BB&T CREATIVE STEALING..how BB&T causes NSF fees to your account Wilmington North Carolina

Dawn,

The bank continues to process your transacions because you continue to swipe. They cannot just not process. You are given this card under this understanding. If you have something pending and it has not came thru yet the bank may not know about it. Then all of your transactions come streaming thru at once. Balance



Andy,

I do understand your frustration, but you have to remember the bank does not know what you have floating out there. They do put money on hold for you when you use your debit card, but the merchant still has to collect it. If you use it at a diner and add a tip then they do not know how much to hold. If you use it at a gas station there is a $1 hold. You must balance. Always balance.

So the following does make sense if the merchant from the intentional $100 purchase (knowingly w/out the funds to cover) collects their $ first. Just because you swipe in a specific order does not mean the bank will process in that order. The merchant is also involved. Just use what you have and read the fine print.

Chronological Order Resequenced
Starting Balance: $100.00 $100.00
-$5.00 P.O.S-covered -$100.00-covered
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$40.00-NSF fee+35
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$40.00 ATM-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$100.00 check-NSF fee+$35.00 -$5.00-NSF fee+35
Ending Bal.=$-100.00 owed to the bank End Bal.= $205.00 owed to the bank
=$35.00 in NSF fees =$140.00 in NSF fees
$35.00 or $140.00 if you don't see something wrong here, you have gone mad.

Dawn,

The bank continues to process your transacions because you continue to swipe. They cannot just not process. You are given this card under this understanding. If you have something pending and it has not came thru yet the bank may not know about it. Then all of your transactions come streaming thru at once. Balance



Andy,

I do understand your frustration, but you have to remember the bank does not know what you have floating out there. They do put money on hold for you when you use your debit card, but the merchant still has to collect it. If you use it at a diner and add a tip then they do not know how much to hold. If you use it at a gas station there is a $1 hold. You must balance. Always balance.

So the following does make sense if the merchant from the intentional $100 purchase (knowingly w/out the funds to cover) collects their $ first. Just because you swipe in a specific order does not mean the bank will process in that order. The merchant is also involved. Just use what you have and read the fine print.

Chronological Order Resequenced
Starting Balance: $100.00 $100.00
-$5.00 P.O.S-covered -$100.00-covered
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$40.00-NSF fee+35
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$40.00 ATM-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$100.00 check-NSF fee+$35.00 -$5.00-NSF fee+35
Ending Bal.=$-100.00 owed to the bank End Bal.= $205.00 owed to the bank
=$35.00 in NSF fees =$140.00 in NSF fees
$35.00 or $140.00 if you don't see something wrong here, you have gone mad.

The consumers mentioned are consumers like you that refuse to keep an accurate register and continually overspend their account. Since the account owner is responsible for the account balance and the transactions that post against that balance (except for cases of fraud), then when the owner overspends the balance they are asking the bank to cover the items.

Consumers have made it clear that they want banks to pay their overdrafts so they can avoid the inconvenience, embarrassment and potential costs of having a payment or transaction rejected. At the same time, it's important for bank customers to know there are numerous ways to avoid paying overdraft fees, Feddis said.

I'm not sure who these consumers are. This is the Senior Legal Counsel for the ABA. I have not met a consumer yet that has wanted banks to cover overdrafts fees.

Andy,

You are still not getting it!

The ONLY source of checking your "available balance" should be your checkbook register. Period.

Banks do NOT "create" overdrafts. However when YOU "create" an overdraft, the bank software does indeed maximize profits on YOUR MISTAKE.

Posting order is ABSOLUTELY IRRELEVENT as long as you had funds available for use in your account PRIOR to initiating your transaction. Period.

Why do you find this basic concept so hard to comprehend?

Forget online banking!!
Do not even look at it until after you learn how to manage your checkbook register.

You are hung up on your online balance which means absolutely NOTHING!!!
What does your CHECKBOOK REGISTER say?

You CANNOT ever use online banking to determine your available balance.
That is NOT the intended purpose of online banking.

Just common sense and third grade math here.

