Report: #280081


  • Submitted: Sun, October 21, 2007
  • Updated: Mon, May 05, 2014
  • Reported By: carol stream Illinois

    DALLAS, Texas

Show customers why they should trust your business over your competitors...

NAA runs massive ads on the web to recruit sales people. After you sign a contract at 55% comission that require you to build a team (MLM) and you get a over ride. NO WAY THIS CAN HAPPEN! my contract was at 55% and my new hires are 55% wheres the difference? Thats lie #1

Then NATIONAL AGENTS ALLIANCE charges for leads that are $23 ea. Leads are sent to my manager (Mark Sher) and then he cherry picks, steals from me, then gives me whats left! which is nothing. He debited my account for $1900 and I got nothing

It's been 3 months now and I lost everything!! Mark Sher ( NAA manager) drained my checking account! Took all the people that I recruited!

NAA is a SCAM Save yourself save your money save your time. Thousands of NAA agents are running away everyday, broke a mad!

carol stream, Illinois
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This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 10/21/2007 09:27 AM and is a permanent record located here: The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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#1 UPDATE EX-employee responds


AUTHOR: be informed - ()

To author VBall, you clearly have not read all the comments on rip off.  Many are from people like myself who are former managers and former speakers at their conferences and spent many many years there and are qualified to comment.  What would be your response to the fact that NAA's most "decorated veterans" are leaving in droves along with many of their teams?   Shawn Meakie (NAA's former top 3 manager), Art Leazer (was with Andy and the rest since Amway, and was for almost 10 years straight a top 2 income earner)  Matt Smith (NAA's top poducer 2013 and a top exploding agency manager) Paul McClain (NAA's top 3 fastest growing managers 2013) and along with all those guys there have been at least 20 other recent former agency managers and top recognized producers that have left NAA in the last 5 months, not to mention all the other top level people that have left over the last year and a half.   By the way, there are many more that are planning on leaving that will continue to suprise everyone still left there.  People are catching on to the fact that there are many NAA "leaders" that have also become notorious for  "spinning"  false negative stories about why that particular accomplished NAA manager, or agent has left the company.  By the way, doesn't that completely conflict NAA's latest theme of PIE (Prosperity, Integrity, and Eternity)  It seems based on everything currently happening that no one is prospering except for the Lampes (very nice people)  and Fitz who are left.  Allthough their income has to be declining with everyone leaving.  There is no way Fitz is on a 110%, give me a break.  He has been with Andy since he was young.  You can bet he has a comp plan different from everyone else.   

As far as Integrity at NAA, well just read all the posts out there, and you get the idea.  Now as far as "Eternity"  well as you can see it is listed last in PIE instead of first, I'll leave it at that.       What is your repsonse to the fact Andy has somewhere in the neighborhood of around 25 lawsuits that he had his attorneys file just in the last year against all the people that have decided to leave, and he calls himself a Christian?   Which begs another question.  Why does he go after everyone that decides on their own accord to leave?  Seems like if someone didn't want to be in business with me hey, more power to them and I wish them the best!  Not NAA though, it would seem like  he's intentionally trying to slow down peoples momentum when they leave NAA and make life difficult for them so that everyone "still within NAA"  does not see that these people go onto much better things, or that possibly he's trying to scare people from leaving thinking they may get sued too with all the copies of lawsuit letters that have been circulating that were apparently mailed out to all contraced agents with NAA.   I truly hope that at some point you will wake up and realize the same that everyone else is waking up to, that the expense to do business with NAA is a scam and that there are so many NAA "profit centers" that are completely and utterly ridicoulous that cut deep into an agents and managers net income.  People are sick and tired of all the crap they have to pay for from leads, training, 4 conferences a year, book clubs, the presidents club, and if your above average all the other mini trips that you are pressured into going to get around Andy.  NAA changes their conference "themes" so much it has become a joke.  Andy to this day is trying to sell everyone that "this is the year," "Bo, we are breaking records round here!", or the always recurring "The alliance is more united than ever!"  it's a bunch of amway crap meant to keep people pumped up. 

