Bank Of America, BOFA Took 100s of Dollars In Overdraft For No Reason- Now Can't Join Another Bank Ripoff Nationwide

Steve I have gone through so many of these BOA reports and you seem to be busy on here. You must get paid well from BOA to DEFEND them as strongly as you do. I bet they don't screw you around like they do everybody else because of your work here. Hope one day you get a taste of what the rest of has...

SUUUUURE you have a "Swiss" account. We all know the enormous fees the foreign banks charge(NOT FREE) just lure people in. People use Swiss Banks for one reason...NO TAXES. That's it. There is no other reason to use one. They have no taxation on the account, but they DO charge fees.

How do you pay your bills with one? In order to write a check, you have to use a LOCAL bank. NOBODY will accept a check from a foreign account. I'm sure you're willing to allow the grocery store to hold your veggies for the 14 days it takes for your check to clear. Your ATM card? Sorry. Unless it's on a system the locals use, you're SOL again.

You're just too funny. You should be writing for some straight to video movie production.

John,

Do you really expect us to believe this crap?

"Military syle" encryption? Please..

I guess you pay all of your bills electronically, right? Swiss accounts don't come with checkbooks I assume.

If your debit card is Visa or Mastercard branded, it is NOT untraceable, and if it is not Visa or Mastercard branded, it is virtually useless.

You need to step out of the world of 007 and step into reality.

John,

Do you really expect us to believe this crap?

"Military syle" encryption? Please..

I guess you pay all of your bills electronically, right? Swiss accounts don't come with checkbooks I assume.

If your debit card is Visa or Mastercard branded, it is NOT untraceable, and if it is not Visa or Mastercard branded, it is virtually useless.

You need to step out of the world of 007 and step into reality.

John,

Do you really expect us to believe this crap?

"Military syle" encryption? Please..

I guess you pay all of your bills electronically, right? Swiss accounts don't come with checkbooks I assume.

If your debit card is Visa or Mastercard branded, it is NOT untraceable, and if it is not Visa or Mastercard branded, it is virtually useless.

You need to step out of the world of 007 and step into reality.

John,

You sound like James Bond. This thread is dealing with US banks and their manipulation of the Check21 system among other things.

It must be very difficult to manage an overseas account, especially if it is as secret as you say. It takes weeks for the process to go through the clearing house, and you would need a US bank to do the processing, unless you have a multi-million dollar infrastructure in your bedroom for this purpose.

I can't imagine a bank that offers VPN access to its customers. For what you say I can determine that you are not truthful. VPN is for private access to a limited number of users. It would be extremely costly for a bank, even in Switzerland, to provide this type of service, unless you are an account holder with a balance in the millions of dollars. There is no such thing as military encryption. With https which is the same protocol you use to browse in the internet but it runs on a Secured Socket Layer (SSL) is sufficient to guarantee the most secure communication.

Thanks

I don't use any of the USA banking systems, I opened up Swiss Bank accounts a few years ago among others that I will not mention, I have never had a problem nor do I have to indentify myself to the banking institutions. I have a non-traceable ATM card that works anywhere in the world and I can access my accounts through a Virtual Private network using military grade encryption.

I can tell you from experience that using overseas banks are far more easy to deal with and you will NEVER and I mean NEVER be denied a bank account!

The USA Banking systems are a bunch of crooks!

John

Nicole,

You say you do not work for a bank or any finacial institution, but you explain very clearly the process of the hold and actual withdrawal in batch by a bank's commercial customer. This is something a business student doesn't understand quite professionaly as you expose it.

Be honest like Stile whom admitted immediately that she represented a bank. You know to much to just be a casual concerned reader.

Thank you

Mark,

I didn't mean to offend you by mispelling your name, there are 3 Marcs at my company and it's just a question of habit.

Please get used to finding a little passion in our discussions, but don't take it too personal. How boring would it be if we were all as perfect as you.

By the way, I don't have problems with my bank accounts, and when I have had them there are sufficient grounds to get them resolved in a prompt manner. But I do know how the systems work and I know when there is tweaking behind the scenes.

And everyone who is extra careful and takes a few minutes a day (I take a couple of hours) to manage their accounts, having the money, will never encounter problems.

We are talking about the borderline inconveniences that many people who stretch payday to payday experience.

I don't want to repeat myself so read the other threads related to this topic.

And by your statement that others in this forum got confused about John's supposedly blatant plagiarism I can only suspect two things: The first is that you belong to the same group as Stile, Steve (Hmmm, I think Steve really is the way he expresses himself. I think Steve believes in what he says, I'll take Steve out of this niche, I like the way he stands for his opinion), Nicole and others work for the same bank and are just trading turns at downgrading and condescending us.

Continues .... (like always)

A few others saw it as yours so I am not the only one that missed the author unknown, sorry.

