Jim Rosen Web Ad Systems Aka W. Craig & Company ripoff, false promises, fraudulent sale contacts, operates under many names Phoenix Arizona

Dear Carolyn- First of all, I want to say how very sorry I am that this has happened to you, especially during such a difficult time as this when your husband is suffering from a terminal illness. My thoughts are with you. I am fighting a very similar battle with W. Craig and Company / WebAd Systems. You can view my Rip Off Report by typing in the keywords Web Ad Systems in the search box on the badbusinessbureau.com Rip Off Report site. It is under the title "W. Craig & Company, Web Ad Systems Real Estate Rip Off, Scammed out of thousands of dollars, John Beck's Land Banc Phoenix Arizona".

My situation is a little different in the respect that my websites were supposed to be selling real estate property, rather than fitness equipment. However, the thing that is similar about our situations is that the validity of the targeted visitors to the websites is questionable and also the product being sold is somehow fraudulent or misrepresented.

I also asked for a refund a couple of months after I had purchased the program, but was told that I had to wait 11 months, at which point I could return the product for a full refund. I had this guy at the Web Ad Systems company (Mike Upsal) e-mail me this document (the "11 Month Challenge")that states this agreement regarding the refund. Do you know if Jim Rosen/WebAd Systems had a similar "11 month challenge"? I doubt they would have included it in any of the paperwork they sent you. I only found out about this "11 month challenge' when I called to demand a refund back in November 2003. I believe that this "11 month challenge" may be a stall tactic to prevent people from taking action sooner.

Like you, I began to realize that something was very wrong. I had no requests for purchases which I felt was very odd, especially since my website was supposedly being sent out to over 50,000 search engines. I started to wonder if the properties my website was marketing really existed. In my case, this wonderful property being sold was actually in the middle of no man's land, miles away from any power lines, running water, etc... (you get the picture).

I called Web Ad Systems back and confronted Mike Upsal with information about the properties being advertised on my website. I had gathered some negative information about the properties when I made several phone calls to Texas and Arizona and spoke to Tax and Deed Departments and utility companies. He issued me a verbal approval for a refund and gave me an RMA# that I wrote down. Did you even get this far with anyone at the company?

It may not matter. Long story short, I have been trying to contact Mike Upsal or anyone for that matter at W. Craig & Co. and all of the phone lines have either been cut off or an answering machine picks up. A live person does not even answer the phone anymore. The last time I called the company was Thursday 1/19. I just let the phone ring for over a half hour. Someone finally picked up and he gave me a fake name and number for the president of the company. He then became very inappropriate and started asking me how old I was. When I asked his name, he hung up on me.

I decided to call the number he gave me and it was some guy who seemed to be really nervous about how I got his number. He told me that the company had "hit a financial wall" and was trying to "reorganize and restructure". He then gave me an incorrect number for the Chief Financial Officer.

It's really bad. I am envisioning that these people have probably thrown everything into boxes and left in the middle of the night. So, let me tell you the steps I have already taken to try to get the money back.

I contacted the FBI in Phoenix. They referred me to a website and I filed a complaint with the IFCC for fraudulent internet activity. It took some time- you have to kind of sit down beforehand and think about specific dates that you had contact with the company (either through mail, e-mail, phone contact, etc.). They also ask you to explain in a detailed, but factual way how the company victimized you. They also ask you to list any other known victims of this crime and I referred them to the badbusinessbureau.com Rip Off Report website to check out the other reports made against this company.

They have you put down all your personal information (address, phone #, e-mail address, etc.) but I don't think that they will necessarily contact you back. I'm not sure what contact from them there is, but you do get a confirmation to print out that you filed a complaint with them and they give you a complaint number with a password (if you need to contact them again with additional information). I don't think there's a way to contact them to find out the status of the case, but I felt it was extremely important that I file a report.

I also called my credit card company and explained the situation to them. I had tried to dispute the charges back in October, but my creidt card company told me it was too late and I had gone over the number of days that I could dispute the charges. This time when I called them back and explained again (and told them I had received a verbal approval over the phone for a refund and had U.S. Postal confirmation that I had sent back the materials), they told me to fax whatever information I had to them and they would try to dispute the charges and get a refund. This may or may not work.

I did speak to a woman in Washington, Louisiana named Linda. She also filed a Rip Off Report for the same exact thing that you did, only she was taken for over $11,000. She, however, was able to get Discover card to get a refund from the company. She was the one who urged me to call my credit card company back.

I am faxing several things to the Disputes Dept. of my credit card company. I am also going to fax all information I have to the Arizona Attorney General. It will take anywhere from 2-8 weeks before anyone at the Arizona Attorney General might get back to me, but I am still taking the steps and trying to cover all the bases.

In the meantime, I am trying to take the advice from the Do-It-Yourself Rip Off Revenge guide. I am going to try to find some fax numbers and phone numbers that still work for the company and start sending them faxes of my rip off report. It's very hard, though, because I can't seem to get a live person. I also live in Boston, so there's no way that I can physically go to the address to check to see if the office is empty.

If it comes down to it, I will start contacting the media. Oh, by the way, did you have to get your merchant account through E-Commerce Exchange? Did you mention that you found out that this company is fraudulent? I paid $1695 for a license to accept payments online. In total, I have been taken for over $9,000 between what I paid to W. Craig & Co./Web Ad Systems and the merchant account.

Anyway, if you would like me to contact you with any updates or information that I find out about the company, just do a rebuttal to my rip off report. Add your phone number and/or e-mail address and I will contact you to let you know if anything I did resulted in getting my money back, or at least brought me a few steps closer to doing so.

Again, take heart. You are not alone. I'm not a religious person, but, boy have I been doing a lot of praying to God since this has all started. It has really wreaked havoc on my life, giving me a lot of stress. I can only imagine what you must be going through. Let me know how your situation is going. Take care.