National Arbitration Forum Consumers have NO chance of Winning even when Proof given Minneapolis Minnesota

Carolyn,

You may be legitimate and may work for a legitimate firm. However, that is not what the other poster was talking about, nor was it what I initially responded to.

You are talking about BUSINESSES and business credit, not individuals with individual credit, and you are talking about VOLUNTARY arbitration.

The entire issue here was MANDATORY BINDING ARBITRATION that is being slid into the fine print of credit card contracts and the third party debt collectors and junk debt buyers that are trying to exploit it.

Mandatory Binding Arbitration being used by a creditor NEVER helps the debtor. NEVER. there is a 99.6% average rate of determination in favor of the CREDITOR.

And, under the contract I am speaking about, which is most of them, the debtor does not have the right to reject arbitration, and take it to court. he must default as his only option and wait to get sued.

That is the problem.

That is the issue here.

First of all Steve, I am not clueless and definitly not self riteous. I have been working tirelessly FOR the businesses in financial trouble. These are everyday people who don't WANT to go to court and have a judgment placed against them. They WANT to pay their bills. They are small business owners who are UPSTANDING citizens who don't want to WALK away from a large amount of debt because they are HONORABLE people and want to at least TRY to pay their debts.

Steve, I have seen many of your postings and believe in my heart you want to help. I work for an organization that negotiates 40 to 80% OFF the total debt owed. And we NEVER charge any up front fees because when it comes down too it, if the business is still unable to pay our negotiated down total, they do have the option of going to court. However, as I said above, these businesses want to be upstanding. Even after agreement is made between our negotiators and our businesses, they have to approve the total before we get any form of compensation and if they don't approve, it's okay. They owe us nothing. I never work on the side of the creditor. And no, I do not work for NFO. And because this is not a place where you are supposed to "promote" your own company I will be honorable and not say where I work. But I do work long hours to HELP businesses. So don't put all arbitrators in the same category. That is ignorant.

Carolyn---Upstanding citizen--Not an Attorney--but definitly infavor of arbitration for businesses in need.

Can you explain why if arbitration, is a FAIR way to settle dispute.

Then why is the complainant allowed to have only an attorney there, not themselves.

In almost every case there is you or a panal, the complainant's attorney and the respondant.
how is this fair

Attorney's should not be allowed in arbitrations, wouldn't that make it more one sided and drive the cost up, seeing how attorney's charge by the hour

In every case i saw with NAF and I'm sure with other firms, the complainant had a attorney involved.

If I had to go out and get an attorney, the courts would protect my right, better the you.
Almost every arbutration firm has violated consumer protection laws. and do not give full discloser

Didn't this company get into trouble with the superior court in San Francisco a few years ago

For everyone ripping NCO in this case, based on the newer post by the OP, NCO did their job. They did nothing wrong. They settled the debt, and provided proof to the consumer regarding the settlement. This complaint has ceased being about a collection agency screwing with a consumer.

And for the most recent post saying that Steve does not know what he is talking about, tell us where he is wrong. It is easy to say someone is wrong, but provide proof of his bad advice.

And yet you didn't bring one fact to back up your statement about Steve. Nor about arbitration or a company in general to back up your rebuttal title.

Carolyn,

First, lose the self righteous attitude. You are clueless here. Here's why.

Arbitration is only a forced meand of settling a DISPUTE between the ORIGINAL creditor and the debtor. And, it is always one sided and in the creditors favor. The debtor NEVER wins.

Furthermore, there is no legal requirement for a debtor to use the arbitration clause. they can just stop paying and then the only option is to go to court. This is the most beneficial path for the debtor to take.

And, that arbitration nonsense does not follow on to a junk debt buyer. A junk debt buyer / third party collector has no rights whatsoever under the arbitration scam.

Yes, arbitration IS a SCAM. This is well documented, and could actually fall under the RICO act. It is organized crime.

NCO Financial is the larges junk debt buyer in the world, as well as the largest group of collection agencies. They are also the number 1 violators of debtors rights, and the single largest violator of the FDCPA.

You must work for NCO on the side.

In either case, before you try to talk down to me, you should get educated.

Dennis,

First of all, under the law, Ed is not responsible for anything a third party posts or reposts. That is the law. You should learn it.

Second, who exactly are you to tell me anything? Was I talking to you? You obviously have no idea what you are talking about, so it is you who should put a sock in it. That would make 2 extra socks on your person.

What exactly did I post that you have a problem with?

This arbitration thing is a scam. I do not participate. There is no reason to do so. It is not a legal process, it is a farce.

Arbitration is only to settle a dispute on a debt. It has no bearing on someone who is unable/unwilling to pay. That is what the courts are for.

I bet you are part of the NAF by the tone of your post.

Get a life, and some education.

Yes Steve, would you please put a sock in it for awhile. You seem to have an answer for everyone about everything on the ROR but it is getting very old now. Your non legal dribble could very well cause people great harm. Ed could very well get a summons some day to turn you over due to some brainless babble that cost someone a great deal of harm like in this post.

The date should have been 09/06/2006, not 2005

I did contact NCO Financial this morning. My
account does show a balance of $.0.00 Paid in
full. My credit report also shows $0.00 balance
and Paid. They also said a judgement would
not be seeked since there is NO balance. They
said they would also send a letter to this effect.
So, my problem is with the National Arbitration
forum and not NCO.