There is however one positive NAA has brought to the industry though.  They have managed to earn the worst reputation in the industry with so many people that have been burned that the word is getting out like wildfire.    They have had former managers that have tried to duplicate and copy the NAA system only to find that many of the spin off NAA's are just as bad.  SO, the positive is the new IMO's that have popped up offering higher commission contracts,  No costs for trainings, no required conferences,  lower lead expenses, no additional costs to do business with them except for your leads and gas, and agents getting there full renewals on the business they write.    I hope that even some of the spin off NAA's realize this fast otherwise their ships will sink to.  For any potential agent or newly licensed agent reading this please, please, please, do your research. You cannot deny the facts that the same recurring bad things people have experinced are being posted on forums going back as far as 2006.    There are some great opportunities out there, and you can get a great commission contract even just starting out!  The people I feel most sorry for are the people still left at NAA that would rather suffer financially and their families continue to suffer financially all because they don't want to dissappoint their NAA friends, thier upline, or be called a quitter.  I am shocked they still think something is going to change.   Friendships and the the long time relationships with your upline aren't going to pay your bills.   Wake up!  

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#2 Consumer Comment

NAA Leads Scam

AUTHOR: VBall - ()

For those of you who have only worked for 2 months or any short period of time, are really not qualified to comment on NAA.

They are upfron and honest about all of their positions. You are not an employee but have the opportunity to run your own business with out the expense involved in starting a business.

For those of you who have had problems with leads, that's pretty much your own fault, since you choose the leads you want.

This is not a "Get rich quick scheme" it is a job and you have to be willing to invest in yourself and others, and actually work. The income is not going to land in your lap. You have to go aout and get it like any other job.

I have read many of the comments on here and they seem to all be from uneducated people who have not actually put forth any effort on their own behalf. Feel sorry for them. They let an amazing opportunity get a way.

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#3 Consumer Suggestion

NAA Garbage Leads!

AUTHOR: Chucky - (USA)

The leads are garbage! The only reason I joined NAA was because I thought, based on what I read on NAA's website and heard on their opportunity conference calls was that NAA was overflowing with high quality leads. I regret wasting over $1000 in total expenses with NAA. The leads are garbage! The typical response I got on the phone was "I'm not interested anymore" or "we are covered, thank you". Many of the A1, AA leads were 3 to 8 months old!! Unbelieveably we have to pay a lot of money for these leads. I wish I would have asked tougher questions in the beginning and research and for complaints before joining NAA. My bad, my mistake! It's an MLM ripoff where most of the money is being made by a very very few people and the others are struggling to stay afloat. Some are making decent money but I heard a LOT of discouraged people on conference calls about the garbage leads!
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NAA...what a joke.  After putting my resume on Monster and CareerBuilder, I have received e-mails from at least 7 different "agencies" ranging from Phoenix to Texas to Ohio to the deep South, all of which are automated responses saying that I should call some number and see if I qualify to be an "agent."  I live in Southern California, so WHY would I ever think about doing business with an "agency" so far away from me?  A major insurance carrier?  That's okay, but not an agency; way too far removed if there are any kind of problems (and it's guaranteed there WILL be problems)

I did talk to two such "agencies"; one in Texas and another in Ohio.  The one in Ohio did a Webinar then scheduled me for a telephone interview the next day.  He let me ask questions to "lead the interview".  The first one was "are the leads free?"  I knew they wouldn't be and, sure enough, he told me a long story that the NATIONAL CORPORATION has people in every courthouse in the country that supply leads to the corporation which then sells them to hime at a cost of  $35.  He then sells me the leads for $20.  Hmmm, sounds like this guy has no business sense...He then says that he will NOT ALLOW me to buy too many leads (say $1000 worth) because he's on the hook for $3500 and can't make back any money until I sell a lot of product.  What about the $2000 that I'm out of pocket for?  DUH.

