• Report: #814984

Complaint Review: AOL & GoDaddy email

  • Submitted: Wed, December 28, 2011
  • Updated: Sat, December 31, 2011

  • Reported By: BoxcarsNoThanks — Miami United States of America
AOL & GoDaddy email
770 Broadway # 4 New York, NY 10003-9558 Internet United States of America

AOL & GoDaddy email Negligent Blacklisting of My Home Computer and 19 others computers Emails Based on what email software I use. New York, Internet

*Author of original report: Correction Proof a Bigger Threat in Question

*Consumer Comment: I recomend you check out the site of the orginization he won't name.

*Consumer Comment: This guy is obviously a spammer...

*Author of original report: Response to Pro Blacklisting Rant

*Consumer Comment: More than likely

*Consumer Comment: Another rant?

*Author of original report: Update and Response to Replies

*Consumer Comment: Substantiation?

*Consumer Comment: Just an FYI.

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Because of the complaint of my prospective client that AOL was putting my emails in Spam, I had to invest some time in finding out why.


 


It turns out that Billions of American consumers (including all of AOLs) are not being made aware that there emails are being scanned and culled for blacklisting by foreign blacklists companies that are selling and operating not only censorship for what people can write but also what software programs they are allowed to purchase and use for sending emails as well the most dangerous aspect, limiting how many people a person can communicate with.


 


This targets American Small business newsletters and mailers and squeezes the US  economy. It has literally eliminated my ability to communicate with almost all of my local businesses. It has also infringed on my ability to communicate political opinions. Blacklisted as junk is blacklisted. 


 


The scam which according to the reports of the blacklisting company I traced as the one trigger of the blacklist by AOL, affects billions of users. Most of which are likely not aware that private companies are enforcing their own set of email behavioral requirements and shunning tactics. 


 


A clue that they are operating a scam is the avoidance of disclosure of the true facts. They conveniently list a range or IPs rather than my specific IP leaving me no recourse of the claim of defamation. The UK foreign government, according to Spamhaus-ZEN, has a "Security for Cost"  law it has implimented to make lawsuits against them pay up front a form of deposit.
 


thus it appears by their claims only wealthy can likely sue.


Thus rather than saying "you" (a single ip) have been blacklisted, they are saying "a range".


These blacklist implementations are likely done via AOLs firewalls, something similar to Cisco.


 


With billions of American businesses relying on the communication of contracts and daily business via the Internet, the scam allows false blame shifting that leaves a consumer victimized feeling that they cannot file suit unless they are wealthy enough to do it in the foreign country where the blacklist is located. The question of the negligence of a blacklist technology being used on US wires, however is simple to answer. These Internet wires are US  jurisdiction and these blacklists are communicating and using their products with softwares, such as firewalls, on US servers. They are doing business on US equipment, for US customers and blacklisting US citizens.


 


If they are enforcing unfair competition and extortion based on blacklisting, AOL, whether they know it or not, is a party to it.


 


The scam claims the customers opted for blacklisting.  Victims of the blacklisting (for whatever reason) often need to address and pay the foreign companies fees (according to a report I saw) as well as disclose private information and person/business details to overseas companies.


 


 Aol claims it is doing the censorship filtering for the protection of the consumers against malicious viruses and spam. However the censorship of many of these black listing companies is trivial or oppressive of American freedoms.


I have not seen anywhere where AOL has disclosed that people would be surrendering their freedom of speech, privacy or reputation. 


To give an example of this limiting of speech, one firewall company touts it considers asking "were there really six million" as the criteria for blacklisting email content as spam. (A legitimate question in many commerce emails about shipment quantities as well as those about the true amounts of people that are estimated well above 6 million that died in the holocaust.


 


The scam is that people are led to believe the deletion and classification of emails is based on the attempt to eliminate illegal, spurious, or dangerous "spam". Can AOL shift responsibility for implementing the false logic that an email program or configuration denotes SPAM and defamation of a range of IPs? Correct me if I am wrong, but AOL has a responsibility by law to protect the personal details and information of customers. To scan inbound personal information for the sake of classifying whether a person believes in the count of a holocaust, for example, or to apply a shunning of legal communication because one uses a email program of their choice, is a Scam in my opinion. 


