Report: #309853

Complaint Review: Abunza

  • Submitted: Mon, February 18, 2008
  • Updated: Mon, December 14, 2009
  • Reported By: Calais Maine
  • Abunza

    Nationwide
    U.S.A.

Show customers why they should trust your business over your competitors...

I got scammed by Abunza. Search it and if you ask what it is and how you make money, the response is always the same:

Abunza is a revolutionary new marketing system that is untapping and bridging the online spanish language market. Abunza has introduced a revolutionary MLM (Multi-Level Marketing) business model which pays out 100% commission on every product sold to the retail customers. BLA BLA BLA...Start today for only $997 and make the money you always dreamed of!

It does not matter who you inquire, the run around answers always feature the same cleverly worded dialog. THIS IS THE MARKETING YOU WILL BE DOING. Your never told what it is because they want you to buy into the program, people get curious until they can't stand it and that is how they make their money. There are some ebook sales in Europe- just enough to make the company look ligitimate. Faced with dispair, I searched and found it's called a pyramid scam. Notice there are no negative comments ANYWHERE on the web..They search and delete them. To prove this the best I can, look around close to home. Money making businesses are hidden for the chosen few and skilled. No one is gonna be like "MAN join this company and sell more than me so I go out of business, all for just $997!" and be serious. Look on youtube. Hardly a negative comment because they are all deleted and flagged by insiders.

Spread the word that it is a scam and drive the thieves out of business! Others who have been ripped off..post your experience too! Any rebuttals by Abunza will be deleted, just like you do to us!

Chris
Calais, Maine
U.S.A.
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This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 02/18/2008 01:15 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/abunza/nationwide/abunza-scam-how-they-got-us-nationwide-309853. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author
12Consumer
1Employee/Owner

#1 Consumer Comment

Another red flag

AUTHOR: Your Neighbor - (United States of America)

It is good advice to research a company before handing over any money, in spite of company claims.  I found another red flag.  In addition to the "official" Abunza company address mentioned above 2350 SOUTH JONES BLVD, SUITE 101-3C Las Vegas, NV 89146, I was able to locate another Abunza company address.  I found this when researching the ownership of "Abunza.com."   The internet registry "whois" lists ownership to Michael Spire at 2950 E. Flamingo Road, Suite B Las Vegas, NV 89121.  This address is just another "form-a-corp" agent, if not the same one, phone number disconnected.  If an offer seems too good to be true, it usually is.
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#2 Consumer Comment

Read the FINE PRINT (if you like)

AUTHOR: Junior - (U.S.A.)

I've never joined the Abunza Company or any other similar networking operation, but I have studied up on a lot of them. Before coming here and reading these various reports, I was just in the Abunza site reading their FAQ page, which was actually put there right in front of me and I didn't even have to look around for it like so many other sites that will effectively force you to search for specific items of information.

What I found there actually pleasantly surprised me, because it was being TOTALLY HONEST from anything I could detect in factually identifying that only about 2% of ANYBODY who joins similar systems end up making any money from them AT ALL. They did otherwise offer an at least generally objective evaluation comparing a so-called "2-Up" compensation plan versus a "2-Tier" compensation plan - which is what their system apparently employs - to suggest that their system was at least easier to make some money on even if it only meant breaking even on the investment.

Beyond that, their fine-print commentary further offered to illustrate where 90% of the income produced through any direct-selling organization is generated by only 10% of the participants. There should certainly be no argument coming from anyone on that front, since it has been known forever where statistical analysis shows that more than 90% of ALL NEW BUSINESSES are proven to fail within the first two years of being in business, and necessarily REGARDLESS of the business type or category. So it would only make sense that 90% or more of people who attempt to become successful at SELLING (which is one of the hardest businesses to succeed in anyway) should also fail based on any available historical data that I am aware of in terms.

As far as the content of the dialogue was concerned within the FAQ page, there is no indication that the company is offering to somehow REMOVE themselves from the statistical norm in terms of a success rate versus failure rate for anyone who chooses to become involved in the business model. In fact, when the question was posed as to what a person might expect in the way of monetary success, the answer given was plainly reflective of the consideration, to the effect of, "you get out of the system what you put into it." In other words -- "RESULTS WILL VARY."

If a person blindly buys into something because his or her EMOTIONS became overwhelmed with CURIOSITY at all the goings-on about any given ideal, then probably those types of personalities rest as cases of people are not good candidates for being in business for themselves in the first place, since becoming successful - and remaining successful - in any business entails MAKING SMART AND INFORMED BUSINESS DECISIONS.

