/news/2010/06-18-10-lapd.htm

That the OP's friend gets by so well in undergraduate classes may speak more about the capability and capacity of his friend, vice the weakness of the courses. When I look at the syllabus of the 100 & 200 level courses, I think they are pretty easy, too.

But, my 17 year-old son, who is inexperienced, but no slouch, is working pretty hard on his BA.

Let the regional accreditation agencies do their job...

Best complements, 

David Terrell
Texas A&M 1980, AMU 2011(est)

I, too, want to do a PhD based on an AMU History MA. So, I chose the Thesis option, over the comprehensive exam, so I would have examples of my research in a portfolio. I also have three AMU professors willing to give me recommendations. Each teach full-time at other schools (SUNY, Naval War College, U of Florida). Now I'm beginning to work on my foreign languages (French, German and Latin) at a local B&M, to prepare me for that part of the curriculum.

David T

I was going back and forth mentally in regards to whether I wanted to go to AMU or not. Your post sealed the deal. I'm registering tommorow!

i am a recent graduate from amu and it is not a rip off.  like anything else in this world, you get what you put into it.  i took some tough classes and some easy classes.  the point being is that this is accredited school and i was able to enroll in north dakota state university to continue with my graduate work.  the graduation rate is 55% versus university of phoneix which is 23%.  the cost for each credit is half of what phoneix charges for the exact same program. 

until one attends an online school, then we humbly ask to not steer others away from a program that will do them good.  also as any first year law student can tell you "here say is not admissable in a court of law."  do the research yourself and dont listen to people who have never attended school.
thank you

As a current APU student, I was surprised by this article. I did my research before attending, and APU fit the bill for the lifestyle I had. (I was wary of a online school I had never heard of). It was comparable in price (if not cheaper) than the brick & mortar schools in my area. Not to mention, working 40+ hours a week and finding the time to drive and attend classes was not an option for me.

I am glad so many have stood in defense of APU/AMU. I have been attending since March 2010 and have worked very hard to maintain my GPA. All of my professors have been great and the classes are challenging.  All of my professors have been sticklers for grammar and punctuation usage. Chicago style formatting is a must for History majors.

What shocked me the most from the original article (and others have mentioned it as well) saying that papers were reused and the Wikipedia was an accepted source. In every single class I have taken, it is an adamant statement that Wikipedia is not an acceptable source. The other, was the re-use of papers. They have stated that that is unacceptable and they view that as plagiarism. Not to mention, I have not had any classes where I could really re-use them.



Overall, I'm happy to be a student and cannot wait until I graduate! And the original poster, and this has already been said, but he should have done some more research.

The writer of this complaint is NOT a student.  Until you actually get into the system, it is impossible to determine quality/value.

When I decided to go back to school in 2009, I was ready to go with State College but just before I registered for classes, I learned about all of the hidden fees that they would not use financial aid for.  Their solution to cut costs was courses like basket weaving that did not require a textbook. 

Another institution I  looked at kept changing their fee structure.  I got a written breakdown via an email and then the story started changing throughout the registration process.  The student advisers lied and promised eligibility for scholarships.  When I asked where to apply for those scholarships, I was ignored.  I researched the scholarship opportunities independently and learned they were not applicable to my degree program, adult returning students, and one had a residency requirement.  When I asked about this discrepancy I was treated with disrespect, and that I was too stupid to understand hour financial planning for an education works and obviously too stupid to make it through the program.  This was a brick and mortar school with an on-line extension program.  

The writers friends laugh at how easy the classes are.  Some are were very easy but that is because I am in my 40's and have real world experience, have a career, and have run my own business in the past.  Many of the topics were familiar territory.  As minimal time, that's insane and his friends taking 3 classes in an 8 week condensed period must not have full time jobs, or they took the easy courses. 

The intro 1 credit course to familiarize the student with the on-line classroom was a breeze.  It brought familiarity to the various forms of writing scholastically such as APA, Chicago, etc.  Most of my classes required APA format, a few required others.  Most classes required textbook reading.  The amount varied from 150 and as much as 500 pages in a week.  Some classes required you have the reading complete and write a paper using at least one outside source of 750 words mid-week to have classroom discussions.  Then you have to read student responses and respond to at least 2 others.  Invariably, half of the students could not write at a college level, they were late, or just used 750 words to get the assignment done making it extremely difficult to participate.  It became challenging.  One would hope these students putting in a sloppy effort.  I heard from many in my classes that they were not doing well.  

I also don't understand the complaint about credits being earned through military training.  I have my Six Sigma Lean through the military as well as being a Certified Property Manager, and a Level II Certified Logistician.  Each certification required several classes and in the military you have 3 chances to earn 100% with the system we use.  We have tons of training on the job that is actually more brutal than any expensive brick and mortar school I attended in the past.

For the most part, I have to agree that the study is extremely independent and it really depends on the instructor.  I had some instructors that posed "devils advocate" questions to get people thinking in a guided self-discovery learning style.  I nearly dropped my marketing class because they instructor was completely unresponsive and late in grading work which is critical to managing an 8 week condensed course.  Sciences and Math instructors went above and beyond.  My only complaint is that the appeals process for a grade is a joke.  I submitted a few assignments and due to a computer error, the attachment did not go through.  I lost points for being "late" when there was electronic proof the work was submitted on time.  Again, we used a database to create a plagiarism report before submitting final papers.  I submitted a paper and the instructor wanted the PDF and a word doc.  I was traveling when I got the announcement so uploaded what I had with an explanation the bibliography was in the PDF.  I still lost 20% as a result of the last minute change. When I appealed, both times, I was ignored and not even given a response. 

The biggest plus is NO HIDDEN FEES.  If you like e-books... no cost for textbooks.  As far as the books being "excerpts" I actually bought used textbooks because of my travel schedule and I never saw anything cut.  The books I saw were full versions.

I also question the "HIGH" tuition statement.  $250 a credit, books included, and no additional fees.  An Associates runs you about $15K and a bachelors $30K.  All costs are well below the Federal subsidized/unsubsidized loan limits.  The only thing I have to say is that the school required me to take out the maximum on the loan even if I didn't need it.  I had a credit balance on my account and wanted to use that for upcoming classes in lieu of another loan but the school wouldn't let me, they forced another loan.  I had them send me the refund and I sent it back to the loan people.  They seem to have problems if you want to switch from Student Loans to self-pay.  I received a promotion in the process of getting my degree and did not need the financial assistance, but they wouldn't change my status.  No big loss, I just sent the money right to the loan folks paying it off as soon as it was distributed.  The costs were a lot lower than ANY OTHER university I looked at.

I have to say if someone isn't reading the book, it will catch up with them if not in school when they start applying for jobs.  If they can't write a cohesive sentence or sends the same paper for every class, it will probably catch up with them on the graduation audits. 

It is true your tests for the most part are open book and not proctored, but your overall final degree assessment IS a proctored, closed book exam that covers questions in every subject of your degree program as well as a writing sample.  If you don't pass that final degree assessment... no degree...  I would be interested to know if the person's friend passes that test and the outcome.

LTmax engages in numerous fallacious arguments unsupported by fact, logic, and empirical research.

For example, it took this AMU grad a mere 2 minutes to uncover a contradiction within the 10th grade level prose in LTmax’s biased and anecdotal rant unsupported by fact, logic, and empirical research:

‘All my friends taking classes with this university laugh at how easy it is to get a degree.’—Ltmax

And this,

‘The sad part about this, is that my friends honestly believe they are getting a good education.’—LTmax

Indeed, it appears that LTmax has been caught in a contradiction or misrepresentation – are the author’s friends stupid, schizophrenic, or is the author fabricating evidence ?

Moreover, the diatribe is rife with poor grammar indicative of a substandard education, not a substandard university education – a substandard secondary school education.

In sum, the only true statement that LTmax has offered is that he/she did not attend AMU since the fundamental framework of his/her entire critical review would have been exposed as faulty in an introductory research methods course at AMU.

So it appears after an AMU alumnus generously offered to pay for the author to take a course, and another sensibly asked the author to release the names of cheating students/lazy professors, the author disappeared.  That pretty much tells me that these were misguided allegations posted by someone with the intent of slandering the university’s name.  I must say that such a showing of school pride is uncommon in many brick and mortar schools, let alone an online university.  The well thought out responses in this thread that eventually led to the dismissal of this false claim are commendable.  The pride that people take in AMU as their academic choice illustrates the hard-work and effort many have put into their education at AMU.  I am working on my Master’s in National Security while deployed in Afghanistan and could not be happier so far.  The online portal, interaction with students and professors, and curriculum has all been outstanding thus far.  I would be satisfied with the education I am receiving from AMU anywhere back home; the fact that AMU enables me to pursue this degree while deployed only helps me to appreciate the true value of this education.

Paul Anderson
B.S. Boston University

I had considered this school for a little over six months, as I made my decision to go back to school. I wanted to be sure that my degree would be worth something and that it would be relevant in the job market. I saw this RIP off report and I decided to give it a read. As I said I wanted to find the dirt on AMU so that I could be sure about my decision.

I read the post and it was written by someone who had never even attended. I read through the other posts and what I found was interesting. There were no negative comments by students who actually attended. There was not a single comment from those who attended and then dropped out either. I read alumni experiences and I was impressed with everyone’s ability to convey ideas in a rational, logical, and critical way.

After reading this report and the glowing responses from the alumni and the educators, I started to read posts on the perception of AMU as a whole, and within the collegiate community. What I found was pretty impressive. AMU/APUS is regionally accredited. It is one of the top online schools along with WGU (a not-for-profit school) and some B and M school that offer online learning.

Further more I looked into the claims of the eight week curriculum. It is true AMU/APUS does offer eight week courses, but as I found so do my local community college and their program transfers directly to UNC. Further research indicates that the eight week curriculum is not uncommon even in B&M's. It is in fact a growing trend. Perhaps educators have come to the realization that learning a subject of study does not require a rigid eight week course. This is becoming common practice even in "reputable" four year colleges.

As far as the cost of tuition; it is competitive. There are B&M schools that are so much more, I don’t think I could reasonably afford them even with student loans, grants and scholarships.

Finally I looked into the actual programs. I wanted to get into Global Logistics, and AMU has a specialized program in this field. My impression when all my research was completed? JACKPOT!

I am now attending AMU as a full time student and I can assure anyone considering this school that it will not be a matter of breezing through. You will not be able to turn in one paper for multiple classes. They have high standards on plagiarism and they verify your work is original by sending it through a verification website. This will alert your professors as to the originality of your papers and if you have turned it in already then it will give your professor a note indicating the work is not an original.

My suggestion to anyone who read the original post and thought to themselves, "an easy degree, I can get for me..." think again. You will spend time researching your papers, you will not be able to copy and paste, you will not be able to cite Wikipedia, you will be given expectations and you will have full disclosure so no surprises when grades are given.

To conclude, the original poster was angry about something or someone attending AMU/APUS. Perhaps he/she graduated from a B&M and was passed over for promotion for a better candidate who happened to graduate from AMU/APUS. Would that make AMU or his/her B&M school less valid? Did they even attend any kind of higher learning institution? Hard to say with his/her glaring grammar, and punctuation errors, not to mention his rigid stance on arguments based purely on conjecture and had no bases in actual factual research. Perhaps his/her friends were less than reputable persons, lending to the old saying "you are your friends..." That's not a slight on anyone, but how could this one person have found the only five people who have anything negative to say about AMU? Why could they not write this report themselves? Why have there not been more people coming forward to argue on behalf of his/her tirade.

Believe me when I say people do not care how much money they spend on something, if it is of low quality they WILL make it known, if for no other reason than to place shame on the broken promise of their purchase. Embarrassment may take place if this were a face to face environment, but this is basically an anonymous way to express feelings about a product, so yes eventually someone would come out and speak to the claims made on the initial post, but in fact no one has...

That probably says more than anything else I or any one else could say in defense of this school.
 

I don't understand how one person, the author, who never attended the university has any idea as to what goes on there. Some of the courses are easier than other, yes but it isn't all candy and bubble gum. Anyone who reads this review and believes it needs help. AMU is fully accredited by all the right organizations and is far from a mill degree university.

