Tax Sale Lists John Lane John Lane, daughter Lindsey Lane www.TaxSaleLists.com Program is Deceptive Westminster, Colorado

In reading the previous report about the Scam artists selling information that could be retrived from the Internet for free.....I know nothing about them or what they do.  I am answering the person who evidently does not know the difference between a tax sale and a tax sale overage.  First of all, getting finders fees for helping people retrieve their overages is a very common practice and has nothing to do with buying anything at a Tax Sale.  Many times at a Trustee Auction or any kind of Foreclosure on property, the auction accepts a bid that is much higher than the balance of the lien on the property that caused the foreclosure.  This lien is paid off at the time of foreclosure, and results in a Tax Sale Overage which the former home owner knows nothing about, since the county only makes a feeble attempt at locating and contacting the former homeowner. So what the result is, many people have these overages that exist in the County Treasurer's coffers, for months, and months, and in some instances, for years.  So for someone to offer another the retrieval of several thousand dollars is music to the ears of someone who has just gone through foreclosure.  So you see, once the Asset retrieval person contacts the homeowner and they sign an agreement, the funds are retreived and disbursed to the homeowner after the Asset Recovery person takes his cut. Straight and simple, and has nothing to do with buying anything at a tax sale.

First of all I am not affiliated with John Lane's company in any way.  I have ordered one of his courses, in the past.    For the price, I found it fairly informative.   I think you get a fair value.  Just look at some of the other courses out there.  Their prices are really exorbitant, some of them.   As for the individuals who feel they have been cheated.  I have been reading their blogs and comments.   John Lane has done a lot of research and put forth a lot of effort to pull that research together to help individuals understand the system so they can create an income.   But as with anything,  you have to put forth your own effort and build on the information he has given.  But he does give you a good starting point.   There will always be individuals who are just not satisfied with anything.  Unhappy people.  They will find fault with everything no matter how much you do for them.   There is a price for success, some people are just not willing to pay that price. 

I purchased John's course over a year ago. I can tell anyone, I've been buying tax liens for over 8 years and I spent the money on John's course anyway. I found it very informative. Showed me some mistakes I had been making. His videos were great and you can reference them anytime. I also received a phone number and email and have never had a problem more or less than any other entity (i.e. verizon, sprint, con ed, etc........) that anyone calls today. they've always answered my questions. I found more information in his course than in my 8 years of doing this business myself. And for the people telling you it's all free and easy, I have a very simple answer I give people who tell me that.... Go Do It and let me know when you make all this money. John also never says you get all these properties with liens or deeds. there's always a percentage and with liens it's very small. So what, if you don't know what you're after then open your eyes. Sometimes we make 10%. But tell me where you're getting that return with little risk (if you listen to John) or get some kind of magic info from these counties everyone speaks of.

By the way, I've called many counties and cities and states. I'd like to see a rebuttal from one of these complainers telling me how nice these folks were if you can even get them on the phone. Also, how easy it was pulling this info out. Also, I can tell you personally that it's not all free unless you're just using the tiny news print. One spot in NY charges $150 just to get their list in large print and on cd. Give me a break with the complaining. Also, I commend John who takes the time to answer each and every complaint and wastes his time. I give him and Lindsey a A+.

I purchased the system, and wanted it returned. It was outside the
refund period because of a mistake of Canada post. When I told them to
report the problem, they repeatedly told me it was my problem. They are
the one ones with the shipping information, and I am the one that is
supposed to make the request? I even showed them the website to make a
claim. Luckily someone delivered it BUT A MONTH AFTER!



I Have several issues with this garbage product, and Extremely bad customer service. Here are my issues that I had.



1) Really bad communication. I emailed them 4 times, and when I said I
wanted to refund before the package arriving, then and only then they
replied. I had asked to speak to John repeatedly and all I got was '
John is a extremely busy man" Yeah ripping people off. I don't know how
they seriously sleep at night.



2) When i told Mary that I was going to refund the product she stated
"thank you for the information" then I paid for the shipping, and
signature approval and sent it back. Not knowing what they would say, I
took several pictures of the product and also video proving that it is
in perfect condition. I cant provide everything if requested.



3) After the product had arrived back to them, i sent several emails
back and Mary replied saying that  the packaging needs to be assessed
for it's condition it would take 3-4 weeks. REALLY? I sent the package
back(1 week), reviewing the package (1 week), refunding (1 week, doing)
nothing wasting time (1 week) 3-4 weeks? REALLY? They must really be
getting a lot of returns if it takes that much time to process a item
like that.



4) She told me that she would ask John Lane if the refund could be
processed quickly. I stated ok. Then she stated that she was unable to
return the item because it was past the 30 days.