Explanation of how mail-in/direct mail leads work.  First of all, mortgage protection leads are bought from a handful of companies that hire people to go into the courthouses and county registrars offices and buy lists of all the home sales and title changes due to refinancing.  They then compile these lists and sort them using many different criteria, such as purchase price or loan amount, age of the buyer, location and so on.  Then they sell these lists to whomever wants to buy them.  Some company like ChoicePoint's Targeted Leads or Precision Leads then contracts with a buyer to make a custom mailer that includes either a letter that the potential client fills out and mails back to the company in a prepaid envelop or a prepaid postcard.  The buyer then gets the leads that come back, resells them to the NAA agencies who resell them to their unsuspecting sales force to call, set the appointment, and make the sale.

Sounds good on the surface, but leads usually get "cherry-picked" so that most of theremaining ones are worthless (the "good" one usually go to the agency principles and managers and sometimes to someone who is willing to pay. let's say, $50 for a really good looking lead).  The way mail-in leads work is that if you have 25 of these leads ($500 worth), you'll MAYVE close ONE or, if you're REALLY lucky, TWO...BAD RATE OF RETURN.  There are also many other ways that these leadscan be misused or abused.

Anyway, when I told him that I personally bought 1076 mailers from Precision Leads targeting upper middle income home buyers or refinancers BEFORE the mortgage meltdown (I did this in late 2006) in zip codes I knew should be VERY GOOD for respnnses, I got back a total of 8 cards and sold NOTHING.  These mailers cost me $250 since the company I worked for split the cost with me.  Typical mailing lists cost 50 cents each with a1000 mailers minimum.  The main reason for NO SALES was the fact that a $600K mortgage had an average monthly payment of around $4000.  The cost to "protect" this mortgage with a 30 year term product for someone aged 40 and in decent health was in excess of $200.month or 5% of the monthly payment.  In those days, most people would keep a loan before refinancing it for about ONE TO TWO YEARS.  Forget about it if the medical exam turned up any problem.  I also bought 1000 mailers from Targeted Leads in 2007 (again subsidized by the company at a cost to me of $250) targeted for something different: life insurance, long term care, annuities, and and mutual funds.  Same targeted zip codes.  Got back a decent number (34, which is WELL ABOVE the average of 1-2%), but since the financial crisis was hitting hard. AGAIN NO SALES.  MAIL-IN AND DIRECT LEADS DO NOT WORK AND AVN'T WORKED FOR AT LEAST TWO YEARS.  YOU GET CRAP AND PEOPLE SHOPPING AROUND FOR THE BEST "DEAL".  Should you make a sake, remember that a term product has NO value unless you die.  No cash value, no loans, and when the term is up, no insurance.  Some people buy Return Of Premium policies that cost more since the ROP is a seperate policy or rider that guarantees the buyer all of his premiums back at the end of the term.  How about letting the insurance carrier use all of your premiums INTEREST FREE?  Can you say BAD DEAL for you, GREAT DEAL for the insurance carrier?  Remember, insurance companies pay NO INCOME TAX, so when they invest your premiums, all the money they make is tax free.  Oh, I forgot to add that even though your interest on the mortgage IS tax-deductible, your insurance premiums are NOT.

I told Mr. Ohio what I thoiught of buying leads and his tone changed immediately.  He told me that this was not an expense BUT AN INVESTMENT in my business.  Then he went on to add that he just sent someone from Michigan to LA two weeks ago since he had too many leads and not enough salesmen (his exact word...salesmen, not agents) and that that the salesman had a $14,000 weekend.  Let's see...what's probably wrong with that statement?  First, the "salesman" would have to have a vslid, up-to-date foreign license for California, which I really doubt (but it's possible and expensive).  Second, the airfare, car rental  hotel, meals, etc. on a short notice trip like that would cost the salesman at least $1000 but probably MUCH more.