I don't have miles and miles of words to say but I do want to point out that the author clearly bought his degree if he has one at all. If he is considered a "reporter" he needs to find a new profession.

I don't understand how one person, the author, who never attended the university has any idea as to what goes on there. Some of the courses are easier than other, yes but it isn't all candy and bubble gum. Anyone who reads this review and believes it needs help. AMU is fully accredited by all the right organizations and is far from a mill degree university.

I don't have miles and miles of words to say but I do want to point out that the author clearly bought his degree if he has one at all. If he is considered a "reporter" he needs to find a new profession.

I am a student of APU, which is also associated with AMU. Here is my rebuttal:

1) MYTH - APU/AMU is expensive: Capella, Kaplan, and the University of Phoenix are expensive, with some charging over $350/credit for undergraduate courses, as well as charging for books and having other fees, as well. APU/AMU charges $250/credit for undergraduate courses and offers free textbooks and no application fee.

2) MYTH - APU/AMU free textbooks are not full textbooks: That's BS. The textbooks are full-length e-books, and if an e-book isn't available, the textbook is shipped to you for FREE. The university actually pays for it completely.

3) MYTH - You don't have to put forth effort: I have busted my butt to obtain a 3.6 GPA, and my friend Beth who attends AMU has done the same to obtain her 3.9 GPA. It is also against university policy to copy and paste information from books or the internet and not cite them properly. To combat plagiarism, many classes require that you submit your paper to turnitin.com, which analyzes the paper to see how original it is - if anything is plagiarized, it shows up in what is called an Originality Report. Some classes require you to turn in a paper with the originality report.

4) MYTH - Discussion boards turn off-topic "most of the time": Again, complete BS. Some instructors are less involved, that is true. However, the discussion boards are not easy. Most require a minimum of 300 words for the initial post, and 150-200 words for replies to students. They must be on topic. If you're just posting gibberish, it is likely you won't get a very good grade. Some instructors are very involved in the posts, and they will instruct as you go along, commenting and asking questions. The questions can be very difficult at times, some requiring that you answer 10 questions and writing mini-papers about the topic. By the time you're done, you have four pages of material!

5) MYTH - The instructors don't care: I have to call BS on this one, too. I have taken 11 classes with APU, and I have only had 2 instructors that I didn't like, both of which were still very involved in the classroom experience. I have done the online school thing many times, with many universities, including a brick and mortar university. I have hated every online experience except for this one. The instructors care, they are HIGHLY qualified (many with doctorates) and they spend a lot of time grading, providing feedback, and getting involved in the discussion boards.

If your friend is taking an economics class and can't cite references or tell you basic principles of economics, than your friend isn't trying and he is probably an idiot.

Here are some good things about APU/AMU:

1) Low tuition for an online school and free FULL e-books or textbooks if an e-book is unavailable
2) Qualified instructors that provide passion and a quality education
3) A simple application process, geared toward working and busy adult students
4) 8 week classes that allow for flexibility and quick results (IF you put forth the effort to learn)
5) A reputable school that has been around for 20 years, that is regionally and nationally accredited

I am so surprised that this website accepted a claim from someone that never attended this university. First of all, AMU is an excellent school that is regionally and nationally accredited. Yes, it is for “profit” organization; however, the tuition is one of the lowest compared to that of other online universities.The quality of education is superior and the professors are all qualified to match their specialized fields. 

I am so happy with my experience at this school compared to that of University of Phoenix; who’s mainly in it for the money and not the education.  I have a BA in Business Management from AMU, and I have gotten many job offers from civilian companies such as Lockheed Martin, General Dynamics, Raytheon, DSCI. 

To any prospective students, please do your research first, but trust me when I say this is an awesome school. Remember, you get what you put into your education.

Be the judge for yourself and don’t be discouraged by LT Max comments.

Good luck to you all in your educational endeavor :)

As a current graduate student in military history at APU, I read LTmax’s critique of this online school about six months ago and was disturbed by his lack of research, as well as the quality control at Ripoff Report for allowing such unsubstantiated nonsense to be published on their website in the first place.



I cannot speak for others, but to prospective students out there I would like to offer my experiences so far after the three classes I have taken in the last year. I am an active duty sergeant major in the U.S. Army and I am working on a Masters Degree in Military History at APU. Due to the course workload, I am taking one class at a time. Other students may be able to take multiple classes at the same time, but my experience thus far is that each class has had an enormous amount of work involved so I can only handle one at a time in addition to a full time job.



LTmax stated, “Some classes usually require a paper to write…One of my friends, submits the same paper for every class every semester.” Well, that has not been the case for me.  Every class I have been in has had multiple papers to write.  My first class was an Introduction to Historical Methods, and I was required to read two textbooks as well as about 30 articles and essays, and complete a précis as well as a research paper proposal.



LTmax stated, “He is getting by and will get a degree and only had to write one paper.”  I would really like to see this mythical “one size fits all paper” that LTmax talks about. That statement alone tells me that LTmax has probably never been to college, and as a non commissioned officer in the U.S. Army for over 22 years whose job it has been to teach, coach, and mentor new officers over the years, I must say that I have never seen an officer express himself/herself so inadequately so I doubt that “LTmax” is a commissioned officer in any organization in our nation’s military forces. Notice how he/she disappeared after being offered a chance to take a course? That in itself speaks volumes.  Furthermore, the mythical “one size fits all paper would be worth more than the Mona Lisa!



My second class was Historiography and was much more difficult and culminated with a historical research essay that required a minimum of ten references. In the end I read seventeen books in order to get enough information to actually write just that one paper. That is in addition to an academic book review as well as the essays/articles/textbooks that I was required to read as well. Not to mention the time that I spent online searching as well as in my local libraries. In addition to a full time job the workload was staggering. I did not see much of my wife or friends during that class.



The third class I just finished was Studies in US Military History and has not been as much of a challenge as the other two, but I have still had to read one 701 page textbook, as well as five books; each of which required an academic book review, as well as posts/responses each week.  Depending on the class, I have spent an average of 2-3 hours a night and 2-5 or more hours on Saturday and Sunday reading, writing, researching, etc. just for one class at a time. My professor in Historiography stated to our class, “You must master the material.”  He was not kidding. I cannot speak for the rest of APU, but in the graduate history degree you will do a lot of reading and will be expected to analyze what you read. Students are required to read a large amount of material each week which will cover different subjects so just keeping up with this information has been a challenge for me.



LTmax stated, “The curriculum is a joke…  The questions are extremely easy but most of the time the conversation turns to an off-topic conversation.” This has not been the case for me.  All of my classes have had a requirement for multiple posts and responses each week.  Each post requires some effort as the questions usually cover a great deal of information from the textbooks/essays/articles.  My experience has been that my posts usually wind up being akin to a mini essay that requires a great deal of thought and reading (e.g. “hours”) beforehand. Additionally, the instructors actually read these posts and frequently offer more leading questions for you to answer, and you will not get by with one and two sentence posts or responses. I know this from experience as I was lazy one week and my professor docked points off my grade due to my limited and poor response.



LTmax stated, “The books are free but most of the time they are not complete versions just excerpts.” I have not used the online versions, as I prefer to actually buy my textbooks so I can highlight and make notes in them because I learned early on that the professors refer to them quite a bit.  Buying them used off Amazon or Barnes and Noble usually costs me about an average of $60. It is an untruthful statement to say that you can pass by just reading “excerpts”. I would like to see an academic book review or historical research essay completed from excerpts.



Another thing that really bothered me was LTmax’s statement, “He gets an "A" every time so I know his paper don't get read. By the way he is a senior in AMU and don't even know how to reference a paper using APA or MLA!” In my humble opinion, anyone with grammatical skills this poor should not even attempt to take classes at APU. All of my professors have covered this basic fact in their syllabus and they grade accordingly. To be quite frank, I have never seen any weekly post from any of my classmates with grammar as consistently awful as LTmax in any of my classes so far.  Additionally, all of my papers were required to be referenced using Chicago/Turabian, and you can forget about using “Wikipedia” for anything. This is something else that every professor that I have had has specifically mentioned so far. And all my papers were read with responses/corrections given back to me. Furthermore, they are all checked for plagiarism at Turnitin online and anyone caught doing so is expelled. My professors have all mentioned this basic fact. 



LTmax stated, “True some of the instructors are probably experienced people in their fields working full times.” “They are there for the easy paycheck not the passion to teach.” Not in my case. My three professors have all had quite impressive resumes.  They have all had a PhD, and one teaches at the Army War College, one has been a history professor for 26 years, and one had been a naval officer for over 20 years prior to his teaching career.



LTmax stated, “Basically if you put some minimal time, minimal effort and a ton of money you will eventually get a degree.” Nothing could be further from the truth. All of my classes have been 16 weeks long, and furthermore, as an active duty soldier, APU is extremely affordable for me due to the army’s tuition assistance, which pays for almost 90% of my costs. It is even better for soldiers pursuing a bachelor’s degree because each class does not cost as much as those classes in the master’s degree program.



Personally, if I were researching online colleges and universities, I would pay no attention whatsoever to any of LTmax’s statements. He was never a student, and for some reason, he felt compelled to offer his comments in which he did so extremely poorly, and his rebuttals were even worse as they failed to offer any proof to his allegations. However, I would pay tremendous attention to the responses in this forum by actual students and alumni of this university. If you are searching for the real answer to what it is like to be a student at the online university of AMU/APU, they have stated it much more eloquently than I have.



To prospective students out there, I would offer this advice. If you do not have good study skills, cannot write effectively or research any better than “LTmax”, and are not prepared to spend considerable time and effort towards achieving a degree then you are going to have a difficult time at APU/AMU. In my personal experience, it has not been a “degree mill”.



On the other hand, over the past year it had been an extremely rewarding experience for me with proactive administrative personnel (over the phone and here at my duty station) and with professors who care a great deal about their students and who expect even more. Any motivated student with half the smarts and common sense of “LTmax” should be able to and could earn a degree at this university. However, it has been my experience so far that this institution is going to make you earn it. 

My fellow AMU graduates, students, and Professors have handled the original poster well.  I just wanted to add a couple of comments. I have attended several colleges - online and brick and mortar.  I look for two things when choosing a school.  First and foremost is accreditation.  The school must be regionally accredited.  Regional accreditation is the accepted accreditation of all legitimate universities.  Harvard, Purdue, Drexel, etc.  are regionally accredited.   AMU and APU are regionally accredited.  The credits you earn there will transfer to any major or state university in the country.  Therefore, regional accreditation is not given lightly. 

The other item I look for is the education of the professors--if your professor was educated at an Ivy League or another well-known school than that is the education you, as a student, will also receive. Take a look at the faculty list of APU and AMU.

The poster needs to catch up with the times--online education is the wave of the future.  You can no longer judge an online education as synonymous with diploma mill.  I would not attend a school that was not regionally accredited.

Maybe the original poster could not get accepted to AMU or APU?  Why the angst against a school you have never attended?

To all respondents, hired or otherwise, It’s been a while since I wrote the original post and there has been a lot of replies that I feel is time to re-address. 

First of all, I truly understand the motives behind a for-profit corporation to attack posts with legitimate concerns like this one in an effort to protect the image of AMU/APU and consequently enrollments and the bottom line.  Do I believe that every poster above is a true AMU/APU alumni and not a paid PR agent defending the quality of their degrees and institution? Not a chance!  But let me indulge in the ignorance of the posters that do everything but address the main points of my post and subsequent ones. 

Most of the replies have been nothing but personal attacks, discrediting my grammar, punctuation, and mechanics.  This is a perfect example of an ad hominem attack, which for the uniformed; it simply is a logical fallacy in any argument.  The posters here are trying to discredit me and thus by extension discredit my posts without never addressing them.  Perfect examples of lesser minds are work, who takes things at face value without having to engage their minds in true critical thinking by addressing the true issues at hand.  Not surprising since is all coming from AMU/APU alumni.  One has to wonder if critical thinking was not or is encourage in their curriculum. 
How about you posters stick to the issues and address them? I guess you can’t because all you have is your own personal and bias experience or in the case of PR agents, an agenda to save face for this company.

