Report: #590436

Complaint Review: List Wire Gary Ambrose

  • Submitted: Wed, April 07, 2010
  • Updated: Tue, December 04, 2012
  • Reported By: Anymonous — Beverly Hills California U.S.A.
  • List Wire Gary Ambrose
    12472 Lake Underhill Rd. Suite 112
    United States of America

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Here is a support request I sent in. 

"Under list setting I've put in the confirm redirect urls and remove redirect urls that I would like the visitor to go through - yet it brings it over to listwire's page - which it promotes the visitor to money making websites. 

I do not like this.

please fix it. 

the email has also gone into my spam mail...

you're list management system also refuses to send my custom confirmation email. It doesn't even save it properly online.

Why would you release something that doesn't even work? I don't care if it's for free - this was a waste of my time and I probably won't be using it if those issues aren't fixed. 

I highly suggest you fix these issues ASAP or this service will be a huge flop."

Here is their completely childish response.


Congratulations! You're the first person to have their account cancelled by the staff of List Wire ... and no, I'm not kidding.

We're not here to take your abuse, or crap ... and we're not going to. So, good bye. Please do not sign up for another account with us at any point in the future.

And, please learn to treat people with some courtesy. This is a support system, not a place for you to rant and be negative. If you had a question, we'd have gladly answered it, but that's not what your support ticket was."

PS. My account wasn't even banned. Wouldn't want it anyway. 

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 04/07/2010 09:51 AM and is a permanent record located here: The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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#1 Author of original report

Happy He Banned Me!

AUTHOR: Ansub - ()

Actually my grip wasn't only just the redirection. If you read everything, you would you know the service was not even working and I had to do a marketing campaign immediately.

And made a support request on why it's not working and simply got Gary Ambrose's uncalled for sh*tty condscending attitude and ego. 

I'm actually happy he banned now 3 years ago. I found a much much better provider with many more features, reliability, more professional and no sh*tty scam advertisments to my customers.

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#2 Consumer Comment

the major downside to usng listwire?

AUTHOR: cdhhyper - (United Kingdom)

You may be interested to read this report at

Tim initially gave listwire a very good rating in his initial review - but then found out exactly how listwire works. He suggested that to some people this may be enough to send them elsewhere.

of course, if you are happy with what gary ambrose is doing you can continue using listwire.

This of course, is why the initial poster of the report was probably a bit chagrined.  he could not stop this redirection happening no matter what he did.

And this redirection is of course how mr  g ambrose makes even more money.

the key to all this - get the info then make your own decision about usage.

A 'free'  service is never free - it has to make money to survive - and  also make money for it's originator.

You just to be sure that you are happy with how they make thier money and what impact this will have on your own list prospects.

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#3 REBUTTAL Owner of company

Another alternative

AUTHOR: David - (United States of America)

First off, I'd like to say kudos to the above poster for keeping your business alive and pulling out of your slump. That is indeed inspiring and I think it's helpful to would-be marketers and marketers in the making to hear of such things. I know it encourages me.

I do agree that you have to expect some cost with "free". And having said that, I will reitterate that I do not hold Mr. Ambrose in contempt for his methods, but I maintain that if I had known about them up front I would have chosen a different route.

Also, I was sort of under the impression that ListWire was the only real viable alternative to Aweber. But I've found this to not be so. As a matter of fact, I've just signed up to

MailChimp is similar to Aweber in pricing except that they do have a free service that covers up to 5k people on your list, and 12k outgoing emails per month. This is something that could help you to get on your feet, and then be able to start paying for your service once you're up and running. I've also researched their services and believe they are comparable to Aweber and ListWire.

Of course I only just discovered them last night, so time will tell. But in their case the price of "free" is the assumption that they will get your continued business once you start making money. And I'm happy to give it to them barring any little surprises in their business practices. If I do find that there are any such surprises, I'll be back to make it known. Otherwise, I'll use them for as long as is feasible.
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#4 REBUTTAL Owner of company

MR.Rafael Cruz j.r.

AUTHOR: Euer - (U.S.A.)

