How Firestone Makes BIG MONEY on a $9.95 oil change! from a Former Manager

Joe,

Ironically, you stated that you don't make a living by ripping people off and then proceeded to describe repair/replacement policies you follow that are specifically designed to rip people off.  There is absolutely no need to replace any spark plug at 30K unless a plug is defective or has been damaged by another underlying issue (e.g. valve cover gasket leak).  Virtually all OEM plugs are rated for 100K and none of them are going to break off unless they are a 2-piece plug, such as the one that was used on the early 3rd gen Expeditions.  I would not suggest waiting the full 100K as bad spark plugs are the #1 cause for early coil-on-plug death, but doing them as a maintenance issue at 30K is simply ridiculous.  Changing the coolant at 30K is equally ridiculous and any (honest) independent radiator specialist will tell you the same.  Go to Autozone, Walmart, etc. and pick up an Antifreeze/Coolant tester for less than $3; this will tell you if your coolant needs to be changed.  As for transmission fluid, some specialists do recommend changing fluid every 30K, but rather than changing it "just because" check the color and smell of the fluid; that will tell you if it needs to be changed.  Better yet, pick up a $70 UltraGauge so you can monitor your engine and transmission temps as well.

Even if there was any evidence to support such ludicrous maintenance schedules, what would be the point?  Firestone of Chicago, IL quoted one owner $809 for spark plug replacement in a 1994 Ford Aerostar Mini Van in April 2015.  At a cost of $6/plug for Bosch plugs (which are junk btw), that's $36 in parts at retail; Firestone probably paid half that.  Even if they paid retail for parts though, that is approximately $775 in labor for a job that would take 60-90 minutes to perform!  Add in another $500 for the fluid flushes and in approximately 3 years the owner will have spent an amount equivalent to the cost of a (remanufactured) engine replacement. That doesn't even account for the air filters sold at a 300% markup, the cabin filters sold at a 200% markup, the $1,000+ brake jobs, and so forth.

Finally, let's not pretend that Firestone doesn't willfully recommend unnecessary services.  It has already been proved in court, repeatedly, that they do exactly that.  Moreover, I have personally experienced it at numerous Firestone locations in northeastern NJ and northeastern PA.  Recently, I replaced an air filter and a drive belt in my wife's vehicle the day before she took it to a NE PA Firestone location for an oil change.  They told her the air filter was "really dirty" and that the belt was in such bad shape that it could snap at any time.  She declined both services, but did not escape unscathed; they hit her with a $15 surcharge for an oil filter under the guise that she needed a "special" oil filter.  Her vehicle uses a standard $3 oil filter; there is nothing "special" about it.  (For what it's worth, I raised hell and got the $15 back.)  Two years ago I had an even more blatantly fraudulent experience with another NE PA Firestone location.  I took it in for a wheel alignment and during their "courtesy check" they yanked out one of my hoses.  When the vehicle started sputtering as soon as I started it up, they offered to "fix" it.  I immmediately saw the disconnected hose and moreover, noted that the clamp was missing so I know it was not accidental.  I had to wait an hour for them to find a suitable replacement for the clamp.  The customers that were currently being ripped off took precedence over the guy they had failed to rip off.  I didn't pay them a dime to repair the damage they caused, but I also never returned.

 What about the guy who sued and good a settlement? Lol I can't believe the way you tried to discredit the complaint. I once went there when I was young and naive to have my air conditioning fixed. I probably just needed freon, but ended up getting charged FIFTEEN HUNDRED. Firestone does what they can to steal from you, so please stop lying. At most I should have paid $150, but I was new to vehicles, had just got my licence and just didn't know any better. I don't have any reason to suspect they deliberately break things to get you to pay to have them fixed, but they DEFINITELY do what they can to make you buy things you don't need.

Follow the SEVERE schedule if any one of the following are true:

Most trips are less than 5 to 10 miles (8 to 16 km). This is particularly important when outside temperatures are below freezing.