So to everyone who is considering working for these clowns, you've been warned.  Proceed, if ou must, with extreme caution and NEVER, EVER ALLOW THEM TO DO DIRECT DEPOSIT.  IF YOU DO, A LOT OF THESE CLOWN AGENCIES WILL DEBIT YOUR BANK ACCOUNT THE SECOND THE POLICY GETS CANCELLED, LAPSES, SOMHOW CEASES TO EXIST ANY MORE IN THE FIRST YEAR.  By the way, I know many such agents who have worked for companies like that that have gotten wiped out by such tactics.  If you must do direct deposit, create a special account that only these checks go into; that way, if they debit, they don't grab any of your personal funds, AND ONLY WHAT'S IN THAT ACCOUNT.  Better yet, go to your neighborhood check cashing place and pay the 1% fee and let them cash it...then they have NO RECOURSE other than suing you which would normally have to be in the county in which you reside...way too expensive a proposition for them to make the complaint here (Superior Court in California has a minimum of $25,000; any lower amount has to settled in either small claims or municipal court.  A very expensive deal to fly out, make the complaint, pay the filing costs, have someone serve you, then fly out again for the trial).  They could sue in the county where they are, but executing the judgment where you live would be cost prohibitive at best.

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#5 Consumer Comment

Your complaint is only partially true

AUTHOR: Know Better - (U.S.A.)

Your complaint about the company is not correct. It is not a rip off at all. You do not understand how you make overrides which come from recruiting yes, but only when your personal volume grows and therefore your percentage you receive grows. I have heard about your manager and it is unfortunate that one bad apple can ruin it for others. I suggest you take this straight to the company owners, Andrew Albright would want to hear about this and set you up with someone who will work with you and want you to succeed in this business. The company's philosophy is phenomenal and wants each and every member to thrive and help lots of families while helping yourself. The leads you received are very valuable, expensive and should have come to you without ever being cherry picked. Your upline was and is a bad manager and should not be allowed to continue this activity. If you complain to the appropriate party such action will be taken against him. Using a public forum such as this to dis a highly respected and reputable company because you have had a bad experience is inappropriate. I take nothing away from your experience, but it is not the company just that individual. I am a new agent myself and have had just the opposite experience, already making money and having unlimited support sent my way. I hope you find a better mentor, manager, teacher and group with which to work as this business is the best opportunity out there to set your life up for success and the fulfillment of helping many who need help. Your training has been lousy, but the opportunity is real and wonderful. Please contact headquarters to report your dilemma and I know you will have much satisfaction once you do.
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#6 UPDATE Employee

There are Success Stories

AUTHOR: Jason - (U.S.A.)

I can feel the frustration in your words & I have compassion for anyone who has to deal with an inexperience leader. I also know of many success within the NAA family. My 20yr cousin Paul has been with NAA since Aug of 07 and he has made a total of 96k this year (about 90% of his income is from personal production). His college body Andrew, who is 19yrs old, just cash flowed over 10k in the month of Sep and will cash flow about 7,500 this month (all from his own personal production). I cash flowed about 98k my first year with NAA (all Personal Production), 225k in 07 (160k personal production & 65k from my team), and I'm track for 300k this year (200k personal production and 100k team production).

I love the income I've made from my personal pen and I love being apart of the NAA family. My number is 888-252-9350 for anyone who would like to ask me any questions.
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#7 UPDATE Employee

Davies - go for it

AUTHOR: Tlk - (U.S.A.)

Davies - I know who you are and your an idiot. You jerks put people into plans they can't afford and when they drop - the agent is the one losing. I left NAA after 2 years (thank god) before they strung me out too far. I saw many of a friends lose a lot with this company and I feel partly responsible for bringing them in. Yea, I made money in the beginning with NAA, that's until the top dogs got their finger into my checking account and pounded me with crap for leads. Add on the high dollar conventions and taxes - I made nothing!!!! Only about 1 in 8 of the clients I wrote actually stayed with NAA and now with my new agency I haven't lost the first peice of business. You overcharge the clients for insurance and they figured it out and now I'm having a blast re-writing all those policies.
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#8 Consumer Comment

The Wisdom of Crowds

AUTHOR: ***naa_skeptic*** - (U.S.A.)

While our culture generally trusts experts and distrusts the wisdom of the masses, New Yorker business columnist James Surowiecki argues that "under the right circumstances, groups are remarkably intelligent, and are often smarter than the smartest people in them." in his book titled The Wisdom of Crowds.

