SUBMITTED: Thursday, July 28, 2005
POSTED: Thursday, July 28, 2005
James,
You're in an unfortunate situation in an industry that is well known to be dishonest and deceitful. No one is about to sanitize the “system”, so you must rely on your own wits, and not be a sucker.
We all know that whenever it comes to cars, that the consumer is always on the short end of the stick. The auto industry, the backbone of America, is like a colony of ticks, sinking their teeth into your wallet, and not letting go. And unfortunately, too, people with no credit or bad credit are at the bottom of the food chain, and will be sucked dry since they don't have any financial resources to defend themselves or strike back. USA = you have to be rich to survive. But also, USA = you can use your brain to survive. With all of the rip-offs of the many suckers out there, it looks like the latter equation is seldom used.
Don't expect a tick to have feelings about you or your family, or your desperate situation.
Business is business and there is nothing personal or emotional about it. Bottom line is always profit margin, so they hustle to stay in the black and buy those big homes and vacations for their wives and kiddies.
I don't know what you would sue this Ugly Duckling for, and litigation doesn't come cheap. The best advice is to avoid any place that doesn't seem legit in the first place. I mean come on, why don't people just use their head?
It seems your wife went to Ugly Duckling with absolutely no idea of the value of cars. And why didn't you go with her? Shame on you! Salesmen love to see lone women come in, since they don't usually know a tire from a hubcap, and they make easy prey. These people are vultures, and you let her go it alone? You've just helped her set herself up to be one of their "Roaches" (suckers).
Why do people let themselves be a sucker? Don't they have any self worth? Are they just too lazy to prepare themselves for a major purchase? Would you walk into a den of wolves and let them eat you? Then why would you go to a used car lot, the territory of the notorious used car salesman, and essentially tell them to devour your wallet?
"Hello, Mister Upright, Honest, You've Got My Best Interests At Heart Used Car Person, I don't know anything about cars or how much they cost, but I want to buy one, and I need it today".
You've just cooked your own goose.
I bet the Ugly Duckling used car salesman is in the same boat as many salesmen are. Ugly Duckling seems to be such a schlock outfit (as most places are) that they don't pay anything to the salesman in the way of salary. Commission only, so you now have a pack of hungry ticks that would sell you anything that even resembles a car, at top dollar, so they can make some money..
Otherwise, they can't feed their wife or kids, and they'll eventually lose their job and home. They don't care if the car is falling apart, or if you have to pedal it like Fred Flintstone. They just need to earn a living, and they‘ll lie and manipulate you until they legally own a huge chunk of your future income.
So why don't you get a used car price book before you go to the salesman's territory? It's not hard. Then you know that the 2001 Supersonic 18-wheel drive SUV with power mud flaps isn't worth the 20 grand they're asking, it's only worth 9G's.
And for God's sake educate yourself and your wife a little bit. There are a ton of books out there about buying a used car. You are about to go into the ring with a professional salesman that's been selling cars his whole life. He knows every trick in the book to wring every last dollar out of your paycheck; and you know squat. Who's going to win and who's going to lose (big time) on this deal? That's a no brainer, isn't it?
You don't even need a brain to know these things.
Never, never sign anything until you're totally satisfied with the price, financing, condition of the vehicle, everything. Once you sign, you are stuck, period. You may spend the rest of your life paying for a car that went to the junkyard after 4-months on the road. An inspection of the vehicle by a professional mechanic that has no ties to the seller, is an absolute necessity. Never trust the salesman, he'll say anything to sell you that car. If his lips are moving, he's telling you lies. If his lips aren't moving, he's thinking up new lies to
tell you to get you to buy.
The repossession racket goes hand in hand with the used car sale. Miss even one payment and that's it, you're done, and it's entirely legal. Well, golly, your wife signed the loan papers, so now it's too late, what do you expect? If you have bad credit, you can't get a loan at a good bank, so you're stuck with the rip-off dealer financing, with super high rates and zero tolerance for missed or late payments, since you are a high risk loan for them. Don't like the loan terms? Was it even read? Then don't sign the damned paper unless you're sure what you're getting yourself into.
But any bank, good or bad, where you default on the loan, will eventually repossess your car, and auction it off at a low price; they can't afford to store it. And yes, they all will hold you responsible for the difference between the auction price and what you owe on the loan. Nothing illegal about that; you're wife was the one that promised to pay a certain amount, which was way above what the car was worth. Actually, Ugly Duckling did cut her a break by asking only $3000 more instead of $6000. They didn't have to do that. I know you don't feel that way, but what if they did want her to pay $6000 more dollars, that they are legally entitled to? There is no way to fight it, unless she declares bankruptcy.
And I just looked at your reports again, and your wife is being sued for the $6000. This is no surprise, is it?
Cosigning a loan is usually a very bad idea, since your credit rating might get ruined if there's problem down the road. Any negative activity on the loan will show up on your report, too, since you signed on the loan along with your wife. You're both responsible in that situation. Then you both will have lousy credit should the loan go sour. It's always best to keep at least one of you with top notch credit. But if you can keep up her payments if she's having trouble, and keep the account current, perhaps you should consider this option. Car loans are easy to get, and extremely easy to get with a cosigner. Just don't get took on the interest . If for some reason your wife gets pissed off at you, though, and refuses to pay on the loan, you either pay it for her , perhaps against your will or means, or lose the car and both your credit ratings take a deep dive. And don' forget a divorce may bring you a lot of grief with a cosigner situation, too. A lot to consider here.
