Keystone RV Company Thor industries Crossroads RV Dutchmen RV company Sold Fifth Wheel RV with an Untested Defective PEX pipe and Multitude of Warranty Issue to a Cancer Patient Goshen, IN

To provide some background information about our purchase of this defective 2022 Keystone Montana Fifth Wheel RV we bought from a dealer called Sunrise RV in Omak, Washington whereas this RV company is owned by Sunrise Chevrolet in Omak, Washington. The 2022 Keystone Montana RV was manufactured by Keystone RV Company, which this company is located in Goshen, Indiana.  Please be advised, our experience with this dealer and manufacture is they will not honor their warranties on their products that they sell.  Both the dealer and manufacture should not be trusted whatsoever.  We don't know how Sunrise Chevrolet deals with its customers, but be warned this company does own Sunrise RV.

In November of 2022, my wife and I purchased a brand new 2022 Keystone Montana Fifth Wheel RV, model 3761FL.  The reason we bought this RV is because I was diagnosed with stage 4 head and neck cancer.  Our home was currently being remodeled by myself when we found out the bad news.  The doctor told us that I could not be in a bunch of construction dust and dirt, before and after the surgery, so we ended up purchasing this RV, so I could have a clean place to live, while recovering from a radical cancer surgery, chemotherapy treatments, and rehabilitation.

We ended up putting a large deposit down using our Capital One Visa card and financed the rest of the purchase of the RV through WSECU, (Washington State Employees Credit Union).  After providing Sunrise RV with a large deposit, we asked the dealer do a couple of upgrades to the solar system and water heater in the RV and were waiting on it to be delivered to our home.

The Many Issues We Found with this So-Called Legendary Fifth Wheel RV.

The first issue started when the dealer was taking a long time to complete the upgrades and deliver the RV to our home.  The dealer had all kinds of excuses and blamed the delivery of the RV on parts not being on hand, the part supplier not having and sending the parts, and also the weather.  The dealer ended up delivering the RV on New Year Eve, December 31, 2022, which was nearly 2 months after purchasing the RV.

We don't believe that the RV would have been delivered on this day either, other than the fact we had checked the weather in Omak, Washington by looking at the Washington State Department of Transportation web cams to see if there was snow on the streets in Omak, on I-90, and Snoqualmie Pass, which of course there wasn't.

We texted the salespersons Charlie Breshears and Michael the new salesperson about why they had not delivered the RV, we also e-mailed them pictures of the streets in Omak, I-90, and Snoqualmie Pass showing Charlie that there was no snow on the pass and driving conditions were good for delivery of the RV. We did this so Charlie would not have excuses for not delivering the RV.  We really did not think that the RV would have been delivered to us this day either, if we had not sent photos and road conditions to them.  This must have been embarrassing to them for us to check the weather conditions.  It was really poor customer service, if you ask us.

Anyhow, the RV was delivered by a service / deliver driver and the Sales Consultant Charlie Breshears on December 31, 2022.  Both employees of Sunrise RV setup our RV in our driveway. Prior to delivery we had spent $1000's to level our driveway, put in a 50 amp electrical service and sewer hookup for the RV, weeks prior to the delivery.

The second issue that we experienced was with the RV.  When the dealer went to level the RV with the self-leveling mechanism, it wasn't apparently working properly, because Charlie could not get it to auto level.  Charlie did not diagnose the issue with the self-leveling mechanism or even discuss this with us that there was an issue, he instead manually leveled the RV using the leveling system mechanism.  Come to find out, when we sent the RV back for the warranty work and the major pipe leaking issue, which we will discuss in more detail on here, we found out the curbside front landing gear (hydraulic jack) was bent.  Supposedly, the dealer replaced the landing gear.

The third issue we found, after Charlie Breshears manually leveled the RV, he then showed us the RV's features of the instant hot that we had upgraded from a water tank and solar panel command center, and the other features in the RV. Charlie gave us a brief narrative on how to operate these things inside the RV.  When checking over the RV, the third issue we noticed is there was water on the floor of the RV in the Kitchen/Galley and bathroom area.  We asked Charlie Breshears why there was water on the floor of the RV.  Charlie Breshears stated that it was probably water from the toilet that splashed out onto the floor of the RV, while traveling from Omak, WA. to Kent, WA.  This really seemed strange to us why water would splash out of the toilet, but we accepted Charlie's theory of what may have happened and why there was water on the floor.  We would latter find out this was not the reason at all and that there was a leaking pipe in the wall of the RV.

