• Report: #564652

Complaint Review: 411locals.com. 411 Locals

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  • Submitted: Thu, February 04, 2010
  • Updated: Mon, August 15, 2011

  • Reported By: Luis — EL Paso Texas United States of America
411locals.com. 411 Locals
Internet United States of America

411locals.com. 411 Locals 411locals, local 411, Page One Local Listings, 411 Service, 411 Service Net Evades Google Guidelines, Selling Free Product, After Cancelation, Modify your Listing, Charge you after sending Letter Confirming Cancellation Internet

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: Dear Luis

*Consumer Comment: Thanks for helping me.

*Consumer Comment: just do some research

*General Comment: 411 Malice

*UPDATE Employee: Really?

*Author of original report: They are still harrassing me!!!

*UPDATE Employee: Local Business Results

*REBUTTAL Owner of company: 411 Locals

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Do not work with this Company, Offer is too good to be true. They sell you a product that Google, Yahoo and MSN Offer for Free!!! Just research Local listings. You set up your own Keywords and Images without the need of outsourcing someone else. 


I already had a Google Local Listing and they informed to tell me that Google frowns upon multiple listings for the same company. Did they care? No. After I cancelled my account the following day my Google Analytics was no longer active. Obviously, they pulled the plug on that to make my job of advertising that much more difficult. 



Granted, it took a long while for me to resolve this issue with Google. I finally was able to delete my duplicate listing (almost impossible task). Once I did that they charged me again. I filed a fraud charge with my bank and they made a fictionous report listing my website page one. Having only had their service one day, this is impossible as web optimization takes a great length of time. 



I was fortunate to escape with only a 140 dollar loss, yet feel for those who have gotten ripped-off by this company before and those that continue to do so.



Ask them to reveal their method. They won't.

They call from an Anonymous number.

They say no catch, yet there are many to come....





BEWARE!!! 



STAY AWAY FROM 411Locals or 411Service!!!







This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 02/04/2010 04:51 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/411localscom-411-Locals/internet/411localscom-411-Locals-411locals-local-411-Page-One-Local-Listings-411-Service-411-564652. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
1Author 5Consumer 2Employee/Owner
Updates & Rebuttals

#1 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Dear Luis

AUTHOR: David H - ()

We are sorry that you feel you had a bad experience.

Luis wrote:

Just research Local listings. You set up your own Keywords and Images without the need of outsourcing someone else.

This is 100% true. In fact I believe we even have a blog post where we tell potential customers, for free, the precise steps it takes to do exactly that.

However we do not sell local listings and never have claimed to sell local listings. We do optimize local listings. This is something your average business owner cannot do. We use geo-targeting to define a local market for a client, then using analytics specific to a local industry (not the analytics Google offers if you buy an AdWords account for example, but analytics very specifically crafted for a specific business which we feel and many of our customers feel provides excellent results) we determine a list of keywords and phrases which leads to sales as opposed to which are searched for more often, these are two very different lists and an important distinction, we then develop a strategy taking into account dozens and dozens of unique factors which search engines use in order to sort the millions and millions of web pages online. This process is different for every business because every business is different, every area is different, each has different competitors in their area, and each area has a different set of customers. All of these factors are taken into consideration, and then a long-term strategy is implemented which includes only White Hat SEO practices.

That is the easy explanation of our process. In reality the software and technology needed to do this effectively while still following Best Practices is intensely difficult to understand and our tech team specializing in this area all have years of experience in SEO and advanced degrees in a range of technology fields.

I already had a Google Local Listing and they informed to tell me that Google frowns upon multiple listings for the same company. Did they care? No.

 It is difficult to translate what the report is trying to say here, but we feel we should repeat that we do not sell listings. If a customer does not have one we will make one, but if they already have one our only concern is optimizing it. If there was a miscommunication we apologize, but this is something we check currently, and especially since recent updates to Google’s algorithms, in order to maintain our Certified Google Partnership status. However this would have actually been a very easy fix for us had it been communicated, and we will go over this below where this individual speaks further about the double listing.

After I cancelled my account the following day my Google Analytics was no longer active. Obviously, they pulled the plug on that to make my job of advertising that much more difficult.