SIDE NOTE... **If anyone needs the sales page, or any page in his sales
process, you can message me and I will send you anything, because I have
everything documented**



5) So its past 30 days? Why would you say " ok thank you for the
information" when I told you I was going to return the item. They
stated, that was the acknowledgement of the email. These people are
worse liars than Bill Clinton. Like seriously. REALLY? 

- They want to waste my money again by sending that s**t back and then
say NO. ( that is just disgusting. and saying that [we rip people off,
and lie through our teeth and give you a smile while doing it]



6) What a waste of my money. This company is out to steal and Rip you
off. I really wish I had seen this before buying this garbage.
Seriously. Bad customer service and the Owner JOHN LANE wont even talk
to any one because hes scared. Seriously You make a product, your
customer service says something. Stand by your world you slimy marketer.
You have ZERO credibility.



***announcement****  Because I am extremely angry still, and i am a seo
specialist. I am going to build a search engine friendly site detailing
my exact process of the lies this company told me, so that anyone who
searches for this garbage will be able to read the entire story,
pictures, screen shots, videos, emails. Everything I got. If anyone is
interested in collaborating with me and would like there story published
you can email me at [rippedoffbytaxsalelists@gmail.com]



I really want to talk to you guys who also got ripped off about this. Please let me know.

I took John's training a few months back and can not believe some of what I read here.  First off, if you can do all the things he tells you to do and know where to go, why buy his course in the first place.  I found it extremely helpful and throughout the program he emphasizes due diligence.  It should be clear that the odds are long but if performed properly can lead to results in acquiring property.  Mr. Lane even recommended that students attend a sale to get a real picture before jumping in over their head.  I did just that and found it very informative.  As for going to the counties yourself, give it a try. Some are very guarded and the information not even in a presentable format.  His excel lists save enormous amounts of time and for pete's sake, 300 are FREE. 
Anyone running a large an enterprise as this is going to experience disgruntled people, no matter what they do and they will make a mistake from time to time.  In all honesty, I am working through an issue regarding an overcharge right now that I expect will be resolved very soon, just as questions I have posed have been answered promptly in the past.  
To summarize, I have attended sales and have invested small amounts in liens, knowing that most will redeem and my returns will be small.  It sure beats what my bank and 401k have done lately.  I'll take 12-18% and more anytime.  It would be great to start making large profits and acquiring land right away but to quote Mr. Lane, this is NOT a get rich quick scheme.

I used to work for John over 15 years ago when he was pounding the pavement all over the country researching tax lien sales. I found him to be a stand up guy who was very detailed in his approach and I learned a considerable amount working for him. However, I have not seen him since and know very little about what his current program entails. I was doing some research on tax liens which led me to this site and I wanted to respond. While I do not know anything about the over bid strategy, I can verify two very important facts in dispute here:
 
1. Doing the due diligence on the lists is the single most important factor in being successful at investing in tax liens. Simply getting instructions from the county will not suffice. Now, if you are savvy about real estate you may not need a program to tell you how to do the due diligence properly, but I'd imagine there are few people out there more qualified than John to tell you how to do it.

2. To do the due diligence efficiently, you need a sortable list. Good luck if you are trying to do due diligence on a paper list with 50,000+ tax liens on it.

His overage program is deceptive as well as the tax liens.  Do you have plenty of time and money? You will have to pay a lawyer to create your contacts.  His program will disappoint you.

He minimizes his complaints filed.  One complaint is too many! His is all about greed, money, lacks communication and customer service.

Even though I needed help to earn money and cancelled his program in less than 3 days time, he leached on to my $100 and refused to let it go. He was determined to steal $100.  Several months later, when I thought the matter was done, he filed a false collections claim for almost $1,000 in error on purpose, because he is a criminal type mentality.

You can go online to any county and teach yourself.  Save time, money, energy by skipping doing business with them.

I found this report while google-ing overages.  I have been a student of John Lane's since 2007 and, this spring I purchased his Overages program.  I am very pleased.  I have also sent e-mails and occasionally called over the years and every one of them have been responded to promptly by TaxSaleLists.com.

vas575rei@gmail.com

We have taken John Lane's course and it is really extremely valuable.  He is highly knowledgeable.  However, we are just beginning to use the materials so I can't comment on success rates with the technics.  It would be valuable to hear from more students who have done well just to confirm the current value of these approaches).  Now, to be honest, we have learned from and made money using technics taught by folks who do much more hype and oversell.  The products that Mr. Lane provides are tremendously valuable (you can listen to your courses again, sit in on the new ones, lots of manuals and written materials. 

Contacting them has been a little bit of a problem in the past (he shared why that was the case and FIXED it).  I just had another issue that I addressed with the company (the time it is currently taking to get lists after ordering them which could interfere with the ability to do one of the technics he teaches) but I expect that will be addressed, too.  There is no way to contact them by phone, that is probably true (although I didn't check the telephone book), but probably also essential since one person could tie up hours of their time. 