As for Michael, you write

Please don't insult our (the participants) intelligence.

1. spell my name right
2. This is a thread about people that seem to think it is the banks fault when they overdraw, isn't it?

I have never had NSF fees, so I guess that shows my intelligence huh?

Marc,

Please don't insult our (the participants) intelligence. John does not claim to be the author. As a matter of a fact it ends with "Author unknown". Did you want John to write a ridiculous footnote clarifying the legal disclaimers or whachamacallits.

And thanks for letting us know the true origin of it. And as you said it has been ciculating on the internet modified from the original so it is hard to know where it actually came from.

And lets please take this thread back to its original course:

"The Unethical Assesment of NSF Fees by Our Mogul Banks"

Thank you

Mark,

What does author not known mean?

I did not take credit for it!

John, at least acknowledge you did not write it when you post other peoples stuff.

Direct from snopes.

The letter quoted above was one man's method of blowing off steam at having to deal with some of these exasperating aspects of modern banking. It was penned by Peter Wear, a columnist for the Courier Mail in Brisbane, Australia, for that publication's "Perspectives" column. The letter was not actually sent to a bank; it was a humor piece from start to finish, albeit one inspired by the author's having had one of his checks bounce. Though the item did appear in an actual newspaper, it was not, however, (as claimed in the Internet-circulated version's prologue) published in The New York Times. Mr. Wear's sardonic offering about the over-mechanized joys of banking as experienced by the consumer was written in January 1999. Since then, anonymous rewriters have been moved to alter his original to make it better fit with a primarily American audience.

Michael,

Check 22 is a typo on my part. You are correct, it is Check 21. Carelessness on my part and lack of typing ability.

Steve

That was creative John. You have contributed to this forum with a nice touch.

I read from the story that the customer has the reason and should call the shots.

Banks have too long used the unfounded excuse that they have to implement the rules because of federal laws, fraud, charge-offs, etc.

It's enough! Honest customers should not have to pay for this.

Steve, since you like BofA so much, why don't you let your account overdraw every once in a while so that you contribute to their losses through the assesment of an NSF fee. You do want a strong and solid bank that takes care of your money, don't you? Please help them, they are losing too much money and they might lose yours, eventually.

Steve, can you explain to the public what Check 22 is? Because I have only heard of Check21. Could it be that you know of a secret agenda that the public is not aware of?

Register, Register, Register, REGISTER, REGISTER.

I believe you must have a bit of a compulsive behavior issue. Steve, please register this.

Good Night!

I loved your letter, John. While I have no reason to use it today, I have NO DOUBT someone somewhere will screw up shortly and this letter will be used. I'm sorry! I almost forgot to ask: may I blatantly plagiarize your letter???

Dear Sir:

I am writing to thank you for bouncing my check with which I endeavored to pay my plumber last month. By my calculations, three nanoseconds must have elapsed between his presenting the check and the arrival in my account of the funds needed to honor it. I refer, of course, to the automatic monthly deposit of my entire salary, an arrangement which, I admit, has been in place for only eight years. You are to be commended for seizing that brief window of opportunity, and also for debiting my account $30 by way of penalty for the inconvenience caused to your bank.

My thankfulness springs from the manner in which this incident has caused me to rethink my errant financial ways. I noticed that whereas I personally attend to your telephone calls and letters, when I try to contact you, I am confronted by the impersonal, overcharging, pre-recorded, faceless entity which your bank has become.

From now on, I, like you, choose only to deal with a flesh-and-blood person. My mortgage and loan repayments will therefore and hereafter no longer be automatic, but will arrive at your bank, by check, addressed personally and confidentially to an employee at your bank whom you must nominate. Be aware that it is an offense under the Postal Act for any other person to open such an envelope.

Please find attached an Application Contact Status which I require your chosen employee to complete. I am sorry it runs to eight pages, but in order that I know as much about him or her as your bank knows about me, there is no alternative. Please note that all copies of his or her medical history must be countersigned by a Notary Public, and the mandatory details of his/her financial situation (income, debts, assets and liabilities) must be accompanied by documented proof.

In due course, I will issue your employee with a PIN number which he/she must quote in dealings with me. I regret that it cannot be shorter than 28 digits but, again, I have modeled it on the number of button presses required of me to access my account balance on your phone bank service.

As they say, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Let me level the playing field even further. When you call me, press buttons as follows:

1. To make an appointment to see me.

2. To query a missing payment.

3. To transfer the call to my living room in case I am there.

4. To transfer the call to my bedroom in case I am sleeping.

5. To transfer the call to my toilet in case I am attending to nature.

6. To transfer the call to my mobile phone if I am not at home.

7. To leave a message on my computer, a password to access my computer is required. Password will be communicated to you at a later date to the Authorized Contact.