If you buy a used car based on the straight body and the nice paint job, but don't check to see whether the "title is clean" or not, and then come to find out the electrical system is shot because the vehicle had been through a FLOOD, then a lot of that problem is YOUR FAULT for not being smart enough to do your own homework.

Likewise, if you buy into an online business - or any business - without at least reading the FAQ page and other fine print for what its worth enough to know that NO FALSE CLAIMS are being made, then shame on you for berating the business model simply because you could not personally make it succeed for you...
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#3 Consumer Comment

Reports Can't Be Edited or removed from Rip Off Report....

AUTHOR: Carolinagirl - (U.S.A.)

The value of Ripoff Report is that companies who rip people off are reported and Ripoff Report has a "no removal policy." If a company refuses to take consumer complaints seriously and they attempt to resolve the issue, or resolve consumer complaints, now there is a place they can post a complaint. As time goes on, you will see ALL consumers who have been ripped off by this company listed in this report and then the company will understand "yes you can make money on the internet, however, if you are not legitimate, honest, customer focused and above board. If this company is above board, honest and a legitimate money maker, happy consumers will not file complaints!

I applaud Ripoff Report for sticking to the rules. I am sure this company has already sent letters to attempt to remove these comments. What I like the most about Rip Off Report is that you will begin to see the Ripoff report show up right under the company name on the search engine. As more and more consumers make complaints, the good and the bad are quickly identified! So my advise is CONSUMER - if you are happy with this company, use this forum to rebut these negative comments. However, if you have been ripped off by this company, please add your comments and alert others to the scheme!
Best regards,
Kim
North Carolina, NC
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#4 Consumer Suggestion

Abunza Has False Misleading Address

AUTHOR: Lee25ca - (U.S.A.)

To: Michael Spire So Called co-founder of Abunza.com

I was looking into joining Abunza and like in every invesment i first look into the company's history.

on your website Abunza.com i entered to the contact us page and the following address comes up :

2350 S. Jones Blvd. Ste. 101-3C
Las Vegas, NV 89146

well i checked out this address on the BBB and guess what the address is linked to a different company by the name of:
Form-A-Corp, LLC

this company offers Incorporation Services which means it incorprorates company's online and provides them with a LLC

Its funny because your company's legal name stated in your website is Abunza, LLC

so i guess you guys came up with the smart idea to put down your company's address
as same as the company that probally got your LLC registered.

Even dought there is no such Company as Abunza, LLC according to the Better Business Burea

so please "MR Michael Spire" (Hope its not a alias name) would you explain to me why your company is not listed with the Better Business Burea and the address you are stating in your website belongs to a different company.


i hope you will have logical anwsers for these questions.
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#5 Consumer Comment

This report doesn't add up

AUTHOR: Connie - (U.S.A.)

If your claim that Abunza deletes negative comments found on the internet was true, why is yours still found?

I'm an independent distributor for Abunza. My experience with Abunza has been positive. I joined at the Elite level and received access to the entire digital library and other personal development software. I would've paid $10,000 for this privilege alone.
I always get the impression that the co-owners really do care about everybody's success and I'm very appreciative of them.

I plan on using the free unlimited travel certificates. As I do enjoy traveling very much. The best part about it is, I get to be away on vacation and my Abunza system will still be making money while I'm sipping my day away.

Try checking out the webinar archive. This alone is a wealth of knowledge in "how-to." And next time, step into the car and actually drive it. It may not be too late.

In Abundance,

Connie aka JobBasher.com

P/S I'm sorry your particular case did not work out well.
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#6 Consumer Comment

This report doesn't add up

AUTHOR: Connie - (U.S.A.)

If your claim that Abunza deletes negative comments found on the internet was true, why is yours still found?

I'm an independent distributor for Abunza. My experience with Abunza has been positive. I joined at the Elite level and received access to the entire digital library and other personal development software. I would've paid $10,000 for this privilege alone.
I always get the impression that the co-owners really do care about everybody's success and I'm very appreciative of them.

I plan on using the free unlimited travel certificates. As I do enjoy traveling very much. The best part about it is, I get to be away on vacation and my Abunza system will still be making money while I'm sipping my day away.

Try checking out the webinar archive. This alone is a wealth of knowledge in "how-to." And next time, step into the car and actually drive it. It may not be too late.

In Abundance,

Connie aka JobBasher.com

P/S I'm sorry your particular case did not work out well.
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#7 Consumer Comment

This report doesn't add up

AUTHOR: Connie - (U.S.A.)