Dear Sir,

I used ListWire in a single campaign two years ago (about the time I made my rebuttal above your post.)

I managed to keep things going and as of today, all but one campaign survived.  Since then, I've restored my Aweber account.  Ironically, the campaign which had the ListWire attached to it was the one I let go just yesterday!  It's not that I lost it, but that it was one of my earlier campaigns and it was better to just close it and replace it with a new, more effective campaign.

I used Listwire for almost a year with no incident.  Whilst it is true the email service comes with sponsoring, this is nothing new with free services.  I had no qualms about it and I consider it a normal thing.

Today I'm involved with Wealthy Affiliate University (an online Internet marketing training program.)  I was in this program back when I made my post but I had not been there long enough to learn much.  I'm learning how to do both local and global marketing.

I've been working on promoting physical products.  I've written two books since those days and they are nearing completion.

Gary Ambrose is an Internet marketing pioneer in my book.  His ListWire is an asset to those who do not have the funds (and even those who do, but are on a shoestring budget.)  Practically everyone who becomes a heavy hitter on the Internet will invariably run into folks who have nothing better to do than to slam them.  Gary Ambrose surprisingly, has only had one instance of far as I know at this point.

Thanks for inquiring.  I hope I answered your questions adequately.

Daniel Euergetes
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#5 Consumer Comment

The gentleman may not be the most diplomatic, but he raises an important point

AUTHOR: David - (United States of America)

I recently signed up for Listwire, though I have not used it yet. And in light of what Mr. Gentleman has had to say, I think I will probably opt to pay the $20 per month to Aweber.

I don't blame Gary Ambrose for being displeased with the wording of the complaint. Albeit, it isn't the first time that I've read a strongly-worded response from him in regard to someone who has complained about one of his products (the other was not a free one, like Listwire) so it tells me that he probably does not handle criticism very well. But that's hardly a reason to devalue a product or service that he provides.

What does concern me, however, is that this little detail - and in my opinion an important one; a deal breaker - wouldn't be known aside from the personal experience unless you happened to read about it as I did here.

I actually found this while doing an online search for some kind of Listwire tutorial since documentation is not available at the site yet, and there doesn't seem to be any books written about it yet either (the folks at Dummies haven't taken it to task just yet). But a while back when I was first weighing Aweber vs. the free Listwire, I read a forum thread in which someone was posing the question, "What does Gary Ambrose get out of making Listwire a free service?" Mr. Ambrose got involved in that thread defending Listwire, but was a little evasive in answering the question. Finally (and I'm afraid I don't remember his exact words) he simply said that he would not reaveal what he got from it.

I thought it wouldn't hurt to try it, so I finally signed up. When I started getting emails from Gary Ambrose (several, in fact) promoting another make-money-online product, I assumed that was my answer - what he got out of it was that I'd been added to his list. Now it seems I'm learning there's more to it than that...

I think people should know this up-front. Maybe you're someone who welcomes sharing your list with Mr. Ambrose - as the other fellow who is struggling to stay afloat with his online endeavors. That's fine... that's a price he's willing to pay. But make no mistake about it - in the greater evaluation, sharing your list is a significant price and could, I believe, have a negative impact on your business. It's nothing like the color of Facebook's logo at all. I think that internet marketers like myself - and others - who are weighing Aweber vs. the free service of Listwire have a right to know about this up front so that they can make a more informed decision. Because even though the service is "free", if it ultimately costs you business, it isn't really free after all.
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#6 General Comment

MR.Daniel Euergetes

AUTHOR: RAFAEL CRUZ J.R. - (Puerto Rico)

I read your comments intended for the "Gentlemen".
I recall you mentioned your interest in Gary Ambrose,s services,

Basically im just wondering if you did because i also am interested in his services, and i would love to hear how thats going for you.i mean i cant say a tree bears bad fruit just because i find one rotten apple you know?so please at your leisure of course can you let me how buisness is going for you?if you actually went with garys services of course.thank you very much for your time.ill really appreciate a responce..
MR.Rafael Cruz j.r. 
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#7 General Comment

Come Down from There, Mr. "Gentleman!"