8. To return to the main menu and to listen to options 1 through 7

9. To make a general complaint or inquiry.

The contact will then be put on hold, pending the attention of my automated answering service. While this may, on occasion, involve a lengthy wait, uplifting music will play for the duration of the call. Regrettably, but again following your example, I must also levy an establishment fee to cover the setting up of this new arrangement.

May I wish you a happy, if ever so slightly less prosperous New Year?

Your Humble Client

Author Unknown

In closing: I think that her lawyer can say if Reg E applies, he will after all have more facts than anyone else!

John,

I read the post. She already had major problems BEFORE "losing" the wallet containing the ID, SS sard, bankcards etc..

What I did not see in the post was her immediately filing a police report as BofA will tell you to do, and immediately making a fraud report to the 3 major credit bureaus which they initiate for you.

I had my wallet stolen from a gym locker in Las Vegas in 1999. I was a BofA customer. I immediately called the police after calling BofA to close my accounts.

FYI...Whenever a lost wallet is reported to BofA...ALL accounts under that name are closed and issued new numbers. I told the BofA rep that I had my debit card in my checkbook, and it was not stolen..She told me that all accounts under my name are linked and ALL get cancelled as per BofA fraud prevention policy.

The next morning I immediately filed a fraud report with all credit bureaus and with the SS Administration. BofA initiated everything for me, and followed up with me to make sure it was done. AND, I had my new cards overnighted to me next business day at no cost to me.

No problem.

Michelle,

Having your Social Security Card stolen is far more serious than an overdraft with a bank. (Please notice that the Steve's of this world did not catch that simple fact!)

I would strongly urge you too consider monitoring all three major Credit Reports for fraud activity. Again, the least of your worries is Bank of America!

The person who stole your Social Security Card can now get a Credit Card sent to him/her under your SS number. They can buy a house or a car!

I would strongly urge you too consider placing a fraud alert on all three major Credit Reports.

I would strongly urge you too request and keep the police reports as part of your permanent record. If you have not have a Police Report, then file one ASAP and get a copy.

I would strongly urge you too keep all correspondence concerning this situation together in one place. This would include police reports, letters to creditors, letters to banks et cetera. You will need to have all of this documentation too prove that you did not take a loan out or request a credit card be sent to your home in South America!

In closing: I would strongly urge you too never ever carry your Social Security Card with you again. Your Social Security Card should be kept in a Safe Deposit Box at a Bank or in a fire resistant safe at your home.

Michelle, I do follow my own advice!

Smile, laugh and enjoy life!

Hello everyone!

I haven't gotten far, in fact it seems that I have gone back even farther. I stopped using the bank account for anything but depositing my out-of-state checks. I withdrew all of the money from our account, and continue to withdraw as checks are available for withdrawl. Unfortunately, my E-Bill for my car payment went through multiple times, when it was supposed to have stopped completely. Overdraft fees again! YAY! However, this time it isn't BOFA's fault.

I am currently dealing with a lawyer who is combing through my financials and talking with the bank. He doesn't make it sound like any of this is too promising.

I will let you all know what happens!

And to Steve - not everyone is out to blame BOFA for everything. BOFA is not just a scapegoat, they are a ripoff.

- Michelle

Reg E only applies in cases where there are unauthorized transactions on a customers account, or certain types of merchant billing errors. Reg E doesn't apply to OD fees unless the fees were caused by a disputed transaction.

Alright. Here i am. Explain it to me. Make me understand it. How exactly did the bank rip off consumers who purposely (by not keeping a register) overdrew their account(READ: This Has Nothing to Do With Michelle...not HER Fault)? How is the bank supposed to process checks immediately? And how is the bank supposed to process a debit immediatly if the merchant withdraws their hold (a hold is what you are seeing when it appears right away) before they do a batch report (actually taking the money from your account). That, you need to take up with the merchant. The bank cannot control it.

Now, onto the "hidden sentences." What exactly do you mean? Do you mean sentences they do not write in the disclosures? Or sentences you did not read because it is so much information. Now, three days ago I opened up an account with Wachovia (I know, I know. But I have had accounts with them in the past and had no problems and since I keep a register accurately and do not intend to have a mortage through them, I should be fine...if not you'll hear about it). Now, Wachovia's disclosure is HUGE! I chose to recieve it electronically (I opened the account online) and I read each and every sentence. Was it exciting? Ummm no. Was it even interesting? Not even close. Will I remember most of it? No. But I will remember anything that could cost me money. Would you sign a mortgage without reading the papers? Would you buy a car without reading the papers? Take out a loan, sign a lease, accept a job, take a flight, hire a company, or individual without reading the contract first? No? Then why do it with a bank account. Please, explain it. I am all ears.