 We do not have access to any customer’s Google Analytics unless they personally have granted us access, which obviously was not the case here. We have our own process for analyzing the effectiveness of our ongoing optimization efforts in order to come to the best possible results, one which is not dependent Google’s Analytics, though that is a great tool for customers to keep track in addition to the reports and the dashboard we give them access to. However, we would have no reason to delete this person’s or anyone’s Analytics Account. We can’t even imagine why we or any agency would do that.

Granted, it took a long while for me to resolve this issue with Google. I finally was able to delete my duplicate listing (almost impossible task).

 For anyone reading who genuinely has a problem with multiple listings, here is how to delete them fast and easy:

  1. Sign into your Google local listing account.
  2. Click the “Report a Problem” button located on the bottom right.
  3. Click “Place has another listing.”
  4. (Optional) Paste the link of the additional listing you don’t want.
  5. Hit “Finish”
  6. Google will remove it.

Once I did that they charged me again. I filed a fraud charge with my bank and they made a fictionous report listing my website page one. Having only had their service one day, this is impossible as web optimization takes a great length of time.

 Reports are basically a breakdown of the dashboard which our customers have 24/7 access to. It updates constantly.

Faking this report would be harder than simply offering the service legitimately. However if you are speaking of a screen shot, sure, that could be photoshopped of course.  We are aware though that our customers have computers and can type in a search and see for themselves where they are listed. This is not something we would have any reason to do; especially given the limited time we had to improve their placement. We are certain this situation described is inaccurate.  

I was fortunate to escape with only a 140 dollar loss, yet feel for those who have gotten ripped-off by this company before and those that continue to do so.

Regardless of any misgivings one may have about SEO in general, the fact is that without optimization sites are almost always hard to find, good optimization can put them on the first page, (and to clear up another misconception in a comment below, we do not optimize for a business’s name, that is not helpful. If you are a plumber for example it is not optimization for AAA Plumbers, it’s optimization for a number of terms and phrases like “our pipes are leaking”) and companies charge several hundred, to thousands, sometimes tens of thousands of dollars a month because it is a very significant amount of work for the agency in terms of hours worked, the technology they use, the research, etc. In our case we put an entire team on each account and they dedicate a number of hours every single week to optimizing the client’s site whether they have been a customer for a month or for years. It’s a constant process. That first month is the most cost-intensive time for any account for us.

And optimization is not the only service we are giving our customers. We build a website, a mobile site, we optimize Google Maps placement, we build social sites, today we even create a marketing video.

We’ve been able to help over 23,000 small to medium-sized business owners make more money, we’ve done it while maintaining and A-Rating with the BBB and our Certified Google Partnership status. We are sorry that this customer feels they did not have a positive experience, but we also feel that they initially wanted our service, but then changed their mind before they even had a chance to see what we could do for them. Considering the hours we put into any new account, and our very low starting price, we don’t think it is fair to call this a rip off.

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#2 Consumer Comment

Thanks for helping me.

AUTHOR: moralesa791 - ()

It gives me great pleasure to recommend 411 Locals. The attention to details and the best possible level of customer service have been excellent. Our company have been in first place on Google and we have received a lot of calls from new prospect clients. I don’t think you could find a better service than 411 Locals.

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#3 Consumer Comment

just do some research

AUTHOR: michelle - (United States of America)

this company claims to use only white-hat seo tactics, however, they charge you and agree to create additional listings for a client by purchasing addresses in other areas (black-hat tactic).  they do an injustice for their clients by adding reviews to clients google places, they say they get the reviews from the clients themselves; however, they look fake to potential clients (even if they are real).  when reviews are clustered together by date and you click on the customer user profile and see that person has also reviewed businesses in several states...potential clients see that as a deceitful practice by the business owner themselves.  also, if you stop service with them they hold your google places hostage (black hat seo), they say since they have created it they won't give you the information to run your own google places, you need to create a new one...so you have to start over or continue to use the service of this company....that's just not good business practice.  If you have had dealings with this company and have ran in to these problems, contact the Federal Trade Commission and file a complaint to the bbb...
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#4 General Comment

411 Malice

AUTHOR: Jeff - (United States of America)

I couldn't agree with the author anymore! Everything about this company is unethical; no central number, Caller I.D. Unknown/ Anonymous, unauthorized charges... and completely decieving "customer service".