For those who do not have a hidden agenda or bias, I offer the following article which brings up some of the issues I posted in a very eloquent way.

http://dailycensored.com/2010/03/29/does-the-american-military-university-amu-teach-torture-to-its-students-or-has-it-taught-torture-in-the-past-wikileaks/

Perhaps, those interested in furthering their education will consider the facts (not irrelevant personal experience) and make an inform decision and stay away from AMU/APU.

Ultimately, for all the current students of AMU/APU and alumni, we all make our choices so live with it.  You are or were cheated of a real education.  I don’t wish you ill but rather, I pity you and hope for the best, maybe even a decent living wage.

I attended Radford University part time for 4 years, and have taken a few classes at Northern Virginia Community College. I am currently researching different schools to finish my Bachelor's, and I stumbled across this post while beginning my research on APU. I have been looking to move away from the classroom and into online-only course study because it has always worked best for me as a student; I work full time, I am very self-motivated and like working at my own pace, and have been very disappointed with my in-class experiences at both schools I've attended. I’ve never had any help paying for school, with the exception of a student loan which I'm currently paying off, so APU is naturally intriguing as they are the next cheapest option to the cost of most community colleges. From my research, they incorporate the pricing of the books into the tuition, and while this sounds almost too good to be true based on the price of their undergraduate classes, it is definitely a smart move on their part. I’m so sick of spending money on books that the instructors require but never even touch in the course of the semester, and then receiving less than 10% when selling books back. Anyone who’s ever taken one college course before has been though this, so to incorporate the cost into tuition is an ideal situation. Also, AMU and APU are regionally and nationally accredited; you expressed that just because they are accredited by an agency that is recognized by the government does not necessarily deem it a good school, but does that mean any other school accredited by the same organization is just as illegitimate? What do you argue is the purpose of accreditation if you dismiss their accreditations despite government approval, and how can anyone trust any accreditation in that case when picking a school?

This post is very frustrating to me because I am looking for comments or reviews from people with first-hand negative experience with the school, as I agree that you can't always trust the positive reviews of any for-profit organization or company- whether it's for an educational institution or a fast food restaurant. I’m sorry but your post does nothing to warn or deter me from researching this school further, so in your goal you have failed unless you can provide an actual experience. You speak of a few examples from the people you know, but from your descriptions it sounds to me like your sources are lazy and hold no ethical values as students.  I just think you should be aware of how you have discredited yourself by using resources such as these, and in addition have failed to say anything here that is worth reading as it comes without any offer of an experience of your own. How do your friends that you’ve referenced feel about the school? I have no ties to AMU/APU; I am just looking for some honest opinions bases on real-life experiences. I feel your animosity towards the school is due either to a bad personal experience that you didn't mention on this forum, or that you are bitter having put a lot of time, hard work and money into a program elsewhere while others around you are seemingly breezing through a degree at AMU/APU. I have definitely felt that way before and feel for you if that is the case- I’ve watched my peers whose parents pay for anything and everything skate by and graduate easy as pie while I’m still waiting tables just trying to afford one class at a time while paying bills and struggling to even afford food. After taking courses at Radford I was bitter and angry, so much so that I verbally bashed the school anytime someone mentioned the name. Since leaving I’ve had several friends who have graduated from Radford that LOVED it, so after a few years passed and I cooled down I realized, who am I to say it is so horrible? It just wasn't for me, but that doesn't mean it's not right for everyone. Perhaps this is something that you could consider. If you’ve never had to work while attending school, 16 weeks can be a very long time, and seems unnecessary for certain classes. When you’ve paid for classes over and over to still run into the same curriculum simply to fill class time, it can be very defeating. From my own school experiences and through research of the schools, AMU/APU could be an ideal choice for me in my position but I just don’t know until I read real facts. If what I have been reading from different sources is accurate, the schools promote a virtual environment that is affordable, supports our military students who need it most, and incorporates class schedules that are very flexible and accommodating.
 
Since no one here has agreed with this post yet, does anyone out there have any first-hand negative experience with either AMU or APU? I've only read good things, except that the financial aid department doesn't quite have it together, so I'd love to hear anything that might be a good enough reason not to at least try out one class there and see how I like it. Again, anyone who has proof otherwise please post with some real facts! 

Please advise my friends!

"To all respondents, hired or otherwise". Your first line says it all; I should not have even bothered to read the rest of your little piece. You have been issuing these complaints since Feb 2010, yet you have never even taken a class there and only cite "friends" as your source.  Would it help you to know AMU / APU's accreditation was just reaffirmed until 2020? I'm betting it won't, as you seem to ignore any actual proof this is a decent school.

I tend to agree with another post here, you must be motivated by some personal issue with the school that you are not including in your posts. What else would prompt you to continue to post these reviews after more than a year, and still maintain you have never even taken a course there? Why are you even reviewing the school in the first place if you aren't even a student there? Do you also post reviews of places you've never visited? These aren't personal attacks although you will say they are. Your posts just don't make sense and there must be more to the story then you let on.

Going back to early 2010, (which again is a long time to carry on a complaint against a place you have never been), you have never once offered any more evidence then your "friends" opinions and a link to an article that discusses one individual professor. Hardly solid evidence, or even weak evidence. It's nothing and meaningless. I would really like you to respond with something useful, instead of just getting defensive and repeating your earlier posts.

I just wanted to make a quick comment to state that I am thoroughly impressed by the support that APU has been garnering here and on other sites that I've read.  Of course, there's no real way of knowing if some of these are planted responses, but the logic and clarity of these rebuttals is hard to ignore.  The fact that many have posted full disclosure is comforting.

I've been looking at online universities for several months hoping to pursue a MBA.  I earned my undergrad at the University of Texas in 2008, but I no longer have the time, nor the willingness to deal with the college campus experience.  I've talked to advisors at Kaplan, Phoenix, and lastly APU (which I'd never heard of before) and was most impressed by its affordability, ease of access to learning materials, and the emphasis on personal education (I dislike group projects when it comes to grades).  I work for the federal government, and everything I've read leads me to believe that APU is a smart choice for those looking to advance in their federal careers.

I'm in the process of enrolling for this upcoming semester.  Thanks for putting my mind at ease.

I would like to take this opportunity to make it clear that I am not a student or affiliated with AMU in any way. My comment is for the individual who is claiming that AMU is not a decent university because its curriculum is "too easy" and also because it is a "for profit" school. I am a college graduate of a reputable university and I find it ironic that you encourage people to not attend AMU but instead attend a "not for profit" school. Clearly you do not know the difference between "profit" and "not for profit" regarding education. All universities are for profit schools. If you do know of any that are not, please post one or advise. All universities operate to make a profit rather it be through donations, government funding, tuition, or some form of revenue coming into the school. AMU is no different in this case. That does not mean a school is good or bad due to this necessary economic essential for profit and growth. And to go further with this, the tuition at AMU is quite reasonable as most private universities charge between fifteen to forty five thousand dollars per academic school year versus thirty one thousand dollars for an undergrad degree (whole program) and roughly twelve thousand dollars (whole program) for a grad degree at AMU. At a private university this can cost approximately 120 to 150 thousand dollars versus only thirty two thousand or twelve thousand at AMU. You do the math on that one.

Finally, I would like to comment on the "too easy" comment you made. Just because a person reads a book and takes the test with the book open in front of them does not mean that they are not learning the material. In fact, this method can be very effective for some learning styles. This may help some individuals learn the material and retain it better. After all, its not about how rigorous the system is; its about getting the most out of the books you read in order to be a value to the company you work for. If a person chooses to use this advantage to slack and cut corners in their education achievement, who are they really hurting at the end of the day? It's not the schools fault if a person chooses to take short cuts. By allowing you to take open book exams, I would argue that AMU is giving you a promising route to be successful with the material.

LTMax,

No personal attacks here, no grammar correction, just my personal experience.  USAFA '02, Univ Alaska Anchorage *07 (MPA), AMU *09 (MSI).  I found very little difference between the brick and mortar experience at UAA and the online experience in terms of the rigors of the work, though certainly less at the latter in terms of support (the nature of online - you're much more on your own to sink or swim).  Maybe you feel I've been deprived of a "real education," but when I was accepted for my current PhD program this year, I found they completely disagree as my MSI and my thesis from that MSI were what drew most of their interest and made the sale. 

Of course, maybe you don't see Princeton University as offering a "real education" either. 

I have attended A LOT of different schools; my military career field dictated that I moved quite frequently. To quantify "a lot", I have attended Florida International University, Florida Atlantic University, The University of Maryland, Park College, St Martin's College (Washington State), and a few others. I hold 2 baccalaureate degrees (one with a dual major in Psychology and Aviation Science...so it's really like having 3 undergraduate degrees) and 2 Associate degrees. When I decided to pursue a Master's, I started at the University of Maryland, and switched over to the Masters of Science in Space Studies at AMU. With the exception of AMU, and one other CLEP test, all of my classes were in a traditional classroom setting. None of the classes I had taken previously even came close to the depth and challenge of my AMU courses. None of the final exams or assignments in the traditional classes even broached the amount of effort required by ANY of the AMU exams or essays. As for the setting of those exams...I don't recall any of them NOT being proctored. In some cases, I had to use the proctored facility provided by the Education Centers of the base to which I was assigned, and in others I had to approach a more senior Commissioned Officer to act as my proctor. In all cases, the proctoring entity had to contact my AMU professor to establish his eligibility to act in that capacity.

In most cases, I got more out of the AMU professors than was the case in most of the resident courses because they made themselves available for scheduled online chats, or personally responded to my emails within 24 hours...I cannot claim this for my "traditional" professors, who mostly entered the classrooms, lectured, and left; then held office hours in which, a sometimes pretty significant number of students, would vie for a few minutes of his/her time.

LT Max, I'm not going to resort to attacking you, but I find your assertions to be off-base. This is not to say that your friends may not have been short-changed; but the reality of it is that there are always some lucky people who seem to do less and yet get by. I recall taking "Statistics", I really don't remember the school at which I did it, but it was a resident course...I didn't, and still don't understand one bit of it; and I'm certain that I gave it only minimal effort, and yet to my surprise I got an "A". I am very proud of my accomplishment at AMU; and I'm even thankful to you for initiating this report, because the number of seemingly like-minded people, AMU/APU graduates and others, that rebutted your comments seems to validate my accomplishment, while you are only one voice (actually, to be fair, I think I did see one other person that might have agreed with you; but even they seemed to think your rant was a bit vitriolic).

All this work at amending a report's contents is more like annoyance with information overload

However since there is so much "military" fervor on this particular report I wish to throw out a challenge for those who say this facility is reputable.  There is someone I know who is willing to attend  your "esteemed" University but several questions must be asked!

A.  Will you help someone (help them completely) attend the University even if they cannot pay for it?

B.  Will you help them acclimatize themselves in the University environment?

C.  Will you help them with traveling from where they are to the University no matter where they may be?

D.  Will you help them with room and board?

E.  Will you help them with anything else they may require?

Please don't give me this "garbage" about how it will depend upon the nature of the situation-that's not the point.  The point is if you claim to be reputable will you also render your assistance!

This is where talk stops and truth in action takes over!

The finger is now pointed at you all!

As AMU is an online school, the response to most of the questions posed is "N/A."  As for the others, mainly with finance of the school itself, there is no question that this is a for-profit university, not a non-profit private university, with research$ and endowment funding for scholarships/grants being a key distinction between those two categories.  The questions you pose are an attempt to redefine reputable to exclude all for-profit schools are non-reputable by definition.  If that is your view, fine, no amount of debate will sway that.  But, if you are looking for a solid educational foundation in a variety of fields applicable to the government sector (and that sector sees the degree as reputable, btw), then AMU is a good place to be.

When I was choosing a school to attend, I was urged by many to do my research on different schools before making my choice.  I had heard a lot of talk in articles and on the internet about "for-profit" schools and wanted to make sure I was getting the best education I could.  Many in our local VFW suggested I do my research on retention, graduation and transfer rates of each school, to get a better idea of what exactly each school had to offer, and how other students and graduates felt about the school.  AMU had excellent retention and graduation rates for the degree I was looking for, and came up as the top choice for me, hands down, although I can't speak to all of the degree programs they offer. In my program, they had a 64% graduation rate, which is on par with many private, non-profit schools, while many other "for-profit schools", were around 25-30%. Upon talking with AMU students and graduates in the field I was looking to go into, so many of them had such positive experiences with the classes and obtaining great jobs with their degrees, as well.  This report is actually the only negative I could find about the school, along with one person who continually posts the same answer on Yahoo answers.  That says a lot!