Most trips include extensive idling (such as frequent driving in stop and go traffic).The vehicle is operated in dusty areas frequently.

Trailer towing or using a carrier on top of the vehicle frequently.

The vehicle is used for delivery service, police, taxi or other commercial applications.

Comment on your input. Regarding the difference of Severe service to regular fluid service intervals. Severe service can include other uses than dusty roads, hills, towing Ex. Severe service falls into for example; extended idle time. You wouldnt think that would be severe however extended idle is tuff on the transmission fluid. This is why police cars get the fluid flushed every 15K. Other uses such as short trips. This does not allow engine and other components to achieve max op temps. This would also be considered severe. I agree with your points. This is just another piece of info.

Tony

Do you happen to know the real cause of all the Ford Explorer crashes that ended in fatalities?  Judging by what you wrote, you have no idea.  It was in fact Ford's fault that the Explorers were rolling and the tires were failing.  The placard on the door jam recommended the tire inflation to be way under what it should have been, also the narrow wheel base of the vehicles made them suseptable to roll overs.

I know it wasn't in the media nearly as much as the recall was, but what do you expect?  The media thrives on horror stories and wrong doing, if they corrected themselves it wouldn't seem nearly as bad.  It might also make them look bad.


I assure you that it was not the tire that killed those people.  Look into it, you will see that it wasn't only the firestone tires involved in those accidents.  The vehicle also came stock with cooper and michelins, which were also involved in accidents.  The firestone brand tires were just put on more of them so statisticlly speaking, more accidents would involve the firestone tires.  Why do you think firestone and Ford parted ways shortly after?  They have been doing business with each other since the early 1900's, but now they don't?  Why?

Do your research please.

I agree with the writer 100%.  I too worked for firestone in the Philadelphia district.  d**k Clark is definitely going to h#ll when he dies.   He is a liar, crook and pressures all of his people to do the same.

I was a service manager for firestone.   They force their employees to steal from customers,  sell unnecessary services,  and they do not care if work is done correctly.   They force their employees to sell or lose your job.  They force their employees to get so many credit applications per day or lose your job.  It was so bad at one point, that we were signing each other up for credit apps, just to get the quota.

It was so bad, that I could not sleep at night any more.   So I voiced my concern with d**k CLARK.   I explained to him that I did not like the dishonesty that was going on in the store.  Selling services that weren't needed,  techs not doing work that was paid for,   pressured into selling work customers did not need,  techs doing work they weren't even qualified to do,  techs that were pushing big hours per week,  but were dishonest, stealing, and robbing customers blind,  but they were "above the law" with firestone due to the amount of work they were pushing.     He said he understood my concerns and would get back to me.

Two days later,  I was fired.  And the reason was,  "I didn't fit the firestone program".     I WAS FIRED FOR HAVING A CONSCIENCE!!!!!!!   I WAS FIRED FOR BEING AN HONEST PERSON!

Little did firestone know,  that I kept detailed records of all the events, even took pictures, notes, names, etc.

I got myself a lawyer and sued Firestone.   They settled out of court for an amount I am not allowed to disclose.  But lets just say it was more then 3 years salary.

So, I was able to have the final say at Firestone's theft program.   And I can sleep at night.

MORE EMPLOYEES SHOULD BLOW THE WHISTLE ON THESE CROOKS!

In a twisted and angry sort of way you are somewhat right on your accusations.

First off Firestones credit card is not out of line with most other credit cards. Credit cards build on customer loyalty and give customers a choice when it comes to payments. The credit cards come with some features that some people may want. Like 90 days no interest, 90 days no payments, coupons/special offers, and a rebate that works like miles or points. Not everyone has the money out of pocket to pay for their car so a Firestone Credit card can give them options when sudden repairs come up.

Firestone for awhile did have discounted oil change prices when applying for a Firestone Credit Card this is very similar to any store you walk into that offers you 10% off if you apply. I have used a few of these offers myself to make purchases at places like Home Depot or Ashley Furniture.