Do yourself a favor=

AVOID 411 LOCALS and avoid the MALICE
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#5 UPDATE Employee

Really?

AUTHOR: Competitor - (United States of America)

It is obvious that this person is a competitor of 411 Locals, that became perfectly clear in his latest post. He states that he owns a SEO company...why would any SEO company hire 411 Locals to do SEO for them? It doesn't make any sense, that would be like a plumbing contractor hiring another plumber because he has a clogged pipe. At the same time he is telling everyone to not use an SEO company, he is saying that he owns a SEO company...mixed signals anyone!

>Point One: There is proprietary software that can figure out Google's Algorithm based on the search results that Google provides...it's complicated, but someone who "owns" an SEO company should be aware of that. 

>Point Two: We do have thousands of satisfied customers, at the moment this is being written we have a "B" rating with the BBB. Look us up at http://southernnevada.bbb.org, search for 411 Locals. We do not pay for this rating, we are not a member of the BBB...this is the result of very few complaints and excellent, in-house customer service.

>Point Three: It is true that anyone can start a local listing, but if you are a plumber in Los Angeles there are 15,000 other companies trying to get to the first page, what make someone creating a listing today have any chance of getting in the top 7 spots? They don't, unless they hire a reputable SEO that has the man-power to put in the hours to optimize their listing. Do you think the plumber in L.A. has 10-20 hours a week to maintain his listing.

>Point Four: Yes, it is free to do SEO for yourself. It's also free to paint your own car, but would you want to drive that car to your high school reunion? The writer of that post also agrees and writes this statement,  "It's just most people lack the technical skill to get it done." I couldn't agree more; Unless you have the necessary technical knowledge and a lot of free time every week, which most business owners do not have, you should rely on a professional company to build and maintain your company's website and listings.

>Point Five: We have a "B" rating with the BBB. You can search at the BBB site for Southern Nevada(http://southernnevada.bbb.org) or at the BBB's national website(http://www.bbb.org/us/) for 411 Locals. I am surprised that the person posting this, claimed he couldn't find us, or more likely didn't want to find us because of what it would do to his creditability. I would love to see the BBB rating of the person who posted this, but I'm guessing that won't happen.

>Point Six: Clearly states that he is a competitor of ours, with a very biased opinion, creating doubt whether he was ever a customer of 411 Locals. We don't even have a customer of ours in El Paso for the time period the customer is claiming he was one of our customers.

-The original poster is clearly trying to defame 411 Locals, he repetitively asked for proof, but shows absolutely no proof of his own, just a bunch of outlandish claims. We recommend that companies do as much research as possible before committing to a marketing company. We are happy to provide references of our current customers and any other material requested prior to signing up.  We do not have a contract, our services are month-to-month, so that make us have to earn your money!

-While Rip Off Reports is a very useful and informative website, please don't take the items posted on this site as fact, they are posted by individuals without any background information or evidence. Don't listen to me or anyone else, do your own research!

Thank you for your time! Have a great day and good luck in your business!
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#6 Author of original report

They are still harrassing me!!!

AUTHOR: Visionayer - (United States of America)

Wow...

After (on my own accord) I was able to rank my listing on page one of Google and almost two years later they call to claim it was their doing and that I need to resubscribe to keep my listing...
What!!??!!??

This is a Rip-Off if ever there was one. They want to get paid for all my hard work? They threatened they would remove my listing if I didn't comply. Well, go ahead and Delete my Listing...! I'll call your Bluff! Impossible for them and they know it.
They just assumed I wouldn't know better and were hoping I would bite...

A few words of Notice:
Claim: "we have a technical team that adjusts the mathematical algorithm ( Equation ) to match as closely as possible to what Google is looking for."
Truth: No one knows what Google is looking for except for Google. The Algorithm is constantly changing so it is impossible to get it right 100% percent of the time. Beware of any company using the Google name, it is a tactic often used to rip people off. Google never accepts payment in trade for top placement. Algorithms are for Search Engines, so how can they adjust one of their own if their company is not a Search Engine...?