For my personal experience, I haven't been taking classes with AMU very long, but I can assure you, you can't just skate by in these classes and get good grades.  I was always a student who rarely studied or put much effort in school, while always getting A's and B's, but I really have to put some time and effort into these classes.  I write at least a paper per class, along with several LONG discussion boards and replies, plus quizzes and exams nearly every week. I'm taking six classes this semester, three of which are 16 week classes. It is definitely no cake walk. This school and the degree programs may not be for everyone, but it is definitely a great option for many! 

Here are those challenges again!  For those who may not be from Princeton but still intellectually sound!

A.  Will you help someone (help them completely) attend the University even if they cannot pay for it?

B.  Will you help them acclimatize themselves in the University environment?

C.  Will you help them with traveling from where they are to the University no matter where they may be?

D.  Will you help them with room and board?

E.  Will you help them with anything else they may require?

To:  AUTHOR: CaptK - Princeton (United States of America) who says

"The questions you pose are an attempt to redefine reputable to exclude all for-profit schools are non-reputable
by definition.  If that is your view, fine, no amount of debate will sway that."

These are what we call the intellectual panderings of a distractor that really are unintellectual in design, thought, reason, logic and argument that is full of eloquent yet illogical statements.  Had the contributor read which those at Princeton are supposed to do last I checked he would have come across this offer:

An Offer

AUTHOR: thomasfgibsonmph - fort lauderdale (United States of America)
SUBMITTED: Saturday, March 06, 2010

LT:

My offer to you...I will pay your tuition for one course. I have read your diatribe but am unsure as to your educational
level, so the course offered to you is either at the undergrad or grad level, depending on your educational accomplishments thus far. Course to be determined at my discretion, based upon your major or educational direction.

You agree to completing the 8 week course and then write another review. Fair enough?

Thomas F. Gibson MPH
APU Class of 2009

thomasgibsondmt@gmail.com
www.thomasfgibsonmph.com

I am therefore putting the American Military University AMU to the test-It is not a redefinement of someone's reputation that the Princeton illogical one speaks but a call for reinforcement of one's repiutation

You see reading is for those who are really the real intellectuals isn't it-I want to see if in my case this that the challenges will be met by the school.  No amount of talk or research that has been formerly spoken about concerns this issue with these challenges-It is about action (ACTION) and if any contributor wants to be full of talk which we have seen them do they are free to go right ahead.  Action is much more intellectually sound and of greater value to winning against an argument that deals with the reputation of an institution

...So the challenges are still up-American Military University AMU

...And the finger is still being pointed at you

...What are you going to do about it?

....What will you do in the end?

Your problem is your entire argument hinges on AMU funding education being inherently linked to reputability without providing any basis for the two being linked.  US News and World Report does not consider financial aid as one of their criteria, nor do the ARWU or the THE.  So why is it the end-all, be-all for you?  They are a business and making money, they are not a charity.  You seem to think that and providing a quality, reputable education is mutually exclusive yet have nothing to go with other than your animosity toward the for-profits (what, any school that won't hold your hand and pay your way through is irreputable? HA).  You apparently agree with the paranoid article posted earlier that wants to lump AMU in with Capella, Phoenix, and all the other crappy for profits out there simply because they fall under the same broad umbrella (even though, while playing a guilt-by-association game the author there still had to swallow hard and admit his source still spoke well of AMU throughout the article).  Again, exclusion by arbitrary redefinition is all you have to offer.

First, I am not a student, teacher, blogger, or in the service for  that matter; for AMU. Actually, I attend the UoP (I will be reporting  them(UoP) separately, in hopes of finding a lawyer to assist in forming a lawsuit against them) and have I been researching schools to transfer into. Also, I have not proof-read this comment nor will I go back and do so as I write it, so if it lacks in the tone, grammatical, or punctuation area I truly apologize. Right now I just want to say what I  need to say, and get the point across. (Just to let it be known, I excel in writing so if I wanted to apply it to this message, I could. Just in case"LT" has anything to say about me correcting their writing skills....and yes, I do say something)

So with that said, I have applied to Penn State, and have an extremely hard time receiving help from someone who works there. So, would you will say Penn State is a non-reputable school offering a worthless degree  program? Really, I have no reason to defend the AMU, I know nothing about it. I want to get this straight first, since LT seems to believe that only people that go, have, or work for this school would comment. Like I  said, I have been searching for negative comments about this school  because I do not want to make the same mistake twice when choosing a  college to transfer into. When I came across your "rip-off" report  honestly, I laughed. I laughed before I ever read the next comment, that is the truth. Then, I got angry because you are posting negative  comments about online education as a whole but have no experience or  education concerning the subject other than assumptions. I mean, your  opinion is not even valid. Online schooling is just now becoming better  accepted by employers. But because of people like you(there is a word)the whole process becomes scrutinized all over again. So people like me, who bust their butts academically for their online degree, have that hard work scrutinized or doubted because of people like you, we get highly upset. Especially when these comments are without valid substance! 

The worst part of the whole situation is that  you have no, I repeat, no first hand account of what you are complaining about. And, exactly what is your complaint or how did you get "ripped-off", I still do not understand. Truthfully, I don't know what  is going on with you but you have other issues concerning the subject  than what you're stating in this "rip-off" report. Unless you are a  bored and lonely person, who has nothing better to do than to go  "blogging" about a school, one that you have never attended or are sorry to say, but just plain crazy. I mean, do you know what rip-off means? Because quite honestly from your post, it seems you do not. I can only conclude that either you are completely uneducated or simply writing a "rip-off" report because you are at mad at something you will not state in this post.

Let me state this: People are attacking your grammar and punctuation  because it is ridiculous, really. My writing is not by any means perfect, but then again I'm not attempting to discredit a college and their incompetence in providing a "quality" education........ one yet,  that I have never attended myself. All of this while claiming to have so much education under your belt. That my friend, is why they are insulting your writing errors. I'm sorry but in case whatever esteemed university you attended did not teach you, how a person writes provides a reader with much information concerning their character. It speaks on their mentality, intelligence, attitude, their in general personna really. Stating thing like " He gets an "A" every time so I know his paper don't get read.  By the way he is a senior in AMU and don't even know how to  reference a paper using APA or MLA!

Their quizzes and tests are  all open book." does not say much for you or your character. You sound completely uneducated. Which in case you were not aware of this either, your character has a lot to do with how a person will view any statements you have or will make. So do your "friends" you are speaking on behalf of.......

On account of all the "big" words you chose to include within your last  comment. Please note this, it only makes you looks less intelligent when you use them attempting to make yourself look smarter. Half the words  in your other comment are not in the correct context, this is how one
can arrive at the conclusion that you searched for these "big" words  from dictionary; writing them in hopes of making yourself seem smarter. I am sorry if I am being callous when I say this, but if you are going to accuse a University of providing worthless education,  well.......Sorry, but you need to address whatever university that supplied you with your education, because you are the one who got "ripped-off" my friend. And again, I honestly do not understand how it is you got  ripped off exactly? You for one, are not a student, and for two never  were. 

What exactly gives you the insight that this school is a "rip-off" or that receiving an online education in general is somehow not the same, or less educational than  receiving one brick-to-mortar? First off, if you have not experienced an online education first hand, exactly how would you know if it lacks competence? I have to let you in on something. I hate the UoP oh and btw, in case your "expert in the field of college education" does not know what the UoP is, this is the University of Phoenix. Now, my sister  attends a respected, well known "traditional" college. I can tell you that at the UoP, I have four times the amount of work that she does. I have to adhere to strict APA guidelines as where she does not. She barely has to participate if ever, I do four times a week. She has told me out of her own mouth that my college is harder, her teachers are hardly as available as mine, and consists of a more academically challenging  program. I am talking about the program, not the work itself which also  is not as challenging. So for you to say online classes offer nothing close to what a "traditional" college does, you are completely wrong in this statement. 



Now as for your cheating friends, the hearsay, the only thing you have in attempt to "support" your claims.  If (which is a big if, Uop has "Turnitin") they are cheating; they are lazy, incompetent, and lack any intelligence to begin with; people not worth using as an example of the  quality of education. Also, you know what, in case you were unaware or from another planet, you can cheat at a traditional school. This is where cheating originated from....People do the same exact thing everyday in traditional colleges, I have seen it firsthand. So what is your point really? Your argument is made pointless and ignorant immediately, I'm  sorry. Also, one students experience never accounts for the whole planet in the sense of online schools.  

I do not understand many things about your post but what I really cannot understand is how you speak on something, you have no  education on besides hearsay. This is ignorant, plain and simple. Online schools, being it non for profit or for profit, depending on the school provide the same education as a brick to mortar college. For the most  part they adhere to some of the same coursework plus, a person can cheat anywhere. So for you to say the things you have said about online schooling, especially with absolutely no first hand experience, makes me angry and your IQ appear very low. Your demands are simply put, unintelligent. What exactly more do you want from the people commenting on your statement? They have answered your issues, repeatedly. However, you continue to repeat the same thing which btw is incorrect. If you are looking for a negative comment, is it possible that there is none as far as this website goes? I mean trust me, if this was a post about the UoP there would be about several hundred negative comments. So for you to say the only comments that would be posted regarding this comment are bias, speaks even more for your IQ. You need help. You are slandering a school, you have never attended, and have not paid any money to because what? They wouldn't accept you? The school is cheap, so you obviously know nothing about education nor did you pay for the one you say you have. What is your issue, really? Like I keep stating, your statements make no sense. You make no argument, no point, nothing.Again, how in the world did you even get ripped off? You repeatedly say people going to this school did/are, but they repeatedly argue the fact that they clearly did not/are not. Then you say that they are fake, and they are lying. Why exactly would one lie if the school in fact provided them with an unsatisfactory education or got "ripped off?" They aren't getting paid. I'm sure they would be more than angry, I am. I truly regret spending this  much time on your more than ignorant statement, as I'm sure did many of the other people. However, I really feel I needed to say what I had to say. 
   
Good luck to you and your endeavors LT, you sure are going to need it..












 

"A.  Will you help someone (help them completely) attend the University even if they cannot pay for it?"
Their target is military personnel per their mission, who receive TA up to $250/credit.  AMU charges $250/credit, ergo they meet this criteria for their target audience.  The masters degree is $275/credit, so you have to pay a whopping $75 per course, which if you are active military in a position to get a masters you can clearly afford that as well.  In addition, they provide undergrads with a book grant ensuring no out-of-pocket expenses there either (and most masters degree courses publish their materials online through the school library so no cost there either). 

"B.  Will you help them acclimatize themselves in the University environment?"
They require undergrads to take a course in computer skills and online interaction as part of their core curriculum if they are weak in this area (COLL100: http://www.amu.apus.edu/academic/schedule/course/coll100), and there are multiple tutorials available on using the course system through the university.  If you have a bachelors and are incapable of doing this, you probably can't even find the link to begin the application process for the MA so the point is moot.

"C.  Will you help them with traveling from where they are to the University no matter where they may be?"
University is online.  N/A

"D.  Will you help them with room and board?"
University is online.  N/A

"E.  Will you help them with anything else they may require?"
Alumni network?  Career Services?  All covered:
http://www.amu.apus.edu/community/meet-students/index.htm

Last I checked there were five (5) questions and they required five answers not 3 OUT OF 5 OR 4 OUT OF FIVE!

These five questions were questions that needed to become five action-oriented answers.  it has been claimed that this university is about money making well then they must also be about malicious practices as well and that the report is correct as has been correctly stated.  Let's see if that is indeed so!