Classifying my email as junk spam because I (or any of 19 other IPs the blacklist gave as a range) used an email program that was not main stream, touts that the responsibility for the decision to deploy filtering is not about SPAM at all. And the abscence of responsibility and untouchable legal recourse for a person of common means thorw up red flags a scam may well be at work. 


 


The blacklist company answers in their frequently asked questions, that their blacklisting criteria even blocks people who have done nothing illegal as far as spam law.  If the blacklisting company is correct about their billions of users, the scam I allege, reaches nation security proportions. One company can shut down entire sectors of communication with a single "spam" signature? In my opinion, I cannot see AOL handing this type of power over communication without knowing about the coercion of customers. It is highly unlikely in my opinion.


 


This "decision" by AOL therefore puts millions of their customer in jeopardy of "shut down" overnight at the whim of any of dozens of foreign companies, some in closed societies that shun, but also allows non national companies the ability to enforce written content limitations, scan and read US nationals emails. The world war saying, "loose lips sink ships" takes on a new light when foreign companies can pluck IPs based on content filters (searches of text).


 


The number of small companies and mom and pop stores entangled in frivolous blocking and paying fees to an overseas company because AOL is blocking or diverting to junk mail emails must be sizable, in my opinion. 


 


 


Few AOL customers have knowing surrendered their right to receive legally generated non-spam emails from non mainstream programs. My client was one of them.


 


The allegation of "negligence" that AOL did not know this was happening or did not know that customers emails were being censured would be more difficult to believe than believing that they are part of a Scam of coercion, unfair competition, and tortuous interference.


 


I have no reason to believe treason would be a motivation at this time, but I also would classify censorship and blacklisting of Americans as removing it from the possibilities on the table. 


 


There was talk of moving these blacklists over to the search engines which would further squeeze and shun American Companies and our economy. at this time I have not research nor am I aware whether AOL is apply this alleged Scam to page ranking and listings.


This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 12/28/2011 03:10 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/AOL-GoDaddy-email/internet/AOL-GoDaddy-email-Negligent-Blacklisting-of-My-Home-Computer-and-19-others-computers-Em-814984. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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Updates & Rebuttals

#1 Author of original report

Correction Proof a Bigger Threat in Question

AUTHOR: BoxcarsNoThanks - (United States of America)

I read some more about Spamhaus PBL. From their site: The PBL is simply a list of all of the world's dynamic IP space, i.e: IP ranges normally assigned to ISP broadband customers (DSL, DHCP, PPP, cable, dialup).


 


But they later say your software type and configurations are also and issue. 


 


If try to I understand the technical issue, the main stream software will either allow the use of the dynamic IP in as the origin of the email or the static IP of the senders NIC/hardware based on settings.


Because I checked my hardware IP and they have it listed, it is clear their restrictions on software functionality/config it may not have been the basis of the shunning as Junk by AOL. 


 


For the nay sayers it is the IP of my computer which I can verify by typing ipconfig at DOS prompt.


 


Spamhause is allowing users (AOL) of their technology to incorporated into firewalls to flag or blocking the victim users of their list.  Licensed blacklisting with active participation of this process by SPMAHAUS in making the decision to defame? (This is what their diagrams of how the technology works shows but I am not positive its realtime.)


 


With the greater knowledge I gained, a major threat has been confirmed in my mind by their own admission.


 


If it were true that it was just a list of dynamic IPs, why is my static non dynamic home computer IP listed in their range? If true, something is seriously wrong.  It is very threatening because my IP is not a dynamic IP.  Are their millions of mistakes or intentional corruptions. Beyond that, who gives them this right to begin with? Blacklisting and shunning permanently? Even the justice system limits punishments for the most serious crimes. These companies threaten permanent shunning! They build fear and trepidation with this threat of permanent blacklisting. Many email senders don't know this is just a small NIC card, but likely fear they themselves will be ban. Regardless they are blocked or shun/defamed till the figure it out.


 


If it is true that the IP listed in the database are reserved for dynamic, then mine is proof of corruption of their database? Either someone has entered my IP into a database that shouldn't have a single static IP of a computer (according to their claim see attached image) or they are negligent at the expense of my income and reputation as well as many others.  How many corruptions representing how many people and companies is possible in a private company database that can blacklist and cause shunning?