But, THANKS AGAIN for keeping my BB&T checking account ABSOLUTELY FREE!
Keep up the good work overdrafting your account!

>>>>

Submitted: 12/27/2008 9:46:46 PM
Modified: 12/27/2008 10:21:55 PM Andy
Danville, Virginia
U.S.A.

Resequencing debits and credits
Steve, no matter what you think, this not entirely about managing a checkbook. Banks claim these overdraft programs are for the benefit of the consumer. Thus, consumers aren't embarrased when making a point-of-sale transaction and also to assist the consumer if they need to pay a bill and don't have available funds. The only problem with this is that consumers are agreeing to the ONE $35.00 NSF fee, not five or six.

(This actually happened to me).

I.E. Starting Saturday balance in your checking account of $100.00
Sunday P.O.S. transaction for $5.00 then another P.O.S. Tran. for $10.00
Monday P.O.S. tran. for $10.00 and an ATM withdrawal for $40.00

the bottom line is .......

IF the money is there to begin with it won't matter in which order things post. By spending that last $100.....that you already KNEW there was not enough money for.....you set yourself up to fail.

Personally I find it totally foolish to be using a debit card for all these small purchases....it's a recipe for failure. Carry some degree of cash for these rather than continually debiting.

NO....I dont now nor have I ever worked for a bank or any financial institution.....but I do know how to manage a checking account.....check register and all.

I find what Steve, Jim, and Edgeman say here to be virtually 100% accurate. Stop spending what you don't have......pure and simple. Re sequencing of debits / checks / deposits really has next to nothing to do with OD / NSF fees. If you aren't spending what isn't there, it's not going to happen. You can no longer beat checks to the bank. If you have a $100 balance......you cannot spend $101....no matter how they re sequence that, you going to be OD.....and it's STILL not the banks fault.

the bottom line is .......

IF the money is there to begin with it won't matter in which order things post. By spending that last $100.....that you already KNEW there was not enough money for.....you set yourself up to fail.

Personally I find it totally foolish to be using a debit card for all these small purchases....it's a recipe for failure. Carry some degree of cash for these rather than continually debiting.

NO....I dont now nor have I ever worked for a bank or any financial institution.....but I do know how to manage a checking account.....check register and all.

I find what Steve, Jim, and Edgeman say here to be virtually 100% accurate. Stop spending what you don't have......pure and simple. Re sequencing of debits / checks / deposits really has next to nothing to do with OD / NSF fees. If you aren't spending what isn't there, it's not going to happen. You can no longer beat checks to the bank. If you have a $100 balance......you cannot spend $101....no matter how they re sequence that, you going to be OD.....and it's STILL not the banks fault.

the bottom line is .......

IF the money is there to begin with it won't matter in which order things post. By spending that last $100.....that you already KNEW there was not enough money for.....you set yourself up to fail.

Personally I find it totally foolish to be using a debit card for all these small purchases....it's a recipe for failure. Carry some degree of cash for these rather than continually debiting.

NO....I dont now nor have I ever worked for a bank or any financial institution.....but I do know how to manage a checking account.....check register and all.

I find what Steve, Jim, and Edgeman say here to be virtually 100% accurate. Stop spending what you don't have......pure and simple. Re sequencing of debits / checks / deposits really has next to nothing to do with OD / NSF fees. If you aren't spending what isn't there, it's not going to happen. You can no longer beat checks to the bank. If you have a $100 balance......you cannot spend $101....no matter how they re sequence that, you going to be OD.....and it's STILL not the banks fault.

Steve, no matter what you think, this not entirely about managing a checkbook. Banks claim these overdraft programs are for the benefit of the consumer. Thus, consumers aren't embarrased when making a point-of-sale transaction and also to assist the consumer if they need to pay a bill and don't have available funds. The only problem with this is that consumers are agreeing to the ONE $35.00 NSF fee, not five or six.

(This actually happened to me).