Our understanding is that we are not the first customers to deal with defective PEX piping in Keystone RV's either, according to other reviews on Keystone RV's.  Its a really big issue with Keystone RV's, because the people who are doing the work putting together these RV's don't know what they are doing and are not testing these water systems, before shipping out these RV's to the dealers.  The dealers are also not checking to make sure there are no leaks in the PEX piping or in the grey and black water tanks.  This is causing the RV customers big headaches when they first connect their RV to water systems and the RV floods, causing major damage or when put water or sewage in the holding tanks.  In some cases, the owner of the RV, finds out months later after so much damage has been done that the RV is consider worthless.

The forth issue, after Charlie Breshears setup the RV, he immediately left back to Omak, WA. with our keys to the RV.  We called him on the phone and he did not want to come back to drop off the keys.  He said he would FedEx the keys to us, but never followed through on his promise to us.

We ended up having to call Charlie Breshears again to get the keys sent to us.  We at this point let Charlie Breshears know about all the problems with warranty items we had found so far in the RV, which should have been fixed prior to delivering the RV to us.  We asked Charlie why they did not look over the RV, before delivering the RV.  They only had months to make sure the RV was in tip top shape.  We ended up having to purchase a new lock, so we could lock the RV door as we where not staying at the property and we did not want vagrants or thieves breaking in to the RV.  This lock was not cheap either.  We also had the locksmith make keys to the store compartments too.

After the delivery of the RV, the fifth issue we found was the RV was really dirty.  As seen in the pictures at https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com

The dealer did not take the time to clean the RV or fix any of the warranty items needing fixed in the RV.  There was mud and dirt on the floors.  Besides this, the heat register ducts had construction debris, dirt, saw dust, loose screws, and other types unknown debris in the heat register ducts.  As you can see in the pictures...

Now we specifically asked Salesperson Michael, if Sunrise RV would make sure that the heating ducts and RV were clean before the delivery.  We explained to Michael that we had bought an RV travel trailer before from Keystone and found construction debris in the heating ducts.  We also explained that we had found a vinyl front trim piece detached on the Montana RV when we viewed the RV.  This part needed to be fixed prior to delivery.  Salesman Michael assured us that the RV would be cleaned and checked for any issues prior to delivery of the RV.  This was not the case when the dealer delivered the RV.  The RV was extremely dirty and the vinyl trim still was not fixed when the RV was delivered at our home.  Charlie also made excuses for the trim not being fixed.

The fifth issue we found, after doing some cleaning of the RV and looking at the appliances that the doors on the refrigerator were misaligned.  We don't know why the dealer had missed this, but when we called back after making a list of items that needed addressed.  The dealer's technician said that he was not going to come to our home out of the kindness of his heart to fix these items, whereas the dealer should had fixed or repaired these warranty items prior to selling and delivering this RV to us.

This sixth issue was not damaged when we viewed the RV in Omak, WA, prior to us purchasing the RV.  This item is the console where the 50" T.V. is recessed into a cabinet.  When the RV was delivered to us there was a split in the wood and scratches on the cabinet top as shown in the picture here.  You can also see the dirt and construction debris on the cabinet and T.V. in the pictures we posted on https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com/

The seventh issue we found is that there were miscellaneous scratches throughout the cabinetry inside the RV.  Again when we originally viewed the trailer we did not see these kind of scratches on the cabinetry.  The trailer looked new when we viewed the RV before we bought it.

The eight issue we found is the instant hot system that was installed by Sunrise RV in order to upgrade the factory water heater in the RV also was not working properly.  The instant hot would not get up to 124 degrees.  The dealers technician claimed he checked the unit after installing it and that it was working fine.  The technician even had the balls to claim it was user error.  When we called his boss, we told him what he said to us and we told him that we have been turning on hot water for more than fifty years of our life.  We also found out that the instant hot was not electrical/gas model as we had asked and paid for to be installed.  This instant hot model was gas only.  We ended up calling the manufacture of the instant hot to get help to diagnose problem, because the technician refused to come to our property to fix it.  The instant hot manufacture was very helpful and after providing the error codes, they were able to figure out that the technician who installed the instant hot did not adjust the flow properly.  We told technical support guy at the instant hot manufacture what the dealer's technician said to us.  The technical support guy at the instant hot manufacture said, "he said it was user error?"  The technical support guy at the instant hot manufacture then said, "what did he think you only turned on the cold water?' The technical support guy then called the dealer's technician a moron. You can see the video on https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com/ of the instant hot not getting over a 102 degrees, when the temperature was set for 124 degrees.