 


The IP range they listed in the PBL report returned by my search of my home computer IP is NOT dynamic. It couldn't be because it included the factory original IP of the NIC card in main stream computers. Computer companies such as Lenova, get ranges that are static? How could anyone mix those up? 


 


Another possibility with this ripoff by AOL and filtering by overseas companies outside US jurisdictions:


Let me highlight as I mentioned before, I lived in a society that has public shunning within the Middle East. I wouldn't agree with it because I believe in Liberty and free thinking. So I moved back to the states. I cannot confirm or deny this as the source as not coming from the middle east, because Spamhaus is not in the US and likely AOLs firewalls are programmed in the Middle East. The odd listing of my IP that causes customers of mine to think as these comment posters do, that I am a spammer and untrustworthy.  You see the defamation effects even here by commenters.


 


Being familiar with this technology and how it could be easily leveraged by shunning religious societies or even political movements, I worry that abuse of the system by Middle East shadow groups could very well be going on today.


Being listed in their database when according to what they say it should not be because they say it is dynamic ip ranges that are reserved, Could it be questioned that a programmer or hacker from the shunning country that I lived in put it there? I give it a strong maybe. I wouldn't put it past that society to do such. Abuse of the "SPAM" shunning system would be simple.


How in the world did I get shunned in the  US? I though I left that behind in the Middle East with the fanatics. I dont live under Shariah law and women do not get coerced to sit in the back of the bus in the US, so I am surprised people support shunning of legal activities and innocent owners of computers.


I cant send documents to clients. What is this "not expected"?


 


The technology and basis of AOLs shunning of my emails by putting them in Junk mail, is most odd. Whether it is my software choice, that I use a dynamic IP, a mistake that could effect millions, or intentional revenge by the very people who run closed societies and shun, none of these are acceptable. Possibly I am missing the true reason, but should I be losing money because of this over trumped SPAM hassle that is no where as near as big a threat as it was years ago when computers were slow and limited.


Let me also say that using dynamic IP in emails is actually MORE secure for the millions of senders as it changes and hides your personal computers IP from being exposed to hackers. AOL and Spamhaus want to take this away? Because of spam we will give up our own security?


The idea that there is blacklisting that a company denies is blacklist but admits is blocking IPs in the identical way any black list does is odd to me.


 


NOW


Since I had an update I will respond to comment posters who think they are attacking my character by accusing me of a bulk emailed of unsolicited emails. I personally am not concerned about it. The facts, information and ideas are not going to be erased by empty mud slinging. This is not a political election post where people are swayed by that sort of Chicago political strategies.  


Bulk communication in the hands of the people (not foreign companies escaping US law) is invaluable. Look at the claims of OWS or the Obama campaign to see how valuable this is to the political process. 


I dont agree with these groups but mass unsolicited facebook and texting allowed political opinions to be shared. Should someone England person who owns a company have the power to allow or deny  you communication after you fill out forms so he can decide who gets to speak to people via email. This is what Spmahaus is asking me. To clear my reputation up from false "Junk" labels by giving the power to play God and decide if I can use my God given right to communicate to any of the 1.7 billion people they lord over.  


 


So Bubba Lee who DIDNT see the EIGHT times I mentioned Spamhaus and accused me of not wanting to expose the name Spamhaus, thank you for your great analyses after demonstrating your fabulous reading comprehension skills already, or lack thereof.


I couldnt disagree with you more. 


Let me clarify Bubba, I agree with you that they should read the site and that is why I included image captures and told the other comment poster to go to the site and search PBL.


 


As far as you comment that everything you see there is legal, I must ask if you are a lawyer? How much of that can we believe you really read there anyways? possibly there was something there said eight tomes that you missed that would convince a legal expert or layman otherwise.


 


and just because one claims its legal in the US to allow foreign countries to blacklist Americans, reading as many of USA companies emails they want, playing God, after a coerce shunned person to complete forms to not be shun, and blocking everyone who doesn't use the right software, doesnt mean they are right. They wouldn't be away from American law if they weren;t trying to play the system and use the delays in justice to pull of what military intelligence spends millions to do. This blacklisting and censorship including the ability to spy on Americans from abroad, is a national security nightmare and our founding father's worst nightamre. 