As for 'add-on sales'. Firestone is a retail business and it does try to sell you services on your car. This is no different from any car dealership like Cheverolet or Toyota. It is a very integral part of the automotive industry. However all the services Firestone sales has a benefit and nearly all are recommended by all the vehicle manufacturers. Cheverolet, Toyota, Ford, Honda they all have services that should be done to properly maintain the vehicle. These services are called either Scheduled maintenance or preventative maintenance and the customer is educated and given the option to have these services done.

Firestone does offer free 'courtesy checks'. The customer has the right to decline the service. A courtesy check does the following.

Tops off Windshield washer fluid. Checks for cracked belts, dry rotted or worn hoses, fluid condition/levels, tire life/wear, tire pressure, nails or foreign objects in tires. It also checks your air filter, battery and looks to see if any gaskets might be leaking. It is a great service that takes about 7 minutes for a trained technician to let the customer know if anything might need attention in the near future. It is an optional service. I have never seen anyone reprimanded for not doing a certain number of courtesy checks.

As for scheduled maintenance reports. These reports are downloaded from the various manufacturers and in almost all cases are identical. There is a 'normal' and 'severe' option for scheduled maintenance. A severe option example is if you drive in Hot or cold climates, if you drive on dirt roads, or you do mountain or hill driving. The associate can print out either copy. It sounds like the ex manager above was only giving the severe option. Maybe he did not realize you could print either report.

You do not need to do scheduled maintenance to keep your warranty valid. This statement was used by dealerships for many years but it is not true and has been proven in several court cases. If this manager was telling people that then he was misinformed and no one at Firestone told him that.

Firestone carries Bosch Spark Plugs, Wagner Brake Pads, Dayco Belts, Kendall Oil and many other parts that are top of the line in quality. We can also order any part the customer wants to have put on for the same or close to the same price. Including NGK spark plugs, Mobile 1 oil, AC Delco parts etc etc.

Firestone does not repair tires for free unlessyou purchased the warranty. The warranty covers free flat repairs and free replacement of the tire in case of an unrepairable situation. However some employees choose to repair customers tires for free to help establish a relationship with the customer. However it is not a company wide policy.

Lifetime alignments are a great service. The technician gets paid every time he sets the alignment so there is no reason to for him/her to lie about needed parts. The technician does check for bad suspension parts using MAP or Motorist Assurance Program guidelines. Ask to see any parts that a technician is recommending so you can see what it is and why he/she is recommending it. The company is very forceful that every lifetime alignment recheck be performed. Firestone will terminate any employee that lies about performing this service or any service. There are bad people out there just like any business that will go against company policy but when they are found they are terminated. I have worked for Firestone for many years and I have never worked for a store that lied to customers about services or repairs. I work very hard to provide a good quality and fair priced service to customers. The key here is ask for an alignment print out of before and after specs when picking up your vehicle.

Firestone does use a structured pay plan that does include some bonus options. However almost every retail business like Wal-Mart, Target, Wal-Greens, Olive Garden, TGI Fridays etc etc use similar bonus programs. It is motivation for taking care of more customers and controlling your expenses.

This manager above sounds like he was a deceptive person that turned the company's policies and programs around for his own benefit at the cost of the customer. Once it did not work and he got fired he then decided to tell everyone how crooked Firestone is when it is obvious he was the one pulling the trigger on those deceptive practices. Now he is saying he regrets it. But he needs to own the responsibility and stop blaming a good company because he was a bad apple. There is a reason he does not work for the company and it is not because he was under-performer.

I worked for Firestone for 3 years so I know that what you have said is mostly true.But you do need to be corrected on some things. I currently work at a repair facility that I can honestly say does not try to rip people off. Here in the North-east salt belt the SEVERE maintainance schedule does apply. Cars here see more wear and tear on them than in other locals. Transmissions should be flushed every 30,000 miles. Coolant flushes should be performed every 2 years reguardless of milage(have you ever seen the condition of 5 year old Dexcool?). Belts should be replaced when moderate cracks have developed in them. The public is untrusting enough with auto mechanics, so please do not give info that you don't correctly know. And to you the consumer....shop around and find yourself a ASE certified technician that you trust, then stay with them(you are more likely to get dicounts and free advise if you are a long term customer).