And for the LAST TIME. I do not now, nor have I ever worked for a bank, credit union or Savings and Loans. Ever. The closest I ever came to it was working in a call center for Wal Mart credit cards. The issuing bank was GE. I worked there 9 days and only activated cards. That's it. I am, however, a Business Finance student. And no, I will not work for a bank. The end.

Alright. Here i am. Explain it to me. Make me understand it. How exactly did the bank rip off consumers who purposely (by not keeping a register) overdrew their account(READ: This Has Nothing to Do With Michelle...not HER Fault)? How is the bank supposed to process checks immediately? And how is the bank supposed to process a debit immediatly if the merchant withdraws their hold (a hold is what you are seeing when it appears right away) before they do a batch report (actually taking the money from your account). That, you need to take up with the merchant. The bank cannot control it.

Now, onto the "hidden sentences." What exactly do you mean? Do you mean sentences they do not write in the disclosures? Or sentences you did not read because it is so much information. Now, three days ago I opened up an account with Wachovia (I know, I know. But I have had accounts with them in the past and had no problems and since I keep a register accurately and do not intend to have a mortage through them, I should be fine...if not you'll hear about it). Now, Wachovia's disclosure is HUGE! I chose to recieve it electronically (I opened the account online) and I read each and every sentence. Was it exciting? Ummm no. Was it even interesting? Not even close. Will I remember most of it? No. But I will remember anything that could cost me money. Would you sign a mortgage without reading the papers? Would you buy a car without reading the papers? Take out a loan, sign a lease, accept a job, take a flight, hire a company, or individual without reading the contract first? No? Then why do it with a bank account. Please, explain it. I am all ears.

And for the LAST TIME. I do not now, nor have I ever worked for a bank, credit union or Savings and Loans. Ever. The closest I ever came to it was working in a call center for Wal Mart credit cards. The issuing bank was GE. I worked there 9 days and only activated cards. That's it. I am, however, a Business Finance student. And no, I will not work for a bank. The end.

Alright. Here i am. Explain it to me. Make me understand it. How exactly did the bank rip off consumers who purposely (by not keeping a register) overdrew their account(READ: This Has Nothing to Do With Michelle...not HER Fault)? How is the bank supposed to process checks immediately? And how is the bank supposed to process a debit immediatly if the merchant withdraws their hold (a hold is what you are seeing when it appears right away) before they do a batch report (actually taking the money from your account). That, you need to take up with the merchant. The bank cannot control it.

Now, onto the "hidden sentences." What exactly do you mean? Do you mean sentences they do not write in the disclosures? Or sentences you did not read because it is so much information. Now, three days ago I opened up an account with Wachovia (I know, I know. But I have had accounts with them in the past and had no problems and since I keep a register accurately and do not intend to have a mortage through them, I should be fine...if not you'll hear about it). Now, Wachovia's disclosure is HUGE! I chose to recieve it electronically (I opened the account online) and I read each and every sentence. Was it exciting? Ummm no. Was it even interesting? Not even close. Will I remember most of it? No. But I will remember anything that could cost me money. Would you sign a mortgage without reading the papers? Would you buy a car without reading the papers? Take out a loan, sign a lease, accept a job, take a flight, hire a company, or individual without reading the contract first? No? Then why do it with a bank account. Please, explain it. I am all ears.

And for the LAST TIME. I do not now, nor have I ever worked for a bank, credit union or Savings and Loans. Ever. The closest I ever came to it was working in a call center for Wal Mart credit cards. The issuing bank was GE. I worked there 9 days and only activated cards. That's it. I am, however, a Business Finance student. And no, I will not work for a bank. The end.

John,

This has nothing to do with defending a bank. It simply has to do with right and wrong. Very simple, and so simple that even you should be able to understand it.

EVERY NSF complaint on this site that I have read is from people who do not keep checkbook registers and/or people who "float" checks.

This is very simple. The people who do not "float checks, and keep an accurate register, do not pay NSF fees. I am in this category. I have 3+ checking accounts at all times, and the one being with BofA for more than 15 years. I have NEVER paid an NSF fee.

Why is that? Please explain it to me.

Michelle,

You sound like a sweet person. Please oh please do not listen to the Steve's of this world, for there are thousand if not hundreds of thousands like him. (Steve the world is waiting for you to post your dissertation on the Bank's honesty on this site!)

I don't feel that anybody can provide you fair and accurate advice without knowing your complete financial situation and I don't think that it would be a good idea for you to post that information.

Since your Social Security Card has been stolen, I would advise that you pull Credit Reports at all three major Credit Bureaus. I would also advise putting a fraud alert onto your credit reports and do regular checks.

Next point: Consolidate your accounts into as few as possible. Your future children can wait. Getting you and your husband's financial situation in order is far more important. I hope that the two of you are not having arguments over this. What is that old saying make war?

It is something like that, I am sure you will figure it out.