 


Clearly they are England and using protections from being subject to American laws that require even layman can get a fair shake.


 


To the other commenter, I not a spammer but I see no threat to me from bulk unsolicited messaging. In fact I kind of miss it like many Americans.


 


One more note to the last comments.


In perspective of what great value it is to the enemies of the US to be able to intercept all US communications, can I ask if your posts are paid for as part of pro Spam propaganda?


Because I find it hard to believe that someone who did not notice Spamhause mentioned EIGHT TIMES, actually read the post or cares about the issue. So who are you guys and why do you seem to substantiate that something is really strange with your half hearted attacks on the messenger?


Something stinks about this worldwide censorship, the lack of listings in big search engines, and the rapid attacks on my legitimacy. Its strange that companies who are collapsing my business are getting so much support by you to defame my business emails and me with false claims.


What gives?


 Some odd things in the attached images. ......


 


They know they block legtimate users and they instruct people to not remove themselves.


They have hotmail free emails in the same database as "dynamic only" database and refuse to take requests to remove them from shunning blacklist.


They are quickly erasing data quickly. This is a red flag to me that they are deleting data in a time frame which appears to be below that which it would take for a complaint to get to trial.

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#2 Consumer Comment

I recomend you check out the site of the orginization he won't name.

AUTHOR: Bubba Lee - (Canada)

Anyone who reads the rants above should check out the web site for "The SPAMHAUS Project" to read how and why this works and is more than legal.

They are the ones the complainant won't name.

You should read Spamhaus's postings on spammers threats and attempts at lawsuits. Absolutely hilarious when you compare to the original report here.
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#3 Consumer Comment

This guy is obviously a spammer...

AUTHOR: Steve - (United States of America)

The dude obviously tried using a program to spam people, and got (appropriately) blocked. Given how delusional (borderline schizophrenic?) he is, I would not put any faith in his claims of being knowledgeable of IT, especially when it comes to anything Internet-related. 

To the OP - how about pasting one of the emails that got blocked? 
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#4 Author of original report

Response to Pro Blacklisting Rant

AUTHOR: BoxcarsNoThanks - (United States of America)

In response to the comment you DONT know anything about servers I laugh at this comment like I would a joke.  Seriously, I laugh. I am familiar with servers and have instructed users for using RAID servers on some security applications including configuring the BIOS. As far as setting up an email server, there is nothing to it. Next time I suggest you hire a professional if youre finding it difficult.

 

It is in the area of IT Security that I not only am familiar but have been published and paid considerable amounts of money to write about. Cisco even offered me a project on one of their more advanced firewalls because I knew the technology, but I turned them down due to a prior commitment that would conflict with the project. 

For someone who demands more proof you make wild accusations you could not possibly know anything about. 

 

As far as the Constitution and Bill of Rights, if you baiting me, it wont work. Im not a lawyer. Luckily the law in THIS land is that even a common layman can file a complaint when his/her rights are infringed upon. He need not be a rocket scientist. 

Study your grade school textbooks about the three branches of government and the protection of freedoms granted in the documents. It will be a good start for you to learn that Law is not limited to those two documents and that freedom of speech is a right that is protected by more than one law and precedence.

 

Now on to your bullet points:

 

Re: 1. There is plenty of proof but not everything. See the image captures from the Spamhause website (which represent fair use). If it goes to court further details can and will be given. At any point when you want to go and read the Spamhause website, try using a search engine, you cant miss it. Look up PBL on their site and READ. I've named sections where they have many of the details discussed here about their lists.

 

Re:2 Your just ranting. Either that or your reading comprehension only focus in on one of the many things stated in the ripoff report I filed. I suggest you leave legal to people who know about. Worse, you are wrong anyways. The God given rights granted protection by the constitution cannot unknowingly be surrendered and are protected large body of law. True that a person can go to another company.  So what. It doesn't free anyone from being subject to the laws or civil damages to innocent victims or hindering free speech. For example any of these could be investigated: mass defamation of character, Anti Trust laws, Tortuous interference, extortion of private information, violation of a number of Internet privacy acts, extortion of money, invasion of privacy, treason and a whole list of state and federal law as well as international commerce laws. Additionally the blacklist that injured me admits it was not because of checking or finding me to be SPAM. Thus fraud and deception of the people who actually agreed to SPAM security, should be investigated. 

