Complaint Review: McCrone Associates - Westmont, Illinois
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McCrone Associates McCrone Research, McCrrone Group, Inc. McCrone Associates used subjective reasoning to fill in the holes in an important scientific report, then McCrone rejected their own report, and never replaced it or returned the customer's moneys Westmont,, Illinois
*Author of original report: Joe Barabe had me cut the mat of the orignal framing to mislead me.
*Author of original report: Joe Barabe is a photographer but never used any photo while witing the Renoir report.
*Author of original report: I was told Joe Barabe has been lecturing about the pastel without permission
*Author of original report: To Get my money joe Barabe said he knew Renoir's paper but never told me
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McCrone Associates used subjective reasoning to fill in the holes
in an important scientific report, then rejected the report, and never replaced it or returned the customer's moneys. Although McCrone Associates promised client would only be charged $400 and take only two weeks, if they could not supply information to prove the Renoir Pastel to be of correct date and materials for authentication, the moneys were not
returned.
McCrone Associates insisted the client pay for scientific results, that McCrone Associates were never able of compiling. The payment in advance was compulsory. After admitted mistakes, the McCrone Associates were unable to provide new complete 'certified tests results' to correct errors. Subjective reasoning was mixed with scientific reasoning, for lack of facts, errors admitted in original data, but never corrected.
McCrone Associates, Chicago Illinois, swore to me they could recognize Pierre Augusts Renoir's paints, pastels and paper,"no problem" says Joe Barabe, in a fax, August 25,1999.
Joe Barabe and Dr. McCrone of McCrone Associates, started research in September 1999, when Joe Barabe came to my home and collected a five hundred dollar deposit, took pigment samples, cut a corner from the paper of a Renoir Pastel and told me, only if McCrone Associates totally proved the picture was a real Renoir, would they collect the full $2,000. In December, 1999, Joe Barabe informed me that the tests were positive in his faxes, and requested another $1,000. On March 1st, 2000, in order to receive the data I had to pay the final $500, making a total of $2,000 in up front payments.
Joe Barabe started the new investigation, but found it too time consuming to understand vast implications of 19th century pastels and their differences and gave up. I made Joe Barabe aware of
his mistakes. He admitted he needed to do an investigation into the different type of pastel.
On March 22nd, 2000, they sent me a written final data report full of mistakes, involving the dating materials.
I discovered black pigment restoration on the edges which was being mistaken for "matt burn" by McCrone Associates. Also McCrone Associates also did not know Renoir used coated artist's paper or lithopone pigment, proven by Netherlands experts lithopone was used as his white pigment, in nineteenth century European pastels nor did I.
The technical dating of the paper in Joe Barabe's original mcCrone assoc. was without proof or technical reason, and McCrone Associates were proven wrong by the Dutch and American and European Conservators, but ignored this.
Bo nnie Betty, Vice President of McCrone Associates, March 29, 2000, told me to burn all their reports to cover their mistakes and forget I ever saw McCrone Associates.
Dr. McCrone promised to correct these mistakes after a pattern of restoration on the edges was found, that explained the "matt burn" mistakes.
Dr. McCrone, May 8th, 2000, admitted, in my home, on tape, that the McCrone Associates Report was flawed. Dr. McCrone, May 8th, 2000 took new samples, but never sent an official certified data report, but threatened me that he would make me look bad if I made him look bad.
January, 2001, Jim Few, a known American pastel expert told me pastel migrates, and this is something McCrone Associates never discussed at any time or in the McCrone report. Fredder Schmidt, a paper expert, faxed me to say there is no technical reason for the paper date of 1900 MCCrone Associates made in the their final report.
February 11th, 2001, a year and half after McCrone Associates cut the first corner, Mccrone Associates and Dr. McCrone cut a second corner from the paper in Chicago.
February 20, 2001, McCrone Associates and Dr. McCrone said they would get information from the paper, and needed more time to "analyze." But I never heard any more information from them.
Mccrone Associates still do not know about the proper dating of and use of lithopone during the nineteenth century, or understand the paper itself and the paper Renoir used. In June of 2006, Lucy mcCrone said McCrone Associates have all samples taken form the pastel. These samples have not been returned.to me
I can send the Better Business Bureau any faxes sent by McCrone Associates, any reports, any conversations mentioned recorded and photographs of negligence. The corners they cut from the paper were far too big for any professional and McCrone Assoc. never concluded anything in their final letters.
All this adds up to bad damages on my side, and I should be paid for
the year and one half of my time, $5,000 and the amount their illegitimate claims to knowledge that they did not have, is truly a reason for McCrone Associates to be held liable for their lies.
I have only listed some of the insults and and liable actions created by McCrone Associates. Mccrone Associate and Dr Walter McCrone admitted working together on the Renoir pastel from the very beginning in September, 1999 to February 20, 2001. Dr Mccrone, McCrone Research and McCrone Associates colluded together for a year and half on every aspect of sample taking and reporting. I have all their faxes stating this.