Essentially everything this gentleman said is true. I worked for a Dealership Service Department for 3 years. I still have close friends in the business. However, to dig exclusively on Firestone is just stupid. I know this guy is disgruntled. Every Automotive Service Center and Auto Dealership Service Department is out to spend the least on parts and make the most off of their services/labor. This is backbone of their business. This how they make money to survive. Therefore, I'm not finding the logic here?

I guess you could say that I have been reformed since leaving Firestone. I feel remorse for the many people that I took advantage of in the 10 years I worked for this company. I started with the company at the young age of 20 as an entry level sales associate. I was praised early on from all levels of management on my sales ability. I felt important and that I was doing a good job. I wanted to continue that trend so I fell into the trap. I was never really a mechanical kind of person so I just stuck to selling tires for the first few years. I became a Service Manager after that, and started making decent money. The store I was at had a real loyal customer base, and didnt ask a lot of questions. thats when It started. I soon found out that the only way to make any money, win any of the weekend or monthly contests, or get any praise from the district staff is to screw the customer. The management breeds this behavior. Turns the cheek when stores are cranking out an impossible 20 fluid flushes in a day or 30 alignments on a saturday. no way that all of those services are performed. not legitimately. but they will line the manager or service managers pockets come monday. But if a customer or employee blows the whistle. then someone will get fired to appease the Zone managers. but its business as usual the next day.

I can tell you that the hard push for more and more and more sales every day causes it. Praise for screwing the customer, just make sure you dont piss anyone off and dont get caught. I ran a top 10 store in the NATION. Profit numbers that a business person wouldnt believe. I was 28 and making six figures. My store averaged over 2k a day in just brake sales alone. I went to Mexico more than once just for pushing the firestone credit card. If someone doesnt mind selling thier souls to the devil this company is great.

I dont think that this speaks for all stores, or managers. I worked with some truly good people. But I can tell you that people dont last long unless they are making the sales numbers set and raised by the district managers every year.

Tips for consumers to ensure they dont get screwed:

Try to wait with your vehicle and monitor what services are being performed on your vehicle, especially alignments.

Always ask for a printout before and after on your alignment.

Dont buy brake flush, its crap, and most Techs dont do it properly.

Ask alot of questions, and dont be afraid to get a second opinion.

Inform sales associate that you will not pay for said services unless you get old parts back. (i.e. brake parts, belts)

Dont go in on a saturday. EVER-- hardest sales push day of the week.

Firestone has a "fixed right the first time, or money back guarantee". so if you catch a store throwing parts at a problem. make sure you get your money back before authorizing any additional services.

Follow your owners manual for your scheduled maintenance, not what a sales person tells you.



I would never let a relative of mine do business with firestone. I think that Harvey Firestone would be sick at what has become of his now Japanese owned company.

I am a current employee of firestone (I am not a manager or anything) My position is Lead Master Technician at my location. Some of the things I have read here are possibly true at 1 location or another , but lets not group all firestone in the bunch with some bad apples. The store I work at DOES push CFNA accounts (Firestone credit card) BUT we do it so you get discounts on repairs (Lowest price oil change $16.95), 10% on the first repair and 5% on all other repairs after. With 90 days intrest free. Now IF you go past the 90 days you do get charged 22% just like any other credit card if you dont make the payment, Itis in the terms you sign.. we do a FREE check on every car that comes thru our doors, key word FREE.... Our courtesy check includes: topping off washer fluid check power steering, coolant and trans fluid, air up tires check tire tread, note condition of anything that should be done,and all filters. BUT if you air filter is a huge pain to pull out I am not about to waste my time pulling it out unless it is noted to check it, common sense people am I as a flat rate tech going to pull apart a airbox that takes 20 mins for free on a 10-15 min oil change? however I will note that on my inspection report that it was not checked.