AUTHOR: Euer - (U.S.A.)

A classical case of entitlement mentality!  Unfortunately this is what happens in a world of democracy.  Some people lose sight of reality and hence, things like this.

I say, "Don't muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn."  I don't know the implications of what happens when signing up and using this service and whether or not it results in promotional messages being sent to prospects, but in my case...

I'm broke, trying to keep up my campaigns, am in grave danger now of losing everything for lack of income...because I can't come up with the lousy $200 I need to go another year at this.  Losing my entire Internet presence is now imminent so you can see why I see something like this as God-sent!

Whether or not there's messages from Gary Ambrose to my prospects, it's FAR better than NOTHING AT ALL!

I'm thoroughly grateful this service is there!  I gladly endorse anything within fairness that has been done's a free service that doesn't require any out-of-pocket expenses and you cannot expect a Rolls Royce to come to you when you need a ride somewhere and are the beggar here, now can you?

In this case, take what you are given (well, I guess you blew that) and have the common courtesy to be prepared to give back in some way when it is asked of you...

Good grief!  Get real Mr. Gentleman!  Come out of your chrome-plated, air-conditioned, white universe and show a little gratitude for Mr. Ambrose instead of complaining about it and GROW UP!

Daniel Euergetes

P.S.  I've known about you for a very long time Gary...You have a new sign-up here!  Thank you for providing this service, even though it may not be the best...if it works...and you do tap into my list like this person says, well, it's my way of showing my gratitude by acknowledging that, well, giving is mutual and this person is all looks like all my work is going down the drain, but this service will help me with part of my problem...that's all I need for now!

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#8 Author of original report

Mr. Ambrose is a Bad Liar

AUTHOR: Ansub - (U.S.A.)

Gary Ambrose IS involved with the two ripoff report links I've posted. 

Keith Wellman,FX Marketing Inc, is also involved with another company, or in another. SCAM that goes by the name of

"Nickel Mania, Nickel Mania X,
Gary Ambrose and Keith Wellman

Nickel Mania 2004-2009
A division of Internet Marketing Aces, LLC.

Internet Marketing Aces, LLC 
12472 Lake Underhill Rd. Suite 112 
Orlando, Florida 32828 U.S.A. 

Check out those ripoff report links for yourself - go to the website on the report - look below - and you will see the company "Internet Marketing Aces"

Go to 

And look all the way below on the website home page and you will see this

"List Wire 2008-2010. A division of Internet Marketing Aces, LLC. All rights reserved.
Internet Marketing Aces, LLC - 12472 Lake Underhill Rd. Suite 112 - Orlando, FL 32828 - U.S.A."

Again this guy is nothing but a liar and he can't even defend his case without a single ounce of any sort of merit, proof or solid objective evidence. 

All says has no proof, merit or any evidence. Enjoy your day Mr. Gary Ambrose.  :)
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#9 REBUTTAL Owner of company

again, misinformed ...

AUTHOR: Gary - (United States of America)


Alright, here we go again ... completely misinformed.

First, he links to two posts about someone other than me. Those two posts are not about me, my company, or my service ... so I'm not sure what the "enough said" is about, as neither of those reports are about me.

Should I find some random posts here about someone else, and claim they're about the guy making this complaint? Apparently, at least based on his logic, that makes sense ...

He then says:

"My advice - avoid him and his service. He picks fights & arguments over nothing."

I didn't start this post, now did I? Yet, I started these "fights & arguments" over nothing? It's pretty clear who started this thread, and it wasn't me ...

This will be my last response here. I don't have any more time to waste on picking fights & arguments over nothing. ;)

- G

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#10 Author of original report

Mr.Ambrose Fails to Justify Himself

AUTHOR: Ansub - (U.S.A.)

enough said!

In no way would support responses and requests I sent provoke any sane person to act the way Mr. Ambrose did.

Here's what's the bottom line: Mr. Ambrose tries to make his case by presenting my response - but what he fails to do is point EXACTLY what I said which was "abusive" or indecent.

I highly suggest - you avoid this guy. He advertises scammy get-rich quick websites to your prospects - which can give you a bad name.

