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Report: #275566

Complaint Review: Response Mail Express - Tampa Florida

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  • Reported By: Secane Pennsylvania
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  • Response Mail Express 4910 Savarese Cir Tampa, Florida U.S.A.

Response Mail Express RESPONSE MAIL EXPRESS RIPOFF DECEPTIVE SALES TACTICS AND PHONY MARKETING LISTS Tampa Florida

*Author of original report: *Mike, why don't you face the fact that you're wrong?

*REBUTTAL Individual responds: Always appropriate in every way.

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I started using this company in June 2007. After many phone and mail solicitations, I contacted Michael Totten, a salesperson for this company, and decided to give this company a try because I wanted to use something different in my mailings.

The first mailing I did with them, I provided my own list, and received what I felt were pretty good results, especially given the market we're in right now. As a result, I decided to use RME you another mailing.

Michael Totten recommended to me that this time, I use HIS mailing list because he could get me the same data for a fraction of the cost I was paying and, consequesntly, I decided to take him up on his offer...BIG MISTAKE!

If you're reading this, you're most likely a mortgage professional, so you'll understand what I'm about to say here. I prefer credit score data, because it provides REAL TIME information about a consumer's credit profile, which is important in the mortgage industry right now, because you want to ensure the people who are contacting you QUALIFY for a loan. Makes sense right? Well, I requested FICO scores of 620 and up, and I received numerous calls from people with scores in the low 500s, even one with a credit score of 490! On top of that, I get a call from a young man who was very motivated to get a loan, but it was his parent's house! And here's my favorite. A lady leaves me a voice mail asking me to take her FOURTEEN year old daughter off her mailing list! Mind you, this was "credit score data" they were supposedly using.

I complained to Michael about this, and he admits that not only was the list bad, but he had other companies with the same issue. As a result, he insisted he would send out another mailing for me, for free, though he asked me to cover the postage because he didnt want to take the big commission hit. Forget the fact that I paid $3500 for a bad list, which we all know that without a quality list, marketing is ineffective no matter how good the piece is.

On the "re-mailing" they did for me, out of 5000 they allegedly sent out, I get TWO calls. OK, we've all been there. We've all had mailings that didnt work the way we expected, but we also want to find out why. I check the list and find out that out of 5000 names, less than 300 met my criteria! And Totten tells me he went back to the same list company he used for the last mailing!

I have filed a complaint with the BBB of Western Florida, and likely will be filing with the Attorney General's office as well. I urge anyone who's been ripped off by this company to do the same.

By the way, I have documented proof of everything I've said here, in case anyone wants to see for themselves.

Be careful who you deal with out there. If you have an established company you deal with, change isnt always good. If you havent, you've done the right thing. Keep doing your homeowrk, checking this site and the BBB and you wont have to suffer the aggravation I am right now.

Oliver
Secane, Pennsylvania
U.S.A.

This report was posted on Ripoff Report on 09/21/2007 09:11 AM and is a permanent record located here: https://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/response-mail-express/tampa-florida-33634/response-mail-express-response-mail-express-ripoff-deceptive-sales-tactics-and-phony-marke-275566. The posting time indicated is Arizona local time. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. READ: Foreign websites steal our content

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REBUTTALS & REPLIES:
0Author
1Consumer
1Employee/Owner

#2 Author of original report

*Mike, why don't you face the fact that you're wrong?

AUTHOR: Oliver - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Wednesday, November 07, 2007

Mike,

I appreciate the fact that you at least admitted that the problem with my mailing was with the list company YOU PROVIDED as you did in my email to me. But that's the only bit of truth you've offered in this entire response.

First off, I'm tired of you and your company trying to make yourselves out to be good Samaritans by offering to do a free mailing for me. You made the offer because you KNEW that the failure of my marketing campaign was a result of a bad list by a company YOU hired! So let's make that very clear. Let's also make it clear that you still wanted me to pay for the postage because you didn't want to take the commission hit.

Why not mention that here too? Your customer pays thousands of dollars for a job that you botched, but you want sympathy because you might lose commission. In case you have your usual case of amnesia, contact me, you know how to reach me, and I'll be glad to send you the email you sent me.

As far as a "modeled" list, that's a bunch of crap. Both times, you asked me for my specific criteria, which I provided and agreed to, and the people that responded were nowhere close to the range I agreed to. And yes, I received the receipt from Equifax. Not from you, but from a third party I wont mention here (but again, if you want to know that information, get in touch with me.) And the receipt further proves my accusation. Look at the email of the criteria we agreed upon, and look at the Equifax report. It CLEARLY was not what we agreed upon. Another accusation I can prove to you. You oughtta know me by now Mike. I document EVERYTHING!

Next, you want to blame the market for my response? Another line of crap. Like I told you directly, the rapid changes in the market actually created more business for me because people wanted loans done before all the programs were lost. I don't care how bad the market is, how can you justify TWO calls out of 5000? Yes, direct mail is not an exact science, and yes, I've had failed campaigns before.