All spark plugs are recommended every 30K regardless of manufacturer due to the fact that I don't want to try to take a spark plug out at 100K and have it break off in your cylinder head because its rusted and seized in and now your looking at a $1000-$2000 repair because you wanted to save $50... TRUST ME I AM DOING YOU A FAVOR IN THE LONG RUN. The fluids in radiator and trans. should be changed at 30k I don't care what some no talent clown on here says. what Mr. 100K coolant did NOT tell you is there IS a class action law suit against GM for their "extended life coolant" because it eats seals out of waterpumps and engine gaskets, THIS COSTS YOU MORE MONEY... (note to all with dexcool - GET IT OUT AND PUT GREEN COOLANT IN YOUR CAR. you will thank me) Think about this people, Do you really think the manufacturer/dealer wants your car to run forever with no problems? Hell no they sell more cars when they have major problems and people would just rather roll it into a new car loan than drop 2k on a repair on a old car. I have quit many jobs due to shady sell/repair practices, but i have not seen this at MY firestone location, and I stay very busy every day and I sleep well at night knowing that I do a good job, make pretty good money AND DON'T RIP PEOPLE OFF DOING IT.

- - SALES ASSOCIATES AND MANAGERS ARE NOT MECHANICS - -
I have seen the sales guys say some not so accurate things to customers but ONLY due to the fact that they are not technicians, and do not fully understand the problem themselves. not really a lie, they just dont have the education to know what the details of the problem is. BUT the car still has the correct repair done to solve the problem.

The shady guy that will do some patch job on your car is not your buddy, he is costing you more money in the long run. just do a search here for "Chris Early" to read the full story, this guy really is a crook, I worked there for 1 month and quit because of that fact.

In conclusion I and all the people I work with, are looking out for our customers BEST interests, We do our JOB and tell you whats wrong with your car, its your decision to fix it. I could really care less if you do or not. You don't do your transmission fluid at 30K fine, but don't cry that it costs you a $3500 transmission when it breaks. In the end its your car use your best judgment and some common sense.

michael enrigve 28 of fla. was forever parilyzed when his ford explorer rolled over and flip upside down into an on coming car near orlando in may 06 the other driver was killed.witnesses told the police that the thread came right off enrigve tires. Thread separation in passinger cars and light trucks and suv all are to common by products design and manufactring defects belt leaving belt separation or thread failure results in the complete or partial detachment of tires tread and outer belt from its caseing and inter belts. tire failure begin with small crack on serial # side of tire. In the manufacting defect firestone neglected to utillize gum and strips of nylon overlays on caps or other safe guards to reduce the hazard out of thread belt separation small cracks which are virtualy invisible to the naked eye giving way to larger cracks that develope between belt premature causeing tire failure. ordinarly a tire should excede its thread life. The lengh of time it normaly take to wear down the tire thread.The rough use by a substanital design/safety margins,however manufacturing and defects cause shorter life and can lead to CASTASTROPHIC accidents long before a tire is worn out.

Many of us don't know a thing about cars are a easy prey to being gouged....I'll be sure to avoid these places in the future.

Its all true what he says. I worked on the shop side of 3 different Firestone stores. The cheap oil changes= all crap parts, the cheapest oil filters you can buy, the oil they used I did not care for, put it in a couple of my own cars and was always a quart or two low in a few weeks, but when I used a name brand oil I never had to top it off.

The parts they had in stock were off and on, sometimes good sometimes horrible. I had two major reasons for finally leaving Firestone. The first was the thier hiring policies, hiring was changed from the store manager to the district office and thats when it all went downhill.

All the experienced store managers were fired for stupid reasons and young kids who had managed a fast food joint were hired. It came to a point were I was the only person in the shop who really knew what the f@#k they were doing. The second reason I had for leaving was the parts we bought from vendors. The stores I was involved in bought the cheapest parts available and if we had the parts in stock even if they were crap we had to use them.

