• Report: #994231
Complaint Review:

Hudson Energy, Just Energy

  • Submitted: Wed, January 09, 2013
  • Updated: Wed, February 13, 2013

  • Reported By: Consumer Guy — Toronto Ontario Canada
Hudson Energy, Just Energy
16 Four Seasons Place, Suite 211 Etobicoke, Ontario United States of America

Hudson Energy, Just Energy John Roche, Etobicoke Regional Unethical hiring practices and not getting paid from the company to begin with, must chase the agents for payment, company not providing agent pay stubs for appointment bookings Etobicoke, Ontario

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Hope People Are Reading About This Company!

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: A Little Bit More on Hudson Energy

*UPDATE EX-employee responds: Can't Believe Anyone Can Defend Such Practices

*Author of original report: bullsh* John Roche

*Author of original report: This is no lies, it is the truth! Don't be scammed by John Roaches Hudson recruiting scam

*UPDATE Employee: Thank you for your warning!

*Author of original report: This is no LIE, you will get scammed by John Roche

*Consumer Comment: Small Minded Jelous Person Making Up Lies

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Warning to all professional sales people who are recruited into working as an independent contractor for Just Energy and Hudson Energy in this particular commercial sales office at 16 Four Seasons Place, Suite211, Etobicoke, Ontario, Canada, M9B6E5. The management there (John Roche, Trevor Small, Leanne Evans, will tell you that you must book appointments for the existing agents and you will get paid 30% of the commission from the sales rep's commission for booking the appointment. Next, when it is time to get paid your cut for booking the appointments, you will have to chase the sales rep to get your portion of the commission because you do not get paid directly from the company. There is no enforcement of this pay scam. They do not give you a copy of the sales rep pay stub so that you can verify your efforts for booking the appointments. I hope that Just Energy and Hudson Energy executives will shut down this office down for misleading sales professionals in this industry. John Roche uses the zig ziggler, tom hopkins to brainwash all the agents wich is the only positive thing about this place, other than that, you will lose at least 6 to 12 weeks of income before you figure that this is all smoke and mirrors.
This office is a joke! This office is a discrace to the natural gas and electricity marketing industry. Their top salesman, Glen Lancaster makes about one millions dollars per year, he is an ex con criminal that has served time in jail for fraud, lives in Kingston area, never in the office. All you need to do is google Glen Lancaster,from Kinston Ontario Just Energy scam and you will read about all the lawsuits againts him from commercial clients who have sued Just Energy for altering contracts after being signed because he would check off the green option on the contract after the client has signed to bump up the price in order to get a higher commission. Hudson Energy is a division of Just Energy and formerly operated as Ontario Energy Savings Group. Above all, the rates that Just Energy and Hudson Energy offer their commercial customers are not very competive. Stay clear as commercial customer and stay clear as a new recruit! There are many other energy companies out there that treat the new people much better than these grease monkeys! Also, check out the Ontario Energy Board to find out how many fines that this company has been awarded. Oh, and by the way, the company owes back pay for residual payments and all the existing agents are stuck working there because they think they will get paid out one day.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 01/09/2013 04:55 PM and is a permanent record located here: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/hudson-energy-just-energy/etobicoke-ontario-m9b6e5/hudson-energy-just-energy-john-roche-etobicoke-regional-unethical-hiring-practices-and-n-994231. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year.

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#1 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Hope People Are Reading About This Company!

AUTHOR: Anonymous - ()

I just wanted to add that I hope people are doing their research on the Internet on Hudson Energy, aka Just Energy.   This company's business model is "free labour."  Every two weeks they recruit an "army" of telemarketers to replace the "army" of telemarketers that deserts them every two weeks.    Why does everybody leave after two weeks?   Simple:  they don't get paid.   John Roche will say, "Well, we know you have bills to pay while you are getting established, so you can expect to make around $2,000 a month until you become an outside agent."   The truth is that you won't make even $20, much less $2,000!   Why?   Because you have to set up so many appointments for the outside agents--and around 95 to 98 percent of those appointments will fall through.   Another 1 - 2 percent fall through when the company calls the customer and gives them an opportunity to opt out of the contract they just signed.   And even if some of the appointments do result in a contract, you won't know it:   you are completely dependent upon the honesty of the "outside agent" with whom you are paired to tell you if the prospective customer signed or not.   Good luck with that!   I worked there for nearly three months and did not see a dime.   I would set up appointments, and the outside agent would either fail to get a contract signed, or the customer would opt out after getting that obligatory phone call giving them a chance to cancel the contract.   In Ontario a person has 10 days to opt out of a contract when they are signed up through telemarketing or door-to-door sales.   