Conclusion: Mr. Ambrose simply has a big ego - who wants to be praised for nothing. 

His "free" service - isn't really free as you're PROSPECTS are being hit by -get-rich quick scammy advertising in your email campaigns. 

My advice - avoid him and his service. He picks fights & arguments over nothing.
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#11 REBUTTAL Owner of company

something missing.

AUTHOR: Gary - (United States of America)

Hello all,

Well, I got this notification by Google Alerts, and when I read it, I couldn't help but laugh a little ... is this person really claiming they were "ripped off" by a free service?

How is that even possible? Oh right, it's not ...

I'm the owner of the site, and I'm also the one that wrote the "childish" support response to the gentleman making the complaint ... and just to avoid any confusion, I'm being totally sarcastic when I use the word gentleman.

As you'll notice in my response, I said the following ...

"We're not here to take your abuse, or crap ... and we're not going to. So, good bye. Please do not sign up for another account with us at any point in the future."

The original support ticket submitted, as well as the many others, were not exactly written nicely. And, as stated, the support department of any website isn't there to take any abuse, or crap. We're offering something to people at no cost, and all we ask for is a little common courtesy ... we didn't get it from this "gentleman".

I also said the following:

And, please learn to treat people with some courtesy. This is a support system, not a place for you to rant and be negative. If you had a question, we'd have gladly answered it, but that's not what your support ticket was."

Again, this backs up what I just stated above ... we hadn't been treated with common courtesy, or any courtesy for that matter. All we got were a bunch of rants from someone who seemed mad at the world.

You'll see that the "gentleman" said this in his original ticket:

"Under list setting I've put in the confirm redirect urls and remove redirect urls that I would like the visitor to go through - yet it brings it over to listwire's page - which it promotes the visitor to money making websites. - I do not like this. - please fix it."

hFirst, I'm shocked to see the word "Please" in there, it was the only time he used it in any of the tickets he submitted to us ...

That said, we're a free service, and we'd already told this person that everything was working 100% as it should. There was nothing to "fix", but apparently that wasn't good enough for him.

Again, we're a free service ... if you don't like how we do things, that's alright, there are plenty of other services out there that do the same basic things we do for a fee.

This person said to "fix it" for something there was no fix for. Now I know most of the people reading this won't know what the site, or service is ... but his request would be something along the lines of sending FaceBook repeated angry support tickets telling them to make their logo the color green because he doesn't like it.

Well I'm sorry, but we have thousands of users to worry about, and we're not going to change the functionality of the entire system for one person, even if they get angry, and throw a fit ...

I stand behind my cancellation of this user 100%, and don't regret a single word I sent to this "gentleman". It's pretty obvious based on this post that he's a troublemaker, and when he doesn't get everything his way, he starts pouting and throws a fit ... that's why he posted this complaint here.

He used a free service, didn't like how it worked, we told him that we weren't going to change anything, and he kept complaining ... we have a support desk that's open, and in many cases, the tickets are answered by the owner. We're there to offer support, not to listen take abuse as I said.

The submitter of this complaint conveniently left out this part of the support ticket they quoted, but since we have a record of it, I figured you might want to see the rest ...

Mr. Anonymous, who wouldn't even post his real name here said:

Why would you release something that doesn't even work? I don't care if it's for free - this was a waste of my time and I probably won't be using it if those issues aren't fixed.

I highly suggest you fix these issues ASAP or this service will be a huge flop

We just decided to speed up his decision making process for him. It saved us from spending any more time on this "gentleman", and allowed us to focus on the users of our service who have the decency to ask questions as though they're talking to another person ... and not as though they're yelling at a slave.

There was no issue to fix, but he thought otherwise, and decided that ranting and raving would make us change our minds.

And finally, as was also stated in what he posted, I said:

Congratulations! You're the first person to have their account cancelled by the staff of List Wire ... and no, I'm not kidding."

He was the first, and so far, the ONLY person to have had their account cancelled by our staff. We don't make it a habit to randomly cancel accounts, we only do so in extreme cases, and so far, this "gentleman" was the only person who's account warranted cancellation.

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