If your claim that Abunza deletes negative comments found on the internet was true, why is yours still found?

I'm an independent distributor for Abunza. My experience with Abunza has been positive. I joined at the Elite level and received access to the entire digital library and other personal development software. I would've paid $10,000 for this privilege alone.
I always get the impression that the co-owners really do care about everybody's success and I'm very appreciative of them.

I plan on using the free unlimited travel certificates. As I do enjoy traveling very much. The best part about it is, I get to be away on vacation and my Abunza system will still be making money while I'm sipping my day away.

Try checking out the webinar archive. This alone is a wealth of knowledge in "how-to." And next time, step into the car and actually drive it. It may not be too late.

In Abundance,

Connie aka JobBasher.com

P/S I'm sorry your particular case did not work out well.
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#8 Consumer Comment

This report doesn't add up

AUTHOR: Connie - (U.S.A.)

If your claim that Abunza deletes negative comments found on the internet was true, why is yours still found?

I'm an independent distributor for Abunza. My experience with Abunza has been positive. I joined at the Elite level and received access to the entire digital library and other personal development software. I would've paid $10,000 for this privilege alone.
I always get the impression that the co-owners really do care about everybody's success and I'm very appreciative of them.

I plan on using the free unlimited travel certificates. As I do enjoy traveling very much. The best part about it is, I get to be away on vacation and my Abunza system will still be making money while I'm sipping my day away.

Try checking out the webinar archive. This alone is a wealth of knowledge in "how-to." And next time, step into the car and actually drive it. It may not be too late.

In Abundance,

Connie aka JobBasher.com

P/S I'm sorry your particular case did not work out well.
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#9 UPDATE Employee

Hey You! Silly.

AUTHOR: Connie - (U.S.A.)

Don't you think a person of average intelligence will wonder, "Then why is your report not deleted?" So you can't go around saying that Abunza deletes negative comments found on the internet, can you? Because yours still exists. Silly.

Sorry your experience wasn't that good. Did you check out the webinars in the back office? There's a wealth of information found there alone.
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#10 Consumer Comment

Attorney Nehra did NOT approve Abunza's plan

AUTHOR: Len Clements - (U.S.A.)

When I first saw that Gerald Nehra, who is a friend, had allegedly "approved" of this program I found that very hard to believe, so I ask him. He claimed that he had asked Abunza to remove him from their FAQ section and they were "ignoring" him (although his reference was obviously removed eventually). Specifically to his alleged "approval" of their commission plan, here is what he said (quoted with permission):

"I did some early review - I have NOT approved the current plan."

"I told them the following was ILLEGAL - and it is still in the program..."

[From the Abunza web site] "Besides the initial investment of $997 and the monthly fee of $49.97, there are no additional fees required to maintain your Abunza business."

This email conversation took place back in late March, 2008, but it appears these aspects of Abunza's plan are, in deed, still in the program.

Len Clements
MarketWave, Inc.
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#11 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Please Get Your Facts Right - Response From An Owner/Co-Founder

AUTHOR: Abunza - (U.S.A.)

Hi,

My name is Michael Spire and I started this company with my partner Sebastian Saldarriaga.

The reason your post is one of the very few complaints out there on the internet is simple. We provide an excellent product, training, and true support. We don't hide behind any website and we make ourselves available to our members every day.

First, to rebutt your false claims:

1) When we started this company, legality was top priority. We consulted with specialized attorneys, including Gerry Nehra (who was paid by Abunza for his advice). Gerry asked us to remove his name from the website, so we did. But the fact is that he was consulted and he approved the business plan.

2) The commission members earn is on the sales of actual product. There is no "joining fee" that members are paid commission on. Commission is paid on actual digital products with a value that far exceeds the price that is paid. In fact, Abunza recently partnered with Tom Hua of World Internet Summit, and Abunza Elite members now gain access to an entire digital library of Internet Marketing training videos, subtitled in Spanish. World Internet Summit is the biggest internet business event on the planet.

3) This is a two tier affiliate program that pays out 100% commission. In other words, the distributors make more than the company. This is because Abunza wants it's members to be successful and earn as much direct income as possible. What could you not like about that?

If you quit Abunza, don't blame Abunza for your lack of success. Like any business, performance is based on individual effort. If you don't apply yourself and attend the trainings, then it doesn't matter what business you join, you will not be successful. It is much easier to point fingers than to take responsiblity for something yourself.