Claim: "We have thousands of satisfied customers and would be happy to provide references."
Truth: Provide Away...!!!! ( Thousands )

Claim: "This person's claim that anyone can research local listings, and create a profile that will begin to appear on the first page of GOOGLE is completely inaccurate."
Truth: I did it, so can you... If they can do it, anyone can...
So yes, anyone and everyone has that potential and there is nothing inaccurate in that...

Claim: "If you are in an competitive industry in a city with an average population than you know how hard it is to rank your company online without spending thousands of dollars."
Truth: Any person or company charging thousands of dollars do so because of the work and knowledge involved to get you Top Placement. Truth is, Search Engine Optimization can be done for free!!! All of it! It's just most people lack the technical skill to get it done. Think about it... When the Internet first came out the Search Engines of Yesteryear had plenty of original results. These Listings, as they do now, were ranked by relevance and not because they paid someone to rank em for them.

Claim: "We have the highest rating an online advertising company can have with the BBB.  We have had no complaints within the last 36 months."
Truth: I couldn't locate such proof of good standing with the BBB. Nowhere, so provide proof.

Claim: "We stand behind our service, and for this person to disparage our company in this manner shows an apparent lack of technical expertise, and deficient knowledge of how much labor is actually involved in creating, optimizing, and maintaining a businesses profile on the FIRST page of GOOGLE."
Truth: I have my own SEO Company and therefore do know what it takes to rank first on Google. I thank companies such as these that inspired my practice as an effort to stop seeing people from get ripped off. I am currently ranked first, but for protection will keep my business confidential. Funny how an "employee" was so upset about my complaint he/she felt like rebutting.


They appreciate your diligence in finding the truth to this matter.
( meaning they appreciate your money )


I don't recommend you seek the truth yourself, it is not worth the headache.
Educate yourself on Local Listings and see this treachery stop...!

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#7 UPDATE Employee

Local Business Results

AUTHOR: 411Service - (United States of America)

Dear Consumers,

This person's claim that anyone can research local listings, and create a profile that will begin to appear on the first page of GOOGLE is completely inaccurate.

If you are in an competitive industry in a city with an average population than you know how hard it is to rank your company online without spending thousands of dollars. In fact, if you have more than seven competitors it is a physical impossibility for everyone to show up as a local business on the first page, because there are only seven spots for the local business results ON the first page of GOOGLE. If you are plumbing contractor number 45 in your city, and you create a general profile; what is going to get you listed on the first page of the thousands of results GOOGLE finds without the service of a company such as ours.

We have been in business more than five years. We have more than 10,000 client listings currently on the first page of GOOGLE. We have the highest rating an online advertising company can have with the BBB. We have had no complaints within the last 36 months. We operate on a performance based agreement with NO Contracts, NO Term Plans, and NO Cancellation Fees. Furthermore, our competitors routinely charge two times the amount we do, AND lock you into annual contracts.

We would love to keep all of our clients forever, but unfortunately, we have all done business with customers we would rather not have, right? Truth is; we keep more than 90% of our clients after 3 months, and it is there choice to continue with the program because it is yielding results. Not because they are obligated by a contractual agreement.

I can not state this any more plainly than to say that our service has had a positive impact with hundreds of business owners across the United States.

We stand behind our service, and for this person to disparage our company in this manner shows an apparent lack of technical expertise, and deficient knowledge of how much labor is actually involved in creating, optimizing, and maintaining a businesses profile on the FIRST page of GOOGLE.

We appreciate your diligence in finding the truth to this matter.

Sincerely,

411 Service

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#8 REBUTTAL Owner of company

411 Locals

AUTHOR: Chris - (United States of America)

The offer we are giving to business owners is simple, place your business listing on the first page of Google in the maps section.  Your company name and contact information as well as a direct link to your website will be posted in the first 7 spots on the first page of the maps.

We have a technical team that adjusts the mathematical algorithm ( Equation ) to match as closely as possible to what Google is looking for.  Our technical team does this every two weeks for each of our clients and this is what we charge for on a monthly basis.

The algorithm consists of 60 or so different key characteristics that make up the listing.  We have thousands of satisfied customers and would be happy to provide references.

Please feel free to contact me directly if you have additional questions regarding our services.

Chris
1-480-593-1591
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