The majority of the posts regarding NAA point to this company as one that isn't reputable and is self-serving at best. Face it, you "NAA Kool-Aid Kids", some of you may be riding high for the time being but I'd like to see where you are a year from now or two years fom now.

First off, post copies of your actual checks (minus your account information) you have received for your sales. Of course, Photoshop and other programs can be used to dummy-up information. But hey, humor the skeptics in us anyway. In the words of Jerry Maguire, "SHOW ME THE MONEY!".

Second, what is the percentage of NAA'ers that drop out of the game after the first 3, 6, 9, and 12 months?

Third, what percentage of folks cancel their "policies" within the cancellation period?

Fourth, what percentage of folks aren't able to renew their policies after their policies expire?

Fifth, when do you expect NAA will sign up everyone on the planet?

So you NAA-sayers (clever, huh?) just share some good old factual information with us, and who knows, you might even be able to convert me! :-)

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#9 Consumer Comment

Hold on a minute......

AUTHOR: L.p. - (U.S.A.)

I was interested in joining NAA. I went through the entire interview process was scheduled to start my training. My applications were on their way. I'm online researching the company and I found a very upset woman that said she and her husband were filing bankruptcy and had lost their retirement savings from working at NAA. She also said that she knew someone who lost their house. I found people who owe thousands of dollars to the IRS, have nothing in their bank accounts, owe huge lead debts and have credit cards run to the max. There are people who feel RIPPED OFF and someone said they lost everything. I want to be the first person to apparently tell these people I'M SORRY THIS HAPPENED TO YOU Just because there are people in the company that haven't had a problem doesn't mean that a problem doesn't exist.
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#10 Author of original report

Terry wetherholt

AUTHOR: Marion2008 - (U.S.A.)


terry wetherholt was the agent that robbed me and my money. He claims to be a Realtor but signed me up with this company.

Terry wetherholt is a FRAUD. DO NOT TRUST HIM
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#11 UPDATE Employee


AUTHOR: Craig - (U.S.A.)

Mr 2008,

I have read your initial post and the ones that followed. I will admit every companyhas growth problems, but I doubt very seriously your manager was stealing your leads. He/she would have too call every lead just to see if they were med decline or not, shoppers, or anything else. That being the case, he does not have time to do that. Also your manager does not take anything out of your account it is done by the billing office of NAA.

Now I am not jumping down your throat, but I think maybe you just your facts jumbled. Now if you would call me at 360-265-2754, I will gladly discuss what happened so you can at least feel better about the ordeal. Keep in mind I will only tell you the truth, so if it hurts no big deal.

I need to have your inputs so I can avoid such banter as I grow my agency. If I don't hear from you, all my questions about your comments will be answered.

I look forward to hearing from you.

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#12 Consumer Comment

Thinking of Part Time Employment with NAA

AUTHOR: David - (U.S.A.)

I have been doing research on NAA, thinking about working for the company on a part time basis. I have more good things about NAA than bad. Can anyone give me additional information if I am making the right decision or not. Any information would be appreciated.


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#13 UPDATE Employee


AUTHOR: Eat Me - (U.S.A.)

This is to the guy who posted after my last post ! Yeah you can get a 110% contract with other carriers but most are paid as earned, so unless they pay annually u get paid every month when they pay, that sucks. Unless you do a certain number with the carrier you will stay on paid as earned or get terminated that sounds like pressure I don't want ! I have a contract with AIG always have since day one and I would rather turn in my business and know that I don't have to wait for a para med ,aps after aps, and then 2 months later to only get declined. For your FYI I bet if u added up the time , cost, etc etc you put into trying to generate your own leads and mailers you'd see it comes out your paying probably 20 to 30 a lead yourself and doing all the work and putting up all the cost. Id rather have someone do this for me which NAA does. If your so happy with your current insurance jobs why even bother posting on here. You can't say we scam people because you don't have to buy leads. I have agents who work there warm market and local area just fine and I never tell them they have to purchase leads. We are helping the middle class families get the coverage they desire. You people who try to bash this organization have no idea and need to look deep into your own soul and figure out why you haven't been successful in everything you have tried in life and then gone to bashing the opportunity because u couldn't put in a little hard work and effort for once. Anyone care to comment bring it I'm fired up now!!!!!!! Feel Free TO EMAIL YOUR HATE I WILL STILL TURN IN 10k THIS WEEK IN AP and RESPOND TO ALL YOUR EMAILS!!!!
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#14 Author of original report SCAM

AUTHOR: Marion2008 - (U.S.A.)