Additionally National Security and business trade secretes being intercepted by one or more foreign countries. Looks like treason to me. Check the legal requirements regarding the clause about protecting Americans against enemies both foreign and domestic. FYI consumer offered encryption is NOT protection against foreign intelligence and organized crime (hackers)/enemies.

 

3.  Your not telling me anything I dont know when you say Servers CAN become overloaded. You might want to catch on to the qualifiers I put in my previously posted statements. For more savvy IT professional with even small budgets and for the most part larger companies like AOL likely have the watchdog daimons, redundancy, load bearing and failover mechanism to deal with it. Even if the few circumstances occur, its no excuse. Blacklisting is a more permanent form of downtime.

 

 

4) Did I ask for your advice? Tell me something I dont know. Besides what does that have to do with the law and the ripoff? Your point is shifting the blame for shunning and blacklisting onto the victim? Its my fault? LOL Typical false guilt that goes with shunning and blacklisting. I didnt send spam. The Spmahause site even has a FAQ for people who are complaining they are innocent.

How many Americans feel guilty because they are labeled falsely as SPAM. Creating "guilt" is manipulation of the innocent. 

The definition of SPAM includes unsolicited emails that ARE legal? Do we complain when a billboard offers an unsolicited offer, when an add from google shows up, when a flier shows up in our US post box, when a stranger says hello or networks on business social networks? Unsolicited contacts are the bread and butter of industry and have been for years. Why is there now suddenly guilt? Because SPAM filters and the huge money invested in selling them to the American public as well as the IT industries whining have all contributed to a cult like shunning atmosphere of US  commerce. It is anti American campaign seeded with treasonous intent in my opinion. It goes hand in hand with recent protests that attempted to cripple and collapse US financial operations.  True SPAM is a nuisance and part of doing business. Its not my expense to pay for with my freedoms. Unsolicited contacts IS business aka cold calling.

 

This campaign bears a close resemblance to certain anarchist and political group tactics of recent No one should feel guilty or be punished for doing business. It is part of Liberty! Should I feel guilty that my IP was not expected to send an email? Expect Liberty.

 

5. Again, I didnt ask. Additionally, you complain about costs for your server operation and now you suggest that American business encrypt all of their emails. What about my cost? Should I take on your expenses so you feel better?

Additionally you show ignorance of how effective encryption is. There are legal limits on the level of encryption allowed in the US. You also ignore the fact that recipients such as new business contacts would need to be trained and given decryption tools. It would be no way to do business.

These points you make are irrelevant to the ripoff. The people building signatures and scanning technology will be the first to tell you how easy it is to break most encryptions. Besides being blacklisted or filtered based on the sending program methods goes beyond reading and invasion of privacy but is, in my opinion, about punishing/defamation and unfair competition. It does me no good to send an encrypted email that is blocked because of a blacklist of my home computer and shunning from contacting anyone of the billions exposed to these pirate like controls over US people.

 

 

I hope America gets its finger on what stinks here and bites back before all the affected business and people are harmed further.

 

I would also like to add an answer to the question whether I am a Spammer. Apparently you have not read that the complaint here is not about be being blacklisted for SPAM. They admit I am not listed as sending SPAM, but they block me anyway. Since they are scanning all my emails and everyone elses, does that offer you proof in addition to me saying, I am not a spammer.

You should have picked up on this before you made such a wild statement.

 

Additionally, if a company puts up a page (advertisement) that says contact us and you contact them, they have solicited that contact by publishing their company for other businesses to contact. They not only offer the email they say "contact us". Contact pages can be hidden from search engines, if a person wants to hide it. There is money and jobs in making more not less contact between buyer and seller. With that knowledge, why is there a movement going in the wrong direction? Why did someone outside US laws cripple my business? 

People use the internet to generate and increase business (aka leads) though contacting their audience. If its not the audience they were hoping for, should other people then be victimized and blacklisted by foreign companies that are operating beyond the US legal system?

Everyone including the local burger join get walk ins that are not customers they want. Should we blacklist undesirables from society? What happened to the US melting pot? Is the Internet held to US standards of law?