The ninth issue we found is the refrigerator was advertised on the dealers website (Sunrise RV) that it had an ice maker in it.  When we checked the refrigerator doors we also looked inside the freezer and there was no ice maker.  Nothing short of false advertising.

The tenth issue we found is that the gas range knob light was not working properly.  The lights are suppose to come on to let you know that the gas is turned on.  We had a knob light that would just come on when there was no gas that was turned on.  The light intermittently would just turn on.  We again took a video of the issue and sent it to the dealer and manufacture.  The dealer (Sunrise RV) refused to come out and fix this issue on the gas range.  We had to call the manufacture and they too dragged their feet, until January 18, 2023 when we woke up to a lake in our kitchen galley and bathroom.

The eleventh issue is the worst issue we found on this new fifth wheel.  We only had this RV at our property for roughly 18 days at most, until we where rudely awaken to a lake in our Kitchen/Galley and Bathroom on the morning of January 18th, 2023, which prior to this leaking PEX pipe, we spent at least 5 days just cleaning the RV, and we spent several days getting the electrical and water hookups ready at our home, besides buying and installing the locks for the RV after the dealer took the keys with them, after dropping off the fifth wheel on our property.  This all happen prior to finding the leak and the mold (defects) in the RV storage area.  Remember, this RV was supposed to be new, as that's what we paid to get.

The manufacture and dealer have had our RV in their possession now for over a year now, while we are still paying huge payments for the RV to the financier WSECU.  The floors and insulation are still are not fixed/repaired/replaced from the water damage due to this water leak in the wall, which was a manufactures defect in the untested PEX piping.  Your can see the picture and video of the leak and damage on https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com/

After the so-called warranty repairs were done, we used a Fiber-optic camera to check underneath the floor in the storage area.  We found the insulation was still wet. We also found mold too.

Mold is extremely dangerous to those with immunosuppressed immune systems.  Those who have or are going through treatment for cancer will have weaker immune systems, the effects of breathing in mold can be much worse and can potentially lead to death.  We explained this to the Keystone RV company and Sunrise RV in several e-mails we sent to both companies.  The oncologist at Fred Hutchinson Cancer Center, which treated Alan, wrote a letter of concern for both companies to read and it was sent to both them via e-mail.  The oncologist advised against living in the fifth wheel RV that was flooded, which was due to these companies own negligence of not testing the water systems, prior to selling their trailers to the public.

Insulation and OSB manufactures both warn companies that use their products to build RV's, homes, and other products about the potential effects of mold should their products get wet.

The RV Manufactures and dealers should both be doing their jobs of understanding building product service warnings and Material Data Safety Sheets, prior to building or servicing any product were habitancy of humans will dwell

In the picture on https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com, you can see that the insulation manufacture warns about their products getting wet and the only solution to repair it, if it gets wet, is to replace it.  This picture was taken from a bag of rock wool insulation, which rockwool is water resistant, unlike the insulation that is installed the Keystone RV's.  We asked Keystone and Sunrise to replace the OSB floors and the insulation that got wet, due to the RV manufactures defect of the assembly of the PEX piping.

OSB manufactures have put out a technical bulletin on mold, which states that almost all building materials are susceptible to surface mold formation under certain conditions and the key to eliminating mold growth on surfaces is by controlling the moisture.  The Structural Board Association states that OSB is manufactured very dry with the average moisture content in panels leaving the warehouse have less than 5% moisture content. The Structural Board Association states that OSB in not waterproof or mold resistant.  The Structural Board Association warns that prolong high moisture or wet conditions there is a potential of mold growth.  When we had the dealer pick up the fifth wheel to fix the defect and do the warranty work it was near the end of January 2023.  After the defective Pex pipe was fixed and the warranty work was supposedly completed it was March of 2023.  Please see the technical bulletin locate here.

In March 2023, we went to the dealer's location where the trailer is still today there at the dealers location, which was to fixed.  The dealer stated that they have fixed the defective PEX pipe and supposedly completed the warranty work that was needed on the fifth wheel trailer.  We then checked and inspected the floors to see if the delaminated floor was replace in the storage area.  What we found when we got there and did the inspection of the fifth wheel, we found that the floor in the storage area was warped, delaminated, and still wet after a couple of months after being picked up by the dealer.  We also found the kitchen and bathroom floors were soft too.