They will advertise for "sales managers," "account executives," "sales leaders" and other such titles.   But if you go there, you will be a telemarketer, plain and simple.   You will be given a stack of outdated business directory pages and will take your place in that "boiler room" in Etobicoke where 20 or so voices are competing with your own on the telephone.   You will call CEOs using those outdated pages, and often find that the CEO you just asked for is either dead or has moved on.   John Roche will tell you to always try to get the CEO.   This process is known as "cold calling," for those who are new at this game.   And "cold calling" is an outmoded technique for selling.   It has been used so much that people are naturally resistant to it these days--like building up an immunity to the flu.  

All of this is not to say that something like 0.025 of 1 percent do not actually make it.   One guy named Trevor, who had a real gift of gab and who used to work for a government owned utility actually made it into the outside agent ranks.   There are around a score or so more who made it when the energy selling business was still young--and before Just Energy was trashed in the media for spurious sales practices.   Believe me, these third-party energy companies like Just Energy, Direct Energy and Hudson Energy have been trashed six ways from Sunday in the media--and people remember!   

So . . . if you have a real gift of gab and don't mind making 150 telephone calls a day you might make it.   Just remember that over 99 percent of new telemarketers don't.   And keep in mind that if your appointments actually result in a contract being signed, it's nothing for the outside agent to not tell you and thus stiff you out of your "30 percent."   There is NO contract between you and your outside agent, and Hudson Energy does NOT treat you as an employee, but as an "independent contractor," which is gobbledygook for saying that you are strictly on your own.

Just ask yourself if you want to work for a company that has 95 percent turnover every two weeks--and if you like the idea of working months for free.   Oh--and you like being exploited!

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#2 UPDATE EX-employee responds

A Little Bit More on Hudson Energy

AUTHOR: Anonymous - ()

When I was with Hudson Energy, there was indeed a higher commission for selling "Green Energy."   Of course, that is just another scam for any "eco-freaks" out there.   All of the electricity that comes through your wiring is blended together--you cannot separate "green energy" from energy produced by gas-fired or nuclear power plants.   It just gives you an opportunity to pay more for the same electricity.

Green energy costs a lot more to generate than hydro, nuclear or gas-fired plant electricty.   You can pay more for "green," but it's likely that only 1 percent of the electrons coming through your wires were produced by wind turbines or solar cells.

More to the point, however, is that Direct Energy exploits its workforce.   As I stated previously, the turnover is nearly 100 percent.  

And why is that?   There is one simple reason:   the business model is antiquated and people don't get paid.

The founders of the company aren't really all that business savvy.   They started out in a "boiler room" with a bank of telephones.   They built up their company through sheer cold calling on a massive scale.   But they didn't really understand advertising or sales principles.   So their company, while still profitable, is held together with bailing wire and chewing gum.  And that company is on the decline.   Stay tuned--you're going to hear a lot more about this company and its affiliates in the near future--and none of it is going to be good.

Their market is already over-saturated and they are closing fewer and fewer deals.  

They could turn their company around by doing a few simple things:

1.  Spend some money on advertising.   The only publicity for Just Energy and Hudson Energy to date is negative publicity.   They need an ad compaign to polish a very tarnished corporate image.

2.  Pay your people directly.   Don't jerk them around, making them chase outside agents for a share of the commissions.

3.  Use advertising to generate some solid leads.   Using a three-year-old business directory and having your inside agents call CEOs who died two years ago just doesn't cut it.  

4.  Don't require 14 deal closures to promote an inside agent to an outside agent.   It's not the inside agent's fault if the outside agent blows the sales interview.  

5.  Forget about cold calling.   It's dead.   It's been dead for the last 20 years.   And companies that still rely upon it are hanging onto their ever-shrinking market share by the skin of their teeth.   The sales manager needs to be updating the sales strategy, instead of just blithely mouthing platitudes at sales meetings.   And that script?   A learning disabled monkey could have written a better one!

6.  Reevaluate your entire business model.   Yes, people can save money with some energy plans.   But Hudson Energy has acted so nefariously with its own people and has generated so much negative publicity that the public is more wary than ever of its sales pitches.  

I don't expect the company to initiate even one of the above suggestions.   It's locked into a 1960s era business model and its leaders don't have the business savvy to change.   It's all going to come crashing down very soon.   And those few outside agents who have made some decent commissions in the past had better start looking for other jobs.

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#3 UPDATE EX-employee responds

Can't Believe Anyone Can Defend Such Practices

AUTHOR: Anonymous - ()

If the person who wrote the rebuttal with every other word misspelled wants to drink the Hudson Energy Kool-Aid, that's fine.   And he said that everyone has a past.   That's true, but some have honourable pasts while others have not-so-honourable pasts.

The truth is that the turnover rate is nearly 100 percent, and that you can work there for months and never see a dime.   The company doesn't spend a nickel on advertising--they just send out battalions of unpaid "agents" to burn down the telephone lines.   They tell their victims that they are account managers--but that's not true.   They are telemarketers using a tired old script and doing the same old cold-calling that has been discredited as a viable sales technique decades ago.  