But consider two things (1) If the failure would have been as a result of you amiling as we agreed, I'd have nobody to blame but myself, (2) Had you done the job right the first time, and hired a competent list company, this sudden "change" would have been irrelevant, because my campaign would have been done already? By the way, last I checked, the market started turning in Jan/Feb 07, not in AUGUST! And yes, if I paid for a radio/TV ad, and it didnt perform as a result of the company's inability to perform as we agreed, you're d**n right they'd be doing it again for free. People deserve to get what they pay for. The problem is, instead of making things write the second time, you blow it again!


NEXT LIE: I never files any other complaints. Check the Better Business Bureau site people! If you look up Response Mail Express. You will see they have an UNRESOLVED complaint. Mike, I'd be happy to send you that transcript as well. I provided them with all my documentation and you guys wouldnt respond. Why not? I guess preserving your reputation in the business community wasnt important enough.

HERE's THE KICKER: I filed a complaint with another third party agency, and they responded with documents that were CLEARLY altered and "invoiced" that were dated in October. When I brought this to their attention and they saw this, all they could do was laugh, it was so obvious (I have this as well, and I'd be glad to show it to you). I'm not saying Mike personally did this, but it was definitely done within that company. And trust me, I would not be making such a harsh accusation if I couldn't prove it.

In closing, yes, I signed off on things we agreed on, we both did. But the problem is, what I signed off on, and what was delivered was two different things. I don't believe Mike set out to defraud me when we started off. The list company he hired was bad, and even he was shocked by what he saw, calling it a "white page" list. The deception is covering it up, and instead of taking responsibility for the problem with the list (which since they hired the comapny is THEIR problem), they want to blame everyone and everything else, and even went so far as to present falsified documents.

Ok, you've heard both sides of this story, consumers. Draw your own conclusions. And to Mike, if you really want to mend a business relationship, you can call me anytime (you got my number), apologize and admit you're wrong (and you KNOW you're wrong), and move on. If you would have done right by me, I would have been ENDORSING you with the same passion that I'm complaining about you.

*STOP TRYING TO DECEIVE PEOPLE TO COVER UP YOUR MISTAKES!*

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#1 REBUTTAL Individual responds

Always appropriate in every way.

AUTHOR: Michael - (U.S.A.)

POSTED: Tuesday, November 06, 2007

I began getting contacted by Mr. Oliver as he stated in June 2007. After hours of free consutlation as to our business and how we worked, in great detail, Mr. Oliver chose to move forward with a marketing campaign. In part of the free consutations, as a marketing company we make it very clear that no certain results are guaranteed and some times marketing doesn't completely work just as in TV or Radio, there is no way to ensure any defined results we can only quote national averages of past campaigns.

The first campaign Mr Oliver did in fact provide his own list for us to mail to, which did very well and he recieved several hundred percent return on his investment. From that point he wanted to do another campaign but didn't want to provide the list as we have several LIST VENDORS which we purchase the list on the clients behalf to mail to. We discussed several types of list for the client to choose from and the client chose the one we mailed. He signed off on the list with written approval and the list was purchased. The fact that it was cheaper was very appealing to the client even though I explained it wasn't exact credit data, it is what's called MODELED, meaning that it takes a lot of different things modeled into a matrix to give you more peramiters of what creates a viable deal. This was explained and was agreed to by Mr Oliver. Every step of our marketing process is signed off on by the client via e-mail and fax before proceeding to the next step.

The mailer went out and had many issues as Mr Oliver said, there was an issue with the list provided by the vendor. At that point, like any good business person, I tried to negotiate with him to best suite both sides, a discounted rate for MANY future mailings seemed to be a bigger benifit to the customer than a one time re-mailing. He wasn't open to this so I did exactly what he requested. The re-mailing was done and this time we bought the type of data he used the 1st time, exact credit data.

At this time in the market, the mail went out and the media blast began about ALL the banks going bankrupt and many loans not closing and it was all over the news. Mr Oliver got an ever worse response due to the fact that the mortgage market was collapsing, creating a mass waive of bad media about loans, banks, and loan officers. Mr Oliver then made several accusations about not doing what we said and not mailing the correcrt amount, list, and any other faulse accusations he could come up with. At this piint I put together the complete infomation package to prove to him we did exactly what we said and re-mailed with the upgraded and more expensive data he wanted and mailed the entire mailing for free. I provided Mr Oliver with complete receipts from Equifax showing that we bought the exact credit data he requested and postal receipts from the US post office showing we mailed the entire amount for him as we stated. We countinued to entertain all his written and verbal bashings and accusations for weeks until we came to the conclusion that he just wouldn't be satisfied in knowing that we did everything ethically and correct with no lies or misconceptions to provide him with a successful marketing campaign but due to timing and negitive media, the marketing just didn't work. I still have a file to this day of all the paperwork showing we bought the list he wanted and signed off on, mailed the number of pieces we said with postal receipts and didn't charge him a single dime for the camaping we re-ran for him costing more than the one he actually paid for and therefore maintained good business pratices every step of the way. If he would have spent his money on TV, Radio, or newspaper and didn't get the results he wanted, would they re-do another more expensive campaign to try to assist him in his business growth or just move on? I think you know.

Mr Oliver hasn't filed any other complaints because I showed him our file proving that we did everything we said and he signed off on it all every step of the way making his claims completely unfounded. We wish Mr Oliver the absolute best in his future business and would be more than happy to try to help him grow his business again now that the market has settled and the loan industry is picking back up. He can even provide his own data if he wishes.

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