I recruited 16 people per month. I held my own Opportunity meetings in an A type office.
I did my job NAA FAILED. 55%

You need help! You can get a 110% contract and create your own leads/ mailer.
Naa is in the lead sales business A, B no its an A- no it's a B+ no it's? checking account has been wiped out!!! for leads that my manager ( Mark Sher / Ed Orel ) stole.

Bottom line NAA is the biggest joke In the country and their agents are running like rats to find a legit offer.

Read all about the scam
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#15 UPDATE Employee


AUTHOR: Eat Me - (U.S.A.)

I been with NAA for 3 years now, and this opportunity is so real . Sales isn't for everyone but I will tell you I can work one day a week run 10 appts and pick up more than 10,000 AP and being on the 85% contract I am on hmm you do the math. As far as coming in as a new agent at 55% and recruiting before you have moved up. Heres the deal with this, listen close so you don't miss it son !!! You won't have to pay any overhead on his leads your mgn will and this helps you (and yes you don't get anything from them at first buuuuut) A new Agent usually screws up the first few sets of leads he gets anyway so good your mgn eats the cost you are getting you guy trained for free and then once he starts producing, anyone under you count to your raises together as a whole.

Thus if you have more guys than just one you'll get quicker raises and have a bigger point spread. by then you will also learned to mgn your leads costs and agents costs and before you know it your cranking out 100k a month or week in production thats when it gets crazy. The opportunity is here no doubt about that if your too blind to see it then thats your fault. The ones who don't succeed in life wont succeed in any field cause they are lazy. I worked one day this week, I got 13 leads set 11 appts all on Wed left my house at 8am got home at 11pm had 3 no shows closed the other 8 picked up like 10k in ap. I do this every week 10 to 20 A Leads always get at least 6k to 12k. Its not the system thats not working its you I have run these leads for 3yrs never complained once about leads. B Leads use to suck cause they sold them more than once but who cares. They have an awesome system now and it takes sometimes agents to be guinea pigs to find out what works.I never post stuff on the net but after reading some of this people post it makes me laugh. Im glad people quit more leads for me Hey at least I will call them and work em BECAUSE I PROTECT FAMILYs
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#16 UPDATE Employee

Learn the facts, first

AUTHOR: Gerry - (U.S.A.)

Before you post vitriole, learn your facts.

You stated that NAA "requires" recruiting. It does not. In fact, if you produce only $5,000 APV (approximately 5-6 sales) a month, you'll get a promotion to the next contract level. Produce $7,500 APV (6-8 sales), you'll reach the next level.

If you were around any length of time and still at a 55%, then you hadn't produced, which is why your recruits were at the same level. You have to work at least a LITTLE.
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#17 UPDATE Employee

Marion2008 didn't read easy to find information

AUTHOR: Patrick - (U.S.A.)


while I have not had perfect success as an agent with NAA, I have had success. Any shortcomings regarding my income with them has been a result of me not taking enough action on phone calls to set more appointments.

Regarding the overrides you spoke of, yes we start at 55%. Shortly after I started I was promoted to a higher commission rate because of my volume. I get paid the difference between where I am at now and the recruits I bring to the business. This is normal insurance business practice. Unless the manager you speak of is running appointments himself in your area, he would have no reason to "Cherry Pick" your leads.

If I don't make it in this business, it will be because I didn't do the work. No business is perfect. NAA is no exception. I know the people I work with and they are all people of integrity.

Good luck to you.
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