I greatly suspect that the rebuttal was filed by a shill for the company.   But after weeks and months with nothing in his pocket to show for his efforts, he will most likely see the light, as hundreds of others have.  

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#4 Author of original report

bullsh* John Roche

AUTHOR: Energy Guy - ()

Dear John Roche.   I hope your new recruits bring this website's official warning to you in front of all your seasoned agents.  By the way..... did your agents get paid their past due residuels yet.  I dont think so... in fact I know they have not and that is why your organisation will fall appart.    Past due as of 3 years!   Do not sell residuals if your company can not pay out as per the IC crappy agreements.  JE is in big financial problems. I guess the shareholders come first right?  Those who have worked hard most of their lives for JE will probably never get paid.  This is the word that has spread.

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#5 Author of original report

This is no lies, it is the truth! Don't be scammed by John Roaches Hudson recruiting scam

AUTHOR: Energy Guy - ()

 Small minded people have more brains than you John Roche.   Thanks!   Your marketing enemy but I do not brainwash new recruits.  And your helpers may have to explain this post!

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#6 UPDATE Employee

Thank you for your warning!

AUTHOR: HonestCreditCardProcessing - ()

I just attended an information session and hiring meeting with John Roche and Trevor last week, and so far everything that you have written about in your report is the same as what I experienced.

In brief, I want to say THANK YOU for your warning, and I will be immediately emailing John Roche to let him know that I am no longer interested in joining his team or attending training which starts this Monday April 22nd at their office.
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#7 Author of original report

This is no LIE, you will get scammed by John Roche

AUTHOR: Energy Guy - ()

Good Luck with your efforts at Hudson & Just Energy office in Etobicoke (John Roche's office).   I have been in this industry for years and you are just getting into it or I suspect that you are John Roche trying to do damage control.   When it comes for you to get paid by either Doug Bloomfield, Glen Lancaster and I am sure other agents are in on it,  remember you dont get paid from the company because you are not an agent yet and Leanne is holding on to your JE and Hudson Energy Independent Contractor agreement without processing it with the company.   They will use you for booking appointments.   That is John Roche's scam.  He will not help you when you need to chase these agents for your cash money from the appointments that you booked for the agents.   It's hard to get paid when you dont have a contract with the agent, to use you for booking appointments and then they will hope you quit and that the agent does not have to pay you because your not around anymore.   Great scam John!  keep feeding your agents new recruits to book appointments for your agents and then dont help them get paid.\

Outline of John Roche's Scam:

Hire new outside agents and then tell them that they are inside sales for existing agents.

Give the new recruits a contract from Hudson and JE.  (but you do not get your ECPA training until to following step.) so your not an agent yet, and inside sales does not get paid from JE or HE, only the existing agents do.  

Tell the new recruit that they dont get paid from JE or Hudson but rather from the existing agent that they pair you up with.  (you do not have an agreement with the agent)

Now you have to keep track of all customers that the agent that closed for your appointments. 

Tell new inside recruit that they do not become an agent until you set up 14 appointments that have successfully been closed by outside agent for you to get your ECPA licence from the OEB.

Once you have successfully got your ECPA training licence, now you have to chase your money from the agents that you booked for and go out and sign your own deals.

You go cry to John about you not getting paid from your previous appointments that you booked for the existing agents.

John does nothing, you quit, and then John and Trevor continue to hire new recruits to replace you! bye bye and thanks! 

Remember, the OEB licencing and training is only for EPCA customers,  under 50000 m3 and under 150000 kwh per year.  You do not need a licence for selling contract above these thresholds as per the OEB.  But they dont tell you this because its part of the graduating from inside appointment setting to becoming an agent.  All this so that you can be exploited
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#8 Consumer Comment

Small Minded Jelous Person Making Up Lies

AUTHOR: ver - (United States of America)

I felt it necessaryt to write this report even though I don't beleive in websites like this much. I have been looking into this opportunity and while telling a family member they brought this to my attention.

Before responding to a call back I received from John at the Etobicoke office for an interview, I did my own extensive investigation.

As for the office, I went in for an interview and everything seemed fine to me and the people were very nice. John does use a lot of sales inuendos and references great salespeople but I would say as more of a motavation. If your so small minded to be "brain washed" you have bigger issues!

I also talked to people who had been making calls for outside agents and they(the ones who were doing there jobs) had all been paid by there outside reps.

I looked into this issue about there top sales rep (Glenn) and there is only one law suite against him or Just Energy because of one of his's customer's. If he really is the top guy, that's a pretty good ratio!

As for checking this green energy box for extra commission, I found out this is an outright lie! First there are no law suites based on this, second I found out there is a confirmation call that has to be made with the customer and they have to agree to take a product or not on a recorded call.

As for this guy's past- Who Cares! We all have pasts!

I for one am going to take this opportunity and if I don't make it, I won;t be looking for other people to blame and talking down about people because I'm jelous!

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