I.E. Starting Saturday balance in your checking account of $100.00
Sunday P.O.S. transaction for $5.00 then another P.O.S. Tran. for $10.00
Monday P.O.S. tran. for $10.00 and an ATM withdrawal for $40.00

All of these transaction will be in a pending status until they are posted to the account. These debits are deducted from the available balance. Chronologically, you have spent $65.00 in your account and you have a remaining balance of $35.00. If you have an extra bill that comes in on Monday you have to decide whether to take a $35.00 NSF fee or go borrow money from a payday lender and pay their fees. You go and pay your bill which is $100.00 and overdraw your account by $65.00 and you expect a $35.00 fee to be added on, meaning you own the bank $100.00.
However, if that $100.00 you paid the bill with and all the P.O.S. fees post to your account on the same day, the bank will first subtract the $100.00 debit, then the $40.00 ATM debit, then both $10.00 P.O.S. debits, and finally the $5.00 P.O.S. debit.
Your account will go to a zero and you will be charged 4 NSF fees for the $40.00 debit, both $10.00 debits, and the $5.00 debit when you though you were only going to be charged with one NSF fee.

Chronological Order Resequenced
Starting Balance: $100.00 $100.00
-$5.00 P.O.S-covered -$100.00-covered
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$40.00-NSF fee+35
-$10.00 P.O.S.-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$40.00 ATM-covered -$10.00-NSF fee+35
-$100.00 check-NSF fee+$35.00 -$5.00-NSF fee+35
Ending Bal.=$-100.00 owed to the bank End Bal.= $205.00 owed to the bank
=$35.00 in NSF fees =$140.00 in NSF fees
$35.00 or $140.00 if you don't see something wrong here, you have gone mad.

Andy,

If I don't know what I'm talking about, explain why I have never paid an NSF fee!
31 years of checking accounts with no NSF fees. Just luck?
I think not.

And, why is it that when someone defends the action of a bank, that person is automatically a bank employee?

What kind of 3 year old mentality is that?

Grow up!
Learn how to do 3rd grade math and 6th grade English and just manage your checking account the same way I do to avoid the fees.

I guess I am an idiot because I never have paid an NSF fee?
So be it. I've been called worse by better than you.

Just keep paying those NSF fees so my checking remains free, ok?

You will have to forgive Steve. He's one of those type of people you would want to watch out for in life. Steve has no idea what he is talking about. Steve claims that he doesn't work for a bank, but we all know better than that, or he wouldn't show up on half of the complaints on ripoff report defending BB&T. Steve please go back to managing your checkbook, improving the education system, preparing for an invasion, and whatever else you like to do in your leisure time.

After reading "Davy Jonz" post, I have come to a simple conclusion.

We, as Americans, have failed in our educational system.
We have, indeed, raised about 2 generations of genuine MORONS. The majority of these last 2 generations have absolutely no common sense at all.
They want everyone else to be responsible for them, and thier bad choices, and actions.
They are mostly illiterate.

That is the real rip off here.

Just the mentality of these posters who use the rational that since there are so many posts against banks regarding NSF fees, they must be legitimate, just proves this IGNORANCE.

The fact of the matter is, that the real problem lies with that many people who are just too stupid and/or lazy to properly manage a checkbook register!

Think about it. Maintaining a checkbook register involves ONLY third grade math!
So, how many of you are actually smarter than a THIRD GRADER?

It is an invasion.
Stupidity has landed.



>>>
Submitted: 10/10/2008 4:52:18 AM
Modified: 10/10/2008 9:25:52 AM Davy Jonz
Hanover, Pennsylvania
U.S.A.

Do you people work for the banks?
Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc....its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge, It doesnt matter what you sign. If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!

in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this. If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!


>>>

DavyJonz, your post reminded me why there is so much ignorance in the world regarding the proper management of money. This really has nothing to do with greed, nothing to do with charging interest, and certainly nothing criminal the bank has done. Fees are not interest; they are penalties the bank imposes upon account holders for mismanaging their accounts. Those fees are documented in the account agreement all account holders sign. As I said, nothing illegal, nothing immoral, nothing to do with interest, and nothing greedy about it. If you choose to mismanage your money, that's your choice.