You could get a car loan yourself, but of course the car would have to be in your name, not your wife's, so it won't legally belong to her until the loan is paid off and you transfer it to her name. If she's comfortable with this, it might be the way to go. And if your wife has any judgments against her from good old Ugly
Duckling, or anyone else, it is the only financing option that you will have available. No one will give her a car loan, even with a cosigner should she have unpaid judgments against her. Well, the loan sharks would, but we won't go there. Anyway, if the car was in her name, and she has an outstanding judgment, she might find her car down at the Sheriff's auction lot pretty quick being sold to pay Ugly Duckling. And there is no way to stop the Sheriff from towing the car away, unless you bury it somewhere, or pay off the judgment real quick. And don't forget , you could wind up with some of the same headaches as the cosigner loan, should you and your wife start not getting along.. Be prepared to keep up the payments yourself should she no longer contribute, even if you don't want to or are financially strapped. Fail to to this, and there goes the car and your good credit, and maybe even your marriage.
I think your best bet at this point is to buy the most expensive car that you can afford to pay cash for. No financing, which will also save on the insurance, no collision required. Here in NYS there are plenty of small car lots with cars $5 g's and under. The big places don't sell these cheap cars, since NYS law usually requires some sort of guaranty, and the big places can't make any money on a small margin, and perhaps repairs, too. If the dealer won't let you have the car checked out before you buy, quickly move on, since it is probably a lemon. The same goes for private sales. Although realize some people don't like inspections for the mere fact that they figure you're just trying to beat the price down. So promise not to derate the car if there are small things wrong with it. Don't forget, the car is used, and probably a bit old, so about any car is going to have some problems. Best bet is to stick with the cars that have the best reputation for
dependability, such as a Toyota Corolla or Camry. You can find plenty of these around, and at a good price. The Toyota engines last forever, and Toyota owners usually take good care of their cars.
Short on cash? Buy a beater car for $200 and drive it until it doesn't run anymore and then have the junk yard buy it for $50 and buy another one. Junk yards usually have running beater cars displayed out front of the yard: they try to sell them cheap before they get the car scrapped and it goes to the crusher. Many people just give away their old cars to the yard, so if you look around, you may be able to find one of these that the owner will give you free for the hauling, or you can buy it cheap at the yard. If the car needs a little repair, try a mechanic at an auto shop, and ask if he'd repair the car on his own personal time for cheap, and the repair needn't be perfect, since the car won't last for long anyway. Just enough to keep it running. Meanwhile, you are saving your money to buy a better car. Of course if you're into the “social status” frame of mind, you won't be comfortable in a beater unless the car looks real good and doesn't make noise or smoke.
To battle with the credit bureau is pretty useless. They just report what they are told. I'm sure that your wife now shows a history of late payments and repossession by Ugly Duckling on her report. Not good things, and it can get worse. There's still the matter of the $3000. They will surely get a deficiency judgment for $3000 on her, if not for the entire 6G's. It may include court costs and attorney fees, plus back interest. Then once entered, the whole mess will earn interest at the amount allowed by your State. Here in NY it is 9%, but not compounded. Judgments in NY last for 20-years. Yes, that is 20-years, and to make it worse, that 20-years restarts every time you make a voluntary payment, or an involuntary payment through wage garnishment or grabbing your bank account. The only way out is to negotiate a settlement, or file bankruptcy, which can be tricky if you have real estate or substantial assets. Most of your negotiation power is pretty well shot once a judgment is entered, so your best bet is to negotiate right away. Make the best deal that you can, and the one you can afford, and ask them in return to remove the black marks from your wife's credit report. Do I need to tell you to get the whole deal in writing and make sure it's signed by the Manager
in charge of the loan, before you send any money?
As for putting consumer comments on a report, as one person suggested, this is pretty futile. No one pays them much mind, and they are not even usually read, since computers do all the credit scoring these days.
More of your consumer rights bite the dust; they always find a way to defeat them.
I hope you now understand how careful you must be before you sign your name.
There are a lot of lawyers out there, but you'll find all of the consumer protections you thought you had are just mostly a cloud of smoke. The litigation route is a hard way to go, you're on your own as one “consumer rights” attorney told me. He's busy with class action suits, where he makes all the money and the Plaintiffs get squat. To take an individual case, he would have to charge more than what it would be worth to you, and you would probably lose anyway, since I can't see what you could sue Ugly Duckling for. A contingency basis suit would not bring in enough money for you to split it with him, so he wouldn't make enough to cover his work, and when you lose, he's out his pay entirely. The Courts will not award him his fee if you should win, one big reason that you'll never find an attorney to take your case, unless the amounts involved are huge and the case is solid.
Does your State have a used car lemon law? This is an avenue that you could probably pursue, since you had problems with the car shortly after it was purchased. Didn't the car come with some sort of warranty? I mean, it it had a 99-point inspection done, they must have provided something to back that up, in writing. What actually happened to the car? You state it “blew up”, but what does that mean? Since you waited until the car was repossessed, you may be SOL. If there are any legal options for you, they'e usually pretty
slim to begin with and dwindle each day you don't take action. Best to hurry if you do have a legal option; call the Attorney General. Small Claims Court might be your actual best course of action, but claims are usually limited to fairly small amounts .
Does Ugly Duckling register with your State DMV and have a shop ID #? Register a complaint about them, and everyone else do the same. Enough complaints might get the DMV to do something about them.
I f the complaints keep rolling in, they might pull their license to sell and/ or repair vehicles. I've never heard of this happening though. There's tons of crooked shops in NY, they register with the State, and many have been in business forever.