I have tried to contact the National Arbitraion
Forum on several occasions concerning this
matter, including today, and it is impossible to speak with anyone. All you get is a recording to
leave a message, and no one will return your call.

I did find an additional phone # from the BBB,
Same thing, just a recording.

I do intend to pursue this further since
no award should have even been entered since
they had Proof the account was paid in full.

I certainly wouldn't reccomend anyone doing
business with this kangaroo court.

Carolyn, you can say all you want but Arbitration is in favor of the creditor.
you look at a contract and that's it.
Arbitration was placed in contracts, to stay out of court, where a debtor could have more rights.
Several credit card compines got into hot water, over these arbitrations.

Your paid by the companies. If a breech of contract is made, by a person that goes in default on a load, credit card, ect.
Then the contract is in default, and a court should make the call.

You can not order my work to take money out of my check, you can't take my property to sell, to cover the debt, all these take a court orders
The op, states he reached an agreement over this debt, how is it the the NAF, can over rule an agreement? and still side with NCO, which is not the orginal creditor, but a collection agency, that paid alot less then what is owed.
Collection agency's are not the same as creditors and therefore, do not enjoy the same rights and protections
They buys debts, as an investment. nothing more

How can any arbitration, make a finding in favor of any collection agency, that only wants a return on an investment?

The orginal creditor, who give the credit can force the arbitration, once he sell it, to a thrid party. Arbitration is no longer an option.

Barry you should find an attorney and file against nco, and NAF. Is NCO, still following the agreement, for the 8,000.00 or do they now want the whole 23,000+.?

If NCO, is not following the 8000.00 agreement, but wants all the money since NAF, made a very bad call, sue then both

I think you may have misquoted Steve. I don't think he said that arbitration is a "scam", he said 3rd party collecion agencies are. HE did say that it seemed like there was no reason to use arbitration in this case.

Steve,

How dare you place ALL arbitration firms as being in the same league as the NAF. I work with and arbitration firm that has been in business for 26 years. We have provided our services to businesses in need (as well as some consumers) in order to keep their doors open and their credit in line by keeping them out of Bankruptcy. For you to "flag" all third party abitration as a 'scam' is not only ignorant but harmful to people in need who are unable to afford the services a professional negotiators (lawyers and such). You should do more research before providing your ONE SIDED opinion.

To Barry, the best idea I have for you is to provide a copy of your settlement agreement, a detailed letter (certified) and a copy of the check to your Attorney General. It seems you should be able to get some back up for your settlement through them. My sincerest regards,

Carolyn

This is what I found at quick glance and it doesn't look good. Could this be the next plan of attack by collection agencies? I read another post somewhere that said this NAF can somehow get judgments against you in the name of the collector but I am researching that a little more.



THE ARBITRATORS DESIGNATED IN THE AGREEMENT
BETWEEN CLAIMANT AND RESPONDENT ARE BIASED IN
FAVOR OF CREDITORS.

Out of nearly 20,000 consumer cases involving First USA Bank that went to arbitration under the National Arbitration Forum's iron fist of justice, one of the arbitrators designated
in the agreement, in all but 87 NAF ruled in favor of First USA Bank a success rate of 99.6 percent. Carolyn E. Mayer, Win Some Lose Rarely? Arbitration Forum's Rulings Called One-Sided, Wash. Post, March 1, 2000.

The response to this statistic? According to one of NAF's principals, the statistics are not significant, because the cases were collection cases in which one would expect a bank to win 99.6 percent. Id.An in depth analysis of the bias of the NAF was produced as Petition of Plaintiffs and of Defendant Salmons Agency to Docket Certified Questions, Toppings v. Meritech Mortgage Services, Inc., No. 011984 (W.Va. Dec. 4, 2001). Among other things, the brief points to NAF's marketing literature, which shows the advantage creditors will have in their
relationship with consumers if they sign up with NAF. NAF solicitation letters to would-be clients promise to eliminate class actions for companies who join, and coach creditors on how they can reduce their liabilities to consumers. NAF
marketing letters also promise to limit the consumer's recovery to the original claim, to limit consumers to little or no discovery, and not to issue injunctive relief.

The brief also shows how NAF argues that past NAF actions and the past employment history of NAF personnel also display pro-creditor bias.
There is no question that NAF is biased in favor of creditors, and thereby is biased in favor of Respondent. The fact of NAF's bias, unrevealed to Claimant, calls into question the other arbitrators as well. Claimant will have no chance of a fair hearing before NAF's insidious Kangaroo Court, nor any other arbitrator designated by Respondent, as the result for Respondent is nothing more than predetermined.

Barry,

This is the one thing that people cannot seem to ever understand. Third party collectors are almost always liars, thieves, and overall scumbags and should never even be responded to. It will NEVER do anything positive for you.

Arbitration is a waste of time. It only applies when there is a DISPUTE over the account. It was not in dispute, right? You just didn't pay it!

NEVER speak to any third party debt collector.

Never fill ot or respond to anything sent to you by a third party debt collector.

NEVER pay a third party debt collector. Always wait for them to sue you. Most won't. Regardless of all of the threats they make.

In the future, just remember the three NEVERS.