Here are these five questions again:

A.  Will you help someone (help them completely) attend the University even if they cannot pay for it?

B.  Will you help them acclimatize themselves in the University environment?

C.  Will you help them with traveling from where they are to the University no matter where they may be?

D.  Will you help them with room and board?

E.  Will you help them with anything else they may require?

Let's hope that your answers become actions as well.  Talk is cheap and actions speak louder than words and your talk is not redeeming you so far from the reputation that this report has seemingly placed upon this University.  Let us therefore see what your ACTIONS will be our so-called nonmalicious Military University?  Talk is Cheap.  Actions Speak Louder than Words and these are FIVE questions that Require FIVE Actions!  Let us see how action-oriented you really are!

Look again, CaptK answered all 5 of your questions. Maybe you need to rethink what you are asking. What does room and board have to do with an online school? Travelling to the university? Are you serious? You tell us how much it costs
to "travel" to the internet. Acclimatize to the University environment? What does this even mean? Are you talking about basic computer skills like using a mouse and keyboard?  Your first question is so absurd it's useless. The value of a school isn't in whether someone would pay someone else's tuition. That's called charity my friend. The true measure of value is whether people will use their own hard earned money to pay their own tuition, and every year more and more people do just that. Both you and "LT" Max amaze me. You post these comments that have nothing to do with the actual school, I think you have missed the whole point of this website.

AMU is a great school, especially for those not fortunate enough to have the free time to attend a traditional campus. The classes are challenging and the professors are readily available, even when many of them are in a different state then their students. The tuition is reasonable, and there are a vast amount of online resources available for free to every student.

Tell that someone you know who wants to attend AMU to do what everyone else has done. Take care of your own business. If you need help then figure out how to get it. If you can't handle that one simple task of personal responsibility then maybe the rigors of earning an academic degree aren't for you.

Three of five are answered because they are all that apply, by the schools mission and target audience.  If you want help getting to the Univeristy, here you go, I will take you there myself: www.amu.apus.edu.  If you want room and board then sorry, this university is not for you,  nor would be a community college, a commuter campus, or any number of other institutions.  It is targeted for mid-career professionals who work full time, not for people straight out of high school for full time.

I cannot attest to the original poster's comments, but I can say that I have been trying to become a student at AMU for over a month.  I cannot get the “new student advisor” or financial aid to return phone calls or e-mails so I can only imagine what the quality of the education will be.  AMU is notorious for having booths at military trade shows and other locations where they can prey on veterans, so all I can say is beware.

As a UOP alumnus, I can tell you that some online universities like UOP know how to get your money but that’s about all.  I’ve been shopping for a real online university and have yet to find one, although Capella is in the lead.  If you are looking for a real education, go to a real university.  If you are simply looking to buy a degree I am sure they are all about the same.

Yet again a comment is posted here from someone who has not actually attended the school. This website is called Ripoff Report. If you have never attended the school or given them money, how have they ripped you off? I have never had a problem contacting the school. They have always been quick to answer emails and when I called I was always able to talk to someone.

I hope in the future someone who has actually done business with the school will post about how they were ripped off. I actually have attended the school. I earned my Master's Degree, and I am returning to work on a Graduate Certificate program since you can't do much else in the winter anyways, and the classes were terriffic. It's a great, affordable school. The professors are easy to reach (for those who actually have enrolled in a course), and the free resources available are outstanding. If you need tuition assistance there are links all over the site on how to get it. If you have military tuition assistance available there is also a lot of help available on how to use it towards tuition. Somehow every other student has managed to figure it out, it's really not that hard.

I am a current student at APU/AMU, and have been taking courses for 2 years now.  I also work full time.  The majority of what this first negative poster said is not true.  I will be the first to admit that some of the courses were too easy.   However, I have taken courses at a brick and mortar university that were equally as easy.  With that said, online schools are truly what the student puts into them.  The material at APU/AMU is very good.  I'm in the midst of finishing up an IT degree, and we have covered very relevant information.  Yes, I probably could have squeaked by with a C- in most courses by doing minimal amounts of work.  But,  I chose not to, and put a tremendous amount of time into learning the material. 

In terms of the instructors, most of them do a very good job.  I did take 2 classes with instructors that I was very disappointed with, simply because there wasn't much interaction.  However, even in those classes, the material was still high quality.  And, I've been lucky enough to have had a couple excellent instructors in most of my major courses. 

The fact that the school is for-profit is completely irrelevant.  Why people find that shocking is beyond me.  Is it shocking that a company as successful and revolutionary as Apple is for profit?  What if they weren't for profit.  Then what?  I'll tell you what, they'd cease providing great products and services.  They would no longer have the best and brightest people employed.  An online school is no different.   By working for a profit, an online school will continue to ensure that the material is current and up to date, and that they do what it takes to retain their students. 

I agree that an online degree may not be as great as a traditional brick and mortar university degree.  However, many adults are unable to quit their job and go to a typical university.   The online degree is what you make of it, and in my opinion, getting one from APU/AMU is as good as any online degree. 

I would like to respond to the "shoppers" out there who are wisely attempting to make an informed decision about distance education. First, I would like to qualify that I am a grad student of APU, secondly I would like to state that I also attended graduate school and received my bachelor's degree from an accredited Research 1 institution (if you don't know what that is, look it up, but basically it means research money galore) brick and mortar school. AMU/APU has the EXACT same accreditation as the University I attended.

You posters who are looking for valid information about the school should be advised that AMU/APU is a school that is especially targeted to working adults and the military. The set up is very self-motivated and not at all easy so beware if you expect to skate by. You have to know how to manage your time without a class schedule or you will find the work piling up. What you were really looking for, however, were some negative comments about the school from a current or former student. I will share mine with you.

First of all, I receive federal financial aid and I think it takes them way too long to send credit balances back, but that is a personal opinion. They have programs in place that provide texts for undergrads, but not for grads. Getting my financial aid early on would have made purchasing books easier for me in the beginning, but my advisor gave me a great suggestion that helped a lot. The classrooms have been slowly transferring to a new system and as the changes are in full force logging in sometimes can be difficult due to technical issues. The university has been very apologetic and accomodating extending due dates to ease the pain of the transfer.

I have had all those problems and more at my traditional school, but those kinds of issues are par for the course. Absolutely nobody is perfect. I agree with the statement that you only get out what you put in. If you are concerned about accreditation or whether your degree will be accepted anywhere consider what your goals are before making a choice. I am planning to move on to a Ph.D. program when I finish my masters so I wanted to make sure that APU shares accreditations with the schools I am interested in applying to, and they do. I work full time, am prior military, and I have a family so this decision was quite easy for me. If you are truly worried about the quality of your education and you can afford it, take a class in each type of campus and get a feel for what works for you yourself. Needlessly bashing any type of institution isn't productive or helpful.

I'm sorry if the negative comments you were looking for were related to the quality of the education. I have absolutely nothing to say in that regard. I have had real life professors that I barely saw and had no interest in working with students, and were only motivated to pursue their publishing agenda. That was quite frequently clear by the direction our discussions would take in class. I had one professor go as far to say that we were going to help him with his research during the semester by focussing the classes discussions in his biased direction. I have never experienced such thing at APU and the faculty are very abreast in current research. I loved my traditional campus experience, but I am very satisfied with my online experience as well.

I am NOT being paid by any organization to post this report. LT, were you paid by someone who is perhaps a competitor of AMU/APU? UofP perhaps? Kaplan? If you are offended by that statement and still wonder why other posters have responded negatively to you, then that my friend, should be the final nail in your coffin.

I am in the middle of registering for APU- I was worried, would my MA in History be respected when I was done? Would it be worth my time? I read your report and realized 1) You have no understanding of the English Language and 2) You have no understanding of research and how to write a well- formed essay.

That being said- I am aghast that you say "don't listen to anyone who goes there." Why not? If you start at a school, and discover it is not up to par- you transfer out. I started my masters at a BM University that was creating an online program. I realized that their program was very much like the one you described- I finished the course I started and didn't take any more. You don't keep attending a bad university. Not if you are a serious student. The former and current students who have posted are very well spoken. They "sound" educated- which is more than I can say for the OP. While this could be misleading, having over 30 people post with this caliber of vocabulary and grammar says something good for the school.

I earned my BS in Education from a traditional BM College- two actually. And as an educator, let me explain something to you- There is something called Depth of Knowledge. The most basic questions are recall- these are questions like "When Did the Civil War Start?" For questions such as these- an open book test is ridiculous because all the answers are in the book. There are more complex questions such as, "Was Ophelia's suicide in Hamlet an act of desperation of liberation? Support your answer with quotes from the text." These types of Essay questions require open book tests because you cannot find the answer to these questions in the book- you must take information and justify your opinion using the author's facts. Any Masters program that operated solely using questions of the first variety would be doing a disservice to its students. If I can find the answers in a book- why do I need to take a class? I want to learn how to think- not how to read.

Now- for those of you who defended APU/AMU- thank you. You have eased my mind quite a bit. I have more faith that the degree(s) I will earn from this University will be accepted and respected in the future.

I live in Rural Arkansas. If I wish to pursue a Tertiary degree I must either move, which I have no desire to do, or look online. This program is less expensive, and more rigorous than most others I have explored. It has been around longer, and is regionally accredited- something most online schools have yet to achieve. Thank you for helping me make my decision to become a proud APU student.

Just finished reading the posting regarding AMU.  First I'd like to say is that any educational experience is what an individual makes of it. It doesn't have to be in a classroom setting, it could in the woods, field or out on the street. Second, this guy makes a statement based upon here say, really? That in itself eliminates this individuals integrity. It sounds, more than likely, that he applied and didn't get in.

Based on my PERSONAL experience at the university I have to state that it has not only been challenging but an extremely rewarding experience that takes a lot of work. Each one of my classes requires at least one 3-5 page paper per week, a final paper (15-17 pages) and a well researched forum response.

This program is not only accredited but recognized by numerous government agencies. In addition, the cost is more reasonable, especially on the Master's level than many other well known universities. I would highly recommend this university to assist one with their educational endeavors.

The critic of AMU has contributed exactly ZERO objective logical, factual or empirically supported arguments against AMU.

Hence -- 'Where's the Beef?'

Indeed, the only supporting citation was a screed from anti-capitalist anti-militarist wikileaks founder Julian Assange that amusingly contains exactly ZERO objective logical, factual or empirically supported arguments against AMU.

In fact, in Assange's rant, he actually acknowledges that AMU was the recipient of North Central accreditation that supports my assertion that AMU provides an education equivalent (if not superior too) traditional 'brick and mortar' institutions.

In sum, it is all too obvious that the originator of this fallacious thread is simply an anti-capitalist with an ideological 'axe to grind'  against any and all private firms, particularly those firms that are now undermining the government monopoly on higher education.

In fact, I challenge this ideologue to declare which system he/she believes is superior --- private education or public education?   Moreover, support your arguments with fact and logic.

This AMU grad will enjoy dissecting and toppling the ideological 'house of cards' that Ltmax's (sic) views are built on.

I was doing a bit of research for my dad (USAF Ret.) and ran across this thread.  Some of the posts are funny while others, not so much.  First thanks to everyone serving for your service.  

About me: 
I have a BS from a large state school.
I attended UoP (for-profit) for a year.
I attended 3 different community colleges (one online).
I'm currently in my last semester at a top 10 law school.

I'm currently enrolled in 14 credits, 7 of which are pass/fail (read: grades don't matter).
When I graduate in May, I'll have $150,000 in student loans, the median for my class is almost $90,000.
Tuition is close to $50,000/year and with cost of living almost $75,000/year.
30% of my classmates are still unemployed and will be at graduation.
I've taken multiple 8 week classes (corporate finance, medical product patents, business strategy, to name a few).
The school offers 4 week classes as well. 

Half of my exams have been open-book and my worst grade was on an open book test.

Sounds like AMU is a better deal than my law school (or most any law school if you listen to the NYTimes).  And unfortunately, every criticism of AMU can be made about any law school and most "real" universities (whatever that means). Adjunct professors (not full-time) are the wave of the future because of budget cuts.  Shorter classes allow students to check out a wider-range of curriculum.  As for whether degrees from for-profit schools get you far?  A couple of years back when I was attending UoP, I looked up the top 10 law schools and found 4 had admitted students from UoP.  