Not perfect probably, but I listened for an hour to a "free" telephone lecture by another tax lien guru the other day and learned almost NOTHING in one hour with lots of "hype".  If you take John's free lecture, you will learn a tremendous amount for free and without lots of other efforts to sell you additional materials..  

If you are serious about this and HAVE the money to invest, I think there is alot of valuable information in this course/materials.

I am not sure where this individual comes up with "they keep $100 and sell you the lists at annual $300 fee".   We do have a cancellation charge - which is posted on our website.  The reason is simple - we can only have a limited number of people in our workshop and when you make a reservation and then cancel at the last minute it generally makes it impossible for us to replace that individual.  This is not an uncommon practice, hotels, airlines and any number of businesses do this.  As to charging a fee for lists - those who take our course get 300 lists for free.

This individual says "a person never owns a tax deed property if not redeemed"- lets examine that statement.
1. A tax deed property does not have a redemption period (with three exceptions).
2. There were over 200,000 properties that tax lien buyers acquired in the last year when the property owner did not redeem.

The claim we refused a refund is flatly false - if you cancel before the workshop we do charge a cancellation fee, but the balance is refunded.   We do not allow cancellation after you have started the workshop - and the reason is very simple.  As soon as you attend the first session you are given over 1,100 pages of manuals on the states and access to over 100 hours of videos.  People would sign up, come to the first session, download all the materials and then cancel.  We are not stupid - we don't allow that.

Yep we have had 13 BBB complaints - most are from individuals like this one.  But keep in mind that we have done over 500,000 transactions in the past five years. that is a percentage complaint ratio of 0.00257 or one complaint for every 38,819 transactions we have done.

It is obvious that the individual (who won't give their name) who wrote this has little if any experience with tax sales.

Counties do publish their rules - some do at least - but that is less than 5% of learning how to profit from tax sales.  The due diligence process, which no county tells you how to do, is where you make or lose money from tax sales.

I find it somewhat amusing to see someone post complaints when they obviously have no experience in the business.  As to allegations that overbids don't work - again it is evidence of ignorance.

We have complete email and support records and will gladly admit that when you call us we ask you to email your question first.  Why is that?  Simple, we often times need to research the question and can't give you the answer online.

Again, it is still my suspicion that this complaint is posted by a non-student and/or a competitor of ours.  Why else not admit who they are and when they attended our class.

Beware of Tax Sale Lists.com They email people to attend a free online workshop. Then they try to sell you a $1,597 program to teach you how to get tax deeds, liens online. You can get the same information from the counties websites with rules. There are no hidden things to be learned by John Lane, owner. They make their money by if you sign up and cancel, they keep $100 and sell you the lists an annual $300 fee or buy lists separately. There are additional costs involved to do their program, attorney fees, etc.

In my research, a person never owns a tax deed property if not redeemed. The people who work in the counties explained to me how it works. I canceled in less than 6 days time and Tax Sale Lists refused me a refund. If you have had a bad experience with this unethical business, please contact District Attorney 303-659-7720. There are 13 BBB complaints filed in a 36 month time frame.

Lets take this one, one at a time.
1. This program is very expensive.   Well, I guess that is subjective, but we are less than half the price of almost all of the other people out there training about tax sales - and most of them haven't done it as a business.
2. Yes you can get tax sale lists from the county - but you are nuts if you think you can get it for free.  We purchase over $500,000 worth of tax sale lists a year.  What you can get from a very few counties is a paper list.  Ours are in Excel - ever tried to sort a paper list?
3. He is correct, the rules and instructions are posted on some sites.  But they don't tell you about all the pitfalls and how to avoid them.  We do.
4. Weak communication?  Hmmm, nobody in eight years has said that one before.
5. They ignore your emails.  That is flatly incorrect.  Our email logs prove it.  But since this person wouldn't leave their name, I can't give the exact facts.
6. Overbid refund is deceptive - he says they are only $100.  He has no clue what he is talking about - Florida alone had over $7,000,000 in potential overbids on their tax deed sales in the first half of the year in just six counties.
7.As to a complaint being filed with the Colorado District Attorney, let me say that first of all, that isn't possible.  You don't file the complaint with the DA, you file a complaint with the Attorney General.  Secondly - I am not sure what the complaint is because nothing stated in their (whoever "they" are) write constitutes something you can complain about to the Attorney General.

Folks, we are very open.  If you have a complaint, email laneproblem@taxsalelists.com rather than making statements where you have to hide your name because they are libelous.

John Lane, CEO
TaxSaleLists.com llc