We use moisture meters on the floors and wall and found moisture content as high as 99%.  The alarm was going off on both moisture meters that we used.  We also used a fiber optic camera to look below the floor in the storage area and we found the insulation was still wet and we also found mold underneath the OSB wood panels.  It appears the dealer tried to cleaned the mold off on the inspection panel and bathroom wall inside the storage area.  The dealer as well removed some of the wet insulation from around the pipes in the storage area.  The wood tested as being very wet, roughly 50 times the moisture content of when the OSB was originally made by the structural board manufacture.  This moisture testing was done several months after the water damage had occurred, so the dealer did not even try to dry our the wood and insulation.

In the pictures and video on the website (https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com) we used two different meters to positively confirm our moisture readings were correct.  As seen in the pictures one meter reading was 22.5% near the pipe hole, which is roughly 4 1/2 times what the OSB board should be.  On the other meter, which was further away from the pipes and pipe hole, closer to the entrance door or opening into the storage area, the moisture reading was 16.1%, which is roughly 3-plus times that of dry OSB moisture reading.

Below the door opening and floor in the storage area is a black and grey water tank area for dumping the waste water tanks. This area is below the storage door and floor.  We took a moisture content reading with the General Moisture Meter and it was 22.7%, which it is more than 4 1/2 times of what a dry OSB floor should read.

There is a moisture content reading picture we took in the pipe hole where the insulation is located.  As you can see in the picture that the moisture content is at 99.9% and the alarm is going off on the moisture content meter.  This moisture content reading is roughly 20 times higher than dry OSB with a 5% moisture content.

We also took a moisture reading near the back of the RV, where the RV was not water damaged. This is what dry OSB sheets look like that come from the factory.  Note, the moisture content reading in the RV of the dry OSB is at 2.8%.

Both the manufacture and dealer are refusing to repair or replace the OSB floors and the insulation.  Sunrise RV and Keystone RV are also refusing to refund us our money for the RV, since they don't want to fix the issues.  The manufacture obviously doesn't honor their warranty on these fifth wheels or their products they make.  The manufacture calls their fifth wheel's legendary.  We call these fifth wheels very expensive legendary pieces of s**t with epic defects.

The financier Washington State Employees Credit Union (WSECU) was contacted immediately about the issue, but failed to take any action against the dealer and manufacture.

We then contacted our credit card company Capital One and did a charge back on the deposit we paid Sunrise RV.  We told Capital One about the defect issues and Capital One recovered our deposit money.  We were then asked by Capital One to provide them information showing them our claim about the defects in the RV.  We sent Capital One this information we posted here on this website and more, which shows the water damage to floors and the wet insulation, and also including a statement from the dealer (Sunrise RV) who stated the floors are damaged.  We sent all this information to Capital One's on-line file folder by uploading the files to their servers that Capital One created for us.  We provided the all this information, pictures, and more than what's posted on this website in timely manner as required before the submission date deadline.  We then confirmed with Capital One that they had received all the information we had sent to them.  Capital One said they would take it from here.  Capital One then supposedly failed to sent any of our response, pictures, dealer statement, and the video to Visa Card disputes in a timely fashion.  We then were again re-charged for the deposit after successfully disputing the defective merchandise with the credit card company.

We called and spoke with the Capital One representatives about the charge back multiple times and on January 30, 2024 and the representative stated for the second time they had screwed up and the company would make good on the mistake.  After fighting with Capital One to get the money back for about a year now, Capital One finally said to us, 'tough luck' about the money, claiming this was lemon law case.  We told the bank representative that this was not a lemon law case as the RV doesn't have a motor in it.  We told Capital One that this was a consumer protection issue.   We also told the supervisor that we will stop using their credit cards and she said no biggy.  Since then we have stopped using our Capital One Visa card and we are now in the process of closing our bank account their too.

We don't recommend anyone to use Capital One, as you too may get screwed over by Capital One, just like we did.  We've been banking with Capital One since they bought out ING Direct, which has been many years of never having any type of issue with doing a charge backs on bad products or services.  Capital One does not have your back, so make sure you don't have this card in your wallet when you buy something!  So much for Capital One and WSECU protecting their customers and stopping predators like Keystone RV and Sunrise RV from robbing their customers and also a cancer patient!

We will be adding more to our review on this website (https://www.peerreviewedproducts.com/ over the coming months with more pictures, video's of the defects, e-mails, even the dealers acknowledgement of the damage floors and warranty issues.

In the mean time, in order to protect yourself from predators like these, please find a different Manufacture, Dealer, and Financiers to buy your RV from, because this manufacture and dealer will not honor their warranties and the financiers will not help you get the dealer and manufacture to abide by the terms of their warranties.