Okay, but enough about me.  If you're in the military and looking to earn your first degree or second or third, d**n commendable.  AMU is accredited, it's paid for, it's flexible, and it meets your needs.  

And finally, as to the original poster, I've been wondering why someone would go to the trouble of writing something that lacks such substance.  Between the inability to form logical arguments and grammar that reminds me of middle schoolers I taught english to in asia, he could just be bitter he wasn't accepted to AMU. 

I feel compelled to respond to the original posting which portrays AMU in an extremely bad light.  This person, while admittedly not a person with direct knowledge of AMU, claims the quality of education at AMU to be substandard.  I dispute this entirely erroneous assertion.  On a side note, I have not read the other posts and apologize if my post is repetitive in nature.

I graduated from AMU and am currently set to graduate from Northwestern University (NU) at the end of this semester, Summa Cum Laude, from one of their master's programs.  NU, a school ranked number 15 among private institutions, accepted my degree granted by AMU.  I suggest that NU is much more knowledgeable of academic standards and quality than the original poster.  Therefore, while I am sure the original poster had some motive for posting negatively about AMU, one should not rely on that viewpoint as the truth, nor anywhere close to the truth.

So you thin AMU is so terrible and that it is not a real University. First off maybe you need to check on your own grammar. Your last paragraph sounded like a drunk angry hillbilly that cant get a degree. Maybe AMU does not have all of the luxuries of education that a major 4 year university does but it is a great stepping stone. Yes they do give you credit for military training and that is not a bad thing. I know for myself i spent a year in a technical training environment to get my job in the military. I do belive my military training is deffinetly worth college credits. Especially considering that I work with very high tech electronics and I use math everyday. Being that i am military and I have spent half my career deployed it is a little difficult to attend a college stateside. Most of the students who attend AMU plan on furthring thier education at a regular state university when they finish thier degree online. I have tried to go to major universities in the past online and it doesnt work well for military personel, especially while deployed. We cant exactly be online monday morning at 9 a.m. and have a live discussion. I dont really know what this college did to you personally for you to bash it like this but its sad. Maybe you are just a psudeo intellectual who needs others like yourself around to feel smart. I have a suggestion for you. If you dont like the school than dont go there, too easy. As for your friends who are there and getting degrees, good for them for making a step forward to thier future. Oh and by the way, before the military I was a succsesful business owner, and no I didnt join because I failed at my business. It was a personal choice. In the REAL business world over 70% of all that major university knowledge is not used. A degree is still only a peice of paper and belive it or not most companies dont care where it came from.

Wow!  I have been on the fence for a couple weeks about getting my MBA from AMU, but after reading the 20+ alumni rebuttals I've made my decision.  Thank you guys for talking in detail about your experience at AMU.  I believe you just saved me about $70,000 in student loans.  :)

Looking forward to graduating from this great institution in 2014, 

-Carlos

I am in a new program, Reverse Logistics.  AMU is the first institution offering a degree program focusing on returns, how to minimize waste, recapturing value whether it be through secondary markets, braking down and re-utilizing parts, or final disposition in compliance with state or federal laws.  The program is also covering global commerce supply focusing on the strict European product and packaging laws that require specific percentages of consumer goods and packaging be recycled.

This program at the undergraduate level is like nothing I ever experienced academically and is a rough road, but worth it.  The professionals I connect with in the supply chain field are brainstorming new solutions to better ways of doing business.

Tomorrow is a Virtual Open House and I encourage folks to check it out.   It is the best value at the lowest cost and more importantly, I am getting solid interviews and currently await an offer letter in the mail for a position as a direct result of my studies.  

http://www.amu.apus.edu/lp2/virtual-open-house

I just wanted to write a response to the initial poster. While I know my grammer isn't perfect, I don't type like an eastern European immigrant who pretends his English is flawless. Now that that's out of the way...

I have attended AMU and yes, the classes are pretty easy. However, as an International Relations major the courses were pretty intense and ALL of the papers we wrote had to be formatted in either an APA or MLA format. There were some very interesting topics discussed during the group chats and I feel the level of education for what you pay is pretty good (most of it was paid for by the government...your welcome). I have also taken classes at community and state colleges in Massachusetts as well as private schools in Pennsylvania and Massachusetts. Allow me to be arrogant for a minute but the professors at some of the MA state schools are of a higher pedigree than those in other state schools throughout the country, it is what it is. However, most of the courses at AMU were more difficult than the courses I took at the other schools. This school isn't Harvard or MIT, but let's be honest, the students aren't at a Harvard or MIT level either. It is fully accredited so the degree is legit.
This school works well with educational officers in various branches of public service. It's a good fit for those who are soldiers and can't take traditional classes. Thus the name.

Sean,

Please elaborate as you initially stated that the courses were easy and then you stated that the work was challenging. The course work is not easy, as I had to write several lengthy papers for each course and write a weekly response to a posted question, along with followup to fellow students.  I spent, on average, 6+ hours per day, 5 days a week on three simultaneous courses [midway through one and start two new]and at least 10 hours on Sat & Sun reading and cleaning up my papers. 

The workload gave me a very specific educational time-managed mindset. Subsequently, I started a doctoral program almost immediately after finishing APU, and I was able to compete on an extremely effective level with the brightest minds in our nation. Less than 5% of the world gets a Masters degree; I am still trying to find the % for a doctorate! I suspect that it is less than 0.1%. APU was arduous, economical and an excellent preparation for the real world. I finished APU with a 3.9725 GPA...I was welcomed into the doctoral program with open arms!!! Currently holding a 3.84 GPA and finish in June with a DHSc.

Tom

Who Cares:  You All Are Still Corrupt

I see that you all did not take up the challenge that was posted by someone here.  This unwillingness begs us to believe the report because although the poster may not mind you have attended the institution it does not mean that he is not right is highlighting the potential possibility for there to be corruption with this institution.

No place is 100% perfect any where regardless as to what individual "experienced" individuals says (who like to write long posts rather than short ones because it seems that their training did not cater for such) because they are only seeing everything from one side of the story-their side and not all the time from every single angle.

With that in mind:  We can say with 100% Belief  that you All Can Most Definitely Still Be Corrupt.

Your need for a short statement is noted so here it is...

The absence of proof is not proof itself especially when there is proof to the contrary. Your assertion that "We can say with 100% Belief that you All Can Most Definitely Still Be Corrupt" has no basis. To briefly elaborate beyond my first statement, you use "belief," belief is an ambiguous term which does not have to be based on fact, but merely feelings. The original complaint revolved around hearsay which is not fact (it is neither proven or generally available for inspection). Therefore, "...100% Belief..." is a baseless ambiguous statement as is the rest of your drivel. Get a real education that includes some critical thinking skills, because what you present illustrates you have none. 

Bangor:

Please elaborate as to the specific challenge to which you are referring. Additionally, your repeated use of double and triple negatives makes for a very difficult read. Furthermore, to whom are you referring as being corrupt?

Also, referring to the original post, please reiterate the economic principles upon which you quizzed your friend; I am interested to see if I know the answer as well. Also, Wikipedia, while an interesting place to gain common information, is never to be used as a reference as it is subject to open editorialization. This information is well publicized at the school. Anyone stating to the contrary is wrong or a liar.

 Also, brick and mortar universities employ part time instructors as well. I know this for a fact, because I am employed at one, as a part-time adjunct professor, teaching the Chemistry of Hazardous Materials.

Please respond with sincere questions and well written, grammatically correct answers; for doing so would actually help to establish your credibility and academic standing.



Tom

I want to be completely honest, so I am disclosing that while I am not yet an APUS student, I intend to enroll there as a graduate student.  It will be my second Masters with the first being conferred upon me by SUNY Stony Brook.  I also have two friends who are attending this school and who I consulted prior to seeking admission (one having received his bachelors from AMU and is now attending a graduate program there and the other who just began a graduate program with APU).  However, I do not need to include their opinions in my response to your report, as it is simply unnecessary with regards to the focus of my rebuttal.  I am more interested with the way your conducted your assessment and your argument in general than I am with your review.

I take issue with the assertion that the students of APUS cannot be trusted; without evidence, it is just as fair to assume that you too cannot be trusted.  To the same poster who insists of trying to make an argument with flashy pictures, the same argument applies and you are just as likely a  fraud. We might make an assumption that any student at any university or college would attempt to defend his or her school so that their degree might mean something later on.  Though, it is a rather ridiculous argument because the reputation of that school will be based upon the quality of their graduates (based upon performance and knowledge) and not opinions.  We could apply this to the
corporate world:  Not every employee is happy and not every employee will sing their employers praises simply so that when they apply for another job, their resume seems more important.  In fact, one of the main reasons people leave jobs is because they do not like their current situation.   You do not have to take my opinion on that, you can simply perform a little research to validate my assertion.  I considered citing the material, but you’d probably demonize me for criticizing you.  After all, semantics suggest that you think that only you are allowed to criticize and anyone who disagrees with you is lying.  Of course, you did cast the first stone in your first paragraph saying, “their comments and recommendations are bias.”  Again, as much as you might charge that the subsequent rebuttals are unfounded and biased, you are no better.  In addition, your report is simply hearsay if only because you readily admit that you are not a student.  Further, your only accounts are from a handful of “students” who are described, by you, to be the picture of dishonesty.  You expect the readers to take you seriously when you’re citing a bunch of cheats who are plagiarizing and cheating their way through school?  I also find that difficult to believe as online and “traditional” schools utilize services such as TurnItIn or SafeAssign to prevent plagiarism (my school used SafeAssign even when I was in a “brick and mortar” classroom).

In addition to the above, the author claims that no one is responding to his real argument and  merely attacking his grammar in an effort to discredit him.  Again, did you not first attack every student and professor by referring to them as bias?  Your argument against the quality of an APUS education is, whether you recognize it or not, supported by your ability to identify a “quality education”.  If you had received a quality college education, which might give you the credentials to recognize the same, you would have these basic skills.  Before I could graduate with an undergraduate degree, I had to submit a portfolio of my writing to prove that I reached a level of competency that is expected of a graduate.  As such, your ability (or lack thereof) to write a well written essay or report that is both organized and backed by research would be not only a valid criticism, but apparently your Achilles’ Heel.  Or, perhaps you simply do not care about being taken seriously?

APUS may not provide the best education in the country, but education is often what you make of it.  The original review/report and as well as the responses by the lunatic (personal opinion only) with the pictures, are meaningless.  You are entitled to your opinion whether you’ve conducted research to back your argument or not and everyone else is entitled to disagree with you.   The only real differences is that your assertions are hearsay (being that you admit to having never attended the school and are receiving your information second hand from a bunch of cheats) and everyone else at least claims to be responding based upon first-hand experiences.

Frankly, I find you insulting towards those that bothered to respond with well written and thoughtful rebuttals.  I did not even consider replying until I read your response to the professor.  We have no proof that he (or she) is actually a professor, but without any evidence to the contrary I will assume that the assertion is true.  Either way, your remarks were marked with insolence, especially for someone who appears to have absolutely no credentials which would provide them with the necessary proficiency to critique an entire higher education system and a college professor.

Try exploring the concept of humility; it is a priceless quality and we can all benefit from it.

Sadly, I have already wasted too much time on something that is likely fall on deaf ears (a conclusion based upon your responses to some very well written rebuttals).

The “challenge” is not so much a real discussion point but a completely ridiculous waste of everyone’s time. Basically someone (who has probably not attended AMU) stated that if the school is a good as people say it is, then current or former students would be willing to pay someone else’s tuition. I felt like I missed something the first time I read that, and still don’t know how charity relates to the quality of AMU. The challenge also mentioned things like helping a potential student travel to the university, and “acclimatize to the university environment”. Who knows what this means, especially since this is an online school we are talking about. The rest of the “challenge” isn’t even worth repeating. However, if anyone reading this can tell me how to get to the internet that would be very helpful.
 
Many of the posts here are from people who have never even attended AMU. Based on their use of the English language they probably would have failed out anyways. The following are from Bangor in earlier posts and highlight the level of ineptitude that is cluttering up this post.
 
“I see that you all did not take up the challenge that was posted by someone here.  This unwillingness begs us to believe the report because although the poster may not mind you have attended the institution it does not mean that he is not right is highlighting the potential possibility for there to be corruption with this institution.”
 