As far as my IP or ISP, its none of your business. I don't need to put anything out there that allows hackers to direct hacking to my home computer address or put me at risk of retaliation. What do you need it for anyways? Do you want to find me? The ISP has no bearing on the blocking of my home IP address. You obviously didn't read the complaint and update closely enough to see that.

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#5 Consumer Comment

More than likely

AUTHOR: Steven - (U.S.A.)

More than likely it is your ISP that is being blocked because of the amount of spam and or viruses that are being spread from their network servers. This has nothing to do with censorship and everything to do with network security.

You should contact your ISP and let them know that this is happening so that they can work with AOL and whoever to provide your provider with an IP address that they can point their email traffic to.

AOL and GO DADDY have every right to protect their networks
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#6 Consumer Comment

Another rant?

AUTHOR: Robert - (USA)

It's clear to me that you DON'T know about servers or computer communications as a whole as well as what our Constitution and the Bill of Rights state.

1.  You post another rant with NO PROOF whatsoever.  Where are the links to all these reports you claim to have read.

2.  The Constitution has to do with protecting your right to free speech from being infringed upon BY THE GOVERNMENT, not a private business.  If you don't like the policies of AOL or any other internet service you are free to CHANGE to another service provider.  I'll warn you now, all REPUTABLE hosting companies and internet service providers have policies against SPAM.

3.  Servers CAN become overloaded under certain circumstances.  I know, I own some and maintain MANY others for my enterprise clients.  SPAM email IS an issue that costs the IT community plenty.  It is not a "petty" issue as you claim.  Now I suspect you really are a spammer or an email list seller-boo h*o for you.

4.  If your IP address is listed with Spamhaus you can have it removed.  If you're losing so much business Einstein, simply have your IP address CHANGED.  Your ISP should be able to accomplish this for you or you can change your ISP as well.

5.  If you're worried about your email being "read" there is another easy solution-encrypt your email.

Tell us, who is your ISP and who is your hosting company?


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#7 Author of original report

Update and Response to Replies

AUTHOR: BoxcarsNoThanks - (United States of America)

 


First let me say, that despite the arguments for censorship filtering, the idea that any third party decides what freedom of communication is allowed and point out and Blacklists Americans whether or not it is in a jurisdiction where American law prevails or some dark corner of the world, I never agreed to it. It is a national security issue that billions (around the world) that communicate are subject to monitoring, control and punishment by rogue companies.


Historically we know what blacklisting is capable of. If you dont, visit a holocaust museum.


In my opinion, these companies are already running from the law of the US, crippling companies (including my own), defaming innocent people, and extorting money and information in the most laissez faire fashion.  They are ripping us off and companies like hotmail, gmail, godaddy, aol, etc. are waiving these filchers in for the long haul.


Blacklisting is not an American value.  The "known by the company you keep" happens to be my right to select any company I want as an ISP as well as any friend I want in my personal life.


The company I do not "keep" is that of one who blacklists Americans or Shuns them based on blacklists created by those in power or those with money.  As Americans we and our companies are allowed many freedoms as long as they do not infringe on anothers freedoms. This is not what blacklisting is about. It is about infringing on others freedoms.


The fact that spammers (which are a petty nuisance at best) are attracted to the least expensive companies means what? These hosting companies are wrong for offering deals? It means we should trample freedom? Post libel against innocent people? Start a society that spies and tells on each other? Maybe put a monopolizing technology in place?


Does a person agreeing to use AOL surrender knowingly their right to free market competition? Did they ever say blacklist law abiding people or that companies and users of certain softwares will be isolated from their businesses, unemployed or unable to send out resumes? No they never said. Americans want freedom to stay in place. We like it unlike other countries that shun and blacklist. Customers never knowingly surrendered their rights to freedom of communication (speech).


If a company blacklists my computer because I do not use a main stream email program (which by the way I do, I use MS Outlook.) how long before it dictates "the company I keep" personally. How long before my friends wonder why I havent written them in so long when in fact I have, it is in junk mail or worse silently deleted.  


In fact, the company I keep is changing because of monitoring and blacklisting by someone in  England, India,  Israel or God knows where. (Stress here is on "keep".)  