Your comment regarding the bank's ability to tell you what the balance in your account is upon your request is a perfect example of the ignorance you shared with us. There is not one bank out there that can give you an accurate representation of what the balance is in your account because the balance won't include (1) pending charges to your account done from a debit card, and (2) outstanding checks you wrote that the bank has yet to receive. If you are properly managing your accounts, you will NEVER have to ask what the balance is in your account, because that balance is in your check register.

Do yourself a favor: please take whatever time is necessary to learn what you need to know about handling money properly, starting off with the shredding of your debit card. Then I would learn the fine art of keeping a written check register, followed by learning to manage your life to live only on cash and checks. The bank will never get another overdraft fee from you ever again if you do these things I recommend. If you choose not to, you can just hand your money over to the bank for them to keep since you won't be keeping any of it....

"Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc..."

Actually, it's about not going below the account balance.

"its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge,"

Illegal? Really? The fees are illegal? And if they are so immoral, why would anyone sign that they agree to these terms and conditions?

"It doesnt matter what you sign."

Yes, it does. If one were to sign that they agree to the terms and conditions of the bank, then they agree to be subject to OD and NSF fees when they go below their account balance. When they sign that receipt at the retialer, they are guaranteeing that transaction.

"If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!"

Irrelevant. OD and NSF fees are not interest. They are a flat fee charged per occurance. It doesn't matter if you overdraft by a penny or a thousand dollars, the fee is the same.

"in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this."

Really? Tonight I bought gasoline and paid at the pump. I bought about ten gallons worth of gas, yet the station only put a $1 hold on my card. How is the bank to know how much the merchant is going to claim? Also, how is the bank supposed to know if I have a check out there that's going to be presented on the next business day? They can't.

On the other hand, it is possible to know your own balance every time you use your card. Simply enter every transaction and deposit you make into a ledger, spreadhseet or check register.

"If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!"

That is just silly. It is ultimately the customer who overdraws their account. Occasionally it is bank error but more often than not it is on the part of the account owner. The bank cannot force you to overdraw your account. It's simply a matter of not allowing your balance to go negative.

And to answer your question, some of us work at banks. I do not. I simply don't see any reason to pay OD or NSF fees. They are too expensive and ultimately unecessary.

"Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc..."

Actually, it's about not going below the account balance.

"its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge,"

Illegal? Really? The fees are illegal? And if they are so immoral, why would anyone sign that they agree to these terms and conditions?

"It doesnt matter what you sign."

Yes, it does. If one were to sign that they agree to the terms and conditions of the bank, then they agree to be subject to OD and NSF fees when they go below their account balance. When they sign that receipt at the retialer, they are guaranteeing that transaction.

"If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!"

Irrelevant. OD and NSF fees are not interest. They are a flat fee charged per occurance. It doesn't matter if you overdraft by a penny or a thousand dollars, the fee is the same.

"in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this."

Really? Tonight I bought gasoline and paid at the pump. I bought about ten gallons worth of gas, yet the station only put a $1 hold on my card. How is the bank to know how much the merchant is going to claim? Also, how is the bank supposed to know if I have a check out there that's going to be presented on the next business day? They can't.

On the other hand, it is possible to know your own balance every time you use your card. Simply enter every transaction and deposit you make into a ledger, spreadhseet or check register.

"If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!"

That is just silly. It is ultimately the customer who overdraws their account. Occasionally it is bank error but more often than not it is on the part of the account owner. The bank cannot force you to overdraw your account. It's simply a matter of not allowing your balance to go negative.

And to answer your question, some of us work at banks. I do not. I simply don't see any reason to pay OD or NSF fees. They are too expensive and ultimately unecessary.

"Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc..."

Actually, it's about not going below the account balance.

"its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge,"

Illegal? Really? The fees are illegal? And if they are so immoral, why would anyone sign that they agree to these terms and conditions?

"It doesnt matter what you sign."

Yes, it does. If one were to sign that they agree to the terms and conditions of the bank, then they agree to be subject to OD and NSF fees when they go below their account balance. When they sign that receipt at the retialer, they are guaranteeing that transaction.

"If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!"

Irrelevant. OD and NSF fees are not interest. They are a flat fee charged per occurance. It doesn't matter if you overdraft by a penny or a thousand dollars, the fee is the same.