-What does this even mean?

"No place is 100% perfect any where regardless as to what individual "experienced" individuals says (who like to write long posts rather than short ones because it seems that their training did not cater for such) because they are only seeing everything from one side of the story-their side and not all the time from every single angle."
 
-Never has such a long sentence conveyed such little information. This sounds like it was badly written in another language and was then poorly translated into English.
 
I would like to one day see an intelligent, well-written post describing how AMU is a rip-off.

I have little time at present to address the absurdity that is the original post.  However, I will briefly reply simply as a non-AMU-student who read many of these comments whilst searching for information on APU/AMU.

To those who have replied honestly from experience at AMU/APU, thank you.  Your posts were exceedingly informative.

LT, the following is not an ad hominem attack:
An "ad hominem", meaning "to the man", attack is not considered a logical fallacy, but simply irrelevant information in a discussion on the validity of a subject. 

To continue:  For what purpose have you filed, and followed, your report for such a long period of time?  It would seem to me that if the issue at hand were of such great import to thyself, that thou wouldst impart more energy into making it appear credible. 

Let us follow your established line of logic from the original post:
You use your friends as references, unidentified and non-categorized.  Then you claim that your "observations" of said friends constitute a viable summary of the quality of education at AMU.  Not only is this poor statistical practice, but it is severely lacking objectivity; something you claim to seek.  If we were to apply the same method of thinking to anything else, such as yourself, we run into a number of problems.  We will consider your posts the "friends" in our example.  Any number of people could take away the following from only your original post:

1)Arrogance
2)Lack of objectivity
3)Immaturity
4)A lack of education
5)A lack of attention to detail
6)Ignorance that previously stated detail should even exist.
7)Unstated, yet deeply seated, anger.

Now, LT, are any of the above true?  Should we believe your "first hand" response or our unbiased observations of the "friends" i.e. your post(s)?  We may easily draw incorrect conclusions from our small sample size in what is a biased environment.  However, I believe that the following would be a reasonable speculation:  Based upon our observations of your writing structure, the language used, the tones conveyed, and the real-life friends referenced, we can assume any number of the above listed qualities AND since the friends mentioned are your friends, our sample must be biased in environment.  It is the tendency of people to gather in groups that are similar.  Those who care nothing for attention to detail will find it difficult to interact regularly with those who do.  Likewise, those who are driven to excel in academia will rarely find their way to spend significant amounts of time with those who do not.

Since we have a reasonable idea that an online course is more oriented toward an input=output venue on an individual basis than an in-classroom course may be and your friends, by your account, are not inputting very much, it is likely that 1) they are not getting much output and 2) you are similar.

LT, you may consider that a personal attack if you wish, but it is nothing more than observation of the situation and application of statistical and social likelihoods.

Now for some other interesting points:
You claim multiple times that the issues you mention are never addressed and simply substituted with personal attacks.  This is utterly false and even a cursory reading of the first several rebuttals will yield otherwise.
You establish that it is

"True some of the instructors are probably experienced people in their fields working full times. They don't have the time to be full time teachers like real universities.  They are there for the easy paycheck not the passion to teach."

Yet you then accuse an admitted instructor and employee of AMU/APU that he is simply attempting to save his job and organization.  If the instructor is an experienced professional, which you allow for, and the given credentials of the instructor are not false, this person would likely have little trouble finding an occupation elsewhere, likely for a higher wage.

Your responses also show a complete lack of understanding of the purpose of this site.  You appear to be bent upon simply standing as a wall in the face of seemingly honest rebuttals, rather than attempting to establish the possible bias of your own claims, which are deep and subtle, despite your statement to the contrary. 

Second to last, it is heinously obvious that you have never taken a timed, well-written, open-book exam.  Being able to synthesize book, lecture, homework, and research material on in-depth questions regarding specific applications cannot be automatically assigned a label of "easy".

Finally, stop wallowing in your own ignorance and educate yourself or attempt to get an education.  If I were you, I would begin with the rudiments of the English language.  <--(ad hominem attack)

I would like to start off by thank all who has given a rebuttal to this nonsense.  It sounds like there is some underlining objective with the original author of the article.  For one, this is coming from someone who has not a clue on how to research higher learning schools.  A school is not going to be regionally and nationally accredited, which is the same accrediations of Harvard, Yale, Princeton, all Ivy league schools.  Oh, and just to let the author know, Harvard, Yale and Princeton are all private universities, which means for-profit.  All schools are for profit.  They are not giving their name and degrees away for free.  That is why if someone transfers to another school the school makes it a point that the student has to have a certain number of credited hours at that school in their degree program.  That amount of hours is usually around 30 hours, which is roughly around 10 classes.  Which brings me to my next point.  Tuition is not that high for an online university.  It is actually cheaper than regular ground tuition.  If you would like to see what high tuition looks like then research all the States major universities and compare them with the online universities.  Also, just about all state university systems have online eductation programs.  Why?, do you ask?  To make more money, add more admissions, and add more student body count.  I went to AMU, but no longer wanted the degree I was persuing.  The degree I now seek is in Christian Pastoral Leadership and Christian Studies.  American Military University does not have this, so I had to go else where.  I am currently at Grand Canyon Univeristy, a Christian based for-profit University.   AMU is a very good school and has been the #2 online university throughout the world for 4 years running. 

As far as, the books.  The government gives a grant to most universities for military students to receive free books.  Why not. We ( I am a veteran) have made many sacrifices for the people of this country.  Honestly, all veterans deserve more than what we get.  The book buy back is just like any and all schools.  It is optional.  Most schools use a company that buys the books.  That money does not go to the schools.  The schools are just helping out their students by allowing them to get rid of unwanted books. 

So, it sounds like this person has a total bias against AMU with no factual evidence on the author's behalf. 

Having attended Bellevue University (non-profit) and obtaining a Bachelor of Science in Business Administration and attended AMU and received a Bachelor of Arts in International Relations, I can say for certain that AMU is comparable.

I have attempted to take a Cyber Security program at Utica College and I found them to be unorganized, the instructors unclear with their instructions in comparison to Bellevue and AMU and extremely expensive. Then there is the fact that AMU is regionally accredited, so no, there is no scam.

I am not sure if you are writing just to provoke a response but if your friend does actually exist, I truly can’t believe your story regarding the submitted paper. First of all, why would anyone sabotage their own education? Then there is the fact that when I started I have been docked several points for using the wrong citation in a paper, APA instead of Turabian/Chicago...  

Your post will most likely cause many to lose out on a quality education. If you are trying to promote non-profit schools for whatever reason, then hopefully the person that reads this will give Bellevue a try, but I assure you, AMU is not a scam, it is not easy, in fact harder than the in-classroom experience that I had in Community College.

 

LTmax I originally read your posting over a year ago, before I enrolled in a Graduate program at AMU.  First I have to say after reading your article I decided to actually do some research into AMU.  Your report is the most in depth negative review about this university (which you did not attend).  Most of the negative reviews had to deal with complaints about the finance department, you will find them at any school.  The finance department is not a representation of how the academic program of the school is.  So not to your complaints:

"I'm not a student of AMU, because for profit universities have an interest not for quality of education but rather profits."  
I am guessing you have never been to college because every collie only cares about one thing and that is the money, without the money they would have to close their doors.

"Classes are about 8 weeks long, with very few being 16 weeks long."
The main reason for 8 week semesters is because the majority of on-line students actually work full-time.  The 8-week system is designed for students to take two courses every 8 weeks.  That equals the four classes that a student at many traditional universities take during their 16 week semesters.  That also explains why the classes are a little bit easier because the overall work load is reduced 2 classes instead of four.

"The curriculum is a joke." Please explain your reasoning for saying this.  Your ad talks about the use of discussion boards.  Those discussions are based on the assigned reading, or course work for that week.  The discussions require students to have completed the assignment in order to answer the questions.  Then students have to respond to fellow students, again not just stating "I agree".  Posts also have to include references from other sources, meaning that research from reputable scholarly sources have to be used.
"The instructors hardly instruct."  Whats your evidence on this?  I have taken courses at traditional universities where the classes were taught by a professors Graduate Assistant, not the professor himself.  As far as them not having participation you are wrong, based on my personal experience in my classes any questions to the instructor were promptly answered.  My instructors also provided other contact information to students including personal telephone numbers, non-campus email, etc.  The online University I received my BA from the instructors regularly held online chat groups weekly that students could attend.
"They don't have the time to be full time teachers like real universities."  Many Universities do not employ full time professors for a variety of reasons.  I personally know a professor who teaches Part-Time at numerous colleges at the same time.  He teaches at Temple, Penn State, UPenn, BCCC.  
"HIGH tuition"  Bullsh*t!  250 a credit is not high tuition for an underrate program, and 375 a credit is not high tuition for a grad program.
"Some classes usually require a paper to write.  Since instructors are not really there to teach, they leave it up to the students to pick a subject.  One of my friends, submits the same paper for every class every semester."  AMU like many traditional and other online universities used Turnitin.com.  Turnitin.com is a plagiarism website that checks the paper and provides a report showing similarities with other papers.  If your friend is turning in the same paper multiple times I find it interesting because I have never taken courses where I could even turn in a paper that was similar and turnitin would flag it.
"Their quizzes and tests are all open book"  many schools use open book testing.  Open book tests are actually written to be more challenging.  The tests all have time limits, if you have not done the assignments that were assigned before the exam then your time limit will expire prior to test being completed.  If you have done the assignment then you do not need to use the book, or you know exactly where in the assigned readings you can find the answer.  

To This is The Truth:
A.  Will you help someone (help them completely) attend the University even if they cannot pay for it?  No, and neither will any other college or university on the planet.  The school will assist you in applying for financial aide, but a college education is not free.

B.  Will you help them acclimatize themselves in the University environment?  AMU is an online university and provides tutorials on how to navigate their classes.

C.  Will you help them with traveling from where they are to the University no matter where they may be?  No, no college will pay for your transportation.  But since AMU is an online university no traveling is required

D.  Will you help them with room and board?  No,  again no college or university will provide you with free room and board.  Again since this is an online university you can stay with your family if you choose to.

E.  Will you help them with anything else they may require?  Help with other things yes, financially no!

Your questions are friggin retarded!  I challenge you to answer my one question.
1) Provide a list of colleges and Universities that provide anything to students for free.

One of the other complaints that you seem to suggest is one of the evils of AMU is its open book tests. I can say from experience that it isn't as easy as you may think. For the most part, the questions have been essays with the desire for you to use the book as a reference.

Anyone here, that believes that AMU is a get a degree quick scam will be in for a rude awakening. This is a serious institution with serious expectations. You will be very irritated when you discover that you have failed and lost your tuition due to stupidity.

As for enrollment, you should have an education plan where you can easily click on your class that you need to accomplish your degree and follow the instructions from there. Enrolling has never been easier in anyother institution that I have attended. In fact that is the easiest part of the school.

I am not a graduate of AMU nor am I a current student.  I am however a senior executive with a prime defense contractor with a primary focus on staffing our current CONUS and OCONUS contracts.  I have interviewed a number of AMU and APU graduates and have in just about every occasion found them to be very good candidates for our jobs.  What I have found by hiring these graduates is that they tend to be able to adapt and refocus on ever changing requirements.  While I understand that much of this is a result of their prior military I also believe much of it also has to to with the non tradition way that they are taught.  The writer references the open book tests.  I am looking for people on my team that can react quickly and find the right answer and not a canned answer that was given to me by a professor.  Additionally I expect that anyone that I send out is going to use whatever information is at his or her disposal to make sure the mission is completed on time.  I don't care where or how they get the information as long as the mission is on time.  Much of the rest of "LT's" comments are discredited because this person openly says that he has no first hand knowledge but only that of his "friends".  I would suspect that "LT" is on this site to foment discourse and really has no intelligent information to add.  The fact that this person went for so long between posts suggests to me that they were not here out of indignation of AMU but more as a way to get under the skin of prior military. 