When i called to complained all the mistakes i the McCrone report, Ms Bonnie Vice president of McCrone said " burn the McCrone Report"
When I spoke To Mrs. Lucy McCrone she said that she and Dr. McCrone never cared about me or my art work.
I hope McCrone will do the right thing and be honest, learn about the their mistakes in my complainant and refund my money.
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#4 Author of original report
Joe Barabe had me cut the mat of the orignal framing to mislead me.
AUTHOR: greg - (United States of America)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, May 26, 2010
Joe Barabe had me cut the mat of the original framing to mislead me when the question of titanium was only found in little quantities on the edge of the art discovered by a different bone black pigment found in the McCrone data than the charcoal in the center.
Mr Barabe never told me there was a different black present to showing there was restoration.
Instead incompetent and destructive Joesph Barabe ordered me to curt a big corner of the mat and for him to examine to see of the reason of the little titanium found.
Sadly i trusted this guy, he seemed to be honest.
How did Joseph Barabe miss a different black found on the edgeon a work of art and not tell me.
It breaks my heart how destructive Josph Barabe was on an imprtant work of art.
Repeat Joe Barabe never used a photograph in a 5 page report that was found to have full of defect,. so many Dr McCrone came to my house to try to fix things. Dr McCrone admitted Joe Barabe made mistakes writing the McCrone Renoir Pastel Report. I have it on tape and a book signed by him when he came to my house saying I was right. Sadly McCrone Associates covered up the mistakes not fixing them.
#3 Author of original report
Joe Barabe is a photographer but never used any photo while witing the Renoir report.
AUTHOR: greg - (United States of America)
SUBMITTED: Wednesday, March 17, 2010
Joe Barabe is a photographer but never used any photo while writing the Renoir report and lost the photo I gave him. I wonder if he did that on purpose.
a high quality Renoir pastel for many years before dying and Wildensteins asked for testing.
I told Joe Barabe that there was French ownership on the back. I guess it went in ear and out the other, sadly.
There are new safer ways of finding out about the make up of art materials by means of safer and non destructive ways other than the McCrone Associates way. Warning go them as a last resort. There are art scientist conservators who are more qualified to do any pigment samples than McCrone Associates.
#2 Author of original report
I was told Joe Barabe has been lecturing about the pastel without permission
AUTHOR: greg - (United States of America)
SUBMITTED: Friday, March 05, 2010
The main for my complaint is as follows:
1. McCrone Associates and Dr mcCrone in a fax said pastel not blowing away. Pastel does migrate and blow away. Joe Barabe nor Dr MCrone never told me it would affect dating using Mccrone Associates methods. Joe Barabe also writes that he should dig into the signature and take more samples which would be useles. Digging in pastel with a needle is not only damaging but it's like digging in sand.
2. McCrone Associates, Joe Barabe, Dr Walter McCrone could have discovered the paper Renoir used over a year and half time after I pleaded with them. Instead McCrone Associates promised they would use an electron microscope on the paper and did not.
I found out 2 years later there going to the Netherlands and seing the Dutch paper, scientists conservation experts, I learned that there are about 5 different organic chemicals in the paper Renoir used and this chemical can be measured and compared to other Renoir's.
Joe Barabe made up a date in a scientific report. According to Hunter's Paper Making the sulphite process began in 1857 and was perfected in the 1870's but for some unscientific and subjective reason MCrone Associates and Joe Barbie said 1905 for a non-techinical reason. No literature was ever offered by McCrone Associates for this subjective date. . To this day they refuse to learn about the paper Renoir used.
3 Joeseph Barabe and Dr Walter McCrone cut two large corners off the pastel paper on two different occasion and never detected a starch coating in the paper where as I have 4 art conservators reports stating coating found . Why did MCrone Associates not detect starch with there plain eye or a magnifying glass. or his highpowered eye wear Joe uses.
There all kinds of organic materials that were found by the Dutch scientists that McCrone Associates and Joe Barabe did not detect. If I had the money i would sue them. Turns out Renoir's paper he used for the studies during 1883-1884 had a coating on it.
4, Mccrone Associates in their Renoir report I paid for never mentioned lithopone being used as a new white in the late19th century in report. Why when it was used?
5. After paying $2000.00 to McCrone Associates, Joe Barabe did not tell me in the their 5 page report that there was a different second black pigment (called bone black) found in the McCrone data going around the entire edge of the pastel and the center of the pastel was found to have charcoal. There was negligence by Joe Barabe of McCRone Associates by not telling me. Instead joe Babe writes it migh be a matt burn. matt Burns are brown not black so what Joe Barbe wrote was out of ignorance about art.
if Mccrone Associates had detected this in their own MCrone data after 6 months of writing a 5 page report, they would have discovered restoration on the entire edge of the drawing. When i found this black on the edge in the data that is when Dr. McCrone came to my house saying he was going help but never did. Why?