I'm proud of what we created with Abunza, and I'm grateful that the number of detractors out there is overwhelmed by the amazing amount of positive response of actual members who have experienced first hand what Abunza has to offer.

There is much much more that I can write to further demonstrate the amount of value that Abunza delivers, but for the purpose of brevity, I'll let the videos and satisfied Abunza members speak for themselves.

Sincerely,

Michael Spire
co-founder
Abunza.com
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#12 Consumer Comment

Pyramid Scheme

AUTHOR: John - (U.S.A.)

Guys
you all have no idea what is going on here. All pyramid schemes look legit and early adopters make a fortune. The late comers get left holding the bag!
Thats why such schemes are illegal.

Abunza is in my opinion just such a scheme. Use your own judgment to decide but here are the facts:

1. there is no offical corporate website explaining the company background, founders or anything. Where are they incorporated? Who are they? Who pays you your money? This should be a red flag right away.

2. The scheme has no proper retail products. I know they have that digital nonsense they claim is worth $75,000 and can be sold at retail, but no one in this deal is making any money that way. Because no one will buy digital products of doubtful value. This is strike #1. In order to be judged a legit program, the FTC will look to see if the Abunza business would survive if retail was the sole activity of its distributors. Its clear that this program would die a sudden death in that scenario.

3. The commissions paid are not "wholesale commissions" as claimed by the schemes promoters. They are in fact recruiting based payments. It is illegal to pay distributors an incentive commission for recruits. Commssions can only be paid for the sale of products to distributors. The $1,197 joining fee is a joning fee and the $997 commission is a fee based upon that joining fee. There can be no required product purchase to become a representative of a company with an MLM compensation plan. The cost to get in must be "zero" or at most an at-cost, non-commissionable charge for a starter kit. I believe this makes the program illegal in direct contravention of the anti-pyramid laws.

4. The legal "approval" so many Abunza websites claim to have from mlm attorney Gerry Nehra is bogus. He has never approved this program nor has he ever heard of this company.

I am sure there is more, but I think that for starters this is enough for sensible people to avoid the program like the plague. If this is indeed a pyramid scam, some people are going to go to jail.

Lets see how this plays out....from the safety of the sidelines :)
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#13 Consumer Comment

not true!

AUTHOR: Ck - (U.S.A.)

I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with you. I personally know one of the current top associates in this business. Her name is Bardi Toto and she's been doing AMAZING!! She's a mom of 3 who pulled in 5 FIGURES during her FIRST MONTH of joining Abunza!! She has also owned and operated her own Spanish lead business for a few years, so I guess that contributed to her jump, since Abunza is a bi-lingual business. Bardi had been in other work at home businesses before and she told me this is the one she has a passion for because it's different and with so many Hispanics that live/work in the US today, do you even realize the growth potential for this??? It's a no-brainer!!!

You also have to realize that even though these businesses SAY they are automated and "do most of the work for you", YOU obviously have to put in a little bit to get your site some advertising online. Anyone with ANY kind of sales background has to be aware of this. If businesses like Abunza did all the SEO, classified ads, etc. advertising for each individual person that joined, they'd charge a hell of alot more!!

I also don't believe people who say that a business that charges you to join is a scam, because that is just not the case; online or in the real world, anything that is entreprenurial-related requires SOME sort of funding (ie. franchises).

Don't get me wrong, I know there are some out there that have tanked and scammed people, but just because you get screwed over once or even twice, that doesn't mean every other business out there is going to screw you over as well. If you go off of that kind of mentality, I suggest you stay with the 9-5, because people that go through life with a negative attitude about things don't get what they want out of life. I've been scammed more times than I can count in both the real world AND online. I don't go around saying this or that is a scam because they do or say a couple things here or there that relate to tanked opportunities. Even successful businesses base some of their principles off of things a scam business may have done, but they're successful because they choose to do other things honestly as well.

I plan on joining in once I get the money together and I am more than willing to do my share in advertising to make some serious cashflow like Bardi has for her and her family!!


Good luck,
C.K


P.S.
Abunza has been out since last year and if you do a search on "Abunza" on this site, you'll notice that YOUR listing is the ONLY complaint against them. Considering the fact that you CLAIM you were scammed but didn't expand on the who/what/when aspect of it, then I don't understand what your problem is. Oh, and do you SERIOUSLY think that there's someone in the company that sits in front of their computer all day looking through MILLIONS of websites online that have the keyword "Abunza" and DELETE a persons' ad if they say it's a scam??? I'd really like to know how much that person is getting paid to do that...
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