I have deals falling through because clients think Im lazy or don't care. This happens because they  are in a situation of assuming I didnt keep my word and send what I promised in time even though I did but Godaddy  or AOL just up and deleted it because I am on the blacklist. Some customers likely change their mind because the critical close of he deal took too long and the paper work was lost in junk mail.  


Pro blacklisting people might say I could just call. I tell you even I felt a bit smothering and desperate because I now have to call after sending each solicited email just to check it arrived. everyone knows in sales this kills deals and AOL makes me do this because the list they are holding has me on it. Why again was that? Because I am not "expected" to be sending emails to anyone. 


Worse, people are always looking for the positive and negative of someone they start building trust and business relationship with. How do I explain I'm not really a spammer. How do I explain why Spamhause in England thinks I am not worthy to send email because they dont expect email to come from my IP? It kills deals to explain this defamation and they likely won't believe me because they are just getting to know me. 


My reputation gets cheese throw all over it by AOL because Spamhaus thinks my IP is one not to expect email from? Who is AOL to call me Junk and why do they do it? Because of spam or because of power? Why are they using companies hiding behind non US laws? Why is AOL hiding behind their customers and saying they agreed to this?


I did more research on the issue and Spamhaus explanations and legal tauntings. Apparently they claim the PBL is not a blacklist, yet they contradict themselves by showing how to block using their PBL blacklist of IPs. The basis of their blocking on PBL is that IP is not expected to send email. Just as non main stream programs that may send emails differently than their preferences are not expected to send emails as
they do. Poppycock! Of course the are expected. 


The double talk reminds me of a liar and a con man. Did they list my IP? No a range. Did the say I sent spam? No they just didn't expect you to send mail. Did they say I used the wrong software? no not exactly but here we market others. Are they responsible? No not really its what AOL customers want. Can I sue? Yes but you better be rich.   If I am not listed can I get off the list? Yes. Why does this blacklist exist? Its not a blacklist. Will I ever come off the list? The blacklist is automatically updated to take people off who are innocent. I thought you said it wasn't a blacklist.  It's not because it doesn't block. What features does it have? It can be configured to block. 


How dare they stop freedoms in the US because they didn't expect my computers IP to do what I bought the computer to do?


One statistic I saw of theirs states this preference on sending (PBL) blocks 90% of emails sent and that those are SPAM filtered. That appears exaggerated. I have had many companies and clients over the years and never have I seen one get 90% Spam. More so, in hindsight, most of the Spam that I did see leaves me suspicious of the lack of a reasonable distribution across all products and markets. It was as if the reason for the SPAM was to generate SPAM as a problem itself and anoy people with a useless product. A small group, was my impression of the Spam that freely flowed through to my mail box and I delt with it without surrendering my freedoms and without creating a defamatory blacklisting society.


I question now why would the SPAM senders all compete on the same products? Most seemed to be Viagra and disgusting things that would bother users, such as asking about a mans size. The annoyance factor seemed to be edging the SPAM problem forward in the psych aspect.


It did not, in my opinion represent a cross section of the marketplace but rather something simulated by non business people. Programmers? I never saw a SPAM for bed sheets or soap. Women being the biggest internet shopping demographic, why little spam at the best demographic on the web? 


I question whether programmers overseas generated these to create a problem. Regardless of who generated most of it, how could we justify the reading billions of peoples emails across the world by private third parties? It is a rip off. The nuisance is not worth the sacrifice of freedom, defaming one person, collapsing one business, or contractually signing away my own rights.


Spamhause states on their website that the PBL blocking or listing (as Junk according to AOL) is not looking if the messages are spam. This is lazy programming in my opinion, why would they not care if it is or is not SPAM. 


As far as the main stream email programs, in my opinion, I can use my computer equipment however I want, sending from whatever IP/NIC that I want and I should not be extorted by a foreign company for money or personal details just so I can get off their list and experience the freedom of speech I once had before deviant contracts and cross border deals were struck to stick it to me and all Americans.


As I noted before, Spamhaus indicates Im not blacklisted but a range is. It states its not really a blacklist anyway. It then shows others this is how you block listed people (me) on the PBL list. Lastly it show how I can remove myself from a list that I am not listed on.


It states if I only fill out their questions and reveal my personal details and explain myself to them, I can get of their list and then will they expect emails from my computer.