"in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this."

Really? Tonight I bought gasoline and paid at the pump. I bought about ten gallons worth of gas, yet the station only put a $1 hold on my card. How is the bank to know how much the merchant is going to claim? Also, how is the bank supposed to know if I have a check out there that's going to be presented on the next business day? They can't.

On the other hand, it is possible to know your own balance every time you use your card. Simply enter every transaction and deposit you make into a ledger, spreadhseet or check register.

"If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!"

That is just silly. It is ultimately the customer who overdraws their account. Occasionally it is bank error but more often than not it is on the part of the account owner. The bank cannot force you to overdraw your account. It's simply a matter of not allowing your balance to go negative.

And to answer your question, some of us work at banks. I do not. I simply don't see any reason to pay OD or NSF fees. They are too expensive and ultimately unecessary.

"Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc..."

Actually, it's about not going below the account balance.

"its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge,"

Illegal? Really? The fees are illegal? And if they are so immoral, why would anyone sign that they agree to these terms and conditions?

"It doesnt matter what you sign."

Yes, it does. If one were to sign that they agree to the terms and conditions of the bank, then they agree to be subject to OD and NSF fees when they go below their account balance. When they sign that receipt at the retialer, they are guaranteeing that transaction.

"If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!"

Irrelevant. OD and NSF fees are not interest. They are a flat fee charged per occurance. It doesn't matter if you overdraft by a penny or a thousand dollars, the fee is the same.

"in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this."

Really? Tonight I bought gasoline and paid at the pump. I bought about ten gallons worth of gas, yet the station only put a $1 hold on my card. How is the bank to know how much the merchant is going to claim? Also, how is the bank supposed to know if I have a check out there that's going to be presented on the next business day? They can't.

On the other hand, it is possible to know your own balance every time you use your card. Simply enter every transaction and deposit you make into a ledger, spreadhseet or check register.

"If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!"

That is just silly. It is ultimately the customer who overdraws their account. Occasionally it is bank error but more often than not it is on the part of the account owner. The bank cannot force you to overdraw your account. It's simply a matter of not allowing your balance to go negative.

And to answer your question, some of us work at banks. I do not. I simply don't see any reason to pay OD or NSF fees. They are too expensive and ultimately unecessary.

The OP is simply stating that if he overdraws his account, why does the bank go ahead and PAY the OD, rather than reurn the check or debit, as would normally happen? The bank need to understand that they cannot make a loan to the OP without his permission. If they (the Bank) goes ahead and pays any overdrafts on their own, then the OP should be able to go take out a loan for whatever amount with the bank, since they deem him worthy of obtaining bank loans.

Its not about blancing a checkbook, etc etc....its about imorral and illegal fees that banks charge, It doesnt matter what you sign. If I drew up a contract and loaned you 500.00 and expected youo to pay me back 50,000 i would go to jail for loan sharking!

in this day and age its possible for banks to give you current balances everytime you use your card, and there are banks that offer this. If a bank doesnt then its just another scam to assist you in overdrawing your account and with ther procedures on debit/credits it increase thier revenue!

The debit card is a replacement for a check. If you were standing at the register writing a check, would you expect someone from the bank to run out and stop you because you had insufficient funds? I realize this analogy is a stretch, but the fact of the matter is that debit cards do not work like credit cards. They go through a completely different system, and the authorization is not always at the instant you swipe. Nonetheless, the bank is obliged to make good on that debit whether you have the funds or not.

You cannot depend on the transaction to be declined, nor can you depend on online balances to track your account. As has been said counteless times here, your only reliable way to avoid fees is to maintain a check register. You can choose to not do so, but expect these fees to continue if you do.

Hmmmm why not get overdraft protection? You complain, but do nothing about it? You need to take responsibilty for your own actions. You swipe your card, you are telling that merchant you have the money in your account. And just for your information, EVERY bank is different. It doesn't take a smart one to figure that one out. They tell you upfront the fees. Do you remember all that lovely brochures that they give you? Did you even read them? Do you own a checkbook register? Maybe you should invest in one. Oh and maybe a calculator?