I work at a dealer now and the difference in parts is amazing. You might think that your saving $300 on a job but in the long run your not. I did work with some guys at Firestone that were great and that did the right thing for the customer but sorry to say I think they have all quit.

I also used to work at Firestone. I am all for companies making a profit, othewise they wouldn't stay in business. I enjoy being told that something is wrong, if it is. What I do not like, and have had happen to me personally at Firestone, is that they try to sell me a brake fluid flush because my fluid is dark and appears dirty. Where is that part of anybody's scheduled maintenance except at Firestone? They do have a kit that will measure moisture, but is rarely used. They will also skim over your car not actually checking items that they said they checked. I found this out due to my air cleaner being filthy and no signs of anybody checking it. It is pretty obvious when their are no prints or smudges on a very dusty engine compartment. I was also told I needed a fuel filter, which is less expensive to have doen by the dealer. I know when I go there, I get what I went there for and nothing else. Cheap oil changes are great, but the rest of the services are questionable.

I have a sincere respect for these ex-employees that got religion and came to the good side of the force. For all you nonbelievers NOW YOU HAVE THE FACTS.

We need to get more souls saved here so any of you other lost sheep out there that has a story to tell come forward brother and get REDEEMED!

my car is a 96 with only 38K miles on it, and unfortunately i didn't know better cause i am only 17. but when they reccomend stuff they told me that if i didn't get it done there was a SEVERE chance of my brakes failing....so they made sure i went with the fluid change, brake pad change, rotor change, and caliper change. i just got 2 pay checks cashed, and i have any personal spending money or any money at all for that matter in hte bank....yes they did charge me 680 some dollars. it turns out i didn't need the calipers, and the rotors were going bad but they weren't ready to be replaced

I have been an employee of Firestone for 6 years and this guy is on crack. As everyone knows Firestone does send out those cheap oil change coupons. And with any business they want to make money. When a customer comes to the counter with any service we ask if they would like our courtesy check which includeds checking out basic areas of the car. I have a question, if you brought your car in and we noticed the belt was almost ready to fall apart from cracking wouldn't you like to know that?? I know that I would. WE do check out the basic items and we recommend them to you. It is your choice to buy them or not. We do not force them to you like the strickly oil change places do. I just want to remind everyone that Firestone is a business, and with all businesses we do not want to loose money. I am shure that there is always confusion about what is recommended and what is needed. We recommend things that are scheduled maintance and close to the end of life. We say you need items when they do not comply within manufacturers spec, or there broken, or they are a safety hazard. The next time you are in a Firestone, listen to the Sales Asssociate, if there are any questions about the repair the can prove why they are recommending it. They will either take you to the car or show you manufacturers scheduled maintence recommendations. Remember that you have the final say-so that what happens to your car.

I AM A MEMBER OF AUTOVANTAGE AND THEY SEND YOU COUPONS FOR SERVICES. FIRST, THEY DID NOT WANT TO HONOR MY COUPON FOR A DISCOUNTED OIL CHANGE. THEN WHEN I WENT IN WITH A COUPON FOR A FREE TIRE ROTATION AND THEY DID NOT ROTATE MY TIRES...WHEN I WENT BACK THEY WERE "UNABLE TO LOCATE THE COUPON".



THEY WERE THE LAST OF THE COMAPANIES THAT I SUSPECTED WOULD GIVE ME FALSE INFORMATION. WITH MY SECOND TRIP IN THEY TOLD ME I NEEDED NEW TIRES AND A SERPENTINE BELT WHICH I HAD JUST HAD REPLACED 2 WEEKS PRIOR. I HONESTLY BELIEVED FIRESTONE WAS THE LAST PLACE THAT WOULD BEAT UP ON A WOMAN. I NOW HAVE NO FAITH IN ANY BUSINESS THAT SERVICES CARS FOR WOMEN.