The Dutch Renoir paper discovery Renoir Paper Authentication Report (which contains the MCrone data) by
Dr. Henk Porck and Mr. Adriaan Kardinaal Amsterdam, is so precise that Dr. Margaret Peggy Ellis of New York University and International Foundation for Art Research can not dispute the great art discovery and thanked me for the the Dutch report. McCrone Associates are unable to dispute the Dutch paper report.
graphs.
Francis Daulte the well documented Renoir expert called the pastel i found i thought was a high quality a Renoir pastel for many years before dying and Wildensteins asked for testing
first please let me say that Dr McCrone and Lucy McCrone was involved with the Renoir pastel report form the beginning. i have a fax dated
Time line meeting McCrone Associates
/5/99 Receive fax stating the cost would be from $1,500.00 to $2,000.00 and usual takes 2 weeks to two months.
8/17/99 first receive introducing me to analyze, a lost manet, for nyu lecture.
8/23/99 saying they examine paper and medium, said he would consult with chemist.
8/25/99 Said there would be no problem testing pastel all the contents.
September 1999 Joseph Barabe came to my house, took 15 pigment samples all over the painting. took arnold Wagner there was given his opinion in a report and was given a photograph by me and i am a photographer. he di not take any photos of before or after or asked for permission while taking samples. and he cut a big corner of the drawing.
Nov. 19,1999 Joe Barabe say he will bring the data to Dr mcCrone and sort out the questions of contamination, admitted not seeing restoration and saying i must watch budget. Admitted was not educated about pastel.vember 22, 1999 Admitted sharing data to Dr Mccrone. Said if we get past pigment issue we will examine the paper and of course look at the paper stock. Rechecks pigments.
December 8, 1999 McCrone associates says again if we are out of the woods, i would proceed with a paper comparison the WDS should clarify the titanium barium issue., if our Renoir passes that test, than yes than lest move on to the paper.
December 17, 1999 McCrone assoc. say they are sorry they have not gotten a financial summary. Joe Barabe was given that Arnold Wagner's paper report from the beginning of the tests and he said he just read them. Tells me how much the paper testing will be. Dr McCrone ha been kept informed for the beginning of testing. It says they have been discussing museum conservators using the Art Institute of Chicago. Tells the fees i have paid and how much I owe up to this point. says more testing maybe done but can be done by a woman from NYU says we want o compare our findings with the material found in other known papers especially in a batch i understand it must be good if we are still talking money.
January 13, 2000 McCrone Research says I will be pleased with the results of the pigment tests. and he has sent the paper to paper specialist and expect a report in 2 weeks says that he report that there is restoration likely on that one signature. Joe Barabe say is sorry too for taking so long and said this was the toughest job he has done.
End of January, 2000 Received a fax from McCrone Assoc. dating the paper 1878.
February 24, 2000 says their is a problem now with lithopone and because he knows nothing of lithopone and the pigment.
March/9/2000 i write about my complaints of evidence missing in preliminary report sent to me.
March 9, 2000 Said Dr McCrone said the signature was similar to Renoirs, but a fake with no proof. suggest i have the painting test, if i did not believe him. the discovery of removal of pulp made no difference and was useless information. used Degas materials to compare a painting by Renoir.
March 14, 2000. Joe Baarbe sends another preliminary report with mistakes and ask them to correct them.
March15, 2000 McCrone assoc. says it is no there role not knowing if old and new pigments can blend easily. Does not warn me pastel particles can fall off and contaminate older pigment. Says now they do not have a sample to compare the paper with.
March 21, i receive a letter from McCrone Assoc. saying that Dr. McCrone worked on the report. and the report was final.
March 22, 2000, after many faxes three rough drafts by McCrone because of repeated mistakes I finally get a finished report with many complaints by me not addressed.
March 24, 2000 McCrone Assoc. invites to challenge the report by an independent person.
April 2000 I discover pattern in McCrone data.
April 13, 2000 says Dr. McCrone the tone of my voice and says check the data, which I did again
April 14, 2000 Dr McCrone say he is interested in what i discovered.
April 26, 2000 says my photograph is excellent and wats to take more samples.
May 2000 Dr. McCrone flies out to see me in May at my house. Arrives and admit the McCrone report was flawed and takes samples. promises me data and would help find out the pattern i found.
September 23, 2000. Mc Crone Associates faxes a new data sheet with words added without graphs or any proof to deny what i hdd discovered in the original McCrone Data and threaten me to go private after they this would be all private.