Next point: Search the rip-off reports for Ed's recommendation for getting your money back. He writes about telling the Bank that you wish to file a dispute, and demand that they assist you in accordance with Federal Regulation E.

It kind of sounds like that when your cards were stolen that BoA did not assist you as required by law and to add further insult they then nailed you with overdraft charges because of there lack of assistance.



In fact this is what the Rip-Off site writes:

Go to your bank within 60 days of the charge, or as soon as you know about the charge, don't delay, and tell them that there has been fraudulent activity within your account. Explain that you wish to file a dispute, and demand that they assist you in accordance with Federal Regulation E.

According to the majority of victims interviewed by Rip-off Report, those who immediately called their banks to dispute the charges did not get very far. Many victims got the following responses from their banks: we could not do anything for you or you waited too long; it has been more than 60 days.

If the bank is says that you have waited too long, explain to them how you called their 800 number as soon as the charges were found, and were told by the bank that nothing could be done. Remind the bank that they failed to assist you properly at the 800 #, and instead, provided you with an inadequate explanation of your right to dispute. Tell the bank that it's their fault time has expired, and since they gave you the wrong info to begin with, they will just have to deal with it, take the loss and reverse the charges.

Tell them the truth; this was unauthorized and your account was NOT to be charged! Keep emphasizing how you never authorized anything! Direct them to the hundreds of victims reports that were filed on Rip-off Report.com. And if you're at the bank, walk them over to their computer and make them go to this site! If you are on the phone with them, tell them you will wait while they access this site! Either way, be persistent!

DO NOT TAKE NO FOR AN ANSWER!

Let them know nicely, that you were advised to Report them (the Bank) and this situation to the Banking Commission in your state. Since each state has a different name for the agency/controller over banks, find that name before you call or get to the bank so you can throw it in their face. The more knowledgeable you appear to be, the further you will get.

And just continue to demand the Federal Regulation E form! The bank CAN, MUST and WILL reverse the charge! But, you must be persistent; ask to speak to the supervisor or the area manager for all the branches in the state.

Let the bank personnel know you are meeting with the media later in the day, that you would much rather they do the right thing (as most other banks have) by looking at the complaints and immediately reversing the charge(s) to your account; no matter how long ago it was. Be sure to call the Media if necessary so you are telling the truth.

If you have to, be loud (but nice) in front of other customers. If you are just calling by phone, the above tactics should still work. The bank can easily fax or mail to you the Federal Regulation E dispute form.

CHARGES TO YOUR CREDIT CARD

If the charge was to your credit card (not debit card, check card, or checking account), contact the credit card company as soon as possible to request a dispute form. Consumers usually have a little longer to dispute fraudulent credit card charges (up to 6 months), but it is better to act right away. In this type of situation, credit card disputes are usually successful since fraudulent companies often won't contest the disputed charge. In rare cases, credit card companies will review disputes, but refuse to reverse the charges. If this occurs, complain to a manager and let them know you will be filing a report here.



Michelle, I don't know if this applicable, but I hope it helps and the credit for that part goes to Ed and the Rip-Off site.

Anyway, I hope that this is a breath of fresh air for you.

Good luck

Hey - Stop arguing and defending every word! You know who you are - I won't name names, but if any of you come against me in this discussion, then it proves negative against you.

Michelle, you are WONDERFUL. I believe in every word you said and I loved reading your post, and you have EXCELLENT typing & spelling skills.

Please keep us all updated here. If anybody else would like to share their relevant experiences, then that will be appreciated.

What happened to Michelle proved my worst fear about getting paid by checks from individuals.

Thanks.

Michael,

It seems that you have a much deeper issue than anything that BofA did to you.

You wrote:
"Banks do not respect their customers. Banks even treat you bad when you are opening an account, like if you were some sort of a gangster. They look at you, glance at your ID, look at you once again, they look at each other. They claim that they are protecting you due to the inclement fraud that is ocurring, when they are the true bandits. How do they dare such attitude.

Come to Arizona to open an account and "live" what I am talking about. They blame illegal immigration or whatever. They blame anything to initiate the denigrating BANK/account holder relationship from the very beginning".
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I never got treated like that in AZ, so I have to ask? Do you present yourself like a thug or gang banger? Illegal immigration is a big problem in AZ and recent federal laws require a higher degree of scrutiny in verifying someone's identity. Banks have new rules they must go by as a result of the Patriot Act, etc.

It's not personal, it's business. I banked at the Thomas Road BofA location just past the Wal-Mart. I never encountered any of this treatment.

I think you are just of anti-establishment personality and everything is a conspiracy. If you don't like the way someone does business, just don't do business with them. Very simple concept. BofA has treated me great for more than 15 years, in 5 different states.

I believe this forum is a very powerful tool in order to bring a balance between the organizations and the people. Balance that has been lost and which loss has been escalating since the 80's.