As I said, I never went to AMU so I have no dog in this hunt but I have found graduates of the AMU program to be very well educated, extremely adaptable and very creative when it comes to getting the job done.  Bravo Zulu to AMU for the program that you have developed and I wouldn't change a thing because one person doesn't see the value of a flexible learning program.

Tom,

The courses are easy in the fact that the professors are forgiving to unforseen events and the circumstances surrounding ones employment. While you are required to do the work, the professors will often give you sme extra time and not adhere to such strict guidelines as I have seen in traditional schools.

As an example, while deployed overseas I was also enrolled in a couple of classes. If we had a lot of missions back to back the professors (for the most part) would give me a break and allow me a few extra days to finish any work that was due. There wasn't the stress of contantly having to show up to class and losing points for attendance that I hate about traditional schools.
Hope that helps.

After reading this report, my mind is made up - I'm applying to American Public University as soon as I finish posting this rebuttal!

This officially being a rebuttal, allow me to rebutt a few of the original poster's points:

1.  APU/AMU is a private for-profit university, yet their tuition, including books, is substantially less than those of a private "non-profit" university.  Their tuition is comparable to, and sometimes even less then, public "non-profit" universities.

2.  APU/AMU is REGIONALLY accredited, just like all of those "non-profit" universities the original poster so highly esteems.

3.  As evidenced by this very own Ripoff Report, APU/AMU is highly respected by those who use Standard American English correctly.  In fact, we can all probably thank those highly esteemed "non-profit" institutions for the original poster's unorthodox use of written English.

4.  Almost all universities offer online courses.  That in and of itself does not imply that it is easy.  If fact, even at my traditional classroom courses at FSU, most learning took place online.  Assignments were assigned online, collected online, graded online, and even tests were often taken online.  Looking back, why the hell did I ever bother with going to class?  I've never learned anything from a classroom lecture.  And parking was horrendous.

5.  If anyone wishes to see students cheating, coasting through classes, just putting in the minimum, go to any state university.  You'll see hundreds.  Some drop out, others eventually get thrown out, but none should have ever been admitted in the first place.  I guess they only got in because the "non-profit" really needed the money.

6.  On a related note, for those who want to see uninvolved instructors, large state universities are also golden.  They aren't the ones who actually attend class to lecture, they aren't the ones who grade assignments or "proctor" an exam, they don't assist students with homework or study, and their office hours are a joke.  If fact, you'll have better luck finding the "instructor" listed on the syllabus on television being interviewed by a talk show host.

I think that's enough for now.  I'd like to recommend the original poster to stop worrying so much about his friends' education and start worrying about his own.  Trust me buddy, YOU more than anyone need it.

As for me, I'm off to apply to APU!

I've have been at AMU for three years and this complaint is completely inaccurate.  I've had to write research papers for most of my classes that needed to be in the appropriate format (MLA, APA or Chicago).  I've also had to include scholarly journals in my research.  I've also written business plans, marketing plans, SWOT analysis and many other products.  Some of the classes require you to upload your papers to turnitin.com and wiki is never an acceptable source.  Some of my classes are open book but timed.  If you are not familiar with the material or understand the formulas you will not make it.  The professors vary, some are pickier than others and some not as engaged but you will find that at any university or school.  Maybe you should research your topic a little more throughly next time.  There are always students who skate through and they usually skated through high school as well.  You can't blame the school for that. It is our responsibility to make the most of the classes. 

I am responding to the LT "complaint" against the American Public University System's schools. Don't know how he or she can complain about something they've not even tried once. I think in law they call it having a claim, which this person does not have. I am about to receive my BS in Environmental Science from them. I have worked very hard to maintain a GPA in the 3.7 range. Some classes are easier than others, but for the most part they are very challenging. 

One thing to consider is that APUS is fully accredited. Another is LT's mention of 8 week courses not being quality. That is malarkey my man. I went to Cleveland State many years ago and they also had accelerated courses for night and summer students. Most traditional schools offer online classes. Many offer complete programs online now as well. The ones that do not must be suspect in this modern day.

All of my instructors except for one have been excellent. Our program director is superb and is constantly improving the program and is always looking out for employment opportunities for us. 

Some of the good intangibles are: no driving costs; study in your skivvies if you want with your cat in your lap; etc. But seriously, the courses develop research skills and independence and time management perhaps more than a traditional school. This can be a plus if presented properly to other schools when seeking graduate study. Undergraduate books are included in the tuition, making LT's comments on the cost unfounded. Graduate books are purchased by the student. Buy backs are universal at every university so it seems to me that LT has not only never been to APUS schools, but perhaps never to a university at all.

Some of the not-so-good intangibles: no face time with fellow students and faculty. Of all the downsides, this is greatest. Again, this forces online students to seek out local people in their selected fields to try to bridge this gap. Another downside is the lack of hands-on laboratory settings. This to me was not a big deal because I had that years ago in Chemistry at CSU and worked in laboratories and in environmental sampling for years. But for others, it is so important that APUS does not offer laboratory science degrees. So, if someone is looking forward to being a chemist or biologist, this is definitely not the way to go. But for other disciplines, it is an excellent choice, especially for the mature student that has to manage a lot of work and family issues. 

As mentioned by others, plagiarism is NOT possible at this school to any extent. 

I have a feeling LT is a provocateur here. One poster did mention how an online degree is viewed in the real world. That is a true concern. I think it is up to the student and APUS to help formulate effective responses and approaches to this issue in the job arena. Another valid issue mentioned is that APUS had not required a Grad. Admission test. Not all schools do require such a test, even excellent brick and mortar ones (this I know through personal research as well as friends' experiences). And if you've ever seen the tests you will know why. They are mostly ridiculous, in my opinion. They are used strictly as a screening tool.

In closing, I DO NOT think a school like APUS is for everyone, but it is certainly not because of a low quality experience, but for some of the other issues I've mentioned above. I am completely satisfied with my choice of APU. 

I disagree with this report made by someone who has never even attended the University. This report is written based on hearsay. Most writers at least get the facts straight with what they are writing. I currently attend the sister university, American Public University. I have had no such experiences as the writer describes. The classes are structures and done online. It is an online university. There is class participation by answering discussion questions and responding to classmates. It's part of classroom participation. I do not see how anyone can use online references in their answers. Our answers are based on what we have read in our materials for the week and must be cited by us as so. The book are mostly online and current up to date. Most of my books are 2012. I am not sure who the writer spoke with about the teachers. The teachers are highly qualified in their field, more qualified than a lot teaching at any other university. The teachers are involved and online every day. Any time I have had a question, they respond very fast with the answers I need. The work is challenging and there are term papers and essays to complete. The teachers are involved in the online discussion and do more than just grade the work and pass out grades. Also I am not sure who the writer spoke with about this person writing one paper for every class. The school stresses plagiarism on every level. They are very strict about this and that means turning in the same paper for several classes. They make us sign up with an online site that we submit our papers to that checks for plagiarism. So to write one paper and use it for more than one class isn't likely. The school provides a challenging education. It is fast paced, and one has to keep up with it. They have a limit of how many classes you can take a semester.  To take more, you must get permission. Also the financial aid department has been great. They got my financial aid and distributed my refund quite quickly. Every time I have emailed financial aid, teachers, or my adviser, they have responded right away within 24 or 48 hours with an answer. Punctuation is a big key in getting good grades and following directions to the t is stressed highly. I love this school and the education it is providing me. Maybe your friends are not getting the quality education as you claim due to the fact they are not reading the material and giving it the effort someone who wants to learn usually does. 

I read the rip off report and am a bit amazed that someone can file on behalf of other people.   I think it makes no sense if the people who attended are offended, why don't they file?  Why you?

I have been an online student for three years now.  I do attend AMU, and I have had NO issues with the school in the manner that you are talking about.  Not once.

I know in the last online school I went to, what you describe happens in the generals class settings.  However, if a student is serious, then they will continue to do their work and see what happens when the core classes occur.  I would have to guess who you are talking about are half hearted and probably just as much of instigators to the "off topic" discussions, or possibly don't know how to stay on topic.

I would have to say I have had to work very hard at AMU and have been graded harshly for errors in my education, and had to learn to work harder to get through the class.  

I don't know what kind of grades your friends are getting, however, I am in the Honor Society, and no I did not get easy A's for my work either, along with that dedicate a good portion of my time learning the material.  

Not all the tests are without proctors.  Again, I will iterate, that you must possibly be speaking of generals classes.  Core classes do require proctors and AMU does use them.  There are many universities online that do not use them at all.  Those I would stay away from all together.

And the "high" tuition you talk about...you are a funny person who does not attend online schooling.  Their tuition is the lowest.  And the material is full material as well.  I know this, because I am currently sitting right next to my entire course materials for my class which include a very large text book on Lifespan Development, along with six other books that are referenced for use for the class, along with a list of resources from the library that I am to use as well.  The books are included in the class and selling back is optional.  Not required.  It's your tuition and yours to choose to keep or resell in the end.

Also, by you stating your friends use Wikipedia to copy and paste...all I can say is, now I can understand why your friends are complaining.  Cheaters do not prosper from education, along with that, you just openly admitted that your friends are not serious students if they don't even do their work appropriately.  

I can't believe you are complaining how your friend takes three classes per 8 weeks and has no effort to working toward a degree...no wonder.  Your friend is a cheater, along with that, your opinion is pretty weak in argument, when you speak from a third person perspective, along with a point of view that you have never experienced.  

I don't know what article you read that states that recruiters don't hire from profit schools.  That would put private schools out of business.  Which, there is no such thing as omitting private schools from application or hiring.  That would be like saying that Yale is a school that just doesn't need some of the top lawyers in the world and should only hire non-profit educated students for law.  Or at least it says that you do not have further education and really don't know how education and hiring works, nor degrees.  Because brick and mortar schools allow open book too, along with proctored, and so do non profit as well.  It all depends on the instructor.  Not the school itself.

It's too bad you had to file a complaint like this.  Especially since you never went and made a complaint on behalf of people that you openly admit are plagiarizing, accepting public money for military aid to cheat, and cost the tax payers a lot of money so they can lie through school and make the public pay for them.  

Thanks for the update on the Military taking advantage of the public.  The public stands strong on fighting for members of the military who serve by defending those who serve, and get to hear on a public forum that the defense of the public to stand up for our military is repaid in theft of money that is hard to come by in this economy and that the integrity that some military members claim to have to protect the civilians from harm are doing the harm themselves.  Not only do they steal our tax dollars, we pay more tax dollars to pay them to be in the military, to be trained to have integrity, honor, and dedication.  Then you go and tell on your friends that they are liars, cheaters, thieves, and have none of what this country supports for them.  You are a great friend....

Have you done any research about online MBA programs? If you did you would notice that a very credible east coast private college in Boston offers an online MBA program without needing a GMAT score or other qualifying test score as a condition of admittance into the program. I can assure you that North Eastern College degrees do hold clout. Just because there is no GMAT requirement is no reason to say a program is horrible. Also, let's keep in mind that AMU/APU has one of the highest graduation rates among online schools (in the upper 90%) and I know many people who have completed either a degree or certificate program through AMU/APU that live and work in the DC area (one of the wealthiest, most educated areas in the US) and have a great paying career. That must say something about the quality of education available and the fact that people are being hired into high paying higher profile positions.

Couldn't go on without pointing this out.
"To be honest, I take everything an AMU allumni post with skepticism"

From what I understand taking into consideration the overall tone of everything you have written, which is exemplified in the above statement, is that you will only trust the word of other ignorant people who, like yourself, have had no experience with AMU. I've read several rebuttals to what you've written authored by professionals, alumni, and professors and your responses to them are equivalent of covering your ears and yelling, "I can't hear you!" 

As far as people ripping on your grammar? Of course they will, you presented yourself as an expert on writing and passed judgement on someone else's paper. You've proven to us all that you're nowhere near qualified to make such judgement calls, we're just trying to show you that. You claimed to have quizzed your friend on economics and he allegedly didn't know the basics, consider the nitpicking of your grammar a quiz -- you failed.

Much of the rest you've written, the parts that are not out right false, is not exclusive to AMU; open book tests, selling books back, teachers with minimal participation, these are all things that occur at major universities. 

You have no bases for posting such a libelous account here. What ever thought process you have embarked upon is flawed.