November 7, 2000 Get a letter from jeopardy saying pastel does blow away and migrated and rubbed off
January 15,2001 Receive a fax that pastel can migrate and digging into signature would destroy art work and be useless.
2/01/ Dr McCrone said to come out and Joe and i will help and we take more sample and get to the bottom of this with McCrone associates help.
2/11/2001 See Dr McCrone and Lucy and Joe Barabe at the the McCrone research. as stated in a from McCrone.
2/12/2001 See Kennyon Oppenheimer in Chicago the and there conservation department detected a coating in the paper.
2/18/01 Receive a fax form Joe Barabe of mcCrone associates and Dr mcCrone saying they will be discussing the pastel.
2/20/01 Repeat the fax saying Joe Barabe and of mcCrone Associates and Dr McCrone and decided they need more time analyzing, but will truly and finish next week.
Over the years pleading for them to look at the Netherlands report and Kennyon oppphiem report
6/2007 Talk to Mrs. Lucy McCrone and said they never cared about the painting from the very beginning without reason and said my samples were with Joe at McCrone Assoc..
8/7/07. Joe Barabe has not mention where my samples a after Lucy McCrone said MCCrone Associates had my samples.
This site is for factual historical purposes only. To always ask questions and to to never give up in what you believe. Despite all the strange subjective statements McCrone Associates never called the Renoir pastel a fake but never finished the job. Why?
The American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works (AIC) was going to investigate McCrone Associates and Dr. MrCrone about my complaints but because of AIC insistence of sending information by mail was ridiculous instead of fax. I had over 20 complaints. I am happy to show them the information and faxes I have concerning McCrone Associates.
Dr Walter McCrone also passed and changed things. So I did not proceed with my complaint. I had rather liked Joe Barabe and Dr mcCrone before they cut that second off without my permission and only found out when i got back to my hotel room. Joe Barabe is wrong about pastel. Mr. Podney also retired as president of the American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works who was conducting the investigation into McCrone Associates. This made me drop my case.
#1 Author of original report
To Get my money joe Barabe said he knew Renoir's paper but never told me
AUTHOR: greg - (United States of America)
SUBMITTED: Tuesday, March 02, 2010
To Get my money Joe Barabe said he knew Renoir's paper but never told me . To this day McCrone Associates refuses to tell me or investigate the paper Renoior's used, which was very special. You have to be some kind of mean hurtful person to withold important information for authentication, Joe Barabe knowing and keeping this information from a person who paid MCCrone Associates $2000.00 just to do that, investigate Renoir's paper and never did to intentionally hurt the history of Renoir.
That is when I went to Europe in 2001. I
was suggested by the University of Maine to contact: the INTERNATIONAL
ASSOCIATION OF PAPER HISTORIANS and and was referred to Dr Henk Pork
who has made great discoveries to preserve books and other paper
discoveries. Dr Pork's reply to my request was that he would help. Mr.
Kardinaal made a team of 20 people in 2002 to do the testing and
research. It took one year to finish the report.
Luckily two years later, going to Europe, a report was completed in December of 2002.
For
the full Dutch 30 page Renoir paper report on the paper the pastel is
on go to: http://www.onderzoeksbureau-defacto.nl/index_en.html
Joe Barabe told me all mediums are basically the same. What Joe Barabe said is flat out false. Pastel will blow away, fall off due to vibration. Oil paint does not do this.
When I asked Dr. Walter McCrone aboue about pastel and pastel dust migrating or moving aound on the surface of the art work and falling off (un-like oil paint or acyrilic that is stable) how this affects dating art work. Dr McCrone faxed me and wrote that pastel does not blow away. Dr. McCrone intentionally tried to persuade me that pastel does not move around or blow to hurt a work of art.
One last note about the McCrone Associates Renoir reports. In the
reports it's suggest to research Renoir' paper. Why did they not to do
it? They promised they would when they took my money. McCrone
Associates should know the paper Renoir used.
Luckily two years later, going to Europe, a report was completed in December of 2002.
For
the full Dutch 30 page Renoir paper report on the paper the pastel is
on go to: http://www.onderzoeksbureau-defacto.nl/index_en.html
The
Dutch Renoir paper report discovery by Adriaan Kardinaal and Dr. Henk
Pork, Amsterdam, is so precise that Dr. Margaret Peggy Ellis of New
York University and International Foundation for Art Research can not
dispute the great art discovery and thanked me for the the Dutch report.
Joe Barabe why did i have go to Europe to learn about Renoir's paper and make up date he created out of thin air. i am shocked at Joe for being so imprecise. Why did he do it? I never got a reason.
I am very hurt by it because I trusted McCrone Associates and McCrone Associates did this weird science on a very important work of art that was attributed to the artist by the expert because I found flawed mistake in there report about pastel and paper. Strange the McCrone data they produced was excellent, it discovered restoration but they never said that in McCrone report.
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