I am absolutely sure that the Internet will bring that balance back eventually. Albeit these moguls are after the total control of it also. Nevertheless we will find other means if it does happen. God bless the Internet, now!

Banks have to change their ways of operating. Their practices go against a healthy customer-service provider relationship. As a matter of fact, most people believe that the bank screws them, commit fraud against them, cheats them, deceive them, etc. them.

I have not heard a healthy comment from anyone (except Steve) regarding a bank. It's like the old saying: "It's an evil necessity".

Why? Because banks are performing acts that are not customer friendly, nor accepted. They do things that are not appropiate nor ethical.

Imagine going to "WM" and purchasing an item and it results that it is just a piece of junk and then you decide on returning it, if they neglected to return your money would you ever go back and buy something again? No! Definitely not! You would go to the competition. Why does "WM" keep growing? Because it knows what customer satisfaction is and it respects that.

Banks do not respect their customers. Banks even treat you bad when you are opening an account, like if you were some sort of a gangster. They look at you, glance at your ID, look at you once again, they look at each other. They claim that they are protecting you due to the inclement fraud that is ocurring, when they are the true bandits. How do they dare such attitude.

Come to Arizona to open an account and "live" what I am talking about. They blame illegal immigration or whatever. They blame anything to initiate the denigrating BANK/account holder relationship from the very beginning.

They have all these hidden sentences in their contracts, which I call: "Hidden Vice". Heck! You sold your soul when you opened an account with a bank. You have no rights! Our government lets them do this! Our elected officials let banks get away with this! Why? Please use your creative and realistic imagination, I don't want to get into politics tonight.

Nicole, what should we do? Please advise.

Thank you.

If you get a chance, please keep us updated! I would love to know what happened. By the way, I want to let you know that if you have trouble opening an account, there are other options. There are still a few good, solid, reputable banks that do not use ChexSystems (the company banks report overdrawn accounts too). Whatever you do, if you go looking for a bank that does not use ChexSystems, DO NOT PAY ANYONE for this information! That would just be another ripoff.

If you have military affiliation, check out military credit unions (do a google for USA A Bank or something like that...). Also, there are support forums for people just like you. People who got screwed by the bank and have trouble opening accounts. (Google ChexSystems Bites). Again, get this information from a free source, it is out there. I would post the link, but ED does not usually allow it.

Good luck! I know it is hard, but it could be much worse. You could have just let this continue and not stand up to these low lifes.


P.S. D, thank you!

Michael,

Nicole did not advise the original poster to "close an account but keep using it..." She said "stop using BoA now! Keep the account open, and just use it to cash checks. Then withdraw the(m)money (10 days later... Plenty of time to clear)... Then march yourself down to your local reputable Credit Union,..."

As to the second statement of Nicole's first paragraph, which does state "*****So many time people come here and complain that they overspent, BoA charged them and now its the banks fault.*****" You read it differently than I did. "Come here" to me meant come to RoR, not BoA.

You, like I, get mad when "loyal" employees respond to consumer complaints in a manner that attempts to place the blame solely on the customer. This is an unethical practice and I can only hope that others who the these suspect responses can see through the "blame game" and "smoke screens".

Your particular postings to this complaint did shift the attention away from the original complaint in a negative way. I don't think this was your intention. I believe that in your desire to protect people from bad advice, you temporarily lost the critical aspect of your normally sound opinions.

Nicole offered Michelle advisement. If you disagree, please offer Michelle (and the rest of the readers) reasons, examples, and experiences that explain why you disagree.

Michael,

Nicole did not advise the original poster to "close an account but keep using it..." She said "stop using BoA now! Keep the account open, and just use it to cash checks. Then withdraw the(m)money (10 days later... Plenty of time to clear)... Then march yourself down to your local reputable Credit Union,..."

As to the second statement of Nicole's first paragraph, which does state "*****So many time people come here and complain that they overspent, BoA charged them and now its the banks fault.*****" You read it differently than I did. "Come here" to me meant come to RoR, not BoA.

You, like I, get mad when "loyal" employees respond to consumer complaints in a manner that attempts to place the blame solely on the customer. This is an unethical practice and I can only hope that others who the these suspect responses can see through the "blame game" and "smoke screens".

Your particular postings to this complaint did shift the attention away from the original complaint in a negative way. I don't think this was your intention. I believe that in your desire to protect people from bad advice, you temporarily lost the critical aspect of your normally sound opinions.

Nicole offered Michelle advisement. If you disagree, please offer Michelle (and the rest of the readers) reasons, examples, and experiences that explain why you disagree.

Michael,

Nicole did not advise the original poster to "close an account but keep using it..." She said "stop using BoA now! Keep the account open, and just use it to cash checks. Then withdraw the(m)money (10 days later... Plenty of time to clear)... Then march yourself down to your local reputable Credit Union,..."