What if they change their mind? What if they want more from me tomorrow? What if? It is a rip off.


AOL is innocent in putting this there because it is what I wanted? What my customers wanted? What their customers want? Get real.


The days of limited email resources has faded away so the overloaded server scenarios is bunk. We send videos with no problems, certainly the days of email load bearing is behind most of us. Certainly large companies such as Godaddy, Hotmail and AOL.


Apparently we need some Americans, Congress and Nations Security agencies to review the US constitution and take action to reign in this horror that started growing in America, namely blacklisting and extortion.


The intent of freedom of speech is about certain types of communication being free from restrictions and not about me being free to open my mouth in isolation as a victim of blacklisting. We are given this freedom to prevent this sort of power mongering thing from happening here in our land. 


We have corporations isolating people. The IP that they "don't expect" emails to come from is my personal laptop. If they black list me for communicating without regard to the legal definition SPAM and prevent me from doing business or prevent me or you from speaking with Americans about political issues, law and rights, the law has been violated.


I would also like to add that the mocking areas of Spanhaus legal pages stating that SLAPP suits are not allowed in the UK, just shows the bile in this whole blacklist attitude towards manipulating Americans. I see fear in their legal pages. 


Blacklisting and unfair competition is a crime that wears many hats and in this case to put it in IT security terms, the hat is no longer a white hat.


In my opinion as person who has lived in countries that shun and seen the intentions of those who actually program this technology, I can say without reservation I see a power grab at the core of the whole SPAM blocking ripoff. I see big sites like Google (which was involved in the drive by scanning of cell phones and mac addresses), betrayal of American trust to say the least, not given high page ranking on opponents to blacklisting and filtering our emails. I have seen proposals that the implement the same blacklisting on who gets ranked. 


Likely the AOL IT people who are administering to protection and the good dont see the full picture of blacklist. Does that make them free from responsibility?


For Spamhause to dictate what and how I can use my equipment to send lawful and correct protocol emails under threat of blacklist is not white hat security in my opinion.


The IT guys at AOL are they worldly enough to understand the ramifications in the same way the CEOs do? Are they not seeing the collapse of the business affected or do they just see is a computer screen cleared and possibly an opportunity to go on a coffee break. Are they not seeing the coercion, the power grabs and losses to freedom? Do the people responding to this ripoff see it? It is a ripoff.


For a company to say if I sue I must put all expected lawyer fees upfront and go to England, just confirms they are not playing by American freedom and rule of law. There is no reason America  cannot have their own Internet security companies under federal scrutiny and legislated to mind privacy and the letter of the law.


This blacklisting has gone too far already. See the image I am attaching.


 


To answer a posted comment: I understand much about firewalls and have documented and help troubleshoot these types of technologies as well as written best practices on how to configure them. So yes, I understand the way it works.


and to the other posted comment, no I will not post ISP or IPs as this ripoff employs the best and brightest hackers in the world. I know, I worked with them. That and there is a huge amount of power at stake should this technology stay in place beyond the reach or American law and common folk.


 


I shouldn't have to say blacklisting is a ripoff. We all know better.


 

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#8 Consumer Comment

Substantiation?

AUTHOR: Robert - (USA)

Where is your substantiation of your allegations?

You posted pages of allegations yet you don't offer any evidence of your assertions.  What email client do you use?  Who is the ISP for your email service?  You mention that you read a few reports but you didn't post any links to any of these reports you claim you read.  What is this blacklisting company you write about?

There is no substance in your tome.
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#9 Consumer Comment

Just an FYI.

AUTHOR: Flynrider - (USA)

It turns out that Billions of American consumers (including all of AOLs)  ... "

With billions of American businesses relying on...  "


   Just a thought.   Your arguments might carry more weight if they were not so obviously exaggerated.  For example, look up how many people live in the U.S.


   As for the rest of the rant, it is so technologically ill-informed that it would take pages to explain why it's apparent that you have no idea what is going on, how the Internet works, or how the law applies to the Internet.

   A quick example would be that your choice of email software has nothing to do with your IP address being on a blacklist.   Suffice it to say that you have chosen an ISP for mail delivery that is not above selling access to spammers.   Aesop's moral about being "known by the company you keep" applies quite aptly to Internet blacklists.  


  

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