As to the second statement of Nicole's first paragraph, which does state "*****So many time people come here and complain that they overspent, BoA charged them and now its the banks fault.*****" You read it differently than I did. "Come here" to me meant come to RoR, not BoA.

You, like I, get mad when "loyal" employees respond to consumer complaints in a manner that attempts to place the blame solely on the customer. This is an unethical practice and I can only hope that others who the these suspect responses can see through the "blame game" and "smoke screens".

Your particular postings to this complaint did shift the attention away from the original complaint in a negative way. I don't think this was your intention. I believe that in your desire to protect people from bad advice, you temporarily lost the critical aspect of your normally sound opinions.

Nicole offered Michelle advisement. If you disagree, please offer Michelle (and the rest of the readers) reasons, examples, and experiences that explain why you disagree.

Aafes,

That was some good information, but people still need to take responsibility for thier own actions. People can educate themselves instead of blaming others for thier mistakes.

Before I go out, I simply write down my checking account balance and place it in my wallet with my cash.

Then, when I make a debit purchase, I write DEBIT over the top of the reciept and place it in my wallet with my cash.

This is such a simple task, and takes so little time or effort. Just basic discipline here.

The core, Steve, of most of these problems is indeed personal financial responsibility. However, in my opinion, the advent of debit cards into the financial system promoted lack of this responsibility.

When only checks were utilized in lieu of cash for most transactions, it was a rare sight to see someone not stop and enter the transaction into their checkbook register. While this practice was somewhat annoying to those of us in line behind the customer, it was more common than not. Even with this practice, many who utilized the "carbon copy" checkbooks found they were often plagued with NSF fees. There was something about having an entry of $500.00 as your previous balance that would make most shy away from making a purchase of $501.

Now with debit cards, I rarely if ever, see an individual make a purchase and stop and enter the amount in a register. It is too easy to "rely" on the experts at the bank to make sure you are not spending money you don't have.

Debit transactions, while real time, are not always automatically posted from the account. Many merchants utilize "batch processing" in which the transactions may be sent at the end of the business day and on weekends on Mondays. While the debit transaction may verify the funds are available, it does not automatically deduct them in every case. This is the primary cause of NSF's for those who rely on the ATM or online balance to manage their money.

All that being said, it remains unreasonable for banks to utilize these practices along with creative posting and "courtesy overdraft loans" to make billions of dollars in fee income from consumers.

Also at the core is the lack of financial education provided to children at the high school level. Whether it is the responsibility of the parents or the schools system, there is little to no education in this subject. Personally, I made it a point to educate my own children in budgeting, balancing a checkbook etc. I would love to see a survey on the number of adults that cannot effectively balance a checkbook - I think most would be astounded to find the numbers so high.

As for credit unions. I will respectfully disagree that all credit unions can be categorized as you posted Steve. Just as with banks, you must do your research. I am currently a member of a credit union that offers competitive rates on savings, CD's and other financial instruments. As with many banks I pay NO fees as I have direct deposit. Unlike many banks my direct deposits are available as soon as the credit union receives them. With my retirement payment this can be up to 5 days early if a holiday weekend is involved. I have found the service to be personal and have yet to experience a single problem that was not quickly resolved.

I want to bring to everyones attention the second sentence of Nicole's first paragraph, which states exactly:

***** So many times people come here and complain that they overspent, BoA charged them and now its the banks fault. *****

If it is read carefully you can see that Nicole is admitting that many times people go to where she is: ("come here"), and also she identifies here as ("BoA") in the same sentence.

Nicole, nobody got you wrong. We all know how to read and we all know that your bank is very interested in having staff browse these messages and to send out of orbit the real topic by using the until now hideously succesful tactic of placing the blame on the customer.

We are aware of this pattern and we respectfully ask that if you speak in behalf of this organization that you do it in a more open and sincere manner.

And by no means try to discredit me by assigning me negative adjectives such as hostile or indicating that I have an attitude problem. I am being frank, honest and blunt. I do not see why you feel offended just because I am uncovering the truth that you let slip away.

I trust that the readers and "victims" will recognize these practices that are ocurring here by the same organizations that are actually being questioned.

What we can determine is that with this attitude your bank is proving to us that it indeed uses unethical maneuvers to accomplish its goals.

And this post will be a very critical one in proving such behavior.

I am sorry Nicole, I just like business in my country to be honest, ethical, customer oriented and above all professional. I can see you were improperly trained. And by no means whatsoever has my intention been for you to feel offended by my critical analysis of this post.

Thank you very much,

Respectfully,

Michael

I see advice given to many people here when they have "trouble" with a bank, to go to a credit union. This is nonsense!

Credit Unions have much more stringent rules and are more fee happy than any bank.

If you cannot properly manage your money at a bank, a credit union is surely NOT the answer. Credit unions SUCK!

My advice: Learn how to keep an accurate checkbook register and wait for deposited items to clear, and I guarantee you will never have an NSF issue again.

For some people (Michael), I guess I was not clear. I, in no way, supported BoA in this post. I told Michelle to keep the account open so that when she goes to open a credit union account she can show a good history for six months. I then told her not to actually use the account (since BoA will just continue to steal her money) for anything other than cashing out of state checks (actually depositing them, leaving them there for upwards of two weeks to guarantee BoA cannot pull out the funds to overdraw her account). I also told her who to contact about BoA's shifty practices. I am not sure where the hostility comes from, Michael. But alas, it does not matter. You were confused. I was supporting Michelle. I believe she was wronged by BoA. She is one of the rare ones that has no guilt in her situation.

Oh, and most credit unions will treat you great. I used to bank with Wells Fargo. (I know, I know..young and dumb I guess) After they decided to "lose" a large deposit (that I had a reciept for and that had been in my account two days prior) I switched to a local credit union in my home town. (Sad to say they do not have one in my current town) They know me by name, and do not require ID when I walk in, they just pull up my account. I like that, I am treated with respect. Oh and the one time I had trouble, they fixed it right away. Of course, there are some shady credit unions as well. I suggest going with a local credit union, maybe a small one. Ask around town, or hey, look it up on RoR. Good luck, Michelle!

And good luck with that attitude problem, Michael!

Run, don't walk away from B of A or any major bank. If you search, you will be able to find a credit union that will open an account despite Chexsystems.

A credit union will treat you as a co-owner and you will be much more satisified at the end of the day.

Take B of A to task for this, take it as far as you possibly can. While I am certain they will eventually try to use the chexsystems excuse for the holds on your funds as well as your checks, don't surrender to this.

Creative accounting, posting and manipulation of posting order is a for profit practice utilized by major banks to make BILLIONS of dollars from consumers.

I have posted facts about this in several other posts here.

Take them to task. Make them justify every penny they took from you.

If you read Nicole's comments on BoA on several posts you will find an interesting pattern: she seems to be on the defensive with everything. Why would an individual be in such turmoil on defending BoA or at least giving advice that is beneficial to BoA, such as: Close an account but keep using it, and use your money orders, and then open an account at a credit union. Nicole, please try to make sense.

And please don't get me wrong, opening an account in a "non-biased" credit union is a good move. But beware of the credit unions that have tight ties with this mogul banks.

I believe Michelle is trying to express an honest frustration that many BoA's customers experience. In fact, I believe that Michelle has a true case in her hands, and many lawyers reading these posts must have noticed that.

Banks use the lame excuse of "out-of-state" when it is convenient for them, otherwise they use the "Check21" excuse. This monster banks, as I call them, have everyone in their pockets. But growing customer dissatisfaction and great sites like this one are making them tremble at their ankles.

I have tested every possible transaction to be able to assist many customers experiencing the problem Michelle has had. This has taken time and it has cost a lot of money.

Michelle, you have a good case in your hands.

I have come up with a term for a very bad practice that banks perform with our hard earned money that comes through direct deposits to our bank accounts with them, this term is "hyper-floating", yes, "hyper-kiting".

There is more to come .

Ok Michelle, let me tell you, if it happened exactly as you say it did (which would not suprise me) then you have every right to be pissed at BoA. So many times people come here and complain that they overspent, BoA charged them and now its the banks fault. You, obviously did not have this problem. Contact the Attorney General in your state. Hopefully, you have all your bank statements to back up what you say. If not, go to the bank and ask for them, all of them.

I could understand holding the check, if it was out of state, but holding the check and holding your funds? That is ludarcris! Also, feel free to contact the Comptroller of Currency since BoA is nationally chartered. They have gone too far.

What I suggest, stop using BoA NOW! Keep the account open, and just use it to cash checks. Then withdraw them money (10 days later ... plenty of time to clear) and pay for everything in cash and money orders for the next six months. Then march yourself down to your local reputable Credit Union, explain everything to them and they will most likely open an account for you. Good luck, keep us updated, please!

After having a checking account with BoA for almost seven years, I closed it in August. I was like you, sick of seeing MY money manipulated for their own convenience and refusing to accept accountability for their OWN bookeeping mistakes. The last straw came when they began refusing to cash my payroll checks, based on my "past" overdraft activity. That was B.S., for I had had NO overdraft activity since November of 2005. I think the real reason they didn't want to do business with me anymore was because I stopped doing direct deposit with them, leaving them powerless to mess with my money anymore...as they are obviously doing with yours. I am using Money Orders now to pay my bills with, and they work just great..and WITHOUT the hassles!